I'll be an outsider with you. Sure, some people with Downs can live great lives, but many, many don't. Many are NOT the high functioning people you see working at your grocery store.
Before becoming pregnant I tested + for the CF gene. Had my DH also tested postitive we would have first talked about adoption options, but had we proceeded to conceive on our own, and our baby was + for CF, we probably would have aborted.
I had the same thing happen with testing + for CF but i found out after having suffered a miscarriage. luckily DH didn't test positive, but it made me think about things. i had come to the conclusion if he had, then we might not want to have children, because most CF kids don't live past 30 and they spend their whole life suffering. but that was just me. i personally couldn't abort for my own reasons, especially after going through a loss.
I dont' judge anyone for terminating a pregnancy for any reason. I don't need their reason. I really don't.
I do judge a person who says they wouldn't be an advocate for their child if they had an intellectual disability or because "people like that make others very uncomfortable.". what you do with your ute is no business of mine but there are things you cannot test for inutero and you need to prepare yourself that your life is not going to be perfect, and neither is your child.
As always, Lanie took the words out of my mouth.
I am very curious what that poster will do if their child has a neurological disorder, or even a birth injury.
I don't quite understand why i'm being quoted in this. i was talking about cystic fibrosis, was saying that i would not abort but i would rethink having a child with CF if i knew i was going to have it, i.e., not get pregnant but consider other options, like adopting. sorry for not wanting my child to suffer an illness and then watch them die before they're 30. luckily DH doesn't carry the gene so i don't have to worry about it anymore. maybe i wasn't clear. i would absolutely have a child with down's.
I'll be an outsider with you. Sure, some people with Downs can live great lives, but many, many don't. Many are NOT the high functioning people you see working at your grocery store.
Before becoming pregnant I tested + for the CF gene. Had my DH also tested postitive we would have first talked about adoption options, but had we proceeded to conceive on our own, and our baby was + for CF, we probably would have aborted.
I had the same thing happen with testing + for CF but i found out after having suffered a miscarriage. luckily DH didn't test positive, but it made me think about things. i had come to the conclusion if he had, then we might not want to have children, because most CF kids don't live past 30 and they spend their whole life suffering. but that was just me. i personally couldn't abort for my own reasons, especially after going through a loss.
I dont' judge anyone for terminating a pregnancy for any reason. I don't need their reason. I really don't.
I do judge a person who says they wouldn't be an advocate for their child if they had an intellectual disability or because "people like that make others very uncomfortable.". what you do with your ute is no business of mine but there are things you cannot test for inutero and you need to prepare yourself that your life is not going to be perfect, and neither is your child.
As always, Lanie took the words out of my mouth.
I am very curious what that poster will do if their child has a neurological disorder, or even a birth injury.
I don't quite understand why i'm being quoted in this. i was talking about cystic fibrosis, was saying that i would not abort but i would rethink having a child with CF if i knew i was going to have it, i.e., not get pregnant but consider other options, like adopting. sorry for not wanting my child to suffer an illness and then watch them die before they're 30. luckily DH doesn't carry the gene so i don't have to worry about it anymore. maybe i wasn't clear. i would absolutely have a child with down's.
She quoted you because she agrees with you, and is adding her two cents.
I'll be an outsider with you. Sure, some people with Downs can live great lives, but many, many don't. Many are NOT the high functioning people you see working at your grocery store.
Before becoming pregnant I tested + for the CF gene. Had my DH also tested postitive we would have first talked about adoption options, but had we proceeded to conceive on our own, and our baby was + for CF, we probably would have aborted.
I had the same thing happen with testing + for CF but i found out after having suffered a miscarriage. luckily DH didn't test positive, but it made me think about things. i had come to the conclusion if he had, then we might not want to have children, because most CF kids don't live past 30 and they spend their whole life suffering. but that was just me. i personally couldn't abort for my own reasons, especially after going through a loss.
I dont' judge anyone for terminating a pregnancy for any reason. I don't need their reason. I really don't.
I do judge a person who says they wouldn't be an advocate for their child if they had an intellectual disability or because "people like that make others very uncomfortable.". what you do with your ute is no business of mine but there are things you cannot test for inutero and you need to prepare yourself that your life is not going to be perfect, and neither is your child.
As always, Lanie took the words out of my mouth.
I am very curious what that poster will do if their child has a neurological disorder, or even a birth injury.
I don't quite understand why i'm being quoted in this. i was talking about cystic fibrosis, was saying that i would not abort but i would rethink having a child with CF if i knew i was going to have it, i.e., not get pregnant but consider other options, like adopting. sorry for not wanting my child to suffer an illness and then watch them die before they're 30. luckily DH doesn't carry the gene so i don't have to worry about it anymore. maybe i wasn't clear. i would absolutely have a child with down's.
Oh no, I quoted you I think because your reasoning wasn't ignorant, uninformed and you weren't all like "eww I saw someone with CF at the mall and he freaked me out." That's all. I have 0 issue with you, just trying to say there 's THAT and then there's "ewwwww people with disabilitieeeeeeeeeeeeees"
Which is not you. Sorry to have quoted you without explanation.
If I have a baby with Down Syndrome and it gets passed the screening and pops out of my vag and into my arms... I will love them. May I give them up for adoption? Good chance, because I know myself and that someone else would love to care for them. Are people "lining up" to adopt special needs kids, maybe not, but there are people who don't mind or who even specifically wish to adopt a special needs child. (BTW, fairly certain her "lining up" statement was sarcasm.)
If my baby has another mental disability farther down the line, of course I will be their advocate. Of course I will love them.
But do overly touchy Down "adults" creep me out? Yes. Would my child have a much better life if they had normal mental capacity and skills? Yes. Are their siblings going to suffer and get less attention due to their needy brother or sister? Yes. Am I really hoping and praying for a child who is eventually able to do everything from wiping their own ass to attending college independently? Yes.
So while I'll take what I am given - My life definitely hasn't been predictable thus far by any means. Believe it or not, I've had plenty of struggles - I will also prevent stress and heartache where I can.
My little brother (24yrs) has down's syndrome, so I couldn't fathom having an abortion because of that. I know, because of my lil bro, that down's syndrome does not mean an unhappy life, any more than being born with blue eyes does. He is vibrant, funny, friendly, and HAPPY. He has more friends than I do, and his days are very full with activities. That guy is always on the go!
Just because he can't do things like drive, for example, doesn't mean his life is any less full. Frankly, he doesn't give a crap that he can't drive. lol It's not like he stares at the car and wishes he could get behind the wheel. He just knows he can't, and he doesn't care, because he doesn't know what he's missing.
He takes care of himself (gets dressed, bathes himself, goes to the bathroom on his own, makes simple meals for himself, entertains himself, etc) as most down's syndrome people are able to do.
I think people are (understandably) afraid of the unknown. But honestly, caring for my little brother from the time I can remember (we're only 4 years apart in age), he was actually a lot easier to care for than "normal" kids. Caring for him is different, but certainly NOT harder.
I think some parents of DS people assume that they will have to have their child live with them forever as well. The truth is, my parents have chosen to have him live with them for now, but they receieve social security to help care for his basic needs (since he turned 18), and he goes to a work program from 9-6, M-F. When they decide to, they will move him in to a group home, and he will probably still come home on weekends. There are, like anything, good and bad group homes.. but the good ones are AWESOME.
OH! And don't forget the amount of love that DS people give. Their love is 100% unconditional, non-judgemental. DS people are widely known for being extremely loving and affectionate. Their ability for compassion is amazing.
Omg.. first of all I'm against abortion so the fact that you would even think to abort your child because he/she is not *perfectly healthy* like you seems very selfish. If you can't handle a child with disabilities or major illnesses at least put him/her up for adoption- children with disabilities are still human beings.. The child didn't decide to come into this world OR have disabilities, but killing him/her because of the challenges shouldn't be the way to go. Don't get me wrong, there are some instances where they have to abort because the child is already dying or other reasons where they would just suffer and wouldn't survive long, but aborting because your child has Down syndrome? There are a lot of people in this world with Downs who are brilliant, successful, and just wonderful people. I'm already in the mindset that I'm gonna love my child no matter what, but if I didn't want to have my child because they had a disability I would at least give them up for adoption so they had a chance at life. Idk.. sorry, this is my 2 cents.
Because people are lining up to adopt kids with special needs.
Wow VERY mature reply. Of course people aren't LINING UP to adopt special needs children, but there are MANY people mature enough to love and care for one! Like people facing infertility, there are many families who would love to just have a child no matter what the circumstances.
I wouldn't rule out any option. My sister is severely disabled, and I've seen what my parents have gone through with her. She will never be independent. She's like a 2-year old in 30-year-old's body. I will have to take care of her one day, and it's a huge issue for everyone in my family. I wouldn't choose that life for anyone. I think it's easy to say that "special needs" kids are no big deal if you haven't dealt with it it every single day. Maybe they're cute and happy when they're little, but it's a lot harder when they're grown adults. After you're gone, who will take care of them? There are a lot of issues people don't think about.
This. If your special needs child outlives you, they typically become a burden either on another family member or the system. That isn't fair to anyone.
My thoughts on abortion have probably shifted since becoming pregnant but I would still rather no child than a severely mentally disabled child. What does a mentally disabled person contribute to the world? Honestly, they might brighten their family's life, but I want my baby to at least have the chance to grow up to be president or an engineer or a writer... not a greeter.
I also find mentally disabled persons extremely uncomfortable to be around for non family members. A "man" with Down Syndrome insisted on hugging me once while I was shopping. My high school had a large program for disabled kids and there were kids that barked, that drooled, that were overly touchy and had no sense of boundaries. Ego is an important part in human development from an evolutionary standpoint and without that filter it is all but impossible to function in society.
I didn't mean that I didn't want everyone's opinion, but more pointing out that I was looking for people who share my views and concerns versus trying to start an argument.
As for asking what I have against "sick" children, I would not just love but FIGHT for my child if they were mentally normal but physically ill.
of all the hurtful, hateful, cruel and ignorant posts I have ever read this passage takes the cake
I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
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OP, I truly do not believe you are mature enough to be a parent. You really scare me. What will you do if your "perfect" child is diagnosed with Autism at age 3? Or is in a car accident and left mentally and physically disabled at age 16? Or drowns and is revived and has an anoxic brain injury when they are 13 years old? Or a 10 year old has a freak fall carrying cake plate to the neighbors house and cuts a main artery in their leg, but survives, but will have permanent brain damage. I personally know families that each of those exact things have happened to. These are just a few examples of things that can and do happen to children. There are many, many, many more scenarios.
You are very ignorant and self absorbed. You should get out into the real world and maybe do some volunteering at a local Cerebral Palsy Center or as another poster said, Special Olympics. You are missing out on knowing some truly wonderful people.
Making the decision to have a child is momentous. It is to decide forever to have your heart go walking around outside your body. ~ Elizabeth Stone
"Don't marry a man unless you would be PROUD to have a son exactly like him." ~ Unknown
I am pro-life and I have a brother who is mentally challenged. My mother was a Special Olympics coach and a special ed teacher so to say that I have experience with those who have disabilities is an understatement. There are a lot of factors that go into raising a child with special needs. If you are one of the luckier ones your child would be higher functioning. Unfortunately there are a lot of people who have children who are not higher functioning and the time that they put into their children is more than a great majority of people would ever understand. Parenting a child with a mental or sever physical disability is a challenge that only those who do it can truly understand and is not like parenting a "normal" child. You also have to consider what will be done when you pass away. Who is going to take care of that person now? Do you leave them for another sibling to raise? Do you give that responsibility and yes potential burden on another person who had nothing to do with the conceiving and raising of that child? Is every family member suppose to feel honored and not at all resentful that they now have the responsibility of changing the diaper of an adult for the rest of their lives because they are family and you are suppose to love them unconditionally?
After factoring in all of that I still would never abort my child unless I knew that I was guaranteed to die or my child would be destined to a miserably painful life and even then I don't know if I could do it. There are no guarantees in life and if you are not ready to take all that comes with having children then you shouldn't be having children. Just because a person does not fit into societies view of "perfect" does not mean that that person does not deserve a shot at life. It doesn't mean that they are unworthy to breathe the same air that we do. God made every person with a gift and a talent and just because YOU cannot see it does not mean that it is not there.
My little brother (24yrs) has down's syndrome, so I couldn't fathom having an abortion because of that. I know, because of my lil bro, that down's syndrome does not mean an unhappy life, any more than being born with blue eyes does. He is vibrant, funny, friendly, and HAPPY. He has more friends than I do, and his days are very full with activities. That guy is always on the go!
Just because he can't do things like drive, for example, doesn't mean his life is any less full. Frankly, he doesn't give a crap that he can't drive. lol It's not like he stares at the car and wishes he could get behind the wheel. He just knows he can't, and he doesn't care, because he doesn't know what he's missing.
He takes care of himself (gets dressed, bathes himself, goes to the bathroom on his own, makes simple meals for himself, entertains himself, etc) as most down's syndrome people are able to do.
I think people are (understandably) afraid of the unknown. But honestly, caring for my little brother from the time I can remember (we're only 4 years apart in age), he was actually a lot easier to care for than "normal" kids. Caring for him is different, but certainly NOT harder.
I think some parents of DS people assume that they will have to have their child live with them forever as well. The truth is, my parents have chosen to have him live with them for now, but they receieve social security to help care for his basic needs (since he turned 18), and he goes to a work program from 9-6, M-F. When they decide to, they will move him in to a group home, and he will probably still come home on weekends. There are, like anything, good and bad group homes.. but the good ones are AWESOME.
OH! And don't forget the amount of love that DS people give. Their love is 100% unconditional, non-judgemental. DS people are widely known for being extremely loving and affectionate. Their ability for compassion is amazing.
Your brother is extremely lucky to be high functioning. Not all DS children are.
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OP, I don't even know where to start. On one hand, I want to tear you apart, but on the other hand, I'm almost too disheartened by your narrow-mindedness to lay into you.
I'm an active volunteer with the DS community and have been for many years. I would hate to confuse you with the facts of DS children being mainstreamed in schools. Shocking, I know! I guess I also shouldn't mention the college program offered to DS students by one of our local colleges. They're actually attending regular college classes and earning credits. Gasp!
And before you say "this is the exception to the rule," I suggest you read a little about how far intervention, educational opportunities and therapies have come for DS individuals. Then venture outside your bubble and think about where those things could go in the future. While it is true that individuals with DS can fall into a wide range of abilities, your assumption about their quality of life is disgusting, to say the least.
I am pro-choice, so needless to say, I'm not here to judge anyone's reason for ending a pregnancy. I do feel completely free, however, to judge your narrow-minded view of people with mental disabilities.You need to educate yourself, beyond wiki, about mental disabilities. I would argue that your blatant display of bigotry is a much bigger handicap than an individual with DS hugging you in a mall.
Omg.. first of all I'm against abortion so the fact that you would even think to abort your child because he/she is not *perfectly healthy* like you seems very selfish. If you can't handle a child with disabilities or major illnesses at least put him/her up for adoption- children with disabilities are still human beings.. The child didn't decide to come into this world OR have disabilities, but killing him/her because of the challenges shouldn't be the way to go. Don't get me wrong, there are some instances where they have to abort because the child is already dying or other reasons where they would just suffer and wouldn't survive long, but aborting because your child has Down syndrome? There are a lot of people in this world with Downs who are brilliant, successful, and just wonderful people. I'm already in the mindset that I'm gonna love my child no matter what, but if I didn't want to have my child because they had a disability I would at least give them up for adoption so they had a chance at life. Idk.. sorry, this is my 2 cents.
Because people are lining up to adopt kids with special needs.
Wow VERY mature reply. Of course people aren't LINING UP to adopt special needs children, but there are MANY people mature enough to love and care for one! Like people facing infertility, there are many families who would love to just have a child no matter what the circumstances.
Yes, you're right. Special needs children should be adopted out to infertile couples, who should just be happy to have a child.
I don't doubt that you are alone in your thinking.
It's just that there are some of us who think that is a sad way of thinking. And I'm very pro choice. But I am also an advocate for people living with disabilities and think that terminating a pregnancy because a man in the mall hugged you once and made you uncomfortable is bizarre. I also think that you need to take your head out of your ass because a lot of intellectual disabilities do not show up on prenatal tests and you need to be strong enough to be an advocate for a child who may, yes, have an intellectual disability you couldn't terminate.
I 100% agree with all of this. I guess I'm a pro-choicer on my high horse according to the OP.
I also find it ironic that the OP stated on Monday that she believes women who choose not to BF their children make less than suitable parents. Because she is obviously going to be a real prize of a mother. . .
TTC #1 Sept 2008 M/C 9/21/09 | M/C 12/24/09 | BFP 1/23/10 Madeline Rey DOB 9/30/10 TTC # 2 Jan 2013 BFP 3/12/13 | EDD 11/18/13 It's a GIRL! Lydia Marie!
I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
There's a difference between choosing to abort a pg with a severely disabled child and being disgusted by people with special needs. The first if a very personal decision that each couple needs to make, the second is just deplorable.
Its hard to say what I would do if faced with that situation. It would be something I'd consider early on in pregnancy. It was something I thought about prior to my NT scan. I almost skipped out on it because it was stressing me out so much. I felt I would abort if something was really wrong (on further testing) but I really didn't want to have to make the decision or experience it so part of me wanted to just let what will be be, and deal with it. I feel that an abortion would be an emotional, traumatizing experience and it would cause me to never want to try again for a pregnancy. However, if for whatever reason the baby was born with a disability I would definitely not put him/her up for adoption. At that point I would want the best life for my child and I don't think adoption would lead to a more optimal life for this baby as not many people out there are looking to adopt special needs children.
This. If your special needs child outlives you, they typically become a burden either on another family member or the system. That isn't fair to anyone.
There are many, many people who are a burden to their families and the system that aren't mentally or physically handicapped.
I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
A lot of people used to think the same thing about bringing biracial children into this world. I don't think struggle is a bad thing. Thank heavens people have come before us and made that challenge a little easier.
I am very pro choice, as I've stated, and I find neither aborting or not aborting as "selfish." I find that statement more than a little ignorant.
Do, don't. I don't give a hoot. But I do find it odd that what's being lost in all of this is the idea that we are somehow using a measuring stick to say who is and who is not welcome in our society and even using stupid statements like "I saw someone at the mall" as our basis for standardizing all intellectually disabled individuals.
This wasn't asking "would you terminate?" And that isn't the reaction most are having here. The reaction is to her asshattery and statements such as "Someone hugged me at the mall and it made me feel awkward."
Um. Ok. High functioning, low functioning, whatever functioning, people deserve respect. And their struggles, however they came about them, also deserve respect.
My little brother (24yrs) has down's syndrome, so I couldn't fathom having an abortion because of that. I know, because of my lil bro, that down's syndrome does not mean an unhappy life, any more than being born with blue eyes does. He is vibrant, funny, friendly, and HAPPY. He has more friends than I do, and his days are very full with activities. That guy is always on the go!
Just because he can't do things like drive, for example, doesn't mean his life is any less full. Frankly, he doesn't give a crap that he can't drive. lol It's not like he stares at the car and wishes he could get behind the wheel. He just knows he can't, and he doesn't care, because he doesn't know what he's missing.
He takes care of himself (gets dressed, bathes himself, goes to the bathroom on his own, makes simple meals for himself, entertains himself, etc) as most down's syndrome people are able to do.
I think people are (understandably) afraid of the unknown. But honestly, caring for my little brother from the time I can remember (we're only 4 years apart in age), he was actually a lot easier to care for than "normal" kids. Caring for him is different, but certainly NOT harder.
I think some parents of DS people assume that they will have to have their child live with them forever as well. The truth is, my parents have chosen to have him live with them for now, but they receieve social security to help care for his basic needs (since he turned 18), and he goes to a work program from 9-6, M-F. When they decide to, they will move him in to a group home, and he will probably still come home on weekends. There are, like anything, good and bad group homes.. but the good ones are AWESOME.
OH! And don't forget the amount of love that DS people give. Their love is 100% unconditional, non-judgemental. DS people are widely known for being extremely loving and affectionate. Their ability for compassion is amazing.
Your brother is extremely lucky to be high functioning. Not all DS children are.
You are extremely lucky that your brother is high functioning. I am a pro lifer and I have a brother who is mentally challenged and higher functioning. I too am lucky but I do not look forward to the day that he becomes my responsibility. The damage, yes damage, that has been done to my family due to his condition has been extreme and I am not looking forward to having that responsibility laid out for me to handle. In fact I am resentful of it. People can judge but the truth is, as happy as most people think those with disabilities are they are not there when the doors are closed and the tantrums ensue.
So while I'll take what I am given - My life definitely hasn't been predictable thus far by any means. Believe it or not, I've had plenty of struggles - I will also prevent stress and heartache where I can.
I am not evil. I am honest.
Give me a break. You think you are the only one who has had struggles? I am sure we could all get into a pissing contest on here about the crap we have been through. It doesn't justify your attitude towards those with mental disabilities.
I am pro-choice. I would like to think that I am strong enough in my faith, my relationship, and myself to be able to handle a less than 'perfect' child. I do not however judge others for their decisions. What I do judge are the pretty ridiculous sentiments you have expressed on here.
It seems like the choice to abort a child with DS wouldn't be out of compassion for the child. It would be for YOU so you didn't have to deal with a less than perfect child.
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We're keeping our baby no matter what. No political, religious or any other reasons except we've already lost one baby and we're perfectly capable of researching and rising to the challenge of whatever the baby brings to us. It's not the baby's fault if anything isn't "quite right".
Have you heard of the T-4 program? It's the program in place by Germany before the Final Solution. It targeted Germans with any issues "feeblemindedness" "idiocy" old age and any birth defects. These aren't my terms, they're the terms used by physicians in the 20s and 30s. Hitler exterminated a distant cousin. Oh no, eugenics and genetic "cleanliness" was a WORLD WIDE issue. Check out Buck v. Bell. My work is working with the Holocaust Museum on this exhibit "Deadly Medicine" and under normal non-pregnant circumstances I would be more than happy to docent and lead tours. However, being obviously pregnant, I'd rather avoid any chance of getting cornered by patrons wanting to discuss modern ethics.
The thing that bothers me the most about the T-4 program is this: I am 24, good health, and I'm working on a Masters Degree. I have a good job with the government. If I had been born in Germany in the 20s or 30s, I would have been killed because I was born with clubfeet.
This. If your special needs child outlives you, they typically become a burden either on another family member or the system. That isn't fair to anyone.
There are many, many people who are a burden to their families and the system that aren't mentally or physically handicapped.
Indeed, we likely will be nursing our aging parents and ILs at one point and they will be our responsibility. Alzheimers, parkinsons, a variety of aging illnesses could happent o all of us or our parents.
and could happen to us. Burden on the system? we're all going to be.
I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
it's only selfish if you don't care adequately for them. i guess maybe it takes a bigger heart or being financially and emotionally stable. but i have a cousin who is lower functioning. it would have only "destroyed" our family if the members of my family were narrow minded. luckily everyone in my family embraces her, loves her and she is the life of the party. her brother and sister LOVE her. there are already arrangements in order if her parents were to pass away and she will continue to be well taken care of. there's not a single person in my family that wouldn't jump at a chance to take her (and her brother and sister) in.
i must be really sad to view the world like you.
eta: i also agree with pp about all the education, early intervention,
and support that is out there now. there are a lot of resources if you
care enough to look into them.
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I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
This.
Why is everyone missing the keyword here, which is preventable. I am not saying I am going to choke out my Down Syndrome newborn or go on a killing spree at the Special Olympics. I am just saying that if given the choice, I will terminate (which I am sure will wreck me) and hope I can get pregnant again with a normal child.
People with mental disabilities (severe) are not the same as people with blue eyes. It is not a race. It is a DISABILITY. DS is an extra chromosome, an undesirable outcome by definition. As I said before, if you think they offer the screening for Down just so you can prepare for it, you're kidding yourself.
If anyone can find a statistic saying abortion rates are less than 90%, please post it. That stat suggests that even people who are normally pro-life will typically choose to abort a DS baby.
I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
There's a difference between choosing to abort a pg with a severely disabled child and being disgusted by people with special needs. The first if a very personal decision that each couple needs to make, the second is just deplorable.
I 100% agree.
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My little brother (24yrs) has down's syndrome, so I couldn't fathom having an abortion because of that. I know, because of my lil bro, that down's syndrome does not mean an unhappy life, any more than being born with blue eyes does. He is vibrant, funny, friendly, and HAPPY. He has more friends than I do, and his days are very full with activities. That guy is always on the go!
Just because he can't do things like drive, for example, doesn't mean his life is any less full. Frankly, he doesn't give a crap that he can't drive. lol It's not like he stares at the car and wishes he could get behind the wheel. He just knows he can't, and he doesn't care, because he doesn't know what he's missing.
He takes care of himself (gets dressed, bathes himself, goes to the bathroom on his own, makes simple meals for himself, entertains himself, etc) as most down's syndrome people are able to do.
I think people are (understandably) afraid of the unknown. But honestly, caring for my little brother from the time I can remember (we're only 4 years apart in age), he was actually a lot easier to care for than "normal" kids. Caring for him is different, but certainly NOT harder.
I think some parents of DS people assume that they will have to have their child live with them forever as well. The truth is, my parents have chosen to have him live with them for now, but they receieve social security to help care for his basic needs (since he turned 18), and he goes to a work program from 9-6, M-F. When they decide to, they will move him in to a group home, and he will probably still come home on weekends. There are, like anything, good and bad group homes.. but the good ones are AWESOME.
OH! And don't forget the amount of love that DS people give. Their love is 100% unconditional, non-judgemental. DS people are widely known for being extremely loving and affectionate. Their ability for compassion is amazing.
Your brother is extremely lucky to be high functioning. Not all DS children are.
You're absolutely right, but from my admittedly limited experience working with his special needs school, special olympics, and being part of DS support systems... a very high number are.
I think parenting and support has a part in this as well. Of course, I'm NOT AT ALL saying that lower-functioning special needs people have bad parents. But I do believe that the earlier a child gets specialized help from professionals, the higher the chance to live a highly functional life are. And the prospects for this happening with DS people is pretty darn high.
I think SOME of the people that are lower-functioning adults, could have been much more successful if their parents/caregivers would've known about or taken advantage of the resources available to them.
Many times it's ignorance about what services are out there, lack of emotional support from extended family/friends, financial issues, and many other times it can be laziness, frankly. I've seen it first-hand, and it's incredibly frustrating.
There's a difference between choosing to abort a pg with a severely disabled child and being disgusted by people with special needs. The first if a very personal decision that each couple needs to make, the second is just deplorable.
All I'm doing in the thread is saying "this"... but THIS. I'm actually a bit uncomfortable that I posted something that might be construed as agreeing with the OP earlier in the post.
This. If your special needs child outlives you, they typically become a burden either on another family member or the system. That isn't fair to anyone.
There are many, many people who are a burden to their families and the system that aren't mentally or physically handicapped.
Indeed, we likely will be nursing our aging parents and ILs at one point and they will be our responsibility. Alzheimers, parkinsons, a variety of aging illnesses could happent o all of us or our parents.
and could happen to us. Burden on the system? we're all going to be.
nah, she'll probably just stick her mom in a home.
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I value all life equally.... so my question would be, what makes a disabled person's life have any less value than that of you or I. God created that life, perfect or inperfect. It is not my place (or yours) to say that he doesn't have the right to live. Not everything in life is how we say it here?? oh ya puppies and rainbows. We take the easy with the hard.
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I find this post amusing. Why? Because you just keep spilling your stupidity all over this board.
Let me remind you that you just posted this a few days ago:
I have a problem with moms who don't really try, mothers who won't for
"emotional reasons" (seriously, if you're that damaged I don't
understand why you'd want to reproduce), or mothers who opt to bottle
feed because it's easier socially. It sounds like you did everything in
your power, but there are mothers who decide during pregnancy to only
use formula and there are doctors who are OK with that, and I think
that's wrong.
Maybe you should step back and take a look in the mirror.
I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
it's only selfish if you don't care adequately for them. i guess maybe it takes a bigger heart or being financially and emotionally stable. but i have a cousin who is lower functioning. it would have only "destroyed" our family if the members of my family were narrow minded. luckily everyone in my family embraces her, loves her and she is the life of the party. her brother and sister LOVE her. there are already arrangements in order if her parents were to pass away and she will continue to be well taken care of. there's not a single person in my family that wouldn't jump at a chance to take her (and her brother and sister) in.
i must be really sad to view the world like you.
Are you going to be the one that has to take responsibility for your cousin when his caregivers die? Becuase boy, does that make the situation a whole lot different when you are in it. My family has taken excellent care of our DS family member, and we love him immensely, but his constant tantrums and inappropriate behavior have been such a struggle for his caregivers and his care has completely taken over their lives.
Don't tell me how I view the world, your world is nothing like mine.
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This. If your special needs child outlives you, they typically become a burden either on another family member or the system. That isn't fair to anyone.
There are many, many people who are a burden to their families and the system that aren't mentally or physically handicapped.
Indeed, we likely will be nursing our aging parents and ILs at one point and they will be our responsibility. Alzheimers, parkinsons, a variety of aging illnesses could happent o all of us or our parents.
and could happen to us. Burden on the system? we're all going to be.
nah, she'll probably just stick her mom in a home.
While I agree with most of what you have said in this post, you have to be careful with statements like that. My father was placed in a home 2 years ago due to his Huntington's disease. We were unable to care for him at home any longer (had been for 7+ years) He was unable to keep weight on (a common side effect of Huntington's and not being able to get physical therapy in the house) among other things. It is an incredibly painful decision to have to come to terms with the fact that you can no longer care for a family member and give them the care that they deserve. I felt really guilty and shiity for quite a while. His health has improved and he is thriving in that environment now.
That being said, I get what you were trying to say though.
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My little brother (24yrs) has down's syndrome, so I couldn't fathom having an abortion because of that. I know, because of my lil bro, that down's syndrome does not mean an unhappy life, any more than being born with blue eyes does. He is vibrant, funny, friendly, and HAPPY. He has more friends than I do, and his days are very full with activities. That guy is always on the go!
Just because he can't do things like drive, for example, doesn't mean his life is any less full. Frankly, he doesn't give a crap that he can't drive. lol It's not like he stares at the car and wishes he could get behind the wheel. He just knows he can't, and he doesn't care, because he doesn't know what he's missing.
He takes care of himself (gets dressed, bathes himself, goes to the bathroom on his own, makes simple meals for himself, entertains himself, etc) as most down's syndrome people are able to do.
I think people are (understandably) afraid of the unknown. But honestly, caring for my little brother from the time I can remember (we're only 4 years apart in age), he was actually a lot easier to care for than "normal" kids. Caring for him is different, but certainly NOT harder.
I think some parents of DS people assume that they will have to have their child live with them forever as well. The truth is, my parents have chosen to have him live with them for now, but they receieve social security to help care for his basic needs (since he turned 18), and he goes to a work program from 9-6, M-F. When they decide to, they will move him in to a group home, and he will probably still come home on weekends. There are, like anything, good and bad group homes.. but the good ones are AWESOME.
OH! And don't forget the amount of love that DS people give. Their love is 100% unconditional, non-judgemental. DS people are widely known for being extremely loving and affectionate. Their ability for compassion is amazing.
Your brother is extremely lucky to be high functioning. Not all DS children are.
You're absolutely right, but from my admittedly limited experience working with his special needs school, special olympics, and being part of DS support systems... a very high number are.
I think parenting and support has a part in this as well. Of course, I'm NOT AT ALL saying that lower-functioning special needs people have bad parents. But I do believe that the earlier a child gets specialized help from professionals, the higher the chance to live a highly functional life are. And the prospects for this happening with DS people is pretty darn high.
I think SOME of the people that are lower-functioning adults, could have been much more successful if their parents/caregivers would've known about or taken advantage of the resources available to them.
Many times it's ignorance about what services are out there, lack of emotional support from extended family/friends, financial issues, and many other times it can be laziness, frankly. I've seen it first-hand, and it's incredibly frustrating.
You are making assumptions, and frankly, it's very offensive. Not all retardation can be modified or controlled through therapy and meds. Trust me.
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There's a difference between choosing to abort a pg with a severely disabled child and being disgusted by people with special needs. The first if a very personal decision that each couple needs to make, the second is just deplorable.
All I'm doing in the thread is saying "this"... but THIS. I'm actually a bit uncomfortable that I posted something that might be construed as agreeing with the OP earlier in the post.
Ditto 100%. I was trying to think of how to say this. I totally stand behind what I said, but I don't want to be viewed as supporting other points from the OP, which I don't agree with in the least.
I am not a pro-lifer, but I don't think I could ever just get rid of my baby. I feel so attached to it already. We got the down syndrome test, but not to see if we needed to abort, but so we could prepare ourselves in advance for caring for a baby with a disability.
Attacking my opinions is one thing, but why attack me?
What do my thoughts on the mentally disabled have to do with my thoughts on my mother?
People cry when they find out their children have disabilities. There are support groups and parent meet-ups. Yet I am a bad person for saying in advance that I will be bummed if there are problems with my child?
After all, what is it that people always say when you ask them if they want a boy or a girl. Oh yes:
"It doesn't matter as long as he or she is healthy."
I guess I just have different ideas about what is healthy.
I could be wrong, but aren't DS kids also much more prone to other illnesses and complications?
I also don't think I ever said that ALL disabled people make me uncomfortable. (Although I don't think "uncomfortable" is really inappropriate so much as just stating an emotion that is out of my control.) Who of you would be absolutely fine with a stranger coming up to you and hugging you, disabled or not?
Maybe late here but this is one of the most vile, loathsome and heartbreakingly disconcerting posts I've ever read. Hollowstar, your capacity for ignorance is astounding.
Re: Sensitive Subject - Not keeping baby with (certain) disabilities?
I don't quite understand why i'm being quoted in this. i was talking about cystic fibrosis, was saying that i would not abort but i would rethink having a child with CF if i knew i was going to have it, i.e., not get pregnant but consider other options, like adopting. sorry for not wanting my child to suffer an illness and then watch them die before they're 30. luckily DH doesn't carry the gene so i don't have to worry about it anymore. maybe i wasn't clear. i would absolutely have a child with down's.
She quoted you because she agrees with you, and is adding her two cents.
Oh no, I quoted you I think because your reasoning wasn't ignorant, uninformed and you weren't all like "eww I saw someone with CF at the mall and he freaked me out." That's all. I have 0 issue with you, just trying to say there 's THAT and then there's "ewwwww people with disabilitieeeeeeeeeeeeees"
Which is not you.
Sorry to have quoted you without explanation.
Take it from a mother of an autistic child...
YOU ARE DISGUSTING!!!!
I'm sickened by the fact that you are procreating.
If I have a baby with Down Syndrome and it gets passed the screening and pops out of my vag and into my arms... I will love them. May I give them up for adoption? Good chance, because I know myself and that someone else would love to care for them. Are people "lining up" to adopt special needs kids, maybe not, but there are people who don't mind or who even specifically wish to adopt a special needs child. (BTW, fairly certain her "lining up" statement was sarcasm.)
If my baby has another mental disability farther down the line, of course I will be their advocate. Of course I will love them.
But do overly touchy Down "adults" creep me out? Yes. Would my child have a much better life if they had normal mental capacity and skills? Yes. Are their siblings going to suffer and get less attention due to their needy brother or sister? Yes. Am I really hoping and praying for a child who is eventually able to do everything from wiping their own ass to attending college independently? Yes.
So while I'll take what I am given - My life definitely hasn't been predictable thus far by any means. Believe it or not, I've had plenty of struggles - I will also prevent stress and heartache where I can.
I am not evil. I am honest.
Mama to Sebastian, born 9/2010
My little brother (24yrs) has down's syndrome, so I couldn't fathom having an abortion because of that. I know, because of my lil bro, that down's syndrome does not mean an unhappy life, any more than being born with blue eyes does. He is vibrant, funny, friendly, and HAPPY. He has more friends than I do, and his days are very full with activities. That guy is always on the go!
Just because he can't do things like drive, for example, doesn't mean his life is any less full. Frankly, he doesn't give a crap that he can't drive. lol It's not like he stares at the car and wishes he could get behind the wheel. He just knows he can't, and he doesn't care, because he doesn't know what he's missing.
He takes care of himself (gets dressed, bathes himself, goes to the bathroom on his own, makes simple meals for himself, entertains himself, etc) as most down's syndrome people are able to do.
I think people are (understandably) afraid of the unknown. But honestly, caring for my little brother from the time I can remember (we're only 4 years apart in age), he was actually a lot easier to care for than "normal" kids. Caring for him is different, but certainly NOT harder.
I think some parents of DS people assume that they will have to have their child live with them forever as well. The truth is, my parents have chosen to have him live with them for now, but they receieve social security to help care for his basic needs (since he turned 18), and he goes to a work program from 9-6, M-F. When they decide to, they will move him in to a group home, and he will probably still come home on weekends. There are, like anything, good and bad group homes.. but the good ones are AWESOME.
OH! And don't forget the amount of love that DS people give. Their love is 100% unconditional, non-judgemental. DS people are widely known for being extremely loving and affectionate. Their ability for compassion is amazing.
Mikaela is going to have a little brother!
of all the hurtful, hateful, cruel and ignorant posts I have ever read this passage takes the cake
the quotes around man makes me physically ill
I find it telling that most of the people that have posted about their experiences with severely disabled close family members would consider aborting. Myself included. Those of you that would willingly bring a severely retarded child into this world may be better than me, but I'm ok with that. I've seen what DS children can do to families, and it's not pretty. Plus, I will not be here forever to take care of the child and I won't place that burden on others.
In my opinion, it's selfish on the part of the parents to knowingly bring severely disabled children into the world knowing that they will forever struggle and never lead a normal life.
OP, I truly do not believe you are mature enough to be a parent. You really scare me. What will you do if your "perfect" child is diagnosed with Autism at age 3? Or is in a car accident and left mentally and physically disabled at age 16? Or drowns and is revived and has an anoxic brain injury when they are 13 years old? Or a 10 year old has a freak fall carrying cake plate to the neighbors house and cuts a main artery in their leg, but survives, but will have permanent brain damage. I personally know families that each of those exact things have happened to. These are just a few examples of things that can and do happen to children. There are many, many, many more scenarios.
You are very ignorant and self absorbed. You should get out into the real world and maybe do some volunteering at a local Cerebral Palsy Center or as another poster said, Special Olympics. You are missing out on knowing some truly wonderful people.
"Don't marry a man unless you would be PROUD to have a son exactly like him." ~ Unknown
I am pro-life and I have a brother who is mentally challenged. My mother was a Special Olympics coach and a special ed teacher so to say that I have experience with those who have disabilities is an understatement. There are a lot of factors that go into raising a child with special needs. If you are one of the luckier ones your child would be higher functioning. Unfortunately there are a lot of people who have children who are not higher functioning and the time that they put into their children is more than a great majority of people would ever understand. Parenting a child with a mental or sever physical disability is a challenge that only those who do it can truly understand and is not like parenting a "normal" child. You also have to consider what will be done when you pass away. Who is going to take care of that person now? Do you leave them for another sibling to raise? Do you give that responsibility and yes potential burden on another person who had nothing to do with the conceiving and raising of that child? Is every family member suppose to feel honored and not at all resentful that they now have the responsibility of changing the diaper of an adult for the rest of their lives because they are family and you are suppose to love them unconditionally?
After factoring in all of that I still would never abort my child unless I knew that I was guaranteed to die or my child would be destined to a miserably painful life and even then I don't know if I could do it. There are no guarantees in life and if you are not ready to take all that comes with having children then you shouldn't be having children. Just because a person does not fit into societies view of "perfect" does not mean that that person does not deserve a shot at life. It doesn't mean that they are unworthy to breathe the same air that we do. God made every person with a gift and a talent and just because YOU cannot see it does not mean that it is not there.
Your brother is extremely lucky to be high functioning. Not all DS children are.
OP, I don't even know where to start. On one hand, I want to tear you apart, but on the other hand, I'm almost too disheartened by your narrow-mindedness to lay into you.
I'm an active volunteer with the DS community and have been for many years. I would hate to confuse you with the facts of DS children being mainstreamed in schools. Shocking, I know! I guess I also shouldn't mention the college program offered to DS students by one of our local colleges. They're actually attending regular college classes and earning credits. Gasp!
And before you say "this is the exception to the rule," I suggest you read a little about how far intervention, educational opportunities and therapies have come for DS individuals. Then venture outside your bubble and think about where those things could go in the future. While it is true that individuals with DS can fall into a wide range of abilities, your assumption about their quality of life is disgusting, to say the least.
I am pro-choice, so needless to say, I'm not here to judge anyone's reason for ending a pregnancy. I do feel completely free, however, to judge your narrow-minded view of people with mental disabilities.You need to educate yourself, beyond wiki, about mental disabilities. I would argue that your blatant display of bigotry is a much bigger handicap than an individual with DS hugging you in a mall.
thank you! thankfully they have a lot more compassion than a lot of the insensitive jerks on here.
your brother sounds amazing!
Yes, you're right. Special needs children should be adopted out to infertile couples, who should just be happy to have a child.
I also find it ironic that the OP stated on Monday that she believes women who choose not to BF their children make less than suitable parents. Because she is obviously going to be a real prize of a mother. . .
M/C 9/21/09 | M/C 12/24/09 | BFP 1/23/10
Madeline Rey DOB 9/30/10
TTC # 2 Jan 2013
BFP 3/12/13 | EDD 11/18/13
It's a GIRL! Lydia Marie!
Being "honest" does not mean you're not nasty and sort of dim.
Updated September 2012.
There's a difference between choosing to abort a pg with a severely disabled child and being disgusted by people with special needs. The first if a very personal decision that each couple needs to make, the second is just deplorable.
There are many, many people who are a burden to their families and the system that aren't mentally or physically handicapped.
A lot of people used to think the same thing about bringing biracial children into this world. I don't think struggle is a bad thing. Thank heavens people have come before us and made that challenge a little easier.
I am very pro choice, as I've stated, and I find neither aborting or not aborting as "selfish." I find that statement more than a little ignorant.
Do, don't. I don't give a hoot. But I do find it odd that what's being lost in all of this is the idea that we are somehow using a measuring stick to say who is and who is not welcome in our society and even using stupid statements like "I saw someone at the mall" as our basis for standardizing all intellectually disabled individuals.
This wasn't asking "would you terminate?" And that isn't the reaction most are having here. The reaction is to her asshattery and statements such as "Someone hugged me at the mall and it made me feel awkward."
Um. Ok. High functioning, low functioning, whatever functioning, people deserve respect. And their struggles, however they came about them, also deserve respect.
You are extremely lucky that your brother is high functioning. I am a pro lifer and I have a brother who is mentally challenged and higher functioning. I too am lucky but I do not look forward to the day that he becomes my responsibility. The damage, yes damage, that has been done to my family due to his condition has been extreme and I am not looking forward to having that responsibility laid out for me to handle. In fact I am resentful of it. People can judge but the truth is, as happy as most people think those with disabilities are they are not there when the doors are closed and the tantrums ensue.
Give me a break. You think you are the only one who has had struggles? I am sure we could all get into a pissing contest on here about the crap we have been through. It doesn't justify your attitude towards those with mental disabilities.
I am pro-choice. I would like to think that I am strong enough in my faith, my relationship, and myself to be able to handle a less than 'perfect' child. I do not however judge others for their decisions. What I do judge are the pretty ridiculous sentiments you have expressed on here.
It seems like the choice to abort a child with DS wouldn't be out of compassion for the child. It would be for YOU so you didn't have to deal with a less than perfect child.
We're keeping our baby no matter what. No political, religious or any other reasons except we've already lost one baby and we're perfectly capable of researching and rising to the challenge of whatever the baby brings to us. It's not the baby's fault if anything isn't "quite right".
Have you heard of the T-4 program? It's the program in place by Germany before the Final Solution. It targeted Germans with any issues "feeblemindedness" "idiocy" old age and any birth defects. These aren't my terms, they're the terms used by physicians in the 20s and 30s. Hitler exterminated a distant cousin. Oh no, eugenics and genetic "cleanliness" was a WORLD WIDE issue. Check out Buck v. Bell. My work is working with the Holocaust Museum on this exhibit "Deadly Medicine" and under normal non-pregnant circumstances I would be more than happy to docent and lead tours. However, being obviously pregnant, I'd rather avoid any chance of getting cornered by patrons wanting to discuss modern ethics.
The thing that bothers me the most about the T-4 program is this: I am 24, good health, and I'm working on a Masters Degree. I have a good job with the government. If I had been born in Germany in the 20s or 30s, I would have been killed because I was born with clubfeet.
2011 Reading Challenge
Indeed, we likely will be nursing our aging parents and ILs at one point and they will be our responsibility. Alzheimers, parkinsons, a variety of aging illnesses could happent o all of us or our parents.
and could happen to us. Burden on the system? we're all going to be.
it's only selfish if you don't care adequately for them. i guess maybe it takes a bigger heart or being financially and emotionally stable. but i have a cousin who is lower functioning. it would have only "destroyed" our family if the members of my family were narrow minded. luckily everyone in my family embraces her, loves her and she is the life of the party. her brother and sister LOVE her. there are already arrangements in order if her parents were to pass away and she will continue to be well taken care of. there's not a single person in my family that wouldn't jump at a chance to take her (and her brother and sister) in.
i must be really sad to view the world like you.
eta: i also agree with pp about all the education, early intervention, and support that is out there now. there are a lot of resources if you care enough to look into them.
This.
Why is everyone missing the keyword here, which is preventable. I am not saying I am going to choke out my Down Syndrome newborn or go on a killing spree at the Special Olympics. I am just saying that if given the choice, I will terminate (which I am sure will wreck me) and hope I can get pregnant again with a normal child.
People with mental disabilities (severe) are not the same as people with blue eyes. It is not a race. It is a DISABILITY. DS is an extra chromosome, an undesirable outcome by definition. As I said before, if you think they offer the screening for Down just so you can prepare for it, you're kidding yourself.
If anyone can find a statistic saying abortion rates are less than 90%, please post it. That stat suggests that even people who are normally pro-life will typically choose to abort a DS baby.
Mama to Sebastian, born 9/2010
I 100% agree.
You're absolutely right, but from my admittedly limited experience working with his special needs school, special olympics, and being part of DS support systems... a very high number are.
I think parenting and support has a part in this as well. Of course, I'm NOT AT ALL saying that lower-functioning special needs people have bad parents. But I do believe that the earlier a child gets specialized help from professionals, the higher the chance to live a highly functional life are. And the prospects for this happening with DS people is pretty darn high.
I think SOME of the people that are lower-functioning adults, could have been much more successful if their parents/caregivers would've known about or taken advantage of the resources available to them.
Many times it's ignorance about what services are out there, lack of emotional support from extended family/friends, financial issues, and many other times it can be laziness, frankly. I've seen it first-hand, and it's incredibly frustrating.
All I'm doing in the thread is saying "this"... but THIS. I'm actually a bit uncomfortable that I posted something that might be construed as agreeing with the OP earlier in the post.
nah, she'll probably just stick her mom in a home.
I value all life equally.... so my question would be, what makes a disabled person's life have any less value than that of you or I. God created that life, perfect or inperfect. It is not my place (or yours) to say that he doesn't have the right to live. Not everything in life is how we say it here?? oh ya puppies and rainbows. We take the easy with the hard.
I find this post amusing. Why? Because you just keep spilling your stupidity all over this board.
Let me remind you that you just posted this a few days ago:
I have a problem with moms who don't really try, mothers who won't for "emotional reasons" (seriously, if you're that damaged I don't understand why you'd want to reproduce), or mothers who opt to bottle feed because it's easier socially. It sounds like you did everything in your power, but there are mothers who decide during pregnancy to only use formula and there are doctors who are OK with that, and I think that's wrong.
Maybe you should step back and take a look in the mirror.
Are you going to be the one that has to take responsibility for your cousin when his caregivers die? Becuase boy, does that make the situation a whole lot different when you are in it. My family has taken excellent care of our DS family member, and we love him immensely, but his constant tantrums and inappropriate behavior have been such a struggle for his caregivers and his care has completely taken over their lives.
Don't tell me how I view the world, your world is nothing like mine.
While I agree with most of what you have said in this post, you have to be careful with statements like that. My father was placed in a home 2 years ago due to his Huntington's disease. We were unable to care for him at home any longer (had been for 7+ years) He was unable to keep weight on (a common side effect of Huntington's and not being able to get physical therapy in the house) among other things. It is an incredibly painful decision to have to come to terms with the fact that you can no longer care for a family member and give them the care that they deserve. I felt really guilty and shiity for quite a while. His health has improved and he is thriving in that environment now.
That being said, I get what you were trying to say though.
You are making assumptions, and frankly, it's very offensive. Not all retardation can be modified or controlled through therapy and meds. Trust me.
Ditto 100%. I was trying to think of how to say this. I totally stand behind what I said, but I don't want to be viewed as supporting other points from the OP, which I don't agree with in the least.
Attacking my opinions is one thing, but why attack me?
What do my thoughts on the mentally disabled have to do with my thoughts on my mother?
People cry when they find out their children have disabilities. There are support groups and parent meet-ups. Yet I am a bad person for saying in advance that I will be bummed if there are problems with my child?
After all, what is it that people always say when you ask them if they want a boy or a girl. Oh yes:
"It doesn't matter as long as he or she is healthy."
I guess I just have different ideas about what is healthy.
I could be wrong, but aren't DS kids also much more prone to other illnesses and complications?
I also don't think I ever said that ALL disabled people make me uncomfortable. (Although I don't think "uncomfortable" is really inappropriate so much as just stating an emotion that is out of my control.) Who of you would be absolutely fine with a stranger coming up to you and hugging you, disabled or not?
Mama to Sebastian, born 9/2010