UO...

northport6

SoMoNY said:

northport6 said:

@gwinnygirl  We really, really, really hope to be ice hockey parents.  We already have an agreement in place that says I don't have to wake up earlier than 7 am for practice/games/transportation in order to make this happen because LAZY. Also SLEEPY.

I was hoping to start DS on skating lessons at Rinx this fall but thinking Spring instead to allow him more time to become better coordinated, better at following instructions and more self-confident.

OMG RINX.  Shades of my own childhood.  *sigh*

natleilynn

Loolaide said:

natleilynn said:

Sigir said:

@KateMW I agree as a mom to two girls! But if it's not too late to join in, I've got what probably is an even more UO than that... I feel that it's selfish not to get prenatal testing, using the excuse "I'd never abort no matter what". IMO that is lazy parenting, because I feel that my job as a parent is to do what is best for my child. W some diagnoses, a child will be born only to die very shortly and in pain. I feel it's responsible parenting to find out what you can for your child in advance, and I'd yor child is diagnosed w one of those diseases, it's good parenting to interrupt the pregnancy in order to spare the child that pain. I think moms to be who refuse all testing based on the risk of anxiety from increases odds for disorders are "sticking their heads in the sand" and not doing the best thing for their child. It's naive, bad parenting IMO. The only slightly acceptable excuse for refusing all parenting IMO would be from a highly religious and highly pro life person. Even then I side eye it, but I can see their point. But those whose only excuse is avoiding anxiety? I judge them heavily.

Side eye and judge me all you want. To DH and I, it honestly didn't matter. It's not that I "don't" believe in abortion (although DH vehemently does not believe in it), but prenatal testing is just not something that I feel like is important. My doctors didn't push the issue, so I must not be the only one out there. Nobody else has to agree with that choice. I don't think it's "selfish" to not choose science. There are plenty of times when the testing has come back with abnormalities - sometimes even with the doctor encouraging abortion - only to have the baby born months later, completely fine. This happens, it's not a fairy tale. I appreciate medical advances, but it's not foolproof. To call me selfish for not trusting it 100% is unfair. I'm not sticking my head in the sand or pretending like nothing bad could happen. I am fully aware that we could have a child with special needs or even one who has a shortened lifespan. We will deal with that when/if the time comes. 

To me, it was an example of pro-choice. My choice is to have the baby, regardless. If they have a shortened life, they will pass away knowing complete love and I won't have to feel guilt for the rest of my life wondering if I did the right thing. I feel guilt from my miscarriage, which wasn't my fault - I wonder constantly if there was something I could have done to prevent it. 

I'm pretty sure this is the first time in my time on this board that I've actually been pretty fired up about something. I think the "selfish" thing is what hit a nerve. That's just...wow.

ETA: I want to clarify one thing. I'm not against abortions. I don't necessarily think they should be used as a method of birth control, but I am completely in support of them for those where the mother/baby's life is in danger/rape/incest/etc. And I'm even in support of those who do prenatal testing and find that their baby might not be compatible with life and have an abortion. I'm just saying, I do not judge people for having prenatal testing and aborting the baby, so I would appreciate not being judged for personally choosing to not have prenatal testing and having the baby.

That's spoken as a "I try to be a non-judgy Christian" girl. 

If you want to come across as non-judgmental, don't spread falsehoods like this.  Sure, screenings come back as high risk and babies are born fine.  That doesn't mean people are aborting healthy babies.  Before abortion, they get an amnio or CVS, like I said above, and that tells them definitively what's up.

Okay, my point is that I'm not judging people who get the prenatal testing so I don't understand why I would be judged for choosing not to. I mean, in the big scheme of things it doesn't matter because our decision for this child has been made. I completely understand why people feel strongly about their own personal decisions. 

I hate that this conversation came at the end of the day because now I'm going to miss it unless I'm able to get back on later tonight. I'm not trying to be snarky here. And I'm not sure why you said "if I want to come across as non-judgmental" - I'm not being judgmental. It doesn't matter to me if you choose to get prenatal testing or not. It doesn't affect my decision and I would never judge someone who chose to get an abortion because of something that came out of their prenatal testing. I completely understand why someone would. It's just not something I personally want to do with this particular child. Maybe with another child I would feel the need to. But I don't see how this makes me judgmental.

Mac2588

Being a teen mom myself and now working on my 4th college degree and married for 12 years to my daughters father, I do not think being a teen mom is the worst thing that could happen to a teen. However, I had a good support system. Now that my daughter is almost 16 I would totally accept/ help her raise the baby if that is what she wanted. Hopefully, with 4 girls we never have to encounter that situation.

natleilynn

Loolaide said:

I want to add, not in response to any particular post, that there were (and are) several board members who had abnormal results at their scans.  A few shared their stories and all pursued further testing to verify the results of those scans before deciding whether they needed to terminate.  Luckily, most did not have to terminate, since their amnio results came back fine, but not a single one terminated without pursuing further testing, and not a single one terminated a child that was later determined to be genetically normal.

Okay - clearly I misunderstood how my doctor explained the testing process to me, which is not completely surprising to me. I retract that portion of my comment. 

Still. I don't see how my choice to not have prenatal testing makes me judgmental or falling short of my responsibilities as a mother. 

natleilynn

Loolaide said:

natleilynn said:

Loolaide said:

I want to add, not in response to any particular post, that there were (and are) several board members who had abnormal results at their scans.  A few shared their stories and all pursued further testing to verify the results of those scans before deciding whether they needed to terminate.  Luckily, most did not have to terminate, since their amnio results came back fine, but not a single one terminated without pursuing further testing, and not a single one terminated a child that was later determined to be genetically normal.

Okay - clearly I misunderstood how my doctor explained the testing process to me, which is not completely surprising to me. I retract that portion of my comment. 

Still. I don't see how my choice to not have prenatal testing makes me judgmental or falling short of my responsibilities as a mother. 

That choice doesn't make you judgmental. Justifying it with falsehoods that make those who would abort look like healthy baby killers does.

It's like me saying that it's fine if you don't want to test, but you're dooming your baby to a short and painful life. One doesn't necessarily cause the other and it's over the top.

Seriously? I wholeheartedly apologize if I came across as saying that anyone who aborts due to prenatal testing is a baby killer. Heck, I don't call people who get abortions just because "baby killers". All I'm trying to say is that I did not choose to get prenatal testing, I don't think I'm less of a mother because of it and I honestly don't judge anyone who aborts due to those tests.

northport6

My birth was the result of an accidental pregnancy.  I was given up to the state at five minutes old.  I was placed by the state with a foster family for four months, then was placed for adoption with my adoptive parents, my parents, the only ones I've ever known, or care to know.

However.  I could never do that to a child.  I spent literally the last eighteen years of my life in therapy once a week to deal with the psychological ramifications of being brought into the world, unwanted.  And now, being pregnant for the last 28 weeks, I cannot imagine how my biological mother carried to term (at fifteen years old), labored and delivered me, essentially for nothing.  I often wonder if she was a sociopath or forced into it or tricked into it or what.  My religion values the life of the mother over the life of the unborn child, the life that already is, versus the life that has yet to be.

If I was at any stage prior to having met my husband, I'd have had the abortion.  I dare you to judge me on that.

(Also, "pro-life" is a misnomer.  Nobody is "pro-death.")

frankierokx

northport6 said:

My birth was the result of an accidental pregnancy.  I was given up to the state at five minutes old.  I was placed by the state with a foster family for four months, then was placed for adoption with my adoptive parents, my parents, the only ones I've ever known, or care to know.

However.  I could never do that to a child.  I spent literally the last eighteen years of my life in therapy once a week to deal with the psychological ramifications of being brought into the world, unwanted.  And now, being pregnant for the last 28 weeks, I cannot imagine how my biological mother carried to term (at fifteen years old), labored and delivered me, essentially for nothing.  I often wonder if she was a sociopath or forced into it or tricked into it or what.  My religion values the life of the mother over the life of the unborn child, the life that already is, versus the life that has yet to be.

If I was at any stage prior to having met my husband, I'd have had the abortion.  I dare you to judge me on that.

(Also, "pro-life" is a misnomer.  Nobody is "pro-death.")

I have such a deep respect for you.  

esf60

@northport6 thank you for sharing that. And no judgement from me either.

FTR, I don't even like to discuss abortion. Mostly because there are ZERO circumstances I can fathom that would give me any reason to pass judgement, should someone feel abortion is necessary. Therein lies the difference between people who are pro-life and those who are pro-choice, in my eyes. I just don't have an opinion, nor should I get a say, in what you do and why you do it.

onewayticket

TheSloppySwish said:

KateMW said:

Cashingn2 said:

KateMW said:

I've got what I believe will be an UO...if my daughter got pregnant in high school, I would all but force her to have an abortion. Boom.

I wouldn't force it, but yeah it would be the first option I mentioned & let her know that I fully support that decision. And I would let her know it is probably in her best interest in the long run to terminate.

This is how I feel. I hope to educate my daughter before it happens. I don't want her to be afraid to ask for birth control. In the even that it happened, abortion would be an option.

I know you weren't replying to me not teaching DD, etc. but I plan to teach her, put her on bc, etc. so this shouldn't happen. But if it does...

This for sure. Around 16 I'll start asking if she wants me to take her to the GYN. I'm hoping to God there's no reason to do anything sooner, other than talk and educate.

The first time I had sex was at 15 1/2 so maybe you should start a little earlier.. just in case.

onewayticket

KateMW said:

EmmaBoBemma said:

KateMW said:

JaxxM said:

Loolaide said:

JaxxM said:

I've got what I believe will be an UO...if my daughter got pregnant in high school, I would all but force her to have an abortion. Boom

No way. Would never force that kind of decision upon someone.  I would never force adoption, or anything of the sort. I would support my daughter in whatever decision she decided to make, but i would let it be known that i am NOT going to support her child financially if she did decide to keep it - she would have to figure that out on her own.  

Those two options abortion and adoption could extremely impact her life and personality ESPECIALLY if forced to do so.  I should know i am a birthmother/firstmother.

Forcing someone to make a decision like that is coercion which is wrong on so many levels.

I

It seems like you're saying that being a teen mom wouldn't have a huge impact on her life.

And you can't literally force a girl to have an abortion.  I would just be on the side of more info and saying that's a very valid decision with a hypothetical daughter.  I'd also probably keep a plan b pill in the house just in case.

no im not saying that being a teen mom wouldnt have a huge impact.  I would just inform her of all the options available and support whatever decision she decided to make, i wouldnt try and talk her into anything or lean to one side.  I would let her make it on her own.

Yeah, at that point, obviously her decision making skills are questionable at best. She could choose abortion or adoption. 

The problem with basically making this decision for your daughter, is that someday(or right away) she could regret it, and that could destroy your relationship and cause more issues. I am not saying that you shouldn't put it on the table as an option, I just think when you "all but force" an abortion, you're asking for more trouble than anything. 

I had a friend in 8th grade who was raped. It was terrible. She got pregnant and her dad basically forced her into an abortion, told her that she wasn't going to live with them and have a baby. She had no other choice, because it's not like there was a father of the baby to fall back on. She failed 8th grade and never returned. Drugs and jail is all her future has seen since then. 

Obviously, I don't think this would be your situation exactly, but I would be very wary of "all but forcing" an abortion. 

Well, I was also raped and my mother all but forced me to have an abortion and I thank her every day. Best decision I ever made.

OMG Kate, so sorry to hear that and so sorry that happened to you! I am glad you were able to move on emotionally and start a famiy etc. Brave of you to share it here.

onewayticket

Mac2588 said:

Being a teen mom myself and now working on my 4th college degree and married for 12 years to my daughters father, I do not think being a teen mom is the worst thing that could happen to a teen. However, I had a good support system. Now that my daughter is almost 16 I would totally accept/ help her raise the baby if that is what she wanted. Hopefully, with 4 girls we never have to encounter that situation.

Why did you get 4 college degrees??

esf60

onewayticket. That must have been an incredibly difficult thing to go through (and that's putting it mildly).

TheSloppySwish

onewayticket said:

TheSloppySwish said:

KateMW said:

Cashingn2 said:

KateMW said:

I've got what I believe will be an UO...if my daughter got pregnant in high school, I would all but force her to have an abortion. Boom.

I wouldn't force it, but yeah it would be the first option I mentioned & let her know that I fully support that decision. And I would let her know it is probably in her best interest in the long run to terminate.

This is how I feel. I hope to educate my daughter before it happens. I don't want her to be afraid to ask for birth control. In the even that it happened, abortion would be an option.

I know you weren't replying to me not teaching DD, etc. but I plan to teach her, put her on bc, etc. so this shouldn't happen. But if it does...

This for sure. Around 16 I'll start asking if she wants me to take her to the GYN. I'm hoping to God there's no reason to do anything sooner, other than talk and educate.

The first time I had sex was at 15 1/2 so maybe you should start a little earlier.. just in case.

Oy. I hope I raise her to be smart enough to just tell me when she starts having sex so I can help her get BC.

notkateanymore

esf60 said:

onewayticket. That must have been an incredibly difficult thing to go through (and that's putting it mildly).

Thanks to both of you. It wasn't easy, but it was date rape as opposed to rape rape {not sure how to say the difference?} and it was hard, but it helped shape my life and who am I, so for that I'm thankful. I was, am and always will be pro-choice, but I did think about continuing the pregnancy for a minute. I'm glad my mother talked some sense into me though. She was very forceful, but it never really felt like I didn't have a choice.  

Mac2588

onewayticket said:

Mac2588 said:

Being a teen mom myself and now working on my 4th college degree and married for 12 years to my daughters father, I do not think being a teen mom is the worst thing that could happen to a teen. However, I had a good support system. Now that my daughter is almost 16 I would totally accept/ help her raise the baby if that is what she wanted. Hopefully, with 4 girls we never have to encounter that situation.

Why did you get 4 college degrees??

My first one was in criminal
Justice, had a career change and went into nursing. Finishing up my BSN now. Plan on starting my Masters next August.

Sigir

natleilynn said:

Loolaide said:

I want to add, not in response to any particular post, that there were (and are) several board members who had abnormal results at their scans.  A few shared their stories and all pursued further testing to verify the results of those scans before deciding whether they needed to terminate.  Luckily, most did not have to terminate, since their amnio results came back fine, but not a single one terminated without pursuing further testing, and not a single one terminated a child that was later determined to be genetically normal.

Okay - clearly I misunderstood how my doctor explained the testing process to me, which is not completely surprising to me. I retract that portion of my comment. 

Still. I don't see how my choice to not have prenatal testing makes me judgmental or falling short of my responsibilities as a mother. 

The reason I see it as "lazy" parenting, for lack of a better term, is this: you are choosing, for no good reason at all, not to receive information that may help you make needed decisions for your child. You are choosing to stick your head in the sand and your fingers in you ears and just be swept along, instead of receiving factual information that could help you help your child. It seems to me that people who do this are so terrified by the possibility of having to make a tough decision that they choose the easy way out- inaction.

It's similar to me to those parents who get a recommendation to get early intervention testing for their child. They are so afraid of facing an issue w their kid that they just choose to ignore the possibility that the testing might find something... And this is to the detriment of the kid.

You are going to have to make all kinds of tough choices and face anxiety as a parent. Comes w the territory. Like I said earlier, just seems wrong not to do all you can for your child right frm the beginning.

mavgirl_73

Sigir said:

natleilynn said:

Loolaide said:

I want to add, not in response to any particular post, that there were (and are) several board members who had abnormal results at their scans.  A few shared their stories and all pursued further testing to verify the results of those scans before deciding whether they needed to terminate.  Luckily, most did not have to terminate, since their amnio results came back fine, but not a single one terminated without pursuing further testing, and not a single one terminated a child that was later determined to be genetically normal.

Okay - clearly I misunderstood how my doctor explained the testing process to me, which is not completely surprising to me. I retract that portion of my comment. 

Still. I don't see how my choice to not have prenatal testing makes me judgmental or falling short of my responsibilities as a mother. 

The reason I see it as "lazy" parenting, for lack of a better term, is this: you are choosing, for no good reason at all, not to receive information that may help you make needed decisions for your child. You are choosing to stick your head in the sand and your fingers in you ears and just be swept along, instead of receiving factual information that could help you help your child. It seems to me that people who do this are so terrified by the possibility of having to make a tough decision that they choose the easy way out- inaction.

It's similar to me to those parents who get a recommendation to get early intervention testing for their child. They are so afraid of facing an issue w their kid that they just choose to ignore the possibility that the testing might find something... And this is to the detriment of the kid.

You are going to have to make all kinds of tough choices and face anxiety as a parent. Comes w the territory. Like I said earlier, just seems wrong not to do all you can for your child right frm the beginning.



Actually prenatal screens and early intervention testing are two completely different things. As a therapist who works with mentally, physically, and emotionally/psychologically disabled children every day my husband and I chose, 3 times now, not to do the quad screen. We had an NT with our first but not with the 2nd and 3rd. Any major issues are likely to be found out at the a/s and decisions can/could've been made then. Call me scared/naive etc but it's a personal choice. Feel free to judge but doesn't change my reasoning that as a therapist I'm probably more able to deal with health complications/disabilities than the average person. I don't think being "financially able to support a child with disabilities" is in the realm of possibilities for the vast majority of the population. Nor does struggling to support them (die to their disability) make you unfit. Judge away...

Sigir

... And for the record there are markers for things that they can discover on us after 20 weeks that need further testing to be definitive, yet it's too late for that definitive testing. Happened to me w my first child. I used to share my story on the "I don't test bc I will never terminate" threads, but stopped bc I was always ignored.

I will admit I am judging w this uo.

cantsitwithus

ColeRose said:

Late to the party because of work blah but I am shocked at the number of pro-spankers on this board. There were a few dissenting voices but the people who are pro got more love tits than the dissents! I am literally shaking my head over here. I don't think spanking accomplishes anything. Discipline =/= Intimidation. I grew up in a spanking household and no, no, no fuck no, I will not do that shit to my kid. No. 

I agree. I grew up in a household where spanking crossed the line into abuse (being hit in the face, belts were used, marks were definitely left) and I can't justify using even a mild form of this as discipline. I am seriously fucked up due to how my father chose to "discipline" me. I am the biggest doormat you will ever meet and lack in self-confidence. I attribute this to how my father dealt with me. Nope, nope, no.

hjweber

KKDRAGONFLY said:

Since @KateMW wants it juicy today, how about spanking? My UO is H and I are pro-spanking, when/if necessary.

How do you teach your child not to hit others if you hit them?

I was spanked as a child (when necessary) and NEVER hit other children.  I don't think spanking 'teaches' violence.  

northport6

JaxxM said:

northport6 said:

My birth was the result of an accidental pregnancy.  I was given up to the state at five minutes old.  I was placed by the state with a foster family for four months, then was placed for adoption with my adoptive parents, my parents, the only ones I've ever known, or care to know.

However.  I could never do that to a child.  I spent literally the last eighteen years of my life in therapy once a week to deal with the psychological ramifications of being brought into the world, unwanted.  And now, being pregnant for the last 28 weeks, I cannot imagine how my biological mother carried to term (at fifteen years old), labored and delivered me, essentially for nothing.  I often wonder if she was a sociopath or forced into it or tricked into it or what.  My religion values the life of the mother over the life of the unborn child, the life that already is, versus the life that has yet to be.

If I was at any stage prior to having met my husband, I'd have had the abortion.  I dare you to judge me on that.

(Also, "pro-life" is a misnomer.  Nobody is "pro-death.")

Most women in the 60's and 70's were coerced into placing their child for adoption if they were unwed or under age.  

I however am a birthmother - someone who has placed a child for adoption, I am not a sociopath and nor was I tricked. I decided to sustain the life inside of me and not do abortion. It was not all for nothing, the happiness i saw with the family that tried for 15 years to conceive made my decision against the abortion the best one of my life.

I was born in the 80s.  And nowhere did I reference anyone's experience but my own.

hjweber

monkeybutt61612 said:

I think packing a hospital bag weeks in advance is silly and unnecessary.  

I don't.  With DD, I was 34 weeks pregnant when I went into PTL.  I went into L&D to get checked out (didn't know I was in labor, but knew something was going on), didn't have any kind of a bag packed or ready, and ended up getting admitted into the hospital and transferred to a bigger hospital about an hour away.  It was up to DH to pack me a bag.  :-q  Trust me-my bag is packed this time and I'm 27 weeks right now.   

cammyisagirlsname

I missed a lot today due to work. But I will never spank my kid. No way, no how. My father (who is the best father ever) used to get us with the belt. That damn belt buckle and sound is forever etched into my brain. But that is how he was taught because he got the belt in his days. And I just would never put my child through that. No spankings, no belts! None!

frankierokx

@Heaven802002

No your not wrong. I was rushed into hospital as the doctors thought it was appendicitis. After a scan they confirmed it was a polyp that was stopping my first period to start. I had a D&C to remove the polyp and I became a young lady at 8 years. It was horrid and I hope my daughter will be much older than I, my mother was 10 when she started hers so I'm hoping it is not genetic.

frankierokx

Cashingn2 said:

frankierokx said:

@Heaven802002

No your not wrong. I was rushed into hospital as the doctors thought it was appendicitis. After a scan they confirmed it was a polyp that was stopping my first period to start. I had a D&C to remove the polyp and I became a young lady at 8 years. It was horrid and I hope my daughter will be much older than I, my mother was 10 when she started hers so I'm hoping it is not genetic.

I was 9, but it wasn't nearly as traumatic as your story. That sounds so scary

It is way to young to have all that start. Your still just a baby. I didn't really understand what was happening till I got home and mum explained. I don't remember much apart from my mum bringing me sweets everyday.

frankierokx

Cashingn2 said:

frankierokx said:

Cashingn2 said:

frankierokx said:

@Heaven802002

No your not wrong. I was rushed into hospital as the doctors thought it was appendicitis. After a scan they confirmed it was a polyp that was stopping my first period to start. I had a D&C to remove the polyp and I became a young lady at 8 years. It was horrid and I hope my daughter will be much older than I, my mother was 10 when she started hers so I'm hoping it is not genetic.

I was 9, but it wasn't nearly as traumatic as your story. That sounds so scary

It is way to young to have all that start. Your still just a baby. I didn't really understand what was happening till I got home and mum explained. I don't remember much apart from my mum bringing me sweets everyday.

I only knew because we had just covered it in sex Ed. My Dad raised me so he had no clue what to say about it.

I can only imagine your dads reaction, your still his baby girl at that age.