Unpopular/Unsolicited Opinion Thursday

AutumnBonfire · May 2014

netsirk2013 said:

Min wage change didn't pass. So why are we still talking about it? I guess this is my UO.

Because fast food works are planning to strike on May 15. Their demands are $15 an hour and the right to form a union.

helloblueeyes · May 2014

tundrabunny said:

My problem with raising the minimum wage to $15/hr, is what do you do with those folks currently making $15/hr? You're going to have to raise their wages too. I made $15 as a mid-level non-profit manager for a small non-profit and I don't think it would be fair if that job didn't pay more than an entry-level cashier at McDonald's. Personally, I think that people should be able to make ends meet on a 40-hour-per-week job at minimum wage.

My problem with the whole thing of raising minimum wage that high is what it does to the pay structure of everyone else. So, if you raise everyone else proportionally, then businesses have to start charging more for their goods and services. And we're back to where we started.

I could get a lot more enthusiastically behind raising minimum wage if I could be convinced that it wouldn't cause either increased wages and therefore increased prices across the board or if it wouldn't cause resentment for those that are currently working in much more highly skilled jobs at $15-$20/hr.

90% of the managers in my company make between $9 and $11 an hour. In July min wage in CA goes up to $9. In another year or so it goes up to $10.

Almost all of them are threatening a mass walk out if they do not get a raise to equal out the pay increase to our min wage people.

And just to throw some actual numbers out, it will cost my company an extra $300,000 a year to give every hourly worker a dollar increase in July.

(Although if i'm being honest, i am absolutely with them and my company could totally afford it)

ashesandpearls · May 2014

jessa8907 said:

darkangel42 said:

Minimum wage shouldn't be the same as a higher level of job, no, but it SHOULD be enough to survive on and, realistically, it isn't.

I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Why should it?

When the minimum wage is not enough to survive on, minimum wage workers often rely on government assistance (food stamps, Medicaid, section 8...) to make up the difference. That means that tax payers are paying to supplement the incomes of minimum wage workers.

The idea that minimum wage jobs should only be a temporary stop on someone's way to better employment is a fantasy. There are not enough high school or college students looking for work to fill all the low paying positions available. Not all minimum or low wage jobs are appropriate for students - some have hours that are not compatible with school. Some are dangerous or otherwise violate child labor laws. Some working adults who hold low paying jobs, are working at capacity - some people are not smart enough to complete a college degree or succeed in training for more skilled labor. Working a cash register is really the most they can do - I would rather the grocery store pay them enough so that they can make rent, buy food and see a dentist if they need one, than they have to be on welfare.

I would also like to point out that raising the minimum wage applies not just to minimum wage workers, but many other low paying jobs that fall below the new proposed minimum. Many of these jobs are actually held by skilled and/or educated workers. Some of who do jobs, like teaching, that we wouldn't want to tell people they ought to aspire to something better than.

AutumnBonfire · May 2014

Csltdk said:

Are we going to pretend that everyone on here didn't also "spread their legs"... -------- I did IVF you can't prove I spread my legs ;)

Technically I bent over the side of the couch.

drunkenhandstand · May 2014

amlonica said:

jojobean86 said:

amlonica said:

So serious question. Im not understanding the difference between leaving your kid buckled in a car seat in your driveway to carry groceries into the house, and leaving your kid alone in your house while you go outside to bring in the groceries. Isnt it the same thing?

It's a matter of perspective. I'm not leaving my kids unattended in a locked car while I go into a store but….. um yeah, I'm not hauling three kids to the cart return, I'm not waking a sleeping babe in my own driveway while I unload groceries, etc. Sorry not sorry. And you know what? It doesn't make me a bad mom. Of course you need to take into consideration external circumstances. If it's 100 degrees out, no I'm not leaving my kid in the car, even for a few minutes. I'm also not going to leave the keys in with it running while I return my cart. Common sense… you get the idea.

I think you misunderstand me - I'm not being critical of you. Im saying okay, 6 of one half a dozen of the other - youre leaving your child in the car or in the house for the groceries, why does it matter which place you choose? I wouldnt think twice about not dragging my kid to a cart return in terrible weather. Id park close to the return on purpose, but I think unless youre a kangaroo, there are going to be moments when its not ideal and you do your best.

Oh no I wasn't directing that towards you. I was agreeing with you and just venting in general.

darkangel42 · May 2014

LeaLupins said:

darkangel42 said:

Feel free to flame me -

I think that if there is a minimum wage, there should be a wage cap.
Bringing down the pay for the very top earners would free up plenty of cash to sort out the lower end, not just the minimum wages but the lower end of the spectrum.

Is everyone being paid 6 digits a year and up actually worth that? Maybe some are but not all of them and I doubt any of them have had to make the choice between paying the electric bill or buying food

Switzerland recently had an initiative that a CEO couldn't make more in a month than its lowest paid employee made in a year. I don't think it passed and I know it would never happen here but it was kind of an intriguing idea.

^That. That right there is a perfectly reasonable suggestion.

Ben and Jerrys used to have a similar thing, something like the top dog not getting more than 7x what the register monkeys got.

I'm not saying equality for all in everything but when you're having noodles again because it's all your $7 an hour job allows you and your company's top manager just bought a ferrari for his nanny, there needs to be some adjustment somewhere in that system.

emy730 · May 2014

Wow, so much to respond to in this post!

Minimum wage: I don't think it needs to go up to $15/hour. I didn't even make that when I graduated college at my first job and that was only 5 years ago. A lot of the people (notice I did not say all) working minimum wage jobs are also eligible for a lot of government programs and subsidies, especially if they have children. I don't think there's a fix-all for this issue, but I also believe that some people are going to be rich, some people are going to be in the middle and some people are going to be poor and that's just how it is, like it or not.

Wage cap: I really don't think that punishing (not the right word, but I can't come up with a better one right now) the wealthy is going to solve problems. Are there people that make 6 or 7 figures that did absolutely nothing to get there? Absolutely. But there are also a lot of people making great money that worked their asses off to get to that point. And to say that no one making that amount of money ever had to worry about their bills is absurd. When I was little, my parents were dirt poor, made very little money, but worked and worked and worked to make a better life. And today one of them brings in 6-figures and the other isn't far behind. It's not impossible; it's hard, but not impossible.

Don't spread your legs: This is just… stupid. I'm sorry. Do you know what solves the problem of teen pregnancy? Sexual education. Do you know what we have a severe shortage of in this country? Sexual education. I'm a firm believer that when you educate teenagers about ALL the options, you empower them to make better choices and you ultimately end up with less unintended pregnancies. Talking to teenagers and helping them to understand consequences is always going to go further than shaming the ones who end up knocked up at 14.

Leaving your kids unattended: I'm a FTM, so I'm not going to go as far as to that I won't do anything, but I don't see anything wrong with taking your cart back and leaving your kid in the car for a few seconds alone. Now going into a building for several minutes and leaving them alone? Yeah, I don't think I'll be doing that any time soon. But, I also see where this depends on the area you're in when making this decision. Not really a one size fits all answer I suppose.

Huahine · May 2014

darkangel42 said:

LeaLupins said:

darkangel42 said:

Feel free to flame me -

I think that if there is a minimum wage, there should be a wage cap.
Bringing down the pay for the very top earners would free up plenty of cash to sort out the lower end, not just the minimum wages but the lower end of the spectrum.

Is everyone being paid 6 digits a year and up actually worth that? Maybe some are but not all of them and I doubt any of them have had to make the choice between paying the electric bill or buying food

Switzerland recently had an initiative that a CEO couldn't make more in a month than its lowest paid employee made in a year. I don't think it passed and I know it would never happen here but it was kind of an intriguing idea.

^That. That right there is a perfectly reasonable suggestion.

Ben and Jerrys used to have a similar thing, something like the top dog not getting more than 7x what the register monkeys got.

I'm not saying equality for all in everything but when you're having noodles again because it's all your $7 an hour job allows you and your company's top manager just bought a ferrari for his nanny, there needs to be some adjustment somewhere in that system.

This is actually my field. I do executive comp disclosure for a (very lucrative) living (and yes I'm worth every penny of my salary and I work insanely hard for it - when I'm not wasting time on the Bump). The Swiss referendum was a dismal failure and it would never get off the ground here. There is, however, federal legislation that is going to take effect in the US in the next year or two that will require companies with publicly traded stock to have to disclose in their proxy statements the ratios between their rank and file and their top executives. It is a mess, particularly for multi-national corps with employees all over the world. And the SEC hasn't figured out how they will implement it yet. But those disclosures are going to be verrrrrrry interesting when they come out.

TugboatSheila · May 2014

LiteraChick said:

ichabody said:

ichabody said:

Minimum wage shouldn't be the same as a higher level of job, no, but it SHOULD be enough to survive on and, realistically, it isn't.
I survived great on $5.15 an hour in 1998 when I was living at home with my parents and 14 years old. And let me tell you, my first paycheck of $141 was like a goddamn GOLD MINE. And I was also very qualified and good at the job too. -"First place drive-thru employee in the region" April 1998

You also lived at home and were 14. What about the single Moms out there who had to drop out of high school,
My UO for the day - if you can't afford a baby at 14, don't spread your legs.

............................... I just...can't even...... wow. Icha I dig you and all but that is bullshit.

Since when do 14 year olds in the majority have common sense?

You think they all come from supportive and loving homes? Have a moral sense instilled in them at that age? Or even introduced?

Even taking the loving homes part out of it, just to expand on this. If we taught people in general, out in society, using our education system and attitudes how to safely and respectfully have sex instead of "do it and you get horrible diseases and die" (which really isn't that much a stretch from my own sexual education in school) teen pregnancies might decline as well.

middleschoolmommy · May 2014

I can't stand the hat they give to all newborns (the pink and blue thin stripped one). I HATE it. DH mentioned it to a nurse (without my knowledge) and they have since gotten Alexander a new hat. LOL I'm sure I was side-eyed over that one.

marathonmom823 · May 2014

Re: leaving kids in the car- I park right next to a cart return when I grocery shop, so I just pop DS into his seat and unload the groceries into the trunk. I will give him the choice when we get home of going into the house or sitting in the car while I carry the groceries up the front steps and set them just inside the door. He's never out of sight.

I avoid Wal-Mart like the plague. I will actually drive 15 miles in the opposite direction to go to Target rather than the 1 mile to Wal-mart.

My UO: I don't want to travel this weekend to the IL's. I just want to stay home, relax, and sleep in on Sunday. And have DH take me out for brunch. Gimme that French Toast and blueberry pancakes!!!!

cuntasaurusrex · May 2014

I think raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour just enables those with entitlement issues, and lessens the motivation for those to get out of minimum wage positions and start on a path toward a higher-paying career.

Ultimately and perhaps ideally, minimum wage jobs "should" be held by teenagers who are just getting their start in the workforce and are finding their way in the professional world. However with the outsourcing of, well, EVERYTHING, it's just not the reality anymore. Does that mean that McDonalds should double their pay and prices and a giant upswing of inflation should follow? No, it means we should be pushing trades and a demand for American products/companies/workforces to become a dominant force again and take back the industries and farming that we were built on instead of trying to get everything cheaper, while wanting to be paid more, and work less- it just doesn't work that way.

Also, on the leaving kids alone thing, I'm just a FTM, but IMO, if I wouldn't be willing to leave my purse in the car while I run somewhere, I don't think my kid should be left either. And I never leave my purse in the car. But sweeping generalizations aren't helpful- we all live in different areas with different crime rates and different notions of what's safe and what isn't.

SuperTinkerham · May 2014

I have one! Late to the party - I think Purity pledges and purity balls are for crazy people.

[Deleted User] · May 2014

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Palan · May 2014

ichabody said:

Agreed! Want better wages get a better job..
To say something like this, in this economy, is incredibly ignorant. I'm not saying minimum wage needs to raised to $15, but it definitely does need to be raised.
Because a 14 year old kid working their first job at McDonalds needs to be paid enough to raise a family? No. Minimum wage pay is for minimum effort and skill level jobs. If you want a better paying job, educate and develop yourself to deserve it. Then quit your fast food job and go find it.

1. The teenager wouldn't work full time 2. There are no other jobs, the major expected job growth sector are those at min or below 3. If the govt doesn't set a min wage then govt will have to subsidize so children have roofs over their heads and food in their bellies. Why should the CEO of Walmart get paid multi millions and have the govt subsidize his employees? 4. In the US we were going for $10.10 which is 30% greater than current and aligns with inflation. My UO, I am of the opinion that people don't want the wage increased because they would then be making near min wage for positions that are for either skilled workers or degrees workers,thus by comparison thet would only be in a min wage job that maybe salaried or require a higher skill, experience or degree than what is needed to flip burgers.

acciovino · May 2014

Ultimately and perhaps ideally, minimum wage jobs "should" be held by teenagers who are just getting their start in the workforce and are finding their way in the professional world.

STUCK IN GRAY
Ideally yes. I was talking to my aunt this weekend and my cousin, who is 17 and seriously trying to get a job, is having the hardest time finding one. It sucks because when I was a teenager, all of my friends had fast food, grocery store, hosting jobs and they were relatively easy to get and keep as long as you didn't jack around. Now, that our economy is in the shitter, college educated people are having to take these minimum wage jobs and therefore, no one wants to hire teenagers who are trying to pay for their cars, phones, insurance, save for college, or possibly even get started on their resumes for the future.
I don't think there is going to be a perfect fix for anything. I totally agree in raising the minimum wage for those that are scraping to get by due to inflation, however it will in turn "reward" those who have no work ethic and don't care to better themselves. Everyone needs money to survive and get by in our economy and there are those who work their asses off and get rewarded, those who work their asses off and don't get rewarded, those who don't work their asses off and get rewarded and those who don't work their asses off and don't get rewarded. There are so many factors and there are no cookie cutter solutions. Most of your situation has to do with where/to whom you were born, work ethic, motivation, strengths and weaknesses, choices and attitude.

[Deleted User] · May 2014

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katnipeverclean · May 2014

1) If I get gas in my car and want a soda from the station I leave my car running and lock it. Then I'll run in while always keeping an eye on my car and grab a drink. Small town life allows this. If I am with DD and I am in Memphis where I work, HELL NO. The kid doesn't leave my sight. All the pearl clutchers need to realize that safety levels are not the same across all regions, states and towns. I will however haul DD to the cart return and back regardless of weather. I realize now that I have my own double standard. Weird.

2) Pearls are beautiful and timeless. I have several strands I wear, and I love them. I will pass them down to DD one day.

3) There is no ideal solution to the poverty and minimum wage debate. It's worth discussing obviously, but I don't believe there will never be a solution that will fix things entirely. No matter how hard we work there will always be those who have and those who have not. I am not saying it is right, but I think instead of ignoring that factor is less productive than helping those who need help and are willing to work.

Palan · May 2014

jessa8907 said:

darkangel42 said:

jessa8907 said:

darkangel42 said:

Minimum wage shouldn't be the same as a higher level of job, no, but it SHOULD be enough to survive on and, realistically, it isn't.

I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Why should it?

If it isn't enough to survive on, why does it need to exist?
If the minimum wage isn't the minimum amount to fulfill basic human needs for food and shelter then what is the point in it even being a thing?

But those standards are different depending on where you live. So why subject small businesses in the entire country to the highest cost of living area?

Right now if you worked a full time minimum wage job in my state you would make $7.50/hr ($300/wk before taxes, $1300/mon before taxes, and a yearly income of $15,600/yr before taxes).

What are the necessary costs to survive for one person? After taxes you will make about $1,000. Here if you rent a small apartment you can get that for at most $500 a month. Estimating utilities high around $300 that leaves $200 for food and other necessities for the rest of the month.

It's not a glamorous life. You won't have a cell phone or cable or a car. But you will probably also qualify for government benefits of some kind as well as subsidies on health insurance if you don't qualify for Medicaid. This is all very doable in the area I live in.

This is not accounting for someone trying to support a family off of minimum wage, obviously. But someone making that little money would most certainly qualify for government assistance if they also had children. Childcare would be the most burdensome expense at that point.

I'm also not entirely against raising the minimum wage, I was just playing devil's advocate here. I simply don't think we need to nearly double it all at once with the economy in it's current state.

Editted to adjust my numbers and to emphasize the bolded.

Why should the govt subsidize the working? Companies should pay a fair wage instead of paying CEOs 10s of millions per year. If you are talking about small business, yes they will need to increase costs of products to cover the increase, but then there should be more people who can buy their product.

marsalisails · May 2014

darkangel42 said:
Feel free to flame me -

I think that if there is a minimum wage, there should be a wage cap.
Bringing down the pay for the very top earners would free up plenty of cash to sort out the lower end, not just the minimum wages but the lower end of the spectrum.

Is everyone being paid 6 digits a year and up actually worth that? Maybe some are but not all of them and I doubt any of them have had to make the choice between paying the electric bill or buying food

@darkangel42‌ - i am from a family that was poor most of my life. I watched my mom rotate bills so that shit wouldn't get turned off. I paid my way through MIT and I work my ass off so that I wouldn't have a wage cap. Ever. Companies pay what the market can bear (sp?) for their employees...The consumer dictates what people make (unless the government steps in). My company wouldn't pay me my salary unless it could be supported through the business we do.

And I work for the food service industry. A minimum wage increase, coincidentally, wouldn't really hurt us that much.

kwh33ls · May 2014

I don't really like most reality tv. I also don't like cats, and don't know enough about economics to make a call on minimum wage.

ghostof5letters · May 2014

All of this minimum wage/livable wage crap could be avoided if companies weren't financially rewarded for moving their manufacturing and highly paid (but low skilled) positions overseas. All of the jobs that one could raise a family on without a college education have moved overseas.

We see it all the time here in NJ with our refineries.

Skeemer · May 2014

rjacques said:

Skeemer said:

Bpargood said:

@cakebatter27‌ I'm a teacher and I totally agree. I hate the term "bundle of joy". It sounds dumb and I don't know why, it just does. What's worse is I have a friend who will still refer to her now 3 year old as her bundle of joy. Don't get me wrong, my son brings me soo much joy, it's just that phrase kills me!

@bpargood
It makes me laugh when people call a baby "Baby Daniel" instead of just Daniel or whatever the name is. I can see it's a baby. Does it really have to be prefaced? Would it be okay for me to call someone "Adult Jessica" or "Teenage Aaron"? Lol. Just my crazy sense of humor.

I agree @Skeemer! My DS is almost 2 and some people still refer to him as Baby Matthew. Drives me crazy!

@rjacques

Technically he's Toddler Matthew now. :P

rjacques · May 2014

mhooks23 · May 2014

jessa8907 said:

mhooks23 said:

I just don't get the breakfast for dinner! Most breakfast food is not good. I usually rebel and have pizza or last night's left overs for breakfast. The best is left over chicken straight out of the fridge.
I dislike cereal! I WILL NOT eat it with milk, it just gets soggy. I would rather not eat than have cereal.
In fact, I dislike all breakfast foods (except bacon and sausage which I don't consider breakfast because I put them on burgers or use to make gravy) I will eat pancakes, french toast, or waffles but I don't really like them.

Etd: I can't spell

What do you put sausage gravy on if not biscuits? Biscuits and gravy is heaven.

I usually don't use the sausage in the gravy just the renderings left over from cooking it lol. I don't mind biscuits and gravy if i make it but everywhere else puts WAY too much pepper in it. Yuck!

Skeemer · May 2014

amlonica said:

So serious question. Im not understanding the difference between leaving your kid buckled in a car seat in your driveway to carry groceries into the house, and leaving your kid alone in your house while you go outside to bring in the groceries. Isnt it the same thing?

@amlonica

The discussion is based on the general safety of the child being more accessible to predators in a car than (hopefully) in the home.

Also, while there are many different circumstances such as leaving a child in the car in your driveway asleep, the first & main post regarded leaving your child in the car while running into the post office. So, the discussion has clearly grown from where it began by others adding more circumstances & situations.

Skeemer · May 2014

SarahVol131 said:

1) If I get gas in my car and want a soda from the station I leave my car running and lock it. Then I'll run in while always keeping an eye on my car and grab a drink. Small town life allows this. If I am with DD and I am in Memphis where I work, HELL NO. The kid doesn't leave my sight. All the pearl clutchers need to realize that safety levels are not the same across all regions, states and towns. I will however haul DD to the cart return and back regardless of weather. I realize now that I have my own double standard. Weird.

@sarahvol131

Maybe it's not so much a double standard as it's just you going with your gut in a particular situation?

ksspiff · May 2014

UO: there are always posts on our neighborhood Facebook page about dogs out on the street or getting out of the yard. And I really don't care about the stupid dogs.

Cristy1020 · May 2014

I took a breastfeeding class last week it was a waste of effn money an time. DH got a kick of seeing all the boobies from the BF vid though. :-w

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