Another thing I was thinking that I feel is important is having reasonable expectations of how much sleep you will get. Especially the first few weeks. You may get 4 hours stretches or 30 minute stretches at a time and both are normal. I have found that when I mentally prepare myself for the worst, anything better than that is a blessing.
For example, cluster feeding usually happens on day 2. It is when a baby will nurse and then fall asleep on the boob, them you think, oh they're done. Nope, you move them and lay them down but 5 minutes later they are rooting around and whimpering for the boob again. Rinse repeat for HOURS. There is a point to it though. This is the way your baby gets your milk to come in. Cluster feeding happens off and on for roughly 3 months. It also happens during growth spurts.
A lot of women, including myself when I was trying to nurse my first, mistake this for not having enough milk. You have plenty of milk, just keep nursing if they need it. They are stimulating your milk production.
I know all this was touched on but I wasn't sure if anyone explained exactly what cluster feeding is.
@emeraldcity603 I was thinking the same thing, only in regards to how often babies nurse. Every 3-4 hours is NONSENSE. I honestly don’t know where it came from, but no nursing mother I have ever talked to about this only nurses every 3-4 hours. My son nursed every hour for awhile, and honestly, I think he still nurses closer than every 3-4 hours pretty regularly. It’s hard to say for sure because I really don’t pay attention to the time, or to the nursing much in general. It’s just a normal part of life (like hand washing or going to the bathroom). How frequently your baby nurses doesn’t necessarily correlate to not having enough milk. I had an oversupply and my son gained a pound a week, so clearly there was not a supply issue. He just liked eating frequently (and still does). Nurse when baby asks and your milk should keep up (assuming there aren’t other underlying issues). It’s a supply and demand situation. One woman put it really well to me once. Breasts are a factory, not a warehouse. You have to put in the order to up production, or the milk won’t be there.
I havent pumped myself, but I have heard that if you do work and therefore pump, it’s really helpful for maintaining supply to nurse on demand as much as you can when you’re home with baby. So nursing overnight and nursing on the weekends, and just as much breast to mouth interaction as baby wants.
Also, this is for down the road, but as babies and toddlers get older and they nurse less due to teeth or other things, and then they come back for way more milk with a vengeance, dont freak out then either. My son is super inconsistent now with how much milk he takes, but even pregnant it doesn’t seem like there is ever not something there for him. I marvel at the ability of my breasts to keep up with his demand every day. I don’t know how they know how milk to produce when he’s so crazy with how much he wants, but they do it.
Hubby and Me Friends since 2008 Started dating: July 1st, 2013 Engaged: July 1st, 2014 Married: July 1st, 2016 R born: July 8th, 2017 N born: June 30th, 2019 Baby #3 Due: July 7th, 2022 (maybe I only ovulate in October XD)
@tuxielove93 all great points, 100% true in my experience. When my son was a year old i thought i was running out of milk until I went on a business trip and saw i could express way more than before - their appetites grow and our bodies miraculously keep up!
I have breastfed all four of my babies, and had a different experience with each one. My DD never latched, despite many LCs, nurses, doctors trying to help, so she was fed exclusively pumped milk. My fist baby had horrible reflux, and I had a really low supply, so I BF him, pumped, and supplemented with formula. It wasn't until my second or third baby (can't remember which) that a doctor told me about Domperidone. It was a total game changer for me, and I finally had enough milk to feed without supplementing. I had tried the herbal remedies and none of them worked for me. My last baby was a NICU baby, so I couldn't BF him for a couple of weeks. I ended up doing a combo of pumping and Bf'ing until he was 10 months old. With each baby, I rented a hospital grade medela pump that did both sides at a time, and it made a huge difference. We bought a good medela too, but it still isn't as strong as the hospital grade one. With this baby, I will be starting Domperidone right after the birth. Breast size definitely has nothing to do with supply either! I'm a G cup and never have enough milk without the medication!
Thank you, sincerely, for all of your responses. I just read every single one of them and was bookmarking all of your suggestions for gear. I'll need to come back with a notebook because there's too much to digest in one sitting.
This thread needs to be stickied or something. We can't lose it.
I posted this in another thread in July, but wanted to add it here. If you plan to breastfeed, check and see if your hospital is 'baby-friendly' certified.
It's a designation administered by the World Health Organization and UNICEF means the hospital has implemented certain measures related to successful breastfeeding, like providing lactation consultants, allowing rooming in (where the baby stays with you instead of going to the nursery), and initiating breastfeeding within the first hour of birth. It's primarily around breastfeeding, but you'll find other things correlate with the baby friendly designation, like undisturbed first hour, immediate skin to skin after birth, delayed cord cutting, etc. When my daughter was born at a baby-friendly hospital, the team did a very quick physical check but almost immediately just placed her on my chest and let us be. They were careful to turn down the bright lights, be very quiet and leave us alone to let us bond while they sewed and cleaned me up in the background. I almost forgot they were there! She did the crawl over to my breast and started feeding very quickly. Maybe an hour later, they took her and cleaned her up and administered any tests but they feel that first hour needs to be a calm moment between baby and mother as opposed to giving the baby a bath, apgar tests, pricking their feet for the blood test, administering the eye goop, etc. They still do that, just later.
Baby friendly hospitals are becoming more and more common (I think a quarter of hospitals are), so if that's important to you, look for it or a hospital that is trying to get certified. Mine technically wasn't certified at the time I gave birth, but they were 95% there and got the certification later.
And if your hospital of choice isn't certified, you can still use this as a guide for your birth plan. I only have one child, so I can't compare, but having that uninterrupted first hour was really amazing. It also meant no visitors for the first hour, which may be difficult for some but I didn't want visitors so early anyways. And if you don't either, it's a nice "medical" excuse to buy yourself some time before the in-laws come busting in!
My last hospital I delivered at did most of those things while I was holding her. I did have a nurse who kept trying to tell me to stop nursing her because babies don't want to nurse right out of the womb. It w as s all I could do to not be rude to her. Then she kept butting in on my conversation with dH about the baby. I mentioned she has such as good latch i bet she cluster feeds tonight and she corrected me and said, "No she will sleep tonight and cluster tomorrow." Well, boy was she wrong. That girl nursed so much my milk was in by the 24 hour mark.
All this to say, my hospital called themselves breastfeeding friendly but they really weren't as friendly as the hospital I used before that one.
@emeraldcity603 Good on you for not slapping her - post labor, I would not have been in the mood for any of that! lol
I don't know if it's been mentioned on here, but it's TOTALLY normal for breastfeed babies to drop up to 10% of their weight immediately after birth (formula fed babies may lose weight too, but typically not as much). Jaundice, due to the weight loss, is also more common in breastfed babies. I freaked out when my baby dropped the weight but my pediatrician was like, that's totally normal, it will go right back up in a couple of weeks. And she was right. However, she's very pro-breastfeeding and has a lot of experience with it (she's been a pediatrician for 35 years). I've heard a lot of pediatricians push for formula if they see that kind of weight loss, to the detriment of the BF relationship. It's a balance - there is a point where it's too much weight loss. Just make sure you find a breastfeeding-experienced pediatrician so that you get informed advice.
I just want to add a small aside to the baby friendly hospital discussion. I gave birth to my oldest in Hawaii at the Army hospital there, and they are baby friendly, which translated to baby rooming in with me with no nursery option - there physically was not a nursery in the hospital because it was all rooming in. Which is great if you want that and was perfect for me with him. But I also had a relatively quick, uncomplicated vaginal delivery with him.
With the twins, I also gave birth in a baby friendly hospital that encouraged rooming in (this time in a civilian hospital in Connecticut) but they did provide the option of the nursery if mom wanted it. And after that delivery, I basically sent them to the nursery (well, my son went to the NICU, my daughter went to the nursery - they were a month early) for the next 48 hours. My delivery and recovery with them was ROUGH. My BP was almost 200/100 by the time they got me in for my c-section (baby B was footlong breach and I didn’t want to risk vaginal delivery). That, combined with the lack of food for over 72 hours, magnesium for 24 hours post delivery, my allergy to morphine necessitating Oxy as my painkiller which led to extreme vomiting with a fresh abdominal incision...it wasn’t pretty and I was in pretty bad shape. I just couldn’t focus on my babies. I needed to focus on me and making ME better before I could give them my attention and be a good mom. If I had been made to have them in the room with me, it would not have been helpful for either of us. The nursery option was a lifesaver. I started pumping as soon as I felt able (about 24 hours later) and my milk came in with a vengeance within 48 hours (I’ve always been lucky like that). I successfully exclusively nursed the twins until they were a year old, despite them starting with a combo of pumped milk and formula while in hospital. There was absolutely no detriment to sending them to the nursery in our case. Mentally, I’m very glad that scenario happened with my second birth. I was a far more confident parent in my decisions and my experience as a parent to say, “no, this is what is right for me and for my family” than I would have been (and was) the first time around.
I guess my point is that every one of us will have different experiences and comfort levels about what works for us. As long as baby is safe and you’re safe and your wishes are being heard and respected, that’s the bottom line. There is no shame in choosing not to room in from day one, just as there is no shame in choosing to supplement if you feel it necessary. When I was working on breastfeeding my oldest, I drove myself into an anxiety attack worse than I’ve ever had because a lactation consultant said she couldn’t believe more parents didn’t poison (her actual word) their kids with all the formula they gave them. It PANICKED me to give him any formula - she had made me believe I was going to kill him. When I finally broke down around 8 weeks (and I really do mean that - I BROKE), my husband insisted on giving him a bottle of formula. It saved my sanity, allowing myself to believe it was ok to give him the occasional bottle of formula. Giving myself that grace, just knowing I had the backup if I needed it, meant that I suddenly relaxed enough that, ironically, he was basically exclusively breastfed until a year simply because I no longer was pressuring myself. By going into the twins breastfeeding experience with that grace for myself already in place, that mental flexibility meant that I had a completely successful breastfeeding relationship with them from basically the get go because, mentally, I knew I had the backup if I needed it.
Married 25 May, 2013 William Alexander born 18 September, 2015 Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017 Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017 Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
I don't want this to be taken the wrong way -- so please, please, read it with grace if it comes out bad...but with all the other adjustments and work that goes into keeping a new baby alive, aside from being free, what would make someone actually WANT to breastfeed? Coming from a FTM perspective, knowing there is no possible way I can understand what all being a mom will entail until I'm in that position, if there's a safe way to make sure the baby is fed, share the work of feeding with a SO, and eliminate a lot of the stress with regard to latching, supply, diet, and so on (and in some cases physical pain)...I'm at a loss as to why this is something moms want to undertake.
Again, please don't read that as a criticism or snarky comment or anything ill-intentioned. I mean it as an honest question. This thread is super eye-opening, with tons and tons of information, and thankfully we still have some time to learn and absorb it all...but from a purely logic-driven, experience-free standpoint, I'm not fully understanding why this is something worth the effort. In other words, for those who did or want to BF, why did or do you do it and not skip straight to formula?
@ki1244 for me going into this for the first time I wish to do it if I’m able simply for hoping that I’m the type of person that loves it and feels closer to baby BC of it. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with not wanting to do it. And I know moms who have had plenty milk supply but simply hated the feeling of breastfeeding and it made them more detached from the baby. So I totally agree with majority of the thread that a fed baby is a healthy baby however anyone chooses to do it. Honestly sometimes my nipples hurt so bad now pre baby that I think omg how will I ever enjoy a baby latched to my breast? I want to enjoy it and will go in hopeful that it’ll be a pleasant beautiful experience but it might not be hahah and I’m prepared for that too
@ki1244, I personally don’t take offense to that at all. I think it’s actually a pretty good question. And I actually felt the same way as you before I had my son. Even now, after having successfully devoted 2 years (literally) of my life to breastfeeding, I have a very love hate relationship with it. I am one of those that just doesn’t really enjoy it (though it does get easier later on). I don’t like having the loss of independence or having to plan my wardrobe around my boobs. I hate sleeping in a bra and I really don’t appreciate leaking or engorgement.
For me, it came down to two major things. First, cost. My husband and I make too much to qualify for WIC or other assistance programs but it still costs A LOT to formula feed. Breastfeeding is free. Second, I’m lazy and it’s convenient. Truly. It took about 6 to 8 weeks to find our rhythm and really get that established, but once we did, it meant I had one MAJOR less thing to think about when leaving the house. I didn’t have to worry about bottles, about formula times out of the fridge, about making sure I made it to the store because we were almost out, or about budgeting for it on tight paychecks. It just was so much easier.
I mean, absolutely, there are benfits to health and all that, but ultimately, those 2 reasons are what made it the right choice for me. As far as getting help from my husband, I pumped once a day (usually right after his last nighttime feed) and after that initial 6 to 8 weeks, I started having enough surplus that my husband was able to bottle feed the pumped milk if I needed help, and it didn’t really have much impact on my daily life (I HATE pumping - so much respect for the EP moms out there). And even with that, I still had over 750 ounces stashed by the time we weaned.
ETA: It’s also, like I said before, totally fine to mix and match! It’s not a one size fits all solution. You can breastfeed/formula feed in literally any combination that works for you and baby. 100% on either side, 50/50, 90/10, and literally any combination in between. If you don’t want to pump, you can have your husband give formula and then breastfeed when you have them, etc., etc. There’a a lot of flexibility here
Married 25 May, 2013 William Alexander born 18 September, 2015 Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017 Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017 Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
@ki1244 So as I wrote above I had a ton of struggles with bfing and it didnt work for my son and I. He was formula fed. That being said I will still try again to BF this time. 1. There are some health benefits for both baby and mom with breastfeeding. I dont have the research but I believe that I've read somewhere that bfing can help lower (not eliminate) chances of PPD/PPA. 2. There is always the fact that formula costs money. 3. Not having to make sure that you have enough bottles/formula when you go out. With my son he had an issue with gas and I had to premake his bottles so that there was time for the gas bubbles to settle before feeding him. I had the Dr. Browns formula Pitcher that I premade every evening for the next day. But when we would go out I had to bring a cooler with enough formula for what I thought I would need that day. 4. There is an element of bonding involved in bfing. Not to say that you dont bond with formula I just think it is a little different.
@ki1244 similar to @KissMeImScottish it comes down to money and convenience. Formula is expensive and if possible I would rather save and use that money on other stuff. It just didn't make sense of my body could make it. Everyone is different, but regulating my supply wasn't hard. Hydrating and high protein was all that I did. But I had a fluid problem early pregnancy with DS so I was already drinking so much water anyway.
It is so easy to pop a boob in the mouth in the middle of the night. DH and I had a system where he went and got DS and I would feed him, then he would put him back down. Not having to get out of bed is a game changer. I can't imagine MOTN having to make and warm up a bottle. Yes you can share the responsibility with DH, but for us it was easier.
It is so easy to BF on the go. At first I was hesitant to BF in public but I have never once been side eyed and DS hated the cover so there was no hiding it. It is a lot more acceptable than it was years ago. I've never been told to go to the bathroom or cover up.
@ki1244 For me, it was a few things. The first was cost. Formula is so expensive and I would love to save money this time. Second is that I had a lot of mom guilt the first time with not being successful BFing DD. I feel like I didn’t try hard enough so I really educated myself for this time. Third is the bonding aspect. When things weren’t going well with trying to feed DD, I really resented her. I don’t want to feel that way with this baby. And finally, not needing to worry about bringing formula everywhere or having enough when we go out. I am high anxiety and I was always worried she would starve when we went out (even though DH constantly reminded me there’s a Walgreens on every corner)
I do want to throw this out there as a thing to remember for anyone considering formula feeding (since cost has come up a whole bunch of times) - if you plan to formula feed or even just want it on hand just in case, make friends with your pediatrician’s nurse and receptionist. I didn’t pay for a single cab of formula with the twins. Literally, for an entire year. Every time I went into the doctor’s office (which was obviously a lot that first year), they loaded me down with samples of whatever formula I was using. And if I called ahead, she would call the rep and make sure they had what I needed on hand. It was amazing to not have to worry about the cost of that if I needed it. Seriously, it was a game changer.
Married 25 May, 2013 William Alexander born 18 September, 2015 Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017 Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017 Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
@ki1244 I think that is a great question! BF can be hard, and I never had that “bonding” feeling some people talk about. But the reason I did it for 6 months is similar to what others have mentioned above so I’ll keep my response short
1. Money (6 months of formula from 6-12 months was expensive) 2. Convenience - no need to carry bottles around and made MOTN feedings easier 3. Health - not only for baby but myself and i was able to lose my baby weight while BF (this isn’t the case for everyone and kind of a selfish reason but...)
For me, BF was something I wanted really bad. I didn't do it with my first and I wanted the bonding experience that comes from a nursing relationship (yes you can bond and bottle feed but for me it is a different kind of bond). Although I never push breast is best on anyone, it is the stance I take for myself. I don't want any supplementing or any interference with my BF relationship, to the point I don't give my babies pacifiers or keep any kind of formula in my house. I also hated cleaning bottles. I have enough to do without constantly washing bottles too.
So for me, the learning curve and discomfort/pain was worth it for the bond and ease that BF brought. I can literally pop my baby on my boob anytime, day or night, and not worry about warming or making a bottle. It makes life so much easier once you get that rhythm and comfort level.
I don't judge any mom for not wanting to feed their baby the way I do. This is one of those things that each mom has to decide for herself.
As for getting help, I have my husband wake at night and change all the diapers. Sometimes he is doing more work than me. With DD1, I didn't change my first diaper until she was 3 weeks old. Plus, you can always pump and give bottles so your SO can help with feedings.
Another thought, dad's aren't going to be jumping at every chance to feed baby. Most dads are stand off-ish with a newborn. So even if you choose formula, you may end up being the only one doing the feeding and most likely bottle duty as well. Especially if these men aren't stepping up in other areas of responsibility around the house. Anyways, just some food for thought.
Just wanted to add when we switched DD to forumula (my supply sucked my first time around and I ended up quitting). We didn’t warm the bottles at all. We had a pretty good system. I pre measured all the formula into 6-8 or so bottles the night before. And had room temp water in the little medela breastmilk plastic storage bottles. If I had to run an errand, I just grabbed a bottle and a medela of water. When she got hungry, I dumped the water into the bottle and shook it up. She didn’t even care about the room temp water. Some will say you have to boil the water and what not, but we didn’t and DD is perfectly fine. Washing bottles does kinda suck, but our system wasn’t too awful. After the last bottle of the night for her dream feed. DH would just wash them all in hot soapy water by hand and pt them on a drying rack while I measured out the ones for the next day. You do need a good amount of bottles for this though. Unless you want to dry them all by hand.
@ki1244 That's a great question and I'm glad you asked it. As a FTM, my reasoning was primarily health-related. Breastmilk changes with your baby to adapt to what it needs. So a newborn gets a thicker milk called colostrum, which is high in protein, vitamins, minerals, and immunoglobulins that give additional passive immunity to your kid. Basically you are sharing your immune system. You'll continue to pass along these antibodies, immune factors, enzymes, and white blood cells through your milk, helping beef up baby's immune system. There are a lot of other health benefits, but that was a big one for me. That being said, I wound up supplementing 5 months in and I should have started supplementing way earlier than that for my mental health's sake. This time around, I want to breastfeed again, for the health benefits but also it was just more convenient as many people have mentioned. I won't be so adamant about exclusively breastfeeding this time around though.
Also, I think everyone's comments about the baby-friendly hospitals are a good grain of salt. I have heard of some awful experiences with overly militant medical staff; at the end of the day, your wishes should be respected. For a long time, the balance was against moms that wanted to breastfeed (mostly because of corporate involvement by the formula companies) and the Baby-Friendly designation was created to combat that. We're in a much better place now for breastfeeding moms, so now it's about finding a place that will respect your wishes, whatever they are. More than anything, a baby needs a relaxed healthy mom and that comes from being supported and treated well and being given the opportunity to rest. If and when you take your hospital tour, these are all good things to ask - figure out if they are breastfeeding-supportive but not breastfeeding Nazis!
@meatballs37 That's exactly what I do too for the middle of the night bottles. She usually wakes up starving between 12 and 2 am, so I keep a bottle with formula powder and a Medela bottle of water on my nightstand ready to go. I never boiled my water, just kept dedicated gallons/bottles of distilled water that I only used for bottles.
We did formula cold. I did boil the water for the first like 8 months though. (they stressed it because he was a premie and because we have well water, I dont know if that is valid or not) I would boil it at night then mix it with the formula in the pitcher and put it in the fridge over night. I could never get shaken bottles to not be super bubbly. (Most likely user error) I would also just wash the bottles at night and put them on a crying rack. Maybe once a week or when I need to run it I would throw a few in the dishwasher. This is the pitcher I had. Super simple and easy.
@meatballs37 This is the kind of system my sister and her husband had for their son, and it seemed to work pretty well for them (they had a few of those formula-dosing containers with like three portioned out segments, but same idea). They just used distilled water and away they went. She also kept a shelf-stable bottle of his formula in her diaper bag, so if they were out longer than she intentioned and she didn't have a pre-measured bottle available, she had that and would just replace it when she got home.
Honestly, the relative ease of that (compared to the horror stories about mastitis and poor supply and overactive letdowns practically choking a baby and pumping making you feel like a cow and whatnot) is kind of the basis for my question in the first place. My sister BFed her daughter, but her son is adopted so BF wasn't really an option (she tried some of the herbs and cookies and such to see if she could stimulate anything, but it didn't work and she wasn't about to get much more invasive than that). I saw how exhausted she constantly was with her daughter, and how with her son there was a much bigger split in responsibilities -- after a few months even her daughter was able to help feed him sometimes (obviously supervised, but it let my sister fold laundry or something while he was being fed). Some of that naturally comes from being a STM vs a FTM, I'm sure, but she seemed to function SO much better the second time around, even with the responsibility of her daughter too, and it seemed like not having to worry about his food source played a role in that. I don't think she's any less bonded with her son than her daughter, other than the fact that he's going through a Daddy-only phase right now (but he's also two and he says my DH is his best friend so I think he just prefers the dudes at the moment).
The cost was definitely a detriment for formula, for sure, and my nephew did get colds more frequently than my niece, so the antibodies in breastmilk I'm sure make a big difference (so the question becomes, would I rather use that Nose Frida thing that makes me dry heave just thinking about it, or go to the effort of BFing, and I legitimately don't know). She didn't have baby weight to lose, of course, but that's something to consider.
Maybe BFing will be easier than I think, or I'll actually enjoy it (I HATE things besides my bra touching my boobs already, outside of sexytimes stuff, soooo that's going to be a tall order). It's obviously still early enough that I can change my mind 357 times before I even get to the third trimester, and even then, if whatever I land on doesn't work with the actual baby, I can change my mind again. In any case, I really appreciate the empathy and honest answers, without shaming me for asking the question.
@ki1244 excellent question. I breastfed or tried in the beginning for the health benefits and I believe mothers antibodies are passed on to babies for the first few weeks (6 is sticking out in my head).
Formula is expensive and does take some planning, running out in the middle of the night or a snowstorm isn’t an option - although I live in the country so planning is essential. I didn’t warm the water with my last two - it also made there transition to whole milk at a year so much easier. I didn’t really notice any more or less of a bond, although I was less stressed formula feeding not that it would have swayed me either way, but if I am being honest.
My other piece of advice involves introducing a bottle. This comes from the struggle I saw my cousin (whom I adore) go through was she wanted to exclusively breastfeed her last baby so she didn’t introduce a bottle (even with breastmilk) until around 6 months or later possibly. Her son refused, to the point if she left him with a family member he wouldn’t eat until she got home. Also his transition to milk at a year was a terrible ordeal. She told me she would have gotten him used to drinking out of a bottle every once in awhile in the beginning so she could go on a date night or have husband feed him if she needed a break. I know it was extremely tough on her and she had 4 older children so she was an experienced mom to say the least. Not saying it will happen, I know some babies that eventually took to bottles when they were introduced later but it is something to consider.
For me there were many reasons so I’ll keep them short 1. Cost 2. Ease- I have milk on tap any time my baby needs it in any place with no prep work or washing afterwards 3. Health benefits for myself and baby- did you know any amount of breastfeeding reduces the chance of breast cancer down the road for mom and the longer you breastfeed the lower the risk? 4. Bonding- while all moms hold and feed their babies often, breastfeeding is a very intimate act which connects mom and baby in a way that no other thing can. 5. Mothering through breastfeeding- breastfeeding is a miracle cure for so many things, it relieves pain for babe, calms them when upset and on top of that expressed breastmilk can be used topically to cure a variety of ailments. 6. Breastmilk changes every feed to meet the specific needs of your baby, how cool is that! There are many more too, I could talk all day about the benefits of breastfeeding 🥰
Although you do make some very good points. Number 4 where you talk about breastfeeding being a bond that connects baby in a way that no other thing can. I think this can insinuate that moms will be missing out on bonding with their babies if they don’t breastfeed. There are plenty of other ways moms can bond with their babies without breastfeeding.
For me, I didn’t feel that special bond breastfeeding. It was more of a chore for me. I felt more of a bond when she smiled at me or when she started reaching for me to be picked up. Or when she started to say “mama” without just wanting me for food purposes. Obviously my experience was different. But I just wanted to speak up and say that if you don’t have that “magical” feeling when breastfeeding your baby, that’s totally ok. DD is a well adjusted 2 year old who often prefers me for nurturing and her dad for fun big jungle gym. I don’t think we missed out on a critical bonding she couldn’t get anywhere else.
@meatballs37, 100% agree with this. While I feel very lucky to have had a pretty easy breastfeeding journey and I totally respect moms who feel that special bond, I think breastfeeding in general is going to be a very different experience for everyone. It was definitely a chore for me. It was admittedly a little surprisingly bittersweet when I weaned, but I also was SO relieved to not have to do it anymore. I don’t typically feel any more connected than I do when I’m giving them a bottle or when I’m rocking them to sleep (which is not to say I don’t feel connected, there’s just no magic juju for me, personally, while nursing). Baby giggles or saying mama or holding up their arms to pick them up or having them climb into my lap and snuggle in while sucking their fingers and holding their stuffed animal always makes me feel more bonded than nursing ever did.
Again, none of that is to say that nursing doesn’t give you that bond. It’s just to supplement @meatballs37 ‘s point that it’s a different experience for every mom/baby and there’s nothing wrong with not feeling a magical, nurturing connection from breastfeeding specifically.
Married 25 May, 2013 William Alexander born 18 September, 2015 Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017 Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017 Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
@ki1244 I think you may have gotten the wrong impression about breastfeeding because we've mostly talked about the beginning of it here, and the beginning can definitely come with challenges. But once you get the relationship established and everything running smoothly, breastfeeding is, at least to me, pretty effortless. And honestly, this is a great question, because women (as you can see) run the gamut from loving breastfeeding and doing that 100% to hating breastfeeding and doing formula 100% (or having/choosing to do formula for other reasons). In the end, it all just comes down to what works for you, what your body can do, and what makes you a happy and sane mama.
So just a quick disclaimer here because I have been flamed pretty hard for my opinions in other forums. I am NOT saying that my personal opinion holds true for everyone. It's just how I feel and what I experienced, and in no way should be seen or taken as a judgment on moms who formula feed for whatever reasons they do it. I am 100% a "do whatever makes you happy and keeps you sane" person in regards to pretty much all things parenting. Lots of people judge MY parenting too, so it's not as if I come even close to just following all the "norms" (My 17th month old still sleeps in my bed, breastfeeds whenever he wants to and is baby worn.)
Ok, now that that's out of the way. I LOVE breastfeeding, and while I know some moms struggle and some just don't like it, its hard for me personally to wrap my head around the idea of willingly choosing formula over breastmilk, at least for myself and my family. Yes, breastfeeding can come with its challenges, and of course there are medical issues for some moms that prevent breastfeeding, but as a general idea, assuming all is well and going relatively normally, I don't see how formula feeding is even remotely close to being easy versus breastfeeding. Obviously if you are really struggling to breastfeed, formula would be easier. Im only comparing relatively successful breastfeeding with standard formula feeding. Once my son and I found a rhythm and his latch got good, all breastfeeding took for me was moving a shirt out of the way. That was it. I fed him without any extra effort on my part for 6 months, and then kept on breastfeeding him for months after, and still am. I realize that I am lucky in that my son latched relatively easily, my nipples adjusted relatively quickly, my milk came in, and my body was able to produce more than enough for him. But because things went relatively well, it was the easy and clearly best choice for me and him.
There are also lots and lots of benefits to baby and mama for breastfeeding. The biggest health ones for me are reduced breast cancer risk and all the wonderful immunity benefits babies get. I LOVE that when he gets sick, I am making and giving him antibodies specifically designed for the sickness he has right now. Plus all the immunity and antibodies he gains just from breastfeeding in general. As far as I know, this is not replicated in formula, and the specificity obviously couldn't be replicated. I always joke with my husband that he should just drink some of my milk when he gets sick, because it never fails that he gets sicker than the rest of us (and generally, I don't end up catching it much at all. I have always had a very strong immune system and I'm thrilled I get to pass that on). (This is a joke, he never has actually drank any of my milk for being sick).
As for bonding, I definitely feel more bonded with him and really think that breastfeeding promoted our relationship and my sensitivity to him, and helped with the PPD (although I had it pretty severly). Breastfeeding was always a chance (and excuse) for me to hold him and cuddle him and keep us close, and for me to just sit down and take a break when I wanted to. I’m sure they are produced in other scenarios too, but bonding hormones are released when baby sucks, and I’ve always noticed that release and felt it. Same thing happens on babies end. For me, breastfeeding was always the biggest bonder, and very few scenarios have compared to that love rush.
For me, the convenience of breastfeeding is unparalleled. No bottles, no special water, no buying anything, no washing, no warming, NOTHING. Move my clothes out of the way, and we are a go. I always had food for him and didnt even have to think about it going out. Overnight was as much of a breeze as it could be. Once I moved him into bed with me, I slept topless, and after awhile he could latch on without me even opening my eyes. Him waking up and wiggling normally at least woke me, but no effort was required on my part. Which is a far cry from having to bottlefeed. Oh and I loved how quick breastfeeding was to. He never cried for very long because he never had to. Food was ready nearly instantaneously.
Breastfeeding is a very special part of our relationship, and I get a bit sad when we make transitions. I was really emotional when we started introducing solids. I was SO PROUD that I had fed him all by myself for those 6 months, and I was sad to let someone else have a chance. Even if that someone else was an avocado XD. I also just recently got pretty emotional because I thought he was really weaning, but it ended up being teething and he came back.
There's also the awesomeness of breastfeeding for things other than feeding. Like he's scared, or hurt, or angry, or just needs a minute to calm down. Especially now as a toddler, it is a fantastic parenting tool, and I will be sad to lose it when he eventually weans. It helps him calm down, and it helps me to relax and refocus on him.
As far as mastitis and the like goes, its actually most common in the first few weeks. Personally, I have had a few clogged ducts and recurrent milk blister. Yes, they are extremely painful. BUT, in the grand scheme of things, they are not huge deals. Mastitis can be very serious, but overall it is treatable and resolves in a couple days. I don’t know any moms who quit or decided not to nurse just because of clogged ducts and mastitis. Plus, if Im not mistaken, even if you don’t breastfeed, you will still have milk come in assuming everything is working properly. And if you decide to stop for reasons other than lack of supply, youIl still have to deal with all the side effects of weaning (which often include getting clogged ducts and mastitis and then not having a baby to help you suck that stuff out. They’re little vacuum cleaners.)
I personally have not had an issue like that since around 8 months when the milk blister finally healed for good. I only had 3 or 4 instances of clogged ducts, all of which resolved in 24 hours, and only one of which was a real pain in the butt to get out. That was the first go round of it around 2 months, and I had multiple clogs so it took some serious effort to get it all out. The other ones were pretty minor and came out within hours.
I would personally recommend at least giving breastfeeding a try if you are able to. Colostrum is really amazing for getting babies started with their immune system, so even if that’s all they get it’s worth it. And then, if you don’t like it or it isn’t working, you can always wean or supplement or do whatever you want to and need to do. But if you give it a shot, you at least have the option of choosing to continue or not.
And again, this is just from my personal perspective of my successful and uncomplicated breastfeeding relationship with my now toddler. Obviously every woman and baby has a different experience. I know this isn’t how everyone’s journey works out, but it is how mine and lots of other women’s works out, and I think it’s helpful to share the success stories so that FTMs and more know that sometimes it works out great. And don’t all just get scared of the challenges. Obviously it’s important to talk about those too, and to prepare for the challenges ahead. I credit a large part of my success to gaining the knowledge of what to expect and challenges to look out for ahead of time, and doing everything I could to get things going well from the start. I was also very personally determined to make breastfeeding work, so if that meant letting my son suck away for three hours, then that was what I did. And those early sacrifices of time were more than worth it to me. But I think it’s really important to share all sides of how breastfeeding can go so you can get a full picture of every way it could work out. As with all things parenting, just take it one day at a time and see what works for you and your baby. And if it isn’t working, try not to feel guilty ( I know, impossible) about switching it up. Find some awesome people to support you no matter what, lean on them, and just keep going.
Hubby and Me Friends since 2008 Started dating: July 1st, 2013 Engaged: July 1st, 2014 Married: July 1st, 2016 R born: July 8th, 2017 N born: June 30th, 2019 Baby #3 Due: July 7th, 2022 (maybe I only ovulate in October XD)
but as a general idea, assuming all is well and going relatively normally, I don't see how formula feeding is even remotely close to being easy versus breastfeeding
I know you didn’t want to cause a thing but in my opinion since I’m assuming you’ve never formula fed a child because you’re still nursing your son, you don’t have the experience to know which is easier. Don’t get me wrong, I am pro-breastfeeding as I’ve mentioned before, but since I have done both (6 months of each) I can say formula feeding is easier in a lot of ways. And honestly I bonded more with my DD when I formula fed bc I wasn’t as stressed as when I was BF. So please know I’m not saying you are wrong or you’re experience isn’t valid, but everyone hasn’t different experiences. But I also want FTMs and even STMs+ to realize that deciding to use formula for whatever reason it may be is ok.
Flame worthy or not I just get annoyed when breastfeeding is positioned as this easy, ideal bonding, and natural experience. If it is, that is wonderful and I am so glad! But if not, I feel for every mom that is guilt ridden and struggling. I’d rather prepare moms that it can be tough and have them pleasantly surprised than convince them it’s easy and have any mom hurt because they don’t enjoy it, don’t feel a bond, or can’t breastfeed for any reason.
I don't think anyone of us needs to worry about bonding with our baby. Whether we BF or formula feed it doesn't matter. Our babies will bond with us no matter what and we will all bond in our own way with our baby.
I FF my first and I developed a strong bond with him. I have BF the rest of my kids and I have a strong bond with each of them. I regretted giving up so easily with my first which is why it became so important for me with my second baby. I never felt guilt though. Mainly because I never had anyone shaming me for my choice to FF.
I don't think there is anything wrong with recognizing that a BF relationships creates a bond between mother and baby. That doesn't mean that the bond formed through BF is better or stronger than a mom who's bond developed in another way. We are all going to bond to our children in different ways. That doesn't make one more superior than the other.
I do feel that if BF is causing more stress than mom can handle, making it impossible to enjoy motherhood and her baby, there should be no guilt over choosing to do things differently. I think that is the point we are all trying to make. Fed is best, especially when the mom's sanity is what's at stake.
I will say, if you even think you want to give BF a try, don't hesitate because of all our discussion about the trouble we had in the beginning. You may not have those issues. I never had mastitis or a clogged duct until I BF DD2. Every single kid has been different. With DD1 I latch issue because I had flat nipples. With DS2 I had low milk supply because he had chronic ear infections and pyloric stenosis, with DD2 I had 2 cases of mastitis and a few milk blisters. Who knows what I will face with this baby.
The point I'm trying to make is, if you want to give it a try, go for it. Educate yourself beforehand so you are prepared but if you decide it's too much, switch it up. Never let anyone make you feel guilty for you choices. They don't know your situation. The only person who does is you.
Have you all ever heard of dysphoric milk ejection reflex? I was never diagnosed with it, but I have a feeling that is what I felt whenever I tried to breastfeed.
I had to quit with my first because I had major PPD and every time she latched, I resented it. I had a traumatic birth with DD. When she was 4 weeks old, I ended up in the hospital for 3 days for PPD. So when people say they don't understand why anyone would choose formula over breast milk, that stings for me. I still carry a lot of guilt for quitting. But I know my mental health was a priority to be a good mom. Once I was medicated (also why I had to quit, what they put me on was not safe for breastfeeding), and got more than one hour of sleep at a time, I finally felt like I was able to bond with her.
I personally did much better with pumping my second go at it. I was also better medicated for depression and anxiety with my second pregnancy (Prozac has been proven to be safe for breast feeding moms and worked really well for me). I am really really hoping to give it a go for this 4th baby (3rd pregnancy). And if it doesn't work out, I may just pump or go to formula again. I know for some pumping is so much more work than breastfeeding. But I was able to personally enjoy my DD much better when she was fed from a bottle because of my history of anxiety and depression. I never really pumped with my first, but did enjoy it the second time around. I am feeling positive that I may be able to get a system down to exclusively pump. I hope you will all cheer me on when I am struggling this time and also be my safe place if I decide it is too much for me.
@meatballs37 what you wrote here really hits home for me. My mom and sister both had horrible PPD (my sister has had anxiety issues her whole life, but said her PPD was the absolute lowest point she's experienced). My dad has depression. I had an undiagnosed struggle with it in grad school, and am pretty open that I've seen a counselor since getting pregnant for antepartum depression, which puts me at a pretty high likelihood of PPD also. For some women, BF might help that; for some, it may worsen it; and for some it probably doesn't make a lick of difference. I don't know where I fall on that. So I'll for sure be cheering you on to a wise decision, whatever it is, and I hope for the same here.
Obviously I still have a lot to learn, and I continue to be so grateful for all the honest voices here to share their experiences without judgment.
I loved breastfeeding. My difficulties came from being a working mom and having to pump 3 times a day at work. Bringing home all your pump equipment and cleaning your bottles every night is absolutely exhausting. I spent all of my breaks from work in that damn pumping room and after 6 months of it, I was completely over it. I was stressed at work all the time and exhausted after work at the thought of having to get everything ready again for the next day. I decided to quit and formula feed and I have zero regrets. For me, formula feeding was a million times easier and I was a million times happier.
TW
Me: 33 DH: 32 DS: March 2014 DD: May 2015 BFP: 12/24/17 CP: 1/2/18 @ 4w 3d BFP: 1/26/18 CP: 2/2/18 @ 4w 4d BFP: 5/16/18 MMC: 6/15/18 @ 7w 5d BFP: 9/25/18! EDD: 6/9/19 TEAM GREEN
What I’ve gathered is that this is a very sensitive topic. I really appreciate everyone’s honesty and vulnerability in sharing their stories. Everyone’s experience is different and as a FTM it really helps to hear so many different experiences and perspectives.
Fed is best. I fully embrace that motto and I applaud every mother for making the decision that is best for them.
I hope to have a wonderful breastfeeding relationship with my child but if it doesn’t work for me I feel better knowing that it isn’t magical for everyone and that doesn’t mean there’s something wrong with me. That’s the beautiful part of this thread and this board. We’re all here to support each other.
I missed a lot of the party. But I want to throw a few facts in there, some BF related and some FF related. I got really down the rabbit hole with research about feeding with DD, probably because I was fresh out of grad school and I still had access to scholarly journals etc.
1. One of the reasons that it's recommended to boil water for making formula is not necessarily because of the safety of the water. Its actually because powdered formula is not sterile. There is a concern for Cronobacter bacteria. So, anyone planning to FF from the beginning should familiarize themselves with the process. The water is supposed to be somewhere between boiling and drinkable temp - I want to say 170F but that should be verified. The (easier, more expensive) alternative is using "ready to feed" (liquid) formula. It comes in sterile containers. The bigger ones are good in the fridge for a defined amount of time after they're opened (often 24-48 hrs but I think it's dependent on the brand and the container, I think). This isn't such a big deal after the first 6-8 weeks in term infants, but I plan to have some of the little 2-oz containers of RTF formula on hand, even though I'm planning to BF. 2. The immunity benefits to baby are largely unproven past the colostrum phase. Certainly there's some potential for benefit to baby, but the last I checked, the only clinically proven benefit is a decrease in gastrointestinal illness in the first year. This is not to deter anyone, but don't feel like you're setting your baby up for a lifetime of illness and poor immunity by FFing. My BF baby has a literal continuous cold from daycare germs. It is what it is! 3. BF can be easy for some people, eventually. I don't know ANYONE who said it was "easy" the first 6 weeks. After that, if supply is good, latch is good, working/SAHM conditions allow, etc it definitely can be easier. But that's a lot of factors that need to go right! 4. To @ki1244 I will also add that one of my favorite things about BFing is that because we have a large-ish and sort of overbearing family (more of an issue for me with the ILs than my family...), I loved that having to nurse gave me an excuse to go somewhere quiet and have a few minutes to myself to read or play on my phone, etc. I agree with most of the other benefits stated. I did also really enjoy it, which surprised me because I was not into any kind of nipple stimulation, etc before. But I know I wouldn't have enjoyed it if there were things that weren't working for us.
I do think for the average person, it's worth giving BF a try. But no shame in it not working or not wanting to do it. Eventually they'll all be eating french fries off the floor and sharing ice cream with the dog.
I'm super impressed that this conversation has been so civilized. Kudos to this group!
I’m so in awe of all moms on here breastfeeding or formula feeding. Hats off to all of you and so many thanks now and in the future for the words of kindness and wisdom.
I'm super impressed that this conversation has been so civilized. Kudos to this group!
Yes! I wholeheartedly agree!
And as a FTM, what I've found most helpful are more of the logistical (can't think of a better word) suggestions that have been made. Individually, any of one of us can Google this topic to death and find blogs/studies/articles that only confirm pre-existing biases on FF v BF, but its nearly impossible to find the sort of anecdotes you STM+ have provided. I love hearing about the "failures" as much as the "successes". There's so much to learn from you all and there's priceless value in what every single person has offered so far.
My goal is to breastfeed and it was set long before this thread was created. However, I knew that there were a number of different variables outside of my control that would dictate my ultimate success. I have you ladies to thank for helping me identify what they may be as well as tips and tricks that may help me achieve my goal. We don't know what we don't know.
Re: Breast Feeding Discussion
For example, cluster feeding usually happens on day 2. It is when a baby will nurse and then fall asleep on the boob, them you think, oh they're done. Nope, you move them and lay them down but 5 minutes later they are rooting around and whimpering for the boob again. Rinse repeat for HOURS. There is a point to it though. This is the way your baby gets your milk to come in. Cluster feeding happens off and on for roughly 3 months. It also happens during growth spurts.
A lot of women, including myself when I was trying to nurse my first, mistake this for not having enough milk. You have plenty of milk, just keep nursing if they need it. They are stimulating your milk production.
I know all this was touched on but I wasn't sure if anyone explained exactly what cluster feeding is.
Edit: fix words
I havent pumped myself, but I have heard that if you do work and therefore pump, it’s really helpful for maintaining supply to nurse on demand as much as you can when you’re home with baby. So nursing overnight and nursing on the weekends, and just as much breast to mouth interaction as baby wants.
Also, this is for down the road, but as babies and toddlers get older and they nurse less due to teeth or other things, and then they come back for way more milk with a vengeance, dont freak out then either. My son is super inconsistent now with how much milk he takes, but even pregnant it doesn’t seem like there is ever not something there for him. I marvel at the ability of my breasts to keep up with his demand every day. I don’t know how they know how milk to produce when he’s so crazy with how much he wants, but they do it.
Friends since 2008
Started dating: July 1st, 2013
Engaged: July 1st, 2014
Married: July 1st, 2016
R born: July 8th, 2017
N born: June 30th, 2019
Baby #3 Due: July 7th, 2022
(maybe I only ovulate in October XD)
This thread needs to be stickied or something. We can't lose it.
It's a designation administered by the World Health Organization and UNICEF means the hospital has implemented certain measures related to successful breastfeeding, like providing lactation consultants, allowing rooming in (where the baby stays with you instead of going to the nursery), and initiating breastfeeding within the first hour of birth. It's primarily around breastfeeding, but you'll find other things correlate with the baby friendly designation, like undisturbed first hour, immediate skin to skin after birth, delayed cord cutting, etc. When my daughter was born at a baby-friendly hospital, the team did a very quick physical check but almost immediately just placed her on my chest and let us be. They were careful to turn down the bright lights, be very quiet and leave us alone to let us bond while they sewed and cleaned me up in the background. I almost forgot they were there! She did the crawl over to my breast and started feeding very quickly. Maybe an hour later, they took her and cleaned her up and administered any tests but they feel that first hour needs to be a calm moment between baby and mother as opposed to giving the baby a bath, apgar tests, pricking their feet for the blood test, administering the eye goop, etc. They still do that, just later.
Baby friendly hospitals are becoming more and more common (I think a quarter of hospitals are), so if that's important to you, look for it or a hospital that is trying to get certified. Mine technically wasn't certified at the time I gave birth, but they were 95% there and got the certification later.
https://www.babyfriendlyusa.org/about/
https://www.babyfriendlyusa.org/for-parents/find-a-baby-friendly-facility/
And if your hospital of choice isn't certified, you can still use this as a guide for your birth plan. I only have one child, so I can't compare, but having that uninterrupted first hour was really amazing. It also meant no visitors for the first hour, which may be difficult for some but I didn't want visitors so early anyways. And if you don't either, it's a nice "medical" excuse to buy yourself some time before the in-laws come busting in!
All this to say, my hospital called themselves breastfeeding friendly but they really weren't as friendly as the hospital I used before that one.
I don't know if it's been mentioned on here, but it's TOTALLY normal for breastfeed babies to drop up to 10% of their weight immediately after birth (formula fed babies may lose weight too, but typically not as much). Jaundice, due to the weight loss, is also more common in breastfed babies. I freaked out when my baby dropped the weight but my pediatrician was like, that's totally normal, it will go right back up in a couple of weeks. And she was right. However, she's very pro-breastfeeding and has a lot of experience with it (she's been a pediatrician for 35 years). I've heard a lot of pediatricians push for formula if they see that kind of weight loss, to the detriment of the BF relationship. It's a balance - there is a point where it's too much weight loss. Just make sure you find a breastfeeding-experienced pediatrician so that you get informed advice.
With the twins, I also gave birth in a baby friendly hospital that encouraged rooming in (this time in a civilian hospital in Connecticut) but they did provide the option of the nursery if mom wanted it. And after that delivery, I basically sent them to the nursery (well, my son went to the NICU, my daughter went to the nursery - they were a month early) for the next 48 hours. My delivery and recovery with them was ROUGH. My BP was almost 200/100 by the time they got me in for my c-section (baby B was footlong breach and I didn’t want to risk vaginal delivery). That, combined with the lack of food for over 72 hours, magnesium for 24 hours post delivery, my allergy to morphine necessitating Oxy as my painkiller which led to extreme vomiting with a fresh abdominal incision...it wasn’t pretty and I was in pretty bad shape. I just couldn’t focus on my babies. I needed to focus on me and making ME better before I could give them my attention and be a good mom. If I had been made to have them in the room with me, it would not have been helpful for either of us. The nursery option was a lifesaver. I started pumping as soon as I felt able (about 24 hours later) and my milk came in with a vengeance within 48 hours (I’ve always been lucky like that). I successfully exclusively nursed the twins until they were a year old, despite them starting with a combo of pumped milk and formula while in hospital. There was absolutely no detriment to sending them to the nursery in our case. Mentally, I’m very glad that scenario happened with my second birth. I was a far more confident parent in my decisions and my experience as a parent to say, “no, this is what is right for me and for my family” than I would have been (and was) the first time around.
I guess my point is that every one of us will have different experiences and comfort levels about what works for us. As long as baby is safe and you’re safe and your wishes are being heard and respected, that’s the bottom line. There is no shame in choosing not to room in from day one, just as there is no shame in choosing to supplement if you feel it necessary. When I was working on breastfeeding my oldest, I drove myself into an anxiety attack worse than I’ve ever had because a lactation consultant said she couldn’t believe more parents didn’t poison (her actual word) their kids with all the formula they gave them. It PANICKED me to give him any formula - she had made me believe I was going to kill him. When I finally broke down around 8 weeks (and I really do mean that - I BROKE), my husband insisted on giving him a bottle of formula. It saved my sanity, allowing myself to believe it was ok to give him the occasional bottle of formula. Giving myself that grace, just knowing I had the backup if I needed it, meant that I suddenly relaxed enough that, ironically, he was basically exclusively breastfed until a year simply because I no longer was pressuring myself. By going into the twins breastfeeding experience with that grace for myself already in place, that mental flexibility meant that I had a completely successful breastfeeding relationship with them from basically the get go because, mentally, I knew I had the backup if I needed it.
William Alexander born 18 September, 2015
Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017
Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017
Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
Again, please don't read that as a criticism or snarky comment or anything ill-intentioned. I mean it as an honest question. This thread is super eye-opening, with tons and tons of information, and thankfully we still have some time to learn and absorb it all...but from a purely logic-driven, experience-free standpoint, I'm not fully understanding why this is something worth the effort. In other words, for those who did or want to BF, why did or do you do it and not skip straight to formula?
For me, it came down to two major things. First, cost. My husband and I make too much to qualify for WIC or other assistance programs but it still costs A LOT to formula feed. Breastfeeding is free. Second, I’m lazy and it’s convenient. Truly. It took about 6 to 8 weeks to find our rhythm and really get that established, but once we did, it meant I had one MAJOR less thing to think about when leaving the house. I didn’t have to worry about bottles, about formula times out of the fridge, about making sure I made it to the store because we were almost out, or about budgeting for it on tight paychecks. It just was so much easier.
I mean, absolutely, there are benfits to health and all that, but ultimately, those 2 reasons are what made it the right choice for me. As far as getting help from my husband, I pumped once a day (usually right after his last nighttime feed) and after that initial 6 to 8 weeks, I started having enough surplus that my husband was able to bottle feed the pumped milk if I needed help, and it didn’t really have much impact on my daily life (I HATE pumping - so much respect for the EP moms out there). And even with that, I still had over 750 ounces stashed by the time we weaned.
ETA: It’s also, like I said before, totally fine to mix and match! It’s not a one size fits all solution. You can breastfeed/formula feed in literally any combination that works for you and baby. 100% on either side, 50/50, 90/10, and literally any combination in between. If you don’t want to pump, you can have your husband give formula and then breastfeed when you have them, etc., etc. There’a a lot of flexibility here
William Alexander born 18 September, 2015
Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017
Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017
Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
It is so easy to pop a boob in the mouth in the middle of the night. DH and I had a system where he went and got DS and I would feed him, then he would put him back down. Not having to get out of bed is a game changer. I can't imagine MOTN having to make and warm up a bottle. Yes you can share the responsibility with DH, but for us it was easier.
It is so easy to BF on the go. At first I was hesitant to BF in public but I have never once been side eyed and DS hated the cover so there was no hiding it. It is a lot more acceptable than it was years ago. I've never been told to go to the bathroom or cover up.
William Alexander born 18 September, 2015
Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017
Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017
Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
1. Money (6 months of formula from 6-12 months was expensive)
2. Convenience - no need to carry bottles around and made MOTN feedings easier
3. Health - not only for baby but myself and i was able to lose my baby weight while BF (this isn’t the case for everyone and kind of a selfish reason but...)
So for me, the learning curve and discomfort/pain was worth it for the bond and ease that BF brought. I can literally pop my baby on my boob anytime, day or night, and not worry about warming or making a bottle. It makes life so much easier once you get that rhythm and comfort level.
I don't judge any mom for not wanting to feed their baby the way I do. This is one of those things that each mom has to decide for herself.
As for getting help, I have my husband wake at night and change all the diapers. Sometimes he is doing more work than me. With DD1, I didn't change my first diaper until she was 3 weeks old. Plus, you can always pump and give bottles so your SO can help with feedings.
Another thought, dad's aren't going to be jumping at every chance to feed baby. Most dads are stand off-ish with a newborn. So even if you choose formula, you may end up being the only one doing the feeding and most likely bottle duty as well. Especially if these men aren't stepping up in other areas of responsibility around the house. Anyways, just some food for thought.
Also, I think everyone's comments about the baby-friendly hospitals are a good grain of salt. I have heard of some awful experiences with overly militant medical staff; at the end of the day, your wishes should be respected. For a long time, the balance was against moms that wanted to breastfeed (mostly because of corporate involvement by the formula companies) and the Baby-Friendly designation was created to combat that. We're in a much better place now for breastfeeding moms, so now it's about finding a place that will respect your wishes, whatever they are. More than anything, a baby needs a relaxed healthy mom and that comes from being supported and treated well and being given the opportunity to rest. If and when you take your hospital tour, these are all good things to ask - figure out if they are breastfeeding-supportive but not breastfeeding Nazis!
@meatballs37 That's exactly what I do too for the middle of the night bottles. She usually wakes up starving between 12 and 2 am, so I keep a bottle with formula powder and a Medela bottle of water on my nightstand ready to go. I never boiled my water, just kept dedicated gallons/bottles of distilled water that I only used for bottles.
This is the pitcher I had. Super simple and easy.
Honestly, the relative ease of that (compared to the horror stories about mastitis and poor supply and overactive letdowns practically choking a baby and pumping making you feel like a cow and whatnot) is kind of the basis for my question in the first place. My sister BFed her daughter, but her son is adopted so BF wasn't really an option (she tried some of the herbs and cookies and such to see if she could stimulate anything, but it didn't work and she wasn't about to get much more invasive than that). I saw how exhausted she constantly was with her daughter, and how with her son there was a much bigger split in responsibilities -- after a few months even her daughter was able to help feed him sometimes (obviously supervised, but it let my sister fold laundry or something while he was being fed). Some of that naturally comes from being a STM vs a FTM, I'm sure, but she seemed to function SO much better the second time around, even with the responsibility of her daughter too, and it seemed like not having to worry about his food source played a role in that. I don't think she's any less bonded with her son than her daughter, other than the fact that he's going through a Daddy-only phase right now (but he's also two and he says my DH is his best friend so I think he just prefers the dudes at the moment).
The cost was definitely a detriment for formula, for sure, and my nephew did get colds more frequently than my niece, so the antibodies in breastmilk I'm sure make a big difference (so the question becomes, would I rather use that Nose Frida thing that makes me dry heave just thinking about it, or go to the effort of BFing, and I legitimately don't know). She didn't have baby weight to lose, of course, but that's something to consider.
Maybe BFing will be easier than I think, or I'll actually enjoy it (I HATE things besides my bra touching my boobs already, outside of sexytimes stuff, soooo that's going to be a tall order). It's obviously still early enough that I can change my mind 357 times before I even get to the third trimester, and even then, if whatever I land on doesn't work with the actual baby, I can change my mind again. In any case, I really appreciate the empathy and honest answers, without shaming me for asking the question.
Formula is expensive and does take some planning, running out in the middle of the night or a snowstorm isn’t an option - although I live in the country so planning is essential. I didn’t warm the water with my last two - it also made there transition to whole milk at a year so much easier. I didn’t really notice any more or less of a bond, although I was less stressed formula feeding not that it would have swayed me either way, but if I am being honest.
My other piece of advice involves introducing a bottle. This comes from the struggle I saw my cousin (whom I adore) go through was she wanted to exclusively breastfeed her last baby so she didn’t introduce a bottle (even with breastmilk) until around 6 months or later possibly. Her son refused, to the point if she left him with a family member he wouldn’t eat until she got home. Also his transition to milk at a year was a terrible ordeal. She told me she would have gotten him used to drinking out of a bottle every once in awhile in the beginning so she could go on a date night or have husband feed him if she needed a break. I know it was extremely tough on her and she had 4 older children so she was an experienced mom to say the least. Not saying it will happen, I know some babies that eventually took to bottles when they were introduced later but it is something to consider.
1. Cost
2. Ease- I have milk on tap any time my baby needs it in any place with no prep work or washing afterwards
3. Health benefits for myself and baby- did you know any amount of breastfeeding reduces the chance of breast cancer down the road for mom and the longer you breastfeed the lower the risk?
4. Bonding- while all moms hold and feed their babies often, breastfeeding is a very intimate act which connects mom and baby in a way that no other thing can.
5. Mothering through breastfeeding- breastfeeding is a miracle cure for so many things, it relieves pain for babe, calms them when upset and on top of that expressed breastmilk can be used topically to cure a variety of ailments.
6. Breastmilk changes every feed to meet the specific needs of your baby, how cool is that!
There are many more too, I could talk all day about the benefits of breastfeeding 🥰
Although you do make some very good points. Number 4 where you talk about breastfeeding being a bond that connects baby in a way that no other thing can. I think this can insinuate that moms will be missing out on bonding with their babies if they don’t breastfeed. There are plenty of other ways moms can bond with their babies without breastfeeding.
For me, I didn’t feel that special bond breastfeeding. It was more of a chore for me. I felt more of a bond when she smiled at me or when she started reaching for me to be picked up. Or when she started to say “mama” without just wanting me for food purposes. Obviously my experience was different. But I just wanted to speak up and say that if you don’t have that “magical” feeling when breastfeeding your baby, that’s totally ok. DD is a well adjusted 2 year old who often prefers me for nurturing and her dad for fun big jungle gym. I don’t think we missed out on a critical bonding she couldn’t get anywhere else.
Again, none of that is to say that nursing doesn’t give you that bond. It’s just to supplement @meatballs37 ‘s point that it’s a different experience for every mom/baby and there’s nothing wrong with not feeling a magical, nurturing connection from breastfeeding specifically.
William Alexander born 18 September, 2015
Harper Grace born 9 June, 2017
Colton Miles born 9 June, 2017
Bowen James due 19 June, 2019
So just a quick disclaimer here because I have been flamed pretty hard for my opinions in other forums. I am NOT saying that my personal opinion holds true for everyone. It's just how I feel and what I experienced, and in no way should be seen or taken as a judgment on moms who formula feed for whatever reasons they do it. I am 100% a "do whatever makes you happy and keeps you sane" person in regards to pretty much all things parenting. Lots of people judge MY parenting too, so it's not as if I come even close to just following all the "norms" (My 17th month old still sleeps in my bed, breastfeeds whenever he wants to and is baby worn.)
Ok, now that that's out of the way. I LOVE breastfeeding, and while I know some moms struggle and some just don't like it, its hard for me personally to wrap my head around the idea of willingly choosing formula over breastmilk, at least for myself and my family. Yes, breastfeeding can come with its challenges, and of course there are medical issues for some moms that prevent breastfeeding, but as a general idea, assuming all is well and going relatively normally, I don't see how formula feeding is even remotely close to being easy versus breastfeeding. Obviously if
you are really struggling to breastfeed, formula would be easier. Im only comparing relatively successful breastfeeding with standard formula feeding. Once my son and I found a rhythm and his latch got good, all breastfeeding took for me was moving a shirt out of the way. That was it. I fed him without any extra effort on my part for 6 months, and then kept on breastfeeding him for months after, and still am. I realize that I am lucky in that my son latched relatively easily, my nipples adjusted relatively quickly, my milk came in, and my body was able to produce more than enough for him. But because things went relatively well, it was the easy and clearly best choice for me and him.
There are also lots and lots of benefits to baby and mama for breastfeeding. The biggest health ones for me are reduced breast cancer risk and all the wonderful immunity benefits babies get. I LOVE that when he gets sick, I am making and giving him antibodies specifically designed for the sickness he has right now. Plus all the immunity and antibodies he gains just from breastfeeding in general. As far as I know, this is not replicated in formula, and the specificity obviously couldn't be replicated. I always joke with my husband that he should just drink some of my milk when he gets sick, because it never fails that he gets sicker than the rest of us (and generally, I don't end up catching it much at all. I have always had a very strong immune system and I'm thrilled I get to pass that on). (This is a joke, he never has actually drank any of my milk for being sick).
As for bonding, I definitely feel more bonded with him and really think that breastfeeding promoted our relationship and my sensitivity to him, and helped with the PPD (although I had it pretty severly). Breastfeeding was always a chance (and excuse) for me to hold him and cuddle him and keep us close, and for me to just sit down and take a break when I wanted to. I’m sure they are produced in other scenarios too, but bonding hormones are released when baby sucks, and I’ve always noticed that release and felt it. Same thing happens on babies end. For me, breastfeeding was always the biggest bonder, and very few scenarios have compared to that love rush.
For me, the convenience of breastfeeding is unparalleled. No bottles, no special water, no buying anything, no washing, no warming, NOTHING. Move my clothes out of the way, and we are a go. I always had food for him and didnt even have to think about it going out. Overnight was as much of a breeze as it could be. Once I moved him into bed with me, I slept topless, and after awhile he could latch on without me even opening my eyes. Him waking up and wiggling normally at least woke me, but no effort was required on my part. Which is a far cry from having to bottlefeed. Oh and I loved how quick breastfeeding was to. He never cried for very long because he never had to. Food was ready nearly instantaneously.
Breastfeeding is a very special part of our relationship, and I get a bit sad when we make transitions. I was really emotional when we started introducing solids. I was SO PROUD that I had fed him all by myself for those 6 months, and I was sad to let someone else have a chance. Even if that someone else was an avocado XD. I also just recently got pretty emotional because I thought he was really weaning, but it ended up being teething and he came back.
There's also the awesomeness of breastfeeding for things other than feeding. Like he's scared, or hurt, or angry, or just needs a minute to calm down. Especially now as a toddler, it is a fantastic parenting tool, and I will be sad to lose it when he eventually weans. It helps him calm down, and it helps me to relax and refocus on him.
As far as mastitis and the like goes, its actually most common in the first few weeks. Personally, I have had a few clogged ducts and recurrent milk blister. Yes, they are extremely painful. BUT, in the grand scheme of things, they are not huge deals. Mastitis can be very serious, but overall it is treatable and resolves in a couple days. I don’t know any moms who quit or decided not to nurse just because of clogged ducts and mastitis. Plus, if Im
not mistaken, even if you don’t breastfeed, you will still have milk come in assuming everything is working properly. And if you decide to stop for reasons other than lack of supply, youIl still have to deal
with all the side effects of weaning (which often include getting clogged ducts and mastitis and then not having a baby to help you suck that stuff out. They’re little vacuum cleaners.)
I personally have not had an issue like that since around 8 months when the milk blister finally healed for good. I only had 3 or 4 instances of clogged ducts, all of which resolved in 24 hours, and only one of which was a real pain in the butt to get out. That was the first go round of it around 2 months, and I had multiple clogs so it took some serious effort to get it all out. The other ones were pretty minor and came out within hours.
I would personally recommend at least giving breastfeeding a try if you are able to. Colostrum is really amazing for getting babies started with their immune system, so even if that’s all they get it’s worth it. And then, if you don’t like it or it isn’t working, you can always wean or supplement or do whatever you want to and need to do. But if you give it a shot, you at least have the option of choosing to continue or not.
And again, this is just from my personal perspective of my successful and uncomplicated breastfeeding relationship with my now toddler. Obviously every woman and baby has a different experience. I know this isn’t how everyone’s journey works out, but it is how mine and lots of other women’s works out, and I think it’s helpful to share the success stories so that FTMs and more know that sometimes it works out great. And don’t all just get scared of the challenges. Obviously it’s important to talk about those too, and to prepare for the challenges ahead. I credit a large part of my success to gaining the knowledge of what to expect and challenges to look out for ahead of time, and doing everything I could to get things going well from the start. I was also very personally determined to make breastfeeding work, so if that meant letting my son suck away for three hours, then that was what I did. And those early sacrifices of time were more than worth it to me. But I think it’s really important to share all sides of how breastfeeding can go so you can get a full picture of every way it could work out. As with all things parenting, just take it one day at a time and see what works for you and your baby. And if it isn’t working, try not to feel guilty ( I know, impossible) about switching it up. Find some awesome people to support you no matter what, lean on them, and just keep going.
Friends since 2008
Started dating: July 1st, 2013
Engaged: July 1st, 2014
Married: July 1st, 2016
R born: July 8th, 2017
N born: June 30th, 2019
Baby #3 Due: July 7th, 2022
(maybe I only ovulate in October XD)
I FF my first and I developed a strong bond with him. I have BF the rest of my kids and I have a strong bond with each of them. I regretted giving up so easily with my first which is why it became so important for me with my second baby. I never felt guilt though. Mainly because I never had anyone shaming me for my choice to FF.
I don't think there is anything wrong with recognizing that a BF relationships creates a bond between mother and baby. That doesn't mean that the bond formed through BF is better or stronger than a mom who's bond developed in another way. We are all going to bond to our children in different ways. That doesn't make one more superior than the other.
I do feel that if BF is causing more stress than mom can handle, making it impossible to enjoy motherhood and her baby, there should be no guilt over choosing to do things differently. I think that is the point we are all trying to make. Fed is best, especially when the mom's sanity is what's at stake.
I will say, if you even think you want to give BF a try, don't hesitate because of all our discussion about the trouble we had in the beginning. You may not have those issues. I never had mastitis or a clogged duct until I BF DD2. Every single kid has been different. With DD1 I latch issue because I had flat nipples. With DS2 I had low milk supply because he had chronic ear infections and pyloric stenosis, with DD2 I had 2 cases of mastitis and a few milk blisters. Who knows what I will face with this baby.
The point I'm trying to make is, if you want to give it a try, go for it. Educate yourself beforehand so you are prepared but if you decide it's too much, switch it up. Never let anyone make you feel guilty for you choices. They don't know your situation. The only person who does is you.
I had to quit with my first because I had major PPD and every time she latched, I resented it. I had a traumatic birth with DD. When she was 4 weeks old, I ended up in the hospital for 3 days for PPD. So when people say they don't understand why anyone would choose formula over breast milk, that stings for me. I still carry a lot of guilt for quitting. But I know my mental health was a priority to be a good mom. Once I was medicated (also why I had to quit, what they put me on was not safe for breastfeeding), and got more than one hour of sleep at a time, I finally felt like I was able to bond with her.
I personally did much better with pumping my second go at it. I was also better medicated for depression and anxiety with my second pregnancy (Prozac has been proven to be safe for breast feeding moms and worked really well for me). I am really really hoping to give it a go for this 4th baby (3rd pregnancy). And if it doesn't work out, I may just pump or go to formula again. I know for some pumping is so much more work than breastfeeding. But I was able to personally enjoy my DD much better when she was fed from a bottle because of my history of anxiety and depression. I never really pumped with my first, but did enjoy it the second time around. I am feeling positive that I may be able to get a system down to exclusively pump. I hope you will all cheer me on when I am struggling this time and also be my safe place if I decide it is too much for me.
Obviously I still have a lot to learn, and I continue to be so grateful for all the honest voices here to share their experiences without judgment.
DS: March 2014
DD: May 2015
BFP: 12/24/17 CP: 1/2/18 @ 4w 3d
BFP: 1/26/18 CP: 2/2/18 @ 4w 4d
BFP: 5/16/18 MMC: 6/15/18 @ 7w 5d
BFP: 9/25/18! EDD: 6/9/19 TEAM GREEN
Fed is best. I fully embrace that motto and I applaud every mother for making the decision that is best for them.
I hope to have a wonderful breastfeeding relationship with my child but if it doesn’t work for me I feel better knowing that it isn’t magical for everyone and that doesn’t mean there’s something wrong with me. That’s the beautiful part of this thread and this board. We’re all here to support each other.
1. One of the reasons that it's recommended to boil water for making formula is not necessarily because of the safety of the water. Its actually because powdered formula is not sterile. There is a concern for Cronobacter bacteria. So, anyone planning to FF from the beginning should familiarize themselves with the process. The water is supposed to be somewhere between boiling and drinkable temp - I want to say 170F but that should be verified. The (easier, more expensive) alternative is using "ready to feed" (liquid) formula. It comes in sterile containers. The bigger ones are good in the fridge for a defined amount of time after they're opened (often 24-48 hrs but I think it's dependent on the brand and the container, I think). This isn't such a big deal after the first 6-8 weeks in term infants, but I plan to have some of the little 2-oz containers of RTF formula on hand, even though I'm planning to BF.
2. The immunity benefits to baby are largely unproven past the colostrum phase. Certainly there's some potential for benefit to baby, but the last I checked, the only clinically proven benefit is a decrease in gastrointestinal illness in the first year. This is not to deter anyone, but don't feel like you're setting your baby up for a lifetime of illness and poor immunity by FFing. My BF baby has a literal continuous cold from daycare germs. It is what it is!
3. BF can be easy for some people, eventually. I don't know ANYONE who said it was "easy" the first 6 weeks. After that, if supply is good, latch is good, working/SAHM conditions allow, etc it definitely can be easier. But that's a lot of factors that need to go right!
4. To @ki1244 I will also add that one of my favorite things about BFing is that because we have a large-ish and sort of overbearing family (more of an issue for me with the ILs than my family...), I loved that having to nurse gave me an excuse to go somewhere quiet and have a few minutes to myself to read or play on my phone, etc. I agree with most of the other benefits stated. I did also really enjoy it, which surprised me because I was not into any kind of nipple stimulation, etc before. But I know I wouldn't have enjoyed it if there were things that weren't working for us.
I do think for the average person, it's worth giving BF a try. But no shame in it not working or not wanting to do it. Eventually they'll all be eating french fries off the floor and sharing ice cream with the dog.
I'm super impressed that this conversation has been so civilized. Kudos to this group!
And as a FTM, what I've found most helpful are more of the logistical (can't think of a better word) suggestions that have been made. Individually, any of one of us can Google this topic to death and find blogs/studies/articles that only confirm pre-existing biases on FF v BF, but its nearly impossible to find the sort of anecdotes you STM+ have provided. I love hearing about the "failures" as much as the "successes". There's so much to learn from you all and there's priceless value in what every single person has offered so far.
My goal is to breastfeed and it was set long before this thread was created. However, I knew that there were a number of different variables outside of my control that would dictate my ultimate success. I have you ladies to thank for helping me identify what they may be as well as tips and tricks that may help me achieve my goal. We don't know what we don't know.