IF/Testing Weekly Check-In 7/25

mrsdaddario

@NamelessAria Ugh that is hard! I spent a few hours on Monday with my hs best friend who is like, three weeks from giving birth to her second. I tried to be present and attentive, but I found myself quieter than normal. It's really hard to adjust to IF in itself, let alone without constant reminders around us. I suppose it's a lot like trying to kick an addiction. Your quitting smoking, seems like everyone smokes. Your quitting drinking, alcohol everywhere. You try to keep your mind off TTTC, babies...everywhere. 

YesOuiCan

@NamelessAria DITTO. My SIL just announced that she's expecting #2, and I had the pleasure of spending time with her over the weekend while I was enjoying tons of spotting during the afterglow of my BFN. Fortunately my SIL does not like the spotlight and didn't want to talk about her pregnancy much. But still. The jealousy is real. I feel you.

jmr1515

@NamelessAria I'm sorry you're having such a hard day. I had a very similar situation with my SIL. We had already been trying for about 4 or 5 months when she told me they were going to start trying...sure enough they announced they were pregnant a few weeks later. I cried so hard that weekend. The baby is here now and we are thrilled to have a nephew but it's incredibly hard seeing how happy they are. They'll never understand just how difficult it is for us. 
I hope you are taking care of yourself. Hugs!

ReesaAnne16

@NamelessAria I'm so sorry, announcements like that are so difficult and it's normal for you to feel sad. Like @jmr1515 said, I haven't handled announcements of forthcoming nieces/nephews very well either, you aren't alone  Take as much time as you need to process this news.

I feel like, all of us will be more considerate when it comes to announcing our (hopefully) future pregnancies.  Already I've decided that we won't be doing a "facebook announcement" because I know how painful they can be for women struggling with IF or even just TTC. Also, you won't see me posting baby photos all over facebook or texting to my friends & family (seriously, my SIL knows we're struggling with IF but STILL texts me pictures of her 8 month old ) 

Hang in there ladies... We are all stronger & wiser women than when we began this journey

LadyMillil

@ReesaAnne16  I don't want to upset people struggling with IF/MC with a pregnancy announcement, so I was thinking that if I'm ever in a position to be able to announce a pregnancy I would want to say something about how we struggled, like "after 20+ (whatever that number is) failed cycles, an IF diagnosis, and XX failed IF treatment cycles we are thrilled to announce our IVF baby is arriving in (month)"

Becky012016

@Daisy621; I'm sorry that I'm most likely one of the posters causing you to have a hard time. I can stop talking about him for a while or add a TW. Really, which ever would be easier for you. 

mrsdaddario

I too want to announce on social media once we DO get our take home baby. However, like @LadyMillil said, I also fully intend to explain our IF journey. I've actually been saving all of my pill bottles/needles/glass vile's of medications for when the time comes. I read an article not too long ago about a couple who finally go their take home baby after IVF. She announced by placing an ultrasound picture inside a heart made out of all of her needles and vile's etc and it just touched me so much. I think it really gives everyone a VISUAL impact of what you went through to get there. And perhaps, as the photo touched me, when the time comes (fx), my photo will help someone else on my social media accounts that perhaps I have/had no idea is going through a similar situation.

KristoKekerooni

@mrsdaddario - I've seen that picture and it is so touching! I wanted to do something similar. I don't think many people understand just how much "stuff" we go through trying to get pregnant. My friend was the one that actually saw it and sent it to me, and asked if that's really what it takes. She thought you got an IF diagnosis, and maybe got a turkey baster and then sometimes a miracle happens. She had no idea it actually took shots and pills and a million other things... even though I had told her it did/ The visual really did help her understand. 

KristoKekerooni

Late to the game, as I have been avoiding TTGP. For a long time I just couldn't handle the possibility of seeing a drive-by. I've been a depressed wreck, but I gotta pull out of it and deal so here I am. 

Diagnosis (If you've been): Severe MFI & RPL

Cycle/CD: Cycle 23, CD20

Status (WTO/TWW/TTA):  TWW

What are you doing this cycle? (Testing? Treatment?): Nothing. We met with the reproductive urologist and then the reproductive endocrinologist on the same day earlier this week. So that was a big step forward. 

  

How are things going? af,gh aklrhjgtklahk;rjg.  Long story short, Boo has varicoceles. They're super small, we don't know if surgery/cauterization will work. We opted out. Boo is on Clomid (off-label use: it's essentially estrogen, which should work to increase the testosterone, which should increase sperm count), we do a retest SA in 6 weeks (we are going to give it till first week of September, I think?). If counts are up, we will do an IUI. If not, straight to IVF. With IUI and increased counts (doc wants to see a minimum of 40 mill total), we were given a 12% chance per IUI. We would do this max of three times. With IVF, we would have the normal 40-80%. A BIG part of me wants to skip straight to IVF. The RE recommended a DNA fragmentation test. I get to skip the HSG since I have been pregnant, but I'm thinking about doing it anyway, just in case. I don't know. I feel like we are moving forward, which is great compared to sitting stagnant. But I also feel like the walls are closing in on me because we have so few choices. 

  

Any questions? Anyone know the cost of DNA fragmentation test?

GTKY: What is one movie that never fails to make you laugh your butt off? Anything animated. Because I am a child. 

NamelessAria

@LadyMillil I really like your idea. I mean at some point you'll have to announce to certain people, like coworkers. But then at least people know the story behind it instead of just thinking "Ugh I bet she is one of those super fertile tarts that get pregnant on the first cycle!"

I know it's easier for me to be happy for someone when I know everything they went through with IF struggles/loss(es) to get their precious baby instead of just assuming it was a first try and done situation.

@ReesaAnne16 You're definitely correct when you say we're stronger and wiser women than we were before all this. I know before I at least understood that MCs and IF are hard for people and I was as insensitive as some people but I probably still would have been the person to do some of the crappy fertility advice and consolation bingos ("it'll happen when it's meant to" "try not to worry about it" "everything happens for a reason" that sort of thing). And I never would have thought twice about announcing a pregnancy on social media, posting bump pics on social media, etc. I've definitely learned a lot.

My husband made some comment yesterday while he was trying to cheer me up that "God refines us through suffering and hardship. Everyone struggles in life with something at some point. This is just our struggle." And I'm not going to lie and say "and hearing that really put things into perspective for me and I felt so much better." because I didn't and I'm pretty sure I burst into tears again. But I do believe that people learn more in life from the hard times and the struggle than they do when everything is great. And I do think it tends to make people better people. Although I think I the time I just yelled at him through the tears something like "well I guess we're pretty fucking fine by now! <sobs>"

ReesaAnne16

@KristoB I will look through our records and see if I can find the cost of our DNA frag test, it was partially covered by insurance (we only get some testing coverage, no treatment )

KristoKekerooni

@ReesaAnne16 - I'd really appreciate it. I'm sure the price will be a bit different. They tend to charge insurance a ton, and our insurance doesn't cover anything, so it's all cash pay. 
Sorry that your insurance doesn't cover treatment. Overall, insurance sucks in this department regardless of whether they pay anything or not.

Edit: Spelling. der. 

ReesaAnne16

@KristoB  It was cheaper than I remembered; for some reason $120 came to mind, but that was the cost of the consultation with the urologist and SA. The DNA frag test only cost us $22 out of pocket (our insurance was billed $105, but only $44 was allowed, so we paid half that.) 
It makes me wonder if we should have the test repeated, since I've had DH on supplements since January, and it wasn't that expensive to have checked. Maybe we will have it checked again if IUI's aren't working for us. 

Let me know if you find any information regarding DNA frag and success rate for IUI/IVF. Our RE didn't feel that the high DNA frag result was a concern, and didn't think it would lower our IUI chances, but that's not what "the internet" says

KristoKekerooni

@ReesaAnne16 - Woah. I was not expecting it to be that cheap. I was expecting several hundred, so I was considering skipping it for the first IUI, if we go that route. I probably won't now. 
As far as DNA frag and IUIs, I haven't found too terribly much. What was your result? My RE said she would skip the IUI and go straight to IVF if fragmentation was anywhere greater than I believe 10%. Which is a pretty tight number, I think. I might be remembering wrong. I think I recorded the conversation, so I will have to re-listen and double check it. 

ReesaAnne16

@KristoB  42%  I worry our RE is overly optimistic.  Even the interpretation report from the lab says anything under 20 is normal, 20-30 is borderline, and >30 is very poor (meaning don't even bother with IUI, your only chance is IVF with ICSI) 
It's been a constant frustration for me, I have asked the nurses several times why would the report say this, and yet our RE is saying something COMPLETELY different. Of course you can never talk to the doctor over the phone, so the nurses keep saying "Dr. says that the semen washing prior to IUI will remove damaged sperm... blah blah..."

So our options are PAY for another in-person consult just to discuss this issue in detail some more, OR just try the IUI and see what happens (and hopefully be able to ask my doctor directly about this question during my IUI appointment). 
Sorry for my rant... it has obviously been a source of frustration for us. 

KristoKekerooni

@ReesaAnne16 - Geeze... Are you going to have a retest? Maybe after lifestyle changes she's hoping for improvement? Honestly, I am a terrible patient because I go into appointments armed with articles from scientific journals and ask for justification when my doc does something outside of the norm. Sometimes I get a great explanation, other times they kinda cede to me and decide to go another route. 

Also, as far as the washing removing damaged sperm, uh. no. The washing removes dead sperm, immobile sperm, terribly morphed sperm, mucus, and debris. If the DNA is fragmented inside an otherwise normal sperm, the washing doesn't remove them. In fact, research says washing can actually damage sperm (which is not a concern in those that already have normal sperm, as it's not a super high amount of damage).

I don't have much advice, since we haven't gotten to that point quite yet, but I encourage you to advocate for yourself. You are paying for this, if you aren't convinced this is the absolutely best route of treatment, then you shouldn't go through with it. You need to be either convinced you have a shot, or taken to a different path. I might only feel this way because I am a crazed money-saver, but really. This stuff is all already so dang expensive, why waste money on IUIs that are going to fail? That money could go to savings for IVF/adoption down the road. 

And now I rambled because I also get fed up with all this stuff.

HarryPotterandCats

@KristoB , FWIW, If I had the option to go straight to IVF I would have. Are you OOP or does your insurance cover and you have to do the IUIs? If you are OOP I personally believe that moving straight to IVF would be the best decision financially and emotionally. 

My RE gave us a 7% chance of success with IUI. Due to the fact that we are dealing with insurance (which I am beyond grateful for) we were required to do 2 IUIs before moving to IVF. 

KristoKekerooni

@HarryPotterandCats
#1 I LOVE YOUR USERNAME
#2 We are 100% OOP. Thanks for your take on it. I am really leaning toward asking for IVF directly, because then we could also skip HSG, DNA frag test, etc. But my DH is wanting to try the IUIs so we don't spend more money than necessary. The IUIs are only 335, including everything, so that's not bad.... but after three of them, if that's what it takes, that's a lot to add on top of IVF. Part of me is hoping the Clomid doesn't increase the counts enough to move to IUI so our choice is made for us. At the very least, it would mean a much shorter time to either get pregnant, or to know it's never gonna happen and move on. Considering September makes 2 years, I'm just really wanting to move on, whatever that means. 

ReesaAnne16

@KristoB   I appreciate your input, and it will definitely be a heated conversation the next chance I get with my RE, but unfortunately IUIs are the end of the road for us, so it's either try them, or do nothing. 

KristoKekerooni

@ReesaAnne16 Well I hope you get answers! Sorry to hear you're reaching the end. My fingers are crossed for you!

HarryPotterandCats

KristoB said:

@HarryPotterandCats
#1 I LOVE YOUR USERNAME
#2 We are 100% OOP. Thanks for your take on it. I am really leaning toward asking for IVF directly, because then we could also skip HSG, DNA frag test, etc. But my DH is wanting to try the IUIs so we don't spend more money than necessary. The IUIs are only 335, including everything, so that's not bad.... but after three of them, if that's what it takes, that's a lot to add on top of IVF. Part of me is hoping the Clomid doesn't increase the counts enough to move to IUI so our choice is made for us. At the very least, it would mean a much shorter time to either get pregnant, or to know it's never gonna happen and move on. Considering September makes 2 years, I'm just really wanting to move on, whatever that means. 

Thanks  

i know why you mean about hoping that the Clomid didnt work. We had the possibility to H not being able to have children due to a knicked tube from a hernia surgery when he was younger. I was secretly hoping his results would be poor so we could just move forward. I felt guilty but it would have moved everything forward. 

Your IUIs are so cheap (for IF purposes, lol). Mine were more expensive because I had to be on injectables. 

The only thing I can suggest is sitting down with your H and writing out a pros vs. cons list for doing IUI (if possible) and IVF. That may help show him that IVF is the best possible route because there is a great possibility that you will have more then one embryo after transfer to freeze. Then you wont have to worry about all this again (if you want more then one child that is) 

KristoKekerooni

@HarryPotterandCats
They are pretty cheap, mostly because I don't have any issues ovulating or anything so we wouldn't have to do meds. 
I think we are just gonna do the "hurry up and wait" deal for now till we redo the SA and then have a super serious conversation. I am working hard to save as much as possible between now and then so I can say "see? I already have X% saved up for IVF, it's not that bad" We will see how that works.... 

I see from your sig. you just had an IUI? Good luck!

mrsdaddario

I posted this question somewhere else, but I think it got lost! 

Can an someone remind me what "watery" CM means. On and off today I've had very watery CM. I usually lack any and all CM so I honestly can't remember what watery means. I realize since my follicle scan yesterday was no where near O, that I'm not close, but I'm just curious if anyone has any experience with "watery".

ReesaAnne16

mrsdaddario said:

I posted this question somewhere else, but I think it got lost! 

Can an someone remind me what "watery" CM means. On and off today I've had very watery CM. I usually lack any and all CM so I honestly can't remember what watery means. I realize since my follicle scan yesterday was no where near O, that I'm not close, but I'm just curious if anyone has any experience with "watery".

Watery is supposed to mean fertile (watery & eggwhite are the 2 fertile ones) I usually get watery leading up to eggwhite and then maybe 1-2days after (still pre-O). Usually it starts 5-6 days before ovulation for me

whiska

@mrsdaddario I'll agree with @ReesaAnne16 that it happens 5-6 days pre-ovulation for me, but I only get it maybe 50% of my cycles.  CM in general I think is an issue for me.  

Reading through all of this I just want to give everyone a big hug.  You're all in my thoughts and prayers!!!

HarryPotterandCats

@KristoB , good for you for putting your mind to things and saving. You will figure out whats best for you and roll with it. 

& I did just have my second IUI! Not having any hopeful thoughts and just assuming IVF is our best bet. It helps me emotionally. Thanks for your positive thoughts! 

mrsdaddario

Thanks ladies!!

kristismith95

Hi ladies! I mostly lurk but I hope you don't mind if I butt in. I just had my first RE appointment and I think your advice would be super helpful.

Diagnosis (If you've been): high thyroid levels, but no IF diagnosis yet!

Cycle/CD: 30

Status (WTO/TWW/TTA):  TWW

What are you doing this cycle? (Testing? Treatment?) Lots of testing! I had my thyroid levels and 8DPO progesterone levels taken a few days ago. I also will have CD3 blood tests and an ultrasound of my ovaries soon. They will also be injecting contrast to see if my tube are open. Also SA for DH.

  

How are things going? I'm just excited that we are finally getting things figured out.

  

Any questions? So my progesterone levels came back at a 6.2 at 8DPO. From what I've read this seems pretty low but still in normal range. I won't get my RE's advice until a month from now and I'm wondering if anyone had similar results and what it meant for you?

GTKY: What is one movie that never fails to make you laugh your butt off?
Bridesmaids and of course the classic Mean Girls!

mrsdaddario

@kristismith95 Hi, welcome!! Most RE's say a normal progesterone level a week after O should be 10 or above for an unmedicated cycle, and 20 or above for a medicated cycle. Your number does seem to be on the lower side but anything over 3 indicates that you did in fact O. Typically while working with an RE, they will put you on progesterone, whether orally or a vaginal suppository, to get your numbers where they should be. Progesterone is really important as it's helps O and also creates a healthy environment for the follicle to attach and stay in your uterine lining. 

kristismith95

@mrsdaddario thank you! That's what I figured would happen. I'm just being impatient about sing my RE again. Lol!

mrsdee15

@mokay19  Thank you, and you have a great point about TI after the IUI potentially.  My RE prefers Clomid to Femara but she mentioned that changing it up would be an option.  I guess there's a head-to-head clinical trial going on right now with Clomid and Femara that she's really interested in.

@mrsdaddario  I'm so sorry for the disappointing results on the scan.  Are they letting you consult with the MD?  I hope your next scan shows growth.  All the creepy internet hugs.  Also, I know the photo you're talking about with the medications around the ultrasound picture, I thought that was extremely powerful and a lovely tribute to all those with IF go through.  Watery CM for me is the closest I usually get to egg white, my understanding is that it's also fertile CM.

@LadyMillil  Thank you for that input - straight to IUI definitely makes sense when you put it in the context of dealing with Clomid side effects (I haven't taken it yet, but have heard it can be tough).  It's interesting that if it's going to work, it works in the first 3ish cycles.  I need to read more about that just out of curiosity.

@whiska  YES to everything you said.  I've been lurking this thread since I went to the RE in June, because it feels like a better fit now.  It's getting a little tedious posting in the normal WTO/TWW threads every day because of the constant feeling that it's not working.  I hope your treatments also go well when you start (I've also only done bloodwork/exams/HSG up to this point), and it'd be awesome to have you as a treatments buddy.  

@NamelessAria  Ugh... I know the feeling, and I'm sorry.  I wish I had more helpful words.  All the hugs.

Thank you all for the warm welcome, it's a huge relief to have this thread!

Lauren4508

Diagnosis (If you've been): factor v Leiden heterozygous 

Cycle/CD: cd 6

Status (WTO/TWW/TTA):  wto

What are you doing this cycle? (Testing? Treatment?) waiting on the rest of the test results to come in before talking to dr

  

How are things going? I feel a little better after getting some of the test results back and knowing that there is a possibility to rectify this situation and hopefully move forward past my 2 mc this year. As I was being told my results over the phone the nurse did say that as soon as I got a positive pregnancy test to call her and she would call in lovenox and show me how to inject myself daily. Not looking forward to that, but happy there is a work around to get our little bundle of joy.

  

Any questions? 

Can you still deliver naturally with a blood clot disorder? Can I breast feed while on lovenox?

GTKY: What is one movie that never fails to make you laugh your butt off? Supertroopers

NYTino24

@Lauren4508 I may be way out of line to post here since I haven't been TTC long enough to be in this category, but I'm lurking / empathizing and I wanted to say I'm rooting for you and all women here. I do have a little insight to blood disorders. I was diagnosed with VWD as a late teen after irregular clotting - bleeding gums, easy bruising, heavy periods, nose bleeds, scarring instead of scabbing, etc. BCP helped and I was given DDAVP / Stimate for surgeries. Fast forward to going off BCP and I had blood work done about 8 months ago. New hematologist says I don't have it... Either way, I've asked about childbirth several times over the years and got a few different answers. Sometimes I was told I would just need monitoring and others said possible medication if I started to hemmorage. I don't know your specific disorder, so I can't give much insight other than most GP and Ob/Gyn really didn't know much about hematology. Some didn't seem to ever have even heard of what I was diagnosed with. Good luck and fx for you!

mrsdaddario

@Lauren4508 I actually had a friend who has a blood clot disorder. She also has PCOS and she got pregnant after years and years of thinking she could never get pregnant. She was on Lovenox her entire pregnant and had a natural delivery in October. In fact, she was in labor and the thought she might need a C-Section, but she ended up delivering naturally. Two pushes and he was out! He'll be one in October!

Marley629

@Lauren4508 hi there! I also have factor five Leiden heterozygous - I asked same questions when was pregnant with DS ; I didn't need lovenox during pregnancy since I didn't have history of an actual clot or loss but i needed it after delivery for 8 weeks. It does not affect breast feeding at all and should not prevent you from delivering naturally. It's great that there is a plan in place.  Giving yourself the shots wasn't so bad after doing it the first time and it's for a great reason so I know you will get the hang of it! I wish you all the luck in the world with your Ttc journey. 

Lauren4508

@Marley629 thanks so much for your response and encouragement! Learning more and more about this stuff everyday!

Lauren4508

@NYTino24 thanks for the encouragement to myself and everyone else out there fighting for healthy and safe pregnancies! 

@mrsdaddario thanks so much for your response! It's nice to hear that your friend was able to deliver naturally! That helps to take a load off my shoulders and give me more hope. 

Thank you all for the words of encouragement and good luck to all you women out there fighting this fight! Love to you all!