Help with friend issue

penguingrrl · October 2014

cjcouple said:

I also do think, though, that it's really important for some kids to understand that they aren't owed an explanation any time someone says no to them. I remember reading an article when Julia was little about how the way you handle things like this when a child is a toddler hard wires their brain and when they hit their teen years they will unconciously expect the same response. So if you teach a child that they will always get a satisfying answer to why you said no at two, when they're a teen they will have a harder time understanding that there isn't always a reason (sex being a huge place where no reason needs to be given, ever). And teens do not have the long-term thinking necessary to comprehend the reasoned answer you're giving them (you need to do well in school so that a decade from now you will hopefully get a good job isn't a very compelling argument when faced with homework versus fun tonight).
hmmmm....interesting. I do think some parents over explain situations with their toddlers. and it makes sense to a point. but wouldn't some of this also depend on the conversation(s) you have with your kids about personal space and respect of the opposite sex. I don't think a screw up as a toddler with "no" means your kid is doomed as a teen to disrespect a no during sex.

I don't think that every child who wasn't taught no as a toddler will be disrespectful to sexual partners/potential partners. There are many more things that go into it of course. But I do think that setting tones can certainly help and setting a precedent that while an explanation is nice you have to listen to authority regardless is a good lesson in general.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:

Andrewsgal said:

cjcouple said:

Andrewsgal said:

cjcouple said:

Andrewsgal said:

cjcouple said:
I think some people might need to step away from the computer!!!

cough.....AG..... cough.

I do find it rather humorous that you are telling me to teach my mute child to just keep quiet and accept no (which he can) when told. I promise you if my kid asked his teacher why she said no, the entire class including his teacher would be celebrating. lol

aim that target elsewhere lady.
When you know you are wrong play the SN card that's cool.

it has nothing to do with his SM. YOU are physically telling ME (you said cj teach your 8yo) to teach my kid a skill about something he can't do. and you know he is mute. it's not a secret.

clearly my kid doesn't pester his teacher.

but isn't it the hope that one day he will? And what about the other one. BTW I still think playing the SN card here is kind of gross.
have you read my posts? you are making a lot of assumptions here. stop attacking ME over something so minor and that isn't even an issue.

I asked for examples of situations where a child might be told no without reason it's not easy to give because most people just give reasons. I didn't say I disagreed with it. I said before I agree or disagree. I just could think of a reason it may happen. and guess what? a pp have me an example without attacking me.

I also followed up with "my kids don't always ask why". it must have just been something they learned along the way. I didn't set out to teach them that.

idc if you think it's gross. you attacked my parenting/kid over an issue that is nonexistent.

I think it's gross you jump on someone you don't even know irl over such a silly thing that may or may not be true.

relax, my parenting/kids have no effect on your life.
Maybe it's time for you to step away from these boards you seem to be playing the victim a lot lately.
yeah because defending myself against being called fucking crazy and my kid a special snowflake when I asked a follow up question is me being a victim. please!!!

tell you what AG: you have fun up there acting like the perfect mother and keep judging the rest of us and I will live in reality with the rest of the board.

maybe you should start checking your fucking ego at the door.

You are out of your mind. Like legit crazy. I have never ever claimed to be perfect in fact I tear down my parenting way more on here than most. You are pissed you got called out. Just own it instead on turning it back around on me.

kcisthebombdotcom · October 2014

Andrewsgal said:

penguingrrl said:

I also do think, though, that it's really important for some kids to understand that they aren't owed an explanation any time someone says no to them. I remember reading an article when Julia was little about how the way you handle things like this when a child is a toddler hard wires their brain and when they hit their teen years they will unconciously expect the same response. So if you teach a child that they will always get a satisfying answer to why you said no at two, when they're a teen they will have a harder time understanding that there isn't always a reason (sex being a huge place where no reason needs to be given, ever). And teens do not have the long-term thinking necessary to comprehend the reasoned answer you're giving them (you need to do well in school so that a decade from now you will hopefully get a good job isn't a very compelling argument when faced with homework versus fun tonight).

I do think there's a difference between a child asking why to no out of defiance and asking why because they're curious and truly don't understand something.
I think it's also important to realize that by my kids age they know the why 90% of the time. My kid knew I would say no to a slurpee today and he knew why. I don't owe him an explanation he is old/smart enough to figure it out. Just like teachers don't owe explanations to every rule.

We are in agreement here because I would never offer an explanation to a rule my kid already knew. I only disagree with the "no because I said so" message when a kid is asking a legitimate question.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:
but IMO listening to authority and flowing rules, is very different than being told no just because I said so.

but I as I said before: as an adult, I have never been told no without reason that I recall.

have any of you?

Yes

Aussie45 · October 2014

There's nothing wrong with kids not getting reasons. My dad was an asshole and never gave a reason, and was awful to live with. What he did and what I do with my kid are so vastly different they're not even on the same playing field. But no, I don't feel (even though I've experienced it a lot) that my kid needs a reason every time.

notkateanymore · October 2014

cjcouple said:

I think some people might need to step away from the computer!!! cough.....AG..... cough. I do find it rather humorous that you are telling me to teach my mute child to just keep quiet and accept no (which he can) when told. I promise you if my kid asked his teacher why she said no, the entire class including his teacher would be celebrating. lol aim that target elsewhere lady.

Way to bring SN into somewhere where it wasn't needed. Next KC will be trotting our her much worked for autism Dx.

notkateanymore · October 2014

cjcouple said:

haha. ok. Called out on what? what exactly would I be owning? you are a dirty fighter.

Oh come the fuck on now, I don't give a shit about the fight between the two of you, but you brought up SN as soon as you could.

kcisthebombdotcom · October 2014

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

haha. ok. Called out on what? what exactly would I be owning? you are a dirty fighter.

Oh come the fuck on now, I don't give a shit about the fight between the two of you, but you brought up SN as soon as you could.

Funny you say that but you jump in every time AG disagrees with someone. Then again you're just as bad as her if not worse....

Aussie45 · October 2014

kcisthebombdotcom said:

fintin said:

@kcisthebombdotcom‌ When I say no my child says "yes ma'am" because that's how we raised him. What we say goes. If I give him a reason great! If not the answers still no. He respects that. So no! I set my standards high for my child and he rises to the occasion.

Again different strokes for different folks but I consider that teaching compliance to adults vs teaching right from wrong. I want my kids to behave because they understand the rules and respect them, not just going along with what adults say.

And yes, they should know that and question things that seem weird or not right. FFS though, I don't need to give my kid a reason every fucking time. Sometimes, I'm tired, having a bad day, or I need to focus on something else. If I say no without a reason, I don't need my kid questioning it, especially if I'm trying to do something else. My SS can take my no without question even though probably 8 to 9 times out of 10 I give her a reason. I don't always need to verbalize it though.

Like when DD asks me for the millioneth time if she can watch Dora and I've already said no about 6 times that day, I don't need to tell her that TV will rot her brain, or that she needs to utilize her toys or anything else. We're just not watching Dora that day, get over it.

notkateanymore · October 2014

kcisthebombdotcom said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

haha. ok. Called out on what? what exactly would I be owning? you are a dirty fighter.

Oh come the fuck on now, I don't give a shit about the fight between the two of you, but you brought up SN as soon as you could.

Funny you say that but you jump in every time AG disagrees with someone. Then again you're just as bad as her if not worse....

LOL Ok. I only "jump in" when it's you...and from the looks of this thread I am not the only one. Seriously, why do you stay here?

notkateanymore · October 2014

cjcouple said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

I think some people might need to step away from the computer!!! cough.....AG..... cough. I do find it rather humorous that you are telling me to teach my mute child to just keep quiet and accept no (which he can) when told. I promise you if my kid asked his teacher why she said no, the entire class including his teacher would be celebrating. lol aim that target elsewhere lady.

Way to bring SN into somewhere where it wasn't needed. Next KC will be trotting our her much worked for autism Dx.

It wasn't needed? Exactly why not?

AG calls me crazy, says my kid is a special snowflake, says I need to teach my kid a skill (knowing full well he is mute) in which she assumed he needed (which he doesn't since he is MUTE and therefore does NOT interrupt his teacher) which again she knows. I call her out ....why wasn't it needed? Why is it ok for her to get nasty but not me to defend myself and my kid.

It's not like I am using it as an excuse. I don't need to excuse him for anything since he doesn't disrupt an entire class (and one more time .....she KNOWS this)

CJ what she said doesn't have anything to do with being mute...kids need to learn that no is no. Who the fuck cares if he speaks?

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

I think some people might need to step away from the computer!!!

cough.....AG..... cough.

I do find it rather humorous that you are telling me to teach my mute child to just keep quiet and accept no (which he can) when told. I promise you if my kid asked his teacher why she said no, the entire class including his teacher would be celebrating. lol

aim that target elsewhere lady.

Way to bring SN into somewhere where it wasn't needed. Next KC will be trotting our her much worked for autism Dx.

It wasn't needed? Exactly why not?

AG calls me crazy, says my kid is a special snowflake, says I need to teach my kid a skill (knowing full well he is mute) in which she assumed he needed (which he doesn't since he is MUTE and therefore does NOT interrupt his teacher) which again she knows. I call her out ....why wasn't it needed? Why is it ok for her to get nasty but not me to defend myself and my kid.

It's not like I am using it as an excuse. I don't need to excuse him for anything since he doesn't disrupt an entire class (and one more time .....she KNOWS this)

CJ what she said doesn't have anything to do with being mute...kids need to learn that no is no. Who the fuck cares if he speaks?

She said specifically, teach your 8yo to accept no without questioning so he doesn't interrupt an entire class. how is this not related?

She should have said my 5yo and it never would have come out. But she targeted B

See here is the issue I didn't target anyone. The fact that you think I did is a prime example of playing the victim. Seriously I totally forgot your kid has special needs. I still stand behind he needs to learn no means no.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

kcisthebombdotcom said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

haha. ok.

Called out on what? what exactly would I be owning?

you are a dirty fighter.

Oh come the fuck on now, I don't give a shit about the fight between the two of you, but you brought up SN as soon as you could.

Funny you say that but you jump in every time AG disagrees with someone. Then again you're just as bad as her if not worse....

This coming from you is downright hysterical.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:

Andrewsgal said:

cjcouple said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

I think some people might need to step away from the computer!!!

cough.....AG..... cough.

I do find it rather humorous that you are telling me to teach my mute child to just keep quiet and accept no (which he can) when told. I promise you if my kid asked his teacher why she said no, the entire class including his teacher would be celebrating. lol

aim that target elsewhere lady.

Way to bring SN into somewhere where it wasn't needed. Next KC will be trotting our her much worked for autism Dx.

It wasn't needed? Exactly why not?

AG calls me crazy, says my kid is a special snowflake, says I need to teach my kid a skill (knowing full well he is mute) in which she assumed he needed (which he doesn't since he is MUTE and therefore does NOT interrupt his teacher) which again she knows. I call her out ....why wasn't it needed? Why is it ok for her to get nasty but not me to defend myself and my kid.

It's not like I am using it as an excuse. I don't need to excuse him for anything since he doesn't disrupt an entire class (and one more time .....she KNOWS this)

CJ what she said doesn't have anything to do with being mute...kids need to learn that no is no. Who the fuck cares if he speaks?

She said specifically, teach your 8yo to accept no without questioning so he doesn't interrupt an entire class. how is this not related?

She should have said my 5yo and it never would have come out. But she targeted B

See here is the issue I didn't target anyone. The fact that you think I did is a prime example of playing the victim. Seriously I totally forgot your kid has special needs. I still stand behind he needs to learn no means no.

Exactly, where did I say he didn;t knwo this?

secondly, defending myself is not playing a victim. You called him a special snowflake and specifically called out my 8yo? you didn't say my kids or my boys. Do you need me to go back and quote? Because I can

Because I totally forgot your kid has special needs. Don't worry KC I won't forget again oops I mean cj. I got mixed up because you both like playing the special needs card when things aren't going your way.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:

Andrewsgal said:

cjcouple said:

Andrewsgal said:

cjcouple said:

Because I totally forgot your kid has special needs. Don't worry KC I won't forget again oops I mean cj. I got mixed up because you both like playing the special needs card when things aren't going your way.

what are you talking about? What wasn't going my way? People were answering my posts respectfully like adults. You come in all fired up

And you got offended and pulled the special needs card. I think that's gross.

fintin · October 2014

cjcouple said:
but IMO listening to authority and flowing rules, is very different than being told no just because I said so.

but I as I said before: as an adult, I have never been told no without reason that I recall.

have any of you?

Maybe that's because your an adult and your safety is in your own hands and you know what's best for you. Kids dont.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:
@andrewsgal
You know I used to respect you and value your opinions. Not anymore, I think your a joke.
Just stop responding to my posts from now on since I'm gross.
And I will stay away from yours ok?

Never said you were gross said pulling the SN card was. I am sorry you feel that way. I am glad I can disagree with others and they act like adults instead of taking their ball and going home.
@cjcouple‌

Andrewsgal · October 2014

BTW if you have been around long enough you would know we have all gotten into it with each other. I believe I told kate to duck off not long ago.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:
Besides, what exactly would you have done in my shoes...sit there and take it? You were out of line.

Then tell me I am out of line. Don't pull the SN card.

fintin · October 2014

I think we have all gotten into it with AG.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

fintin said:
I think we have all gotten into it with AG.

And you're all still here? Weird;)

fintin · October 2014

I know! We are gluttons for punishment. With a reason of course

fintin · October 2014

cjcouple said:

fintin said:

I think we have all gotten into it with AG.

hmmm - I wonder why?

Because we differ in opinion on certain things.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:

fintin said:

I think we have all gotten into it with AG.

hmmm - I wonder why?

You know what @cjcouple‌ you can fuck off. I have always supported you and cheered you on. Through all your stuff with your son, foreclosure and all that crap. Then I call you out because I think you are wrong. Because well that's what we do. Support each other through the crappy times and call each other out when we are being dumb. So play the victim. Take your ball and go home. But don't for one second forget that I have supported and defended you. Grow up.

Andrewsgal · October 2014

I said I forgot your kid has special needs I own that. Yes I was a bitch you were ridiculous. You seriously couldn't think of any time you were told no or told them no. So I am sorry I forgot your kid has SN. I am not sorry for calling you out. Not what you wanted to hear Huh?

Aussie45 · October 2014

What I learned from this thread: @CurlingRocks is a mod. Mind blown! How did I not know this?!

Andrewsgal · October 2014

cjcouple said:

Andrewsgal said:

I said I forgot your kid has special needs I own that. Yes I was a bitch you were ridiculous. You seriously couldn't think of any time you were told no or told them no. So I am sorry I forgot your kid has SN. I am not sorry for calling you out. Not what you wanted to hear Huh?

Without reason? no, I couldn't. I even asked for examples because I realized there may be situations where it might have occured and I forgot.

I mean the only place I can think of where I might be in a position to even be told no is at work. If I ask for vacation, and it is not avaiable they say because it is already taken. I dont need to ask "permission" for much. I never ask DH for permission. Who the fuck else would tell me no?

Even with my kids, I say no. I don't give a reason automatically but it is just natural on my end. I dont; analyze the shit out of every single parent thing. If they ask why I answer? Why wouldn't I?

If they were asking inappropriately/frequently I think it would register as something we need to work on but it is nothing I have ever noticed to be a problem so its never been on my radar.

I don't give a shit what you think about the SN card. I am not making excuses but I not gonna sit here and justify defending myself when I felt attacked. How did I know you forgot?

It was pretty ironic though that you used him instead of both boys.

I didn't use your younger one because I didn't know if he was in school yet. Just like I forgot about the mutism I also don't remember every kids age on here.

notkateanymore · October 2014

scatteredtrees said:

kcisthebombdotcom said:

notkateanymore said:

cjcouple said:

haha. ok. Called out on what? what exactly would I be owning? you are a dirty fighter.

Oh come the fuck on now, I don't give a shit about the fight between the two of you, but you brought up SN as soon as you could.

Funny you say that but you jump in every time AG disagrees with someone. Then again you're just as bad as her if not worse....

Oh puh-lease KC. You post shit like this just to start fights. You're the new Hav.

Or just Hav.

dun dun duuuuuuuuun.

eaglesfan700 · October 2014

Fucking snacks!

Seriously, I still don't get what is wrong with "because I said so". Not every day, obviously but yes, it is said on occasion. Feel sorry for my mindless drones and weep for their future

vlagrl29 · October 2014

dang, now I want some fruit snacks!

rosesandpetals · October 2014

Okay, just want to throw this out there for those asking for an example. Today, I had 24 fifth graders change classes and when they came into my class, half of them ran up to me asking about the homework, can I get a drink, I need to use the bathroom, my mom.is.picking me.up.early. so I said no to everyone and told them to sit down. Once everyone was seated I asked who needed to go the bathroom and let 3 go at a time, sent a couple kids to get some water, and then addressed the questions about when homework was due. But when I first said.no and told them all to sit down, I had THOSE kids -- the ones who need to know why they are being denied water and why I can't just tell them about the homework right now. Sometimes the answer is no, just sit down so I can regain control of the class and send people in an orderly way. Of course, I'm not denying anyone a visit to the bathroom if they need to go but sometimes the answer is no and demanding an explanation takes time away from the rest of the class who us behaving and sitting down like I said. I think it is really interesting how people always imagine this one on one time the teachers have with students, like they imagine their kid raising their hand in class and being told no water because I said so. That is not the case all the time. Anyway, that's my $0.02. Sorry for the text wall, I am on mobile.

Louie4real · October 2014

Holy Shit. 9 PAGES?!

And for the record...KC, I'm pretty sure that you did this intentionally for your own amusement, which honestly, makes me want to take a shower. Just 'aint right.

bumpuser924057 · October 2014

I'm just now reading this nine pages of fuckery after a shitty day of hauling all three kids to an outlet mall, a grocery store, and Sam's Club. I lost count of how many times I had to say no to DS in probably the first hour. No, you can't have all the Frozen merchandise in the Disney outlet. No, we're not going back to the bathroom so you can sit on the toilet a second time just because you like public restrooms. No, you can't have that box of crackers. No, I don't want you to get out of the car cart and run around in the checkout lane. No, you can't climb into the playhouse display at Sam's that's suspended from the ceiling. No, we're not opening that box of strawberries right now. No, no, no, no, no, fucking NO. If I had to give a detailed reason every time I would have driven us all off a goddamn cliff after the first stop. And "I'm out of patience and you're being annoying" is not really a reason that I want to give him anyway.

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