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Smoking weed while pregnant...

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Re: Smoking weed while pregnant...

  • skoogirlskoogirl
    imagebstrangely:
    imageskoogirl:

    Prenatal cannabis exposure was significantly associated with increased mu receptor expression in the amygdala, reduced kappa receptor mRNA in mediodorsal thalamic nucleus and reduced preproenkephalin expression in the caudal putamen. 

    Sample size may be small, but it's a pathology study.  So is this one. I don't understand what these things mean, but they do not sound good and I would not want any child to be exposed to something that is strongly associated with any damage of any kind. 

    Also, small foot size might sound funny, but it clearly indicates that they are negatively affected by the drug.

    These are abstracts from the national libraries of medicine, whose index can be found here www.pubmed.com If you feel like ordering those studies you're welcome to but the abstracts summarize their findings.

    again, these abstracts are not particularly informative. that's why i don't post them unless they are simple enough for a layperson like myself to discuss. you admit that you don't understand these things you're posting, and that's fine, but what you're doing now is being paranoid. there are a lot of things that are associated with "damage" to the fetus, and they aren't illegal, for one thing, and for another thing, women do them all the time. i can list examples like eating sushi or coldcuts without heating them properly. in conversations about those things, i get chastised for providing evidence of harm, because so many women do them without incident, that others are willing to gamble. other examples would be artificial sweeteners, such as the aspartame found in the benefiber i bought and now won't use and the crystal light packets a lot of users here talk about.

    why doesn't anyone ever state that she quit talking to someone because they drank crystal light while they were pregnant? it's the reaction that i find so ridiculous. there are tons of things i gave up while pregnant, but i think it's kind of odd to think everyone else has to too, on pain of excommunication.

     

    I don't think it's paranoid to avoid something that affects development of parts of the brain just because I don't understand what those parts of the brain are (mu receptor, amygdala, kappa receptor mRNA in mediodorsal thalamic nucleus, reduced preproenkephalin expression in the caudal putamen). 

    You asked, begged, for real scientific evidence.  The real studies are hard to understand by layman's terms. What I do understand is that smoking pot is bad for developing babies' brains.

    Fine if you disagree with whatever policy that ensues, but you were saying there is no science that backs up the stance that pot is bad for babies.  I attached scientific studies for you to see.

    You can continue to rant about legalization, sushi, overreaction, whatever so long as you don't try to persuade people into thinking it's not bad to smoke pot when pregnant.

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  • skoogirlskoogirl

    Also, a search on the index of the NLM only produced two results on sushi and pregnancy:

    Sushi in Pregnancy, Parasitic Diseases - Obstetrician Survey. Jones JL, Anderson B, Schulkin J, Parise ME, Eberhard ML. Zoonoses Public Health. 2009 Dec 23. [Epub ahead of print]PMID: 20042060 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]Related articles (which concluded: However, few (19%) knew that thorough freezing kills parasites in fish. Nearly all (94%) respondents thought that parasitic infections can be more challenging to treat in pregnancy. U.S. ob-gyns believe that eating raw fish during pregnancy is not safe; most would benefit from information about how to prevent infection and about treatment.)


    Analysis of the health risk of exposure to breast milk mercury in infants in Taiwan. Chien LC, Han BC, Hsu CS, Jiang CB, You HJ, Shieh MJ, Yeh CY. Chemosphere. 2006 Jun;64(1):79-85. Epub 2006 Jan 25.PMID: 16442149 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]Related articles (discusses mercury content)

     

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imageskoogirl:

    Also, a search on the index of the NLM only produced two results on sushi and pregnancy:

    Sushi in Pregnancy, Parasitic Diseases - Obstetrician Survey. Jones JL, Anderson B, Schulkin J, Parise ME, Eberhard ML. Zoonoses Public Health. 2009 Dec 23. [Epub ahead of print]PMID: 20042060 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]Related articles (which concluded: However, few (19%) knew that thorough freezing kills parasites in fish. Nearly all (94%) respondents thought that parasitic infections can be more challenging to treat in pregnancy. U.S. ob-gyns believe that eating raw fish during pregnancy is not safe; most would benefit from information about how to prevent infection and about treatment.)


    Analysis of the health risk of exposure to breast milk mercury in infants in Taiwan. Chien LC, Han BC, Hsu CS, Jiang CB, You HJ, Shieh MJ, Yeh CY. Chemosphere. 2006 Jun;64(1):79-85. Epub 2006 Jan 25.PMID: 16442149 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]Related articles (discusses mercury content)

     

    most obstetricians warn about sushi because of the listeria risk, not because of parasites and mercury.

    "Pregnant women need to be especially cautious about consuming foods that are associated with a high risk of listeriosis," Weese says, "because the disease can cause intrauterine infections of the fetus that can lead to spontaneous abortions and even stillbirth."

    Many scientists, in fact, now believe the repeated miscarriages and infant deaths associated with Queen Anne?s pregnancies may have been caused by Listeria infections.

    ...

    People at high risk should be especially wary of foods such as smoked fish and mussels, oysters or raw seafood such as sashimi or sushi.

    This also includes prepared or stored salads, such as coleslaw, and pre-cooked meat products, such as deli meats and pate, that require no additional cooking or heating before serving."

    https://www.aces.edu/dept/extcomm/newspaper/feb4a02.html

    https://www.foodmicro2008.org/fm08/resources/374/1143/pdf/FM2008_0447.pdf

    https://www.americanpregnancy.org/pregnancyhealth/foodstoavoid.html

    https://articles.sfgate.com/2010-03-14/food/18527130_1_listeria-pregnant-women-food-safety-system

     

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imageskoogirl:
    imagebstrangely:
    imageskoogirl:

    Prenatal cannabis exposure was significantly associated with increased mu receptor expression in the amygdala, reduced kappa receptor mRNA in mediodorsal thalamic nucleus and reduced preproenkephalin expression in the caudal putamen. 

    Sample size may be small, but it's a pathology study.  So is this one. I don't understand what these things mean, but they do not sound good and I would not want any child to be exposed to something that is strongly associated with any damage of any kind. 

    Also, small foot size might sound funny, but it clearly indicates that they are negatively affected by the drug.

    These are abstracts from the national libraries of medicine, whose index can be found here www.pubmed.com If you feel like ordering those studies you're welcome to but the abstracts summarize their findings.

    again, these abstracts are not particularly informative. that's why i don't post them unless they are simple enough for a layperson like myself to discuss. you admit that you don't understand these things you're posting, and that's fine, but what you're doing now is being paranoid. there are a lot of things that are associated with "damage" to the fetus, and they aren't illegal, for one thing, and for another thing, women do them all the time. i can list examples like eating sushi or coldcuts without heating them properly. in conversations about those things, i get chastised for providing evidence of harm, because so many women do them without incident, that others are willing to gamble. other examples would be artificial sweeteners, such as the aspartame found in the benefiber i bought and now won't use and the crystal light packets a lot of users here talk about.

    why doesn't anyone ever state that she quit talking to someone because they drank crystal light while they were pregnant? it's the reaction that i find so ridiculous. there are tons of things i gave up while pregnant, but i think it's kind of odd to think everyone else has to too, on pain of excommunication.

     

    I don't think it's paranoid to avoid something that affects development of parts of the brain just because I don't understand what those parts of the brain are (mu receptor, amygdala, kappa receptor mRNA in mediodorsal thalamic nucleus, reduced preproenkephalin expression in the caudal putamen). 

    You asked, begged, for real scientific evidence.  The real studies are hard to understand by layman's terms. What I do understand is that smoking pot is bad for developing babies' brains.

    Fine if you disagree with whatever policy that ensues, but you were saying there is no science that backs up the stance that pot is bad for babies.  I attached scientific studies for you to see.

    You can continue to rant about legalization, sushi, overreaction, whatever so long as you don't try to persuade people into thinking it's not bad to smoke pot when pregnant.

    and there are additional studies that prove that there is no difference in children as they age. if you looked at any of the links i provided, you would have seen this. in fact, there is one study from 1991 that says children had better motor coordination if their mothers smoked:

    "The results show no significant differences in developmental testing outcomes between children of marijuana-using and non-using mothers except at 30 days of age when the babies of users had more favourable scores on two clusters of the Brazelton Scales: autonomic stability and reflexes. The developmental scores at ages 4 and 5 years were significantly correlated to certain aspects of the home environment and to regularity of basic school (preschool) attendance."

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1957518

    i have NEVER, NOT ONCE tried to persuade people that it isn't bad to smoke pot while pregnant. that's one reason i have not posted that particular link previously: i don't think one study is generally proof of anything, and definitely not a greenlight for drug use during pregnancy. i simply don't understand why it's perceived to be so much worse than other things. it is unfortunate that so many people fail to read what i've been saying, and you are no exception. at no point did i say that people should smoke weed when they are pregnant, and i personally do not. 

    hope that isn't too complicated for you.

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  • PubStar09PubStar09 member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagePubStar09:

    Holy Hell.  I just read through this entire thread, and omg.  Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?

    My only argument will be that pot is illegal in most states, and accordingly, the user can be thrown in prison for merely possessing it.  That being said, why risk smoking pot because you're selfish, if you could end up being detained and taken away from your family/children? (Yes, pot is dangerous, but so are cigarettes and alcohol, this isn't about "pot is MORE dangerous", it's about "pot is illegal in most places)

    Also, that being said, I don't smoke pot, but I agree with making it legal nationwide.  It's really no worse than cigarettes or alcohol, and we're wasting too many tax dollars trying to arrest people in association with marijuana. Make it legal, tax the *** out of it, and get some of that "war on drugs" money back.

    holy hell, do you not know what "merit" means? where did i say, "hey everyone, it's good to smoke pot when you're ku!"

    seriously, what in the hell. i just want to understand all the people who are cutting friends out of their lives because they smoke weed. is that normal? do you quit talking to someone who had an occasional beer or sushi when she was pregnant?

    Dude. Read my post again.  I didn't say anything about you saying smoking pot is okay when you're ku.  I was talking about smoking pot in general is selfish... more importantly, when you're doing it in a place where pot is illegal... because, and follow along here:  you could end up being detained and taken away from your family/children.  Damn. Reading comprehension FTW.

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagePubStar09:
    imagebstrangely:
    imagePubStar09:

    Holy Hell.  I just read through this entire thread, and omg.  Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?

    My only argument will be that pot is illegal in most states, and accordingly, the user can be thrown in prison for merely possessing it.  That being said, why risk smoking pot because you're selfish, if you could end up being detained and taken away from your family/children? (Yes, pot is dangerous, but so are cigarettes and alcohol, this isn't about "pot is MORE dangerous", it's about "pot is illegal in most places)

    Also, that being said, I don't smoke pot, but I agree with making it legal nationwide.  It's really no worse than cigarettes or alcohol, and we're wasting too many tax dollars trying to arrest people in association with marijuana. Make it legal, tax the *** out of it, and get some of that "war on drugs" money back.

    holy hell, do you not know what "merit" means? where did i say, "hey everyone, it's good to smoke pot when you're ku!"

    seriously, what in the hell. i just want to understand all the people who are cutting friends out of their lives because they smoke weed. is that normal? do you quit talking to someone who had an occasional beer or sushi when she was pregnant?

    Dude. Read my post again.  I didn't say anything about you saying smoking pot is okay when you're ku.  I was talking about smoking pot in general is selfish... more importantly, when you're doing it in a place where pot is illegal... because, and follow along here:  you could end up being detained and taken away from your family/children.  Damn. Reading comprehension FTW.

    it's right there in your post, you silly person:

    "Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?"

    ftw.

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  • PubStar09PubStar09 member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagePubStar09:
    imagebstrangely:
    imagePubStar09:

    Holy Hell.  I just read through this entire thread, and omg.  Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?

    My only argument will be that pot is illegal in most states, and accordingly, the user can be thrown in prison for merely possessing it.  That being said, why risk smoking pot because you're selfish, if you could end up being detained and taken away from your family/children? (Yes, pot is dangerous, but so are cigarettes and alcohol, this isn't about "pot is MORE dangerous", it's about "pot is illegal in most places)

    Also, that being said, I don't smoke pot, but I agree with making it legal nationwide.  It's really no worse than cigarettes or alcohol, and we're wasting too many tax dollars trying to arrest people in association with marijuana. Make it legal, tax the *** out of it, and get some of that "war on drugs" money back.

    holy hell, do you not know what "merit" means? where did i say, "hey everyone, it's good to smoke pot when you're ku!"

    seriously, what in the hell. i just want to understand all the people who are cutting friends out of their lives because they smoke weed. is that normal? do you quit talking to someone who had an occasional beer or sushi when she was pregnant?

    Dude. Read my post again.  I didn't say anything about you saying smoking pot is okay when you're ku.  I was talking about smoking pot in general is selfish... more importantly, when you're doing it in a place where pot is illegal... because, and follow along here:  you could end up being detained and taken away from your family/children.  Damn. Reading comprehension FTW.

    it's right there in your post, you silly person:

    "Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?"

    ftw.

    K... let's go back...  "where did i say, "hey everyone, it's good to smoke pot when you're ku!"

    After I said nothing about smoking pot while pregnant... and now you're quoting my post where I said: "Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?" As evidence that I was talking about smoking WHILE PREGNANT.  Where in that sentence does it say WHILE PREGNANT?

    Stop smoking the ganja... you can't read.

    Batman likes to watch cartoons on the weekends. Whatever.
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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagePubStar09:

    K... let's go back...  "where did i say, "hey everyone, it's good to smoke pot when you're ku!"

    After I said nothing about smoking pot while pregnant... and now you're quoting my post where I said: "Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?" As evidence that I was talking about smoking WHILE PREGNANT.  Where in that sentence does it say WHILE PREGNANT?

    Stop smoking the ganja... you can't read.

    yeah, i was giving you an example of what "debating the merits" would have actually meant. but i wasn't debating the merits, i was trying to figure out why everyone was going apesh!t about the fact that omg... somebody knows someone who smoked while pregnant. zounds!

    for extra points on the reading comprehension, i said i had stopped. several times.

    ftw... and wtf.

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  • PubStar09PubStar09 member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagePubStar09:

    K... let's go back...  "where did i say, "hey everyone, it's good to smoke pot when you're ku!"

    After I said nothing about smoking pot while pregnant... and now you're quoting my post where I said: "Is this chick honestly trying to argue the merits of pot smoking?" As evidence that I was talking about smoking WHILE PREGNANT.  Where in that sentence does it say WHILE PREGNANT?

    Stop smoking the ganja... you can't read.

    yeah, i was giving you an example of what "debating the merits" would have actually meant. but i wasn't debating the merits, i was trying to figure out why everyone was going apesh!t about the fact that omg... somebody knows someone who smoked while pregnant. zounds!

    for extra points on the reading comprehension, i said i had stopped. several times.

    ftw... and wtf.

    And the thread stopped being about you several hours ago.  We all started debating our opinions of smoking vs not smoking.  I merely posted my opinion, completely NOT related to you in any way, and you immediately thought it was about you.  The earth revolves around the sun, not you.

    Batman likes to watch cartoons on the weekends. Whatever.
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  • monimonimonimonimonimoni member
    imagebstrangely:

    duh... but i'm wondering why it's illegal when no one has ever died from marijuana and cigarettes kill tons of people.

    in california they tried to pass a law recently that said you couldn't smoke cigarettes in a car with a child under 7. i voted against it because i didn't think that was reasonable... would kids have to carry ids so the arresting officer could tell if they were 6 or 7? it might be well-intentioned, but utterly unenforceable. and tell me that isn't a totally arbitrary age limit.

    I had a close friend who, due to his marijuana "habit", developed paranoid schizophrenia. Then took his own life. No one has ever died from marijuana? Bullshiit.

    Just think yourself lucky that you or no-one else you know has had to deal with marijuana induced mental illness, it's not pretty.

    Also, do some actual research on the matter (not just web articles, I'm talking medical journals) before you act all high and mighty in the future. Why you would defend the use of cannabis during pregnancy is just....wow.

     


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  • grace416grace416 member

    I haven't read everything here, I don't have enough time.

    I don't smoke weed. And I really don't care who thinks it's good or bad, but I do like to do research. Have you heard of Melanie Dreher?(google her) She's a doctor who has done one of the 1st and the longest study on pregnancy and cannabis.

     Here's a video of her explaining the study..(Pregnant women and their children were studied over ten plus years, both marijuana smokers and non smokers. One of the first scientific study of the effects of cannabis on pregnancy and the child?s development.)

    https://xcannabis.com/2008/08/cannabis-use-and-pregnancy-with-melanie-dreher-rn-phd/

     Again, I don't smoke weed, just thought this was interesting.

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagePubStar09:

    And the thread stopped being about you several hours ago.  We all started debating our opinions of smoking vs not smoking.  I merely posted my opinion, completely NOT related to you in any way, and you immediately thought it was about you.  The earth revolves around the sun, not you.

    ok, who did say it was good to smoke weed?

    seriously, no one took that position. many people said they had smoked, but i don't think anyone was advocating smoking, except for one or two people who said they did so to take care of specific medical problems.

    seriously, if you can't debate an issue, there is no reason to get involved, let alone to be so insulting and ridiculous.

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  • melzer14melzer14
    imagebstrangely:
    imagemelzer14:

    you know...you're actually quite annoying. Half the *** you have been posting is in your view point....there are arguments for BOTH sides...how about you let it go and move onto give your useless opinion somewhere else.... 

    We get your opinion...and your not changing anyones mind sooooo you can stop now 

    :) 

    oh zomg.

    if you really have an argument for your side, then post it. don't just complain because someone else has actually bothered to look up something you don't agree with.

    I give up arguing with you because frankly you are annoying and you will find some other random site to try and prove why it is okay. Bottom line...it is NOT okay and I don't know why you are trying to prove it so badly....it is completely irresponsible to smoke while pregnant. Notice you are one of the ONLY people sticking up for this...take a hint...because no one in their right mind thinks its acceptable..

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagemonimonimoni:

    I had a close friend who, due to his marijuana "habit", developed paranoid schizophrenia. Then took his own life. No one has ever died from marijuana? Bullshiit.

    Just think yourself lucky that you or no-one else you know has had to deal with marijuana induced mental illness, it's not pretty.

    Also, do some actual research on the matter (not just web articles, I'm talking medical journals) before you act all high and mighty in the future. Why you would defend the use of cannabis during pregnancy is just....wow.

    i have. if you haven't noticed, i have post several resources and they all cite real, peer reviewed research. what happened to your friend is terrible, but again, that is not a death caused by marijuana. you just described a suicide. and i can find articles that suggest that marijuana actually alleviates psychiatric problems:

    Cannabinoids promote embryonic and adult hippocampus neurogenesis and produce anxiolytic- and antidepressant-like effects

    and while there does seem to be a link between marijuana use and schizophrenia, it seems to be exacerbating an existing predisposition (genetic for example) rather than creating schizophrenic symptoms in a vacuum.

    https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/display/article/10168/49641?pageNumber=2

    this is further documented here:

    https://www.cannabis.net/psychosis/schizoprecip.html

    and again, i never defended the use of cannabis. i never said it was ok for people to use it or that they should use it... i just know for a fact that it's not as bad as some other legal substances which have clearly documented fetal risks.

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  • PubStar09PubStar09 member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagePubStar09:

    And the thread stopped being about you several hours ago.  We all started debating our opinions of smoking vs not smoking.  I merely posted my opinion, completely NOT related to you in any way, and you immediately thought it was about you.  The earth revolves around the sun, not you.

    ok, who did say it was good to smoke weed?

    seriously, no one took that position. many people said they had smoked, but i don't think anyone was advocating smoking, except for one or two people who said they did so to take care of specific medical problems.

    seriously, if you can't debate an issue, there is no reason to get involved, let alone to be so insulting and ridiculous.

    See, there you go again.  Try a little reading comprehension.  I didn't say anyone said it was good to smoke weed.  Some people are pro weed, some people are anti.  Very seldom will someone outright say "smoking weed is good for you"; hence why I didn't make that claim.

    You're impossible.

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagemelzer14:

    I give up arguing with you because frankly you are annoying and you will find some other random site to try and prove why it is okay. Bottom line...it is NOT okay and I don't know why you are trying to prove it so badly....it is completely irresponsible to smoke while pregnant. Notice you are one of the ONLY people sticking up for this...take a hint...because no one in their right mind thinks its acceptable..

    look, i never said it was responsible to smoke while pregnant. i never even said it was acceptable. if you honestly disagree with me that's one thing, but instead you're attacking a position i never espoused. good job!

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  • melzer14melzer14
    imagebstrangely:
    imagemonimonimoni:

    I had a close friend who, due to his marijuana "habit", developed paranoid schizophrenia. Then took his own life. No one has ever died from marijuana? Bullshiit.

    Just think yourself lucky that you or no-one else you know has had to deal with marijuana induced mental illness, it's not pretty.

    Also, do some actual research on the matter (not just web articles, I'm talking medical journals) before you act all high and mighty in the future. Why you would defend the use of cannabis during pregnancy is just....wow.

    i have. if you haven't noticed, i have post several resources and they all cite real, peer reviewed research. what happened to your friend is terrible, but again, that is not a death caused by marijuana. you just described a suicide. and i can find articles that suggest that marijuana actually alleviates psychiatric problems:

    Cannabinoids promote embryonic and adult hippocampus neurogenesis and produce anxiolytic- and antidepressant-like effects

    and while there does seem to be a link between marijuana use and schizophrenia, it seems to be exacerbating an existing predisposition (genetic for example) rather than creating schizophrenic symptoms in a vacuum.

    https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/display/article/10168/49641?pageNumber=2

    this is further documented here:

    https://www.cannabis.net/psychosis/schizoprecip.html

    and again, i never defended the use of cannabis. i never said it was ok for people to use it or that they should use it... i just know for a fact that it's not as bad as some other legal substances which have clearly documented fetal risks.

     

    I officially decided that you have NO life and need to go find one...you have lost...obviously and no one agrees with you. I left for HOURS and come back and you are still attempting to fight with everyone about something ridiculous and makes you sounds like a dumb a$$.

    Seriously...find something else to do....

    annnddd scene!  

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  • PubStar09PubStar09 member
    imagemelzer14:

    I officially decided that you have NO life and need to go find one...you have lost...obviously and no one agrees with you. I left for HOURS and come back and you are still attempting to fight with everyone about something ridiculous and makes you sounds like a dumb a$$.

    Seriously...find something else to do....

    annnddd scene!  

    Yes

    *skips out of the room, arm in arm with melzer* Big Smile

    Batman likes to watch cartoons on the weekends. Whatever.
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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagegrace416:

    I haven't read everything here, I don't have enough time.

    I don't smoke weed. And I really don't care who thinks it's good or bad, but I do like to do research. Have you heard of Melanie Dreher?(google her) She's a doctor who has done one of the 1st and the longest study on pregnancy and cannabis.

     Here's a video of her explaining the study..(Pregnant women and their children were studied over ten plus years, both marijuana smokers and non smokers. One of the first scientific study of the effects of cannabis on pregnancy and the child?s development.)

    https://xcannabis.com/2008/08/cannabis-use-and-pregnancy-with-melanie-dreher-rn-phd/

     Again, I don't smoke weed, just thought this was interesting.

    that is interesting! i had linked the abstract for this study earlier, but it wasn't nearly as detailed with the methodology and findings. i'm going to have to watch more of that later.

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagePubStar09:
    imagebstrangely:
    imagePubStar09:

    And the thread stopped being about you several hours ago.  We all started debating our opinions of smoking vs not smoking.  I merely posted my opinion, completely NOT related to you in any way, and you immediately thought it was about you.  The earth revolves around the sun, not you.

    ok, who did say it was good to smoke weed?

    seriously, no one took that position. many people said they had smoked, but i don't think anyone was advocating smoking, except for one or two people who said they did so to take care of specific medical problems.

    seriously, if you can't debate an issue, there is no reason to get involved, let alone to be so insulting and ridiculous.

    See, there you go again.  Try a little reading comprehension.  I didn't say anyone said it was good to smoke weed.  Some people are pro weed, some people are anti.  Very seldom will someone outright say "smoking weed is good for you"; hence why I didn't make that claim.

    You're impossible.

    seriously, being pro-weed is saying that it is good to smoke weed. and no one in this thread was pro-weed. 

    words mean things. sorry, that's just the way it is.  no one was debating the merits... the only thing being debated was the reactions of people here and at large to marijuana use.

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  • monimonimonimonimonimoni member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagemonimonimoni:

    I had a close friend who, due to his marijuana "habit", developed paranoid schizophrenia. Then took his own life. No one has ever died from marijuana? Bullshiit.

    Just think yourself lucky that you or no-one else you know has had to deal with marijuana induced mental illness, it's not pretty.

    Also, do some actual research on the matter (not just web articles, I'm talking medical journals) before you act all high and mighty in the future. Why you would defend the use of cannabis during pregnancy is just....wow.

    i have. if you haven't noticed, i have post several resources and they all cite real, peer reviewed research. what happened to your friend is terrible, but again, that is not a death caused by marijuana. you just described a suicide. and i can find articles that suggest that marijuana actually alleviates psychiatric problems:

    Cannabinoids promote embryonic and adult hippocampus neurogenesis and produce anxiolytic- and antidepressant-like effects

    and while there does seem to be a link between marijuana use and schizophrenia, it seems to be exacerbating an existing predisposition (genetic for example) rather than creating schizophrenic symptoms in a vacuum.

    https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/display/article/10168/49641?pageNumber=2

    this is further documented here:

    https://www.cannabis.net/psychosis/schizoprecip.html

    and again, i never defended the use of cannabis. i never said it was ok for people to use it or that they should use it... i just know for a fact that it's not as bad as some other legal substances which have clearly documented fetal risks.

    Um, wait....what? What do you think you've been doing this entire thread? You've not exactly been "neutral" on the subject, it's quite clear with your CONTINUAL rebuttal what your opinion is. I can't believe you've read accounts from pediatricians, people with personal experience of neonatal marijuana withdrawal and the like and you're still going. And you know for a fact that it's not as bad as some other legal substances do you?....Wow.

    Oh, and you can use Pubmed too? How clever. 

     


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  • monimonimonimonimonimoni member
    imagePubStar09:
    imagemelzer14:

    I officially decided that you have NO life and need to go find one...you have lost...obviously and no one agrees with you. I left for HOURS and come back and you are still attempting to fight with everyone about something ridiculous and makes you sounds like a dumb a$$.

    Seriously...find something else to do....

    annnddd scene!  

    Yes

    *skips out of the room, arm in arm with melzer* Big Smile

    Wait for me!


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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagemelzer14:

    I officially decided that you have NO life and need to go find one...you have lost...obviously and no one agrees with you. I left for HOURS and come back and you are still attempting to fight with everyone about something ridiculous and makes you sounds like a dumb a$$.

    Seriously...find something else to do....

    annnddd scene!  

    what does it say about you that you keep checking this thread?

    Wink 

    image
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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagemonimonimoni:

    Um, wait....what? What do you think you've been doing this entire thread? You've not exactly been "neutral" on the subject, it's quite clear with your CONTINUAL rebuttal what your opinion is. I can't believe you've read accounts from pediatricians, people with personal experience of neonatal marijuana withdrawal and the like and you're still going. And you know for a fact that it's not as bad as some other legal substances do you?....Wow.

    Oh, and you can use Pubmed too? How clever. 

    look, just quote one statement i've made that was pro-weed. 

    the person with personal experience of neonatal withdrawal never said anything about how she knew it was marijuana induced. what even suggests she really works in a hospital? shoot, i just do not take the word of random people i meet on the internet at face value. and when i found a description of marijuana withdrawal in newborns that didn't include anything about seizures, i saw that i had a good reason to question her account.another person related a story third hand. um, yeah... i'll definitely take peer reviewed literature over that, any day of the week.

    and yes, i do know for a fact that marijuana is not as bad as some legal substances. have you ever even heard of fetal marijuana syndrome?

    didn't think so.

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  • FordlorFordlor member

    Well that's at least 30 minutes of my life I'll never get back.  I can't believe I read the entire thread.  What does that say about the kind of life I've got goin' on on this rockin' Friday night??

    Bstrangely- dude, you are like the freakin' Energizer bunny.  You keep going and going and going and going. 

     

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imageFordlor:

    Well that's at least 30 minutes of my life I'll never get back.  I can't believe I read the entire thread.  What does that say about the kind of life I've got goin' on on this rockin' Friday night??

    Bstrangely- dude, you are like the freakin' Energizer bunny.  You keep going and going and going and going. 

    what can i say... i like politics and science. must be all the weed!

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  • MrserinJMrserinJ member
    This is ridiculous. If you can't give up something like weed for 9 months, for your child, you are screwed. You have to sacrifice so many more important things when your baby is born, like say, having a shower daily! If you can't give up something as insignificant as weed, you really shouldn't be having children because you are too selfish. Whether or not its been "proven" to be unsafe to the fetus or not is beside the point. Its illegal. For a reason. There really is no valid argument in my opinion for smoking weed while pregnant, and the people that argue "for" it should be embarrassed and ashamed of themselves. Period.
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  • Liz710Liz710
    I'd just like to say, bravo bstrangely, bravo.  I'm glad you were here when this thread blew up.  
    <a href="http://s26.photobucket.com/albums/c122/DubZPicZ/?action=view
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  • monimonimonimonimonimoni member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagemonimonimoni:

    Um, wait....what? What do you think you've been doing this entire thread? You've not exactly been "neutral" on the subject, it's quite clear with your CONTINUAL rebuttal what your opinion is. I can't believe you've read accounts from pediatricians, people with personal experience of neonatal marijuana withdrawal and the like and you're still going. And you know for a fact that it's not as bad as some other legal substances do you?....Wow.

    Oh, and you can use Pubmed too? How clever. 

    look, just quote one statement i've made that was pro-weed. 

    the person with personal experience of neonatal withdrawal never said anything about how she knew it was marijuana induced. what even suggests she really works in a hospital? shoot, i just do not take the word of random people i meet on the internet at face value. and when i found a description of marijuana withdrawal in newborns that didn't include anything about seizures, i saw that i had a good reason to question her account.another person related a story third hand. um, yeah... i'll definitely take peer reviewed literature over that, any day of the week.

    and yes, i do know for a fact that marijuana is not as bad as some legal substances. have you ever even heard of fetal marijuana syndrome?

    didn't think so.

    I know you're trying to sound educated, I get that. But you're coming across as a belligerent teenager, not as somebody who actually knows what they're talking about. Citing research articles from Pubmed is asinine -you can find research articles on any topic and find opposing research in the same breath. I never said you were "pro-weed" either, but you're certainly coming across that way, possibly due to your constant defense of the subject.

    Fin.


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  • bstrangelybstrangely

    imageMrserinJ:
    This is ridiculous. If you can't give up something like weed for 9 months, for your child, you are screwed. You have to sacrifice so many more important things when your baby is born, like say, having a shower daily! If you can't give up something as insignificant as weed, you really shouldn't be having children because you are too selfish. Whether or not its been "proven" to be unsafe to the fetus or not is beside the point. Its illegal. For a reason. There really is no valid argument in my opinion for smoking weed while pregnant, and the people that argue "for" it should be embarrassed and ashamed of themselves. Period.

    nobody argued for it. 

    honestly, why is that so hard to understand? and you have a really weird statement in your post:

    "Whether or not its been "proven" to be unsafe to the fetus or not is beside the point. Its illegal. For a reason."

    yeah, it's illegal because the united states government decided to punish minorities with targeted legislation. there is no legitimate reason for it to be illegal, especially since there is no clear documentation that it ever harmed anyone.

    and especially since alcohol and cigarettes are clearly proven to have killed many, many people, yet rich, white people enjoy those substances, so i guess that explains that.

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  • bstrangelybstrangely

    imageLiz710:
    I'd just like to say, bravo bstrangely, bravo.  I'm glad you were here when this thread blew up.  

    thank you! i bet we can get this sucker to 10 pages.

    image
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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagemonimonimoni:

    I know you're trying to sound educated, I get that. But you're coming across as a belligerent teenager, not as somebody who actually knows what they're talking about. Citing research articles from Pubmed is asinine -you can find research articles on any topic and find opposing research in the same breath. I never said you were "pro-weed" either, but you're certainly coming across that way, possibly due to your constant defense of the subject.

    Fin.

    i don't need to "sound educated" when i can actually present evidence. that's what's known as being informed.

    you were the one who initially said this:

    "Also, do some actual research on the matter (not just web articles, I'm talking medical journals) before you act all high and mighty in the future."

    and now that i've shown you some (more like a ton), you come back and say they don't mean anything.

    one more time... i have never defended marijuana use in this thread, especially not during pregnancy. what i have consistently argued is that the reaction to marijuana use is ridiculous and silly. people get locked up over this issue every day and it costs the country millions of dollars for law enforcement and incarceration.

    let's just say i'm anti-idiocy, rather than particularly pro-drug. the other drugs all scare the bejesus out of me because they are legitimately scary.

    image
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  • MrserinJMrserinJ member
    imagebstrangely:

    imageMrserinJ:
    This is ridiculous. If you can't give up something like weed for 9 months, for your child, you are screwed. You have to sacrifice so many more important things when your baby is born, like say, having a shower daily! If you can't give up something as insignificant as weed, you really shouldn't be having children because you are too selfish. Whether or not its been "proven" to be unsafe to the fetus or not is beside the point. Its illegal. For a reason. There really is no valid argument in my opinion for smoking weed while pregnant, and the people that argue "for" it should be embarrassed and ashamed of themselves. Period.

    nobody argued for it. 

    honestly, why is that so hard to understand? and you have a really weird statement in your post:

    "Whether or not its been "proven" to be unsafe to the fetus or not is beside the point. Its illegal. For a reason."

    yeah, it's illegal because the united states government decided to punish minorities with targeted legislation. there is no legitimate reason for it to be illegal, especially since there is no clear documentation that it ever harmed anyone.

    and especially since alcohol and cigarettes are clearly proven to have killed many, many people, yet rich, white people enjoy those substances, so i guess that explains that.

    Why are you using alcohol and cigarettes as a means to jusify your position on marijuiana? I don't believe that anyone on here has said that its OK to do either of those things while pregnant. Just because those things are legal, doesn't make them "good: to do.

    I have to say, that your argument that it has never killed anyone is ridiculous. People who are high and get in car accidents or any accident for that matter while high clearly had their judgement impaired by the drug. Its just not a responsible thing to do, at any time, especially when you are pregnant. If you can't see that, then I really don't know what to say to you... 

    I get that you're trying to be the devil's advocate here, but you're coming off as a complete idiot. I know that you didn't say YOU smoke weed while pregnant, but you seem like you really don't see what the big deal is. Can I ask you something? If you're so sure that smoking has never killed anyone, or harmed a fetus, then why did you quit "cold turkey" when you got your BFP?

    Anyway, its obvious you're not going to change your position. There's no point arguing. GL with everything.

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  • monimonimonimonimonimoni member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagemonimonimoni:

    I know you're trying to sound educated, I get that. But you're coming across as a belligerent teenager, not as somebody who actually knows what they're talking about. Citing research articles from Pubmed is asinine -you can find research articles on any topic and find opposing research in the same breath. I never said you were "pro-weed" either, but you're certainly coming across that way, possibly due to your constant defense of the subject.

    Fin.

    i don't need to "sound educated" when i can actually present evidence. that's what's known as being informed.

    you were the one who initially said this:

    "Also, do some actual research on the matter (not just web articles, I'm talking medical journals) before you act all high and mighty in the future."

    and now that i've shown you some (more like a ton), you come back and say they don't mean anything.

    one more time... i have never defended marijuana use in this thread, especially not during pregnancy. what i have consistently argued is that the reaction to marijuana use is ridiculous and silly. people get locked up over this issue every day and it costs the country millions of dollars for law enforcement and incarceration.

    let's just say i'm anti-idiocy, rather than particularly pro-drug. the other drugs all scare the bejesus out of me because they are legitimately scary.

    Yes. Actually research medical journals, not copy/paste links from Pubmed Confused


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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imageMrserinJ:

    Why are you using alcohol and cigarettes as a means to jusify your position on marijuiana? I don't believe that anyone on here has said that its OK to do either of those things while pregnant. Just because those things are legal, doesn't make them "good: to do.

    I have to say, that your argument that it has never killed anyone is ridiculous. People who are high and get in car accidents or any accident for that matter while high clearly had their judgement impaired by the drug. Its just not a responsible thing to do, at any time, especially when you are pregnant. If you can't see that, then I really don't know what to say to you... 

    I get that you're trying to be the devil's advocate here, but you're coming off as a complete idiot. I know that you didn't say YOU smoke weed while pregnant, but you seem like you really don't see what the big deal is. Can I ask you something? If you're so sure that smoking has never killed anyone, or harmed a fetus, then why did you quit "cold turkey" when you got your BFP?

    Anyway, its obvious you're not going to change your position. There's no point arguing. GL with everything.

    actually, if you spend much time here, you will see a lot of people who will drink "once in a while" or on special occasions, and no one freaks out on them. some women purchase o'douls and while it says it is "nonalcoholic", it does still contain alcohol unless it's marked "alcohol free"... it just has a lot less than regular beer, so much less that you can't get drunk on it, but you're still giving it to your fetus.

    and i'm not saying this to invite women to dogpile those other women... i don't think anyone knows how much alcohol is "ok". many sites say none, but huge numbers of women had healthy pregnancies and babies before we knew it was not ok to drink.

    seriously, it is not my personal accounting that makes me state that pot never killed anyone, that comes directly from the government. even if someone died because they drove drunk, the government doesn't list their cause of death as "alcohol." but they do list alcohol when the cause of death is "alcohol poisoning." that happens all the time at colleges and parties across the country. i have not defended driving while impaired a single time. no one should do that, ever.

    and gee, thanks for telling me i come across like a complete idiot, when you can't even scroll through the thread to get the answers to questions people have already asked me. i also gave up lunch meat and sushi because i am paranoid even about risks that are incredibly low. if anything does go wrong with my pregnancy i don't want to have any opportunity to beat myself up. yet in threads where women ask if sushi is ok, there is a whole pack of chicks who will treat you like a moron for taking that risk seriously.

    i am just begging you all to think about these reactions to other people's behavior. this is my body and i'm happy making my own decisions. i'm also happy to share whatever i found interesting or compelling with other posters so they can make their own decisions. and if you didn't know... we have an audience:

    https://community.thenest.com/cs/ks/forums/thread/33989959.aspx

    it's really a debate worth having.

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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagemonimonimoni:

    Yes. Actually research medical journals, not copy/paste links from Pubmed Confused

    uh, i'm not just copying links from pubmed. these are articles in medical journals if you'd actually care to click on them.

    this is a full article:

    https://www.jci.org/articles/view/25509/version/1

    this is also a full article:

    https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/display/article/10168/49641?pageNumber=2

    i can't help that you're so lazy you just assume you know what i'm posting instead of looking.

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  • monimonimonimonimonimoni member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagemonimonimoni:

    Yes. Actually research medical journals, not copy/paste links from Pubmed Confused

    uh, i'm not just copying links from pubmed. these are articles in medical journals if you'd actually care to click on them.

    this is a full article:

    https://www.jci.org/articles/view/25509/version/1

    this is also a full article:

    https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/display/article/10168/49641?pageNumber=2

    i can't help that you're so lazy you just assume you know what i'm posting instead of looking.

    I repeat, RESEARCH medical journals. As in, STUDY them, don't just post links, JFC Indifferent I have a medical degree and have plenty of resources and contacts of my own. You don't have to keep struggling to make your point, let it go.


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  • bstrangelybstrangely
    imagemonimonimoni:

    I repeat, RESEARCH medical journals. As in, STUDY them, don't just post links, JFC Indifferent I have a medical degree and have plenty of resources and contacts of my own. You don't have to keep struggling to make your point, let it go.

    so in your advanced medical opinion, what's wrong with what i posted?

    i read them, and they're very clear. especially the jci article which is complete with figures and footnotes. this is not a struggle.

    honestly, if you have a medical degree, you should have known better than to post a personal anecdote as if it were evidence. that is hardly what i would call compelling.

    ah, i see... you're an herbalist. here you are asking other strangers on the internet for medical advice.

    that's some network you've got at your disposal.

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  • monimonimonimonimonimoni member
    imagebstrangely:
    imagemonimonimoni:

    I repeat, RESEARCH medical journals. As in, STUDY them, don't just post links, JFC Indifferent I have a medical degree and have plenty of resources and contacts of my own. You don't have to keep struggling to make your point, let it go.

    so in your advanced medical opinion, what's wrong with what i posted?

    i read them, and they're very clear. especially the jci article which is complete with figures and footnotes. this is not a struggle.

    honestly, if you have a medical degree, you should have known better than to post a personal anecdote as if it were evidence. that is hardly what i would call compelling.

    1. Nothing wrong with many of them, all I was saying is that you should study them but you kept firing links off at me like some goddamn spam robot.

    2. I never posted my anecdote as evidence, I posted it as experience. There is a huge difference.

    3. LET IT GO.

    Oh, and in response to your edit, yes, I have a degree in medical herbalism with 4 years of full time medical training. And I'm sorry if my network doesn't involve women who have been pregnant before and have tips to share in regards to non-herbal/pharmaceutical heartburn remedies. Way to go, you're much more all-knowing and mature than I.

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  • grant822grant822
    imagemelzer14:

    I'm sorry if you are one of those people that think smoking pot while pregnant is okay but I find it disturbing.

    I wanted to slap her...people like her should not be allowed to bring children into this world...there should be some kind of IQ test!

    I TOTALLY agree!!!!  It makes me SO mad because there are people that try SO HARD to have a baby but can't, or it takes them a long time, but then people like that get pregnant and their baby is fine.  It's just not fair, I'm sorry.

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