HIPAA- wwyd?

srcr2011

So I used to work as a nurse at a drs office (7 years ago), where I am now receiving care for this pregnancy.  I went in for my first appt, and ran into an old coworker who works in medical records . We did small chit chat, but never did I tell her why I was being seen (family practice office, she had no clue).  That appointment did not end well. They could not find a heart beat (everything is great now , I was just earlier than expected).

Well, we finally told a few close friends about my news last week. One of them works in that same office in medical records.  When I told her, she said "Gina mentioned something about that to me the other day. She said you were pregnant, and I said 'what?'. Gina said, 'didn't you know?'". My friend said she looked at her weird and said Gina got a weird look on her face and  said "uh, yeah, she posted it on instagram". My friend checked right away and told her "there is nothing there." Gina told my friend "oh she must have deleted it, maybe she didn't want people to know".

Yay, no freaking shit I didn't want people to know! She flat out lied to cover her butt, I never posted in on social media! I gave it a few day to cool off, but when I think about it,  I get just as angry again. It makes me mad that she has no integrity for working in MR as the supervisor and doesn't know how to keep info confidential, and blabbed it to my friend. With my history of losses and a bad appointment,  it makes me even more angry.

 My friend said I should report her, but I hate to throw my friend under the bus. She also told me that in electronic MR, it shows when people log into a chart. It will show Gina logging in (to see the reason for my appointment ).  I didn't have labs or imaging for her to scan in. There was absolutely no reason for her to be on my chart.

So, with that said, would you report it? I am pretty sure I am going to, I just don't want my friend to regret telling me this info.

I hope this post makes sense,  sorry it's long without a ; TLDR.

TucknBoom

Yes, that's completely unethical. She should be reported. 

muybueno

You have every right to be mad. Very, very mad. However, you are holding someone's career in your hands, which can't be taken lightly. I won't say what I would do, because that doesn't matter anyway. I'll just say that you might give it a few more days and a good long think about the ramifications before reporting her. Good luck- what a tough decision.

srcr2011

muybueno said:

You have every right to be mad. Very, very mad. However, you are holding someone's career in your hands, which can't be taken lightly. I won't say what I would do, because that doesn't matter anyway. I'll just say that you might give it a few more days and a good long think about the ramifications before reporting her. Good luck- what a tough decision.



----fail-----


I know, I feel bad about it. If I knew she wouldn't be fired, I wouldn't question it. Breaking HIPAA is a huge deal. I do think she should get reprimanded though, but that's not my call.

muybueno

srcr2011 said:

muybueno said:

You have every right to be mad. Very, very mad. However, you are holding someone's career in your hands, which can't be taken lightly. I won't say what I would do, because that doesn't matter anyway. I'll just say that you might give it a few more days and a good long think about the ramifications before reporting her. Good luck- what a tough decision.



----fail-----


I know, I feel bad about it. If I knew she wouldn't be fired, I wouldn't question it. Breaking HIPAA is a huge deal. I do think she should get reprimanded though, but that's not my call.

She'll be fired, unless she can talk her way out of it. She could also face civil monetary or even criminal penalties. However, if you don't report it to the Department of Health and Human Services, it may just be dealt with at the office. Do you have a lawyer you could consult about the process and the likely ramifications?

kns1988

Chiming in as someone who works IT on electronic medical records. She didn't necessarily look at your chart maliciously or with the intent to find out why you were there. If you were scheduled as an "OB appt" or with a chief complaint relating to pregnancy, that would (depending on the system) show on the list of appointments for the day. It might be something that she accesses every day, and she just happened to see your name there.

That being said, it's certainly wrong that she told someone about it and I agree that it's a violation of HIPPA. She could lose her job if you report her, or she could explain to her bosses that she had a legitimate reason for accessing your record. 

rooftop

I agree. Not OK to do. If you don't report her you should at very least get a hold of her and call her out on that. She knows that isn't acceptable behavior but maybe a little reminder that she can cause a lot of trouble might set her straight.

srcr2011

muybueno said:

srcr2011 said:

muybueno said:

You have every right to be mad. Very, very mad. However, you are holding someone's career in your hands, which can't be taken lightly. I won't say what I would do, because that doesn't matter anyway. I'll just say that you might give it a few more days and a good long think about the ramifications before reporting her. Good luck- what a tough decision.



----fail-----


I know, I feel bad about it. If I knew she wouldn't be fired, I wouldn't question it. Breaking HIPAA is a huge deal. I do think she should get reprimanded though, but that's not my call.

She'll be fired, unless she can talk her way out of it. She could also face civil monetary or even criminal penalties. However, if you don't report it to the Department of Health and Human Services, it may just be dealt with at the office. Do you have a lawyer you could consult about the process and the likely ramifications?

I don't have one. I wouldn't want it to go that  far. I would just hope it would be dealt with just through the office. I have a lot to think about. 

Katemr1146

I don't know if I would necessarily report her. But I would definitely discuss it with her directly. 

aquasocks

Ugh that's tough. And it might not be the first time she's done this. Anyone in medicine should know better than to say anything about someone's medical history/condition. Obviously as a nurse you know that you cannot sue (I hear people say all the time "That's a HIPAA violation, you should sue!" But you can't actually sue for it, you can just report them to the OCR and they can be fined. The patient cannot recover money. I know that's not what you're after here anyway so I digress...)

But my question is are you asking if you should report her to her employer, or to the federal gov't?

atcwag

I work for a hospital. If this was me, I would absolutely be reporting her to the corporate compliance officer. 

srcr2011

kns1988 said:

Chiming in as someone who works IT on electronic medical records. She didn't necessarily look at your chart maliciously or with the intent to find out why you were there. If you were scheduled as an "OB appt" or with a chief complaint relating to pregnancy, that would (depending on the system) show on the list of appointments for the day. It might be something that she accesses every day, and she just happened to see your name there.

That being said, it's certainly wrong that she told someone about it and I agree that it's a violation of HIPPA. She could lose her job if you report her, or she could explain to her bosses that she had a legitimate reason for accessing your record. 

That's true, and i had thought about the she said /she said  issue as well.

muybueno

srcr2011 said:

muybueno said:

srcr2011 said:

muybueno said:

You have every right to be mad. Very, very mad. However, you are holding someone's career in your hands, which can't be taken lightly. I won't say what I would do, because that doesn't matter anyway. I'll just say that you might give it a few more days and a good long think about the ramifications before reporting her. Good luck- what a tough decision.



----fail-----


I know, I feel bad about it. If I knew she wouldn't be fired, I wouldn't question it. Breaking HIPAA is a huge deal. I do think she should get reprimanded though, but that's not my call.

She'll be fired, unless she can talk her way out of it. She could also face civil monetary or even criminal penalties. However, if you don't report it to the Department of Health and Human Services, it may just be dealt with at the office. Do you have a lawyer you could consult about the process and the likely ramifications?

I don't have one. I wouldn't want it to go that  far. I would just hope it would be dealt with just through the office. I have a lot to think about. 

When I suggest a lawyer, I don't mean so that you can take her to court. You clearly aren't wanting that, nor do you seem to want to report her to the Dept of Health and Human Services. I just mean that a lawyer could inform you about all of the things that might happen to her, if you were to report her to the office. It might help in your decision making, to know what this would mean in terms of her career, penalties, etc. 

SweetiePateetie

Do you consider Gina a friend? If so, I would talk to her first. If not, I would go straight to the Practice Administrator/ Office Manager - or even your doctor at your next appointment. I would not report her to the government.

srcr2011

aquasocks said:

Ugh that's tough. And it might not be the first time she's done this. Anyone in medicine should know better than to say anything about someone's medical history/condition. Obviously as a nurse you know that you cannot sue (I hear people say all the time "That's a HIPAA violation, you should sue!" But you can't actually sue for it, you can just report them to the OCR and they can be fined. The patient cannot recover money. I know that's not what you're after here anyway so I digress...)

But my question is are you asking if you should report her to her employer, or to the federal gov't?

My intention has been to just report her to the office. Never federal,  and like I said, I would hate to be the reason she is fired.  I would feel guilty about it. 

SweetiePateetie

srcr2011 said:

aquasocks said:

Ugh that's tough. And it might not be the first time she's done this. Anyone in medicine should know better than to say anything about someone's medical history/condition. Obviously as a nurse you know that you cannot sue (I hear people say all the time "That's a HIPAA violation, you should sue!" But you can't actually sue for it, you can just report them to the OCR and they can be fined. The patient cannot recover money. I know that's not what you're after here anyway so I digress...)

But my question is are you asking if you should report her to her employer, or to the federal gov't?

My intention has been to just report her to the office. Never federal,  and like I said, I would hate to be the reason she is fired.  I would feel guilty about it. 

There is a very good chance she would be fired, isn't there? You have first-hand experience as to how this office operates, right? Do you think they would fire her? If they do, you have to remember that it was her actions that got her fired. You would only be bringing it to the attention of others. But I'm with you, if it were me and she got fired, I wouldn't be able to live with that. Sorry... that may not be very helpful.

srcr2011

SweetiePateetie said:

Do you consider Gina a friend? If so, I would talk to her first. If not, I would go straight to the Practice Administrator/ Office Manager - or even your doctor at your next appointment. I would not report her to the government.

I was never close to her. Shes doesn't have the best morals (obviously ). I remember her telling us a story that she sold a truck to a man for 5k. Before the title switched over, the guy was arrested. The truck was towed, and she picked up the truck. That guy got screwed.  

I would rather go to the office manager.

srcr2011

SweetiePateetie said:

srcr2011 said:

aquasocks said:

Ugh that's tough. And it might not be the first time she's done this. Anyone in medicine should know better than to say anything about someone's medical history/condition. Obviously as a nurse you know that you cannot sue (I hear people say all the time "That's a HIPAA violation, you should sue!" But you can't actually sue for it, you can just report them to the OCR and they can be fined. The patient cannot recover money. I know that's not what you're after here anyway so I digress...)

But my question is are you asking if you should report her to her employer, or to the federal gov't?

My intention has been to just report her to the office. Never federal,  and like I said, I would hate to be the reason she is fired.  I would feel guilty about it. 

There is a very good chance she would be fired, isn't there? You have first-hand experience as to how this office operates, right? Do you think they would fire her? If they do, you have to remember that it was her actions that got her fired. You would only be bringing it to the attention of others. But I'm with you, if it were me and she got fired, I wouldn't be able to live with that. Sorry... that may not be very helpful.

I honestly don't know. It's been 7 years since  I worked there. I have a family member who was laid off, it sucks, but to have no job because of being fired...I would feel so bad, even though she did it herself. 

srcr2011

Thanks everyone,  I have a lot to think about. 

shevaCC

So...if she is ok with gossiping about protected medical information, should she really be working in medical records? I mean, I understand you feeling torn since she's an acquaintance, but her actions are totally inappropriate. Even if she had a legit reason to find out what your appointment was for, mentioning it to your friend was obviously not ok.

talkthewholetime

Report it. I got one of my husbands high school friends fired for HIPAA violations, and I dont' feel bad for even a second. I don't evn know her, but I had made an appt at my dr's office when I first started dating my husband. I got a text from my H that was like "Oh, xyz told me you're going to the office she works at for an appointment later". Apparently she recognized my name off facebook, and took it upon herself to message my husband (who was just my boyfriend). HELL NO. It just shows a lack of judgement. If she's doing that, what else is she doing? I told my doctor and really, no regrets. I dont' know if that got her fired or other things too, but she's no longer there.

GreenEyedUnicorn

I've worked in the medical and human services field for 12 years. Screw that shit, she needs to be reported. The truck story was definitely a tipping point for me. She sounds like a shitty person. Odds are she was being nosy and looked up why you were there. I'm sure she's done it before and will do it again. 

aquasocks

srcr2011 said:

aquasocks said:

Ugh that's tough. And it might not be the first time she's done this. Anyone in medicine should know better than to say anything about someone's medical history/condition. Obviously as a nurse you know that you cannot sue (I hear people say all the time "That's a HIPAA violation, you should sue!" But you can't actually sue for it, you can just report them to the OCR and they can be fined. The patient cannot recover money. I know that's not what you're after here anyway so I digress...)

But my question is are you asking if you should report her to her employer, or to the federal gov't?

My intention has been to just report her to the office. Never federal,  and like I said, I would hate to be the reason she is fired.  I would feel guilty about it. 

Gotcha. Then yes I would report her to the office. She's the one breaking the rules, so try not to feel guilty. If you were her boss, wouldn't you want to know?

Des321

It's weird that you are experiencing this right now, because I just went through this myself last week. A little different situation but I ended up reporting an old friend/coworker for nosing into people's charts unauthorized. I was afraid mine was one of them so I finally said something, and she lost her job. It's horrible and it did make me feel guilty at first, but it was her actions that got her fired. I would report this woman if I were you, what she did was not okay! HIPAA is taken very seriously.
Edited for spelling 

MissAmeliaPond

I just had to do a HIPAA training today.

It doesn't sound like you are close with this person nor do you value a continued friendship with her. I would absolutely report her to the office manager in a heartbeat.

kmmnocal

re: "holding her career in your hands" and similar sentiments: YOU are not in the wrong here. She broke the law, and backpedaling when she was caught verifies she knows she's wrong. Her career is in her own hands, you should absolutely not feel guilty about doing the right thing.

While I don't work in the medical field, I grew up in a medical family and I really, truly feel this stuff is serious business. 

GirPipley

I do not work in the medical field, so I'm not sure if this would even be an option, but shouldn't your friend be reporting her? 

When Gina told your friend, shouldn't your friend have reported her? Does that make sense? At least to the office manager? 

If if that isn't how it works, then I agree 100% that she should be reported. 

lin0442

Yeah, you should report her. Even if, as one poster said, she might have had a valid reason for looking at the appointment info, she shouldn't have opened her mouth about it to anyone but the care team. She knows she did something wrong, and with some people getting caught is the only way they learn. With all the HIPAA training we medical people get, she has no excuse for her choices. 

It's a serious breach of ethics to snoop and gossip, and I would sure as heck want to know about this incident if I were her manager. OB-GYN is a field that deals with a lot of sensitive information, and people need to feel comfortable in their doctor's office.

muybueno

GirPipley said:

I do not work in the medical field, so I'm not sure if this would even be an option, but shouldn't your friend be reporting her? 

When Gina told your friend, shouldn't your friend have reported her? Does that make sense? At least to the office manager? 

If if that isn't how it works, then I agree 100% that she should be reported. 

Yeah, but who's going to report their friend so she can get fired? I think the decision is definitely up to srcr2011.
It's a really shitty position to be in.

Does YH have any thoughts on the matter? Whenever I'm super pissed about something and ready to take action (which again, you have every right to), I like to run it by DH because I really value his viewpoint and feel like he always has my best interest in mind, even if I don't like what he has to say. 

GirPipley

muybueno said:

GirPipley said:

I do not work in the medical field, so I'm not sure if this would even be an option, but shouldn't your friend be reporting her? 

When Gina told your friend, shouldn't your friend have reported her? Does that make sense? At least to the office manager? 

If if that isn't how it works, then I agree 100% that she should be reported. 

Yeah, but who's going to report their friend so she can get fired? I think the decision is definitely up to srcr2011.
It's a really shitty position to be in.

Does YH have any thoughts on the matter? Whenever I'm super pissed about something and ready to take action (which again, you have every right to), I like to run it by DH because I really value his viewpoint and feel like he always has my best interest in mind, even if I don't like what he has to say. 

I completely understand her friend not wanting to report Gina, but I guess I'm curious what happens if srcr2011 reports Gina. Since the friend was the one who told srcr2011, wouldn't she be pulled in anyway? like I said, I am not familiar with the medical field, but it seems like the person who was blabbed to would be liable if they didn't report it and then it was reported. 

I agree it's a really hard place to be in, and I'm sorry for that @srcr2011

MrsDho11

I would definitely report her to the office.  I used to have to sit through HIPPA training when I worked at a hospital for a few years-- and I worked in research and never came across patients or their files.  It's serious business, and it needs to be reported.  

As bad as you might feel if (when) she got fired, it's really not your fault as others have said. It's hers.  If I were you, I wouldn't feel comfortable going back there knowing she might be all up in my business and blabbing about it to others.  Not to mention, you might not be the only person she's done it to, but others might not have the connections to find out. 

Anyway, yeah, I think you have to say something.

DunkinDecaf

Man I hate moral quandaries. I don't know whether I would report her or not. Your call. Im sorry she put you in a position to make such a shitty choice.
If she were my friend, I'd definitely have a frank, in-person discussion with her and flat out say, "I should have reported you, and you should have lost your job for that." And if she makes anything less than an over-the-top groveling apology I'm sure I'd never speak to her again.

muybueno

GirPipley said:

muybueno said:

GirPipley said:

I do not work in the medical field, so I'm not sure if this would even be an option, but shouldn't your friend be reporting her? 

When Gina told your friend, shouldn't your friend have reported her? Does that make sense? At least to the office manager? 

If if that isn't how it works, then I agree 100% that she should be reported. 

Yeah, but who's going to report their friend so she can get fired? I think the decision is definitely up to srcr2011.
It's a really shitty position to be in.

Does YH have any thoughts on the matter? Whenever I'm super pissed about something and ready to take action (which again, you have every right to), I like to run it by DH because I really value his viewpoint and feel like he always has my best interest in mind, even if I don't like what he has to say. 

I completely understand her friend not wanting to report Gina, but I guess I'm curious what happens if srcr2011 reports Gina. Since the friend was the one who told srcr2011, wouldn't she be pulled in anyway? like I said, I am not familiar with the medical field, but it seems like the person who was blabbed to would be liable if they didn't report it and then it was reported. 

I agree it's a really hard place to be in, and I'm sorry for that @srcr2011

Very good point. @srcr2011, have you thought about how you'd do it without getting your friend involved? Have you asked her for an opinion? I'm assuming she's not thinking of reporting Gina herself?

srcr2011

muybueno said:

GirPipley said:

muybueno said:

GirPipley said:

I do not work in the medical field, so I'm not sure if this would even be an option, but shouldn't your friend be reporting her? 

When Gina told your friend, shouldn't your friend have reported her? Does that make sense? At least to the office manager? 

If if that isn't how it works, then I agree 100% that she should be reported. 

Yeah, but who's going to report their friend so she can get fired? I think the decision is definitely up to srcr2011.
It's a really shitty position to be in.

Does YH have any thoughts on the matter? Whenever I'm super pissed about something and ready to take action (which again, you have every right to), I like to run it by DH because I really value his viewpoint and feel like he always has my best interest in mind, even if I don't like what he has to say. 

I completely understand her friend not wanting to report Gina, but I guess I'm curious what happens if srcr2011 reports Gina. Since the friend was the one who told srcr2011, wouldn't she be pulled in anyway? like I said, I am not familiar with the medical field, but it seems like the person who was blabbed to would be liable if they didn't report it and then it was reported. 

I agree it's a really hard place to be in, and I'm sorry for that @srcr2011

Very good point. @srcr2011, have you thought about how you'd do it without getting your friend involved? Have you asked her for an opinion? I'm assuming she's not thinking of reporting Gina herself?

I haven't,  but it is a good point. I am going to talk to my friend tonight.

dreamcatch-her

She didn't only break company policy, she broke the law. I would also be livid. I know it's hard when it comes to friends, but if you did the same to her, she would be getting the same advice. 

Also, it's one thing to look into personal information illegally, it's another thing for her to go around blabbing YOUR news to people you know personally. That is NOT a friend. 

str13

Lurker here. I'm a nurse too, and as much as I wouldn't want to get someone fired this is a serious issue and a huge breach of trust. Patients should be able to trust that we won't be spreading their private medical information to anyone and everyone. I agree with PP that it's not you getting her in trouble, it's her getting herself in trouble. 
The thing is that all she told was that you're pregnant and this is a desired and positive pregnancy for you. But what if what she tells next time is someone's terminal diagnosis, or a contracted STD, or maybe a pregnancy that's the woman hasn't decided if she will or can carry. Her actions can have very real ramifications for others. 
She works in medical records, she knows the rules. 

cbamama641

Lurking from October.. but had a similar situation.  I work post partum at our local hospital and sometimes one of the floor clerks winds up filing paperwork faxed from the offices.  Well, my OB faxed my Hollister forms to the floor last week and she came to me and said "I filed some paperwork the other day, is it true?" Duh, of course it's true, my ob obviously isn't sending fake paperwork to the floor.  So I told her yes, but I'm not telling people for a couple more weeks.  Well, the next morning another clerk says to me "you should tell so & so not to spread your business."  So not only did she read through my chart, but she told others.  And when I told the second clerk "yea I'm 14 weeks and about to start telling people" she was like "oh I know, she told me all that." I feel like you, I'm pissed that she did it, and I know she has a huge mouth and anticipated her telling people after I knew that she knew. I don't want her to be fired because I know she needs her job but I don't know how to confront her to say that what she did is completely out of line.  She's not even my friend and hardly an acquaintance.  I've thought about going to one of my managers that I feel I'll most comfortable talking to and just asking her to send an email or something reminding staff how sensitive the information that we see is on our floor.. such a quandry.

Mawmee

I agree that you should report her. Even if she did have cause to access your records, she is not to repeat such info. You would not be throwing your friend under a bus. Gina threw herself under one.

2undertwo2bee

This bitch Gina.   Is all I can think when I read the post and responses lol. But I would report Gina to. 

muybueno

@srcr2011 where ya been? What did you decide to do about this sich?

TwandaFTG

Late to this post but Gina needs another job.  She should maybe look into public records research bc at least then when she gossips it won't be illegal.

Also, it would be real tempting to me to link her to a thread like this (maybe not this one but apparently this is a common occurrence).  She needs to know she got busted regardless of who you chose to tell (ie her, her boss, or some other authority)