Potty training... Thoughts?

niknak1208

So DD will be 3 at the end of October. As of 9/8, she will be in the preschool room at school. She cannot be in diapers. So we started potty training today. She knows about the potty. She's sat on it several times. She's pooped in it twice before

So here's my thing and I've never encountered this so not sure what to do. I swear to you.. She poops ALL the time. Literally every single diaper has a little poop Uin it. So she keeps popping her underwear. It's not always a lot. And it's not solid. It's never diarrhea but it's not solid either. So she's pooped her underwear like three times since 3pm. Why on Earth is she always pooping?? And how do I combat that?

mattandlora

It's *usually* from constipation. A big hard poo is in the way and only the smaller soft stuff gets out around it, leaving streaks. L Gice her lots of prune juice / water mixed

niknak1208

Thank you. I was thinking that was it. She's my good eater too. She's so good about veggies and fruits. She loves everything. I gave her just water today mostly. I think she had maybe half a cup of milk this morning. I'll grab her some prune juice tomorrow.

niknak1208

@mattandlora. This is going to sound weird but when she lays flat.. It seems like there's firmness in her lower belly. I actually mentioned it to DH before because I kinda thought it was weird to feel anything firm there. He was like oh it's because she's laying down.. It's muscle probably. But could it be that she has poo stuck? My nephew had that happen only he was describing a lot of pain. She doesn't say her tummy hurts. Maybe every once in a while. She does, however, say that her tongue hurts. Like pretty often. I chalked it up to the strep she had a while back but now she's still saying it and her strep is long gone. I asked her tonight where it hurts on her tongue. She says way way back by her tummy.

Geeps2

I would think part constipation, maybe part not eliminating her bowels fully when she does go?  My 3 year old is 100% potty trained with both #1 and #2 (not saying as a brag) but she has since birth had issues with constipation.  I know there are times that she will go poop and then say she is done, I help her wipe and she is on her way only to return to the bathroom shortly after leaving to make more poop. Also, her muscles might still be maturing making it harder for her to "hold it in".  If you think about it when in a diaper they can go whenever, they don't have to think about soiling themselves because that is what the diaper is there for?  Just a thought.  Good luck! 

niknak1208

Hopefully it gets better. I just worry about her because it's a lot of adjustment at once. New baby. Big girl bed. Potty training. Ditching the paci. It's just s lot. I worry about my sweet girl.

I'm going to grab her some prune juice today and see if I can get her to drink it. My son has issues pooping too. He's 6 but I understand him. Hes an extremely picky eater. He won't eat anything. But she's a great eater.

Geeps2

If you can't get her to drink prune juice, pear juice also has a lot of fiber and will help her go.  I know prune juice was a no-go here but she would drink the pear juice.  

niknak1208

Gerber had Apple/prune so I bought four little bottles. Put one bottle in plus water and she seems to like it. Hopefully she can get past this because she's been doing it for a while and I'm kinda worried about it and how it might complicate potty training.

harmonicbabe26

Aww nothing to add since NOTHING worked for my DD1 as far as potty training till she was completely ready (around 3). She was deathly afraid to poop on the potty till she was OVER 3. But then once she did it she never went back. I'm just glad her school didn't have any potty requirements...

niknak1208

I'm frustrated with school actually. I'm being told that it's against their licensing to allow her in the preschool room if she's not potty trained. That room is 3-4 yr olds. DD is not 3 until 10/30. I realize that's around the corner but they act like it's odd for me to not have potty trained her yet. I potty trained my 6 yr olde when he turned 3. DD is wearing underwear but it's not going very well. I've give her prune/Apple juice for two days and nothing has happened.

mattandlora

niknak1208 said:

@mattandlora. This is going to sound weird but when she lays flat.. It seems like there's firmness in her lower belly. I actually mentioned it to DH before because I kinda thought it was weird to feel anything firm there. He was like oh it's because she's laying down.. It's muscle probably. But could it be that she has poo stuck? My nephew had that happen only he was describing a lot of pain. She doesn't say her tummy hurts. Maybe every once in a while. She does, however, say that her tongue hurts. Like pretty often. I chalked it up to the strep she had a while back but now she's still saying it and her strep is long gone. I asked her tonight where it hurts on her tongue. She says way way back by her tummy.

That's definitely poo. It doesn't have to cause pain though. Hope the juice works for you.

niknak1208

@mattandlora. Thank you! That's exactly what I suspected. She has an apt with the pediatrician next week. I'm going to talk to him about all this too. I bought the little Gerber bottles that are Apple/prune. She actually loves them. She keeps asking for more. I just gave her the last bottle last night. She did have a pretty big stool last night but it was still soft. I just feel like she's not really in control of it right now because she's always leaking soft stool even if it's not much which is kind of making potty training more difficult.

I've also been pushing water over the last week and trying to eliminate sugar.

Geeps2

Poor thing!  I am sorry that the daycare is acting like that with you.  I work in a public school and we have a preschool program for 3-5 and they don't require that a child be potty trained.  I know I am preaching to the choir but we all know kids develop at different times and ditching the diapers is no exception.  2 is not the magic number by which all children will or should be potty trained.  They are basically forcing you to push her to do something that sounds like physically she is not yet ready to do.  I hope the pediatrician will give you some good suggestions as to what you can do.  Glad she likes the juice and it sounds like it is helping her a little bit.  

At least she has 3 more months to mature and work out the kinks.  If not is she able to stay in the room she is in until she is potty trained?  

niknak1208

@Geeps2 does licensing differ state to state? Because the director of the preschool program is telling me that it's against their licensing for I that room. It's the 3-5 yr old preschool room. I'm really irritated about it actually. I can't MAKE her be ready. She'll either be ready or she won't. All kids are different.

September 8th is when they are supposed to move her to that room. She'll be 3 on October 30th. So I have a month until she needs to be potty trained. I think I'm going to try again but start Thursday this week because we can just stay home and not go anywhere. Last week it was like underwear then pull up. Because we had school and swim lessons all week.

Ugh. I am frustrated for sure.

Geeps2

@niknak I don't know about licensing from state to state or maybe the problem is private run daycares vs. a public school?  A public school has to educate everyone regardless of what they wear under their pants LOL.  Maybe the licensing has to do with ratios of kids to staff and if they have higher number of kids to staff it may be difficult for one teacher to change diapers/pullups?  I have no idea.  I just know our preschool program does not require a child to be potty trained.  We work on it at school. We have timers going off all the time reminding someone it is time to go potty.  We have potty parties when someone is successful.  It's just what we do.  I am sad to hear that isn't the case everywhere  Again, I am in a public school so the rules and regs may be vastly different from a daycare.  Thinking about you.  Not easy for you or your little one  

niknak1208

Geeps2- this is also a public school. Right now she's in the toddler room. Which is probably 18mo to 2.5/3 yrs. As of 09/08, she'll be in the 3-5 yr old preschool room and she sent me an email and said its a violation of their licensing. I just thought it was odd because you can't force a kid to potty train. You can't make them ready.

Ugh. Frustrating. Crossing my fingers that next week goes better.

Guennie

This is a really big subject to me. I absolutely hate that it's become more important to force kids to train early than to focus on the health and development of the child. If a child is not yet physically and emotionally ready to potty train and they are forced, there are both physical and emotional problems which develop. Constipation is a big one. They can start holding it in all the time because it's traumatic and they don't want to go. Please do talk to your ped about all of this. I wish you didn't feel so much pressure. You shouldn't have to be put in this position, I'm sorry.

niknak1208

And here's the thing.. She just loses her spot and won't get to go to preschool if she isn't potty trained. It ticks me off. I can't make her be ready. She either is or she isn't and I'm not going to get mad at her for it. I'm trying to make it exciting for her. I took her to the store yesterday and let her pick out a brand new potty. I let her pick out candy that she'll get if she goes potty in the potty. Yesterday I set a timer every 20 minutes and when it sounds we just sit on the potty and try. If she doesn't go, she doesn't go but I try not let her get frustrated about it. She keeps saying it's not working mommy and I just say that's ok honey we will try again. we had to go to the store in the morning so we started using the timer and undies around 1pm. She never peed until like 5:30 and I'm hoping she wasn't holding it. She never had accidents either but never peed in the potty.

I'm just so anxious about it. So she loses out on preschool or daycare with her friends at school because she's not ready? It's not fair to her and I'm really mad about it.

Guennie

I completely agree with you and it's not only not fair, it isn't right. As a society we are failing our kids when we refuse to put their needs before convenience.

Try to keep it as casual as you can and stay focused on the positive. It sounds like that's what you're doing. I would maybe stretch out the time a little so she doesn't feel quite as much pressure and if she has an accident don't scold her just ask her if she could feel she needed to go and say that's the time we want to sit on the potty. You have the right idea trying to keep it happy and exciting. If you shamed her she would just hold it in and you'd have more issues.

Again I'm sorry, it stinks you have to rush this. I hope with a positive environment she will decide she wants to do it. But like you said, if she isn't ready she isn't ready. And she can't help it if her physical development isn't there yet.

Are you someone who would feel comfortable writing a letter to the director of the program expressing your concerns? These things never change unless people speak up. I'm not suggesting you will singlehandedly change their policy but maybe you could get them to address it. There are some good articles written by doctors arguing the harm in early potty training. Perhaps it would help.

niknak1208

That's who I've been dealing with is the Director of the program! It's a preschool/daycare program that's within the public school that my older son attends. My son is almost 7 and he's been going there since he was 3. He wasn't potty trained until he turned 3. DD isn't 3 until the end of October. I don't know why they think she's even ready for preschool. That room is 3-5 yr olds. I feel like everyone looks at her like she's older because she's so tall. Everyone treats her like she's 4 and she's not. It's aggravating. I get dirty looks about letting her still have a paci and not potty training yet etc. I have to repeatedly remind them that she's 2.5!

I wonder if I spoke with someone above her? I'm totally comfortable. When it comes to my children, I don't really give a hoot who I might make mad. I just feel like it's unfair to give her spot away in the room she's in just because they feel like it's the right progression for her because she's almost of age.

niknak1208

Ugh. And now she's getting irritated when the timer goes off. She was gettng excited about it but now she gets mad. Should I reward her for sitting on the potty? Or only if she goes potty??

Guennie

I think it's a bit early for a timer so often given everything you've said. What I would start out with is potty every couple of hours. You really don't want to push her in the other direction. If you are going to use a reward system she should only be rewarded if she goes. But she should be praised for trying, keep it positive and continue to encourage her. Try to choose times when you think she should need to go. If you are constantly trying to make her go when she doesn't need to she's going to get so sick of it and that will work against you.

I would definitely see who you can talk to about your situation. Our kids all have different needs and it's up to us to advocate for them.

niknak1208

Thanks! I laid off her a bit yesterday. I think you're exactly right. She was just like woman leave me alone. Lol. She looked at me at one point and said in a very firm stern tone... I turning this off mom!! I not going!! And ran off to play. Lol. She was getting mad at me so I let it go. I've also had to have a talk with my 6 yr old because he kept chiming in and making her more mad!

So frustrating. We will get there. I'm going to talk to the director once more but if I'm not satisfied I'll go above her.

Disneygeek77

My daughter is 6 and a few months ago she was having a similar problem.  It was like she had constipation and loose stools at the same time and was going through so many pairs of panties.  She wouldn't have a large poop for a few days, she would only have what I would describe as muddy or pudding like leakage.  Then when she did pass a large BM, she would have several days of the muddy ones. We talked to her Dr about it and she said it was quite common and there is a name for it but I can't recall the name at this moment.  Pretty much, there is one large and hard BM that is blocking her system.  When it does pass, it moves everything forward quite a bit and those BMs that were behind it aren't being processed or digested as well as they should be.  Her Dr recommended upping her fruit and yogurt intake and giving her a small amount of miralax every day to keep things moving until she was fine with just the increased fruit and yogurt.  Sure enough that worked and her bowels became normal.  Her behavior got better too and she could now sit comfortably and wasn't grabbing herself as much. 

niknak1208

I wondered about miralax but I was t sure what was safe to give her. I've been doing prune/Apple juice for almost a week. I've been using essential oils on her belly for three days. Nothing. She had one larger poo the other day but still not really a formed stool. Still more of a muddy consistency. I can still feel the firmness in her belly.

I really would love to avoid suppositories. I had to do it with my son a long time ago and it was just so traumatic for him I think.

Geeps2

Oh man!!!  I still don't understand how they can say you have to have her potty trained if this is within the public school setting.  At least here in NJ we have preschool in most schools (3-5) and I know of no program that states that you have to be potty trained.  I have worked in 2 different school districts (one urban and one lily white suburbia) and neither had the stipulation that a child must be potty trained upon entry.  Diapers and pull ups were being changed at any time of the day.  Learning how to go potty at school was just another area to work on for those that weren't trained yet.  This makes me mad for you.  I know when I was working with my own daughter when I started she just wasn't ready.  I left her alone, just put her on the potty before her bath every night and made a big deal when she went and asked her about going potty during the day.  I didn't push it and followed her lead.  As you know, until they understand signs/ the physical urge to go with going on the potty there isn't much you can do.  

I just don't get it!!!  

niknak1208

Right!! I agree Geeps! Today for the first time EVER she actually didn't want a diaper on. We were packing up to go to the zoo so I kinda had to put her in one but she asked for underwear. I was excited about that!!

I sent a pretty curt email to the director because I had a talk with her teacher and didn't like what I heard. They told me that they all discussed it prior to me having the baby and the teachers told the director that they weren't sure she would be ready because she hadn't really shown any signs. And the director said well she's gonna have to get onboard and so are her parents. Really?? I was hot. She's 2. So I wrote her an email to let her know just how 'on board' I was. Lol.

I ended up running into the director at school Wed. She said she won't lose her spot I the toddler room but can't move up into the preschool room unless potty trained. She did say that I could go ahead and send her in undies this week and the teachers can help.

Ugh. Say a prayer! Lol.

Geeps2

Holy SHIZZZZZZZ!!!!!  First, YEAH for asking for undies  

Now....... Does this Director have children of her own?  It's not like your daughter is 8 and you just haven't gotten around to potty training!!!!  She is 2 for God's sake!!!  You have a new baby.  If slack was ever to be cut someone it would be you.  Where is the empathy for your child, forget the need to be potty trained.  Oh I am pissed for you.  This just shouldn't be.  

I will pray for ya.  So crappy I can't even stand it.

niknak1208

Right!!?? I totally agree Geeps. I'm sick of her acting like she's 8 wearing a diaper. She's 2. She's a normal 2 yr old girl. And it's also normal for her to regress a little while adjusting to the new baby. So we have 2.5 weeks until school starts. If she's not ready, she will stay in the toddler room. But she'll be the oldest kid. The other kids wil be newly 2 yrs old.

Today hasn't been great. Lol. She wanted undies this morning but she's throwing an absolute fit aboit sitting on the potty. She's holding it. I know she is because she went from 8am to 1pm before she peed her pants!!

xuxachi

What a frustrating situation. So terrible that they are forcing her to potty train. My DS was in 3s program in diapers for a few months (he has an Oct birthday) and it wasn't a big deal thankfully.

Here's a question- if you kept her in the toddler room would she be there for the whole year could she change mid-year? Could she move up with her peer group next year? If yes to either is is so bad to keep her with the toddlers? Just a thought.

niknak1208

@xuxachi that's a good question actually. My understanding is that she can't change mid year but I'm not 100% certain. I should probably ask!

Soo today I picked her up at school. She goes 9-12 two days a week during the summer. I immediately notice she's in the same clothes that I dropped her off in?! She peed in the potty at school today!!! No accidents. I was so excited that I got a little teary. Lol. She's had three accidents since being home but I'm feeling encouraged!! And she was allll smiles.

Geeps2

YIPEEEEEE!!!!!  Sometimes all they need is peer pressure  Onward and upward!

niknak1208

Well we are getting closer!! She just suddenly got up and ran to the potty but I was feeding the baby. She couldn't get up on the seat by herself me peed on the floor. But at least she recognized it and went to the bathroom!!

xuxachi

Yay - progress! She's turned a corner I think!

Guennie

Very encouraging!! Yay!!!

niknak1208

So ladies.. Today she had zero accidents and she peed on the potty FOUR times!! Yay!! Just over a week left until school starts. We are so close!!! Cross your fingers!!

Geeps2

Go mini Niknak!!!!!!!!!  Whoooo hooooo  

niknak1208

School is letting her start her 3 yr old preschool room!! She's not quite at the point where she's telling me at the right time but she's getting there. We don't do diapers except at night and she's been dry the last two mornings! She does hold it a lot and say she doesn't have to go but I make her and she almost always goes. Poo isn't totally mastered yet either but she's getting it.

It's nice not changing her diaper anymore or buying them!! She's soo tall that she hangs off the changing table. Lol

Geeps2

Awesome news!!!!  Keep it up girlfriend

Guennie

Yaaay!! Great news!!

niknak1208

Ugh. My poor girl. This girl does NOT like pooping on the potty. She's been avoiding it again and complaining of stomach pain. Tonight she would not stop screaming about it. I mean all out screaming in pain. Didn't want to eat dinner because she said it would hurt. I tried to get her into the pedi last week but they had no appointments! So I called the after hours RN on call because I was scared that it was more than constipation.

Thank goodness it wasn't. X-rays showed that she was extremely gassy and backed up. They said it was good we brought her because she was close to having problems because of it. Poor baby. They ended up giving her a pediatric enema. It worked thank goodness but it was so hard. I had to put a bed pad on my lap.. Put her in a diaper and hold her as she cried.

All the while I'm worrying that it's traumatizing her and hoping she doesn't avoid pooping even more!!

I was working all day with my mom delivering wedding cakes. She thankfully stopped over afterwards so she came and sat in the lobby with my oldest son and our baby while DH and I were back with DD.