It's time for the circumcision thread!

PineApple85

absolutelymaybe said:

I've noticed this has been a UO on other boards, but I left the final decision up to DH because he is the one with the penis and I feel like, as long has we both do research and have an educated discussion, he has better insight on potential implications of the decision we make.  But we were leaning toward the same decision to begin with, so I can understand how it would be more difficult for a couple with more polarizing opinions on the matter. 

Edit: typo

This.  My personal opinion was not to but I left the ultimate decision to SO and he wanted it done.  I shared the research and he considered - for a very long time.  We actually got it done really late because he was on the fence for so long.  I can't remember DS1s age but he was 10 lbs and had some complications because of his size.  

So I'll add this: if you're on the fence, try to make your decision sooner than later.

lisaren

abbyful said:

lisaren said:

abbyful said:

Another tid-bit: 1 in every 500 infants circumcised has serious side-effects.

Can you link this??

Having worked on the Peds unit for 9 years I've never seen or heard of this. Not saying it doesn't happen but I'm curious as to the serious side effects you're referring to??

It's mentioned here: https://www.childrensmercy.org/PediatricAdvisor/Article.aspx?id=466
"Problems with surgery. Problems that may occur are skin or bloodstream infections, bleeding, gangrene, scarring, and various surgical accidents. One study showed that 1 of every 500 circumcised newborns suffered a serious side effect."

I'm on my phone right now, so can't hunt for the original study.

There are lots of articles on PubMed about circumcision complications.

That was written by a MD. I would like to see his actual sample group, the outcomes and how long the follow up was. It's easy to write 1 in 500 but without an actual sample group template to show the statistics that was used to create this number is kinda hard to Base this as facts and not an
Opinion.

Again, not saying it's not true, but 1 in 500 for a serious side effect is a pretty heavy statement to make.

lisaren

Can you tell I loved my research and statistics class in college

MindyAndRyan

I told Ryan that since baby is a boy, the circumcision decision was up to him. I even emailed him a link to this thread, so he can read opinions and any articles linked. (Hi Ryan!) He is a very thorough guy who likes to do his research, so he's done quite a lot of reading on the topic already. At this point, he is leaning against it. I could see both sides based solely on research and personal opinions...until now. This thread made me decide to watch a video of the procedure (neonatal circumcision), and I feel like I cannot do this to my son. I couldn't even make it through the video. Watching the nerve block injections, and the poor baby trying to squirm, just seemed cruel and unnecessary. I made it to 8:27 in the video and was crying at that point and couldn't watch anymore. I just couldn't see doing this to my son if it isn't medically necessary.

It is a personal decision. I am not an extremist one way or the other. I just now know that this is something I cannot do to my son.

edit: typo

Maelara

Thankfully we are having another girl. We would our son circumcised but I was on the fence. DH has good reasons for wanting it though. He got circumcised when he was 8. He still remembers it very well and insists any son of ours will have it done.

There is one thing I want to add about the whole 'sensitivity' thing. I've been with both a non-circumcised man and a circumcised one. From my experience, this is a personal thing and has little basis on whether either was circumcised or not. I found the opposite to be true, my ex that was not circumcised had a harder time... Getting off. It's more mental. Plus he never showered and it tainted my experience.

Isa27

We are having a boy and choosing to circumcise for a few reasons... my husband is for it, cleaner throughout life and also as a nurse I've seen old men have to undergo a geriatric circumcision for medical reasons and it was traumatic at that age. Felt it would save my son a lot of trouble down the road. I also got to see a circumcision when I was in school so that helped to calm my nerves about it. Well anyway it seems we have one choice down out of hundreds.

shindylahoe

Dang it! I had blissfully forgotten about the circumsion choice. That's the only reason I wish this baby was a girl. I hate having to make this kind of decision.

dh2613

You guys have given us a lot to think about. I come from a Hispanic background and men are typically not circumcised but I married DH who is not from that culture and is circumcised. I just figured we would circumcise but now I guess we better do some research before we make our decision..... and I thought a boy was going to be easy..

Isa27

What are all these abbreviations? DH?

Jpinky9

We are having a boy and have decided not to circumcise. DH isn't, not that makes our decision but we just don't feel it is necessary. My dads side of the family is Jewish so early they have all had it done and my sister had my two nephews done, but no one in our families has given us any grief over our choice.

Like many others have said, I just don't see the 'need' to have it done. I certainly do not judge anyone who has had it done and if DH said he would reccomend it then I would.

MrsDL

 

lisaren said:

Another tid-bit: 1 in every 500 infants circumcised has serious side-effects.

Can you link this?? Having worked on the Peds unit for 9 years I've never seen or heard of this. Not saying it doesn't happen but I'm curious as to the serious side effects you're referring to??

It's mentioned here: https://www.childrensmercy.org/PediatricAdvisor/Article.aspx?id=466 "Problems with surgery. Problems that may occur are skin or bloodstream infections, bleeding, gangrene, scarring, and various surgical accidents. One study showed that 1 of every 500 circumcised newborns suffered a serious side effect." I'm on my phone right now, so can't hunt for the original study. There are lots of articles on PubMed about circumcision complications.

That was written by a MD. I would like to see his actual sample group, the outcomes and how long the follow up was. It's easy to write 1 in 500 but without an actual sample group template to show the statistics that was used to create this number is kinda hard to Base this as facts and not an Opinion. Again, not saying it's not true, but 1 in 500 for a serious side effect is a pretty heavy statement to make.

https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/prevention/research/malecircumcision/risks.html

This is from the CDC, interesting they cite a "large" study with complication of .2% which is 1 in 500 technically, however they cite the most common complications as "bleeding and infection which are usually minor and easily managed" - that's not the same thing as saying there is a .2% occurrence of  a serious complication - I assume serious to be something like sepsis or hemorrhage which requires control. 

 

moroccojade

I do NOT want to circ if this baby is a boy.  Not even one little bit.

DH comes from a country where all boys get the procedure done. 

So we are going to have one supremely annoying conversation on our hands when we find out the sex of this child.

Question -- many people (even here today) are basically saying "DH is, so our son will be, too.  They need to look the same."   So I need to ask...   Do Dads and sons actually compare penises?  My daughter and I never compare labia!  I am having a hard time picturing a father with his little boy comparing and contrasting various aspects of their anatomy below the equator.  (And really, a little boy looks NOTHING like his dad for a long, long time anyway.)

And if I am really going to be honest and ridiculous today, I really don't think penises are ever esthetically attractive pieces of machinery - cut or uncut.  I find them purely functional (and appreciate them for that, of course.)  But pretty? No penis is pretty.

lisaren

I think it's just what you're comfortable with. My boys were circumcised.
It was an easy choice for us to make.
I just asked my son who is a junior in HS soon to be senior if he were not circumsized would it matter.. He looked at me, almost with fear, and said whyyyyyyy???? I said "just wondering if we made the right decision" and he said "yes, best decision ever, changing subject"

Hahahaha. But if he were never circumsized his answer may be the exact opposite.

abbyful

DH is circumcised, DS is intact.

At first, DH didn't even really consider it a choice, he was like "don't all boys get circumcised?!". (Side note, it's currently about half.) But then when we both researched it, he quickly became anti-circumcision.

"Like father, like son" wasn't an issue for us. Like others have said, they aren't going to sit around and compare penises, and an adult vs child penis look different anyway.

ARZamora1111

On the car ride back from our u/s in which we found out we were having a boy, I asked DH what he wanted to do, ultimately leaving the decision up to him. He has opted for it and that was that.

I have never been with an uncircumcised man or talked to one about it, so I really didn't have much to go on. Think my preference would be to circumcise as that's what I know.

tinkerbell1658

Ds's father isnt and said it was up to me. I didnt do it for the reasons listed. I couldnt be in the room with him emotionally even if i could physically. I couldnt imangine putting him through that alone and so young. Now..... this babys father wants it done but if its a boy im putting my foot down and wont be getting it done.

kimberly_ann81

AeandJb said:

I will catch up on this when I'm not mobile, but I did want to say: We decided before ttc that we would not circumcise if we had boys. It's an unnecessary surgery, especially on somebody so tiny. Everyone on both sides is cut, buy he's our baby, our choice. One of my sisters had my nephew circumcised and she regrets it. They told her it would be 20 mins and an hour later he still wasn't back and no one would tell her where he was. H saw from his OB rotation, if they don't wake up well from the anesthesia that the doctors won't give them back until they're normal. She now feels guilty and is saying how she has to circumcise all her future boys so they match even though she doesn't want to. We've told her how stupid that sounds. Her H will insist on it so maybe when he has a nephew that isn't, he'll change his mind?

What did they give him?  Sweet Pea got a topical and he didn't cry, fuss, or wiggle at all.  He didn't seem to even know what was happening.  Peanut got a little shot right above the area and only fussed for about 30 seconds.  Both mine were fine right away.

2ndGeneration

 My dh and three young adult sons are all intact.

 The boys have told my dh that they are glad we did not circ them. Dh is also glad he is not. None of them have ever had a uti or any issues with cleanliness. Dh showed them how to wash when they were little boys-they learn just like they learn to wash the rest of themselves. It was no biggie.

 As for how a boy 'looks' , my guys maintain that no other guy is going to be looking at their parts, unless he wants to get punched lol. So there has never been any 'locker room' issues.

 I had two girls after and am having another girl so haven't even thought about this lol.

sparklingwhit

I just asked DH what he wants to do. He said "yep, we'll get him circumcised."

This has really been a non-issue to me. I can see both sides of the argument, so I figured I'd just leave it up to DH. I've also been with circ'd and non circ'd guys and I've never noticed any noticeable difference. To each their own I guess

creativesoul83

having a boy. our decision is just that ours not posting about that.

what I do want to say is. The whole "like father like son" and "do they actually compare" I am female and no children but it seems like a father shows a boy how to pee standing up and aiming and like peeing outside. So the boy may ask "dad why does mine look different?"

That is My thought as to why that opinion. regardless to reach their own.

also would rather keep my dh penis out of conversation.

jlove253

Not having a boy, so I don't have to make this choice, but I think it's totally personal. What you feel is right will be ok.

I did want to add in my experience I have only heard stories of uncirc men having problems, and none about circ men having problems. I'm not a researcher and those stories are totally first hand experiences retold to me by women close to the men, but it was enough to make me lean more towards circ, if the option ever needed to be considered. I've done a little reading on it, and if I ever had a boy id certainly research more.

I'll just share one story: Dh's grandpa had to get circ-ed as an adult when he joined the military, and resultingly always told his children boys should be circumcised as babies just to prevent needing it as an adult.

Also, it seems like some women are reporting babies experiences lots of pain, and other babies not seeming to experience much pain at all. This may be because if the methods the dr uses to perform the procedure. If you're deciding to circ your son it's probably worth asking the dr who'll perform it what method they use and why.

SarahHeck

We haven't made a final decision yet, but my husband is leaning towards getting our little guy circ'd and reading some of these stories is making me lean that way too. I would not want my son to have to go through that later on in life. My daughter had to have surgeries as an infant and babies heal sooo much faster. I hated seeing my baby cry though.... I dunno, I still want to look at numbers.

abbyful

creativesoul83 said:

what I do want to say is. The whole "like father like son" and "do they actually compare" I am female and no children but it seems like a father shows a boy how to pee standing up and aiming and like peeing outside. So the boy may ask "dad why does mine look different?"

Child and adult penises look different anyway, even if they are both circumcised or both intact.

If our son does ask, my husband will simply tell him "they used to think it was a good idea to cut off part of the penis at birth, now we know it's unnecessary so we didn't have it done to you". Simple, no big deal. Not a huge dramatic issue to deal with.

lisaren

I find it funny that people freak out when we -in general we- post US pics in the bump or anywhere for that matter that show the goods, but will openly discuss their child's penis and even more so their husbands!

Bizarre.

Sarahbeth612

I'm glad this was brought up. I'm so excited for a boy but the circumcision deal freaks me out... I can see both sides to this and am not excited about making a decision.

My mom also felt the need to share what she probably thought was a sweet article about having boys, with one of the bulletpoints being to expect pee on everything all the time. So while I'm trying to be happy about adding a boy to the family, all this penis talk is worrying me. Should I really expect pee to the face when I change him? Doesn't the circumcision hurt them? How do you clean a tiny penis anyway? I feel so lost and stupid.

edit can't spell atm either.

brichar31

Thankfully we are having a girl!!  We did circ DS because I know 3 boys who have had to go through the procedure later in life due to complications.  DH is also done so I never thought much about it.   Now we'd have to travel 2.5 hours to have a circ done, the one doctor who still did this in our area has retired.  I was relieved to hear its a girl and we don't have to make that decision again..although MIL wants us to name it after her so the poor little girl's middle name would be Lucinda...sorry to any Lucinda's out there, I hate that name!

Allisonville

Sarahbeth612 said:

I'm glad this was brought up. I'm so excited for a boy but the circumcision deal freaks me out... I can see both sides to this and am not excited about making a decision.

My mom also felt the need to share what she probably thought was a sweet article about having boys, with one of the bulletpoints being to expect pee on everything all the time. So while I'm trying to be happy about adding a boy to the family, all this penis talk is worrying me. Should I really expect pee to the face when I change him? Doesn't the circumcision hurt them? How do you clean a tiny penis anyway? I feel so lost and stupid.

edit can't spell atm either.

You said it! I'm excited about having a boy but I'm kind if freaked out about his little penis. I know it's irrational and it'll be no big deal when he's here blah blah blah but I can't help it. To circumcise or not, the pee issue, supposedly they play with it a lot and at an early age. Ahhh! I've spent way to much time thinking and my fetus' junk. Maybe that should be my FFFC.

jaminjeff

MrsDL said:

I know this probably had nothing to do with it - but the OB practice I did belong to with DS had the NP do this (we didn't find this out until afterwards - they would not let us watch or be there).  I really would recommend parents insist on an MD/DO doing it (like your actual OB) and insist on being there.  I regret not doing this.  Also, research the aftercare, they didn't tell us too much about caring for it - Vaseline until the gauze came-off.  The adhesions issue would have been prevented if we did Vaseline or OTC cortisone a few times a week after bath time. 

It's so weird how it's so different every where you go on who does it.  When DS was circumcised (and this one will be too if it's a boy), our pediatrician we chose, who came to the hospital each day to check on his new patients, is the one who performed it.

kimberly_ann81

Sarahbeth612 said:

I'm glad this was brought up. I'm so excited for a boy but the circumcision deal freaks me out... I can see both sides to this and am not excited about making a decision. My mom also felt the need to share what she probably thought was a sweet article about having boys, with one of the bulletpoints being to expect pee on everything all the time. So while I'm trying to be happy about adding a boy to the family, all this penis talk is worrying me. Should I really expect pee to the face when I change him? Doesn't the circumcision hurt them? How do you clean a tiny penis anyway? I feel so lost and stupid. edit can't spell atm either.

Yes, he will pee on you, the wall, the changing pad, basically what ever is near by at the time.  Sweet Pea peed on his own face on day.  It's something about the cold air on their penis that makes them pee.  Both my daycare boys have peed on me as well.  When older, they will grab it during a diaper change and hang on or pull it; bath times too.

Yes, the circumcision will hurt/bother them, it's surgery.  How much I have no idea and for how long I have no idea.  Both my boys were circumcised and given a pain killer when it was done, one topical and the other a shot.   Both were acting normal/not in pain.  They never cried if I held them close or during any diaper changes so I would assume the pain was gone but you can't really ask them.

Clean, just wipe with a baby wipe.  If circumcised you just avoid the very tip for a day or two unless there is poo on it but I used a lot of vasoline a never had that problem.

mockingjay1

We haven't had this discussion at length yet, but I am pretty sure we will choose to circumcise DS. I've seen hundreds of circumcisions done, and most times it really does depend on the doctor doing it. Fortunately from working in mother baby I know who I do and definitely do not want to do my son's circ. 

They use lidocaine (and sometimes numbing cream) and then give tylenol after where I work. Most of the time if the physician is doing everything correctly and waiting the correct amount of time before moving to the next step, the babies do really well with the procedure. They are usually fussy for 20-30 min and need some extra breastfeeding/snuggling, but after that they are usually ok except the first couple hours when you mess with their diaper. That's just my experience from working with them. 

I also think this varies a lot on what region you live in. Where I live, most people decide to circumcise their boys, which is not the case in other states. DH and I will do more research into this, because most of my knowledge comes from work and what the physicians have told us about research. 

tinkerbell1658

Sarahbeth612 said:

I'm glad this was brought up. I'm so excited for a boy but the circumcision deal freaks me out... I can see both sides to this and am not excited about making a decision.

My mom also felt the need to share what she probably thought was a sweet article about having boys, with one of the bulletpoints being to expect pee on everything all the time. So while I'm trying to be happy about adding a boy to the family, all this penis talk is worrying me. Should I really expect pee to the face when I change him? Doesn't the circumcision hurt them? How do you clean a tiny penis anyway? I feel so lost and stupid.

edit can't spell atm either.

I never got peed on. I would think circumsizing would definately hurt! You just wipe it clean, do not pull back! And yeah they play with it lol. Its not that big of a deal. Ive had the 'its private, do it in your bedroom' talk.

Since i didnt circumsize ds and i breastfed my boobs and his penis was the topic of many conversations brought up by my family....smh

Allisonville

ClrkKntismyAE said:

@Allisonville Hate to break it to you, but my DD is 18 months and will grab and play with her vagina every chance she gets. Since penises and vaginas are almost always covered kids are curious when they come out to play. They are just body parts and we don't make a big deal about it when DD grabs herself. When she is old enough to understand better we will give her the "privacy" talk and tell her that she should only touch her vagina in her bedroom or the bathroom.

As for the circumcision discussion, my mother and I got into this conversation last night. She told me that if we left DS intact she wouldn't change his diaper because she wasn't comfortable with pulling back the foreskin to clean the penis.

I bring this up because, like so many other aspects of parenting, there is a lot of misconceptions and out dated information when it comes to circumcisions. I still think the circumcision is a personal choice, but just make sure you research it.

You should never pull back your son's foreskin. He will do it himself at an older age. During the diapering stages cleaning the penis should be as easy as cleaning a finger. This was on of the facts that made me consider to not circumcise. It just seems easier than caring for an open wound that is kept in a diaper.

Edit because words are hard.

My kid is 23 months and doesn't seem to care that she has a vagina. I know that it's natural and no big deal. On all those cute little lists about raising boys or whatever there's just always so much penis talk, so I figure that there must be some truth in it. That's all I was saying.

absolutelymaybe

ClrkKntismyAE said:

@Allisonville Hate to break it to you, but my DD is 18 months and will grab and play with her vagina every chance she gets. Since penises and vaginas are almost always covered kids are curious when they come out to play. They are just body parts and we don't make a big deal about it when DD grabs herself. When she is old enough to understand better we will give her the "privacy" talk and tell her that she should only touch her vagina in her bedroom or the bathroom. As for the circumcision discussion, my mother and I got into this conversation last night. She told me that if we left DS intact she wouldn't change his diaper because she wasn't comfortable with pulling back the foreskin to clean the penis. I bring this up because, like so many other aspects of parenting, there is a lot of misconceptions and out dated information when it comes to circumcisions. I still think the circumcision is a personal choice, but just make sure you research it.  You should never pull back your son's foreskin. He will do it himself at an older age. During the diapering stages cleaning the penis should be as easy as cleaning a finger. This was on of the facts that made me consider to not circumcise. It just seems easier than caring for an open wound that is kept in a diaper. Edit because words are hard.

THIS! I was actually thinking about posting a link to cleaning/care for an uncircumcised penis but glad you brought it up. This is something neither DH and I knew until about two weeks ago (I mean, it's not like he remembers how he was cleaned as a baby). 

SweetMelissa5

kimberly_ann81 said:

Sarahbeth612 said:

I'm glad this was brought up. I'm so excited for a boy but the circumcision deal freaks me out... I can see both sides to this and am not excited about making a decision. My mom also felt the need to share what she probably thought was a sweet article about having boys, with one of the bulletpoints being to expect pee on everything all the time. So while I'm trying to be happy about adding a boy to the family, all this penis talk is worrying me. Should I really expect pee to the face when I change him? Doesn't the circumcision hurt them? How do you clean a tiny penis anyway? I feel so lost and stupid. edit can't spell atm either.

Yes, he will pee on you, the wall, the changing pad, basically what ever is near by at the time.  Sweet Pea peed on his own face on day.  It's something about the cold air on their penis that makes them pee.  Both my daycare boys have peed on me as well.  When older, they will grab it during a diaper change and hang on or pull it; bath times too.

Yes, the circumcision will hurt/bother them, it's surgery.  How much I have no idea and for how long I have no idea.  Both my boys were circumcised and given a pain killer when it was done, one topical and the other a shot.   Both were acting normal/not in pain.  They never cried if I held them close or during any diaper changes so I would assume the pain was gone but you can't really ask them.

Clean, just wipe with a baby wipe.  If circumcised you just avoid the very tip for a day or two unless there is poo on it but I used a lot of vasoline a never had that problem.

For what it's worth, girls also will occasionally pee during diaper changes (my youngest actually seemed to have the timing down well enough that she would frequently poop as soon as I took the diaper off, which made for a lot of laundry for me); the difference is that with girls, the pee mostly just runs off the side and onto the changing table, while with boys, it has the potential to squirt up and get anything in the vicinity. I always just covered my son's penis with a washcloth while he wasn't covered by a diaper, and I never got peed on.

ColeyCannoli

I don't get the cleanliness argument. Wash what you see. I've washed both and it's not exactly rocket science. The circumcised kids look weird to me because they are scarred and the tip is all rough when it should be smooth. I will not being doing it because I honestly don't get it. None of the men in my family or DH's are and nothing has happened to them to make it seem necessary. I always thought it was just a religious thing.
I'm sure it doesn't hurt them or anything but cutting off some of my baby's skin is just confusing to me. (Seems like a white American thing)

ColeyCannoli

JMPrice said:

DH is a surgical RN/NP and he's done countless surgeries on adult males due to infections or constricting of the foreskin. Someone posted the AAP article from Aug. 2012 but here it is again:

https://www.aap.org/en-us/about-the-aap/aap-press-room/Pages/New-Benefits-Point-to-Greater-Benefits-of-Infant-Circumcision-But-Final-Say-is-Still-Up-to-parents-Says-AAP.aspx

It basically states the benefits outweigh the risk but it is still a parental decision. AAP states that there are enough benefits for health insurance companies to cover it. Most don't (including ours).

Even though DH is strongly pro-circ, he is letting me make the decision because, well, I'm the one baking this baby. The hospital will allow us to be present, DH with his surgical experience will of course be the one to be there. I would not allow the circ if we couldn't be there, IMO you don't leave loved ones to do scary/painful things alone. My decision had nothing to do with appearance and everything to do with the medical benefits, which include reducing the risk of HIV and HPV infection.

Wouldn't safe sex also prevent those?
The health argument makes the most sense to me but it still seems odd when it's for STDs that can be prevented with condom use. But I totally agree that you should be present for something like that. My hospital doesn't allow us to go back with baby for it, which if we were considering it would make me really uncomfortable.

lisaren

When I worked on the Peds floor we would actually encourage the parents to NOT go back with the baby's so that the baby does not have a negative image of mom/dad with a procedure. We brought the baby straight to parents as soon as we were finished so that mom/dad were the soothers and there were no associations with the parent and pain.

And with the thousands of procedures my daughter with SN has had we've always followed this, and she calmed much much quicker.

Nfranco973

I did with DS and if I ever have any other boys I will as well. I had absolutely no problems with DS when I had it done. He didn't seem in any pain either. I was present for his circ. to each it's own.

lisaren

JMPrice said:

lisaren said:

When I worked on the Peds floor we would actually encourage the parents to NOT go back with the baby's so that the baby does not have a negative image of mom/dad with a procedure. We brought the baby straight to parents as soon as we were finished so that mom/dad were the soothers and there were no associations with the parent and pain.

And with the thousands of procedures my daughter with SN has had we've always followed this, and she calmed much much quicker.

I disagree with this. We are there for her shots to soothe her and it's the same thing. Negative associations with pain? Ridiculous.

Ok, years of witnessing this along with countless physicians and my own daughter who has had one too many procedures to count all proves ridiculous.

And soothing during a shot and soothing during a spinal tap... Not the same thing.
But ok

ShelleyElla22

Both my boys are circumcised and this one will be too. Was never even a conversation between DH and I.