IF Treatment & Testing w/o 9/27

acleverusername · September 2021

Okay, got some time now while on a boring meeting.

@optimistgardener I totally get your reluctance re: hitting up your donor friend while you wait for your next retrieval cycle. Question: what are you currently doing for egg quality?

@mokay19 sounds like you've got a lot happening in your life. Treatment while a near and dear one passes is just another complex layers in this multi-layered game. Are you staying with the same clinic as before once new insurance kicks in?

@kiki047 👋🏻What are your next important dates?

@zwink1 6 months IS A LONG TIME to wait, but everything is a long wait when doing IVF. Question, how are you moving your embryos? Are you renting a tank from a 3rd party? Using one provided by the clinic? What's the cost of that? We have some sperm stored at another clinic (which we had to fire) and I'd love to get it over to our new clinic.

@CatGifsRock Welcome! Would love to get to know you a bit more in the Newbie Intros thread. I would have to agree with @inthewoods23 about some of your eggs being over mature. The ones that were 10mm were likely 14mm by trigger time; the 22mm one was likely 26mm+. Depending on how many of each you had, it's possible you only had 3-4 in play to start. But of course your trigger procedure can play a role. What was your trigger? I hope the lil' embryo makes it to tomorrow and that your transfer is successful.

@gingermama29 So quick for an appointment! Yay. And of course having that recommendation from a doctor with personal experience is invaluable. In terms of what to ask, I refer you to this article. There's also this thread that can be helpful.

I have a new hashtag for us: #MassTTGPExodus

zwink1 · September 2021

@acleverusername, so funny story about that, we're actually moving them ourselves with a tank provided by the new clinic. They're only like an hour and a half away, but the courier services our new clinic referred us to wanted to charge $700-800 to move them. The clinic gave us the option of getting them ourselves, so we were like, why the f not. This way, all it's costing us is time. H picked up the tank today and is now deathly afraid that he's going to accidentally tip it over while he's transporting tomorrow, but I personally trust him more to keep it upright than I do a random courier service

It was relatively easy to set up and was mostly just coordinating pick up/drop off times between the clinics.

acleverusername · September 2021

@zwink1 this is great! Thanks for sharing. I'm going to contact our clinic to see if they'd allow to move the semen sample ourselves.

shortstack930 · September 2021

@walkawaynee welcome! I'm excited for you to start your IVF journey!

@keikilove we're all here for whatever you need

. I think it's a great idea to seek extra support from a therapist, they can be so helpful and you guys have been through so much lately.

@acleverusername I'm so sorry you're back and for everything you're going through. I'm so glad you don't have to put the next cycle on hold though. It sounds like you've got a really great doctor who understands exactly what you're going through!

@inthewoods23 I have no idea on the insurance thing but I hope it works out and doesn't mess up your cycle timing!

@hanshotfirst77 bummer that you missed your window for this cycle!

@optimistgardener I LOL'd at "low key sperm transfer"! I think you made the right choice though with all of those things to consider.

@mokay19 I'm so sorry for your loss.

@bumblebee0210 I am so freaking happy for you!!! Those are some amazing results!!!

@zwink1 looks like we may be transferring around the same time!!

@LJMoon6 yikes that office sounds awful! I hope you're able to have a better experience with them but I definitely agree it might be time for a change.

@CatGifsRock I'm sorry you only ended up with one. I hope your transfer goes well!

@gingermama29 I'm glad you were able to get the referral!

Diagnosis (if you've been): Endometriosis

Status (WTO/TWW/TTA): TWW

What are you doing this cycle? (Testing? Treatment?): FET prep

How are things going?: I've worked the past three days in a row so I'm wiped out, but on the bright side it has taken my mind off of TTC so that's nice. Still doing the estrogen pills and patch and just waiting for AF now which should be here Friday or Saturday and then we can start our FET cycle! I'm trying to figure out how I'm going to switch shifts at work if my transfer ends up being on a day I'm scheduled to work. I don't really want anyone at work to know about our FET just yet so I'm thinking maybe if I just say I have a last minute minor medical procedure maybe that will be okay?

Any questions?: Nope

GTKY: besides Halloween, what are you looking forward to the most in October? All the pumpkin stuff!!!

optimistgardener · September 2021

@shortstack930 if i can do nothing else around here, at bare minimum i can amuse people with my adventures in sperm transfers. for those curious, the usual system is to have my friend over and then send him with cup in hand to a distant corner of the house with a convenient spare bathroom. he emerges sometime later, slightly disheveled, places the cup on a table where i can grab it, and he makes his farewells and disappears while i rush over to get the cup and keep the semen warm while i prepare the syringe, etc. (we're good friends so this arrangement is only a liiiiittle bit awkward.) most of the time though (for IUIs and IVF) i just buy my sperm from a bank where i can guarantee quality and i don't have to harass my friend endlessly with requests.

Anyway as you can see this strategy is not ideal with family around, and it's almost as unworkable for me to go and pick up the goods from his place, since he has roommates and a tween child.

walkawaynee · September 2021

@optimistgardener i love that you have a friend that does this for you and I would low key love to see you try to do it with family around just share the story

acleverusername · September 2021

@optimistgardener; I second @walkawaynee's challenge! We need something to rival @keikilove holiday FW sex in the garage last year!

@shortstack930 LOL @ all the pumpkin stuff. Hehe. Do you mean pumpkin spice or just pumpkin the gourd? It would be great if we can graduate both you and @zwink1 at the same time! #MassTTGPExodus.

kiki047 · September 2021

@optimistgardener I am LOLing at "slightly disheveled"

I always wondered how that worked with your donor friend. He sounds like a cool dude.

Image: https://media.giphy.com/media/2uIiDfV1s0aE016wjb/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47egld8n8n82sb09jqnvxtrzwafhpmpn8xtkhvwl40&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

@acleverusername Only one more week until our follow up with the REI for test results. Oct 7th, 6:30pm ET (or thereabouts, they said within a 2 hour window). Thanks for asking! I may not have any fingernails or hair left by then but then again, I'm not expecting to learn anything life-altering, hoping it'll just paint a clearer picture on how we proceed. The bigger question is when can we get the ball rolling again. I need to know that we're actively planning to move forward, and AF is already due before this next consult so I know we're automatically already still kinda benched for my Oct cycle so FX we might be able to start right away in November? Wishful thinking?

LJMoon6 · September 2021

@inthewoods23 Hopefully your test results give you some answers! Did you decide to go ahead with the blood draw before the pre-authorization comes through? I really hope you never have to go back to your RE’s clinic either. These places suck. But I guess I should be grateful for the advancements in science. Yay science!

@acleverusername Ya. That’s what was so mind boggling to me. Why would they be ok with me triggering with 5 follicles?! But when I pressed them on this I got the impression that I had the “potential” for 5 follicles, but if they don’t do the follow-up scan then they can basically turn a blind eye. Just seems… sketch to me. Thank you for the further explanation of LH and timing. I did read a little bit about washed sperm not sticking around as long. It’s good to hear you’ve been through this same situation and have done the research. It makes me feel more comfortable with what happened.

@kiki047 That appointment is right around the corner! Finally. You’ve been waiting so long. I hope you get a clear idea of how to move forward. I’ll be sitting here anxiously waiting with you!

Update: I had my baseline yesterday. I potentially have a small cyst (13) but they said it’s small enough that we can still continue. They are keeping me at the high dose of letrozole even though I’m concerned I’ll over produce. I didn’t start the meds till CD4 this time though (last time started them on CD3). Not sure if that would make a difference. I’m slightly concerned about MH’s post wash numbers. Looking back a couple years ago his numbers were in the 20mil range. Last cycle is was 13mil. I know anything above 10mil is good. He has started a multi-vitamin, but is there anything else that he could take to increase his count (the count and motility are the only numbers we get during the IUIs). I know changes take a few months to be seen in the sperm quality but I thought I would try to start somewhere.

acleverusername · September 2021

@LJMoon6 starting the meds a bit later might work well. Cause your body might already have prepared to "select" the lead follicle, and Letrazole will just give it a boost in case there are 2-3 in contention right now. I have to start Letrazole very early in my cycle because my body "recruits" early. So, I usually start on CD2. Here's to hoping this does the trick!

As for YH, come to me with all your sperm enhancement questions! Lol. Here's what MH is taking. I've asterisked the most important ones. You'll want to check how much is in his multivitamin and supplement accordingly. You should see results in as early as 50 days, although full sperm replacement cycle is around 90-110 days.

1 cap - Selenium (200 mcg) ***
1 cap - Vitamin D3 (2000 IU)
1 cap - Zinc (50 mg) ***
1 tab - Methyl Folate (800 mcg) ***
1 cap - L-Carnitine (1000 mg) ***
2 cap - Vitamin E (800 IU) ***
2 cap - Fish Oil (2400 mg)
1 cap - Tru Niagen (300 mg)
1 tab - Vitamin C
2 caps - COQ10 ***

shortstack930 · September 2021

@optimistgardener he sounds like an amazing friend!! And yes, definitely awkward to try that with family around!

@acleverusername haha both! All the pumpkin spice stuff plus all the pumpkin-y fall decorations! But mainly pumpkin coffee!!

bumblebee0210 · October 2021

Thanks all for the good wishes-- and @optimistgardener. for adventures in sperm donation. Amazing.

AFM: Day 5 today, stats in spoiler. Tonight I'm headed out to another wedding at which I will have to find a quiet place to inject myself...

I *think* most of the leftover follicles from round 1 are gone, because I had a very reasonable day-5 reading-- 4 measurable, all 10-12 and 10 less than 10. That is actually quite good for me, though not as good as last cycle, and not where my imagination was going when I heard I had 25 littles at baseline (almost surely some of those were also leftovers). It's funny how quickly expectations can get ratcheted up!

kiki047 · October 2021

@LJMoon6 thank you, friend! Though I'm sorry you're still here, I love seeing familiar faces crop back up and I'll be cheering you on through your IUIs this time too! As for your Q about sperm parameters/supplements, I think Clever has the supplements covered but something else you could potentially try is what I lovingly refer to as "priming the pump"

*TMI warning and spoilering because NSFW?*

What I refer to as Priming the Pump would be where he would masturbate until just before climax then stop. For the few times we've successfully done that it has improved his count by at least a 20% margin (like 11-15M vs 19-20M). I say "successfully" because the other side of that is not being able to stop.... womp womp. MH thinks it's the worst, but like c'mon, it's not that bad *eyeroll* This is not in any way backed up by science btw lol, it's purely anecdotal.

@keikilove's RE had her H doing frequent (daily?) ejaculation at one point in order to stimulate production and clear everything out when he admitted to taking some sperm-unfriendly suppements. We're not that extreme, but there are some studies that show that a shorter hold, like <2 days, is better for motility and DNA fragmentation than longer holds of ~5 days.

walkawaynee · October 2021

@kiki047 I died laughing at "successfully" or rather the unsuccessful scenario

kiki047 · October 2021

@walkawaynee it's truly a ridiculous scenario, lol, and I have a hard time having any sympathy for MH either way

Image: https://media.giphy.com/media/4AjWXJ8WjrK2Q/giphy.gif

The way this came up was because an old (ex) friend went with her partner to get an SA done and she had instructed him to prime the night before but he "accidentally" came and was too embarrassed to tell her. So then they get his SA results his count was really low, and of course they freaked out. Their RE asked how long the hold period was and she said 3 days - or however many it was - but left out the part about priming. Then her BF had to reluctantly admit that he goofed, and the RE was confused, and then the whole story came out and they all had a good laugh. He did another SA and it was fine and that was that. But it surprisingly helps us so now it's this big running joke. Not recommended for the faint of heart

optimistgardener · October 2021

@kiki047 i read your NSFW "priming the pump" essay while waiting with my dog in the car for a vet to come out and take some blood for a lab test (all is well). Dog was staring at me like, what is going on with this crazy woman? I was laughing so hard.

ETA I have this story that is not mine, and so i really shouldn't tell it, but we'll just pretend and put it in a spoiler and keep it vague... so basically it involves a male friend who lives across the country and is serving as a donor for a friend of his, and he told me this story about this one time when he was sent at the clinic to deliver his sample in a dark broom closet without any lube. Suffice to say the "sample" was not easy for him to deliver because the visual aids were all hetero-oriented (plus he was in a broom closet with a smelly mop). and then there was some inadvertent self-injury involved because no lube, and he had to go out on a mid-process excursion to find a nurse who could give him some kind of safe lube (delivered in an open dixie cup, like a whole cup worth) in front of a room full of aghast ultra-orthodox Jewish ladies who were clients at the clinic, and then sent back into the broom closet again to finish his business. there's actually like a lot more to the story than that but i'll just leave it there.

inthewoods23 · October 2021

@optimistgardener omg broom closet and mid-process excursion

fantastic story

AFM, biopsy sample has been collected! Hurt like a bitch just as I expected. The paperwork called for a huge sample so what was 5-10 seconds of intense cramping the first time I had an endometrial biopsy was 30+ seconds this time around. I winced quite a bit but didn't need to white knuckle grip the chair (or bench? what do they call them?) or anything like that. I guess that nurse from the first time was right that I do have a high pain tolerance.

And then the nurse and OB in the room taking my sample said it looked beautiful. I have an attractive baby oven I guess haha. Sample is chilling (literally) in my fridge for now until I can figure out getting the blood drawn for the other tests for the immunology lab. Thinking about it... I guess those tests aren't genetic ones right? I've asked the nurse at the RI to confirm because if they're not, I shouldn't require the pre-authorization for them and could get the blood drawn early next week so I can ship out the package right after. Just gotta hope my PCP's office is willing to draw the blood for me (they're closer to me than the OB).

optimistgardener · October 2021

@inthewoods23 you are a brave woman (and so are all the rest of you on here who've also gotten biopsies done). just the thought of that process makes me squinch up my whole body in anticipatory pain.

acleverusername · October 2021

@inthewoods23 this is me reading your update...

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5020794/uploads/editor/2b/kqpjyz1k0cq6.gif

acleverusername · October 2021

... but in all honesty, that sounds hugely uncomfortable. Thank God you have a high pain threshold. I thrashed around a bit during my HSG, which lasted maybe 10 seconds. I don't think I could handle 30 sec of cramping.

inthewoods23 · October 2021

@acleverusername yeah I think my legs were tensed up the whole time haha. And I did this without Tylenol or ibuprofen because I wasn't sure if it would affect the results!

I wasn't feeling great last night and woke up this morning almost feverish (99.12 on my BBT! Had to discard it) that they had warned me about. Slept some more hoping to break the fever. Got out of bed eventually and watched TV a bit. Fell asleep doing that and only when I woke up then did I finally take some Tylenol ha.

Hopefully I can wake up at a reasonable time to pick up DH from the airport in the morning!

optimistgardener · October 2021

@acleverusername dude i somehow only just now read your question about my egg quality protocol. I know for a fact that my protocol is not nearly as impressive as yours, but i absolutely despise swallowing pills (I actually think I prefer needles to pills!) so getting these things into me is a challenge already. I'm all ears if you think something majorly important is missing from this list, though.

PNV, Vit E, Vit D (I am chronically low on this), low dose DHEA, Acai, CoQ10

I'll start baby aspirin and melatonin again closer to treatment, and up my DHEA a bit

Trying to eat lots of Omega-3 rich eggs, seeds, etc.

Trying to keep my alcohol consumption occasional (despite having been surrounded by my heavy-drinking family for the past month and change... they all think i'm uptight and boring now i'm sure)

Trying but mostly failing to get a reasonable amount of sleep

acleverusername · October 2021

@inthewoods23 I sincerely hope that you’re feeling better tomorrow. It’ll be nice to have YH back I’m sure!

@optimistgardener I can’t say I’m a pro when it comes to egg quality, but I’m definitely taking a lot of stuff and - don’t know if it works or not - but obviously my cycle results are rather unusual. So here’s what I’m taking:

- 150mg Pterostbene (TEW recommendation)
- Açai 600, 3 pills 2x a day (recommended by @lickastick)
- Resveratrol 1 pill 3x a day (recommended by @lickastick)
- Vitamin E 1000IU (recommended by @lickastick)
- COQ10 600mg in liquid form
- TruNiagen (NAD) 300mg (TEW recommendation)
- Melatonin 3mg starting just before and continuing through the stim cycle
- 3000mg of Liposomal Vitamin C (recommended by a doctor at my fertility clinic)

The other thing I’m taking is liquid glutathione. This was prescribed by my functional medicine doctor and I started it shortly after my cancelled IVF cycle in June. Based on my research, it has pretty powerful anti-oxidant properties; it’s called the “master antioxidant”. But I’ve never heard it mentioned in fertility circles. A casual Google browse lands some credibility to the hypothesis that it might help with sperm and egg quality. Google article here from a naturopath in Vancouver who uses it for infertility: https://www.acubalance.ca/blog/boost-your-fertility-glutathione

Of course, besides Glutathione and COQ10, all of these supplements are in the pill form which might not be helpful at all.

@keikilove might have some additional info/opinion re: above.

Finally, for @bumblebee0210 and @hanshotforst77, the final word on grading vs. PGT:

I’ve uncovered an amazing new source of information. /r/AskEmbryologists *pats herself on the back*

optimistgardener · October 2021

@acleverusername thanks as always for your knowledge and willingness to share. I had a look at a couple of the things on your list that i'm not on, and am definitely considering them. for others who may be looking at this list, i'd like to just quickly highlight what might be an important thing for people to weigh: the resveratrol, while associated with improved egg quality, is also associated with less receptive endometrial lining. so at least this one site recommends staying away from it during luteal phase/priming for FET or if you think you may be doing a fresh transfer after retrieval.

acleverusername · October 2021

@optimistgardener just modified the dosage of Resveratrol cause I made a mistake writing it out last night.

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