@mytrueloves it was me and I didn’t know that, only the cigarette reference. So was it a hate word at the same time as cigarette word or did that come later? No worries if you don’t know, I’m just curious. I could probably go look it up myself, but being lazy.
Jumping in to the whole ‘who gets to use what words’ discussion - I think it comes down to the population it’s targeted at and they get to decide if they find it offensive or not within their community. But when people outside their community use it, it is almost always in a derogatory and offensive manner whereas in their internal dialogues it might not be used to intentionally cause harm. You don’t use those words as an outsider because you want to invoke positive feelings about the group.
I work with individuals with diversabilities and their families - when I hear someone use the term ‘retarded’ it is immediately implied that person thinks someone with a disability is a less than. It might be ignorance and they don’t know that isn’t a PC term anymore - but even in that case it also implies the individual is a lesser citizen because of their disability (because they are also using the dated thinking that goes along with the word that people with diversabilites are incapable of self determination). That being said - I don’t think it’s one of the groups where they’ve really tried to ‘take back’ the word either, I’ve never heard a self advocate refer to someone else with a disability using that term.
Re: music and kids. DH and I were literally talking about this an hour ago on the way to dinner. We are hard rock/metal fans, so the music we listen to has some inappropriate words/themes for children that we wouldn't want them repeating. (heyyyy Ghost, love you guys, but don't need my kids telling grandma and grandpa about how they listen to semi-satanic metal bands )
ETA: we will probably just screen our music around the baby and awkwardly talk over any bad words lol
Relatedly, one of my concerns about raising tiny human is that I listen to quite a bit of hip-hop and R&B. How do I explain that just because tiny human heard some lyrics on the stereo, that doesn’t mean xe can repeat them.
I dread having to get radio edits of my music- especially since I hate radio edits.
This has been an issue for me a lot lately as DD1 has just gotten old enough to ask in-depth questions about song lyrics, and DD2 has entered the parroting phase. I listen to all kinds of music and some of it uses explicit language. Some of them I’m comfortable explaining to my kids, and others I just don’t play around them now. Like, I’m happy to explain a song that has “ass” in it, e.g. “Ass is a grown up word for your bum, honey. It’s one of those words that it’s not acceptable for kids to use but sometimes grown ups choose to use them.”, but I’m not about to explain Fuck the Police by NWA to my 3 year old. Honestly songs that have references to violence have been causing me more problems than language lately, because it’s a lot easier to forget that a song has a passing reference to violence than a bunch of cussing.
99.9% of the music we listen to is in Spanish and neither H nor I are fluent, so Z has no idea what’s being said. That’s how I avoid explaining foul language in music.
I’m totally in agreement with baby clothes phrases. I was actually quite annoyed Sunday because I was going through DS’s clothes and a lot of his baby clothes would be so perfect for this little one, but that said dumb shit like “handsome little dude” and I just won’t put my daughter in that. Although I did buy a onesie that said “strong like mommy” for this little one, but it sounded empowering to me. I want my daughter to be strong and intelligent, not just cute or pretty.
I also hate quotes on walls, especially when people put those wall cling quotes up. It’s not my style.
As far as taking back words. I tend to lean more towards @kiwi2628, but I think that’s because I grew up in a very conservative atmosphere. I’m much more liberal in comparison to my family, but I’m really just a moderate. I guess I’ve always been more of the “why can’t we all just get along mindset”. I also think of it as a why would I not respect myself kind of thing. Like, I hate when girls jokingly say “I’m such a bitch” or “hey bitches”. Like no, that’s rude, please respect yourself and me. But because I’m neither liberal or conservative I tend to really look at both view points. I also understand that the pain from racism or descrimination runs deep so I can definitely see why use it to lessen the pain of the word.
As far as music, I’ll give the music teacher perspective. Kids through elementary school are really good at “that’s a bad word”, but they don’t understand the deeper meaning of the songs or even the simple metaphors until middle school age or older. I think it’s totally okay to say, we don’t use this word because it’s not kind with bad words, and I won’t worry to much about what the song is actually talking about. That being said you kind of have to draw your own line. DH listens to lots of Irish music so DS’s favorite songs all have lines about drinking, but even though DH and I like rap/hip hop (from before it sucked) we usually don’t play it’s round him.
And now that I typed a novel...
My UO...I don’t get “gender (sex) disappointment”. I can understand people saying that we’re hoping for one sex and we’re a bit shocked or sad when they found out if was the other. However, when people cry or shut down because of the sex of their kid, I think it’s dumb. If your baby is healthy that’s all that matters.
@jemmerjams We listen to the same kind of music. (side note, I say "ratssss" all the time now, thanks Ghost haha) but with a different view, I want my kids exposed to mommy and daddy's weird quirky musical taste. Music is so much of mine and DH's relationship and who we are as people. I figure if they bring up the swearing then I'll address it as pp's have mentioned.
@cdepperschmidt I'm with you on 'gender disappointment'. I completely understand secretly hoping for one or the other and being slightly disappointed or sad for a bit. But I mean, be sad for a day or two and move on. It's one thing to be a bit disappointed and another to be crying and shutting down and not wanting to be pregnant anymore. There are so many people in this world who can't have children, and so many children in this world who are without parents. Their sex shouldn't matter, health and happiness is all that matters.
I truly believe you are meant to get what you get. If that's all 4 boys or 3 girls in a row....just embrace it!
@Kfrob omg love it. I keep saying it too, you can't not say it that way!! I have some younger cousins that picked up swearing really early and it's kind of a sore subject in the family (plus my family is pretty religious), so I'm hoping to keep that to a minimum. But for sure, my kids are going to be exposed to the music I like, just *maybe* more censored, or with a lot of talk about why we don't say these words.
@jemmerjams We listen to the same kind of music. (side note, I say "ratssss" all the time now, thanks Ghost haha) but with a different view, I want my kids exposed to mommy and daddy's weird quirky musical taste. Music is so much of mine and DH's relationship and who we are as people. I figure if they bring up the swearing then I'll address it as pp's have mentioned.
This is one thing I think is cool about SS having two families. The music that BM, DH, and I listen to is all very different. BM is more of a country and top 40 kind of person, DH prefers rock, and I love showtunes. DH and I both listen to a variety of music, but those are our preferences. In turn SS loves everything! He will sing along with Imagine Dragons and Five Finger Death Punch. When it's him and I in the car, we listen to Disney and play "what's this from".
Late to The Who gets to use what words convo, but adding another thought. Some people get to reclaim words because those words have been used against them in violence and there is power and healing in reclaiming them and part of that power relates to the exclusive right to use the words in a positive context. It’s important that not everyone can say them and that the meaning depends on the speaker.
Relatedly, I think the “why can’t we all just get along” mentality is sometimes similar to colorblindness or saying “All lives matter.” It ignores the ongoing targeted violence against certain communities. It assumes that the experience of safety and neighborly good will is universal and not related to privilege (often white privilege.
I haven’t been nearly articulate enough in this post, so I’m going to also look for an article that I think expresses what I’m trying to say.
@rc-cola well said! I once read an article that explained this SO well, but there's no way I could ever find it again.
Going to a session this afternoon with women at work to talk about equality in our workplace given some of the recent drama that was blasted by the news. Had a similar conversation with my boss about how we need to ensure all people are represented and recognized equally, but that we have to shine the light on where the significant issue is first so as not to mute/damper the entire situation from the beginning. It's been so interesting to hear everyone's perspectives. Looking forward to the session, but I'm anticipating it being intense.
@rc-cola I once heard it put beautifully. Yes, all lives matter, of course, but in this moment, BLM is important because there is absolutely an issue with racism in this country that goes far beyond racist remarks and goes deep into the housing, wealth, health and justice parts of our nation. Saying all lives matter is like going to a doctor with a broken bone and you ask him to fix it and he says to you 'but all bones are important!' and you are like 'thats true, but this is the broken one so maybe we focus on that one right now'.
@rc-cola I admittedly have spent a lot of time trying to take my white privileged blinders off. The older I get the more I see that even though I grew up lower middle class, I definitely experienced white privedge. Although, I’ve always been a supporter of BLM and found All Lives Matter to be insulting to BLM.
Re: U/O Thursday (6/14)
I work with individuals with diversabilities and their families - when I hear someone use the term ‘retarded’ it is immediately implied that person thinks someone with a disability is a less than. It might be ignorance and they don’t know that isn’t a PC term anymore - but even in that case it also implies the individual is a lesser citizen because of their disability (because they are also using the dated thinking that goes along with the word that people with diversabilites are incapable of self determination). That being said - I don’t think it’s one of the groups where they’ve really tried to ‘take back’ the word either, I’ve never heard a self advocate refer to someone else with a disability using that term.
ETA: we will probably just screen our music around the baby and awkwardly talk over any bad words lol
I also hate quotes on walls, especially when people put those wall cling quotes up. It’s not my style.
As far as taking back words. I tend to lean more towards @kiwi2628, but I think that’s because I grew up in a very conservative atmosphere. I’m much more liberal in comparison to my family, but I’m really just a moderate. I guess I’ve always been more of the “why can’t we all just get along mindset”. I also think of it as a why would I not respect myself kind of thing. Like, I hate when girls jokingly say “I’m such a bitch” or “hey bitches”. Like no, that’s rude, please respect yourself and me.
But because I’m neither liberal or conservative I tend to really look at both view points. I also understand that the pain from racism or descrimination runs deep so I can definitely see why use it to lessen the pain of the word.
As far as music, I’ll give the music teacher perspective. Kids through elementary school are really good at “that’s a bad word”, but they don’t understand the deeper meaning of the songs or even the simple metaphors until middle school age or older. I think it’s totally okay to say, we don’t use this word because it’s not kind with bad words, and I won’t worry to much about what the song is actually talking about. That being said you kind of have to draw your own line. DH listens to lots of Irish music so DS’s favorite songs all have lines about drinking, but even though DH and I like rap/hip hop (from before it sucked) we usually don’t play it’s round him.
And now that I typed a novel...
My UO...I don’t get “gender (sex) disappointment”. I can understand people saying that we’re hoping for one sex and we’re a bit shocked or sad when they found out if was the other. However, when people cry or shut down because of the sex of their kid, I think it’s dumb. If your baby is healthy that’s all that matters.
I truly believe you are meant to get what you get. If that's all 4 boys or 3 girls in a row....just embrace it!
Relatedly, I think the “why can’t we all just get along” mentality is sometimes similar to colorblindness or saying “All lives matter.” It ignores the ongoing targeted violence against certain communities. It assumes that the experience of safety and neighborly good will is universal and not related to privilege (often white privilege.
I haven’t been nearly articulate enough in this post, so I’m going to also look for an article that I think expresses what I’m trying to say.
Going to a session this afternoon with women at work to talk about equality in our workplace given some of the recent drama that was blasted by the news. Had a similar conversation with my boss about how we need to ensure all people are represented and recognized equally, but that we have to shine the light on where the significant issue is first so as not to mute/damper the entire situation from the beginning. It's been so interesting to hear everyone's perspectives.
Looking forward to the session, but I'm anticipating it being intense.