Chartstalk/Questions Week Of 10/9

SkilledSailor · October 2017

This is a thread where anyone can feel free to request a chart stalk, second-guess FF's interpretation, or post TTC-related questions, regardless of where in your cycle you are. Sometimes FF is wrong. That's where we come in. Get your second opinion here!

Image: https://media.giphy.com/media/3TDY96Q2aX8m4/giphy.gif

SkilledSailor · October 2017

Yet another selfishly started CS/Q thread.

I'm going into month/cycle 6 of TTC. My doctor said after 6 months we could start testing. So I have a couple of questions. Do I go ahead and set up appointments for month 7 and hope I can cancel them or do I wait until the 6th cycle was officially unsuccessful? The reason I can be tested at 6 months is because of known potential issues (ovarian cysts and uterine fibroids). Other than a blood test to check hormone levels for PCOS, is there other testing I should be requesting or looking out for? I've been ovulating on my own according to my temps, which is the main issue with PCOS I thought. So should I even bother with the testing this early and just wait until the year mark?

Gold star to anyone who read all of my rambling!

adirat · October 2017

@SkilledSailor I don't think it's a problem to do some bloodwork for PCOS and an ultrasound (or other scan) for fibroids with your existing doctor, but if either comes back positive, or if they both are negative but you still aren't getting pregnant, make sure you go to a reproductive endocrinologist for further treatment. I highly recommend against fertility treatment with your gynecologist if you have a fertility problem -- they are trained for other things and they don't have the specialization to provide a full work-up. I started with my gynecologist, who is great, and after a couple things came back she essentially said, "I can't find your problem, and other than giving you progesterone, I don't know what the best treatment is." My RE found my diagnosis and it's something a gynecologist never would have tested for.

Also, please remember that half of fertility problems are male factor, so even if you have some issues, get your partner checked too!

millpe · October 2017

@SkilledSailor I agree with everything @adirat said above. There is no RE in my town so I did initial testing with my OB that "specializes" in IF. Our tests show male factor IF, so DH was referred to a urologist. So I definitely agree that your H needs to get checked out as well.

adirat · October 2017

@SkilledSailor This older thread may be helpful:

https://forums.thebump.com/discussion/12694676/fertility-testing-q-a/p1

SkilledSailor · October 2017

@adirat @mrsmiller8588 Thank you ladies for the advice! And thank you for sharing that thread! I’ll be reading it ASAP.

jrm_14 · October 2017

@SkilledSailor. I’m in a similar place. We are cycle 6 (5+1ntnp) but month 4. Clearly my cycles are short. My PCP/women’s health doctor said testing at 6 months due to other known existing issues. MH will be requesting a SA at month 6. I have an appt later this month to go from there. With a prior known conditions, I made the appt to get a referral knowing I could cancel it. Thinking about if I needed it and had to wait another month to get in, I’d rather do that than wait.
ETA: and by testing, I mean redoing all regular reproductive labs for an update and reassessing my known issues.

@adirat. Thanks for the link! Super helpful!

josie12367 · October 2017

@SkilledSailor I don't think there's any harm in getting the process started now since you know you have a couple of diagnoses which could be causing issues. Getting an appointment might take awhile. I know my office is always booking a month out. The testing process can be lontg and drawn out, and delayed by certain tests needing to be done at specific times. I personally did initial testing through my OBGYN because I had to (bloodwork, SA, HSG, and ultrasounds), but if you can get in with an RE sooner than later, I would. The hormone issues alone of PCOS really make it an RE's nitch for evaluating. I honestly think that if I need to do all that again, I'll start at six months and pay OOP for an RE from the start.

LaceyBee522 · October 2017

Hi chart experts! Any thoughts on that big dip on day 22? I know my chart is a hot mess, but I just keep staring at it hoping it is an “implantation dip.”

josie12367 · October 2017

@LaceyBee522 I've seen some ladies mention that there might be an estrogen spike around that time which causes a dip, and then sometimes fertile CM to reappear...more knowledgeable folks well have to verify this....

But really some ladies have dips every cycle, some just random cycles, and some never at all. You can search FF and see that there are plenty of pregnancy charts with no implantation dip...

So, long story short...It could be something, it could be nothing. You'll have to wait and see

LaceyBee522 · October 2017

@josie12367 Thanks! That’s about what I figured. I’m just SS like a MFer tonight.

offtoneverland · October 2017

@LaceyBee522 100% agree with @josie12367. Unfortunately there's just know way to know what it is until you either get a positive test or AF shows up. Now's the part where you just have to be patient and distract yourself for a couple of days. (Easier said than done.)

LaceyBee522 · October 2017

@offtoneverland Oh shit! Did I just break board rules by asking about this? (ie asking if I’m preggo in a roundabout way??) If so, my profuse apologies!!!

offtoneverland · October 2017

@LaceyBee522 No, I don't think so. If you had asked if the dip meant you were KU, then it would have been. But you just asked what the dip might mean, which I don't think was wrong since it could mean anything. But I haven't been around here long, so maybe others will chime in.

mygoodlucycat · October 2017

Hm, OK. So here is my chart as recc'd by ff

Here it is the way that makes sense to me

Couple observations I've made - I'm starting to test OPK way too early, I need to wait until at least CD 10 and probably start HIO days 13-17ish. My timing was not great this month but at least I got one in good timing. Which leads me to a question - so we have a 20% shot to get preggers per month - is that like overall? With perfect timing? Anyone know? I know it doesn't really matter, I'm either pregnant or I'm not and it's way too early to know right now. It also seems like my cycle is a little wonky (or is it?) that the build up to O is long and then my LP is kind of short? I say that because some cycles I'm getting AF on CD25 (although one month it was CD31). It seems I've (at least for the last 2 months had O on day 15-16. This has all been very interesting to me.

Any thoughts?

LaceyBee522 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycat I’m not a chart expert, so I will leave that to others. However, re 20%, it is my understanding that it means overall. Like, you don’t jump up to 60% chance if you jump it out 3 times instead of 1.

lulu1180 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycat First of all, what are the open circles for CD 14-17? Second, FF will give you CHs after 3 days of elevated temps. Today may be O and you may see a spike tomorrow morning. A lot of people O the day after the last +OPK. I would keep HIO and charting and see if you get a temp spike.

The 20% is per cycle regardless of timing (as long as you hit FW). I've seen grads with timing of only -5 although most people do hit somewhere between -2 and O which are the days that generally give you your best chances. Also, there is nothing out there that indicates a long FP causes any kind of issues, every woman's cycle is different, I know there are quite a few people who don't O until later in their cycle. Also, if I remember right this if your first month temping so what makes you think you have a short LP? Your LP most likely stays the same length every cycle regardless of when O is, so if you O later than your cycle will be longer.

mygoodlucycat · October 2017

@LaceyBee522 I'm no math expert but I did know that much! Otherwise we'd all be KtheFU! I more mean, is it 20% for folks with great timing or just 20% regardless (whether you HIO a lot or just like once).

@lulu1180 Thank you for your reply - I have NO IDEA what the open circles mean. I had some erratic sleeping like most of those days so maybe that is why? Also, yes it is my first month temping - I thought LP was the time between O and AF/Pregnancy?

lulu1180 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycat yes, LP is the time after O and before AF or a BFP. For most people it stays the same length regardless of when you O.

Here is some info on open circles https://www.fertilityfriend.com/Faqs/Open-circles-on-chart.html. FF doesn't know you had restless or erratic sleep unless you tell it. If you haven't yet, I would look at taking the charting course that FF offers as it has a wealth of information.

josie12367 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycatSo your open circles are due to when you are temping. You have to temp I think within a thirty minute time frame, or you'll get an open circle. To help with this I set my alarm for the same time everyday for temping, even on the weekends. If I don't have to get up, then I just roll over and go back to bed. You will notice that your temp will steadily rise the later in the morning it gets, so there might be a marked difference between 4am and 6am by .5 degree....which is crucial when FF is looking for temp rises already. Try taking your temps at the same time everyday, and the open circles should disappear. If you're just inputting the data at different times, but taking your temp consistently at the same time, you can manually adjust the time in the data section

LaceyBee522 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycat Lol! Sorry! In that case, I think @josie12367 covered it. FWIW regarding the open circles, I get those too when I don’t temp at my 6 AM alarm. Because of that, I’m going to move my temp time up to 5:20 next cycle, in order to hopefully have less issues.

darkstar42 · October 2017

@SkilledSailor I know I'm late to the party here, but as someone going through testing I'd be happy to chat over pm about which tests were done, etc. I did my initial testing with my ob/gyn and will follow up with an RE next week. One thing to be aware of is that not all REs will accept testing done by your ob. You don't want to have to pay twice, so this can be good to check on before you have anything done. I also second (third?) the advice to have YH checked soon.

zwink1 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycat, what makes you think your cycle is wonky. Is there some sort of back history there that leads you to believe that, other than what you've mentioned about CD25 v CD31? @lulu1180 gave some great LP info and the other ladies provided some good guidance regarding FF and Your open circles.

Your FP can vary and does for many women month to month. Some women notice that their FP changes depending on which ovary is ovulating that month. It's pretty hard to have a clear understanding of your cycles until you've been charting them for a few months. But, "normal" is considered a ~28-35 day cycle with a ~10-16 day LP. Obviously, those are pretty big ranges and given the info you've provided so far, it looks like you're within the normal ranges, so not wonky.

mygoodlucycat · October 2017

@zwink1 Nope, no other history, just learning so much about my body now with ff. It's pretty cool!
@josie12367 and @LaceyBee522 Thank you for your reply - I def am struggling with temping at the same time. In part because *tw* I have a toddler who sometimes gets up at 5 and sometimes sleeps at 7.*tw* I'm one of those people that when up, it UP and can't go back to sleep and at this point I am not ready to just get up at 5 every day.
@lulu1180 Thank you! I'll check that out.

lulu1180 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycat I know it sucks getting up earlier than you want to but if you want an accurate chart (and accurately predicted O) I would suggest setting that alarm and just dealing with it to be quite honest. When I'm not TTA if I know it might be an important temp (either just before O or one of the 3 temps needed to get CHs) I would set an alarm and wake up to temp on Saturday and/or Sunday to make sure the data I had was as accurate as I could get it so I knew I was timing sex right. I've even set an alarm and temped while at my in-laws for an extended weekend to catch O.

LaceyBee522 · October 2017

@mygoodlucycat I used to be exactly like you. When I'm up, I'm up. However, after a couple of months of waking up early to temp, my body has gotten used to it and I go right back to sleep (unless I have to be up, obv.). One morning last week, I fell back asleep with the thermometer still in my mouth. Thank goodness for those four beeps at the end!

Alternatively, I have the Ava bracelet. I've read a lot of folks refer to it as a very pricey thermometer. It measures your skin temp, so you could try using that instead of your BBT to see if you can find any patterns. You don't have to wake up at any certain time to use it, you just have to get 4 hours of sleep. And there are some cycle restrictions (i.e. can't be less than 24 day cycle or more than 35 - or something like that). FWIW, a lot of the women I've chatted with who have it are *TW* moms of toddlers and can't do the regular BBT temping because of their child's erratic sleep schedule *End TW*.

Avrilmai · October 2017

does anyone know if getting a flu shot can impact BBT? either evidence based or anecdotal? I had a big temp spike this AM, got my flu shot yesterday and can't think of any other reason.

lulu1180 · October 2017

@Avrilmai I think that happened to someone on the board last year. I did also find these threads where the same thing happened
https://forums.thebump.com/discussion/12648360/flu-shot-and-temping
https://forums.thebump.com/discussion/8691030/flu-shot-temp-spike

Avrilmai · October 2017

@lulu1180 thanks...and i'm slightly embarrassed that I didn't even think to search for it...
Image result for hangs head in shame gif

mygoodlucycat · October 2017

@lulu1180 and @LaceyBee522
Thanks ladies. Next month! 6AM! I'll do it. It's certainly worth it.

lulu1180 · October 2017

lol It's all good @Avrilmai! I only searched because like I said I think it came up last year (one of the very small advantages to being around for so long) and wanted to see if I could find it. Otherwise I'm not sure I would've thought of it!

@mygoodlucycat I agree that it is worth it, especially if you like having reliable data like me!

canucklehead123 · October 2017

@Avrilmai I don't know for sure, but if I were a betting woman, I'd place money on yes, a flu shot would cause a temp spike!

br0co1ii · October 2017

Okay ladies. I got a Mabis from Amazon, and I could not get it to recall the last temp. I complained, and they sent me a new one today. Same thing. I'm not sure if I'm doing something wrong, or if I'm actually getting bad thermometers. Here's what's happening:

Turn on, wait for beep, take temp. Turn off.
Then: turn on, shows 188.88, then 97.70, then lo.

It never shows previous temp, no matter what I do. Is it me? I kind of need to start temping right away since it's cd8, and I don't want to miss the shift.

nitnat007 · October 2017

@br0co1ii I personally don't use the recall function because mine does the same thing. I look at the temp and remember it for when I do actually get up and enter it into FF.

Hopefully one of the other ladies knows the secret to making it work.

spottedginger · October 2017

@br0co1ii my old mabis beeped as I turned it on and then at the end of taking the temp. So if you are waiting for the beep and then putting it in your mouth, it is already done measuring. So there wouldn’t be a legitimate recall temp for it to show (room temp is too low and wouldn’t register). Try placing it under your tongue and then turning it on.

Avrilmai · October 2017

@br0co1ii this may be a silly question, but when you say "take temp" are you waiting for the series of beeps to indicate it has reached a temp? and Are you allowing it to go "off" on its own or pushing the button to turn it off?

I use a mabis, but I have not had this particular issue. So, I'll just tell you what I tend to do. I don't typically turn my off, but i turn it on, wait for the Lo, take my temp (waiting for the beeps to indicate temp has been reached) and then I will typically look at the temp and then just put it on the night stand. the thermometer typically turns off in a few minutes (indicated by beeping) and I can go back later and review the temp if I can't seem to remember it. So maybe it is the act of pushing the button and turning if "off" that is causing the problem? Not sure if that was helpful, but maybe try it that way and see if it makes a difference?

nimmle · October 2017

Might be a TMI warning buuuuuut....Does anyone else have EWCM that just doesn't stop? This cycle has been real bizarre. I had loads of fertile CM from CD 15 - 24. Then it sorta dried up but not really. Now I've had EWCM every day from CD30 - 38. FF says I O'd on CD33. I would have expected it to dry up by now if I O'd. I guess I should be DTD just in case?

I might be a bit ornery because I am not on my last panty liner and have to go buy more but come on

emmasemm · October 2017

Does anyone have experience of cramps that are like a stabbing pain on one side for a couple of days - I say stabbing, it's more like someone is poking my left ovary with a sharp needle every 20 minutes or so a few times. Has happened for two days, not extreme, annoying and off putting when it happens, a little bit of radiating into my shoulder but not always. I don't normally have any repetitive cramping in my cycle- the odd twinge at the start of AF and again at ovulation. I'm now CD7.

I have the follow up with my RE tomorrow afternoon so will ask - but should I push for him to check anything in particular? Does anyone have experience of cysts or blockages, fibroids or endometriosis giving these kind of symptoms? So far I've had none of these. But a little concerned of ovary or fallopioan tube damage from ER or I don't know...

PS definitely not KU as had negative beta last week at 14dpt, so not an ectopic.

SkilledSailor · October 2017

@emmasemm It does sound like my cyst pain but mine has never radiated outside of the abdomen area. I feel it most like that around ovulation but it occasionally happens other times. Hopefully it's nothing or an easy fix. GL! Keep us posted please!

adirat · October 2017

@emmasemm I had that in college, EXACTLY what you are describing, and it was a large ovarian cyst. I was shocked at how painful an ovarian cyst can be and how far the pain can radiate. I went on a different brand of birth control pills and the cyst was gone by my 8 week follow up ultrasound.

You may have seen in the IF thread that at my cd2 u/s this morning they saw an ovarian cyst today. Apparently ovarian cysts are relatively common after ivf stims/retrieval. I hope that's all it is for you! They should be able to see it on ultrasound.

br0co1ii · October 2017

@spottedginger and @Avrilmai it makes a ready beep and then I temp, and then it beeps that it's done.
I'll try to turn it on when it's in my mouth to see if that helps. Otherwise, it looks like I'm going to have to actually look at it like @nitnat007 does.

Thanks for the feedback!

Want a personalized experience?

Chartstalk/Questions Week Of 10/9

Re: Chartstalk/Questions Week Of 10/9

Choose Another Board

Search Boards