Babies: 6 - 9 Months
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At my wits end!!!!

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Re: At my wits end!!!!

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    @Kdeanda Thanks for your suggestions. Just an update for everyone who's been following, I'm making a doctors appointment tomorrow to see someone. I'm suffering from severe PPD I guess and obviously, with all this not helping, it's getting so much worse. I feel like the worst mother in the world. I'm typing this crying and I can't make anything better. I'm missing out on these amazing times in his life because I can't sleep and keep it together. I feel so helpless. Last night he only slept about 2 hours because he refused to go in his crib. We ended up cosleeping around 7am on the floor in the living room. I knew motherhood was hard but I didn't think it would be anything like this. I don't mean to be a Debbie downer I'm just so lost :'(
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    Big hugs. I actually made a chiropractor appt for my little man. A few of my friends swear by it, so we'll see.

    Talking to your dr is the best thing to do. Take care of yourself. Do you have any family that would keep LO for a few hours or even over night so you can get a break?
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    I'm very fortunate that I have my mom here who helps me when I need it and my husband helps a lot, too. Good luck at the chiropractor. Keep me posted!
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    I wish I could help more! You are definitely NOT the worst mother in the world!!! Look at everything you have done to help your LO!!! You are an amazing woman, mother, and wife! Your family is lucky to have you! Stay positive!! We are all rooting for you!!!
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    BBoyd2013 said:
    @melissa11015 Yeah we tried those in the beginning but he hated it. Along with the rock n play, bouncing seats, car seats ha-ha. Anything that didn't involve him being held was a scream fest lol. This sounds so crazy. I know that me listening to all those blogs on the internet about you shouldn't let your baby cry and things like that didn't help him any. I never let him even fuss because I read that it can lead to the feeling of abandonment so I basically grabbed him the moment his face started squishing up. That mixed with just his personality is probably why we are in the predicament we're in. I know it won't last forever, it just makes me feel like a incompetent mom because my baby won't sleep the way all my friends babies sleep. The good news is he takes good naps in the crib (2/1 hr naps and then sometimes a cat nap). So at least that's something!!

    Some babies are just high-needs at night and require the extra attention. I wouldn't let him CIO (I know that its unpopular to be so anti-CIO). At this point he has a need and meeting it is the way to go IMHO. Your baby's sleeping, eating or behavioral temperament is really beyond your control (as you are discovering).

    Nothing makes me more ragey than someone equating babies with different needs as "bad babies" and their mothers somehow failures. Its really nothing anyone can control, and so its best to leave the qualifiers out of it. Bottom line, your kid needs to be rocked a ton. That's just what he needs. It WILL pass.

    DS (now 2) required nursing up to 20 times a night until he hit around 8 months. No joke it was constant and I felt like tearing my hair out. He would sleep just fine. It was just the need to be constantly on the boob. I just went with it. Cried my tears and drank my coffee. Eventually, around 9 months old and a year we just BOOM snapped out of it.

    He still wakes occasionally (I think our most recently has been during sickness, around 4 times a night) and I still roll with it. I know its hard and I've been where you are. I'm so sorry. Its just the way it is for some of us.

    You aren't a bad mother, you are NOT spoiling your kid. You are meeting their needs and doing your best. That is what a good mother does. I always say you can go wrong letting a kid scream himself to sleep-- but you can never go wrong doing what they need. Hang in there.


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    BBoyd2013 said:
    @Kdeanda Thanks for your suggestions. Just an update for everyone who's been following, I'm making a doctors appointment tomorrow to see someone. I'm suffering from severe PPD I guess and obviously, with all this not helping, it's getting so much worse. I feel like the worst mother in the world. I'm typing this crying and I can't make anything better. I'm missing out on these amazing times in his life because I can't sleep and keep it together. I feel so helpless. Last night he only slept about 2 hours because he refused to go in his crib. We ended up cosleeping around 7am on the floor in the living room. I knew motherhood was hard but I didn't think it would be anything like this. I don't mean to be a Debbie downer I'm just so lost :'(
    HUGE SQUISHY HUGS, hun. Really, I understand and you are a great mother. A bad mother wouldn't care. A bad mother would just say fuck it and let their kid go without. You are trying and as long as you keep trying you are a wonderful mother.


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    @PrimRoseMama I really appreciate your input but I'll be honest with you, I truly feel that what you are saying is right for some but not everyone and not for every baby. The past 2 nights we have done straight CIO and he cried for all of 20 minutes and slept straight through (he woke briefly but went right back to sleep). I woke up not feeling like I was going to have to be committed and he woke up with a smile on his face. In fact, I had to wake him up yesterday because he was sleeping so soundly. It was so beautiful. We played, I ate (like really ate because when I'm as tired and stressed as I was I'm not hungry I'm 5'8 and currently weigh 116lbs), he ate during the day instead of eating all night long, he took good naps, and I didn't lose my patience due to extreme exhaustion. I know that a lot of people don't agree with CIO but a lot of people don't agree with bedsharing either and there's just as much if not more evidence against that than there is against CIO. Although, I feel if one works better for you and your baby then you should do that. Be it bedsharing, CIO, breastfeeding, ff, rice cereal, purees, real food, whatever. Anyway, I'd love to rock my baby back to sleep every 45 minutes but that's not good for him or me and I'm a good mom no matter what I do as long as I'm doing it out of love. And believe me, I am.
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    @PrimRoseMama I reread that and I hope you don't think I was being rude. I really do appreciate your input and we are all just doing the best we can :)
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    BBoyd2013 said:
    @PrimRoseMama I really appreciate your input but I'll be honest with you, I truly feel that what you are saying is right for some but not everyone and not for every baby. The past 2 nights we have done straight CIO and he cried for all of 20 minutes and slept straight through (he woke briefly but went right back to sleep). I woke up not feeling like I was going to have to be committed and he woke up with a smile on his face. In fact, I had to wake him up yesterday because he was sleeping so soundly. It was so beautiful. We played, I ate (like really ate because when I'm as tired and stressed as I was I'm not hungry I'm 5'8 and currently weigh 116lbs), he ate during the day instead of eating all night long, he took good naps, and I didn't lose my patience due to extreme exhaustion. I know that a lot of people don't agree with CIO but a lot of people don't agree with bedsharing either and there's just as much if not more evidence against that than there is against CIO. Although, I feel if one works better for you and your baby then you should do that. Be it bedsharing, CIO, breastfeeding, ff, rice cereal, purees, real food, whatever. Anyway, I'd love to rock my baby back to sleep every 45 minutes but that's not good for him or me and I'm a good mom no matter what I do as long as I'm doing it out of love. And believe me, I am.

    Not bitchy at all. However, I will politely disagree with you about the effects on CIO and attachment, cortisol levels and brain chemistry. I am against it from all my readings, the sleep experts I consulted and psychologists. I'm not saying its a horror, but that given its' effects I'd rather not use it. Some still choose to, and that is ok. I am just vehemently against it because attachment disorders are kind of a study of mine. I can't really put it in the same category as feeding disagreements or even sleeping arrangements. It is its own beast all together, but I am really not out to shame anyone about the use of CIO. I'm simply stating why I am very much against it for myself. I believe in meeting needs and that can never fail.

    I think good mothers understand that they are there for their kids needs and while I understand why you would do CIO in your situation-- I don't really agree with it. It doesn't really matter, though. You need to do what you need to do. Please understand though that once you CIO you will have to do it again in the future. Its not a permanent fix. The more you do it, the more attachment can suffer and trust. Its documented. However, you do you and you be confident in you. if this is the only way you can stay sane then I say go for it. In the end I don't have to pay any doctor's, psychologist or any other bill for you. I don't have to worry about job performance and sanity-- you do.

    So, I understand why some do it. The lady I nanny for does it and I have done it at her request (not my baby, therefore not my rules. I even kept my feelings to myself!) with her daughter. So I understand for some its necessary. I just can't do it for my kids given my research and my personal feelings about it.

    Again, if you have to do it then do-- but I always feel for moms that have to do it. Its not easy on anyone. Good luck.


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    Oh @PrimRoseMama I love you, I truly do but GEEZ! This poor OP is struggling hard core. She doesn't need the CIO speech.

    OP, CIO WILL NOT HAVE LONG TERM EFFECTS ON YOUR CHILD. People go SO COMPLETELY overboard on this fucking topic and it's so exhausting to read. What you do for your child when it comes to sleep has ZERO to do with anyone else so I don't know why other people care so much.This is YOUR child so do what you want. Besides blatantly neglecting your baby, nothing you do with sleep training is going to harm them or affect the person they become when they are older. NOTHING.

    Damn. It's just sleep training and they won't remember any of this!!! This is so minor in the big scheme of things. Truly.

    And I hope you get some help for PPD. I've been there and experienced it with both kids and it's really hard but be strong. You'll get through this. Parenting is nothing like we all thought before we had kids.

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    BBoyd2013 said:
    @Kdeanda Thanks for your suggestions. Just an update for everyone who's been following, I'm making a doctors appointment tomorrow to see someone. I'm suffering from severe PPD I guess and obviously, with all this not helping, it's getting so much worse. I feel like the worst mother in the world. I'm typing this crying and I can't make anything better. I'm missing out on these amazing times in his life because I can't sleep and keep it together. I feel so helpless. Last night he only slept about 2 hours because he refused to go in his crib. We ended up cosleeping around 7am on the floor in the living room. I knew motherhood was hard but I didn't think it would be anything like this. I don't mean to be a Debbie downer I'm just so lost :'(

    I'm sad for you because I've felt the way you are describing. Did you make the appointment??
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    BBoyd2013 said:

    @PrimRoseMama I really appreciate your input but I'll be honest with you, I truly feel that what you are saying is right for some but not everyone and not for every baby. The past 2 nights we have done straight CIO and he cried for all of 20 minutes and slept straight through (he woke briefly but went right back to sleep). I woke up not feeling like I was going to have to be committed and he woke up with a smile on his face. In fact, I had to wake him up yesterday because he was sleeping so soundly. It was so beautiful. We played, I ate (like really ate because when I'm as tired and stressed as I was I'm not hungry I'm 5'8 and currently weigh 116lbs), he ate during the day instead of eating all night long, he took good naps, and I didn't lose my patience due to extreme exhaustion. I know that a lot of people don't agree with CIO but a lot of people don't agree with bedsharing either and there's just as much if not more evidence against that than there is against CIO. Although, I feel if one works better for you and your baby then you should do that. Be it bedsharing, CIO, breastfeeding, ff, rice cereal, purees, real food, whatever. Anyway, I'd love to rock my baby back to sleep every 45 minutes but that's not good for him or me and I'm a good mom no matter what I do as long as I'm doing it out of love. And believe me, I am.

    YAY!!!! SO HAPPY FOR YOU!!! I hope it continues! I can't tell you how happy I am for you!!! We actually did CIO the other night...per pediatrician because LO has been waking in middle of the night for 2 or more hours and that's not really great when we have to get up @ 5am for work the next day. He fussed...not even really cried...for 10min for the last 2 nights and went right back to sleep, sleeping until 5am! It was great! We were going in right away to try to get him back to sleep while he was still groggy but he was getting so excited to see us that he was like, "yay! Time to party!" So he'd be up for 2 or more hours.
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    @Bigboobsmcgee Yes, I went and saw my OBGYN a couple days ago. We have given CIO a 2nd try and it's been going well the past 4 nights. He fussed for a about 20 minutes but that was it and things have been so much better. Things may change tomorrow but for now we're all enjoying our rest :)
    @melissa11015 I'm glad you guys got everything worked back out. Our pediatrician, too, was the one who originally recommended this method. We didn't really plan it out this time, I had just had a few consecutive nights of only 2 hours or less of sleep and I just couldn't do it after he woke up for the 3rd time in about 2 hours. Surprisingly it was short and he went out and stayed out for a long time. I kept having to go in and check on him because I wasn't use to him sleeping that long! Lol

    AND what a difference in my sons behavior when he's had a full night's sleep! He looked and acted constantly overtired before and now he's actually calmer (he's high energy anyway) but we actually got to cuddle and he wasn't squirming to get out of my arms! I'm hoping this isn't a fluke but for now we're all catching up on much needed sleep :D
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    That's so great! I hope it continues!
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    @Bigboobsmcgee I just read both your comments, I was trying to read too quickly this morning and missed the first one. I've done research and read all the books but for us, what it boils down to, is sanity. You and I know that sleep won't make PPD go away but it definitely helps. I have noticed a HUGE difference in just the last couple days. We went to the zoo today!! Lol anyway, thanks for your support and I'm sorry you've had to struggle with this, too. It's rough stuff.
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    @BBoyd2013 : I am so glad your family is getting more rest!  
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    How's it going?? Still sleeping???
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    @melissa11015 Well, I'll say it's loads better than it was. We've had a few rough nights but nothing like before. He is an amazingly stubborn little guy lol but all in all still good :) how's your LO doing in daycare? Getting used to it now and having fun?
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    I'm so glad it's gotten better!! He's getting there. I know what you mean by stubborn! It's still not perfect but when I picked him up on Wednesday, he wasn't crying and his facE wasn't blotchy so there's been some improvement.
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    Could you put a mattress on the floor and sleep with him on it (or get one of those cosleeper mattress things on amazon) then you could just sleep while he breastfeeds without worrying about him falling off the bed? I recently had to wean for other reasons and I thought it would help my sleep since my husband can feed him now bit I'm still the one that hears him first so I end up having to nudge my husband to go get a bottle. It's a little better since you can go back to sleep but I still feel like I'm not getting normal sleep. I'm sorry you have to deal with this. Good luck mama! I-)
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    @febmom4 We tried that actually. We cleaned out his entire room to make it safe in case he decided to explore in the middle of the night lol but it just didn't work out. He still woke up and wanted me to rock him back to sleep then nurse as well. We have been actually doing better lately although last night was another all nighter but he's teething now (one just broke through the gum) so I'm sure we're in for another ride lol. The only thing that stays the same is that everything changes, I guess lol. Hope you get some better rest, too!
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    How is his daytime sleep? Can you post a daytime schedule? My LO is a brutal sleeper as well I feel your pain momma! I know how totally frustrating this can be. If my LO has good naps she sleeps way better at night. Sleep begets sleep, tricky part is getting sleep in the first part! How long are his wake times during the day? Is the room black out? My room has to be totally black in order for my LO to sleep. Have you tried wearing him in a carrier at all? Mine seems to sleep in there, and although its inconvenient at least you can do something (grocery shop or whatever) and they sleep. Also, I have read that being in the carrier helps them sleep better, so maybe wear him for a half hour before starting bedtime routine? Do you have a sleep/bedtime routine? Mine also really needs this as she does not wind down easily. 
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    The white noise machine is magical and works for our little one! She's a little over 7 months. She must have her pacifier and has now learned to put it back in her mouth when it falls out. I'm sorry this is happening to you!

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    You said your breastfeeding? When he wakes he wants to feed?? if so, why not try to bottle feed the breastmilk. He may not be getting enough milk at the breast. I started with breastfeeding but then just started the pumping and bottle feed. I know exactly how much she's getting.

    Did you try pacifier? Does he just want to suck??

    Music?

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    I didn't read all the other responses so if this was said already, my apologies.  You sound EXACTLY like me.  I even went to my son's pediatrician b/c I was losing it.  He suggested a 3 fold approach- try introducing solids (son was about 5 months when I went to doc) to see if he was hungry, tylenol if it was teething pain or sleep training.  I tried all 3 and NOTHING worked.

    I asked my cousin's wife who is also a pediatrician and a mom of FIVE and she recommended Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child to read. A large part of the book does talk sleep training....but the biggest take away I got that (knock on wood) cleared up a lot of the mayhem in the beginning of the night was an earlier bedtime.  My son was going to sleep at 7/7:30 and would wake up 30 min-an hour later and proceed to do that pattern, maybe up to a 2 hour stretch all night- wake up, cry, i go in, repeat.  He is almost 8 months and is asleep and in his crib by 6pm.  I get a lot of shit from my in laws and others saying "it's too early!".  The book clearly states an overtired baby does not sleep well and you have to get them to bed before they are exhausted.  Im in teething hell now so its not all rainbows and sunshine BUT we kept inching his bedtime back and for now, 6 seems to the magic hour.  He sleeps, most nights, from 6am until at least 2 or 3, and I feed him, change him, and he's back to bed for a few hours.

    Not sure if this will work but maybe try bumping back bedtime by 20 min each time?  Not sure about you, but my guy cried buckets at night and that has subsided.  Trust me, it's not fixed 100% but the early bedtime was the only thing that got him to stop waking so much.  Screw the haters that say it's too earlier, if my kid needs sleep than sleep he will get!  Good luck!
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    I didn't read all the other responses so if this was said already, my apologies.  You sound EXACTLY like me.  I even went to my son's pediatrician b/c I was losing it.  He suggested a 3 fold approach- try introducing solids (son was about 5 months when I went to doc) to see if he was hungry, tylenol if it was teething pain or sleep training.  I tried all 3 and NOTHING worked.

    I asked my cousin's wife who is also a pediatrician and a mom of FIVE and she recommended Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child to read. A large part of the book does talk sleep training....but the biggest take away I got that (knock on wood) cleared up a lot of the mayhem in the beginning of the night was an earlier bedtime.  My son was going to sleep at 7/7:30 and would wake up 30 min-an hour later and proceed to do that pattern, maybe up to a 2 hour stretch all night- wake up, cry, i go in, repeat.  He is almost 8 months and is asleep and in his crib by 6pm.  I get a lot of shit from my in laws and others saying "it's too early!".  The book clearly states an overtired baby does not sleep well and you have to get them to bed before they are exhausted.  Im in teething hell now so its not all rainbows and sunshine BUT we kept inching his bedtime back and for now, 6 seems to the magic hour.  He sleeps, most nights, from 6am until at least 2 or 3, and I feed him, change him, and he's back to bed for a few hours.

    Not sure if this will work but maybe try bumping back bedtime by 20 min each time?  Not sure about you, but my guy cried buckets at night and that has subsided.  Trust me, it's not fixed 100% but the early bedtime was the only thing that got him to stop waking so much.  Screw the haters that say it's too earlier, if my kid needs sleep than sleep he will get!  Good luck!

    Yes, yes, yes to the early bedtime. People are shocked when I say that my 1 year old goes to bed at 6:30 and yes it sucks in the evening if we want to be out doing things but an early bedtime is so much better for babies. My first child, my son had a bedtime that early as well. It just works.
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    I agree with the early bedtime. We've actually been putting him to bed much later recently and 3 nights in a row he slept through the night. From 8-6am and then to about 8:30am. He's teething hardcore right now so he's up usually about twice which is a far cry from where we were at when I originally posted this. I'd like to get us inching back the bedtime again at some point but I'm not touching anything at the moment lol.
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    BBoyd2013 said:
    We have tried everything under the sun and nothing has worked to get my 7 month old to sleep in his crib. I'm not even asking for him to sleep through the night just sleep longer than an hour because it takes 30 minutes to 2 hours to get him back down. Here's a sample of what our night looks like: 7 pm bedtime 8 wake 8:30 back down 9:00 wake 9:15 back down 10:00 wake 10:30 back down 1 am wake 1:30 back down 3:30 wake 4:00 back down 6:00-7:00 am wake for the day We've tried nursing, rocking, staying in the room but not touching, we've even tried the Ferber method (with 2 motn feeds), we've tried bedsharing, room sharing.... Nothing works!!!!!!! The only thing he wants is for me to continuously rock and nurse him the whole duration of his sleep. That isn't possible for obvious reasons. My marriage is stressed, I'm stressed, my husband is stressed, his job is at stake because he can't focus, I'm bitchy, irritated and have very low patience and now on the verge of depression. We need help!!!!!!! I breastfeed and I've seriously considered weaning in hopes of a better night sleep. The kid is 23 lbs and clearly does not need to eat every 1-2 hours throughout the night. I'm so lost and so tired of hearing, "it'll get better" because it's not getting better. This has been 7 months of this and I've yet to hear anyone have this problem to the extreme that we do. I'm losing my mind!!! He's not sick, not teething, no reflux nothing that would prevent him from sleeping. Please someone help us!!!

    This is what I experienced for the first five months. When my daughter was 5 months 1 week, we tried CIO and it worked in one night. I honestly never in one million years believed that it would work because our nights were really similar to yours and it seemed my daughter did not know how to fall asleep on her own. I held her for naps. Ever since that first night, she's been sleeping through the night and going down for naps. So, because of this, I am a big supporter of CIO/Ferber and that is what I'd recommend to you (and to everyone!) However, I know you said that you have tried it and it didn't work. If we were talking in person I'd want to know exactly what you did when you did Ferber so I could fill you in on anything that we did differently for you to try. But then maybe all babies are different and just because it worked for me doesn't mean it would work for you. It worked so well for me though that I just wanted to make sure that I gave you this reply for you to consider. 
    "It's always better when we're together." -Jack Johnson
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    @yellowdaisies84 Well with Ferber we did it for a month (4 weeks). We followed the book to a tee, setting our intervals, not too much contact when we did a check, very consistent and it worked great for 3 nights. Then he progressively woke up more and more and cried longer and longer for the following weeks. The exact opposite of what should have happened so we took a break (more for my sanity than anything else). Then, after a month break, we decided to do CIO with no checks. Again it worked well for a few nights but he woke up more and more and cried longer and longer. Come to find out he had a tooth coming in and is currently cutting his 3rd tooth so we've put CIO on hold. But, I will say that when I do go in to comfort I try to keep it brief and he usually goes back down on his own. He's currently waking 2-3 x's a night, which isn't great but much better than it was. So, that's where I'm at now. I just can't do CIO when I know he's in discomfort. He's 10 months old now and we've recently had 4 nights where he sttn completely. What did you do during teething?
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    BBoyd2013 said:
    @yellowdaisies84 Well with Ferber we did it for a month (4 weeks). We followed the book to a tee, setting our intervals, not too much contact when we did a check, very consistent and it worked great for 3 nights. Then he progressively woke up more and more and cried longer and longer for the following weeks. The exact opposite of what should have happened so we took a break (more for my sanity than anything else). Then, after a month break, we decided to do CIO with no checks. Again it worked well for a few nights but he woke up more and more and cried longer and longer. Come to find out he had a tooth coming in and is currently cutting his 3rd tooth so we've put CIO on hold. But, I will say that when I do go in to comfort I try to keep it brief and he usually goes back down on his own. He's currently waking 2-3 x's a night, which isn't great but much better than it was. So, that's where I'm at now. I just can't do CIO when I know he's in discomfort. He's 10 months old now and we've recently had 4 nights where he sttn completely. What did you do during teething?
    Well you know, I haven't gone through teething yet! So I don't know exactly what to expect during teething and I have the exact same question you just asked me- what will I do during teething? I am concerned about how big of a set-back it will be. I have been loving her current sleep schedule and really relieved that I got through the first 5 months of frequent wakings. That took a huge toll on me. But I guess I need to prepare for teething and back to frequent wakings. I'm hopeful that it won't be as bad as I'm worried it will be...please share any tips that you come across that work for you! 
    Also, as much as I LOVE CIO because it worked like a miracle for me when it felt like it could never work, I have to tell you that my baby barely cried and it made a big difference in one night. Had it not worked, I don't know that I would have stuck with it for long and I'm sure I would be much more against it. It's so hard, SO HARD, when your baby cries. 

    "It's always better when we're together." -Jack Johnson
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    I had the same problem with my son and what ended up working for us was putting a rocking chair in his room... I would feed him, rock him to bed and every time he would wake up just rock him right back to bed. It took me about two weeks and eventually I stopped rocking him back to sleep in the middle of the night but now he finally sleeps in his own room.
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    @BBoyd2013 I came across this thread and wondering if your LO is finally sleeping through the night. I have high hopes for mine as soon as he turns 1.
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    @bboyd2013 yeah I would love to hear an update on this since it has been awhile. 
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    I think I could have written this post! I totally feel you. My LO is about to be 9 months old and wakes up an hour after he goes down, wakes an hour later, sleeps for 2 hours and then starts waking up every 45 minutes to an hour after. I am about to fall apart! I have read every book on the planet, but none really have anything that I would consider "useful". I am still nursing so it's always me who gets up with him and he is still in a pack and play by our bed because I don't want him to wake up my 3.5 year old, who just started sleeping through the night herself like 2 months ago! The only way that he will go back to sleep is if I nurse him and rock him and then I have to place him down every so slowly and gently and then try and sneak back into bed like a cat burglar. I've been thinking about weaning him for the sake of better sleep and I also think out CIO which worked for a while with my daughter, until she hit the 2 year mark, but for some reason I keep chickening out. My husband has to leave for work at 6 a.m. everyday and since he is the primary source of income (i have a part time job), I don't want to wake him because I know he needs to function the next day. I know at this point with my son that its a "bad sleep association" that he needs to be nursed to sleep. He is healthy and gets plenty to eat during the day. I wish I had something helpful to contribute, but mostly I just wanted you to know that you aren't alone. Best of luck.
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