While i want to say I'm tired of hearing about the election and we should all just move on I understand that that comes from a place of pridledge that many don't get to experience right now. However, my frustration in what I've seen in the last couple of days is much hate and ugliness from HRC supporters because they feel it's justified (ie hateful things being directly sent to people who voted trump, violence, etc). Maybe it's because I live in Oregon where there have been daily riots since the election so it's more prevalent. I totally support standing up for what you believe in to see change, by all means use your voice! What I am not okay with is destruction of property, violence, disruption of very important things (ambulances were not able to get to hospitals last night because the freeways were blocked). Why not use that voice and power for good, to stand up for "the others" if those rights are threatened. Rioting two days after the elections (before he even has power) is not going to cause reform.
@L1C4gal@FlyChick@schnitz9 west of Raleigh! I love that theres a few of us. I lived within 1 hour of two moms in my last BMB back in CA and met up with one a couple times. Now the nearest one is 3 hours which makes me sad.
While i want to say I'm tired of hearing about the election and we should all just move on I understand that that comes from a place of pridledge that many don't get to experience right now. However, my frustration in what I've seen in the last couple of days is much hate and ugliness from HRC supporters because they feel it's justified (ie hateful things being directly sent to people who voted trump, violence, etc). Maybe it's because I live in Oregon where there have been daily riots since the election so it's more prevalent. I totally support standing up for what you believe in to see change, by all means use your voice! What I am not okay with is destruction of property, violence, disruption of very important things (ambulances were not able to get to hospitals last night because the freeways were blocked). Why not use that voice and power for good, to stand up for "the others" if those rights are threatened. Rioting two days after the elections (before he even has power) is not going to cause reform.
I do not condone violence or the committing of any crimes. I can't tell if your intent is to blame all HRC supporters and I won't put words in your mouth implying that it was. But I am so very sick of the more than half of the voters in this election getting blamed for the actions of a few. It's not right to say that all Trump supporters are racist and its not right to say that all HRC supporters are rioting. In America, we have the right to a peaceful protest, whether it accomplishes anything or not. (Peaceful being the key word there. Obvi.)
Oh gosh I didn't see that. My heart goes out to them.
Yes when I saw her intro I felt terrible.
i think the whole pro-life and pro-choice debate should never be black and white. There has to be a grey area. HRC never said "women should get abortions at 35 weeks because they don't want the baby." She believes that the government shouldn't have a say in decisions that are very painful and personal. It's a proven fact that a very small percent of terminations are done after 12 weeks. Also almost all of those done in 2nd tri on are for children that were wanted and for medical reason. It's very rare for a woman to walk into a clinic in the 2nd tri and say I don't want my baby get rid of it. While yea it does happen it's unbelievably rare so why do we only focus on that? Why did trump have to make those types of comments?
i understand some peoples religious beliefs and all. But I would never say I would never do something if I wasn't ever in that situation. It's very easy for someone to be on the outside looking in and say "I'm a Christian and I would carry my child to term knowing they were going to die to donate their organs." How do you know that's what you would do? Has it ever happened to you? I'm tired of hearing well it happened to a family member or a friend so I know what it's like. NO YOU DON'T. It would be like me saying "well my mom had 3 stillborn children so I know how it feels." No I don't it never happened to me. How can anyone say what they would do in that type of horrific situation if they've never experienced it. Until a doctor tells you I'm sorry but your child will die once it's born, please don't say what your decision would be. Frankly I find that offensive to anyone who's ever been in that situation.
And for for those of you who think "well I would donate my child's organs". Please for the love of God do some research on that. There are many situations that prevent you from doing that.
I get where everyone is coming from. I get why people are still outraged and lashing out, I get why people don't like hearing about it. I get why people say they voted for Trump (we're going to have to agree to disagree that it wasn't largely based out of ignorance, and btw, homie was definitely pro choice, like, months ago). I'm scared about the Supreme Court and I'm scared that our president will be having Twitter fights with world leaders. I'm scared for basically all non white men in America right now.
Only thing I don't agree with is that Bernie would have won. I'm as liberal as they come, for the most part, but I am so glad he wasn't an option. He had no realistic actionable platform, and as a Jewish person, I hated that he all but renounced his religion and his stance on Israel, which is where my family is.
While i want to say I'm tired of hearing about the election and we should all just move on I understand that that comes from a place of pridledge that many don't get to experience right now. However, my frustration in what I've seen in the last couple of days is much hate and ugliness from HRC supporters because they feel it's justified (ie hateful things being directly sent to people who voted trump, violence, etc). Maybe it's because I live in Oregon where there have been daily riots since the election so it's more prevalent. I totally support standing up for what you believe in to see change, by all means use your voice! What I am not okay with is destruction of property, violence, disruption of very important things (ambulances were not able to get to hospitals last night because the freeways were blocked). Why not use that voice and power for good, to stand up for "the others" if those rights are threatened. Rioting two days after the elections (before he even has power) is not going to cause reform.
I do not condone violence or the committing of any crimes. I can't tel if your intent is to blame all HRC supporters and I won't put words in your mouth implying that it was. But I am so very sick of the more than half of the voters in this election getting blamed for the actions of a few. It's not right to say that all Trump supporters are racist and its not right to say that all HRC supporters are rioting. In America, we have the right to a peaceful protest, whether it accomplishes anything or not. (Peaceful being the key word there. Obvi.)
Not my intention at all to blame only HRC followers. My personal experience of hate that I'm a seeing right now is HRC supporters but I know they are not the only ones voicing concerns. But it goes the other way too, it's not fair to call every person who voted for Trump racist, anti-woman, etc. Yes there were some who voted that way but for the vast majority that I know voted that way for a laundry list of other reasons. I think it's Unfair that the few (on both sides) are giving a bad name to the majority.
I just wanted to pop back by to tell the ladies on here from NC I'm thinking of you with all these fires popping up! I hope none of you are near them and you stay safe!
Here's my problem with Trump supporters, and here I'm referencing specifically the ones who claim not to be racist, bigoted, etc. I've seen some say that they're just going to live their own lives as morally as possible, and that's the only responsibility they have. Everyone else should just do the same, and things will be fine. Too bad it obviously doesn't work that way, as the various hate groups have taken off with the green light that a Trump presidency has given them. And has Turmp himself rescinded their support? Reassured Americans that he doesn't agree with those actions done on his behalf? No, why would he when so many of his policies and rhetoric during his campaign went right in line with those extreme beliefs. And if you as a Trump supporter don't share those views, you better damn well reassure the rest of us that you mean that and do you part to make sure your future President knows that. If he continues to make these statements and push for hateful policies, stand up to him and tell him that isn't what you want. It's going to have to come from you and other Republicans in addition to Democrats or not much will change. Otherwise, just sitting idly by in silence because it doesn't affect your daily life and you can't see past your own nose is just making you complicit in all of this. That's why so many of us who voted for HRC are angry and upset, and we have every right to be.
Married since 8.2.08 DS born 8.11.14 BFP #2: 9.14.16, EDD: 5.24.17
Only thing I don't agree with is that Bernie would have won. I'm as liberal as they come, for the most part, but I am so glad he wasn't an option. He had no realistic actionable platform, and as a Jewish person, I hated that he all but renounced his religion and his stance on Israel, which is where my family is.
I feel like for once I was glad a politician was able to bring some light to Israel/Palestine. Not all Jews agree with what is happening there and rightfully so. Judaism does not implicitly mean that all Jews agree 100% with what is happening there and disagreeing with Israel politics and actions does not mean he has "all but renounced his religion" My husband and his family are Palestinian refugees and there's definitely multiple sides to that whole story. And none of it is clear cut. I'm glad a US politician has challenged the status quo position there that so many Americans view as anti-Semitic if you dare speak up about it.
TTC1: May 2015
Primary IF May 2016; Failed HSG; Scheduled Lap Sept. 2016
@FlyChick Also just west of Raleigh, so I have a feeling I'm very close to @pshaortao!
@laurenann89 Thanks for thinking of us! And now I feel bad that I didn't know there were fires, but
glad you mentioned it. I hope all the other NC ladies are staying safe!
@FlyChick Also just west of Raleigh, so I have a feeling I'm very close to @pshaortao!
@laurenann89 Thanks for thinking of us! And now I feel bad that I didn't know there were fires, but
glad you mentioned it. I hope all the other NC ladies are staying safe!
It's in the Lake Lure area but where I live you could see the haze from the smoke all day.
Just to clarify, I didn't just vote for him because he is pro-life. That was just one reason why I didn't vote for Hillary.
@chickyclg, my belief is that, unless there is harm that can come to the mother's life, then a baby should be carried. Now I am not going to tell anyone how to live their life. It is a very serious conversation, and if a woman and her partner or just the woman herself decides that she does does want to carry the child then that is her decision. I just know that for myself and my husband, our decision is that any child would be carried for as long as they could be. We know plenty of people who have had abortions for various reasons and we are still friends with them, but you never know the good that can come from a life no matter how short lived. Organ donation is a beautiful thing.
I'm sorry, but you do realize that this is the definition of being pro-choice, right? Did you listen to HRC's answer about abortion during the debates? She said no one should be forced to carry a fetus to term. AND no one should be forced to have an abortion, as has been the case in other countries. That is HRC valuing your unborn baby's life. She's just valuing your autonomy, too. Also, her record of fighting for chlidren is long-standing and impeccable. There are plenty of reasons to dislike her, but based on how you've written your stance on the issue, this is just not one of them.
I'm late to the party but I had to chime in. My responses:
1) If you're sick of people saying something on facebook like bellyaching over the election, then take a break from facebook. You can also hide posts and choose to see less of a person as the second step. And if you hide every post on this topic, the AI facebook will adjust the settings for you. You have autonomy. You don't have to be on facebook all of the time. Besides, the people bellyaching aren't engaging in hate speech.
2) As others said, it is a tremendous privilege to say "suck it up and get over it" or "I'm sick of hearing about it." I suppose that means you don't risk deportation (or no one close to you does), registration based on your religion, hate crimes, the loss of health insurance for your pre-existing condition, etc. To be clear, I fall into that category of being able to not care after this election because I bet my life won't be changed much personally. But I know it's a BIG fucking deal to a LOT of other people. You can get off of facebook. People of color can't unsee and unhear the things said to/about them as they walk through life, go to work/school, etc.
3) This election outcome is not like others, and the two sides are not equivalent. Democrats are not bigger crybabies to cry over this when republicans did a better job of sucking it up in 2008 and 2012 (there was whining but not really protests). Compare 2008 and 2012 to 2000 and 2004. Fine. I remember whining in 2000 and 2004 but we sucked it up and got over it. This time is different because the winning candidate literally incited violence and hate in his electorate, and normalized it. Have you not heard of the numerous incidents of racism, xenophobia, islamaphobia, and anti-Semitism that have sprung up all over the nation just in the past few days? (Or the same thing happening after the Brexit vote in the UK? We shouldn't be surprised.) It's happening in schools, too--middle school kids chanting "build a wall" or "go back home," etc. This is not "kids will be kids" bullying. At my alma mater, the black freshmen (freshmen!!) were added to a group text invite for n--- lynching day and were fed racist messages. This is highly unusual behavior following an election and most of us are concerned that it's not going to get better with time as long as Trump is in office (it hasn't gotten better post-Brexit). I'm waiting for the president-elect to say something, given his "come together" acceptance speech. I'm waiting for his wife to say something, given that she has said the one thing she wants to work on is bullying. That was her stated agenda, but I'm hearing crickets.
4) For the record, HRC won the popular vote by 670,000 votes (not 200,000), and this amounts to a difference of 1/2 a percent (0.5%), not 0.002%. Still a close margin, of course, but larger than the margin of several of the close states. Fact of the matter is that more people voted for HRC than Trump.
5) You can't defend sexual assault in one candidate by saying the other candidate's husband is "just as bad." He wasn't on the ballot. There was NO evidence she was involved in any of his shit other than being married to him.
My UO for the election: I'm not a big fan of the disaffected working class as Trump voter narrative. I mean, obviously this is a huge portion of his supporters, and they believe their motives are economic. There are some VERY, very, very, real and personal economic concerns, concerns about the industry in places like the rust belt, Appalachia, etc. But we can't ignore the fact that this election was about race and xenophobia. When you look at the exit poll data for income, Trump got the top income brackets and Clinton got the bottom ones. So it's not the "elites" voting for Clinton and the "working class" voting for Trump. Quite the contrary. Meanwhile, when you look at the racial data, white men AND women voted overwhelmingly for Trump. Everyone else voted overwhelmingly for Clinton. The data are there. We need to be willing to name this and take responsibility.
Late to the game here, but here goes. Trump as president terrifies me. I have been posting safety pins in support of my friends who are genuinely afraid of the hate they will experience during this administration (my Hispanic, African American, LGBQT, etc friends). If one more white, Christian male or female posts asking where my support of them has been, I'm going to scream. As a straight, white, Christian suburbanite, woman - we are not being targeted against! Get over it! My posts are about showing love and tolerance for all. But really, you're not the ones who need protecting right now.
Warning
No formatter is installed for the format bbhtml
Re: UO Thursday
@L1C4Gal where in NC ?
DD: 6
DS: 2
DD: 6
DS: 2
May17 Siggy Challenge
Labor
i think the whole pro-life and pro-choice debate should never be black and white. There has to be a grey area. HRC never said "women should get abortions at 35 weeks because they don't want the baby." She believes that the government shouldn't have a say in decisions that are very painful and personal. It's a proven fact that a very small percent of terminations are done after 12 weeks. Also almost all of those done in 2nd tri on are for children that were wanted and for medical reason. It's very rare for a woman to walk into a clinic in the 2nd tri and say I don't want my baby get rid of it. While yea it does happen it's unbelievably rare so why do we only focus on that? Why did trump have to make those types of comments?
i understand some peoples religious beliefs and all. But I would never say I would never do something if I wasn't ever in that situation. It's very easy for someone to be on the outside looking in and say "I'm a Christian and I would carry my child to term knowing they were going to die to donate their organs." How do you know that's what you would do? Has it ever happened to you? I'm tired of hearing well it happened to a family member or a friend so I know what it's like. NO YOU DON'T. It would be like me saying "well my mom had 3 stillborn children so I know how it feels." No I don't it never happened to me. How can anyone say what they would do in that type of horrific situation if they've never experienced it. Until a doctor tells you I'm sorry but your child will die once it's born, please don't say what your decision would be. Frankly I find that offensive to anyone who's ever been in that situation.
And for for those of you who think "well I would donate my child's organs". Please for the love of God do some research on that. There are many situations that prevent you from doing that.
Only thing I don't agree with is that Bernie would have won. I'm as liberal as they come, for the most part, but I am so glad he wasn't an option. He had no realistic actionable platform, and as a Jewish person, I hated that he all but renounced his religion and his stance on Israel, which is where my family is.
DS born 8.11.14
BFP #2: 9.14.16, EDD: 5.24.17
@laurenann89 Thanks for thinking of us! And now I feel bad that I didn't know there were fires, but glad you mentioned it. I hope all the other NC ladies are staying safe!
DD: 6
DS: 2
My responses:
1) If you're sick of people saying something on facebook like bellyaching over the election, then take a break from facebook. You can also hide posts and choose to see less of a person as the second step. And if you hide every post on this topic, the AI facebook will adjust the settings for you. You have autonomy. You don't have to be on facebook all of the time. Besides, the people bellyaching aren't engaging in hate speech.
2) As others said, it is a tremendous privilege to say "suck it up and get over it" or "I'm sick of hearing about it." I suppose that means you don't risk deportation (or no one close to you does), registration based on your religion, hate crimes, the loss of health insurance for your pre-existing condition, etc. To be clear, I fall into that category of being able to not care after this election because I bet my life won't be changed much personally. But I know it's a BIG fucking deal to a LOT of other people. You can get off of facebook. People of color can't unsee and unhear the things said to/about them as they walk through life, go to work/school, etc.
3) This election outcome is not like others, and the two sides are not equivalent. Democrats are not bigger crybabies to cry over this when republicans did a better job of sucking it up in 2008 and 2012 (there was whining but not really protests). Compare 2008 and 2012 to 2000 and 2004. Fine. I remember whining in 2000 and 2004 but we sucked it up and got over it. This time is different because the winning candidate literally incited violence and hate in his electorate, and normalized it. Have you not heard of the numerous incidents of racism, xenophobia, islamaphobia, and anti-Semitism that have sprung up all over the nation just in the past few days? (Or the same thing happening after the Brexit vote in the UK? We shouldn't be surprised.) It's happening in schools, too--middle school kids chanting "build a wall" or "go back home," etc. This is not "kids will be kids" bullying. At my alma mater, the black freshmen (freshmen!!) were added to a group text invite for n--- lynching day and were fed racist messages. This is highly unusual behavior following an election and most of us are concerned that it's not going to get better with time as long as Trump is in office (it hasn't gotten better post-Brexit). I'm waiting for the president-elect to say something, given his "come together" acceptance speech. I'm waiting for his wife to say something, given that she has said the one thing she wants to work on is bullying. That was her stated agenda, but I'm hearing crickets.
4) For the record, HRC won the popular vote by 670,000 votes (not 200,000), and this amounts to a difference of 1/2 a percent (0.5%), not 0.002%. Still a close margin, of course, but larger than the margin of several of the close states. Fact of the matter is that more people voted for HRC than Trump.
5) You can't defend sexual assault in one candidate by saying the other candidate's husband is "just as bad." He wasn't on the ballot. There was NO evidence she was involved in any of his shit other than being married to him.
My UO for the election: I'm not a big fan of the disaffected working class as Trump voter narrative. I mean, obviously this is a huge portion of his supporters, and they believe their motives are economic. There are some VERY, very, very, real and personal economic concerns, concerns about the industry in places like the rust belt, Appalachia, etc. But we can't ignore the fact that this election was about race and xenophobia. When you look at the exit poll data for income, Trump got the top income brackets and Clinton got the bottom ones. So it's not the "elites" voting for Clinton and the "working class" voting for Trump. Quite the contrary. Meanwhile, when you look at the racial data, white men AND women voted overwhelmingly for Trump. Everyone else voted overwhelmingly for Clinton. The data are there. We need to be willing to name this and take responsibility.
president terrifies me. I have been posting safety pins in support of my friends who are genuinely afraid of the hate they will experience during this administration (my Hispanic, African American, LGBQT, etc friends). If one more white, Christian male or female posts asking where my support of them has been, I'm going to scream. As a straight, white, Christian suburbanite, woman - we are not being targeted against! Get over it! My posts are about showing love and tolerance for all. But really, you're not the ones who need protecting right now.