Hello,
I'm new here, I had my first IVF cancelled last month due to risk of OHSS, I just did my first FET this past Saturday with one 5 day blastocyst transferred. Before the Embryo transfer, they showed me a picture on a screen as well as printed me a photo. When I asked my gyno about grading, he was very evasive about it, pretty much said something along the lines of "Grading is various to different places and aren't reliable, so therefore we don't grade them"-, this approach made me even more nervous- I mean, it makes me wonder what aren't they telling me? You know? So I then asked the embryologist about it and she just said= "It looks good and it's doing what it's suppose to do" and nothing else. Nothing about fragmentation, development. Nothing about anything. Curiously vague. I just want to know SOMETHING, I mean the entire process is already mysterious and doubt ridden anyway.
Okay, so since I didn't get any answers; I did my own research.... (din.. din.. diiiinnnn) I took the photo they gave me of my embryo and compared it to high grading and low graded blastocysts. Guess what? They don't look like any other blastocyst anywhere! Are they even blastocysts??! Booth poor and high quality blastocyts have a cell mass that takes up the entire "circle"- but mine is a floating mass of cells in the middle? Does it seem highly fragmented to you as well?
I have been given two picture of the same single blastocyst that was transferred. Anyone with a bit of knowledge, please let me know exactly what you think. I am aware that grading doesn't mean everything, but I still would like to know anyways?
Re: 1st FET- Being Evasive about Embryo Grading (Pics)- makes me nervous
I have to be honest in that I have no clue if your pic is good or bad. It doesn't look like mine looked like, but that's not saying much since mine didn't do anything once they were transferred! However, with an FET, the expanding process takes awhile. Perhaps these aren't expanded yet?
For our fresh vs fet, the pics looked completely different and the embryos were all graded the same. So, I wonder if that's what you're seeing here??
This being said, I would be very concerned about an office who is giving you vague info. If you aren't feeling comfortable with what you are being told, go with your gut. Keep questioning them! This is your body, your money, and your dreams. You deserve to know more. I'd call in the morning and ask more questions until you are comfortable with the answers you are getting. If they don't grade, I'd ask why. Yes, the grade isn't everything, but it would tell them something. For instance, if you continued to create poor quality embryos, depending on the day they started to look poor, they could point to if it is an egg vs. sperm issue, sometimes.
Best of luck and I hope none of this matters and your embryo is busy snuggling in as I type this!!
ttc #2 since 2004 Me (35): Stage 3 Endo, DH (34): High DNA Frag
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ET of 2 great quality embryos. + BFP on 9dp5dt. Beta #1 (10dp5dt): 257, Beta #2 (14dp5dt): 1561,
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I'm really not sure the grading means all that much, either.
***Losses mentioned.*** TTC #1 since May 2012. Me: 37, OH: 41. Ectopic August 2012 => tubal damage. Stage 1 endo removed June 2013. IVF #1 Oct/Nov 2013: Long Lupron with Gonal-F. 7R, 7M, 7F. 2 txfer@3d. Nothing frozen. => M/C @ 8 wks. Selected RPL panel all normal. Very hyper and brittle response to stims. IVF #2 (antagonist protocol) Feb 2014 => Converted to IUI (Perfect conditions). BFN. IVF #2.1 w/ new RE June 2014: Antagonist protocol. 33R, 31M, 30F, 19 blasts to test!!! I made it through without crashing!! Hats off to Dr. Fancypants!! ET of one 5AB blast. BFN. 13 10 CCS'ed snowflakes! FET #1 PUPO as of 7/29 Betas: 8/7@24, 8/9@97, 8/11@334 (etc.) Two sacs on 8/15, one seen on 8/18 after a bleed. U/s 8/25 (6+3) "perfect": 5.9 mm + HB@120bpm! U/s 9/4 (7+6): 15.9 mm + HB@172 bpm! Please, PLEASE stick this time!!!!
Thanks for your responses! I was also thinking this mustn't be a picture of a blastocyst, but some other stage.
I am also annoyed that they were so vague, seeing that they aren't protecting me from anything; the less I know the worse it seems for me, maybe not others. Not having them even roughly grade them is worse them being told they are low quality. I mean, it's expensive and I don't want to be felt like I'm having the cotton wool pulled over my eyes. It's playing on my mind.
Worse thing is feeling like your being a pain for being curious about the science behind it, that's what it felt like when I was asking about the grading. Has anyone else felt like that? That if you question or press an issue of what they are telling you- that they will do a sloppier-quick job because you annoyed them and they want you out of their fast? Lol, that's what I fear happening. That's why I don't want to press the issue too much now, it's been done.
I'm still open to any other opinions about this.
I'm sorry they were so evasive with you. What I WILL say is that I've had embryo transfers at 2 different clinics and I've seen how both clinics handle transfers very differently!
1st clinic: I sat down with RE for 20 mins before ET and we discussed the chances/odds we had... he told us the "grade" of our embryos, etc.
2nd clinic: I arrived and went back to the area where they do the transfers. About 15 mins later the emrbyologist came and brough pics of my emrbyos and explained to me how they were doing etc. but no grading at all. She was more than willing to answer any questions I had, etc. One of them looked alittle different than the other and she told me it was b/c it was a "early" blast and the other was expanded... But still not dicussion of "grade"
IMO: I'd prefer not having the grade. I feel like at my first clinic they ALWAYS told me the grade (2 transfers) and I honestly always had good embryos so my hopes were SO built up and when they didn't work I was totally devestated. I also felt better at the second clinic b/c they didn't really bias me one way or the other so the entire 2ww i felt like I had a pretty fair shot but wasn't overly confident (b/c I had such a awesome "graded" embryo) and wasn't disappointed with a negative feeling (b/c my embryos weren't of the "best" quality). Truthfully, I still get pissed when I think about how much false hope my first clinic gave me. They SWORE my emrbyos were "first round" quality and I"d be pregnant in a few days. I'm on my 4th transfer this week!! lol
Hang in there! If it makes you feel more comfortable I"d call and just ask "I wanted to just touch base and find out if my embryos were morulas or blasts when they were transferred" and go from there.
FET #1 (7/2013) - 2 embryos - BFN
FET #2 (9/2013) - 2 emrbyos - BFN
New RE. Fresh Start
IVF #2 (2/2014) - 25 Retrieved, 19 Mature, 16 Fertilized, 9 blasts.
CGH Testing: 6 Normal
FET #3 (4/2014) -1 embryo - BFP! Beta#1: 35 Beta #2: 16
FET #4 (5/2014) -1 embryo - BFP! Beta#1: 321!!! Beta #2: 727.9! 6/5/2014 Heartbeat! 144bpm It's a girl! Due January!
dx: Unexplained IF
TTC since May 2011, 1 year trying, and then 3 TI, 2 IUI = BFN
IVF #1 (May 2013): Antagonist Protocol:
24R, 18M, 15F w/ICSI; 5dt of 2 early blasts, no frosties = BFN
IVF #2 (August 2013): Lupron Stop Protocol:
28R, 23M, 15F w/ICSI; 5dt of 1 partially hatched blast, 7 frosties = BFP
EDD 5/23/14, blighted ovum (6w6d), D&C (8w6d)
FET #1 (April 2014): transferred 2 5d blasts = BFP
C.J. born 01/09/15
2012-2013: 3 Clomid cycles, 3 IUIs, all BFNs
IVF #1 January 2014: 14R/12M/9F 1 transferred, 3 frozen = BFN
FET #1 March 2014: 1 transferred = BFFN · FET #2 May 2014: 2 transferred = BFFN
IVF #2 June 2014: 24R/11M/10F 6 PGS tested: 1 normal embryo, 1 with no result
FET #3 in March 2015: 2 transferred = BFFN
Me: 32 H: 31
IVF #1 October 2013 Antagonistic Protocol with ICSI ER 10/31/13 (18R 16M 11F- 6 blasts to freeze)
ET delayed due to OHSS
FET scheduled for July 8. Delayed due to a crazy high TSH (it had been under control for YEARS!)
FET #1 8/5/14 sET BFN
A couple years ago I did FET for the same reason as you (OHSS) and transferred 2 blasts, graded 3BB and 4 AA. I posted the pics my RE showed me. When I saw them I thought they looked awful and was convinced that there was no hope of them sticking, but he explained that the freezing process can make them look funky and that it just takes a little time for them to 'reorganize' and look like fresh embryos again. Maybe that's part of the reason some people say it takes longer to get a BFP during FET than a fresh cycle? Best of luck!
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