UO Thursday!

rainbowdashh · March 2014

KrystaJ said:

ohyealovely said:

Maybe I'm the crazy one but I could care less that my living room is scattered with toys.

For us, with two dogs that chew everything, this isn't necessarily an option. I'm already used to having to quickly pick up anything that is out and pick up dog toys once or twice a day, so my routine won't change much.

I'm not saying I don't pick up the clutter, but I don't make it a priority. My dogs think anything plush is for them and I do chase them around when they run off with Winnie the Pooh. But honestly, it's not possible to pick up all day long with a toddler. And with two I'm imaging it will be that much more crazy.

kaleyandjason · March 2014

LadyMacaron said:

ohyealovely said:

Children do not ask to be born. I don't understand people who choose to have children and then say "they will adapt to my way". You made the decision to have the child, you should be doing the adapting. Maybe I'm the crazy one but I could care less that my living room is scattered with toys.

Of course we all do some adapting, but we are the adults. A little 7lb being should not make you adjust every single thing about how you live. Babies and children adapt to their environments. I'm a really active and fun person, I will play with my kids and we will be making messes outside and doing lots of crafts/cooking (I'm a BIG cook), but there are certain things we aren't going to change about the way we live. We like a clean house for one. I will not be a short order cook, and we will eat all together as a family. I will not run other people's plans by our baby's schedule, etc...I'm not saying to be inflexible in raising children, but parents in the US are WAY more into being slaves to their children than anywhere else in the world. We believe in a more parent directed way of parenting, and so we will try that. I prayed for this child for years, but I don't need to be catering to a child like they run the household.

HahahahahahahHhahahhhh! Someone is in for a rude awakening. But you are a nanny so you basically already know everything.

rainbowdashh · March 2014

LadyMacaron said:
Well, I never said we will be perfect parents. Listen, there are all kinds of different families out there, and not one is doing things better than any other, they are just different. The way I was raised in Spain is incredibly different to how most people parent here. The way people parent in France is vastly different too. I don't buy into a lot of the American style of parenting, and that's ok for me to choose that for myself. I don't need condescending "talk to me in 18 months sweety" comments, because no one has all the answers and we are all doing what we feel is best for ourselves. I am a really neat person, and that's not likely to change in 18 months. Specially not when I raised my sister, and have been taking care of kids for 7+ years. I'm not really a newbie at having kids around.

You got a little condescending first implying that American parents are slaves to their children.

All I meant by "everyone thinks they're the perfect parent until they have kids" is that people have an idea of what it's going to be like and how they're going to do things. I said no baby in my bed ever. That didn't last long. Plans change and I just think it's important to acknowledge that not everything will play out the way we imagine.

Unknown · March 2014

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flerlgirl · March 2014

LadyMacaron said:

Well, I never said we will be perfect parents. Listen, there are all kinds of different families out there, and not one is doing things better than any other, they are just different. The way I was raised in Spain is incredibly different to how most people parent here. The way people parent in France is vastly different too. I don't buy into a lot of the American style of parenting, and that's ok for me to choose that for myself. I don't need condescending "talk to me in 18 months sweety" comments, because no one has all the answers and we are all doing what we feel is best for ourselves. I am a really neat person, and that's not likely to change in 18 months. Specially not when I raised my sister, and have been taking care of kids for 7+ years. I'm not really a newbie at having kids around.

I think people are taking issue to the fact that you are coming off as a little holier-than-thou and then want to act hurt when people disagree with you. I just think that raising your own child from birth is a whole different ballgame that you can only experience to understand. I am not a messy person but there are six loads of folded laundry waiting to be put away in my bedroom because DS decided he would like to start eating laundry so I hide it and get to it when I can. I can tell him no, I can redirect him, I can take away all his toys, but he is a baby. He wants the laundry. So I hide it. Them's the breaks.

nunzchucks · March 2014

Holy shit! Toys everywhere in the adult space!!!

Pepper6 · March 2014

I think it's naive for first time parents to say how exactly they will and will not do things. It's great to have goals and idea of the direction you want to take, but from all the people I've seen become parents, you have to pick your battles and you'll probably end up doing a lot of the stuff you said you'd never do. I'm a FTM, so although I have an idea of how I want to do things, I'd like to think I have a realistic expectation that I'll be adapting those things a lot as I go.

I do think there's a balance though, but more than likely there's a big learning curve to get there. You might start out trying to keep the toys separated, and end up deciding that it's not practical, or just doesn't work for your family. That doesn't mean they run the household, it just means they are part of it and you have adapted to suit everyone's needs.

rainbowdashh · March 2014

There it is, @BrightEyes112‌. Including the paper plate from lunch my pug stole from the trash while DD is napping on me.

Unknown · March 2014

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Read247 · March 2014

All STMs+ should go post a pic of their living room NOW, AS IT IS. Please? I would love to see what I am in for.

Your wish is my command! My DS is 3 and one of his favorite things to do is dump out his entire toy box. He cleans them up, which is how we compromise and why it doesn't drive me crazy anymore. I used to clean this up 5+ times a day, plus regular housework... Yeah. Ain't nobody got time for that!

RedMar · March 2014

@LilyGracesMommy‌ - I'm getting foils and a cut as we speak!! You go for it momma!

Pepper6 · March 2014

Speaking of how you keep your house...my UO is that I HATE having company at my house. I don't like having to clean twice (before people get there, after they leave) and I just don't like being "the host" and having to entertain everyone. I especially don't like hosting overnight guests, I hate feeling like I have to be around 24/7 and not having my own space.

rainbowdashh · March 2014

Rachel5130 said:
I find it incredibly ironic that many ladies laughing at macaron are the ones who say 'If one more person tells me "oh you just wait!" I will [insert violent thought here.]'

Just saying. It is definitely possible to have kids, pets, a clean home and your sanity. You just have to pick three most of the time. I say, if you can have all four? I'm jealous.

I thought most of the women who are tired of hearing "just you wait" were FTMs?

flerlgirl · March 2014

Rachel5130 said:

I find it incredibly ironic that many ladies laughing at macaron are the ones who say 'If one more person tells me "oh you just wait!" I will [insert violent thought here.]' Just saying. It is definitely possible to have kids, pets, a clean home and your sanity. You just have to pick three most of the time. I say, if you can have all four? I'm jealous.

three... or two... or option a) everyone is alive at bedtime

steprozz · March 2014

@BrightEyes112‌ your wish is my command! this is the best it's looked all week!

eta: you can't see the pile of laundry in the corner or the the pack n play filled to the brim with toys

katekat8721 · March 2014

I totally agree with @LadyMacaron‌ re: adoption. After years of IF and heartbreak you're probably broke and desperate by that time. I would donate to that.

The other debates, keeping the house clean and all that, eh we'll be in surviva mode the first year. We're gonna play it by ear and hope for the best. I used to be such a spaz about keeping the house clean and tidy since messes stress me out, but pregnancy has knocked me on my ass so I've had to adapt. Probably a good thing for me!

katekat8721 · March 2014

My UO, coming into work with wet hair and no makeup and yoga pants makes you look less professional than those who take the time to do their hair and makeup.

I write this as my hair is still damp from this morning, my makeup is nonexistent and I'm in yoga pants. My FFFC is IDGAF about looking professional hahaha.

CindyRelluh · March 2014

shiggybop said:

LadyMacaron said:

ohyealovely said:

Children do not ask to be born. I don't understand people who choose to have children and then say "they will adapt to my way". You made the decision to have the child, you should be doing the adapting. Maybe I'm the crazy one but I could care less that my living room is scattered with toys.

Of course we all do some adapting, but we are the adults. A little 7lb being should not make you adjust every single thing about how you live. Babies and children adapt to their environments. I'm a really active and fun person, I will play with my kids and we will be making messes outside and doing lots of crafts/cooking (I'm a BIG cook), but there are certain things we aren't going to change about the way we live. We like a clean house for one. I will not be a short order cook, and we will eat all together as a family. I will not run other people's plans by our baby's schedule, etc...I'm not saying to be inflexible in raising children, but parents in the US are WAY more into being slaves to their children than anywhere else in the world. We believe in a more parent directed way of parenting, and so we will try that. I prayed for this child for years, but I don't need to be catering to a child like they run the household.

Talk to me in 18 months sweety.

Lurking from j13.

You have another thing coming if you think that your child is going to adapt to your life. Tell it that when they refuse to eat what you give them, tell it that when they throw everything on the floor, yell, climb stuff etc, because guess what? Kids do kids, they literally cannot comprehend what it means to think about anyone but themselves, at least not for a while. If you want an adult space then don't bedshare, and keep your room, because if you want to do so much as pour yourself a glass of water or go pee anywhere with that child around, and not have anything around to entertain it you will lose your damn mind. It's ok though, you stick to those guns and see how well it works out. Like she said, talk to her in 18 months, talk to me in 3 years.

Eta spelling

and I let my kids play in their house because it's theirs too, and it does not make me a slave to them, because believe me I discipline. You won't teach them to be neat if you never give them anything to learn to clean up. I love clean up time.

tbmadeamistake · March 2014

My living room, and C hasn't been home all day! She's been sick, I've been sick, so meh. Normally all the toys are in their nice organized boxes/baskets/toy bin at the end of each day. We have a small house, and I'd rather have her playing where I can see her than down in her room. If we had a bigger house, I might have a play room, but I'd still probably let her play in the rest of the house.

That said, I grew up in a very British household. We moved to the States when I was 16 months. We had a small room that contained the toy box. We were certainly allowed to play with our toys in any room except my father's office, but everything had to be back in the toy box before we moved on to another activity and before we went to bed. I don't think that @LadyMacaron 's expectations are too out of whack considering what I grew up with. I agree with PPs that the tone wasn't great and that both she and her child will have to adjust, I also don't like "I'm never going to" statements, but I don't think she's way of base either. If she sets a tone with her kids and follows through, she may very well end up with the house she wants and the toys all contained. My mom certainly did and I never felt overly contained or left out because my toys had a specific home.

JNerd · March 2014

It was a heck of a lot easier keepin the house clean before DS was mobile. He's nearly 2 and runs, climbs and throws. His favorite 'toys' are not toys at all- they are tupperwear or the kitchen chairs. We keep a tidy house, but have made the decision that we would rather spend the time we have together enjoying each other's company rather than cleaning or stressing over every little mess. I was him to feel free to explore and I really want him to be comfortable in his own house. It's one this to try to make 7lbs conform, it's another to ask 30lbs to not be a child.

MrsP419 · March 2014

I actually think it is important to go into parenthood with SOME standard of tidiness, and not just go into it thinking "we will see what happens" because if you have a tendency toward laziness like me, you can use that as an excuse to be messy. Neither DH nor I were neat people before having kids. I struggled (and still struggle) with managing a home. We weren't living in squaller, but we could get lots of clutter or pilled up mess easily. Since having kids, I am constantly trying to think of ways to keep the mess contained. It is a balance between your house being not overwhelming but still being lived in. I keep a tidier house now with kids than without because I am more aware of it and feel my sanity tested more with four people AND a mess. It is a work in progress.

With that said, my kids have a playroom and a nursery (well, they are losing the nursery and now the playroom is their bedroom, but both have toys) and sometimes they play in their room for hours with the doors shut, and sometimes they want to be part of the action in the living room. We have a corner of the living room that has my son's train table and some toys underneath, and they bring out toys as they day goes on; they just need to put them back in their homes at the end of the day. I would never get anything done if I didn't let them play in the living room. Also, I have a friend who has the tidiest house in the world and keeps all her kids' toys in their rooms (and picks them up herself because she doesn't like how they do it) and I think it is a burden on her. She feels like it always has to look a certain way, and her house would be still be beautiful and neat if she relaxed a little. Sometimes I feel out of place there, like I am going to mess things up.

crhein26 · March 2014

I know I'm a little late, but I absolutely cannot stand it when I spend money on a gift for you or your child and you can't send me a hand written thank you. Thank you pictures with a pre-printed Thank you for your gift is not acceptable!!!

crhein26 · March 2014

This really isn't an UO but I have to say thanks to all the ladies who have kept me entertained with the clean house drama. I really do appreciate being called a slave to my children. Since you lady do not know all Americans or probably know very few of us IRL, you can keep your slave comment to yourself. As for me, this will be our parenting philosophy:

MrsP419 · March 2014

I have to say I have not pooped much today, but when I have, I have been acutely aware of how I am wiping. Thanks for that.

LadyMacaron · March 2014

crhein26, really? I live in the U.S. and I have lived here for the last 16 years. Half of my family, including my husband's, is American. All my friends here are American. There are millions of books on how different parenting styles are around the world, it's not a big secret that a lot of American parents cater to their kids more than some other cultures. I never insulted anyone who chooses to parent this way, I just said this is what is important to me. I didn't say anyone here was a slave to their children, I said it is common in American style parenting.

Some of you act like everyone has the same priorities. I never said I wouldn't allow my kid to play in my living room or house, I said I don't want toys cluttering our common areas. I will prioritize cleaning up, after each toy is played with, because that's important to me. Just like some people don't feed their kids sugar or limit t.v. time, we all have different priorities. Plenty of people live in toy free homes (with the exception of the kid's rooms) it's not a difficult thing to do if that's important to you. This how I grew up and how most of my friends grew up. I raised my sister this way. I have taken care of the same little girl from age 2 to 9 (in addition to a family of three ranging ages 3 month -12) and they also play and their rooms, clean up, and don't clutter their living rooms. Not everyone does thing the same way...I'm so confused as to how I am ridiculous for wanting to raise my kids how plenty of other people around the world do it. You guys don't have to, but you certainly don't have to laugh/snicker at me for it. Also, living in a clutter free and clean house did not keep me from being a kid or making memories.

LadyMacaron · March 2014

joules235 said:

@LadyMacaron‌ I don't think the biggest issue was where you choose to put toys but rather your sweeping generalizations and holier then thou attitude about it. Also the fact that you think your kids will compleatly conform to you and your pre-baby lifestyle is naive. By all means clean your house and prioritize how you like, just realize that a toddler isn't always going to cooperate... and your life does change when you have kids. This change doesn't make you a slave to your children it makes you a parent. Your kids will have personalities too and should be allowed to express them.

I am holier than thou for choosing something different than you and talking about it? I expressed myself respectfully. If someone told you that you were holier than thou for choosing to be green and talking about it, you would think it's ridiculous too.

pcourtade · March 2014

I actually just have a corner for my DS's toys in our living room. He does have some toys in his room but we spend most of the time in the living room when we're at home so it just made sense to me. The dining area, kitchen and our bedroom usually don't have any of his toys. I'm a SAHM so I do follow him (and my DH lol) and pick up after him. It took me awhile to get adjusted after DS and it'll take me awhile to get adjusted again after DD. I don't have any plans on how to keep a tidy house after DD is born but I know that I'll find a new rhythm.

temursgirl · March 2014

@MegK82 So with you on the pants! DH has been very nice about my not wanting to cook and all when people come over (which happens all the time), but I still kind of resent that I have to wear pants for the whole evening.

I've learned a lot from this thread. Like @Lilygrace48 I was raised being able to play in most rooms, but I couldn't leave stuff there. Some rooms, like my parents' bedroom, were off limits. I could play in the living room, but I was definitely expected to take my toys with me when I left, my dad came home, or it was dinner time, whichever came first. The other kids I grew up with had the same rules. I never felt constrained. I just assumed I would do the same with my own kids.

I actually never knew there were differences over this until this thread. It does explain a lot though.

LadyMacaron · March 2014

joules235 said:

joules235 said:

@LadyMacaron‌ I don't think the biggest issue was where you choose to put toys but rather your sweeping generalizations and holier then thou attitude about it. Also the fact that you think your kids will compleatly conform to you and your pre-baby lifestyle is naive. By all means clean your house and prioritize how you like, just realize that a toddler isn't always going to cooperate... and your life does change when you have kids. This change doesn't make you a slave to your children it makes you a parent. Your kids will have personalities too and should be allowed to express them.

I am holier than thou for choosing something different than you and talking about it? I expressed myself respectfully. If someone told you that you were holier than thou for choosing to be green and talking about it, you would think it's ridiculous too.
You said Americans are slaves to their children, have messy child run houses, are short order cooks and have no personality because their babies squashed it with piles of toys. Your tone and words do make you sound like you are judging the other people here and many of us are Americans. Also that comment about your children adapting to you not you to them is ridiculous. Kids are kids no matter the country or parenting style. Nobody from any part of the world will tell you that their child conformed neatly into their prebaby life right from birth...doesn't work that way.

I did NOT say this about anyone. I said these are things in my list of priorities. A big part of my personality is that I like to have things clean, and I said that having a kid is most likely not going to change that. I'm sorry if anyone misinterpreted that, but I was speaking as to the things that were important to me in parenting.

This is the point in the conversation where I am going to bow out, because I am not going to start going line by line trying to clarify things. I was not speaking about anyone but myself.

crhein26 · March 2014

LadyMacaron said:

crhein26, really? I live in the U.S. and I have lived here for the last 16 years. Half of my family, including my husband's, is American. All my friends here are American. There are millions of books on how different parenting styles are around the world, it's not a big secret that a lot of American parents cater to their kids more than some other cultures. I never insulted anyone who chooses to parent this way, I just said this is what is important to me. I didn't say anyone here was a slave to their children, I said it is common in American style parenting.

Some of you act like everyone has the same priorities. I never said I wouldn't allow my kid to play in my living room or house, I said I don't want toys cluttering our common areas. I will prioritize cleaning up, after each toy is played with, because that's important to me. Just like some people don't feed their kids sugar or limit t.v. time, we all have different priorities. Plenty of people live in toy free homes (with the exception of the kid's rooms) it's not a difficult thing to do if that's important to you. This how I grew up and how most of my friends grew up. I raised my sister this way. I have taken care of the same little girl from age 2 to 9 (in addition to a family of three ranging ages 3 month -12) and they also play and their rooms, clean up, and don't clutter their living rooms. Not everyone does thing the same way...I'm so confused as to how I am ridiculous for wanting to raise my kids how plenty of other people around the world do it. You guys don't have to, but you certainly don't have to laugh/snicker at me for it. Also, living in a clutter free and clean house did not keep me from being a kid or making memories.

@LadyMacaron - I get your point. You want to live in a perfect house. That's cool. It's your choice. I don't judge you for that. And my kids won't be hanging out with your kids, so I could care less how you choose to run your hosue. Just don't come in here and call American's slaves to their children. I'd quote it again, but @Merie412 just did it for me. I'll take back my comment about you not knowing anyone from the US, BUT if you have been here for 16 years, then you know enough about this countries history to not throw the word slave around.

folding · March 2014

Heh. I am a very neat and organized person and I love having a clean/neat house.

Then I had Oliver.

He has a huge bedroom, and a playroom in our basement. Also huge. But we love having him near to us and we love playing with him, so guess where he plays (and where most of his toys/things are?) In our family room. I guess that's why it is called a family room

Every night I spend 20 minutes putting all his things away and back into a reasonably neat space (so we are not tripping on balls and trucks and so our house doesn't look like the clearance section of Toys r Us) but really... Oliver runs the house... and we wouldn't have it any other way!

We have someone come clean the house once a month which has been a lifesaver for us, because honestly having a kid not only means more mess, but also less time for the adults to clean said mess (and when I have downtime, do I really want to spend it scrubbing floors or toilets? No.) Today is cleaning day, actually. Today will be a GOOD DAY.

MrsCase1 · March 2014

joules235 said:

My daughter doesn't run the house but as an important member of my family she gets a vote/scream in how it runs.

@joules235 I just needed you to know that this was the best thing I have read in days. Most of Lincoln's votes are uttered in a very high pitch!

katekat8721 · March 2014

Rachel5130 said:
Curious from everyone after last week's debate on on or off leash dogs... How does this make you feel?

Stressed. First, I don't think it's safe for the dog. Second, I've been barked/snapped at by plenty of dogs in the back of a truck while I'm trying to get in my car and it scares me.

MrsCase1 · March 2014

Rachel5130 said:

Curious from everyone after last week's debate on on or off leash dogs... How does this make you feel?

My vet advises against this because of not only the hanging possibility, but because the pads of their feet burn easily in the summer because the beds are so hot. Regardless of the breed, though, I don't want to walk past this. I am a dog lover but this scares me.

hubbs173 · March 2014

Rachel5130 said:

MrsCase1 said:

Rachel5130 said:

Curious from everyone after last week's debate on on or off leash dogs... How does this make you feel?

My vet advises against this because of not only the hanging possibility, but because the pads of their feet burn easily in the summer because the beds are so hot. Regardless of the breed, though, I don't want to walk past this. I am a dog lover but this scares me.

***fuck quoting. I'm done. Seriously.***
Ditto, girl. I love my dog and random strangers too much. It irkes me. Especially when they are parked, like in the picture. It was a nice day out, so he wasn't uncomfortable, but hello? You're not even around, bro.

I don't see that as safe and would be very cautious walking by that truck no matter what the breed. I too am crazy about my dog!!! Whenever he is in my car he is tethered in the back seat with a car seat harness!

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