Food in 1st Year for "Fun and Practice"

MrsCaddyshack · April 2012

Can someone explain this concept to me? I see this a lot on the board...

To me, a baby ingests the food, the food provides additional calories and nutrients, and over time, babies will start to drink less milk/formula because they are eating.

How can food be for fun/practice in the first year when they are eating it? Isn't it for fun and nutrition?

smilelari · April 2012

They don't need any additional calories during the first year and the amount of milk consumed should not decrease during the first year. It's not for nutrition. It doesn't matter if they eat any solids or not.

Mrs.Greeko · April 2012

I think generally they don't "need" the food. They can survive on only breastmilk or formula so they don't need the nutrition that food provides.

But yeah, by the end of the year they should be eating a lot more and taking in less milk. It's still important that they receive breastmilk or formula as that is a huge contributor of their necessary calories.

I think they say that so dumb parents don't think that since their kid is eating food now they don't have to give them formula or breastmilk anymore.

Mrs.Greeko · April 2012

smilelari:
They don't need any additional calories during the first year and the amount of milk consumed should not decrease during the first year. It's not for nutrition. It doesn't matter if they eat any solids or not.

I disagree with this statement. Their milk consumption should start to decrease towards the end of the year as they are consuming more calories through food. Nothing magical happens on their first birthday that makes them need less calories through milk and more from food, it's a gradual process starting when food is added. Some babies it might take longer for them to eat enough food to decrease their milk intake, but others will eat more food and need less milk. Both my older kids were eating a lot of food by 1 year and were taking in less milk.

smilelari · April 2012

Mrs.Greeko:
smilelari:
They don't need any additional calories during the first year and the amount of milk consumed should not decrease during the first year. It's not for nutrition. It doesn't matter if they eat any solids or not.

I disagree with this statement. Their milk consumption should start to decrease towards the end of the year as they are consuming more calories through food. Nothing magical happens on their first birthday that makes them need less calories through milk and more from food, it's a gradual process starting when food is added. Some babies it might take longer for them to eat enough food to decrease their milk intake, but others will eat more food and need less milk. Both my older kids were eating a lot of food by 1 year and were taking in less milk.

I agree that it's gradual, but the change tends to happen closer to the first birthday. Gavin drank 30 oz a day from 8 weeks old until he was 1 year old. He was eating more and more solids, but he needed the calories on top of the milk not in replacement of the milk, so he at 30 oz of milk plus an increasing number of calories from solids. After his first birthday we started replacing BM with WCM and then decreasing the amount of milk (he got BM until 14 months and even some formula past that). I don't really expect this one to "get" solids until closer to 8 months.

I don't understand how there can be a really significant decrease in milk considering that the first foods tend to be fruits and veggies. Even at a year, DS was probably getting maybe a hundred calories (or maybe 2) a day from solids (and at that point was eating cheese and yogurt and the like as well).

MrsCaddyshack · April 2012

This is my first.. but my SIL has a 9 month old who refuses milk/formula and only eats now... she's eating 3x per day and gets veggies, fruits, carbs and meat. I feel like she's definitely getting nutrition from food.

Mrs.Greeko · April 2012

By nine months both of my kids were eating more than just fruits and veggies, they were eating meats, grains, dairy. And they were eating pretty significant amounts of food. Like I said it is different for every baby. If they are eating more food, which some babies do before 1 then they need less milk, if they aren't eating as much food or are still eating a lot of pureed food at 1 then they will probably need more milk.

smilelari · April 2012

Mrs.Greeko:
By nine months both of my kids were eating more than just fruits and veggies, they were eating meats, grains, dairy. And they were eating pretty significant amounts of food. Like I said it is different for every baby. If they are eating more food, which some babies do before 1 then they need less milk, if they aren't eating as much food or are still eating a lot of pureed food at 1 then they will probably need more milk.

But, they still need the milk more than they need the meats and the veggies and the yogurt.

We'll see how it goes this time. Since we're doing BLW, we'll just go with whatever G wants to do. But, it sounds like most babies taking the lead aren't eating many solids until 8 or 9 months (but it will be a better variety).

Some of this probably varies by pedi as well. Mine is pretty crunchy and wants you to hold off on solids until after 6 months and then make sure that the amount of milk doesn't decrease (she even encouraged us to keep night feedings). And encourages you to make sure they get full milk feedings before offering solids.

smilelari · April 2012

MrsCaddyshack:
This is my first.. but my SIL has a 9 month old who refuses milk/formula and only eats now... she's eating 3x per day and gets veggies, fruits, carbs and meat. I feel like she's definitely getting nutrition from food.

This would worry me.

Mrs.Greeko · April 2012

Eh, I don't think you can force them to eat food or drink more breastmilk or formula. I went by my kiddos' leads and they ate a lot of food. They still were drinking considerable amounts of breastmilk or formula, but it definitely was decreasing gradually after 9 months. I figure they know better than I do what they need. I offered them healthy choices for food and offered the breast or bottle. They took what they needed and were fine. I wasn't going to stop feeding them food so they would take more milk. That seems counter productive as the ultimate goal is to have kids that are eating food and not relying on milk as their main source of calories.

smilelari · April 2012

We agree for the most part. We just did milk before food instead of food before milk. Let the kid have all the milk he wanted and then offered solids (and let him have all the solids he wants). Not the same as "stop feeding them food" so they would take more milk. More along the lines of don't stop giving them milk so they will eat more food.

mben1119 · April 2012

smilelari:

MrsCaddyshack:
This is my first.. but my SIL has a 9 month old who refuses milk/formula and only eats now... she's eating 3x per day and gets veggies, fruits, carbs and meat. I feel like she's definitely getting nutrition from food.

This would worry me.

I agree, that is really concerning to me. There is absolutely no way she's getting enough calories and fat from the little bit of solids her tummy can hold. That's why BM and formula should be given for a full year-they are dense with nutrition.

lkm2006 · April 2012

My LO has all of a sudden started getting really into eating (we are doing a mix of baby food and BLW). He gets baby food twice a day and is usually grabbing food off my plate all the time now. His food intake has greatly increased but he is getting the same amount of milk. I figured he would continue this (with adding more table food) and his milk intake would start decreasing close to his first birthday.

MrsCaddyshack · April 2012

mabenner1:
smilelari:

MrsCaddyshack:
This is my first.. but my SIL has a 9 month old who refuses milk/formula and only eats now... she's eating 3x per day and gets veggies, fruits, carbs and meat. I feel like she's definitely getting nutrition from food.

This would worry me.

I agree, that is really concerning to me. There is absolutely no way she's getting enough calories and fat from the little bit of solids her tummy can hold. That's why BM and formula should be given for a full year-they are dense with nutrition.

I shouldn't say "no" formula... She will take a few oz during the day, and still wants it for nighttime and first thing in the am.

mben1119 · April 2012

MrsCaddyshack:
mabenner1:
smilelari:

MrsCaddyshack:
This is my first.. but my SIL has a 9 month old who refuses milk/formula and only eats now... she's eating 3x per day and gets veggies, fruits, carbs and meat. I feel like she's definitely getting nutrition from food.

This would worry me.

I agree, that is really concerning to me. There is absolutely no way she's getting enough calories and fat from the little bit of solids her tummy can hold. That's why BM and formula should be given for a full year-they are dense with nutrition.

I shouldn't say "no" formula... She will take a few oz during the day, and still wants it for nighttime and first thing in the am.

So first it was no formula, and now its 3x a day?

MrsCaddyshack · April 2012

mabenner1:
MrsCaddyshack:
mabenner1:
smilelari:

MrsCaddyshack:
This is my first.. but my SIL has a 9 month old who refuses milk/formula and only eats now... she's eating 3x per day and gets veggies, fruits, carbs and meat. I feel like she's definitely getting nutrition from food.

This would worry me.

I agree, that is really concerning to me. There is absolutely no way she's getting enough calories and fat from the little bit of solids her tummy can hold. That's why BM and formula should be given for a full year-they are dense with nutrition.

I shouldn't say "no" formula... She will take a few oz during the day, and still wants it for nighttime and first thing in the am.

So first it was no formula, and now its 3x a day?

Not quite sure why you're being rude... but, I meant to say the majority of her calories were from food, not formula.

mben1119 · April 2012

MrsCaddyshack:
mabenner1:
MrsCaddyshack:
mabenner1:
smilelari:

MrsCaddyshack:
This is my first.. but my SIL has a 9 month old who refuses milk/formula and only eats now... she's eating 3x per day and gets veggies, fruits, carbs and meat. I feel like she's definitely getting nutrition from food.

This would worry me.

I agree, that is really concerning to me. There is absolutely no way she's getting enough calories and fat from the little bit of solids her tummy can hold. That's why BM and formula should be given for a full year-they are dense with nutrition.

I shouldn't say "no" formula... She will take a few oz during the day, and still wants it for nighttime and first thing in the am.

So first it was no formula, and now its 3x a day?

Not quite sure why you're being rude... but, I meant to say the majority of her calories were from food, not formula.

Not trying to be rude, but it is hard to get the feel for a situation and give advice on it with details changing with every post. If she's taking 3 formula bottles a day, if they are 6-8 ounces each, she's still getting plenty of calories from formula.

JerseyBella · April 2012

I think every baby is different and if their pedi isn't concerned then mommy knows best ie. Mrs.Caddyshack! There are days where Gabbi is eating more than she is drinking and our pedi says her growth and development is great. Everyone is different and honestly every culture is different. So I say Mrs.Caddyshack do what works for you and your LO! Talk to your pedi see what they say, but if LO is growing and is happy then you go girl!

dpeugh85 · April 2012

I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.

MrsCaddyshack · April 2012

dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.

Yes

kristina104 · April 2012

dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.

I agree!

smilelari · April 2012

This thread became a huge mess, LOL

Basically:

Solids in the first year = not necessary

Milk in the first year = extremely important

The end.

Allibob · April 2012

Mrs.Greeko:
I figure they know better than I do what they need.

I don't mean to be snarky, but my baby really isn't the authority on nutrition over here. She will eat whatever I give her. She would happily eat diapers. I agree with the PPs that said the foods they are eating in their first year are not as nutrient-dense as breastmilk/formula, and don't have sufficient protein, fat and other nutrients needed for optimal growth. Not saying that babies can't live on other things, but it's probably not the best...This is why milk should be the main source of calories, and other foods are in addition to that, for practice. After a year, you can gradually wean from BM/formula to table foods as primary nutrition.

MrsCaddyshack · April 2012

smilelari:

This thread became a huge mess, LOL

Agreed. Thanks for the info... I also found a chart on Kellymom.com that illustrates the transition (in case anyone else is interested.)

https://kellymom.com/nutrition/starting-solids/solids-how/

kajordan09 · April 2012

Allibob:

Mrs.Greeko:

I figure they know better than I do what they need.

I don't mean to be snarky, but my baby really isn't the authority on nutrition over here. She will eat whatever I give her. She would happily eat diapers. I agree with the PPs that said the foods they are eating in their first year are not as nutrient-dense as breastmilk/formula, and don't have sufficient protein, fat and other nutrients needed for optimal growth. Not saying that babies can't live on other things, but it's probably not the best...This is why milk should be the main source of calories, and other foods are in addition to that, for practice. After a year, you can gradually wean from BM/formula to table foods as primary nutrition.

ditto. Also, just because a baby grabs for food of their parent's plate doesn't necessarily mean they are ready for solid food. My baby will grab for anything within his vicinity and want to put it in his mouth..edible or not.

Mrs.Greeko · April 2012

kajordan09:
Allibob:

Mrs.Greeko:

I figure they know better than I do what they need.

I don't mean to be snarky, but my baby really isn't the authority on nutrition over here. She will eat whatever I give her. She would happily eat diapers. I agree with the PPs that said the foods they are eating in their first year are not as nutrient-dense as breastmilk/formula, and don't have sufficient protein, fat and other nutrients needed for optimal growth. Not saying that babies can't live on other things, but it's probably not the best...This is why milk should be the main source of calories, and other foods are in addition to that, for practice. After a year, you can gradually wean from BM/formula to table foods as primary nutrition.

ditto. Also, just because a baby grabs for food of their parent's plate doesn't necessarily mean they are ready for solid food. My baby will grab for anything within his vicinity and want to put it in his mouth..edible or not.

You took it out of context. "I figure they know better than I do what they need. I offered them healthy choices for food and offered the breast or bottle. They took what they needed and were fine."

My point was that if you offer healthy choices and breast/bottle, the babies will regulate themselves. Toddlers are the best judge of what their bodies need and how much they need. As long as they are offered healthy choices (you know not diapers or big macs or whatever) they self regulate very well. They lose it as they get older because outside influences telling them how much to eat (i.e. parents telling them to clean your plate and you get dessert! or parents shoving a spoon in the baby's face after they are losing interest because there is still some left in the jar or shaking the bottle to get them to finish the last two ounces or whatever). That's how we deal with food and my kids in my house. If you don't agree that your baby or toddler can self regulate then by all means approach food differently in your household.

mben1119 · April 2012

dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.

No, but she is acting like her SIL's child is a model for solids, which she isn't.

Vieve831 · April 2012

Mrs.Greeko:
kajordan09:
Allibob:

Mrs.Greeko:

I figure they know better than I do what they need.

I don't mean to be snarky, but my baby really isn't the authority on nutrition over here. She will eat whatever I give her. She would happily eat diapers. I agree with the PPs that said the foods they are eating in their first year are not as nutrient-dense as breastmilk/formula, and don't have sufficient protein, fat and other nutrients needed for optimal growth. Not saying that babies can't live on other things, but it's probably not the best...This is why milk should be the main source of calories, and other foods are in addition to that, for practice. After a year, you can gradually wean from BM/formula to table foods as primary nutrition.

ditto. Also, just because a baby grabs for food of their parent's plate doesn't necessarily mean they are ready for solid food. My baby will grab for anything within his vicinity and want to put it in his mouth..edible or not.

You took it out of context. "I figure they know better than I do what they need. I offered them healthy choices for food and offered the breast or bottle. They took what they needed and were fine."
My point was that if you offer healthy choices and breast/bottle, the babies will regulate themselves. Toddlers are the best judge of what their bodies need and how much they need. As long as they are offered healthy choices (you know not diapers or big macs or whatever) they self regulate very well. They lose it as they get older because outside influences telling them how much to eat (i.e. parents telling them to clean your plate and you get dessert! or parents shoving a spoon in the baby's face after they are losing interest because there is still some left in the jar or shaking the bottle to get them to finish the last two ounces or whatever). That's how we deal with food and my kids in my house. If you don't agree that your baby or toddler can self regulate then by all means approach food differently in your household.

lol, you're point made sense to me, Mrs. Greeko

Vieve831 · April 2012

mabenner1:
dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.
No, but she is acting like her SIL's child is a model for solids, which she isn't.

I didn't see it that she thought she was a model for solids, just an example of something different than what was already being discussed and an illustration of her original question

Honeydewchestnut · April 2012

My youngest sister was EBF until 12 months - no solids at all. Of course babies are getting nutrition from what they eat, but it isn't essential nutrition. That's found in BM or formula

authorofdreamz · April 2012

For BF babies it definitely can be just for fun and practice but for FF's babies it does start being a source of nutrition especially around 8-9m. My pedi said the amount of formula should start decreasing at that point so that they are only have 1-2 bottles of formula by 12m so it is easier to transition to WCM at 12m. For BF it is completely different since it is fine for them to BF longer than 12m and can be weaned whenever the baby/parents choose.

The reason we have talked about this already is because DD has weight gain issues and so they said if it continues we will delay this process so DD stays on formula past the 1yr mark.

Allibob · April 2012

Sorry. I took it out of context because I couldn't bold it. I'm sure you're not feeding your kids diapers, and I didn't mean anything personal. I still disagree with the idea that babies and toddlers are the best judge of WHAT their bodies need. They do better with knowing how much, though. I worry that if little baby stomachs fill up on solids they will be missing out on better nutrition from milk. Even healthy solids. But that's just my opinion, and there are a million ways to raise a child.

ETA: That was to you, Mrs.Greeko

littlewinnie15 · April 2012

mabenner1:
dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.
No, but she is acting like her SIL's child is a model for solids, which she isn't.

My favorite part of the Bump is when random people that no one knows or has heard of for months and month comes back to be an a$$hat! YIPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11!!

RedCamaro · April 2012

littlewinnie15:
mabenner1:

dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.

No, but she is acting like her SIL's child is a model for solids, which she isn't.

My favorite part of the Bump is when random people that no one knows or has heard of for months and month comes back to be an a$$hat! YIPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11!!

LOL!

blairy926 · April 2012

littlewinnie15:
mabenner1:
dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.
No, but she is acting like her SIL's child is a model for solids, which she isn't.
My favorite part of the Bump is when random people that no one knows or has heard of for months and month comes back to be an a$$hat! YIPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11!!

Like this?? As per the solids question--do what's right for your baby and what's recommended by your pedi (if you think he or she gives good advice).

duffmaker · April 2012

Our Pedi told us this at our appointment last week. That it's just for fun and she said that until a year we should really think of solids as dessert, it should never replace milk and DD's milk intake should not decrease at all during the first year.

duffmaker · April 2012

Oh my I had no idea this thread went so loco... oh and DD is EBF so I don't know if it's different for FF babes. Our Pedi also told us that when we give her solids to do it as close to in between feedings as we can so it doesn't fill her up when it's time for her to nurse.

MrsCaddyshack · April 2012

clizh:
Our Pedi told us this at our appointment last week. That it's just for fun and she said that until a year we should really think of solids as dessert, it should never replace milk and DD's milk intake should not decrease at all during the first year.

Thanks, that's a nice way of looking at it.

skipperkelly · April 2012

littlewinnie15:
mabenner1:

dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.

No, but she is acting like her SIL's child is a model for solids, which she isn't.

My favorite part of the Bump is when random people that no one knows or has heard of for months and month comes back to be an a$$hat! YIPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11!!

hmmm...pot, meet kettle.

littlewinnie15 · April 2012

skipperkelly:
littlewinnie15:
mabenner1:

dpeugh85:
I don't think she was looking for advice on her SIL's child.

No, but she is acting like her SIL's child is a model for solids, which she isn't.

My favorite part of the Bump is when random people that no one knows or has heard of for months and month comes back to be an a$$hat! YIPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11!!

hmmm...pot, meet kettle.

Hmmm... I'm sorry, have we met?

skipperkelly · April 2012

not sure we have, but I sure haven't seen you on this board in quite a while.

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