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Blended Families
Phantomgirl
member
Addicts
Phantomgirl
member
I am always amazed at the amount of women on this board who declare that their DH ex is an active drug addict and unfit mother.
In my opinion normal healthy people are not attracted to drug addicts. Normal healthy people most certainly do not marry and procreate with drug addicts. In my opinion if your DH married and/or procreated with a drug addict then he most likely has drug issues himself, or at the very least huge self esteem issues that led him to believe he could not do any better. There is just no way in hell that anyone who is anti drugs ended up married to a drug addict.
If your DH married and procreated with a drug addict and unfit mother then he holds some responsibility in how the children?s lives have been affected by it.
I don't buy the 'he made a mistake', you can make a mistake by briefly dating or having a ONS with a drug addict BUT marrying them and procreating with them is a choice.
It just kinda rubs me the wrong way when people get on their high horse and call the ex all sorts of names. If she really is that bad then what does that say about the man you married???
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Re: Addicts
I will agree to a certain extent. I have ALWAYS given DH the side-eye for his marriage to BM - but he did it for SD (who is not his biological daughter, he adopted her)
However, he WAS only 20 at the time and the human brain IS NOT FULLY DEVELOPED until the early 20s. Not to mention that most humans do not have enough life experience to "SEE" the world clearly.
Now, I DO have issues with DH's lenght of marriage and the fact that he continued to try for another child with someone who is not a great parent (remember, my BM strapped my DD in her highchair for hours until she would eat the adult size meal infront of her).
Of course I did not know he allowed that carp to happen before we got married.....so that makes me just like the Dirt Bag husbands you are complaining about.
Is she a drug addict? I knew she was not the best mother but I never heard you refer to her as an addict.
I am specifically calling people out who get on their high horse and make slurs about addiction. If the ex is addicted then chances are your DH has either addiction or emotional problem, healthy people DO NOT marry/procreate with addicts. So unless your DH is currently in a 12 step program or has received counseling you can climb down because it speaks volumes about YOU.
I do see how you can end up married to people with emotional issues. The first few months of any relationship people are generally on their best behavior. Rush in to it or ignore the red flags and you are destined to fail. That is what dating is for, to weed out the BSC.
I agree with you to a certain extent as well and my husband's ex turned out to be a drug addict. In his case, her "addiction" didn't present itself until 6 years into their marriage. He found out years later that she had had problems off and on with addiction since she was 14. My DH was, at the time, the most naive person about drugs that I have ever seen. He has never tried them and had never been around them at all. He got his education in drugs really quickly and dramatically when she started using again at the end of their marriage.
I have known people, though, who marry addicts and think they can change them. That is so sad (and dumb) and I've never seen it turn out well.
I'm beginning to wonder if you have a split personality, Phantom.
Isn't your DH an alcoholic?
My basic thought still remains the same. When you are young, you may not recognize that your SO is an ADDICT. What is taken as heavy recreational use could be an addiction.
And if the person is hiding their addiction, as many do - especially in the beginning, how can you fault the SO?
Hell, I dated a drunk and did not recognize the full extent of his addictions until months into living with him....and I was 33. He was perfectly functional at work and at home. He HID his weekday drinking from me.
I certainly do not think I am an addict or have emotional issues (more than the average bear that is) for having spent time with him.
Yes. So what would that tell you about me J&A?
Illumine my point being that if you are healthy and emotionally well you will not marry them, you WILL weed them out during the dating process. Hence the active alcoholic is your ex. You would not settle for that life unless you believed you could not do any better.
My ex-h started using rx painkillers to drown out the world when his father was diagnosed with a terminal illness. I never would have thought him capable of doing this when we were dating, getting married or TTC. The closest I've been to abusing drugs is re-using my leftover antibiotics. Now that he's my ex, I'm not responsible for his actions, and would hope that they don't reflect on me.
Thats a tough break and I am sorry that that happened to you.
I totally understand that that can happen. My uncle married his wife it must be about 25 years ago now and moved to the country side. She hated it and her drinking at home steadily increased. He tried everything to get her the help she needed. She died age 45 from alcohol related ilness.
He is your ex because you were unable to settle for that life style.
Or the woman who marries a gamer, knowing full well that is how he spends his time, only to turn around and get all butthurt when he doesn't change after saying I do.
The person who knows their soon to be spouse is verbally/mentally/physically abusive but marries them anyway, thinking they will change.
I think in the end a lot of people get into relationships for really unhealthy reasons.
I don't think Phantom is talking about people who are married to someone who ends up with a problem years down the line.
It sounded to me like she was talking about entering into a relationship with someone who already has an addiction. Or develops one very early on.
But maybe I'm reading it wrong.
I think beginning a relationship with an addict--especially one not seeking help--shows pretty questionable judgment. My sister is an addict, and while she's been going to meetings for about 18 months, she's showing zero growth. If we weren't all standing beside her with this, she'd be back on drugs within a week or two. It feels very much like we're waiting for that inevitability. I judge the guys who date her, because I feel like she takes SO much emotional energy and brings nothing to the table. I very much wonder what they get out of it.
Frankly, I think thats a blanket statement. I know of at least one situation that doesn't apply to involving my husbands brother. He was a heroin addict who had been to prison a few times. His current wife got him clean after they got married, and he has custody of all six of his kids. He's a great parent who is at all his kids activities. Meeting him you would never guess that 15 years ago he was a hardcore drug addict.
Since we are talking about favorites and blanket statements, if you marry a man with a huge CS payment that you know puts a strain on your finances DON"T GET PREGNANT. I'm so sick of women coming on here and saying it was an "accident" b*llsh*t. There are so many ways to prevent pregnancy, and if you have an oops there is the MA pill. Quit bringing kids into the world you can't support.
::gets down off soap box::
Goose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' and then lament how hard they make their DH lives.
If he didn?t want to deal with an addict he should not have laid down with one or made her his wife.
I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
Goose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceeded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
and thenGoose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceeded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
and then goes onGoose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceeded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
and then goes on toGoose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceeded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
and then goes on to lament howGoose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceeded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
and then goes on to lament how hard sheGoose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceeded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
and then goes on to lament how hard she makes herGoose his wife did not get him clean, that is absolutely impossible. He got himself clean and I commend him for that.
My DH is a recovering alcoholic and got sober after years of drinking. HE did treatment, two years of aftercare, attends meetings, has a sponsor and sponsee's (sp?). He also did individual counseling to tackle the issues that preceeded his drinking. I certainly supported him through his recovery BUT I did not get him sober. He is also a great husband.
MY 'blanket statement' is.. I hate women that come on to this site and say... I have a young SC and the BM is a scumbag crack addict' I also agree with you, it called BIRTH CONTROL.
and then goes on to lament how hard she makes her herDid I mention it's DS's birthday today? My little boy is a year old!
I am the adult child of a crack addict. And i'd like to respond. I will try not to get angry or defensive, but this is a pretty emotional issue for me, so if I come out a little hostile I apologize in advance.
My mother married my father in the 70s. There was some "recreational" drug use that went on in their circle during the time they were dating and no one saw that as wrong at the time. As their circle of friends all got married and began having babies many of them stopped using weed and coke. Unfortunately, my dad did not.
My mom married him when she thought his drug use was still "recreational" and got pregnant with my sister. After my sister was born, and my dad's drug use continued my mom struggled and struggled to get him help. She loved him and didn't want to leave him...her marriage vows were to stay with him "in sickness and in health" so she struggled to get him healthy.
I was born and the struggle continued. It got worse and worse and finally, when I was 8 years old she decided she was done and was going to leave him. Us leaving is what got him clean (the first time). And when he got clean we went home. He was clean for 7 1/2 years and then when I turned 14 he relapsed. My mom did her best to do what was right for us as a family. Tried to help him....kicked him out....tried some more to help him....kicked him out. It was a very difficult time for her and us.
Finally, on my 18th birthday she divorced him.
My mom was not "attracted to a drug addict" nor was she abnormal or unhealthy as your post implies. My mom was not flawed. She was in a situation of trying to save the life of the man she loved. And when she realized she was not able to do that and having him around was causing more harm to her children than good, she divorced him.
So not every situation is as cut and dried as you would like to imply.
Happy Birthday to your DS.
I was an emotional mess part of the day for my DD - I kept thinking about the day she was born. So happy - but so emotional!
I hope you and DS have a wonderful 1st birthday together. Lots of kissing, hugging and cake eating!!
Jessy-I am sorry that you went through that, and I know this will sound horrible, but in all honesty, someone who chooses to procreate with a man who has drug problems (recreational or not) most likely does have some sort of issue. Maybe it's self-esteem, maybe depression, maybe it's a martyr complex-but a completely healthy and totally stable person does not bring children into a marriage when one of the spouses is a drug addict. Being in denial and thinking oh, it will get better, when dealing with something as dangerous as drug use is not healthy. It's not like saying, oh he is a slob and pees on the toilet seat, but I love him and it will get better. To put your life and the life of your children at risk because you love someone isn't healthy. Your mom sounds like an incredibly strong woman, who struggled with doing what was right and living in a world where she thought he would just get better.
I lived with my alcoholic grandparents for the first ten years of my life. My grandmother raised 9 children while my grandfather sat in a bar. Slowly over time, she too became an alcoholic. It was during the 40's, 50's, 60's, when it wasn't looked at as a disease, and it was more "normal" and getting a divorce was not really an option, for a woman with no education, who never had a job and who had 9 kids, not to mention it was still fairly taboo. My grandmother was an amazing woman, but she too had her demons-which was evident from her actions, of having 9 children with a man who was an alcoholic, to becoming an alcoholic herself. I adored her, but I still till this day wonder why she stayed in a marriage that was so filled with disease.
For the most part, I agree with you. If your so was married to or had a long term relation with someone like that, I would question his background as well.
While we have our differences with BM and she really is a biotch on most occasions, I can't say she is actually off the charts crazy and she certainly is not an addict.... although their therapist did say he believes BM may have a hormonal inbalance causing depression and mood alteration. I definitely am well aware that there are FAR WORSE mothers out there.
Paris, I think you answered yourself why your GM stayed. It was so different back then and honestly those reasons you listed were all very valid. Who knows what anyone of us would have done differently if anything, had we lived back then. How would she have supported all those children, if she divorced him? She had to make a logic decision and stay for the survival of the children. Birth control was probably taboo as well, hence the 9 kids. She probably did the best she could. I think a situation like that would probably lead a lot of otherwise normal people to the bottle or some sort of an outlet.
To Phantom - my dad says that marriage is always a russian roulette. You can do the best you can in picking and choosing the best possible mate for yourself, but in the end you need a whole lot of luck for it to actually work out. There are so many unforseen circumstances in life that you just can't predict and that can throw a monkey wrench into a seemingly good relationship, that you just can't foolproof this. That includes spouses falling into addiction later on. I personally know of a relationship that started as young teens, no money, getting pregnant wihin the first 2 months of dating, no clear future, both of them drinking/partying heavily at first....now 12 years later: a great marriage with 3 children, nice home, 2 good carreers, no drinking. They made it, although everybody was giving them less than a year after their shot gun wedding. It was a disaster waiting to happen to everyone that knew them. But, the disaster worked itself out. Same with the oppossite: a perfect couple, everything going for them....5 years down the line everything fell apart, both in debt, hating each other, one using prescription pills. You truly never know.
My guess is that in a lot of cases the man (or woman) doesn't full disclose their entire past, or tells you that their ex was a druggie in the first stages of dating. I think it would be hard after you fall in love with someone, then you find out EVERYTHING, to just walk away because of the past. People always say "don't dewll on the past" and that you have to make your own future... IDK, that is just my guess.
I did have parents that were drug users. After my Dad left my Mom for another woman when I was 14, my Mom fell in with the wrong crowd (she was always a SAHM), and after my Dad left she was forced to get a job. She didn't have any education or a HS dipolma, so she got a job cleaning motel rooms. That is where she met her druggie friends. I know first had that being a child of someone who is/was a drug abusier is no fun! I got a job at 15 and my pay checks went towards buying food for my sister and I, because my Mom would spend her money on dope! And I can proudly say that I have never in my life touched drugs after seeing how it can ruin a life, and lives of the people around you.
I didn't take the time to read through all the posts, but you are making a very definate statement for a not so definate situation... You make a statement as though the surrounding circumstances are always black and white, and it's just not.
Without going in depth, yes there are real life examples that support your statement perfectly, but there are real life examples that totally defy your statement as well.
This is what I was trying to say.
She isn't saying it as a professional, she saying it as a personal observation.
And I would think, that your H as a TRAINED PROFESSIONAL, would have to agree that most times people who knowingly involve themselves with an addict, especially to the point of marriage and children, often have issues they have to deal with themselves. It might not be addiction, but they probably have their own demons-as I said before, it might low self-esteem, or depression, but SOMETHING is going on if they are willing to deny the fact they are possibly risking their lives to be with someone. And you are in fact risking your life to live with an addict. Your financial stability, and your physical life-whether it be because they go off the deep end and hurt you, get involved with the wrong people, piss off a drug dealer, drive drunk, or a myriad of other things, your life is in danger to some degree when dealing with an addict. How could someone who is perfectly mentally healthy will ignore those things, and continue a relationship with an addict?
IMO, no one is a picture of perfect mental health.
Just as there are cancer patients whose cancer goes into remission, and they are called survivor's, there are addicts alcoholics who are "in recovery" for the rest of their lives, are they not deserving of a healthy sound partner?
You could say the same about people who choose to marry individuals who are terminally ill, that something is wrong with them. I personally don't believe that, some people are strong enough to deal with these kinds of realtionships and the hardships they bring.
IT IS NOT THE SAME THING!!!!!!
There is a big difference between being in a relationship with someone who is sober, and in recovery, than it is to be in a relationship with an active addict, and you cannot tell me that there isn't a difference. Especially entering into a relationship.
Someone who is terminally ill is not going to put their families life at risk the way a drug addict or alcoholic will. It's just NOT the same thing. If a person willingly and knowingly gets involved with a person who is in active addiction, then yes they have issues. Sorry, but a person who is being reasonable, will see the risks they are taking, and will understand that no amount of hoping, praying, or even encouraging is going to change that addicts behavior until they themselves want to change it.
I agree it's not the same thing, but the statement was "normal healthy people are not attracted to drug addicts. Normal healthy people most certainly do not marry and procreate with drug addicts. "
There was no clarification on being an active addict, whose to say they didn't begin their relationship when the addict was in recovery and years later relapsed, and is it so mentally unbalanced to try in vain to keep a marriage together at that point? Maybe, maybe not, it would depend upon a lot of specifics.
The comparison to an individual who is terminally ill, was that someone would knowingly marry someone with a disease, like addiction is a disease, you can't cure it, and it potentially could be passed on to your children.