Addicts

paris.inthe.spring

armourall:

paris.inthe.spring:

IT IS NOT THE SAME THING!!!!!!

There is a big difference between being in a relationship with someone who is sober, and in recovery, than it is to be in a relationship with an active addict, and you cannot tell me that there isn't a difference. Especially entering into a relationship.

Someone who is terminally ill is not going to put their families life at risk the way a drug addict or alcoholic will. It's just NOT the same thing. If a person willingly and knowingly gets involved with a person who is in active addiction, then yes they have issues. Sorry, but a person who is being reasonable, will see the risks they are taking, and will understand that no amount of hoping, praying, or even encouraging is going to change that addicts behavior until they themselves want to change it.

I agree it's not the same thing, but the statement was "normal healthy people are not attracted to drug addicts. Normal healthy people most certainly do not marry and procreate with drug addicts. "Correct. I think what OP meant was that a normal healthy person would not knowingly enter into a relationship with an active addict. And I agree with her.

There was no clarification on being an active addict, whose to say they didn't begin their relationship when the addict was in recovery and years later relapsed, and is it so mentally unbalanced to try in vain to keep a marriage together at that point? Maybe, maybe not, it would depend upon a lot of specifics. Sure it would. But, when your life is endangered by the actions of your partner, the healthy thing to do is get out. Of course it isn't always that easy, but if it isn't considered, and they stay for "love" then yes, likely they need help as much as the addict does.

The comparison to an individual who is terminally ill, was that someone would knowingly marry someone with a disease, like addiction is a disease, you can't cure it, and it potentially could be passed on to your children. Marrying someone you KNOW has a terminal illness is not similar to marrying an active addict. Them having cancer or something else is not going to put their spouse in harms way. Having children in that situation, is a totally different topic-as there are genetic tests that can be done to weigh the safety of reproduction and the chances of passing it on. I believe that addictive tendencies are often genetic, but it is a different beast entirely. Someone who chooses to procreate with someone who is struggling with an active addiction is clearly making a poor choice, and it isn't the same as doing so with someone who is in a strong recovery.

I feel like i am talking to brick wall-and you probably do too, thus this my last post on this topic.

armourall

paris.inthe.spring:

armourall:

paris.inthe.spring:

IT IS NOT THE SAME THING!!!!!!

There is a big difference between being in a relationship with someone who is sober, and in recovery, than it is to be in a relationship with an active addict, and you cannot tell me that there isn't a difference. Especially entering into a relationship.

Someone who is terminally ill is not going to put their families life at risk the way a drug addict or alcoholic will. It's just NOT the same thing. If a person willingly and knowingly gets involved with a person who is in active addiction, then yes they have issues. Sorry, but a person who is being reasonable, will see the risks they are taking, and will understand that no amount of hoping, praying, or even encouraging is going to change that addicts behavior until they themselves want to change it.

I agree it's not the same thing, but the statement was "normal healthy people are not attracted to drug addicts. Normal healthy people most certainly do not marry and procreate with drug addicts. "Correct. I think what OP meant was that a normal healthy person would not knowingly enter into a relationship with an active addict. And I agree with her.

There was no clarification on being an active addict, whose to say they didn't begin their relationship when the addict was in recovery and years later relapsed, and is it so mentally unbalanced to try in vain to keep a marriage together at that point? Maybe, maybe not, it would depend upon a lot of specifics. Sure it would. But, when your life is endangered by the actions of your partner, the healthy thing to do is get out. Of course it isn't always that easy, but if it isn't considered, and they stay for "love" then yes, likely they need help as much as the addict does.

The comparison to an individual who is terminally ill, was that someone would knowingly marry someone with a disease, like addiction is a disease, you can't cure it, and it potentially could be passed on to your children. Marrying someone you KNOW has a terminal illness is not similar to marrying an active addict. Them having cancer or something else is not going to put their spouse in harms way. Having children in that situation, is a totally different topic-as there are genetic tests that can be done to weigh the safety of reproduction and the chances of passing it on. I believe that addictive tendencies are often genetic, but it is a different beast entirely. Someone who chooses to procreate with someone who is struggling with an active addiction is clearly making a poor choice, and it isn't the same as doing so with someone who is in a strong recovery.

I feel like i am talking to brick wall-and you probably do too, thus this my last post on this topic.

Not a brick wall at all. I compeletly agree that if you enter into a relationship with an active addict, that you yourself are not mentally healthy, that just was not what I got from what the OP typed.

Saran

Of course, as usual, people are not actually reading the post. I SAID THERE IS SO MUCH MORE TO IT. You can't just make a statement without really thinking it thru. Addiction is DEEP and deserves much more thought and knowledge than just a fly by night comment.

In the future, when post like this come up, we should all just take it for what it is (someone venting without thinking), roll our eyes, have a good laugh and keep it moving.

J&A2008

Phantomgirl:

J&A2008:

I'm beginning to wonder if you have a split personality, Phantom.

Isn't your DH an alcoholic?

Yes. So what would that tell you about me J&A?

 

I'm not sure.  I would say people find someone who complements them, adds excitement, comfort, stability, companionship and eroticism to their lives. 

After reading your post, I'm wondering if you have special insights you're sharing as a PSA, or are questioning your choices, and if you think your situation is the same or different than the women/men of whom you sound so critical.

J&A2008

 

 

xmaryrickx

Saran:

Of course, as usual, people are not actually reading the post. I SAID THERE IS SO MUCH MORE TO IT. You can't just make a statement without really thinking it thru. Addiction is DEEP and deserves much more thought and knowledge than just a fly by night comment.

In the future, when post like this come up, we should all just take it for what it is (someone venting without thinking), roll our eyes, have a good laugh and keep it moving.

maybe that is what YOU should do but some of had a discussion whether you chose to participate or not.

Phantomgirl

armourall:

paris.inthe.spring:

armourall:

paris.inthe.spring:

IT IS NOT THE SAME THING!!!!!!

There is a big difference between being in a relationship with someone who is sober, and in recovery, than it is to be in a relationship with an active addict, and you cannot tell me that there isn't a difference. Especially entering into a relationship.

Someone who is terminally ill is not going to put their families life at risk the way a drug addict or alcoholic will. It's just NOT the same thing. If a person willingly and knowingly gets involved with a person who is in active addiction, then yes they have issues. Sorry, but a person who is being reasonable, will see the risks they are taking, and will understand that no amount of hoping, praying, or even encouraging is going to change that addicts behavior until they themselves want to change it.

I agree it's not the same thing, but the statement was "normal healthy people are not attracted to drug addicts. Normal healthy people most certainly do not marry and procreate with drug addicts. "Correct. I think what OP meant was that a normal healthy person would not knowingly enter into a relationship with an active addict. And I agree with her.

There was no clarification on being an active addict, whose to say they didn't begin their relationship when the addict was in recovery and years later relapsed, and is it so mentally unbalanced to try in vain to keep a marriage together at that point? Maybe, maybe not, it would depend upon a lot of specifics. Sure it would. But, when your life is endangered by the actions of your partner, the healthy thing to do is get out. Of course it isn't always that easy, but if it isn't considered, and they stay for "love" then yes, likely they need help as much as the addict does.

The comparison to an individual who is terminally ill, was that someone would knowingly marry someone with a disease, like addiction is a disease, you can't cure it, and it potentially could be passed on to your children. Marrying someone you KNOW has a terminal illness is not similar to marrying an active addict. Them having cancer or something else is not going to put their spouse in harms way. Having children in that situation, is a totally different topic-as there are genetic tests that can be done to weigh the safety of reproduction and the chances of passing it on. I believe that addictive tendencies are often genetic, but it is a different beast entirely. Someone who chooses to procreate with someone who is struggling with an active addiction is clearly making a poor choice, and it isn't the same as doing so with someone who is in a strong recovery.

I feel like i am talking to brick wall-and you probably do too, thus this my last post on this topic.

Not a brick wall at all. I compeletly agree that if you enter into a relationship with an active addict, that you yourself are not mentally healthy, that just was not what I got from what the OP typed.

If you had read all the replies you would know that my DH is a recovering alcoholic.  I would not have married him if he were still actively drinking. 

The bolded part above is exactly my point.

So to all the ladies who come onhere ranting that their DH ex is an active addict, I have to ask 'what does that say about your DH'.  BTW my family has addiction issues so I am not being judgemental I am just stating a fact - see the bolded part above. 

 

Phantomgirl

J&A2008:

Phantomgirl:

J&A2008:

I'm beginning to wonder if you have a split personality, Phantom.

Isn't your DH an alcoholic?

Yes. So what would that tell you about me J&A?

 

I'm not sure.  I would say people find someone who complements them, adds excitement, comfort, stability, companionship and eroticism to their lives. 

After reading your post, I'm wondering if you have special insights you're sharing as a PSA, or are questioning your choices, and if you think your situation is the same or different than the women/men of whom you sound so critical.

What it tells you about me J&A is that when I dated DH way back when we were teens and he was actively drinking and I was right there by his side I was just a sick as he was.

I am married to a recovering alcoholic and it has taken him a lot of hard work and dedication to get to a point where he is emotionally well.

I come from a very abusive childhood and have used drink and drugs in my past also.  I am currently in counseling dealing with emotional issues.

I know that we were not emotionally well when we were drinking/drugging - how the hell could we be?  We know that we needed help to get to a good place in our lives.

The very first step to admitting you are an addict is to admit that your life is unmanageable.  How can a healthy person with a manageable life deal with that.  They can't.  Read the replies above, when addiction entered the marriage after they said 'I do' it either ended in divorce OR the partner being miserable.

Don't tell me you have never given your DH the side eye for marrying and having TWO kids with an active addict.

And from the bolded part above, if your DH ex complimented him, what does that say about him?  Which is my point to being with.

 

 

Phantomgirl

Saran:

Of course, as usual, people are not actually reading the post. I SAID THERE IS SO MUCH MORE TO IT. You can't just make a statement without really thinking it thru. Addiction is DEEP and deserves much more thought and knowledge than just a fly by night comment.

In the future, when post like this come up, we should all just take it for what it is (someone venting without thinking), roll our eyes, have a good laugh and keep it moving.

Saran you seem to be confused.  This is a public message board, I can make whatever statements I like.  I know when I make these statements that some people will agree and some will disagree.  Some will read it, some won't.  Some will get annoyed, some will smile and keep moving as you suggested.  You do not have to be a 'trained professional' to have an opinion on anything.

Also addiction has been, and is very prevalent in my life so I have thought this through.

I would love to know if your ?trained professional? DH thinks that an emotionally healthy person would choose to be in a relationship with an active addict.  What's his verdict?

 

 

J&A2008

Phantomgirl:

J&A2008:

Phantomgirl:

J&A2008:

I'm beginning to wonder if you have a split personality, Phantom.

Isn't your DH an alcoholic?

Yes. So what would that tell you about me J&A?

 

I'm not sure.  I would say people find someone who complements them, adds excitement, comfort, stability, companionship and eroticism to their lives. 

After reading your post, I'm wondering if you have special insights you're sharing as a PSA, or are questioning your choices, and if you think your situation is the same or different than the women/men of whom you sound so critical.

What it tells you about me J&A is that when I dated DH way back when we were teens and he was actively drinking and I was right there by his side I was just a sick as he was.

I am married to a recovering alcoholic and it has taken him a lot of hard work and dedication to get to a point where he is emotionally well.

I come from a very abusive childhood and have used drink and drugs in my past also.  I am currently in counseling dealing with emotional issues.

I know that we were not emotionally well when we were drinking/drugging - how the hell could we be?  We know that we needed help to get to a good place in our lives.

The very first step to admitting you are an addict is to admit that your life is unmanageable.  How can a healthy person with a manageable life deal with that.  They can't.  Read the replies above, when addiction entered the marriage after they said 'I do' it either ended in divorce OR the partner being miserable.

Don't tell me you have never given your DH the side eye for marrying and having TWO kids with an active addict.

And from the bolded part above, if your DH ex complimented him, what does that say about him?  Which is my point to being with.

 

 

Well, hindsight's 20/20.  DH's ex was a recovered addict, Phantom, who had used drugs as a teen to escape from her homelife when her parents split.  She was his gf when he was 19, and not at all someone he was with because he wanted to marry her or start a family; his agenda was much different at that time as he was just a kid. 

When he discovered she was using again and found drugs in his home, he called the police and turned her over.   Situations change.  What she's told me is that she needed something to cope with having two babies and being a full time student.  I think she was under a lot of stress.  I can't imagine caring for a baby and a toddler.  Caring for one was difficult enough.  She fell back on her old habits and what she used to take comfort in and found a way to once again escape what she couldn't handle.  However, I don't excuse her choices. 

I'm not sure where your post is coming from.  I hope everything is ok with you and DH.  I think I'd say to you what we would say to anyone in your shoes - if you're having doubts about your DH's sobriety or his commitment to being a parent, or his ability/willingness to support his children, DON'T HAVE KIDS.  He might make a fine DH, but stuff happens. 

Phantomgirl

J&A2008:

Phantomgirl:

J&A2008:

Phantomgirl:

J&A2008:

I'm beginning to wonder if you have a split personality, Phantom.

Isn't your DH an alcoholic?

Yes. So what would that tell you about me J&A?

 

I'm not sure.  I would say people find someone who complements them, adds excitement, comfort, stability, companionship and eroticism to their lives. 

After reading your post, I'm wondering if you have special insights you're sharing as a PSA, or are questioning your choices, and if you think your situation is the same or different than the women/men of whom you sound so critical.

What it tells you about me J&A is that when I dated DH way back when we were teens and he was actively drinking and I was right there by his side I was just a sick as he was.

I am married to a recovering alcoholic and it has taken him a lot of hard work and dedication to get to a point where he is emotionally well.

I come from a very abusive childhood and have used drink and drugs in my past also.  I am currently in counseling dealing with emotional issues.

I know that we were not emotionally well when we were drinking/drugging - how the hell could we be?  We know that we needed help to get to a good place in our lives.

The very first step to admitting you are an addict is to admit that your life is unmanageable.  How can a healthy person with a manageable life deal with that.  They can't.  Read the replies above, when addiction entered the marriage after they said 'I do' it either ended in divorce OR the partner being miserable.

Don't tell me you have never given your DH the side eye for marrying and having TWO kids with an active addict.

And from the bolded part above, if your DH ex complimented him, what does that say about him?  Which is my point to being with.

 

 

Well, hindsight's 20/20.  DH's ex was a recovered addict, Phantom, who had used drugs as a teen to escape from her homelife when her parents split.  She was his gf when he was 19, and not at all someone he was with because he wanted to marry her or start a family; his agenda was much different at that time as he was just a kid. 

There is actually no such thing as a recovered addict, in fact it is an oxymoron if you think about it.  So basically she was an abstinent drug addict.  Recovery implies that you admit you have a problem, seek help, abstain from drug use and commit to a program which offers continuous support and help with your addiction.  It is a lifelong commitment.

I actually have great compassion for your DH, after all, who's to say that my DH will never drink again OR that I won?t for that matter.  In saying that he choose to have kids with someone who was far from stable and obviously emotionally damaged to begin with.  But you are right hindsight is 20/20.

When he discovered she was using again and found drugs in his home, he called the police and turned her over.   Situations change.  What she's told me is that she needed something to cope with having two babies and being a full time student.  I think she was under a lot of stress.  I can't imagine caring for a baby and a toddler.  Caring for one was difficult enough.  She fell back on her old habits and what she used to take comfort in and found a way to once again escape what she couldn't handle.  However, I don't excuse her choices. 

I get it, what she couldn't handle was life on life?s terms.

I'm not sure where your post is coming from.  I hope everything is ok with you and DH.  I think I'd say to you what we would say to anyone in your shoes - if you're having doubts about your DH's sobriety or his commitment to being a parent, or his ability/willingness to support his children, DON'T HAVE KIDS.  He might make a fine DH, but stuff happens. 

I am not having any doubts about DH recovery, he is 100% committed.  Kinda lives and breathes the program to be honest.  Things are good with us we are settling into married life quite nicely.  I have no doubts about his commitment to being a parent, he committed to his son, despite the situation and despite his drinking.  DH is a real family man and comes from a very close nit family. 

On the other hand I personally feel that I would like a little more time to 'find me' and 'experience life' before I commit to being a parent.

For personal reasons (listed above in abundance) I am simply passionate about the topic of addiction - hence the post.

 

armourall

Phantomgirl:

If you had read all the replies you would know that my DH is a recovering alcoholic.  I would not have married him if he were still actively drinking. 

The bolded part above is exactly my point.

So to all the ladies who come onhere ranting that their DH ex is an active addict, I have to ask 'what does that say about your DH'.  BTW my family has addiction issues so I am not being judgemental I am just stating a fact - see the bolded part above. 

After my first post I did go back and read all the replies, I did read that your DH is a recovering alcoholic, which made me think that you might understand why saying point blank that marrying an addict aloholic means you have some mental instablilty, was rather insensitive for a rathe sensitive subject, and as others have said too much of a "blanket statement".

Unless the ladies on here have clearly stated that DH married and had children with MB while she was active in her addiction, and they clearly knew (the nature of addiction is insidious in and of itself, it is a master of lies and deception) you have no way of knowing whether or not they are just like you, and married someone with a problem (or maybe it wsn't even a problem yet) that is being delt with in a healthy positive way. The simple fact that their ex is an active addict should not necessarily reflect badly on their character. After all, they are as you have said, their ex because they were not okay with that lifestyle.

Addiction is a problem in my family as well, it's totally possible to be judgemental even if addiction is a close to heart matter, but I don't believe you were intentionally trying to offend anyone, but rather help some of the ladies recognize a potentially huge problem, because afterall if DH did enter into a realtionship with an active addict knowingly, and then proceeded to have children in spite of obviously bad circumstances, then there's most likely a huge red flag there. Reading through though it does not initially come off that way.