I know this should be saved for UO Thursday, but I am having this opinion today.
ahem... (climbs on soap box)
You know what I think is wrong with this country is we have raised a bunch of wimps. Parents/teachers/coaches have been telling children for years that "everyone is a winner" when damnit no they aren't, some people are losers. That's just the way it is. We give trophies for participation, kids aren't allowed to play dodgeball because it "singles kids out", they don't keep score in a lot of little league type games anymore... so kids are not ready for what the real world tates like. -- Not everyone wins.
Life isn't easy, you aren't guaranteed to get everything you want out of life. But because parents don't say no, they don't disapline, teachers allow extra time on deadlines or extra credit for those students who haven't done their work all semester but don't want to fail, and coaches who give trophies for showing up then kids think they are entitled to EVERYTHING.
No one wants to work hard to be the best because from a very young age they've all been told they are the best no matter how bad they suck. No one spends the time trying to do extra work to get better, they instead try to find ways to get out of practice knowing they'll get to play anyway because there's a rule in place that says everyone gets to play.
I'm so sick of the feel good crap. You want to get a trophy... win the league, you want to pass 2nd grade, do the work, you want an IPod save your allowance, you smack your sister, I'm going to smack your ass...
We are not doing our children any favors with all this feel good crap because that's not how the world works, sometimes you bust your ass at work and the guy sitting next to you gets the promotion... is that fair? Nope. Is that the way it goes? Yep.
What are they going to do go running to their boss and say... hey that guy is mean he stole my idea, why didn't I get the promotion? Is there extra credit I can do?-- Tough titty said the kitty... that's life.
The world is not all sunshine and roses... I refuse to improperly prepare my baby for the way the world works.
-- End rant (steps off soapbox)
I hope everyone has a good Saturday!
Re: Its not all sunshine and roses!
Molly-coddling leads to entitlement. There is definitely a good balance between encouraging kids and offering help and just letting them get away with everything to make it easy on their delicate psyches.
There are consequences to actions. If I didn't get a report done in time for school there is no way in hell that my parents would call and ask for a time extension. I would either: A- turn it in late and get a lower grade or B- get stuck with a zero because it wasn't done in time. My fault, my responsibility.
Life sucks sometimes... ok a lot of times... but thats what makes you stronger. How are you supposed to learn the "lessons of life" if there are no lessons being taught?
YAY! This is one of my favorite topics. I am a teacher. The PP was right on when she said that teachers get their hands forced by parents. For example, if I try to outlaw tattling in my class, I get a slew of angry parents telling me that now ther kid is suddenly being "bullied" and is afraid to tell me. Or how about when you give a kid the grade they earned, and the parents come at you with flaming torches? I would love to have failure and competition (real aspects of life) in my classroom so kids could learn from it, but as it is we are not allowed to even discipline a child without everyone getting up in arms. I am not even talking about harsh discipline, which I am not in favor ot. I am talking about making a kid sit out a recess.
Anway, back to the real topic. I totally agree that people are not taught that life is a struggle. We are taught to expect to "be whatever we want to be" without any hard work. I notice this especially among males my age. They never got out of their parents' basements. The females, however, are quite successful. I am not sure what went wrong. I won't blame teachers, though. Teachers pretty much do what is dicatated by society at the time.
I also see a VERY lazy, spoiled, entitled generation of teens coming up the pike. They are not even allowed to get part time jobs, because their parents for some reason don't like the idea. They all have smart phones, cars and designer clothes all paid for by dad. It sickens me. These kids aren't going to stand a chance in the real world at this rate.
OP, I agree with you on most everything. Kids need to learn how to win AND how to lose, and how to succeed AND how to fail. But, as a teacher, I also agree that parental pressure plays a huge role in what we are/aren't able to do. I really think that a lot of parents want teachers to hold kids to deadlines and to help them learn responsibility...unfortunately the VERY vocal group of parents that feel that their children deserve special treatment are causing teachers and administrators to bend rules and regulations. There are parents out there who can make your life as a teacher very miserable.
On a hopeful note...I teach K-12 students. I get to see the whole range of students and parents and expectations. Our current 6-9 graders are some of the most "entitled" students I've ever taught. (Example: An 8th grade student emailed me 5 times over the course of 2 hours...he had turned in an assignment that day at 3 pm. The assignment was a week late. As of 4pm that day, I hadn't changed his grade in my online gradebook...and he was demanding that I change the grade ASAP. His parents e-mailed me at 7 that night also wondering why the grade hadn't been changed.) However, the tide seems to be turning again. This past September, one of the Kindergarten teachers commented that last year and this year the parents of her students are much more supportive of her enforcing discipline and holding students to a high standard...allowing them to fail when necessary.
Just a side note...A few years ago, our principal showed us this article from Psychology Today it pretty much echos exactly what you said.
I'm not necessarily blaming teachers I just wish they could get their administrations to hold their ground and force parents to be parents and students to do what they have to do get the grades. It's an all over problem that STARTS with the PARENTS... little timmy or becky is perfect and would never do anything wrong... ugh... my parents never bought into that ***, the rules were if you get in trouble at school you'll get it 10x worse at home so do what you're supposed to do. YOu know because adults used to put more stock in the words of adults than the words of children who were trying to get out of trouble.
Side note my sister is a teacher, and I know what you ladies mean about your hands being forced. She has one kid who will not do his homework, she's sent letters home, called home, and the mom keeps telling her that her son said that he did it and that she must have lost it. -- they then expect her to give him an A on all of these "lost" assignments.
It all starts at such a young age too. I work at daycare and it is amazing at how many excuses a parent can make up for their child's behavior. And they just cannot believe that they don't behave at school because their perfect angels at home (yeah because they are sitting infront of an electronic device and told to be quiet). Movies in the classroom used to be a reward and the kids would love watching a movie, now when I put a movie in once ever 3 months the kids want to do something else instead of watching the movie, because that is all they do at home!
Parents need to start parenting instead of being friends and making their child happy. LIFE IS NOT FAIR!
Amen, and it starts with us teaching our kids properly, making them go through the "lumps" of life and not letting them get away with murder.
We'd all love to believe our kids were perfect little angels, but we all know better... I mean think about it, were you a perfect little angel? I wasn't. -- so what makes some parents think that their kids are? -- I don't get it.
PS I loved the article posted, it is a much longer version of what I said...it sad that no one wants to work hard and learn from their mistakes anymore.
The saying I remember a lot when I was growing up was..."if at first you don't succeed, try, try again."
Today it seems the saying is "If at first you don't succeed, have mommy and daddy call the coach/teacher and *** until they tell you you are a success."
sad.
I loved the article, too. I feel like I could have written it myself! I especially agree with the parts about play and organized sports.
This discussion has me thinking about what I will do as a parent to try to live within my own beliefs. I don't want my child to have to go to all-day kindergarten. I don't want my kid to be in soccer with the crazy parents screaming from the stands. I live near a really "hippie-ish" town and could take my kid to that school district. They encourage play, art, individuality, and they have some of the best test scores in the state.
I wanted to put it out there, also, that I have worked with a broad spectrum of families in terms of financial backgrounds. I will tell you, the entitled ones are NOT the poor. The poor families I work with by and large know how to struggle. They work multiple jobs, encourage their children, support discipline, and are quite conservative in their beliefs. They don't want pity or handouts. Some of the PPs took this discussion as an opportunity to flame the poor and I think we need to educate ourselves and be careful not to spread prejudice.
Case in point: I read my class a fable about a poor man who found a gold ring, returned it, and became rich from the reward. The kids interpreted the poor man as worthless, lazy, and shameful. They failed to see the moral in the fable. They failed to see that the man actually was morally good in the story, because they would not see past the poverty. It was interesting to me, because my class is made up of homeless and poverty-stricken children.
Yep, I agree. Honestly, I think a lot of "family time" has been thrown to the wayside and replaced by external stimuli like tv, internet, cell phones, etc... I am regularly shocked to see parents out for walks with their kids and see them chatting away on their cell phones or on their iPods. As a culture, we are so used to being plugged in 24/7 that it seems we often forget to spend time with those around us.
Parents are still expecting Timmy to get straight A's, but they aren't putting aside the time and effort to teach Timmy the skills he needs to attain the grades and disussing why he did not get an A on his last project. Same thing with sports, everyone wants to win, but they don't want to work towards it, especially if it means taking time away from a TV show or facebook to teach Timmy how to kick a soccer ball.
IMO, a lot of this may have to do with the fact that the internet, iPads, smart phones and satellite/extensive channel cable are all fairly new. I'm guessing that most of the women on here remeber a time when they did not have a computer in their home (or at least internet access). Our children will never know that. There are so many external distractions that allow for us to tune out from our children, and plug them into something so we have a free moment, that I think parents often forget to work on the life skills with their kids.
And that is my $0.02 on the topic.
For the bolded parts above:
Don't get me wrong I LOVE organized sports... as they are meant to be played, there's a winner and a loser and you shake hands and be sportsman like and you learn how to cope with faliure and be a gracious winner. I played organized sports from the time I was 4 years old until I was 23. It taught me a lot about hard work, dedication and not giving up but learning from my mistakes.
I don't like that now everyone is considered a "winner" just for showing up.
I've read the posts and re-read the posts and I don't see where anyone was flaming the poor. Just poor parenting in general where we teach our kids that they are entitled to everything under the sun. -- but maybe I'm missing it.
Just to add we were not poor but we were by no means rich, we had what we needed and worked for what we wanted. Sometimes we got what we wanted, sometimes we didn't. But I was almost always aware of the household situations and didn't ask for much if money was tight.
In case you are referring to my pp, I didn't mean all poor people feel entitled. I'm talking about the people that just sit back with their hands out saying "gimme gimme gimme" instead of working for anything. I just see it all too often at my job, so when anyone brings up topics like this, it's the first thing that comes to my mind. Just the simple fact that because kids are being raised as "winners" when they aren't deserving of it, reminds me of how it affects us as adults and feeling entitled to things without earning them.