NBF: my marriage is on the rocks

SarieP

DH (and the D definitely does not mean dear this time) decided to make an $11k decision without me.  I'm FURIOUS.  We are not well off at all.  As a matter of fact, we struggle to make ends meet and we are trying to save for a house.   

Long story short, he is a mechanic and owns a ridiculously expensive toolbox.  We traded it in to downsize and reduce his payments.  The amount financed went from about 10k to 4k. Since then he has been prodding me to see if he can get a new toolbox to which I said no since he had just gotten this one.  I told him he needed to pay off this one and then we would talk about trading it in on another one.  Well, last Friday, he found a toolbox he wanted. He had ALL WEEKEND to discuss it with me and decided not to.  Monday, he signed the papers.  He told me about it last night.

He says he feels awful and knows it was a terrible decision.  He is apologizing profusely and says he is going to call the guy and see if there is any way to reverse the paperwork to get out of it.  I don't feel like I can trust him. How can you have a marriage without trust?  I don't know what to do.  I'm so hurt and angry.  I feel like he betrayed my trust intentionally.  He is begging me to forgive him and I don't kow how. 

Any advice?  I love my husband and aside from this things have been so wonderful . . . at least what I know of.  Who knows what else he has hidden. 

lwilkinson

I'm thinking there may be some other areas where you havent been able to trust him??? But wow, that's a huge decision to make for your family. Begging you to forgive him sounds like it's better to ask forgiveness than permission. I'd be furious too but I wouldnt call it a deal breaker. 

SarieP

I think he has always had horrible judgment with money.  We had actually just reached a solution to our money disagreements that seemed to be working great.  He is the spender and I'm the saver.

This absolutely floorboarded me because it seemed so unlike him to make a decision THAT BIG without consulting me. Usually it is over little stuff like a new fishing pole or something like that. The money isn't the issue.  It is the betrayal and complete lack of respect for me as an equal part of this marriage.

Phantomgirl

SarieP:

he has been prodding me to see if he can get a new toolbox to which I said no since he had just gotten this one.  I told him he needed to pay off this one and then we would talk about trading it in on another one. 

SarieP:

 

complete lack of respect for me as an equal part of this marriage 

 

It does not really seem like the marriage was very equal to begin with.  

I would be furious to but I have to say $4000 does not seem like an adequate toolbox for a proper mechanic.  Did you force him to downsize to something not suitable for his line of work?  Did he really need something bigger?  Perhaps he was trying to tell you that but you had your heart set on buying a house.

I do think he messed up big time by going behind your back I am just trying to play devils advocate and give you another perspective to view this from.  You have every right to be this upset.

taylormillgirl

He was probably thinking it's better to beg forgiveness than ask permission, and I'm also assuming he can't get out of his contract without a large penalty and he knows that, too. 11k is a serious debt, and if he's never been good with money (and isn't making an effort now), you're looking at a lifetime of struggle and fighting. I don't know...I hate to say end your relationship over money, but at the same time, I think this will eat away at your marriage if he doesn't make big changes very soon. (My first husband--DD's father--was just like your H. I was a saver and he was a spender. Even when we had nothing, he was buying things on credit without my permission. We fought constantly about it and eventually separated. When he died a few weeks later, guess who got stuck with paying off all that debt he incurred.)

Phantomgirl

OK so I feel that maybe suggesting you forced him was a bit strong but did he agree to your budget and then regret it.  You say yourself he tried to talk to you but you shut him down and told him ... 'pay this off and then we'll talk'.  Perhaps he realized that the toolbox was not working for him and that you were not going to talk/budge on the matter.

DREWLILY

SarieP:

This absolutely floorboarded me because it seemed so unlike him to make a decision THAT BIG without consulting me.

...he did consult you and you said no, so he did it anyways thinking he could just apologize for it later and say he feels bad. To me, you already said no, and he did it anyways. He didn't take in your concerns or thoughts into consideration at all and it was a huge expense. Not cool at all. I don't have advice for you, sorry, your situation sux and I hope you guys can get it resolved.

SarieP

We agreed on how to make decisions in our marriage a long time ago.  Money is my strength so those are the decisions I am supposed to make.  That works (for the most part) for us.  The discussion about the toolbox before wasn't as cut and dry as "pay this off and we'll talk".  He actually agreed that it was wise to wait. 

I understand and appreciate your efforts to be devil's advocate but he acknowledges that he is completely wrong in this and that I am in no way at fault.  He said his toolbox wasn't working for him, which I would've understood had he discussed it with me.  Before, he just wanted a bigger nicer toolbox. It was on a want basis, not a need. He will admit that. 

I just don't know what would go through his head to justify making a decision like this.  How do you rationalize something this big?  That is what concerns me.  If he could do it this time, what's next??

SarieP

DREWLILY:

SarieP:

This absolutely floorboarded me because it seemed so unlike him to make a decision THAT BIG without consulting me.

...he did consult you and you said no, so he did it anyways thinking he could just apologize for it later and say he feels bad. To me, you already said no, and he did it anyways. He didn't take in your concerns or thoughts into consideration at all and it was a huge expense. Not cool at all. I don't have advice for you, sorry, your situation sux and I hope you guys can get it resolved.

I brought up that exact point last night.

duchessofdeuce

Money is the #1 reason marriages fail in the US.

You guys need to do some serious talking and get on the same page fast.  I think you need to tell him this is making you question other aspects of your marriage.  He was way out of line to make that decision without you.  I do agree though, a $4000 tool box is pretty small for a mechanic.  I understand that sometimes you have to make due, but could this have been an issue of his employer having a problem with his lack of supplies for the  job?  Maybe he was too embarrassed to tell you?   

SarieP

The reason he only had $4k financed is because he traded an older one in on that one.  The one he has is a $9k toolbox.  It is more than sufficient for him.  He said the reason why he needed a new one is because this one could be broken in to.  I would've understood if he would have talked to me about it because that is his livelihood.  He easily has $40k in tools. 

So how do you trust someone after being betrayed like that? 

Phantomgirl

So how do you trust someone after being betrayed like that? 

I genuinely don't have an answer for you.  I really would have a hard time getting over the anger and hurt.  Every time the bill came in I would be furious again.

Talk talk talk thats all I can say.  Only when you know he gets how truly hurt and disappointed you are will you be able to forgive him and move on. 

I think you probably need to accept that the toolbox now belongs to you guys. 

SarieP

I think he does realize it now and I believe that he truly feels badly and understands why it was a bad decision on multiple levels.  I am just fearful of the same types of mistakes being made in our future.  It is somewhat comforting that he is trying to get the sales rep to reverse the sale but that still doesn't excuse the fact that he made that kind of decision without regard to my feelings.

sweetie0228

I'm the money manager in my family too.  SO loves it and hates it.  He's terrible with money and remembering to pay bills...so I do it.  But I also do other stuff that he hates like I move around my debt or refiance debt without talking to him first.  Mostly, because he doesn't get it if I talk to him first. I usually make the desicion do it and then show him how it benefits him/family.

What I should do...and here's where my suggestion comes in...is educate.  (I really need to take my own advice about this) Part of my SO's and it sounds like your H's issue is they don't get the impact of financial decisions.  My SO just stays out of it and knows he has a $100 limit he can make all his own decisions without consulting me up to $100 after that we talk.  Your H...seems to be more impulsive.  Sooo we need to educate our guys.  BUT I don't think it can come from us w/out setting up a parent-child allowance dynamic. 

Outside Financial counselor.  We should bring all our financial info, income, debt, expenses, budget and take it to a finanical counselor and have that person look at our whole financial picture and explain it to our guys.  And I think even we could learn something too or they make really give us the ultimate vindication we're doing the best we can w/ what we got.

Maybe if he heard what the real picture is like from another source it would make more sense to him and he'll be able to stick w/ the plan better.

SarieP

sweetie0228:

I'm the money manager in my family too.  SO loves it and hates it.  He's terrible with money and remembering to pay bills...so I do it.  But I also do other stuff that he hates like I move around my debt or refiance debt without talking to him first.  Mostly, because he doesn't get it if I talk to him first. I usually make the desicion do it and then show him how it benefits him/family.

What I should do...and here's where my suggestion comes in...is educate.  (I really need to take my own advice about this) Part of my SO's and it sounds like your H's issue is they don't get the impact of financial decisions.  My SO just stays out of it and knows he has a $100 limit he can make all his own decisions without consulting me up to $100 after that we talk.  Your H...seems to be more impulsive.  Sooo we need to educate our guys.  BUT I don't think it can come from us w/out setting up a parent-child allowance dynamic. 

Outside Financial counselor.  We should bring all our financial info, income, debt, expenses, budget and take it to a finanical counselor and have that person look at our whole financial picture and explain it to our guys.  And I think even we could learn something too or they make really give us the ultimate vindication we're doing the best we can w/ what we got.

Maybe if he heard what the real picture is like from another source it would make more sense to him and he'll be able to stick w/ the plan better.

 

Great suggestion!  I'll have to try that.

fellesferie

Dave Ramsey calls this kind of thing financial infidelity & says it's just as damaging as any other kind of infidelity.

I think you should see a marriage counselor about rebuilding the trust and at he same time, try to talk with him about the financial issues. He needs to somehow be on the same page and really buy in to the budget. If you tell him what he can and can't do and "allow" certain spending, he'll never be a partner to you in this--and that's what you need and deserve.

I don't really want to do free advertising for Dave Ramsey, especially since we're more Clark Howard people, but Dave Ramsey does do a lot of programs at churches. I think his thing is called Financial Peace University. Maybe your H would do better at getting on board if the info and plan came from a third party?

My H is more fiscally responsible than am I. He does occasionally have to tell me no, but I am behind him on our savings plan. But it's because of him that we're (aside from our mortgage) debt free. 

SarieP

fellesferie:

Dave Ramsey calls this kind of thing financial infidelity & says it's just as damaging as any other kind of infidelity.

I think you should see a marriage counselor about rebuilding the trust and at he same time, try to talk with him about the financial issues. He needs to somehow be on the same page and really buy in to the budget. If you tell him what he can and can't do and "allow" certain spending, he'll never be a partner to you in this--and that's what you need and deserve.

I don't really want to do free advertising for Dave Ramsey, especially since we're more Clark Howard people, but Dave Ramsey does do a lot of programs at churches. I think his thing is called Financial Peace University. Maybe your H would do better at getting on board if the info and plan came from a third party?

My H is more fiscally responsible than am I. He does occasionally have to tell me no, but I am behind him on our savings plan. But it's because of him that we're (aside from our mortgage) debt free. 

I think hearing it from a religious perspective would really hit home with my H. I'll look him up and see what I can find.  Thanks.

duchessofdeuce

SarieP:

So how do you trust someone after being betrayed like that? 

Honestly if it were me, I wouldn't.  I would want all the money in my account, all the paychecks in my account, and I would start handling my finances and he would get enough cash each week to live on and that would be it. 

Karma1969

Do you have a child together?

tsevere

Really?  We're talking divorce over this?

No wonder there are so many broken families out there.

J&A2008

I think the best result now is the natural consequences: he HAS to be involved in budgeting for your family so he can see the detrimental effects his decision has on your entire family.

I don't think this one mistake is a deal breaker, but I do think you'll want to pay attention to how he responds and deals with the consequences.  Make him an active part of your financial planning.  Work together as a team.  Make him be responsible, and judge how you plan your future on his ability to work with you.

rowdytexan

tsevere:

Really?  We're talking divorce over this?

No wonder there are so many broken families out there.

This was my thought. I didn't read EVERY comment but..it seems like you're paranoid. You keep bringing up "what's next".

1. I don't think money is really the issue at all here. He broke your trust..If you're going to spend the rest of your marriage being paranoid about "what's next"..it's not going to work.

2. Men are dumb..not really dumb, just...OOOH SHINY STUFF I HAVE TO HAVE IT! My DH is no longer allowed to go to car lots..ever..

3. Take him to a homeless shelter and make him serve lunch or something and tell him that's where you guys will end up if he keeps on being an idiot about money.

4. Make him do all the bills and finance stuff for a while.

5. He was dumb, now you guys have to pay for it. DONE..no use in being all mad and bitter about it forever. If you're going to be, well it sucks to be you.

6. You guys will probably think back to this and laugh 20 years from now. Cheer up..it's not the end of the world, OR your marriage.