TTC After a Loss
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TTCAL week of 8/28 Check-In

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Re: TTCAL week of 8/28 Check-In

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    Not new, been here since the spring. CD10. Wondering where I go from here. OBGYN said nothing conclusive was found from 2nd mc and if I want he can refer me to a recurrent pregnancy loss clinic. He never gave me any indication as to whether I should try again now or wait until I go to the clinic and see if there's a reason for my 2 mc's. After the 1st I convinced myself that I just had crappy luck (if you can call it that) but after the 2nd I don't know if it's me or if it's something that can maybe be 'fixed' or if it was just crappy luck again. Waiting for the clinic referral will likely take a few months and I'll be 41 in October so time's ticking.  
    Rave - I'm going away this weekend with DH to a small little island getaway and staying at a really cute waterfront B&B with an outdoor shower! I'm really looking forward to it
    Hmm, I recently found this quote and absolutely loved it (added u in favourite because I'm Canadian and we add the u :) )  "You'll always be my favourite what if"  I also love the song lyrics "I hope you still feel small when you stand beside the ocean" and "when you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance"

    I've been @strawberryanne  @fishee333 @ELeighMay @robyn2201 @shri929 so sorry to see some new names here

    @amberruka Love that quote
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    amberrukaamberruka member
    edited August 2017
    @40momma hey girl, I was wondering how you were doing. Enjoy the mini vacay and outdoor shower!  :)
    Me: 39 DH: 39
    CP 1/25/16 4.5 weeks, developed Graves' disease
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    Hi  38 almost 39... ttc after loss 7 weeks ago.  Fertile smiley today opk and bd today .

    I can't remember what I'm supposed to say lol 
    A rant:  WE NEED to bd tmrw but I'm cramping pretty bad. 

    Also..this is new for me... after bd,  I was bleeding a lot.. pink, but a lot.  Hoping it has something to do with my miscarriage.  2nd cycle since mc, so I'm hoping it sticks . Feeling hopeful and happy to be back trying!!!

    And a quote I love is 
    "When we have empathy then there is no room for judgement" 


    Working on myself these days. 
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    Well I've read 50 pages of that egg book. I'm over the OCD process off ttc but it has been an interesting read so far. So I guess I should avoid plastic food storage and canned foods. We had just bought a few glass food storage. Guessing I should stop drinking bottled water. I don't see myself following this to a T as I could go crazy. Definitely interested in the supplement chapter.
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    @vlagrl29 Ooo thanks for updating. I searched online and found the book at my local library so I'm going to sign it out tonight. I can't imagine that I'd follow the book to a T either, but I'm interested to see what it says since my RE thinks my eggs might be old before their time. 

    Me: 35 I DH: 38
    *TW loss and children mentioned*
    DD:2006 | Dx: Unexplained Secondary Infertility | DS: 2011

    TFAS since 2012

    Oct 16: Spontaneous BFP | m/c @ 9w1d (massive SCH) | D&C
    Apr 17: IUI #1 = BFN
    May 17: IUI #2 = BFN
    Jun 17: IUI #3 = Late BFP (18 DPO) | NMC 17Jul17 @ ~6w
    Aug 17: IUI #4 = Cancelled due to premature ovulation | TI = BFN
    Sep 17: IUI #5 = Cancelled due to overstimulation (10+ follies)
    Nov 17: IVF #1 = Cancelled due to non-IF related health issue | TI = BFN
    Dec 17: IVF #1 = Puregon 200, Menopur 75, Orgalutran, Suprefact trigger due to OHSS risk | 22R, 18M, 16F, 10B frozen  
    Feb 18: FET #1 (medicated) = BFN
    Mar 18: FET #2 (natural cycle) = CP (beta 1: 54; beta 2: 0)
    Apr 18: FET #3 (natural cycle) = cancelled due to missed ovulation
    Apr 18: FET #3 (natural cycle) = BFP! Beta 1: 201  Beta 2: 585 Beta 3: 3254 Beta 4: 9715 U/S 19May - one bean measuring on track with a HB of 125!
    EDD: 07Jan2019 Team Green
    My Rainbow Baby Boy born 03Jan2019 <3 

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    Mack2342Mack2342 member
    edited August 2017
    @vlagrl29 and @tosh24. I just ordered the book.  If this last round of IUIs is going to be it.  I'm going to do everything I can to say I gave it my all.  I just finished taking charge of my fertility.  I might be a little late with these books and should have read them earlier but hell I was late to the TTC game to begin with.  We started trying at 39 and I'm 42 now 
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    @tosh24 - some things I know I can't do.  Like she said to not use a coffee pot that is made of plastic which most are.  I see avoiding the storage containers and bottled water much easier for me.  I don't eat much canned foods anyways.  I skip the parts that pertain to IVF since that's not what I'm doing.  I think plastic is more of a problem when it gets hot like when you heat it up with food in it in the microwave.  Something about it getting heat releases the BPA.  Also take out containers are not good.

    I'm a bit nervous to read the next chapter which is about a toxin that is in makeup.  I don't want to  change out all my make up.  See I used all these things when I got pregnant with DD so that's why I'm more interested in learning about supplements and drinking that raspberry leaf tea.
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    vlagrl29vlagrl29 member
    edited August 2017
    @Mack2342 -  I think it's a great idea for you to read it if this is it for you.  I never read taking charge of your fertility.  I know my cycle enough by now I don't think it would benefit me.  I'm just going to stick with my plan of BD EOD days 10-20 and take an OPK.  I always O sometime between days 14-16.  This is my last push naturally then I'm done and possible clomid next year.
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    Got an email from MIL - apparently she said she saw an article on the news that some yoga mats have a toxin in them that contribute to infertility. Thanks MIL because why are other yogis getting pregnant?
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    TW (child mentioned)



    Missed a lot because my DS started school yesterday. Trying to catch up!





    @vlagrl29 sounds like an interesting book. I can see myself avoiding water bottles too. I would hate to switch out my make-up tho! Ugh!
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    @vlagrl29 I think I could switch out makeup but I only wear it every once in a blue moon so I don't think it really matters.  Plus like you I wore it when I was pregnant with DS 
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    I feel so strongly now I just want to tell everyone to F@ck off.  I'll probably reply to her email and just let her know I'm not going bat shit crazy about this stuff and for now we are just going with the flow and see what happens.
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    vlagrl29 You go girl! Sometimes you seriously need to tell people when it's time to back off. Like all of this isn't stressful enough, we certainly don't need people helping raise that stress level with their tips and tricks.
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    @EleighMay - that's why when my OB told me last week I have unexplained infertility I gave him a look and straight to his face told him I'm not infertile.  Screw You!!  well I didn't say that last part to him :)

    Anyways I replied to MIL via text and told her there are probably tons of toxins out there and we all have it in our system.  I have a lulu lemon yoga mat so I doubt there is a crazy toxin in it.  I told her I have 2 choices right now in my path of life - go bat shit crazy ttc or just enjoy my blessings now and I'm choosing the later.
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    vlagrl29 Good for you! I envy those women who have amazing relationships with their MIL's. Mine, not so much, so a text like that would've seriously rubbed me raw.
    I'm currently at the BSC stage of TTC I think. While clearly it's common to have everything messed up after mc I am sick of waiting for AF. My OB told me I ovulated on CD14, and here I am on CD 30 waiting on AF. Like, COME ON ALREADY, let's get the show on the road. I know full well it's not uncommon for the cycle length to increase, but having patience isn't my strong suit so it's even more annoying when I have absolutely no control over it.  
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    I completely understand where you are at @ELeighMay - as that was me in the early part of this year.  So after googling for that article MIL sent me the materials in yoga mats that are PVC or polyurethane can be toxic.  They have just started studies on this.  So I call our lulu lemon store and ask them to tell me the ingredients.  One being polyurethane which is on the top side of their mat to make it not slippery.  So I informed them of the article I read just to let them know.  So I find an article of preferred mats that are very eco friendly and that is Manduka or Jade.  Looks like a new yoga mat is in my future!
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    Seriously, yoga mats can contribute to infertility? And makeup? Ugh there's too much stuff to avoid. That just stresses me out. Not that I even do yoga lol. I am curious about this book though, @vlagrl29, please share more interesting stuff you read about. I'm especially interested in supplements as well.

    I know what you mean about being impatient... It hasn't even been 4 weeks since my D&E and I'm already like, come on period, where are you???? I gotta get back to reality and accept that my period is probably going to take even longer than 4 weeks to come back. I'm just ready to get it and move on TTC. 

    Also, thanks guys for your feedback on ovulating and HCG levels. 
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    ladies just don't stress about it all - it will make it worse.  I'm just switching out yoga mats because I do a lot of yoga and yoga is full of inhales and exhales.  I won't be switching make up. ha!
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    @fishee333 Mine took 7 weeks to come back!
    BabyFruit Ticker
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    1. Still newish I guess - 7 weeks post d&c
    2. Benched until surgery for polyp removal in October 
    3. Finally got my chromosome results back from the miscarriage today. It was a girl with trisomy 21 and inversion of chromosome 9. Per my RE, likely a fluke but we will see what my chromosome testing says. Definitely the cause of the miscarriage though. Also, found out I'm insulin resistant and he wants me to start metformin. The combo of the birth control and metformin makes me feel like I'm pregnant and have morning sickness, which is kind of a downer. 
    4. Recently heard this quote and it really describes this season that I am in - "I'm half agony, half hope." Jane Austen. 
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    GeekBeagleGeekBeagle member
    edited September 2017
    1. Introduce yourself (if you're new)
    Been around a few weeks.

    2. Status? CD7 after my first period post-MC, so officially allowed to try.

    3. Rants/Raves
    Sorry I haven't been around this past week. Lots going on. Last week I mentioned that DH and I got in a fight while on vacation. It's been 6 days and he's still barely talking to me. We've had many fights in the past regarding the same issues. I am quite awful at communicating and talking about my feelings. I actually called for a counseling referral this morning because I just feel so overwhelmed with life now. He refuses to go with me, but I just need to talk to someone about all the emotions I have going on about everything in my life now and can hopefully work on myself. That being said, I am supposed to ovulate in 6 days and it's not looking like we will be at the point to BD in order to TTC this cycle. So, I'm super upset about that too because that's all I've been looking forward to for the past month.

    Oh, and over the past two days two good friends of mine made pregnancy announcements for their first babies. I was actually genuinely excited about both announcements, which has not been the case for me lately, so that's something positive. But, they did make me bummed that I won't be having a baby at the same time as them.

    4. GYKY. What is your favorite quote (or song lyric)? Comparison is the thief of joy.
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    @GeekBeagle I'm sorry it's been a rough week. I think going to a counselor will be helpful. Sending hugs your way! 
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    1. Introduce yourself (if you're new) Not new, just suck at consistently checking in. I'm going to try to be better (and catch-up on every one now)! 
    2. Status? Circling the drain 
    :(  
    3. Rants/Raves: 
    Rant: I left my RE a few weeks ago feeling positive because we finally had answers. She mentioned that I would have my septate surgery with my next period, just to call with CD1 and we’ll be on our way to trying again. Fast forward to CD1 (only a week and a half later, which I mentioned at my appointment) this month and they don’t have any availability to do my surgery, need to try next month. I had gotten my hopes up so high that we could finally get this show on the road and all this would be behind me, but it got ripped away all because of vacations and they have too many transfers scheduled that week to fit me in. Crushed. On top of that my “due date” was next week and my labs came back indeterminate for the clotting disorder, so off to the hematologist I go. So back to circling the drain. 

    Oh and my other rant: bump mobile sucks. 

    Rave: I finally signed up for the gym membership to start back swimming. Last night was my first night back and it was so mind clearing and motivating. I think I’ll be relying on this heavily to get me through this emotionally/physically and disconnect from the countdown to hopefully surgery in a few weeks.
    4. GYKY. What is your favorite quote (or song lyric)? I heard a song on the radio (which is about a breakup BTW) which the lyrics just really stuck with me about how this whole process has felt (the high and shine of finding out I was pregnant 3x and then the hurt and sting of losing them and the whole process in general. “Every little thing”

    Every little thing, I remember every little thing, The high, the hurt, the shine, the sting, Of every little thing

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    @leahcimmichael I like that quote!

    @mack2342 HBD to your DS!

    @vlagrl29 Your puppy is SOOO cute! They can’t be spoiled too much. So basically the egg book is suggesting we wrap ourselves in bubble wrap and don’t expose ourselves to anything? Eh, scratch that, that’s plastic, so a glass booth with filtered air? ;)  

    @moofish2364 That quote is beautiful!

    @strawberryanne Sorry for your loss. Please make sure that you make yourself the priority. Work’s never going away and one day won’t make or break it.

    @jchpg Hope that you get your answers.

    @amberruka Ugh, hopefully you’re making better plans to celebrate this weekend?

    @pumpkinpancake That sounds amazing. I’m glad I’m not the only one that feels like I need a vacation from my vacation!

    @Eleighmay I’m sorry about your mother. I completely understand because my mother is the same way. I’m glad that you survived the reception though! PS a new oven is definitely the way to my heart

    @fishee333 I’m sorry for your loss and that you find yourself here. Spacing has been a really tough part for me too, so I understand what you mean.

    @shri929 Glad everything looked great for you!

    @silvergreen Sorry for the BFN :( Hopefully your body will sync with the Japan schedule for next cycle!

    @tosh24 Seriously they denied your IVF claim? Insurance companies infuriate me, hopefully everything works out so you can move on.

    @zamora_spin Fingers crossed for you that you don’t make it to the RE!

    @40momma That island getaway sounds amazing!

    @mrsjcrane Hi from the other side of the bench!

    @geekbeagle I’m sorry that you’ve had such a rough few weeks. If you have a hard time communicating, maybe you could try to write him a letter so you have time to think it out in addition to the counselor? I’ve found that admission of what I’ve done wrong off the bat really helps DH come down from his anger to start the conversation on my part. 

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    2. Status? Benched. TWW.

    3. Rants/Raves Got back from visiting friends in Portland, Oregon last night. Had a great trip. *TW* Surprisingly did very well with being with the 11 month old and 4 year old. Super happy that I've gotten to a place in my life where I can at least find some joy in my friends kids, even if I still wish evil things to other peoples kids sometimes... *end TW* Not super happy about being back to work today, but looking forward to a long weekend!

    4. GYKY. What is your favorite quote (or song lyric)? Recently? “I aim to misbehave.”

    ELeighMay Sorry about the reception. Didn’t sound awful though. Did you end up having the cakes (since your oven died)?

    fishee333 Sorry for your loss. I’d definitely recommend temping… it can help a lot after a MC, as you try to figure out the ‘new normal’ for your body.

    MrsBunz Ugh. DH and I have different needs… it sucks when I’m like “hey baby ::waggles eyes::” and he’s like “Meh.”  *sigh* It can get super frustrating. But it is what it is I guess.

    tosh24 FL with your sister and her new baby. That’s a tough situation to be in, but self-love really is the best. Would telling your mom about the struggles help at all? I mean, I’ve been open with my mom about my struggles and she still says asinine things… so it may not help at all…. And ugh on the insurance making you wait 2 years for a procedure. As if this process isn’t hard enough. The whole lack of understanding insurance gives to IF and RPL struggles is ridiculous.

    mrsjcrane I believe chromosome 9 inversion is a common inversion (pretty sure this is the chromosome DH had an inversion on). The specialist told us that it was probably passed on in his family for generations and no one knew it was there until we had the test done. They said it had nothing to do with our TTC/RPL.

    GeekBeagle Sorry for the marital problems. Hope the counseling helps. Maybe after you start going for a while he’ll eventually come with you? It’s probably best not to TTC while you’re trying to work things out with him. Remember that TTC and PG is not a race…

    msstephanielynn WOW… that’s total crap! Ugh. Hopefully they can fit you in next month. Stupid that you need something specifically timed and they can’t make that happen because they’re too busy!

    MC #1: D&C Oct 23, 2015 (7.5 weeks)
    MC #2: July 1, 2016 (5.5 weeks)
    MC #3: October 17, 2016 (CP)
    RE #1: RPL testing November 2016-January 2017
    MC #4: Feb. 28, 2017 (CP)
    RE #2: Additional RPL testing March-November 2017
    MC #5: January 2019 (6.5 weeks)

    RE #3: More testing 2023. 
    Egg Retrieval Sept/Oct 2023, 2 good embryos after PGT-A testing.
    Surgery for endometriosis January 2024
    Lupron Depo March 2024.  Benched 3 months.  Hopefully FET after that.

    #BitterHagPartyOf1

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    @msstephanielynn Sounds like we are in the same boat! Waiting on surgery sucks! I might lose my mind waiting for 6 more weeks!!!! 

    @dpjennifer You're right. My RE said the inversion of chromosome 9 was "not clinically significant." He thought it had more so with the trisomy 21, but he was pretty sure that wouldn't be an issue moving forward! 

    @GeekBeagle Sorry you're having a rough time with DH. I'm sure it's making an already stressful situation much worse. Hope therapy helps! I've considered going myself to deal with feelings. 
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    I'm sorry about the DH issues @GeekBeagle - I can't handle silent treatment.  It does nothing but build up emotions in not a good way so they may manifest in a bad way.  My first husband use to pull that on me and at 1 time didn't speak to me for 2 weeks and wouldn't even look at me like I didn't even exist.  If he doesn't go with you to therapy I would suggest finding someone to go to yourself.  Eventually tell him if he doesn't go to therapy with you that you will leave.

    @msstephanielynn - pretty much but I'm just starting the prenatal vitamin chapter followed by the supplement chapter so that's what I'm really interested in.
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    @msstephanielynn I *love* that song lyric. It is so fitting. I'm so sorry that scheduling your surgery for this cycle has fallen through. That is really frustrating. Do they have a cancellation list or something they can put you on? Maybe some of their other appointments for transfers will get cancelled (not that I would wish that for anyone, but it does happen) and they could fit you in? Yes, insurance apparently gets to decide if I can build my family the way I had planned to or not. And the health care consultant my RE provided to help me fight started off by saying "well, I don't know exactly how you feel in this situation because I have 5 kids at home". Thanks douchebag. I plan to fight it but I just haven't had the energy to since I found out on Tuesday. I feel so overwhelmed with the uphill battle.

    @mrsjcrane That quote describes me perfectly through this process. It is so agonizing but if there wasn't a part of me that had hope, then I wouldn't be putting myself through all of this. Glad you were able to get some conclusive results back from the chromosome testing. While I was on the table in the OR waiting for my D&C I asked the OB on-call if the tissue could be tested and he said "no" so I'll never know. But it's a piece of information I really wish that I had. 

    @GeekBeagle I'm sorry you've had such a tough week. Dealing with all of this can put such a strain on a relationship. Good on you for making an appointment to see a therapist on your own. I hope YH comes around and is open to working through things with the help of a 3rd party. Over the last 11 years of our marriage, DH and I have seen a therapist 3 times to help us work through different situations that we just can't seem to get past/resolve on our own and it really does help us to come out stronger on the other end. Thinking of you guys!

      
    Me: 35 I DH: 38
    *TW loss and children mentioned*
    DD:2006 | Dx: Unexplained Secondary Infertility | DS: 2011

    TFAS since 2012

    Oct 16: Spontaneous BFP | m/c @ 9w1d (massive SCH) | D&C
    Apr 17: IUI #1 = BFN
    May 17: IUI #2 = BFN
    Jun 17: IUI #3 = Late BFP (18 DPO) | NMC 17Jul17 @ ~6w
    Aug 17: IUI #4 = Cancelled due to premature ovulation | TI = BFN
    Sep 17: IUI #5 = Cancelled due to overstimulation (10+ follies)
    Nov 17: IVF #1 = Cancelled due to non-IF related health issue | TI = BFN
    Dec 17: IVF #1 = Puregon 200, Menopur 75, Orgalutran, Suprefact trigger due to OHSS risk | 22R, 18M, 16F, 10B frozen  
    Feb 18: FET #1 (medicated) = BFN
    Mar 18: FET #2 (natural cycle) = CP (beta 1: 54; beta 2: 0)
    Apr 18: FET #3 (natural cycle) = cancelled due to missed ovulation
    Apr 18: FET #3 (natural cycle) = BFP! Beta 1: 201  Beta 2: 585 Beta 3: 3254 Beta 4: 9715 U/S 19May - one bean measuring on track with a HB of 125!
    EDD: 07Jan2019 Team Green
    My Rainbow Baby Boy born 03Jan2019 <3 

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    @ELeighMay that cake is beautiful!! 
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    sprkls8506 That's genuinely too sweet of you to say, but thank you. :)
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    ELeighMay Simple and elegant.  I like it.  :)

    MC #1: D&C Oct 23, 2015 (7.5 weeks)
    MC #2: July 1, 2016 (5.5 weeks)
    MC #3: October 17, 2016 (CP)
    RE #1: RPL testing November 2016-January 2017
    MC #4: Feb. 28, 2017 (CP)
    RE #2: Additional RPL testing March-November 2017
    MC #5: January 2019 (6.5 weeks)

    RE #3: More testing 2023. 
    Egg Retrieval Sept/Oct 2023, 2 good embryos after PGT-A testing.
    Surgery for endometriosis January 2024
    Lupron Depo March 2024.  Benched 3 months.  Hopefully FET after that.

    #BitterHagPartyOf1

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    @ELeighMay beautiful cake!
    Ivy: July 2010  |  Stella: Dec 2012  |  BFP#3: MMC at 11Wk's, July 2017 | Wyatt: April 2019 | BFP#5: Twin Girls due Sept 2020

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    @ELeighMay I love your cake!
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    @ELeighMay  So pretty!! 

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    @tosh24 I wish it worked like that. They have to book it in another office, so not only does that office have to be free but the doctor from mine has to be available too. It makes me worried that next month will unfortunately be the same deal again. I would ask for a different case manager because that is not OK. It sounds like it will be a frustrating fight, but for lack of better words, worth it. "Sometimes the right path is not the easiest one" 

    @vlagrl29 Now that I would be interested in hearing about - report back :) 

    @mrsjcrane Are you booked for a certain day or does it go by your cycle too? 
     
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    oh I will @msstephanielynn -  After I finish it I think I'll go ahead and have my blood taken for vitamin D levels and check my thyroid.  I set aside at least 30 minutes every night to read this book.  DH saw me reading a couple a days ago and asked me what i was reading because I never read!!
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    Wow so many replies since I last checked - not sure if I can keep up! On mobile, so I can only reply to a few...

    @GeekBeagle I'm really sorry about the issues you're having with your DH. I don't know what your relationship was like before TTC, but I know how much added stress it can put on a relationship. It sounds like you're making the effort to fix things with getting a referral for a therapist/counselor, and even if your DH won't go, it could help for you to talk to someone. 

    @vlagrl29 I haven't read the book you're talking about, but I'm curious about what it has to say. I definitely fall on more of the "crunchy" end of the spectrum, especially with things that I eat or put on my body. I don't obsess over it, but definitely some of the things you've mentioned with plastic/bpa, and chemicals in makeup are things I've been trying to avoid for a while. FWIW about the yoga mats, I have an Aurorae brand mat that claims to be non-toxic and eco friendly, and I love it.  Also, have you considered switching to a French press to avoid the heated plastic in a coffee maker? I'm a tea, not coffee, drinker, but my husband swears the French press makes the coffee taste better anyway. What's the name of this book, by the way? I think I missed it in some of the posts... 

    @ELeighMay that cake looks gorgeous!  I love to bake, but I joke with my family that I only make things that taste good, and can't always get it to look good :wink: Also, I'm stuck in the same waiting game as you and @fishee333... just waiting for my cycle to come back, and it's so frustrating that we have no control over it!  I'm trying hard not to stress or think about it, but I just want AF to come so I can get this show on the road! 
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    @pumpkinpancake - I've never heard of french press.  I've used my normal coffee maker for years!  I wouldn't say I'm crunchy and am not a crunchy mom but I'd rather try these things and know I gave it 100% my all before using clomid.  I'll look into french press.  I found a Jade yoga mat that is 100% eco and will be buying it on amazon in the next day or 2 with prime shipping.  Not using my lulu anymore.  The book is called "it starts with the egg".  I'm not switching out my makeup and not getting OCD with it but they say anything that has the word "fragrance" in it could be toxic.  I'm going to make minor changes with less plastic and not wearing perfume.   But I gotta have my hair products and hair spray.
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
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    Totally random thought-I get annoyed thinking about people who don't even know they are pregnant or people who don't care that they are and do so much worse and have healthy (or maybe not healthy but they don't miscarry) pregnancies. I feel like so many of us prob stress about so many things during pregnancy and still can't keep a pregnancy. 
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