Definitely a UO.... I'm really getting tired of all of the posts on Facebook about gender identity/transgender. I'm researching and reading about it and I REALLY just don't get it; I "identify" as female because I have lady parts, not because I fit into the social norms of being a "typical" woman (which most women don't). If you have a deep-seated desire to wear makeup and dresses, then cool, but in my opinion, that isn't the same as "identifying as female." I seriously just don't understand.
Me: 25 DH: 28
Hubby's little boy - my wonderful step-son - born 5/23/10
BFP#1: 06/2010...my beautiful baby girl born 3/7/2011
BFP #2: 10/24/15...mc on 10/31/15
BFP #3: 11/27/15. EDD 8/6/16
"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -Winston Churchill
@1faceinacrowd I work with a lot of youth that are LGBTQ I think I'm reading your post correctly.
Gender, gender expression, etc are a sliding scale. some days some feel more more feminine (wearing dresses, etc, while others we feel more masculine) This is the easiest way to understand it. The things you brought up in defining you gender are "I have lady parts" that would be under sex. Wearing makeup and dresses is under gender expression, and though it does not define your gender identity, it also can move along the scale laterally.
@texasmama2014 hah- I annoy my girlfriends with my overly positive and optimistic sayings but they just throw things at me and laugh at how corny I am. Lol im a dork - can't help it!!
I get so irritated when people constantly correct others grammar, punctuation, spelling, etc. It just comes off as so pretentious to me. It's a bit classless to make someone else feel bad or embarrass them over a stupid comma. I was a copy editor for years so, I get it but, just get over yourself!! Unless the person using bad grammar is an ignorant a-hole bashing others, then I'm fine with the public humiliation
@mrsrundell The *one* person I do that to? My little brother. He has a masters in English, his BA in English education. He should mind his their, there and they're.
Since it's March, here's my UO that's going to be an issue in the coming weeks. I hate March Madness! Ugh, it's so annoying. Out of nowhere, everyone suddenly claims to care about college basketball. And about obscure colleges in distant states that they didn't graduate from, and certainly wouldn't have heard of except for in the context of March Madness (I mean I know some big name schools are in it too, obviously). And then there's so much college basketball on TV that it pre-empts other programming. And when you end up getting stuck watching a game with your family or SO, and you get excited because the game is FINALLY over... and then they change the channel and there's a whole 'nother game to watch. And friends and co-workers try to get you to do a bracket, which often times you have to pay money for, and you look like a party-pooper if you don't participate. And the whole thing drags on for weeks!
@MSUgrad12 Isn't that sort of sexist though, to say that having certain traits or desires makes you more/less a man or woman? I mean, I'm not a huge fan of wearing dresses most days, and I could never be a stay-at-home mom because I'm way too into having a successful career, and don't even get my started on my cooking skills...but I'm still a woman. I identify as a woman because I grew up as a woman, with a vagina. I grew up having periods start in the middle of class and having to run to the bathroom, with a fear of getting made fun of if anyone could tell; I grew up having to work harder just to get the same amount of money as my co-workers with penises, and I grew up being told that I intimidate boys and that I shouldn't be so open about my intelligence or so direct/forward in how I talk to people because boys who are direct are strong, but girls who are direct are bitches.
Up until about a year ago, I thought that if you had a vagina, you were a girl - end of story. Anything beyond that is completely up to you. In my opinion, you can't really "identify" as a woman/girl unless you have experienced the things that come with biologically being a female, because everything else about being a woman is up for debate, and varies from person to person, and I know it's the same for men. That's why it doesn't make sense to me - because unless you fit perfectly into one stereotype or the other, how can you possibly identify as the gender that you weren't born as?
Me: 25 DH: 28
Hubby's little boy - my wonderful step-son - born 5/23/10
BFP#1: 06/2010...my beautiful baby girl born 3/7/2011
BFP #2: 10/24/15...mc on 10/31/15
BFP #3: 11/27/15. EDD 8/6/16
"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -Winston Churchill
My UO is probably going to not sit well with some people, but I am totally one of those people that need to see my baby before naming it. I find it a bit weird when people have the kid named before they even conceive! Just my opinion! With that said, we do have a list of names we like and some that are front runners, but I am not dead set on any of them until we the little ones!
@Snaps816 I'm with you. I couldn't care less about basketball. I've never done a bracket.
@1faceinacrowd I think what you're forgetting is that there are people who were born with one set of sex organs but truly identify with the other sex. So someone may not have grown up starting periods in the middle of class, but may truly feel they are trapped in the wrong body. Should that person not be allowed to live as a woman just because they were born with a penis? And what about gender reassignment? What if someone born male now has a vagina? Now are they allowed to be a woman finally? Where do you draw the line?
I agree that most people identify with the sex they were born, but gender identity is a complex topic that isn't always black or white.
It's not sexist. You aren't labeling others, they label themselves and where they sit on the scale, which can also change day to day. It's sexist for us to tell them what they are based on how they present. This is kind of hard to explain over the internet.
Example: Someone can be born female (sex), identify as male (gender/what they feel they truly are), wear dresses (gender expression) and be bisexual (attracted to).
I am only uses dresses as an example, obviously what is feminine and masculine is up to the person wearing it and generally society's view of femininity and masculinity.
"I mean, I'm not a huge fan of wearing dresses most days, and I could never be a stay-at-home mom because I'm way too into having a successful career, and don't even get my started on my cooking skills...but I'm still a woman. I identify as a woman because I grew up as a woman, with a vagina. I grew up having periods start in the middle of class and having to run to the bathroom, with a fear of getting made fun of if anyone could tell; I grew up having to work harder just to get the same amount of money as my co-workers with penises, and I grew up being told that I intimidate boys and that I shouldn't be so open about my intelligence or so direct/forward in how I talk to people because boys who are direct are strong, but girls who are direct are bitches."
^ You're over complicating it. These are all things you value in being a female or gender stereotypes defined by society. Your life experiences don't make you any less male or female. A Man that wants to be a homemaker or a woman who is a CEO, don't make them any less of their gender because they don't fit into the societal stereotypes.
This will stir the pot, I hate how politically correct we need to be now a days or you may offend someone.
Obviously be conscientious that what you say isn't rude or ignorant but come one. It can no longer be a gender reveal but a sex reveal...you think my grandma or aunts want to come to that (disclosure, I'm not having one)?They would think it was something to do with sex or toys lol. I think if someone says gender reveal, bite your tongue and move on if it offends you. Even this app/the bump says find out gender in the weekly task/guide. Yes I know that does not mean that it's correct but jezz.
If it's a friend, family member or coworker, sure educate them, spread the word, but to attack someone because they unknowingly said the wrong term when so much of this is still new, not mainstream, in the social media or being taught and therefore no way for them to have already known this. I get it, educate yourself and stay current, but honestly it's just so over the top. Don't be racists, don't be sexist and don't go out of your way to say something spiteful or mean but with all new things it takes a while to understand all of the differences.
With that being said, just be you, what makes you happy. I don't care if you were born a boy and are now female or see yourself that way, or a girl that likes girl, I'll still respect you and my views wouldn't change. Unless you kick puppies and do other horrible things.
Flame cloak is on, it's cool. I'm in -35 weather right now, I'll go jump in a snow bank if it gets too hot
@1faceinacrowd I dont think it's as black and white as you're making it. As a society we want to put people in boxes (male/female, etc) and many people don't feel like they fall into those norms. This doesn't mean that they have the biological experiences of being a woman that you have but in their mind they feel and relate more to being a woman than a man (or vice versa). Imagine looking in the mirror every morning and seeing a totally different body than the one you expect to see. As someone with very close people in my life who have transitioned I can tell you that it is a very real and painful place to be in mentally, and there is an incredible peace that comes with the process.
My UO is probably going to not sit well with some people, but I am totally one of those people that need to see my baby before naming it. I find it a bit weird when people have the kid named before they even conceive! Just my opinion! With that said, we do have a list of names we like and some that are front runners, but I am not dead set on any of them until we the little ones!
I am as well. It pissed off my inlaws to no end with my DD. This time we are team green which again drives them nuts. We also do not share our name options. I hate other people thinking their opinion matters in this decision. Because they don't matter.
Apparently UO: just because you don't understand something doesn't mean it's wrong. I can't begin to wrap my head around molecular physics but I'm not going to start bashing people who post about it on FB.
ETA: So my period never started while in class and, as far as I know, I've never had a lower salary than a male coworker in my position (not saying it doesn't happen, just saying I've personally never experienced it). Does that mean that I'm "less" of a woman? Do you have to personally experience sexism to identify as a woman?
I actually have personally experienced sexism, so I'm not being literal with this post. I'm just trying to understand your argument. I think you're having trouble separating biological sex with gender with gender expression. The genderbread person @MSUgrad12 spells it out pretty well, but it can be a hard concept to grasp if you haven't been exposed to it before.
This will stir the pot, I hate how politically correct we need to be now a days or you may offend someone.
Obviously be conscientious that what you say isn't rude or ignorant but come one. It can no longer be a gender reveal but a sex reveal...you think my grandma or aunts want to come to that (disclosure, I'm not having one)?They would think it was something to do with sex or toys lol. I think if someone says gender reveal, bite your tongue and move on if it offends you. Even this app/the bump says find out gender in the weekly task/guide. Yes I know that does not mean that it's correct but jezz.
If it's a friend, family member or coworker, sure educate them, spread the word, but to attack someone because they unknowingly said the wrong term when so much of this is still new, not mainstream, in the social media or being taught and therefore no way for them to have already known this. I get it, educate yourself and stay current, but honestly it's just so over the top. Don't be racists, don't be sexist and don't go out of your way to say something spiteful or mean but with all new things it takes a while to understand all of the differences.
With that being said, just be you, what makes you happy. I don't care if you were born a boy and are now female or see yourself that way, or a girl that likes girl, I'll still respect you and my views wouldn't change. Unless you kick puppies and do other horrible things.
Flame cloak is on, it's cool. I'm in -35 weather right now, I'll go jump in a snow bank if it gets too hot
I agree. Sex reveal is real weird. I think it's important to just be educated. I also think that some things people say are offensive because they are genuinely ignorant and this isn't even just in relation to sex/gender topics.
At the end of the day whether someone is using the term gender or sex for their baby isn't really a big deal, we all know what you mean. There isn't a reason to attack someone over it.
However, I do think it is important that if someone, even if they present as male or female, tells you they are a certain gender; we take it and accept it rather than invalidate them.
I saw this thing the other day, that was so spot on. "When we accidentally call a male dog a female, and are told "she's a girl." we correct ourselves. Why can't we do the same for people?"
Definitely a UO.... I'm really getting tired of all of the posts on Facebook about gender identity/transgender. I'm researching and reading about it and I REALLY just don't get it; I "identify" as female because I have lady parts, not because I fit into the social norms of being a "typical" woman (which most women don't). If you have a deep-seated desire to wear makeup and dresses, then cool, but in my opinion, that isn't the same as "identifying as female." I seriously just don't understand.
Maybe instead of trying to understand it by comparing their experiences to your own experiences, listen to the stories of transgender people. You may identify as female because you have lady parts, but others may feel a complete disconnect between themselves and their "parts." They become very distressed by their parts. Many have that feeling very early on in life (way before makeup or high heels come into the picture). The feeling never goes away and many of them become depressed and suicidal because of how much they struggle with the disconnect they feel between their inner selves and the lives they lead in the wrong body. Ultimately, if someone finds that it's worth it (the physical pain of surgery, the expense, the family drama, loss of job, the potential for public ridicule) to go through the process of transitioning, then don't you think this is more than a "desire to wear make up and dresses?" It's not something people just do on a whim because of the clothes they want to wear. Our experiences as men or women go far beyond the way we dress. You don't understand because that hasn't happened inside your brain and it's hard to imagine. I don't claim to understand either, because it's not happened to me. But I believe people when I hear their experiences and accept that just because I don't understand it, that doesn't mean it's not real.
I hate to use such an obvious example, but watch Caitlyn Jenner's full length interview with Diane Sawyer (you may have to look it up as Bruce Jenner's interview, because it was filmed "before").
Definitely a UO.... I'm really getting tired of all of the posts on Facebook about gender identity/transgender. I'm researching and reading about it and I REALLY just don't get it; I "identify" as female because I have lady parts, not because I fit into the social norms of being a "typical" woman (which most women don't). If you have a deep-seated desire to wear makeup and dresses, then cool, but in my opinion, that isn't the same as "identifying as female." I seriously just don't understand.
My thought with this is that you don't have to understand it in order to respect it. Of course it's difficult as a born woman identifying as a woman to understand what it feels like to be anything else. That doesn't mean that people who do feel they were born the wrong gender aren't 100% valid in feeling that way.
I think you guys all make good points. Let me be clear - I don't hate anyone, and I'm not bashing transgenders or anyone else, not even a little bit. I'm just tired of all of the posts on Facebook because personally, I don't like the idea that we, as a society, like to separate and label ourselves to such a degree, and then talk about it All The Flippin' Time. I don't care what your sex/gender/orientation/political party is - just be who you are and move on. Do I understand gender identity? No, I don't, because as I mentioned, the only reason that "female" is part of my identity is because, well, I'm a female. Do I accept that there are people who, for some reason or another, are uncomfortable with their gender? Sure. Do we really need to constantly post about it on Facebook, constantly point out our differences, and get offended anytime someone says something that isn't politically correct? In my Unpopular Opinion, no.
Now, that said.... because I really HATE feeling like an ignorant twat, I've been researching gender identity because I really DO want to understand. But so far, it's all very "feelings-y" and there is almost no scientific data on why it happens, or what causes people to identify with a gender other than their own, at least that I can find. And as I said, I'm really not a huge fan of labels and separation anyway because I truly think that perpetuates hate more than anything.
Me: 25 DH: 28
Hubby's little boy - my wonderful step-son - born 5/23/10
BFP#1: 06/2010...my beautiful baby girl born 3/7/2011
BFP #2: 10/24/15...mc on 10/31/15
BFP #3: 11/27/15. EDD 8/6/16
"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -Winston Churchill
My families been rolling their eyes at me, because every time they bring up "Oh so we know the gender?" I answer with "We know the sex, but we may not know the gender for a few years! He's a male."
I also have a lot of LBQT friends, who are coming to the shower, were at my wedding, so I often remind / educate my family of these type of things, since it can become a hot topic.
Perhaps a little bit of an UO- I hope my child identifies with his sex, because I want his life to be easier. But if he thinks of himself as she, we'll respect it. We also won't go out of our way to force a non-gendered identity until he is old enough to choose... (and yes, I know parents who have done this. Oh Vermont...)
I definitely take a very English view on the matter. "My dear, I don't care what people do, as long as they don't do it in the streets and frighten the horses."
My families been rolling their eyes at me, because every time they bring up "Oh so we know the gender?" I answer with "We know the sex, but we may not know the gender for a few years! He's a male."
I also have a lot of LBQT friends, who are coming to the shower, were at my wedding, so I often remind / educate my family of these type of things, since it can become a hot topic.
Perhaps a little bit of an UO- I hope my child identifies with his sex, because I want his life to be easier. But if he thinks of himself as she, we'll respect it. We also won't go out of our way to force a non-gendered identity until he is old enough to choose... (and yes, I know parents who have done this. Oh Vermont...)
I definitely take a very English view on the matter. "My dear, I don't care what people do, as long as they don't do it in the streets and frighten the horses."
Why have I never heard that quote? I love it. Also, I went to UVM. #ilovermont
@1faceinacrowd I understand being sick of Facebook posts in general, that's why I'm very liberal with my use of the "unsubscribe" button. It's a godsend especially with the upcoming election.
Also, there are decades of psychological research on how gender is constructed -- the biological, emotional, and social forces that play a role. Not all of it is about why people may identify with something other than their biological sex, but researchers have examined why people express their gender in different ways. It goes all the way back to Freud (NOT endorsing Freud as a great theorist to look into, just pointing out that this type of research has been around for awhile).
@1faceinacrowd I get that constant Facebook posts can be annoying, and I'm glad you are a tolerant person, but there are many who are not. There are so many more annoying and useless things being posted on Facebook, at least this can serve a purpose and begin to educate people on an issue that is still very controversial. Society is still very uninformed and judge mental towards gender identity issues and it takes people making a stand about it to make a difference. I'm not a huge Facebook user, but I would much rather see someone advocating for civil rights vs the new design they got on their nails. But maybe that's just me.
Also, there have been many scientific studies on gender issues that I used in my work back in grad school (masters in social work), so if you have access to scientific journals, which I sadly no longer do, I would recommend trying to take a look there.
I hate that we feel the need to capture everything in a picture or video to really experience or remember it. There is no reason for a photographer to be present in the very intimate moments in a person's life. Why do we need a picture of every "first" in a kid's life? If we spent half as much time actually looking at what's going on around us as we do looking through the lens of a camera or at a phone screen, our memories would probably be a lot richer.
My sister, formerly brother, is transgender and would like for those of you who do not understand being transgender to stop thinking about her/his genitalia and think of them as a person. A person that has a heart and soul and is a wonderful person if you can just get past what you believe defines a woman or a man. I had a very similar conversation with my 13 year old son last night and when I told him it's not necessarily about understanding, it's about accepting he got it.
FWIW, I think there is a lot of science behind gender identity. Whether it is biology or psychology I think science can most definitely help people better understand why a person identifies with a particular sex.
On on a personal level, related to science, I have had a theory for a long time relating to my sister (remember born male). This has not been proven because it would impact the gender reassignment surgery. When my sister was six she could not walk well. DNA was tested and she was diagnosed with Duchene Muscular Dystrophy. This is an X chromosome related disease and my mother is not a carrier. This was a mutation. However, unlike other patients with Duchene my sister still produces dystrophin, just not as much. When she came out and started stating that she identified as a woman it started to make sense since she had not progressed like a typical patient. I believe that either she is XXY or has some extra defective X in her DNA. Yes, she was born with a penis, but from very early in childhood she started presenting as a female. My theory is completely based on my own thoughts, this far fetched idea has never been proven or even address with a medical professional because it will affect her gender reassignment surgery. I think science could help in our situation with understanding the true impact of her genetic mutation and disease process, but it is her wishes not to impact the gender reassignment surgery.
I hate that we feel the need to capture everything in a picture or video to really experience or remember it. There is no reason for a photographer to be present in the very intimate moments in a person's life. Why do we need a picture of every "first" in a kid's life? If we spent half as much time actually looking at what's going on around us as we do looking through the lens of a camera or at a phone screen, our memories would probably be a lot richer.
I work with high school students, and we often take them on trips. During the trips the students are so busy taking selfies and pictures of everything we are doing that they don't even get to experience the activities. I always tell my boss, I wish that they would get so wrapped up and having fun and experiencing that they would forget to turn on the camera and that they would have real memories not just pictures.
@Bookhousegirl That's a great idea! I do have access to scientific journals through the university I'm attending for my Bachelor's program right now. I'll take a gander this afternoon. It really is an interesting subject; I'm the very opposite of a psychology major (majoring in Business Analytics - a cross between project management and statistics) so I appreciate the insight from someone more knowledgeable in that realm.
Me: 25 DH: 28
Hubby's little boy - my wonderful step-son - born 5/23/10
BFP#1: 06/2010...my beautiful baby girl born 3/7/2011
BFP #2: 10/24/15...mc on 10/31/15
BFP #3: 11/27/15. EDD 8/6/16
"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -Winston Churchill
@skelly70 I am glad someone else feels this way too!
I frequent concerts with my husband, and my biggest pet peeve are the people who literally record the whole show. I do not want to watch my favorite band through your phone screen. I have youtube for that.
I don't get people that tell me the baby's sex is only a surprise if you find out at delivery. I was just as surprised each time finding out at an ultrasound. Unless you had IVF and like Chrissy Tiegen picked which embryo to use, it's still a surprise.
Katienu ME TOO! I.HATE.AWARDS.SHOWS. They make me want to poke a fork in my eye.
I also hate that since I'm pregnant people ask me how I'm feeling every.single.day. It's the most irritating thing in the world and I have no idea why I feel that way. Oh, and it's the MOST irritating when my in-laws ask. I know it's innocent, but I literally want to light my hair on fire and scream STFU!!!
Katienu ME TOO! I.HATE.AWARDS.SHOWS. They make me want to poke a fork in my eye.
I also hate that since I'm pregnant people ask me how I'm feeling every.single.day. It's the most irritating thing in the world and I have no idea why I feel that way. Oh, and it's the MOST irritating when my in-laws ask. I know it's innocent, but I literally want to light my hair on fire and scream STFU!!!
It's funny how everyone asks how you are feeling (I don't hate it, but I've certainly noticed it). It makes me wonder, did I look like a jerk for never asking moms-to-be how they were feeling in the past? I never knew that was "the thing" to say!
I think you guys all make good points. Let me be clear - I don't hate anyone, and I'm not bashing transgenders or anyone else, not even a little bit. I'm just tired of all of the posts on Facebook because personally, I don't like the idea that we, as a society, like to separate and label ourselves to such a degree, and then talk about it All The Flippin' Time. I don't care what your sex/gender/orientation/political party is - just be who you are and move on. Do I understand gender identity? No, I don't, because as I mentioned, the only reason that "female" is part of my identity is because, well, I'm a female. Do I accept that there are people who, for some reason or another, are uncomfortable with their gender? Sure. Do we really need to constantly post about it on Facebook, constantly point out our differences, and get offended anytime someone says something that isn't politically correct? In my Unpopular Opinion, no.
Now, that said.... because I really HATE feeling like an ignorant twat, I've been researching gender identity because I really DO want to understand. But so far, it's all very "feelings-y" and there is almost no scientific data on why it happens, or what causes people to identify with a gender other than their own, at least that I can find. And as I said, I'm really not a huge fan of labels and separation anyway because I truly think that perpetuates hate more than anything.
I have a (close) transgender family member so clearly that makes me a little extra-sensitive to this topic. I'm not trying to get on my high horse or anything, but I feel that I have a little more insight into this topic than most others (except of course for those who are in fact trans, work with trans people, and have really educated themselves on this issue). I appreciate that you hate feeling ignorant and have been trying to do research. That's really important. One thing that's important to stress is that tolerance and understanding are two different things. Believe me, it is REALLY difficult to understand. I can't say I fully understand it. One way that it was explained to me helped me out a LOT. Think about it from the following perspective. So, you are a woman, and you say you identify with your gender because of your genitalia. OK, so let's take the genitalia out of the equation for a second. When you wake up in the morning, imagine you have to present yourself to the world as a man. That may mean something different to you than it means to other people, but just try and imagine it. Try to imagine yourself having to be someone who you truly are not. It's really difficult, isn't it? So yes a lot of it is "feelings-y", but no one is asking you to try and explain what makes you feel like a woman, so why should a transwoman have to explain what makes her feel like a woman, regardless of her genitalia (or vice versa for transmen)? Believe, me, they DO have to explain it. Transmen and women have to try and explain their needs to their therapists and doctors in order to receive the proper gender confirmation procedures and or drugs that they need to be who they truly are. Imagine how painful and difficult this is to go through.
Katienu ME TOO! I.HATE.AWARDS.SHOWS. They make me want to poke a fork in my eye.
I also hate that since I'm pregnant people ask me how I'm feeling every.single.day. It's the most irritating thing in the world and I have no idea why I feel that way. Oh, and it's the MOST irritating when my in-laws ask. I know it's innocent, but I literally want to light my hair on fire and scream STFU!!!
It's funny how everyone asks how you are feeling (I don't hate it, but I've certainly noticed it). It makes me wonder, did I look like a jerk for never asking moms-to-be how they were feeling in the past? I never knew that was "the thing" to say!
I get this all. the. time. And then people act all surprised when I say that I'm feeling good. I know I'm lucky to have had such mild symptoms, but I'm in the "magic" 2nd trimester right now. How the hell am I supposed to be feeling??
Re: UO 3.4.16
I'm really getting tired of all of the posts on Facebook about gender identity/transgender. I'm researching and reading about it and I REALLY just don't get it; I "identify" as female because I have lady parts, not because I fit into the social norms of being a "typical" woman (which most women don't). If you have a deep-seated desire to wear makeup and dresses, then cool, but in my opinion, that isn't the same as "identifying as female." I seriously just don't understand.
I think I'm reading your post correctly.
Gender, gender expression, etc are a sliding scale. some days some feel more more feminine (wearing dresses, etc, while others we feel more masculine)
This is the easiest way to understand it. The things you brought up in defining you gender are "I have lady parts" that would be under sex. Wearing makeup and dresses is under gender expression, and though it does not define your gender identity, it also can move along the scale laterally.
I get so irritated when people constantly correct others grammar, punctuation, spelling, etc. It just comes off as so pretentious to me. It's a bit classless to make someone else feel bad or embarrass them over a stupid comma. I was a copy editor for years so, I get it but, just get over yourself!! Unless the person using bad grammar is an ignorant a-hole bashing others, then I'm fine with the public humiliation
Unlss thr psts lk lyk dis?
@mrsrundell The *one* person I do that to? My little brother. He has a masters in English, his BA in English education. He should mind his their, there and they're.
Plus, you know... he's my kid brother.
Up until about a year ago, I thought that if you had a vagina, you were a girl - end of story. Anything beyond that is completely up to you. In my opinion, you can't really "identify" as a woman/girl unless you have experienced the things that come with biologically being a female, because everything else about being a woman is up for debate, and varies from person to person, and I know it's the same for men. That's why it doesn't make sense to me - because unless you fit perfectly into one stereotype or the other, how can you possibly identify as the gender that you weren't born as?
@1faceinacrowd I think what you're forgetting is that there are people who were born with one set of sex organs but truly identify with the other sex. So someone may not have grown up starting periods in the middle of class, but may truly feel they are trapped in the wrong body. Should that person not be allowed to live as a woman just because they were born with a penis? And what about gender reassignment? What if someone born male now has a vagina? Now are they allowed to be a woman finally? Where do you draw the line?
I agree that most people identify with the sex they were born, but gender identity is a complex topic that isn't always black or white.
BFP #2 8/22/12 | EDD 5/5/13 | DS1 born 5/9/13
BFP #3 4/25/15 | EDD 1/7/16 | MMC 7/2/15 @ 13w1d | D&E 7/8/15
BFP #4 12/9/15 | EDD 8/22/16 | DS2 born 5/18/16 at 26w2d
Just keep swimming.
It's not sexist. You aren't labeling others, they label themselves and where they sit on the scale, which can also change day to day. It's sexist for us to tell them what they are based on how they present. This is kind of hard to explain over the internet.
Example: Someone can be born female (sex), identify as male (gender/what they feel they truly are), wear dresses (gender expression) and be bisexual (attracted to).
I am only uses dresses as an example, obviously what is feminine and masculine is up to the person wearing it and generally society's view of femininity and masculinity.
"I mean, I'm not a huge fan of wearing dresses most days, and I could never be a stay-at-home mom because I'm way too into having a successful career, and don't even get my started on my cooking skills...but I'm still a woman. I identify as a woman because I grew up as a woman, with a vagina. I grew up having periods start in the middle of class and having to run to the bathroom, with a fear of getting made fun of if anyone could tell; I grew up having to work harder just to get the same amount of money as my co-workers with penises, and I grew up being told that I intimidate boys and that I shouldn't be so open about my intelligence or so direct/forward in how I talk to people because boys who are direct are strong, but girls who are direct are bitches."
^ You're over complicating it. These are all things you value in being a female or gender stereotypes defined by society. Your life experiences don't make you any less male or female. A Man that wants to be a homemaker or a woman who is a CEO, don't make them any less of their gender because they don't fit into the societal stereotypes.
Obviously be conscientious that what you say isn't rude or ignorant but come one. It can no longer be a gender
reveal but a sex reveal...you think my grandma or aunts want to come to that (disclosure, I'm not having one)?They would think it was something to do with sex or toys lol. I think if someone says gender reveal, bite your tongue and move on if it offends you. Even this app/the bump says find out gender in the weekly task/guide. Yes I know that does not mean that it's correct but jezz.
If it's a friend, family member or coworker, sure educate them, spread the word, but to attack someone because they unknowingly said the wrong term when so much of this is still new, not mainstream, in the social media or being taught and therefore no way for them to have already known this. I get it, educate yourself and stay current, but honestly it's just so over the top. Don't be racists, don't be sexist and don't go out of your way to say something spiteful or mean but with all new things it takes a while to understand all of the differences.
With that being said, just be you, what makes you happy. I don't care if you were born a boy and are now female or see yourself that way, or a girl that likes girl, I'll still respect you and my views wouldn't change. Unless you kick puppies and do other horrible things.
Flame cloak is on, it's cool. I'm in -35 weather right now, I'll go jump in a snow bank if it gets too hot
My UO? I am turning into one of those pregnant ladies who are totally demanding and obnoxious...
and I don't care.
I'm freaking growing a human, treat me nicer than normal and give me what I want or I will eat you.
ETA: So my period never started while in class and, as far as I know, I've never had a lower salary than a male coworker in my position (not saying it doesn't happen, just saying I've personally never experienced it). Does that mean that I'm "less" of a woman? Do you have to personally experience sexism to identify as a woman?
I actually have personally experienced sexism, so I'm not being literal with this post. I'm just trying to understand your argument. I think you're having trouble separating biological sex with gender with gender expression. The genderbread person @MSUgrad12 spells it out pretty well, but it can be a hard concept to grasp if you haven't been exposed to it before.
At the end of the day whether someone is using the term gender or sex for their baby isn't really a big deal, we all know what you mean. There isn't a reason to attack someone over it.
However, I do think it is important that if someone, even if they present as male or female, tells you they are a certain gender; we take it and accept it rather than invalidate them.
I saw this thing the other day, that was so spot on. "When we accidentally call a male dog a female, and are told "she's a girl." we correct ourselves. Why can't we do the same for people?"
I hate to use such an obvious example, but watch Caitlyn Jenner's full length interview with Diane Sawyer (you may have to look it up as Bruce Jenner's interview, because it was filmed "before").
My thought with this is that you don't have to understand it in order to respect it. Of course it's difficult as a born woman identifying as a woman to understand what it feels like to be anything else. That doesn't mean that people who do feel they were born the wrong gender aren't 100% valid in feeling that way.
I think you guys all make good points. Let me be clear - I don't hate anyone, and I'm not bashing transgenders or anyone else, not even a little bit. I'm just tired of all of the posts on Facebook because personally, I don't like the idea that we, as a society, like to separate and label ourselves to such a degree, and then talk about it All The Flippin' Time. I don't care what your sex/gender/orientation/political party is - just be who you are and move on. Do I understand gender identity? No, I don't, because as I mentioned, the only reason that "female" is part of my identity is because, well, I'm a female. Do I accept that there are people who, for some reason or another, are uncomfortable with their gender? Sure. Do we really need to constantly post about it on Facebook, constantly point out our differences, and get offended anytime someone says something that isn't politically correct? In my Unpopular Opinion, no.
Now, that said.... because I really HATE feeling like an ignorant twat, I've been researching gender identity because I really DO want to understand. But so far, it's all very "feelings-y" and there is almost no scientific data on why it happens, or what causes people to identify with a gender other than their own, at least that I can find. And as I said, I'm really not a huge fan of labels and separation anyway because I truly think that perpetuates hate more than anything.
My families been rolling their eyes at me, because every time they bring up "Oh so we know the gender?" I answer with "We know the sex, but we may not know the gender for a few years! He's a male."
I also have a lot of LBQT friends, who are coming to the shower, were at my wedding, so I often remind / educate my family of these type of things, since it can become a hot topic.
Perhaps a little bit of an UO- I hope my child identifies with his sex, because I want his life to be easier. But if he thinks of himself as she, we'll respect it. We also won't go out of our way to force a non-gendered identity until he is old enough to choose... (and yes, I know parents who have done this. Oh Vermont...)
I definitely take a very English view on the matter. "My dear, I don't care what people do, as long as they don't do it in the streets and frighten the horses."
Also, there are decades of psychological research on how gender is constructed -- the biological, emotional, and social forces that play a role. Not all of it is about why people may identify with something other than their biological sex, but researchers have examined why people express their gender in different ways. It goes all the way back to Freud (NOT endorsing Freud as a great theorist to look into, just pointing out that this type of research has been around for awhile).
@Katienu https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mrs_Patrick_Campbell
Juuuuust to show how long this debate has been going on
Also, there have been many scientific studies on gender issues that I used in my work back in grad school (masters in social work), so if you have access to scientific journals, which I sadly no longer do, I would recommend trying to take a look there.
FWIW, I think there is a lot of science behind gender identity. Whether it is biology or psychology I think science can most definitely help people better understand why a person identifies with a particular sex.
On on a personal level, related to science, I have had a theory for a long time relating to my sister (remember born male). This has not been proven because it would impact the gender reassignment surgery. When my sister was six she could not walk well. DNA was tested and she was diagnosed with Duchene Muscular Dystrophy. This is an X chromosome related disease and my mother is not a carrier. This was a mutation. However, unlike other patients with Duchene my sister still produces dystrophin, just not as much. When she came out and started stating that she identified as a woman it started to make sense since she had not progressed like a typical patient. I believe that either she is XXY or has some extra defective X in her DNA. Yes, she was born with a penis, but from very early in childhood she started presenting as a female. My theory is completely based on my own thoughts, this far fetched idea has never been proven or even address with a medical professional because it will affect her gender reassignment surgery. I think science could help in our situation with understanding the true impact of her genetic mutation and disease process, but it is her wishes not to impact the gender reassignment surgery.
eta: talk to text while nursing made words weird!
I frequent concerts with my husband, and my biggest pet peeve are the people who literally record the whole show. I do not want to watch my favorite band through your phone screen. I have youtube for that.
eta: fast fingers
I also hate that since I'm pregnant people ask me how I'm feeling every.single.day. It's the most irritating thing in the world and I have no idea why I feel that way. Oh, and it's the MOST irritating when my in-laws ask. I know it's innocent, but I literally want to light my hair on fire and scream STFU!!!
Baby #2 due 8/11/2016