Thoughts on this IEP situation (long).

finsup

DS started Kinder this year (mainstream class w/ some accommodations) and overall has been doing very, very well.  I had a parent teacher conference 2 weeks ago and the feedback was excellent - lots of positives, and one specific area where we still need to work hard (writing) which was no surprise.  Behavior in class, cafeteria and recess has been good - outside of 1 incident regarding a fire drill.

I specifically asked the teacher about some of the classroom accommodations in his IEP and how she is implementing them.  Proximity control, frequent feedback, among others.  She said, that in class, he so far is able to keep up, isn't distracted, follows directions and is on target for most skills.  She isn't seeing that he needs her to implement those accommodations very much that he seems to be doing well.  Super.

And then I got a note home from the PE teacher on Friday.  At our school if they have a behavior incident 3 times in the 9 week marking period, the teacher sends a note home.  His third time with a behavior incident was Friday, which also happened to be the very last day of the 9 week period.  The note said "DS can improve by keeping hands to self, not pushing or hurting other children.  Today DS grabbed a student by the clothes and dragged him". 

Now, keeping hands and feet to self is a goal in his IEP....so that fact that he has trouble here is no surprise to me.  However - the grabbing a child by the clothes and dragging him is extreme even for my kid.  So I questioned him about it, and he said that yes he did that.  I asked him why.  Because H (the other kid) was not following the rules.  What did he do?  He cut in line.  So my kid took it upon himself to make sure that this other child was following the rules, grabbed him and dragged him to the end of the line.  Obvs not ok...however, this is another goal on my sons IEP - to be more flexible around when other kids break the rules.  DS is very focused on the rules and what is right and wrong, and gets angry when other kids try to cheat or break the rules.

To make a long story short - the child whom he dragged we know very well and lives 5 houses away.  I marched his butt down there on Saturday morning so he could apologize - which he did.  But in talking to the other Mom, her child also got a behavior notice on Friday - for the same incident.  The boys apologized to each other, we talked about both of them making better choices in PE, and we had a play date later that afternoon and all was well. 

I called the PE teacher to set up an appointment to discuss what is happening in PE.  I told her my sons version of the grabbing incident - which was exactly how she described it.  And I also asked her to tell me more about the other incidents happening in PE.  All were basically the same - pushing, shoving, getting angry about the "rules" or if he perceives something is unfair or if another child cheats.

Then I said "well, I'll be honest, the fact that struggles with these things in PE is not a shock to me as they are goals with accomodations in his IEP".

Teacher:  eyes wide.  "ohhhhhhhhhhhh".

Then I went over the specifics of his IEP, and I said I'm sure you have a copy, but I brought and extra in case you want it?  And she took it.

I asked if she felt that she was able to implement the accomodations in his IEP appropriately given the class size (which is 55 Kinder students to 2 PE teachers!), and in her opinion did I need to call and ARD to have additional accomodations put in place so that my kid can be successful in PE.

She said, well, I think I can accommodate him just fine.  Let's give it a couple of more weeks - I will ramp up the accommodations and see how he does.  Translation:  I was not doing this before but I will now since you are threatening an ARD for additional support.  She also made a point to tell me that she has a background and training in special ed.

So I said, super.  I will call you in 2 weeks.  You can tell me if the supports are working and if not I'll call an ARD, does that sound fair? She agreed.

It was a very amicable meeting, I stayed friendly and smiling, and I'm giving her a chance to fix it. 

So, 2 more weeks.  We'll see how it goes.  I'm guessing, he'll have a more successful 2 weeks in PE.

She also made a point to tell me that for the first 5 weeks of school he did not have any behavior incidents - all of these incidents have happened in the month of October. I am very pregnant and due in about 3 weeks - she took one look at me and suggested that he "senses" a big change coming at home and this behavior is the result.  Which, ehhh, I could buy IF he were having a behavior issue in class, therapy or at home - nothing has changed - this is a problem only in PE.

WTF with 55 kinder students for 25 mins of PE? It's 3 Kinder classes to 2 PE teachers.  I asked if they get additional aides in PE during those times, no.  How can that possibly be effective for ANYONE?  With the ratio like that - how can she possibly exhibit proximity control with my kid, provide him frequent feedback etc?  I just don't see it.

I know this environment is hard for him - its loud, chaotic, LOTS of kids, competitive - all triggers for my kid.  In addition to that - PE can be hard for him physically.  Its a lot of effort for him to keep up, try to make his body do things and he gets frustrated.  To be honest I'm surprised I haven't gotten a behavior report sooner than this.

Also - who is supposed to make sure all of the teachers working with my child know about his IEP and what his needs are?  His caseworker?  Me?  I'm now concerned I need to have a discussion with the Art, music and theater teacher too.

Our annual ARD needs to happen around the first of the year, so not too far off anyway.

So, any additional thoughts?  Did I handle this well?  What could I be doing better?

MirandaHobbes

Wow. I'd be all kinds of upset if there was a behavior markup for something my kid is supposed to be accomodated for. Not that I wouldn't want to know about it- but he doesn't deserve punishment. Good job seeking out the kid and having him apologize! It sounds to me (and granted I'm all new to this as well, given my son is in kindy) that you handled it really well. Big eyeroll from me on her trying to blame it on impending birth! I would talk to your caseworker/MSW. I'm not sure who the specific person is who is supposed to communicate the IEP, but obviously they failed. Like you, I can't imagine the chaos of 55 kids/2 teachers. DS has 2 aides with him and his class of 14 kids during PE (5 of which are ASD). We got a progress note from PE saying he was having a hard time, but it was more of the tone "we're working on doing xyz".

finsup

-auntie- said:

finsup said:

DS started Kinder this year (mainstream class w/ some accommodations) and overall has been doing very, very well.  I had a parent teacher conference 2 weeks ago and the feedback was excellent - lots of positives, and one specific area where we still need to work hard (writing) which was no surprise.  Behavior in class, cafeteria and recess has been good - outside of 1 incident regarding a fire drill.

Remind me. What's the dx? 

This sounds very like an ASD type set of concerns, possibly with a sensory/fine motor/dysgraphia issue on the side. I'll answer accordingly. Please correct if I'm wrong.

You got it right.  dx is PDD-NOS.  His biggest challenges are fine motor / flexibility / rigidity.

Was the fire drill a sensory issue or more of a transition for which he wasn't prepared? If it is the latter, you could have fire and shelter in place drills added to the IEP to have him sent to a separate place (counselor, SLP or RN) ahead of the planned drill to warn him and perhaps squeeze in a Social Story to prepare him. This is a common primary grade accommodation, btw.

I will put this in my notes for our next ARD.  The issue was that the teacher allowed him to be line leader for the fire drill, because he's gone to this school for 3 years, and she wanted a student who had done a fire drill before to be line leader.  In class, when they are line leader, its for the whole day.  She only intended him to be line leader for the fire drill - so he expected to be line leader for the remainder of the day and was angry and defiant when she told him that was not happening.

So it was more a transition/flexibility issue than anything.

I specifically asked the teacher about some of the classroom accommodations in his IEP and how she is implementing them.  Proximity control, frequent feedback, among others.  She said, that in class, he so far is able to keep up, isn't distracted, follows directions and is on target for most skills.  She isn't seeing that he needs her to implement those accommodations very much that he seems to be doing well.  Super.

Are there goals written around these to fade or are they just "soft" suggested accommodations to be implemented as needed? A good teacher will be doing a lot of this sort of thing as a matter of best practices.

They are specific goals, with specific modification.  "by the next annual ARD, during unstructured and structured playtime (pe, recess, etc) DS will keep hands and feet to self when interacting with peers in 4/5 opportunities across 9 random data days"  The modifications read "teacher support to fade as appropriate".  Implementer is teacher, method of eval is data collection, teacher observation.

And then I got a note home from the PE teacher on Friday.  At our school if they have a behavior incident 3 times in the 9 week marking period, the teacher sends a note home.  His third time with a behavior incident was Friday, which also happened to be the very last day of the 9 week period.  The note said "DS can improve by keeping hands to self, not pushing or hurting other children.  Today DS grabbed a student by the clothes and dragged him". 

The first person who ever contacted me when we bridged DS to public manistream in 4th was the gym teacher. She obviously had a little more on the ball than yours- I got a call with in the week asking "what's up with your kid?" Once I shared, she was able to come up with strategies to make gym better for both of them. I also asked her to contact the SLP who already knew DS from speech services if she needed help and gave her access to DS's psych if she needed.

Now, keeping hands and feet to self is a goal in his IEP....so that fact that he has trouble here is no surprise to me.  

How often is data to be collected on this goal? What does keeping his hands a feet to himself look like? Where is it to be measured? How is it measured exactly? And who is responsible for the goal? This information should be included in a well written IEP.

Every 9 weeks - I think its relatively covered in the IEP at this point

However - the grabbing a child by the clothes and dragging him is extreme even for my kid.  So I questioned him about it, and he said that yes he did that.  I asked him why.  Because H (the other kid) was not following the rules.  What did he do?  He cut in line.  So my kid took it upon himself to make sure that this other child was following the rules, grabbed him and dragged him to the end of the line.  Obvs not ok...however, this is another goal on my sons IEP - to be more flexible around when other kids break the rules.  DS is very focused on the rules and what is right and wrong, and gets angry when other kids try to cheat or break the rules.

So you live with the rule police. You have my sympathies.  Ha, thanks!

To make a long story short - the child whom he dragged we know very well and lives 5 houses away.  I marched his butt down there on Saturday morning so he could apologize - which he did.  But in talking to the other Mom, her child also got a behavior notice on Friday - for the same incident.  The boys apologized to each other, we talked about both of them making better choices in PE, and we had a play date later that afternoon and all was well. 

This was an awesome way to manage this. I'm so glad there was no social consequence around this.

I called the PE teacher to set up an appointment to discuss what is happening in PE.  I told her my sons version of the grabbing incident - which was exactly how she described it.  And I also asked her to tell me more about the other incidents happening in PE.  All were basically the same - pushing, shoving, getting angry about the "rules" or if he perceives something is unfair or if another child cheats.

Then I said "well, I'll be honest, the fact that struggles with these things in PE is not a shock to me as they are goals with accomodations in his IEP".

Teacher:  eyes wide.  "ohhhhhhhhhhhh".

Then I went over the specifics of his IEP, and I said I'm sure you have a copy, but I brought and extra in case you want it?  And she took it.

Great move. So often a parent is the last safeguard between a child and special teachers and other adults in the building. I can't tell you how often I have been the bearer of IEP news for teachers. Music class is DS's kyptonite- perfect pitch, sensory issues and short staure make for a kid planted front and center among people without talent. It ain't pretty. Last one I got was from the high school band director in 9th grade- the IEP didn't make the journey from the middle school in time for band camp. Though I would bet the rend the band director wouldn't have read it.

A lot of parents avoid this by proactively sending each teacher a short, concise letter describing their child and directing them to the IEP which may of may not be deliberately withheld. When my mother taught art, she seldom got IEP information unless they child was physically challenged in some way. I have a template I can send you if you'd like a copy.

This is good advice and would love a copy, thanks. 

I asked if she felt that she was able to implement the accomodations in his IEP appropriately given the class size (which is 55 Kinder students to 2 PE teachers!), and in her opinion did I need to call and ARD to have additional accomodations put in place so that my kid can be successful in PE.

In so chaotic a setting, a paraprofessional might be needed. Or he might be better served by a smaller APE class that is less likely to trigger his inappropriate behaviors.

This is what I'm thinking is my next step, a para for PE.  I'm going to give it the 2 weeks and see what the teacher's opinion is and go from there.  I called the kinder teacher today just to let her know what I was doing and she reiterated again she has not seen this behavior in regular class.

She said, well, I think I can accommodate him just fine.  Let's give it a couple of more weeks - I will ramp up the accommodations and see how he does.  Translation:  I was not doing this before but I will now since you are threatening an ARD for additional support.  She also made a point to tell me that she has a background and training in special ed.

So I said, super.  I will call you in 2 weeks.  You can tell me if the supports are working and if not I'll call an ARD, does that sound fair? She agreed.

It was a very amicable meeting, I stayed friendly and smiling, and I'm giving her a chance to fix it. 

So, 2 more weeks.  We'll see how it goes.  I'm guessing, he'll have a more successful 2 weeks in PE.

This is a sensible team approach. You are both to be congratulated for working together.

I have learned that when I make them think its *their* idea in the first place, I'm more likely to get what I want...  :-)

She also made a point to tell me that for the first 5 weeks of school he did not have any behavior incidents - all of these incidents have happened in the month of October. I am very pregnant and due in about 3 weeks - she took one look at me and suggested that he "senses" a big change coming at home and this behavior is the result.  Which, ehhh, I could buy IF he were having a behavior issue in class, therapy or at home - nothing has changed - this is a problem only in PE.

There could be two things going on here. The first is the very common scenario where a student lays low for a 4-6 week honeymoon period before starting to act out. Or she could be correct that your advanced pregnancy coupled with the stresses of the horror that is 55 kindie kids in gym added together is driving the behavior.

Yea, I'm thinking the honeymoon period is over.  He's testing the limits, probably copying other kids and this is the result.

WTF with 55 kinder students for 25 mins of PE? It's 3 Kinder classes to 2 PE teachers.  I asked if they get additional aides in PE during those times, no.  How can that possibly be effective for ANYONE?  With the ratio like that - how can she possibly exhibit proximity control with my kid, provide him frequent feedback etc?  I just don't see it.

I know this environment is hard for him - its loud, chaotic, LOTS of kids, competitive - all triggers for my kid.  In addition to that - PE can be hard for him physically.  Its a lot of effort for him to keep up, try to make his body do things and he gets frustrated.  To be honest I'm surprised I haven't gotten a behavior report sooner than this.

Ask for him to be evaluated for APE.

Also - who is supposed to make sure all of the teachers working with my child know about his IEP and what his needs are?  His caseworker?  Me?  I'm now concerned I need to have a discussion with the Art, music and theater teacher too.

The head of the CSE/CST is officially in charge of making this happen. But it doesn't hurt to give teachers, recess aides, the nurse and lunch ladies a heads up just in case.

Our annual ARD needs to happen around the first of the year, so not too far off anyway.

So, any additional thoughts?  Did I handle this well?  What could I be doing better?

You're doing great.

Thanks!  This is my first real "hiccup" in this process so I'm trying to cover my bases, make friends w/ the teachers and but still get my DS needs met.  Hard work!

finsup

MirandaHobbes said:

Wow. I'd be all kinds of upset if there was a behavior markup for something my kid is supposed to be accomodated for. Not that I wouldn't want to know about it- but he doesn't deserve punishment. Good job seeking out the kid and having him apologize! It sounds to me (and granted I'm all new to this as well, given my son is in kindy) that you handled it really well. Big eyeroll from me on her trying to blame it on impending birth! I would talk to your caseworker/MSW. I'm not sure who the specific person is who is supposed to communicate the IEP, but obviously they failed. Like you, I can't imagine the chaos of 55 kids/2 teachers. DS has 2 aides with him and his class of 14 kids during PE (5 of which are ASD). We got a progress note from PE saying he was having a hard time, but it was more of the tone "we're working on doing xyz".

yea, I just don't see how the ratio in PE is good for anyone, much less my kids w/ specific needs.  And I'd guess that he's not the only one.

AKbadwolf

Just want to say I'm sorry about the IEP problems.  I see that every year with my oldest son who is now in 7th grade.  I have taken to sending an email to the teachers the day before school starts with the IEP information and then setting up an in person meeting after the first two weeks or so of class.  This way they can give feedback on what is and isn't working in their class and I can point out new behavior issues that they may be experiencing along with past modifications that have helped.  It seems to pave the road for a cooperative communication year.  Good luck and great job so far. 

funchicken

Auntie, that letter is great!

@finsup, my mom is the rule police.  It's maddening. 

finsup

Thanks everyone for the feedback, I'm comfortable with the plan for now - I'm anxious to see what the 2 week update will bring.  But, DS has had all "green" days with no behavior notes in his daily log since the meeting, so I'm hoping that's a good sign.  (all students have a daily chart with green, yellow, and red as indicators of behavior for the day)

Coincidentally - report cards came home yesterday and DS is doing great.  I was never worried about the academic side of school, his issues are all about the other stuff that goes along w/ school besides academics.  But its nice to see he's on target.  He got a satisfactory grade in PE as well as his other specials.

I also got a progress report from the social group counselor who wrote "DS is a role model in social group and a great leader in his regular class".  Now, yay, right?  But I'm skeptical.  Is DS truly a great "leader" or is he being bossy and acting as the leader so he gets his way? (which only reinforces his inflexibility and rule enforcing behavior.  I'd be inclined to think the ladder, because I see it with my own eyes outside of school all the time, but I'll address that at our next meeting.   

finsup

2 Week update.

Per the PE teacher there have been 2 more incidents of pushing/hitting in PE but that overall his behavior has much improved.  Which, FTR, he also confessed the incidents to me about at home so I already knew about them.  Kid is honest at least.

I'm doing reminders/rewards for a good PE day at home, and she is doing a check in/check out with him each day as well as keeping his group close to a teacher.  So it does seem to be helping.

So, for now, doing ok.  I'm still going to discuss this in more detail at his next ARD though, which is in about a month, but at this point I don't think an emergency meeting is warranted.