December Natural Birth Thread

tuxielove93 · December 2021

A thread for all mamas considering unmedicated/birth center/home births! Also for talking about non-drug based birth comfort strategies. We can all talk, connect and ask questions here

tuxielove93 · December 2021

Hi mamas! If anyone has a better name idea, I’m all ears. That’s the most succinct way I could encompass everything. And don’t feel like just because you are going to the hospital or want an epidural you aren’t allowed! I think this is just a good place to talk about all the non-drug options for comfort during labor (especially as we get closer)

anywho! I’m a TTM. My first birth was induced but otherwise unmedicated. And my second was completely unmedicated natural term labor, but still in the hospital. I had a midwife team for both. This time I am planning for a home birth for probably a billion reasons. I’m happy to answer any questions if anyone is curious about unmedicated birth.

inthewoods23 · December 2021

Maybe this thread will eventually morph into a general birth plan kind of thread? Just a thought/idea.

I'm super excited for this thread as this is something I've thought about for a long time. I like the idea of going unmedicated (have been on enough drugs with IVF and now immunosuppresants for pregnancy!) but have a feeling I will want a back up plan and don't want to have anxiety over choosing an epidural and what not. I've heard you can be pretty out of it from them - is that true? Or even, when is a good time to abandon the unmedicated plan?

sunshineandlemons · December 2021

I’ve considered it. I was induced with both my daughters but my second, I got the epidural only about an hour before I had her and she came out in one push! After I had her, I was like I could have totally done that unmedicated. The hard part of making the decision is the unknown. If you have a plan for non-medicated at the hospital can you back out and get an epidural? I know there’s a threshold where it can be too late for an epidural but wondering if I can change my mind (or maybe that’s a question for the hospital)?

Also, TMI/TW question- I had a second degree tear with both girls. With the epidural, I didn’t feel that either time. Those moms that have had a tear or episiotomy without medication, could you feel it or were labor pains distracting the pain of that? 🥺

zinnia19 · December 2021

@tuxielove93 thanks for starting this thread! I am a FTM. I am seeing a midwife practice who are a part of our local hospital. So I will give birth at the hospital, but I am hoping by seeing a midwife they will help me have the most natural/unmedicated birth i can. Though I know that there is only so much you can control! I have heard great things about hypnobirthing and would like to look into that further. Has anyone had experience with that?

LJMoon6 · December 2021

I went into my delivery with DS with the idea that I would TRY unmedicated. I'd read some hypnobirthing books and listened to some meditation stuff (I wish I would have actually taken a class on hypnobirthing too). But after only 5 minutes at the hospital I was already asking for an epidural lol. I wish I could have made it a little bit longer without it. But in the end I'm glad I did have it. I was in labor for 30 hours, pushed for 6 hours. DS was sunny side up, so they even had me doing some yoga poses to get him to flip. I was even up on my feet, squatting, with the epidural. I definitely didn't feel out of it @inthewoods23 and could move my legs on my own, I just didn't feel any pain lol.

zwink1 · December 2021

I'm still trying to work through my thoughts on how to proceed with this birth, so this is great (and even something more general like @inthewoods23 suggested would probably also be very helpful). Assuming that things line up, my plan is to at least try to do a VBAC, but beyond that I'm not sure what my feelings will be med-wise.

I went in to DS's delivery assuming I'd probably cave and ask for meds at some point, but wanting to at least try to do unmedicated. The hospital I delivered at was really good with working with alternative pain management plans and was generally supportive of most birth plan ideas.

My early labor was great and I was able to take advantage of a lot of those alternative pain management techniques... then my contractions went haywire, ish hit the fan, and I ended up with an emergency c-sec.

Due to that experience and fear of a repeat of the surrounding circumstances, home birth is completely out for me. That said I have had a number of close friends who have had wonderful home birth/unmedicated birth experiences. It is truly all so individual to the specific person/pregnancy.

bumblebee0210 · December 2021

@inthewoods23. I think by far the best "birth plan" is to have a provider you really, really trust. Then, if they say "you need an emergency c-section" you believe them, and everything goes a lot more smoothly. I found that so many birth plan documents are really adversarial-- you vs. the care team, and my thought is-- if you feel like you have to fight your doctor, maybe get a different doctor or a midwife?

On unmedicated births: I know some women, like @tuxielove93 that had good experiences with unmedicated births. However, all of these women (that I know at least) had short births-- less than 12 hours from "it hurts" to "baby is here", and often much shorter. It is generally pretty hard to know ex-ante if you are going to be one of these women, but your mother's or sisters' experiences might give you a hint.

I also have had friends who started out very much wanting to have unmedicated births (and started out at birthing centers), only to be transferred to a hospital for emergency C-section or an epidural (in the case of a very long labor of a sunny-side-up baby that was not progressing after ~24 hours). Both babies arrived happy and safe, but these moms had a sense of "failure" that they hadn't like, triumphed or something. I thought it was such a bummer to add that stress to the already stressful process of childbirth.

I guess what I will say is: I think it's important with the birth (as with many aspects of parenting!) to be flexible, and not tied to too rigid an idea of how you want it to go. The most important thing is that your baby arrives safely, and that you both are healthy. I think there is a weird, like, machismo about not getting an epidural, and I think it just adds a lot of unnecessary pressure.

Also-- just a quick plug for epidurals. They are great! I had one and I would never do it any other way. I still felt the contractions and pushing, and I could move around, but the pain was much more manageable, and it allowed me to rest between contractions and to frankly, not be out of my mind with pain. YMMV, but I am definitely planning on getting one again.

skilouise · December 2021

So I'm definitely #TeamEpidural all the way. My epidural with my first was textbook perfect, glorious, wonderful, 10/10 would recommend. I did wait about 12 hours to get mine because I wanted to stay mobile as long as possible, but labor took foreeeeeeever to progress after my water broke, so even with pitocin starting 4 hours in*, I felt zero pain until 10.5 hours in.

But as a PSA for anyone considering an epidural (whether as a primary plan or as a backup plan): depending on what your vitals look like, they may need to give you a full bag of saline before they can administer the epidural. This takes an hour. So keep that in mind when gauging when to ask for one - best case you might be in pain longer than you want to be, worst case it might just be too late entirely.

*When your water fully breaks, that starts a clock ticking - within 24 hours that baby needs to come out one way or another, because any longer and there's increased risk of infection. Hence why they started pitocin 4 hours after my water broke after my body making essentially zero progress on its own.

lilirunning34 · December 2021

I got an epidural with my first 2 kids and then did the Bradley method classs and went unmedicated with kid #3. I’m hoping to have this one unmedicated too. My husband and best friend were my team. The doctor pretty much only just caught the baby lol. It was a great experience though.

tsh2021 · December 2021

I was 100% Team Epidural too. Then I read Emily Oster's Expecting Better. It says that there is a link between epidurals and increased use of instruments used during birth. I don't remember exactly how high, but it was enough to give me pause. I feel very strongly that forceps are not used. I would rather have a c-section than have forceps used. So now I am rethinking the epidural and wondering what other forms of pain control are out there. How effective are they?

inthewoods23 · December 2021

Does anyone here have scoliosis? I've heard epidurals can sometimes either not work well or be difficult to administer for those with scoliosis. Can it cause labor problems if we try it and fail?

LJMoon6 · December 2021

@inthewoods23 I do! I have a pretty bad S curve (43 degrees on top and 35 degrees on bottom). But it’s stable. I was worried about getting an epidural last time because I read all the same things you probably did (possibility of it not taking, only taking on 1 side… etc).

I also have a condition call Chiari malformation (although I’ve had decompression surgery). There are other complications with that. Some doctors don’t want you to even push, let alone get an epidural. My doctor was fine with both because, again, I’ve been stable for years. I even ended up pushing for 6 hours and was completely fine.

Anyways, I made sure to have my chart and x-rays reviewed by the anesthesiologist before I went into labor, and then again when I got to the hospital. I also asked for the top anesthesiologist too. I wasn’t messing around! Lol. Mine went perfectly. The epidural numbed the pain enough to the point that I couldn’t even feel the contractions but I was still able to move my legs around and even stand on them (squatting).

I will likely be getting another one this time. I can’t imagine doing it without. I don’t think there are any complications if you try the epidural and it fails. It just means you’ll feel the pain.

bumblebee0210 · December 2021

@tsh2021 I don't think forceps are commonly used in most places anymore. This is a good question to ask your doctor , but I think birth practices have actually changed a lot in the past 10-15 years (even since EO had her first kid). When I talked to my doctor about episiotomies she was like "LOL yeah we don't do those anymore". Same with forceps. I think if anything they use a vacuum now, but again only if the baby really needs to get out and is basically stuck. Unfortunately, I think at that point it's typically too late for a c-section (the baby is in the birth canal), and usually it's a lot better than the alternative (baby not coming out). If it's really important to you, I would definitely ask your doctor about their practices around these things, and you may even be able to look up statistics by hospital in your area. I would guess the difference between hospitals/practices is much larger than between epidural/no epidural, but I don't actually have any data on that.

inthewoods23 · December 2021

@LJMoon6 mine is like that too! I guess by the time they saw me for it, the doc said I was done growing so putting me in a back brace wasn't going to correct it at all. It got worse over the years but eventually settled around 45 or so. I think I have 3 curves in total. But yeah, all below that threshold of getting my spine fused to correct it. I'll have to remember to make a note about it to my OB when I see her next week.

LJMoon6 · December 2021

@inthewoods23 I was diagnosed when I was 5. They initially wanted to fuse my back but my mom said no. I’m so thankful for that. I can’t imagine having a medal rod in my back for the rest of my life. I did wear a brace until I was 14 (when I stopped growing). I was actually diagnosed with Chiari malformation when I was 10 and had the decompression surgery then. They believe the Chiari malformation, and subsequent syrinx from it, caused my scoliosis. Ever since the surgery and I stopped growing my back has been stable. I wanted to get repeat x-rays and and an MRI (for the chiari) to check on things after delivery of DS, but I never got around to it. I’m sure everything is still stable though.

When was your last x-ray? I would make sure that gets into your chart. And then when things get closer to delivery I would have your OB send your chart over to the anesthesiologist. Have them review it. That way if they have any questions or concerns they can bring them up before you’re actually in labor. Mild scoliosis is pretty common, so I'm sure they've seen it and delt with it plenty of times. But with your degree/curves I would definitely be bringing it up sooner rather than later.

inthewoods23 · December 2021

@LJMoon6 hmm idk I probably last got x-rayed when I was 18 or 19? It's been years.

LJMoon6 · December 2021

@inthewoods23 I would just bring it up to your OB then. I know they generally don’t like to do x-rays when you’re pregnant but they may want to in your case. The likelihood of it continuing to progress is slim though, especially if you haven’t had any issues with your back this while time. They may also be able to get a general idea of your curves from an external exam too. That could be an easy quick check to see if things look the same. But again, I would just talk to you OB about it and they should have some good advice on what to do, if anything.

twentythree19 · December 2021

@inthewoods23 no experience with scoliosis but from what I understand about epidurals in general, there is a chance of a “wet tap” (needle can puncture the other side, allowing spinal fluid to leak out). If that happens, it can leave you with a nasty spinal headache. I had (minor) one with DD2 but my sister had a more textbook one with her daughter. Both sucked, but not dangerous for mom or baby. I’m still planning on an epidural with this kiddo.

peppylilfoxy · December 2021

@tsh2021 I don't know how accurate that info may be as all I know is my personal experiences and the experience of friends and family but both my mom and mother in law had no epidural and needed forceps. I had an epidural with my son and it was a super easy labour process... *tw* and my son was full term and not alive during birth. (He had died from the cord being wrapped before I even got to the hospital) Typically living children help along with the birthing process. *end tw* So I think it just really depends on the individual.

Edited to fix a word.

stardustskies · December 2021

I'm a little late here but for those asking about hypnobirthing.. I don't personally have experience but my mom is a hypnotherapist and has been doing it for 20+ years. She's helped many women with med free births and has told me they always thank her afterwards and tell her how much it helped. One lady actually named her baby after my mom Haha!! But I'd say it's definitely something to look into if you want to do med free.

swizzlemalarkey · December 2021

*lurking*

Edited:changed my mind about sharing. I was going to chime in about my son’s forceps delivery so if anyone has any questions about that feel free to PM me

cscrzldbg · December 2021

@sunshineandlemons
In regards to your question on tearing, I tore with my first. I tore because I did not allow my body to naturally stretch but instead pushed through.

Part of why you tore with your girls might have been because of the epidural. You could not feel your body stretching and could not feel when it needed to relax a bit. And so you stretched too much too fast and so tore.

Going unmedicated allows you to feel your body and know when you need to relax and back off. I am pregnant with my 7th now. I only ever tore with my first. I learned to listen to my body and let it do what it needs to do and I break when it needs to break. No tears not even with my super large-headed #6 (and ow did she hurt).

Following up with your other question, yes, you can go unmedicated in the hospital and then later change your mind. As long as you haven't reached the cut off limit for administering the meds, you should be able to receive them at any time. Again, this is just general information in something that is a case-by-case situation.

Ditto with staying home then changing your mind and going to the hospital. Totally okay. Maybe not feasible depending on when you change your mind but possible.

cscrzldbg · December 2021

I agree with @bumblebee0210 that one should be flexible and not rigidly set on one idea or frame of mind. The most important thing is that mama and baby are healthy. Life is unpredictable and so we need to be ready to roll with the punches and accept as best as possible what comes out way.

cscrzldbg · December 2021

And then just a bit of an awareness note, I know it wasn't intentional, but in reading through this thread it sort of changed into a pro epidural vibe. Or that is how it came across to me, personally.

I understand sharing your experience and/or preference and am not trying to be critical of that. However, if someone is coming to look for information and questions on "natural" and then seeing a lot of pro medication posts, it is a bit of a turn-off or can be a deterrent to commenting.

Like I said, just a note to be aware of what and how and where things are said.

tuxielove93 · December 2021

@bumblebee0210 The idea that only "easy" births are unmedicated is just silly. I'm sure you don't mean anything by it, but it comes off as really insulting to those of us who have birthed unmedicated. And women in general.= actually. Women were meant to give birth. There is no such thing as easy labor or birth. Every birth is hard in its own way. There's a whole dang human coming out of you. I was induced with my first and still went unmedicated. Induction is not some cakewalk. I am sorry your friends did not feel empowered by their birth. That's terrible, and I hope they find healing. No woman who brings a baby into this earth failed at anything.

@sunshineandlemons Yes, you can change your mind. There is a point at which they can't do the epidural anymore, but it's pretty late in the game. They asked me during labor if I wanted an epidural, even though I had made it clear I did not. It's not off the table just because it isn't your first choice. As long as you're in a hospital, of course. Birth centers and home births cannot do epidurals. But you can transfer if you needed to.

@tsh2021 Natural methods of pain management are very effective! As backed up by science. Here is one example: https://evidencebasedbirth.com/massage-for-pain-relief-during-labor/
It's not just a bunch of positive thinking. These things actually work.

@cscrzldbg Thank you for saying what I couldn't find a good way of saying.

I agree with cscrzldbg. I'd personally appreciate a thread where we focus on things other than medication and medical intervention when it comes to birth. Of which there are a plethora of options! Actually, come to think of it, maybe every month in addition to just the general discussion I can pull some specifics on one thing or another (breathing exercises, hypnobirthing, lamaze, devices etc. etc. ) and dump the info here for people to read.

I'll preface now by saying this: Every birth matters. No one should be shamed for what happened during their birth, or whatever choices they make for themselves. It's horrible that some moms feel less than because of their birth. That shouldn't be happening.

That said. I do believe that every woman has it in them to birth without pain medication if they want to. For one, your body was designed to give birth. Obviously, women have been giving birth for thousands of years without epidurals. I don't begrudge anyone who wants one, but if you want to go without it, you absolutely can, and there are lots of benefits to it.

For anyone interested, Evidence-Based Birth is a fantastic resource to get your hands on information for all things birth. It was started by a nurse and is chock full of great information on the science behind birth and birth outcomes for all kinds of things. Epidurals included. It's not hearsay, it's all scientific studies. Most of their content is free.

https://evidencebasedbirth.com/

Every birth is hard, regardless of what happens during. My first was an induction. Pitocin is not a joke. Pitocin contractions are longer, harder, and faster than the ones your body would produce on its own. I still did it without any pain medication. If that is something you want, there are a TON of ways to manage the pain and get through the birth without relying on medication.

Personally, I rely on breathing techniques and my husband. The nurses during my first labor taught him a specific back massage that is CLUTCH. They also taught me how to breathe through the contractions. There was a LOT of yelling before that.

For the breathing; You breathe in as the pain accelerates, and then once the contraction peaks, you breath out to let it out. Breath normally in between. If you focus on breathing, it distracts you from the pain and helps you to feel in control. I know it sounds simple, but it really truly works. I've gone through two labors with it. Simple things make a huge difference during birth.

For the massage: I'm going to link videos so that I don't describe it wrong because I am not the one who does it. But my husband pushes down on my back and settles onto my hips. He basically applies counter pressure to the contractions and it keeps the pain in check.

I also stay active during labor. Laying on your back is not helpful!! It doesn't help the baby move down, it doesn't help you feel better, and it doesn't keep labor moving. Slows the whole thing down really. Walking is helpful. Rocking in a rocking chair is good too. I like to sit on a ball for a little bit and just bounce slowly. You should be moving your hips and swaying. As you get further along, leaning over a bed or a chair and just swaying your hips is a good position too.

Don't be afraid to birth in whatever position feels comfortable. Laying on your back is best for the doctor, but not necessarily for you. I prefer to be on my hands and knees. Some women like to squat. Whatever you want to do and feels natural to you, do it! That's the way you should birth.

I personally can't stand water, but some women find that really useful! Some women like to shower, others like to do a full-on tub. The water helps relieve some of the pressures of gravity and soothe the pain. A lot of hospitals now offer birthing tubs if that is something you are interested in.

Make sure whoever is in the room with you is going to keep that oxytocin flowing. Oxytocin (the love hormone) is what causes contractions as well. So having your partner there, staying close to them, holding and hugging, kissing, and having him be intimate with you (as in like at a romantic dinner, not in the bedroom) is extremely helpful. The endorphins and dopamine release will keep you happier, and the oxytocin flow will get baby here quicker. While we're at it, having sex at the end of pregnancy can help get labor started as well for the same reason.

Quick note: some women end up not wanting to be touched at all during labor, and that's ok! If you don't want to be touched, don't fight that.

Also, also, don't get too hung up on having a birthing robe or special clothes to labor in. I very quickly go from jsut wanting a soft sleeping bra on to wearing nothing at all. I can't stand clothes at a certain point, and I am not alone in that assumption. Bring some things to be comfortable, but don't go overboard. And don't be ashamed of anything that happens! Most women poop during labor. A lot of women do not wear anything at all. The nurses do not care and they are very used to it.

Some women find music to be helpful as well, and I'm sure we'll have a thread when we get closer for music suggestions and playlists. Some women like to be pumped up, some want to use calming music. It also just helps to give you something to do when you're just waiting at the end. That last month can feel like a year.

Then there are a few specific "methods" of giving birth. Lamaze, Bradley, and hypnobirthing are the three I know off the top of my head. I personally haven't taken the classes, but some women swear by them!

Anyways. That is a basic rundown of the methods I know of to help you get through labor. I'd love to delve deeper as we get closer and pull more resources.

These are good options for anyone! Even if you do opt for pain medication (and p.s. there are options other than an epidural too) these are still useful for early labor and in general.

twentythree19 · December 2021

@cscrzldbg totally get where you’re coming from. I had the same thought and then wondered if the vaginal birth thread had been miss named. But I do think we may want to discuss a “reset” for this thread.

Ladies planning on natural birth…what’s your definition of it and what do you want to see discussed in this thread?

Full disclosure: I’ve had an epidural with both my kids and will likely do it again. But came over to learn and to cheer you ladies on. If natural is right for you, rock on - you and your bodies will do awesome things! If you ever feel like I’m pushing for interventions, don’t be afraid to call it how you see it. It’s easy to go from sharing my perspective if asked, to coming off as pushy.

tuxielove93 · December 2021

Here's a good video for the hip pressure I was talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FFLWaU8uo4

bumblebee0210 · December 2021

@tuxielove93. Just to be clear-- I did not say that the women I know who had good experiences with natural births had easy labors-- you're totally right. No labor is easy. I sad that they had *short* labors. And, I'm sorry-- it's true. It's a small sample size, sure, but I know 4 or 5 women who have gone unmedicated, and they have all had sub-12-hour labors. It's certainly possible to go unmedicated for longer-- epidurals haven't been around that long and women have been giving birth forever! But this is just what is true for the women that I know.

inthewoods23 · December 2021

As I stated way in the beginning... Perhaps this thread should be a general birth plan discussion thread to talk about all options and maybe as we get closer to due dates we split the thread into medicated and unmedicated birth threads or home birth and hospital birth threads when people have learned more about birthing in general and start deciding what they would like to do for their plans.

I don't think anyone here has been pro anything very strongly nor shamed anyone for their POV or experiences.

I would say starting in January we have a monthly birthing option thread to provide info for the many different options out there.

feather_heather · December 2021

Just a point of order... All birth is natural - so discussions regarding any type of birth should be allowed in this thread. If you would like a thread to discuss unmedicated birth options specifically, then the thread should be titled as such.

tuxielove93 · December 2021

@feather_heather What should the name be?

This is what I said in my first comment “ Hi mamas! If anyone has a better name idea, I’m all ears. That’s the most succinct way I could encompass everything. And don’t feel like just because you are going to the hospital or want an epidural you aren’t allowed! I think this is just a good place to talk about all the non-drug options for comfort during labor (especially as we get closer) ”

if you’ve got a better name idea I’d love it I just have no ideas on what else to call it.

tuxielove93 · December 2021

@bumblebee0210 I appreciate that. I think I misread some of your comment. I personally know women who have had long labors unmedicated. I just don’t want any new mamas to be discouraged 💕

zinnia19 · December 2021

@tuxielove93 thank you for sharing all your thoughts and suggestions on having an unmedicated birth. That is exactly the info I was looking for on this thread.

I agree with what @cscrzldbg said. While I appreciate everyone sharing their experience with epidurals, its not really what I thought this thread was for. I would love resources for natural pain relief through methods like hynobirthing or breathing exercises. And things that your partner can do to assist. Just trying to gather info as a FTM. Thanks all!

feather_heather · December 2021

@tuxielove93 - I think a thread titled "Unmedicated Birthing Options" would be perfect!

tuxielove93 · December 2021

@feather_heather that doesn’t really encompass that this is also for people utilizing midwives,birth centers,and home births. It’s not just unmedicated birth

bumblebee0210 · December 2021

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post, but for those interested in, let's say, lower-intervention births, one great option that I don't see used very often is a family medicine practice. I have a family med doc who is both my PCP and my "OB" (she does all prenatal care and delivers the baby), and then she can also be the baby's doctor as well! In my area at least, the family med docs are sort of halfway in between the midwives and the traditional OBs. The family med doctors deliver in the hospital, but are a bit more "holistic" than the OBs, who very much see themselves as surgeons first. If you end up needing intervention (they do not do c-sections, for instance), in my area you go to the MFMs (high-risk OBs) who are the best surgeons and most highly trained OBs. This might work differently in different areas, but I had a really good experience with my first pregnancy, and am very much looking forward to this type of care with this one.

skilouise · December 2021

At this stage, I think it's a lot more helpful to have a combined thread about birth options. A lot of FTMs may not know what they want to do yet, or know what all the options even are.

Also, while I fully support anyone having a non-medicated birth if that's what's right *for them*, sometimes proponents of unmedicated birth can stray into a lot of unsupported fear mongering about epidurals. For early discussions, I think it's better to have all the options discussed in one place, so people who are unsure what they want to do can see the pros and cons discussed in one place.

I also agree with @feather_heather, and deeply dislike the phrase "natural birth." All birth is natural. There's no moral or biological high ground to preferring one method over another.

skilouise · December 2021

Also, when people discuss their experience with alternate birthing locations to a hospital, it would be helpful to mention what country you are from. The UK and Canada, for example, have different approaches to things than in the US, and options that may be reasonably safe in one country may be much more dangerous in others. Home birth in the US, for example, is extremely dangerous.

tuxielove93 · December 2021

@skilouise You're worried about fear-mongering with epidurals and you just called home birth in the US extremely dangerous? This is exactly why I created this thread. You're gonna have to back that up with some data or YOU are the one in here fear-mongering. And since when does the word natural imply some sort of moral high ground!? I'm kind of confused why you are even worried about home births considering that other than me mentioning I was planning one, no one has even asked about it.

I am sorry if ANYONE somehow felt attacked by the word "natural". Absolutely no harm was meant. The literal translation from MY perspective since I wrote it is "less medical intervention". Exactly as I stated it. No pain medication, midwives, birthing centers, home births. That is it. As I have now stated MULTIPLE times, there is NO moral high ground. I do not think the births that I have had and that I am seeking are any better than anyone elses. We all just want our babies' earthside safe and sound. I'm sorry if anyone has come across other people who express this attitude, but it was never my intention. The ONLY thing I started this thread for was to give new mamas a space to ask those of us who have gone unmedicated and had "alternative" birthing sites questions. And for those of us who choose "alternative" birthing options to have a safe space to discuss them where we don't feel the need to keep defending opinions we don't even hold. I.E. That the word natural had a moral high ground intention to it.

So far all I see are those of us who have had "less medical" births offering support and guidance with LOTS of prefacing about how everyone should make the best choice for them. And other mamas getting offended at preconceived ideas of what words mean and calling birth choices "extremely dangerous".

Now, because I back up my opinions with DATA, here is the data on home birth in the US (and one study from the UK). As you read through, there is an increase in negative neonatal outcomes when you compare home birth to hospital birth (NOT birth centers, btw). HOWEVER, 1/4 of those births are unattended or unplanned. Meaning there was no midwife or doctor in attendance and/or the women did not intend to birth at home. Birthing without a doctor is not a good idea, and unplanned births out of the hospital (i.e. baby came faster than mama could get to a medical facility) obviously carry risks.

Here is the ACOG study on home versus hospital birth: https://www.acog.org/clinical/clinical-guidance/committee-opinion/articles/2017/04/planned-home-birth

Here is another study with much the same answers as the ACOG one: https://azdhs.gov/documents/licensing/special/midwives/committees/mspac/U-of-A-literature-review.pdf

THIS is a study comparing apples to apples: Planned and attended home births versus planned and attended hospital births. AND the women who were chosen to be part of the study that were in the hospital met the same medical requirements as the women who birthed at home. In other words, the health and risk factors of the births were the same. As you will see when you read, this is the outcome of that study: "Planned home birth attended by a registered midwife was associated with very low and comparable rates of perinatal death and reduced rates of obstetric interventions and other adverse perinatal outcomes compared with planned hospital birth attended by a midwife or physician"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2742137/

Here is a big study comparing a number of birthing outcomes and looking at home birth outcomes that are planned and attended.
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/jmwh.12172

And just to make sure I am not misunderstood: I am not advocating anything here. Every woman should make the decision that she feels most comfortable with in regards to her own birth. Judging someone for their birth choices is a stupid game and I do not participate in it. Judging someone for nearly any parenting choice is a worthless quest. I just want actual information to be shared, and I always love sharing the tips and support that got ME through my first two births. I am just trying to pass that knowledge on. If it weren't for other mamas in my other bump groups having threads like this, I wouldn't have had the births I did. I am eternally grateful to them, and I feel the only way to honor them is to do what they did and pass it on. I have also gotten a lot of pushback on my birth choices from family, and I appreciate the space to talk to other like-minded mamas where there isn't shaming and pushback.

I started another thread for all births.

I don't think I can change the title of this thread. But from here on out, when I make this thread, if I am the one to make it, we will call it the " Month Unmedicated/Midwife/Birth Center/Home Birth Support Thread". It's wordy which is why I tried to shorten it in the first place, but I am not trying to upset people here so that's that.

Hopefully that clears this up.

peppylilfoxy · December 2021

I think everyone should just do it like how my gestational carrier gave birth to her second daughter.... In the car in a robin's donuts parking lot on the way to the midwife 😂😂😂

Sorry, but I hate the arguing. I believe sharing experiences or research on multiple birthing options is good for helping others decide what is right for them but it needs to be done so in a non-judgemental way. I also think we don't really have a right to comment on other countries that we do not live in. For example, as a Canadian I wouldn't feel comfortable speaking to the healthcare system in the US because I do not know not have I experienced their healthcare system but I could confidently speak to the UK healthcare because I lived there and experienced it. The only thing we can really speak to with confidence is our own experiences.

Want a personalized experience?

December Natural Birth Thread

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