No Praise, No Punishment

KatCameBack · October 2014

I am generally blissfully unaware of theories on parenting, but lately I gone down several internet rabbit holes on parenting topics. Today, it was the style of progressive parenting/attachment parenting advocated by author Alfie Kohn. In Kohn's estimation it is counterproductive to make your children say "please", "thank you", "sorry" or "goodbye". He also finds that praise (even a "good boy or good girl") deadens the intrinsic drive for kids to achieve. I honestly never in a thousand years thought about not teaching kids to say thank you, or not praising or pushing a little from time to time was a thing. Conflicted on how I feel about this... Anyone have any experience here?

rainbowdashh · October 2014

I consider myself an attachment parent and I think that's a load of crap. Especially the praise. Positive reinforcement goes a long way.

I can understand the idea of not forcing your kid to say please or thank you or whatever because you want them to mean it when they say it. But honestly, I don't always mean it. I say it because it's an automatic response and it's polite. So I do it. Sometimes we have to do things we don't want to.

I just read something the other day that said time outs are basically emotionally traumatizing. I eye rolled hard.

augustusgoose · October 2014

I think all these studies make everything harder then it has to be. I always treated my son like a mini adult. I expect him to think things through. Know consequences of actions, not just to himself but the big picture. I use incentives for something's like school, such as he gets on the Honor role he can pick any place he wants to eat for a calibration dinner. He gets grounded when he's lippy, just from electronics, that's punishment enough for him, he can still play outside and read and use toys (don't want to discourage that). It's just a common sense approach. I don't know if that has a specific name or not. It's the approach we will use for DS2.

MollySm · October 2014

There are a lot of interesting scientific studies on praise. The short version is that praising effort if super useful, but praising a child's achievements, (or looks for that matter) can be disadvantageous. Saying 'Good girl' is pretty meaningless and can take away from actual praise you give (such as 'Good job working so hard to get that shape in the hole. When you got stuck you turned it, trying so many ways to get it to fit!'. Or whatever).

Saying please and thank you is important in my book. As far as saying sorry, I focus more on teaching them to be sorry. Saying it just because you have to is useless. Say it because you actually feel sorry.

diagonalley · October 2014

I cannot fathom why someone would advocate against manners?

catsinawindow · October 2014

This might be a UO / FFFC, but I think that most parenting "experts" WILDLY over think child-rearing. I try to keep doing what seems to work and stop doing what doesn't seem to work and not over-think every single thing I do or say. Chances are the kids will be fine whether or not you call them a "good boy" or teach them to say "please" and "thank you" (both of which I do, by the way).

lest12 · October 2014

I will absolutely teach my children to say please and thank you, and I'm ok with being strict about that. I will also give praise when praise is deserved... I also agree that it's important to talk to them about why they are being praised (same as you would talk to them about the importance of manners, or why they might be punished, you know? I think explaining and talking stuff through will a long way).

MrsRahl · October 2014

Just as an fyi, taking things away that are aversive is actually called negative reinforcement. Positive and negative reinforcement has nothing to do with good and bad. Negative reinforcement can be good.

Ex. Johnny can get up from the table after he eats 2 more bites of broccoli =negative reinforcement (you're taking the aversive stimulus away)

Johnny hates sleeping with the light on so you turn it off = negative reinforcement.

Johnny clears the table so Johnny gets a quarter = positive reinforcement.

I'm a special ed. teacher and so this misunderstanding bothers me. Nerd alert!

fsumom · October 2014

I have recently started to look up "gentle parenting." I agree with the concept in theory. I just personally don't know if I can use it in reality. I'm not the most patient person anyways which is why I'm trying to find better ways to parent. What I do now isn't working with my 8 year old at times so I'm willing to try the nicer approach.

https://www.thenaturalparent.com.au/blog/?p=2901

JmeJoLee83 · October 2014

If a child doesn't learn to say please and thank you at home:

1. I feel sorry for their teachers
2 who's job is it to teach them that?

Just like holding a door open for a person or other acts of politeness- I think are important life skills and will be modeling these for my children.

fsumom · October 2014

@JmeJoLee83

I think with gentle parenting, it's just not forced. The concept is probably taught (someone correct me if I'm wrong), but the parent does not force the child to say as the goal is for the child to want to say it. Although, I can't say I agree with this and have taught my daughter that we say please and thank you.

JmeJoLee83 · October 2014

@fsumom‌ thanks for clarification. I just think it's weird...if a thank you is warranted then you say it. Good manners require a please. To each his/her own though...

Want a personalized experience?

No Praise, No Punishment

Re: No Praise, No Punishment

Choose Another Board

Search Boards