Today's SCOTUS Decision

Re: Today's SCOTUS Decision

• jellybean529 member

  July 2014

  MommyAtty said:

  SoMoNY said:

  They didn't ban ALL forms of BC nor did they say the woman can never take them, they sued to not be forced to pay for it.

  
  

  I have no problem with that at all.

  
  

  The sky isn't falling despite all the faux outrage we see in left leasning press and on FB

  
  

  
  

  
  Wow. You're naive. A woman making $14 an hour cannot afford to get a $900 IUD if the insurance THAT SHE PAYS FOR won't cover it. And under this decision, a Christian Scientist closely held corp can ban all health care other than prayer. A Jehovah's Witness one can ban blood transfusions. A company owned by native Jamaican traditionalists can ban having any body part removed. A Catholic company can ban all birth control. This is why we need single payor healthcare.

  YES. YES. YES.

  

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• rockychryslerb2010 member

  July 2014 edited July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  rockychryslerb2010 said:

  SoMoNY said:

  They didn't ban ALL forms of BC nor did they say the woman can never take them, they sued to not be forced to pay for it.

  
  

  I have no problem with that at all.

  
  

  The sky isn't falling despite all the faux outrage we see in left leasning press and on FB

  
  

  
  

  If you're an executive or work at the corporate office at HL, you can probably afford to purchase without insurance.  This isn't the case for everyone.
  

  
  

  How many people really need to use one of those 4 options over the other 10+ options that are available?

  
  

  
  

  Again, sky isn't falling

  
  

  
  

  
  

  Some women can't take the hormones in birth control.  See @jellybean529 post for how this affects real women.  Besides, what right does an employer have to dictate medical decisions? That should be between a woman and her doctor.
  
  ETA: Huffpost has a good article with real stories. They're not just about preventing pregnancies, their about pills and IUDs.  Worth the read to help gain perspective
  https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/01/birth-control-benefits-hobby-lobby_n_5545178.html?ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000037
  

  
  

  laying down the law on Oahu's North Shore
  

  
  

  

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• jellybean529 member

  July 2014

  ALSO: This ruling completely overrides the Establishment Clause part of the First Amendment.

  

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• SoMoNY member

  July 2014

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Report2 Reply
• jellybean529 member

  July 2014 edited July 2014

  The supreme court ruled in 1947 in the case of Everson vs the Board of Education: 

  
  

  "The "establishment of religion" clause of the First Amendment means at least this: Neither a state nor the federal government can set up a church. Neither can pass laws which aid one religion, aid all religions, or prefer one religion over another. Neither can force nor influence a person to go to or to remain away from church against his will or force him to profess a belief or disbelief in any religion. No person can be punished for entertaining or professing religious beliefs or disbeliefs, for church attendance or non-attendance. No tax in any amount, large or small, can be levied to support any religious activities or institutions, whatever they may be called, or whatever form they may adopt to teach or practice religion. Neither a state nor the Federal Government can, openly or secretly, participate in the affairs of any religious organizations or groups and vice versa. In the words of Jefferson, the clause against establishment of religion by law was intended to erect "a wall of separation between church and State."

  
  

  At what point did this change?? 

  

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• rockychryslerb2010 member

  July 2014

  
  

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Curious what your thoughts are about how HL is making money off these products?   If they are so ethically against these products for religious reasons, why are they OK investing in and supporting the manufacturers of these products as a shareholder?
  

  
  

  laying down the law on Oahu's North Shore
  

  
  

  

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• jellybean529 member

  July 2014 edited July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Businesses =/= People.

  
  

  PEOPLE have a constitutional right to freedom of religion. BUSINESSES DO NOT. Or rather, they shouldn't. A business cannot hold a belief because it is not a living thing.

  
  

  And "just go work somewhere else" SCREAMS of privilege. We should all be so lucky to be able to make that "choice"...

  

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• steponalego11 member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  OK, So if a Muslim owned company wanted to say that either woman can't work in their company and if they did make an exception then they couldn't speak or contaminate with men would that be OK with you?
  
  If a christian scientist said you couldn't treat your kids heart condition or give them immunizations would that be ok with you? or if they said chemo for cancer treatment didn't go with their beliefs would that OK?
  
  
  
  ALSO EMPLOYEES PAY FOR THEIR HEALTH INSURANCE!! So these companies take money from their employees paychecks to pay for the group coverage and then dictate what can and can't be covered regardless of medical need but it's ok because it goes against their beliefs?
  
  I really don't understand your logic at all.
  

  

  Report17 Reply
• thebanich member

  July 2014

  If one more person says "Just go get another job" I may completely lose it.
  
  not the point.
  

  

  Report23 Reply
• thebanich member

  July 2014

  Also really fucking hard.
  
  <-  Has a college degree and been searching for a (better paying) job for well over a year.
  

  

  Report11 Reply
• jellybean529 member

  July 2014

  thebanich said:

  Also really fucking hard.
  
  <-  Has a college degree and been searching for a (better paying) job for well over a year.
  

  I'm so sorry

  

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• rockychryslerb2010 member

  July 2014

  
  

  FTWR said:

  If you say 'go get another job' I think you seriously need to check your privilege.
  

  Also if you truly believe anyone can just go out and purchase these products without insurance coverage....
  

  
  

  laying down the law on Oahu's North Shore
  

  
  

  

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• thebanich member

  July 2014

  
  

  Inkogneetoh said:

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  It's also not right for a business (not an individual) to force it's beliefs on their tens, hundreds, even thousands, of employees (actual individuals) who do not hold the same beliefs.  Especially on beliefs that ARE NOT BACKED BY FACT.

  
  

  Edited to also point out that a business is not an individual while it's employees are.

  QFMFT
  

  

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• minervacullen member

  July 2014

  I just wait for people like SoM... whatever, to meet karma. It will happen.
  
  Maybe some day she, or her daughter, friend, relative, will have debilitating ovarian cysts or an ectopic pregnancy. It'll be a shame when her insurance won't cover the costs to treat, because years before SCOTUS ruined women's rights.
  

  
  
  
  
  
  
  

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• vterp member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Why not slice this the other way...if the business owners don't like the laws they would have to abide by as business owners, then don't open a business.

  '>v

  Report16 Reply
• MommyAtty member

  July 2014

  @amy052006‌ - I just got an IUD. I read the FAQs. Interestingly, in their FAQs, they admit they don't know how the IUD works, but it's most likely that it kills sperm and thins the uterine lining. And my IUD has hormones, so it's also keeping me from ovulating. Bottom line, absolutely no birth control method is at all like abortion. None.

  Report6 Reply
• [Deleted User] member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  You live in a very simplified world if you honestly think this is a valid and realistic option.
  
  
  
  

  Report11 Reply
• SoMoNY member

  July 2014

  MrsButt said:

  Oh yes, because getting a new job is SO easy. What stellar advice!
  

  For people with marketable talents getting a job is quote easy.

  
  

  I could change jobs tomorrow if I wanted to without breaking a sweat as could 90% of my friends and colueges.  

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• jellybean529 member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  MrsButt said:

  Oh yes, because getting a new job is SO easy. What stellar advice!
  

  For people with marketable talents getting a job is quote easy.

  
  

  I could change jobs tomorrow if I wanted to without breaking a sweat as could 90% of my friends and colueges.  

  Well aren't you special and lucky then?

  Not everybody has this choice. Not everybody has "marketable talents". Not everyone comes from a socioeconomic background that provides them the support needed to cultivate marketable talents.

  
  

  Oh and:

  
  

  FTWR said:

  
  

  CHECK YOUR PRIVILEGE
  

  ^^ QFT.

  

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• SoMoNY member

  July 2014

  jellybean529 said:

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Businesses =/= People.

  
  

  PEOPLE have a constitutional right to freedom of religion. BUSINESSES DO NOT. Or rather, they shouldn't. A business cannot hold a belief because it is not a living thing.

  
  

  And "just go work somewhere else" SCREAMS of privilege. We should all be so lucky to be able to make that "choice"...

  Corporate personhood, the Supreme Court ruled in favor of it.

  
  

  As for screams of privilege, no its a result of hard work.  I have 3 college degrees and have worked hard to get to where I am.  

  
  

  
  

  Report0 Reply
• [Deleted User] member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  MrsButt said:

  Oh yes, because getting a new job is SO easy. What stellar advice!
  

  For people with marketable talents getting a job is quote easy.

  
  

  I could change jobs tomorrow if I wanted to without breaking a sweat as could 90% of my friends and colueges.  

  
  

  Can I ask what your field is?

  Report0 Reply
• SoMoNY member

  July 2014

  MarlaSinger& said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  You live in a very simplified world if you honestly think this is a valid and realistic option.

  
  

  Well the highest court in the land says otherwise.  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  Report0 Reply
• SoMoNY member

  July 2014

  A great quote from the NYT discussion boards

  
  

  "The fact that folks against HL and against this decision use such overblown language, and ignore the fact that HL has been and will continue to cover birth control pills (and the fact that 48 million Americans continue to have no health coverage at all, while hand-wringing over the 23,000 HL employees who won't get their IUDs and ECs paid for) makes it look like comments like this are all just pure political partisanship."
  

  
  

  
  

  Report1 Reply
• [Deleted User] member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  MarlaSinger& said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  You live in a very simplified world if you honestly think this is a valid and realistic option.

  
  

  Well the highest court in the land says otherwise.  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  Oh snap.  

  
  

  
  

  Report1 Reply
• steponalego11 member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  MrsButt said:

  Oh yes, because getting a new job is SO easy. What stellar advice!
  

  For people with marketable talents getting a job is quote easy.

  
  

  I could change jobs tomorrow if I wanted to without breaking a sweat as could 90% of my friends and colueges.  

  Unless something happened in your life or the economy that made your skills and marketable talents  not so valuable. Only a few years back massive amounts of people with high level skills were laid off and forced to work in jobs that were once beneath them. I know many a banker who was forced to take a retail or hourly position while they reinvented themselves and those skills.
  
  Good luck facing the rough times in your life with such a generous and empathetic spirit!
  
  P.S When making statements about how great your colleagues and skills are that you will never have to even think about things like struggles finding a job or paying out of pocket  - it's best to use a spell check in these parts, it's quite easy.
  

  

  Report9 Reply
• SoMoNY member

  July 2014

  I'm typing left handed because my dominant hand is in a cast, thought I was doing well considering the situation.

  
  

  But for you Miss perfect I will try harder

  
  

  
  

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• jellybean529 member

  July 2014 edited July 2014

  loislayn said:

  SoMoNY said:

  A great quote from the NYT discussion boards

  
  

  "The fact that folks against HL and against this decision use such overblown language, and ignore the fact that HL has been and will continue to cover birth control pills (and the fact that 48 million Americans continue to have no health coverage at all, while hand-wringing over the 23,000 HL employees who won't get their IUDs and ECs paid for) makes it look like comments like this are all just pure political partisanship."
  

  
  

  
  

  I fight for the rights of both. They aren't mutually exclusive.
  
  I also sign people up for insurance every day.
  

  QFT. Again. I agree and do the same.

  

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• [Deleted User] member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  A great quote from the NYT discussion boards

  
  

  "The fact that folks against HL and against this decision use such overblown language, and ignore the fact that HL has been and will continue to cover birth control pills (and the fact that 48 million Americans continue to have no health coverage at all, while hand-wringing over the 23,000 HL employees who won't get their IUDs and ECs paid for) makes it look like comments like this are all just pure political partisanship."
  

  
  

  
  

  The implications and precedent set are more far reaching than 23,000 employees receiving birth control.  

  
  

  But I am not really expecting you to understand that.

  Report11 Reply
• thebanich member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  jellybean529 said:

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Businesses =/= People.

  
  

  PEOPLE have a constitutional right to freedom of religion. BUSINESSES DO NOT. Or rather, they shouldn't. A business cannot hold a belief because it is not a living thing.

  
  

  And "just go work somewhere else" SCREAMS of privilege. We should all be so lucky to be able to make that "choice"...

  Corporate personhood, the Supreme Court ruled in favor of it.

  
  

  As for screams of privilege, no its a result of hard work.  I have 3 college degrees and have worked hard to get to where I am.  

  
  

  
  

  
  
  

  

  Report3 Reply
• thebanich member

  July 2014

  <----------- banned
  

  

  Report3 Reply
• steponalego11 member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  A great quote from the NYT discussion boards

  
  

  "The fact that folks against HL and against this decision use such overblown language, and ignore the fact that HL has been and will continue to cover birth control pills (and the fact that 48 million Americans continue to have no health coverage at all, while hand-wringing over the 23,000 HL employees who won't get their IUDs and ECs paid for) makes it look like comments like this are all just pure political partisanship."
  

  
  

  
  

  Again it is not just HL, there are 100 other companies that brought suit. Also, and with your 3 college degrees I am sure you would've learned about how the supreme court rulings work, IT IS NOT JUST ABOUT THE BIRTH CONTROL IN QUESTION IT IS ABOUT THE PRECEDENT IT SETS FOR BUSINESS OWNERS TO DETERMINE WHAT MEDICAL TREATMENTS CAN AND CAN NOT BE OFFERED TO THEIR EMPLOYEES AND CLAIM RELIGION AS THE REASON (WHEN OFTEN TIME IT WILL BE COST) THIS WILL COME TO AFFECT IMMUNIZATIONS, MENTAL HEALTH TREATMENT, BIRTH PLANS, AND IN SOME INSTANCES HEROIC MEASURES TO SAVE A LIFE.
  
  The importance of a Supreme Court decision is VERY RARELY, If at all, just about the case in questions.
  

  

  Report17 Reply
• [Deleted User] member

  July 2014

  This was a nice refresher that there really are people out there still who echo elitist mantras and expect their life reflects those who have not had the life circumstances they have.  

  Report21 Reply
• jellybean529 member

  July 2014 edited July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  jellybean529 said:

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Businesses =/= People.

  
  

  PEOPLE have a constitutional right to freedom of religion. BUSINESSES DO NOT. Or rather, they shouldn't. A business cannot hold a belief because it is not a living thing.

  
  

  And "just go work somewhere else" SCREAMS of privilege. We should all be so lucky to be able to make that "choice"...

  Corporate personhood, the Supreme Court ruled in favor of it.

  
  

  As for screams of privilege, no its a result of hard work.  I have 3 college degrees and have worked hard to get to where I am.  

  
  

  
  

  AS DO I. But I don't live in this hole where I think that I am above everybody else because I have 3 college degrees and a great job. I recognize the fact that ANY OF US are one catastrophe away from disaster. I was DAMN lucky that I was raised in a white, upper middle class family where I had the socieoeconomic support TO earn those three college degrees. THAT IS PRIVILEGE. 

  
  

  ETA Corporate Personhood is a sham. Just because they ruled in favor of it doesn't make it any less of a sham.

  

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• Unknown

  July 2014

  This content has been removed.
• jellybean529 member

  July 2014

  YellowWallpaper12 said:

  
  

  SoMoNY said:

  jellybean529 said:

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Businesses =/= People.

  
  

  PEOPLE have a constitutional right to freedom of religion. BUSINESSES DO NOT. Or rather, they shouldn't. A business cannot hold a belief because it is not a living thing.

  
  

  And "just go work somewhere else" SCREAMS of privilege. We should all be so lucky to be able to make that "choice"...

  Corporate personhood, the Supreme Court ruled in favor of it.

  
  

  As for screams of privilege, no its a result of hard work.  I have 3 college degrees and have worked hard to get to where I am.  

  
  

  
  

  I can't believe there are still people who buy into the myth that if you just WORK HARD, you will be successful. That's some blinded by privilege bullshit. The working poor work just as hard as you do.
  

  Many of them even harder.

  

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• CinemaGoddess member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  MarlaSinger& said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  You live in a very simplified world if you honestly think this is a valid and realistic option.

  
  

  Well the highest court in the land says otherwise.  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  Yes, and the court is never wrong. 

  
  

  Plessy v. Ferguson

   
  

  
  

  Unable to even.  

  ********************

  You don't understand the appeal of Benedict Cumberbatch / think he's fug / don't know who he is? WATCH SHERLOCK.  Until you do, your negative opinion of him will not be taken seriously.
  

  
  

  
  

  Report4 Reply
• jellybean529 member

  July 2014

  amy052006 said:

  Please right leaning wackos, keep on keeping on with this nonsense against women.  "Enrage and motivate the female voter to turn out in droves" has always been a huge win for the right.  I am sure it will work out great for you!

  IDK about you but I'll be taking election day off to drive people to the polls if I have to at this point.

  

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• CinemaGoddess member

  July 2014

  SoMoNY said:

  jellybean529 said:

  SoMoNY said:

  Don't like your employer or their coverage do a little research and find a job that fits your needs.

  Or go on the open exchange and get your own insurance.
  

  
  

  I don't think its right to force a business to pay for things that offend their beliefs.  

  
  

  Businesses =/= People.

  
  

  PEOPLE have a constitutional right to freedom of religion. BUSINESSES DO NOT. Or rather, they shouldn't. A business cannot hold a belief because it is not a living thing.

  
  

  And "just go work somewhere else" SCREAMS of privilege. We should all be so lucky to be able to make that "choice"...

  Corporate personhood, the Supreme Court ruled in favor of it.

  
  

  As for screams of privilege, no its a result of hard work.  I have 3 college degrees and have worked hard to get to where I am.  

  
  

  
  

  I have three college degrees, a Honda civic, 7 popsicles in my freezer, and a girl boner for Benedict Cumberbatch. 

  
  

  I WIN AT LIFE. 

   
  

  
  

  Unable to even.  

  ********************

  You don't understand the appeal of Benedict Cumberbatch / think he's fug / don't know who he is? WATCH SHERLOCK.  Until you do, your negative opinion of him will not be taken seriously.
  

  
  

  
  

  Report24 Reply
• CinemaGoddess member

  July 2014

  White people are so lame.  

   
  

  
  

  Unable to even.  

  ********************

  You don't understand the appeal of Benedict Cumberbatch / think he's fug / don't know who he is? WATCH SHERLOCK.  Until you do, your negative opinion of him will not be taken seriously.
  

  
  

  
  

  Report2 Reply
• Unknown

  July 2014

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