Found this gem on Facebook, opinions?

Ecat504 · June 2014

https://www.umbrelr.com/young-mother-giving-kids-dont-blame/

JustCricket · June 2014

I agree with a lot of the article

bumpuser10199668 · June 2014

I'm confused. When you say "gem" it makes it sound like you don't like it. Is that your opinion?

gingerkid9989 · June 2014

I love the article.

MMason12 · June 2014

CarmAlarm said:

I'm confused. When you say "gem" it makes it sound like you don't like it. Is that your opinion?

That is the same impression I get.

I agree 100% with the article. My husband and I were just talking the other day about how kids now-a-days are not being taught how to function without people catering to their constant needs. It's okay for kids to be taught how to fail, dust themselves off and how to try again. Although our kids will be a priority to us, they will not be our number one or only priority.

ETA: more.

Djcieply · June 2014

I also agree with this article. I guess I just dont agree with the title, because I dont feel that helping your kids learn how to cope with reality and failure is giving up on them or that they are not the center of your world.

trebekastan · June 2014

I read this a while back and 100% agree with this. Very few parents actually "parent" anymore. Instead you have a generation of kids that has grown up with parents that have push electronics in their faces from day 1 so they don't have to be an active participant in raising their children. On top of that, they choose being "cool" and liked over providing them with any sort of structure.

formerwigirl · June 2014

I also agree with the article. I grew up with a very strict/old school father. My friends always thought he was mean or wrong because of things he said/did. But as an adult I don't blame anyone for my failures. To each their own though.

punnybunny · June 2014

Djcieply said:
I guess I just dont agree with the title, because I dont feel that helping your kids learn how to cope with reality and failure is giving up on them or that they are not the center of your world.

This. I also think there's a difference between taking care of the problem FOR the child and being there for guidance if the child needs and asks for help.

mrsdanielleM2010 · June 2014

I was put off by the title, but loved every word of the article. @ecat504 what do you think of the article? I can't tell.

MMason12 · June 2014

lstrejcek said:

I read this a while back and 100% agree with this. Very few parents actually "parent" anymore. Instead you have a generation of kids that has grown up with parents that have push electronics in their faces from day 1 so they don't have to be an active participant in raising their children. On top of that, they choose being "cool" and liked over providing them with any sort of structure.

All three of my sister-in-laws and my in-laws are 100% shocked and they all act almost offended that we refuse to own a video game system (for the TV or handheld) in our house. We really just feel like owning one is not a necessity and our kids can learn to function without having electronic video games to entertain them.

Djcieply · June 2014

lstrejcek said:

I read this a while back and 100% agree with this. Very few parents actually "parent" anymore. Instead you have a generation of kids that has grown up with parents that have push electronics in their faces from day 1 so they don't have to be an active participant in raising their children. On top of that, they choose being "cool" and liked over providing them with any sort of structure.

Yup it drives me nuts that my 7 year old twin nephews have their own ipad mini's and all they do is lounge around the house. My BIL gets them whatever they need after school like a snack or a drink because its just easier and quicker for him to do everything for them then to teach them and have them do it themselves. If I ever correct them when they are at my parents house they usually run to my sister and complain and I get the "You know you cant be that hard on them they are really sensitive" from my sister. I want to say to her "pretty sure the same parents raised us idk why you let them act the way you do" but arguing with my sister is always pointless.

ashaw512 · June 2014

mamakate12345 said:
Agree 100% with article. You should see some of my son's friends at age 10....constant crybaby entitled, supersensitive crap. And parents who run to them as if they've smashed their heads open when literally nothing significant has happened.

This is SIL kids. Her son is 7, crybaby, tattle tale, blah blah.

trebekastan · June 2014

https://www.2machines.com/articles/181304.html

DH shared this on my FB today. Glad we are on the same page.

trebekastan · June 2014

Djcieply said:

lstrejcek said:

I read this a while back and 100% agree with this. Very few parents actually "parent" anymore. Instead you have a generation of kids that has grown up with parents that have push electronics in their faces from day 1 so they don't have to be an active participant in raising their children. On top of that, they choose being "cool" and liked over providing them with any sort of structure.

Yup it drives me nuts that my 7 year old twin nephews have their own ipad mini's and all they do is lounge around the house. My BIL gets them whatever they need after school like a snack or a drink because its just easier and quicker for him to do everything for them then to teach them and have them do it themselves. If I ever correct them when they are at my parents house they usually run to my sister and complain and I get the "You know you cant be that hard on them they are really sensitive" from my sister. I want to say to her "pretty sure the same parents raised us idk why you let them act the way you do" but arguing with my sister is always pointless.

Disgusting. I every table I see when we go out to eat the kids are on their tablets and the parents are on their cell phones. What is the point of having a family if you never want to interact with them. These parents act like it is a chore to engage in a dialogue with their kids.

trebekastan · June 2014

kshayes0315 said:

https://www.2machines.com/articles/181304.html
DH shared this on my FB today. Glad we are on the same page.
I was actually ganged up on at pizza the other the night by my MIL and her cousin because I wouldn't download a coloring app on my phone for my 22 month old to play with. I said she doesn't need it. We play with her or she has learned to entertain herself in other ways (I bring toys and books when we go out). They sat there and said I was actually doing her harm by not allowing her to play with those types of electronics because when she starts school she won't know how to operate them. I will eventually let her play with computers and iPads and such but in very small amounts and supervised my me. I'm not going to use it as a tool to distract my child so I can have a conversation. Especially when she isn't even 2 years old!!!

How is knowing how to open an app on an ipad (or not even since you would open it for her and hand it to her) more important than her learning to master the hand-eye coordination necessary (that a lot of kids now have to do remediation on because they got no practice a children) for WRITING!!!! I can't even stand it.

MMason12 · June 2014

I am glad to see I'm not the only semi "anti electronic video" game person out there. I swear most of the time we feel so alone with that parenting thought of ours.

Every single one of nieces and nephews has no clue what to do when we go out to eat with them other than play with video games. None of them can hold any type of conversation with you. It's sad.

The amount of "crap" that we take for being anti-electronics for babies is unbelievable. You would think we were basically abusing them.

And @Damasked I 100% agree with you that kids need to learn what "bullying" really means. Being called names, teased, or made fun of -- like almost every kid at some point has done to them -- is not bullying. Nor is it bullying if other kids do not like them or want to play with them. People have seriously forgotten what "bullying" really means now a days.

wrightpalomo · June 2014

Damasked said: I agree with not making your child the center of your universe and not coddling them. I do think, however, that kids should be taught the TRUE definition of bullying and what they should do when being bullied or seeing someone else being bullied. I want to raise a daughter who is empowered to deal with these situations on her own as much as possible.
-----------------^quote^-----------------------
I read this article a while ago and remember not liking it. I remember thinking that her attitude is one of those "kids these days!" which is just so blah to me. People always think that people "nowadays" aren't being raised properly. I feel like people say this every generation. I also take issue with her "boys will be boys" point of view. I know she has some good points in the article (teaching manners, limiting TV time, teaching forgiveness, etc) but to me they are obvious to the point of being moot in a parenting article and her good intentions get lost in light of her presentation.

I don't have time to read it again right now and pick it apart in a detailed way but I do want to say that I agree with @Damasked. My nephew is 11 and excellent when it comes to bullying. He has intervened when his friends are treating others poorly and has diffused situations that other kids would have let get out of hand. Not all kids have the ability (confidence, support, personality, whatever) to do this but I am really proud of him when he steps up to defend others. I do think it is important to recognize that bullying isn't just physical violence. I think kids who treat other children poorly are likely to grow up to be adults who treat others poorly. Raising kids to have the ability to recognize that and confront others (peacefully) when they are uncomfortable in a situation is important. It is also important to recognize that some behaviors (like violent/gun play) are not acceptable in all situations (like at school).

eta: quote fail

Djcieply · June 2014

MMason12 said:

Every single one of nieces and nephews has no clue what to do when we go out to eat with them other than play with video games. None of them can hold any type of conversation with you. It's sad.

This is exactly how my sisters kids are. My 12 yo niece rarely answers you if you say hello or ask her a question, she just acts like she didnt hear you. Its painful to carry on a conversation with her or her brothers. I had to take my niece with me to a baby shower over the weekend because my sister was unable to go and my sister told her before we left that she cant be on her phone the whole time. Im thinking why is the 12 year old even being allowed to bring her cell phone with to a baby shower that she is going to be at with her two aunts and grandma that all have cell phones in case something happens.

mrsdanielleM2010 · June 2014

wrightpalomo, you remind me of this quote:“Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers.”

From Socrates. It's good to remember that for thousands of years people have struggled with the new way of parenting, and the way that new generations seem to be different. I agree with you about what's good in the article, but unfortunately I don't think that those points ARE actually that obvious. If they were, we wouldn't need to still discuss them so frequently I think.

MrsLaLaBug · June 2014

I absolutely agree with the article. When I was pregnant with DD, I went through a period of feeling very unsure and anxious about ACTUALLY raising a child in this insane society we live in today. I realized all I can really do is "train up a child in the way he should go", and hope that it sticks.
I have also recently had a run in with my own mother about the computer/TV/iPad scenario. She wondered why I didn't let DD play on my iPad nonstop("isn't that why y'all bought it?"), was confused that she wouldn't sit in front of the computer with her and watch YouTube videos(she's only just over a year old FFS??), and she acted like I was the weirdest mom on the block when she kept turning on cartoons and asking me which one was her favorite and I said "none of them, bc she doesn't really watch cartoons much at home." I tried to point out that was why I brought books, bubbles, and other toys for her to play with when I was visiting. My mom actually acted like she was annoyed that my kid wouldn't just veg out on the fucking couch like her lazy ass and stare at the tv or the computer for hours. *eyeroll* I haven't been back to visit yet since then bc it bothered me so much.

trebekastan · June 2014

wrightpalomo said:

Damasked said:

I agree with not making your child the center of your universe and not coddling them. I do think, however, that kids should be taught the TRUE definition of bullying and what they should do when being bullied or seeing someone else being bullied. I want to raise a daughter who is empowered to deal with these situations on her own as much as possible.

-----------------^quote^-----------------------

I read this article a while ago and remember not liking it. I remember thinking that her attitude is one of those "kids these days!" which is just so blah to me. People always think that people "nowadays" aren't being raised properly. I feel like people say this every generation. I also take issue with her "boys will be boys" point of view. I know she has some good points in the article (teaching manners, limiting TV time, teaching forgiveness, etc) but to me they are obvious to the point of being moot in a parenting article and her good intentions get lost in light of her presentation.

I don't have time to read it again right now and pick it apart in a detailed way but I do want to say that I agree with @Damasked. My nephew is 11 and excellent when it comes to bullying. He has intervened when his friends are treating others poorly and has diffused situations that other kids would have let get out of hand. Not all kids have the ability (confidence, support, personality, whatever) to do this but I am really proud of him when he steps up to defend others. I do think it is important to recognize that bullying isn't just physical violence. I think kids who treat other children poorly are likely to grow up to be adults who treat others poorly. Raising kids to have the ability to recognize that and confront others (peacefully) when they are uncomfortable in a situation is important. It is also important to recognize that some behaviors (like violent/gun play) are not acceptable in all situations (like at school).

eta: quote fail

I really disagree with you here. I think boys will be boys and making them act more like girls does them a disservice. This goes to a whole other topic, but we have taken isolated school shooting incidents and turned them into a national epidemic. Expelling kids for making a gun with their hand or playing cops and robbers is asinine. Boys aren't meant to sit still, they just aren't. That is a more well liked female characteristic and I think it's time we start accepting boys for who they are and allow them to just BE sometimes.

bumpuser10199668 · June 2014

First, @mrsdaniellem2010 I absolutely LOVE love love that quote. I'm stealing it for a lesson next year, I've decided.

Second, @wrightpalomo I really have a hard time agreeing. I get what you're saying about each generation struggling with the new one, and that I will agree with. But as @lstrejcek said, there's really nothing wrong with a boys will be boys mentality, in fact, I would encourage it.

Like it or not, we are wired differently. Boys will be boys, girls will be girls. Obviously, there are exceptions to the generalizations, but there's a reason they are generalized.

I have a very difficult time saying that playing violence simulation and gun related games at school is inappropriate. I mean, cops and robbers? Cowboys and Indians? Hell, even Red Rover and dodgeball have aspects of violence. And it is fun, and exciting, and a helluva lot more beneficial to them than a video game.

ETA: I also think it is important to add that while bullying isn't JUST physical violence, not all physical violence is bullying. Sometimes people get beat up because they piss off another kid and they fight it out. And then that's the end of it.

Ecat504 · June 2014

CarmAlarm said:
I'm confused. When you say "gem" it makes it sound like you don't like it. Is that your opinion?

Oh no I completely agree! I didn't mean to sound sarcastic.

Ecat504 · June 2014

MrsLaLaBug said:
I absolutely agree with the article. When I was pregnant with DD, I went through a period of feeling very unsure and anxious about ACTUALLY raising a child in this insane society we live in today. I realized all I can really do is "train up a child in the way he should go", and hope that it sticks.
I have also recently had a run in with my own mother about the computer/TV/iPad scenario. She wondered why I didn't let DD play on my iPad nonstop("isn't that why y'all bought it?"), was confused that she wouldn't sit in front of the computer with her and watch YouTube videos(she's only just over a year old FFS??), and she acted like I was the weirdest mom on the block when she kept turning on cartoons and asking me which one was her favorite and I said "none of them, bc she doesn't really watch cartoons much at home." I tried to point out that was why I brought books, bubbles, and other toys for her to play with when I was visiting. My mom actually acted like she was annoyed that my kid wouldn't just veg out on the fucking couch like her lazy ass and stare at the tv or the computer for hours. *eyeroll* I haven't been back to visit yet since then bc it bothered me so much.

This is how I feel, which is why I bought it up.

Ecat504 · June 2014

Also on the "boys will be boys" topic, boys will be boys and girls will be girls. Girls have been catty towards each other since the beginning of time just like boys have played cowboys and Indians & cops and robbers. Obviously there are instances where "boys will be boys" have been over used and are not acceptable, like rape and such. But i agree trying to feminize our boys does all of us a huge disservice.

biokitty42 · June 2014

I'm in the minority here, but I don't like a lot of the article. I also disagree with the idea that "boys will be boys," and that sitting still is a female trait.... I don't think anyone knows how big of a role nature and nurture play compared to one another in determining gender traits, but I do know that nurture does play a role. A lot of so-called masculine and feminine traits are considered to be masculine and feminine by society, not because they are inherently male or female.

I also don't like the way the author refers to girls being called a bitch once and then committing suicide. That's a pretty cavalier attitude to have. Talk about lacking compassion. I do think the term bullying gets thrown around too much these days, but to mock young people who have been persistently and systematically bullied and tormented to the point of suicide is pretty disgusting.

I can get behind the family time and minimizing electronics, but I was really put off by the beginning of the article. "Boys just naturally want to shoot things, and teenage girls just naturally call each other bitches." No.

brittneyandadam · June 2014

I don't like the phrase "boys will be boys"...just because some people use it as a lame excuse to let their boys be little asshats while they sit by and watch. I also don't like when ppl think that "feminizing" boys is a bad thing. It gives a negative connotation to being female and there's a lot that little boys can learn from girls...vice versa as well. That being said, I do agree that parents baby their kids way too much and an element of independence is being lost. What I like about the article is that she emphasizes lessons in respect. Learning to respect that others have different opinions, respecting someone else's personal rules, etc. I think that respect is being lost b/c there's an expectation that other people will drop what they're doing to cater to the kid's wants.

trebekastan · June 2014

brittneyandadam said:
I don't like the phrase "boys will be boys"...just because some people use it as a lame excuse to let their boys be little asshats while they sit by and watch. I also don't like when ppl think that "feminizing" boys is a bad thing. It gives a negative connotation to being female and there's a lot that little boys can learn from girls...vice versa as well. That being said, I do agree that parents baby their kids way too much and an element of independence is being lost. What I like about the article is that she emphasizes lessons in respect. Learning to respect that others have different opinions, respecting someone else's personal rules, etc. I think that respect is being lost b/c there's an expectation that other people will drop what they're doing to cater to the kid's wants.

No. It just means that there is a difference between boys and girls. A little girl may be able to sit and color at 3 because she is developmentally able to do so, but typically boys don't have this skill until much later but we expect them to conform to this more desirable standard.

brittneyandadam · June 2014

lstrejcek said:

brittneyandadam said:
I don't like the phrase "boys will be boys"...just because some people use it as a lame excuse to let their boys be little asshats while they sit by and watch. I also don't like when ppl think that "feminizing" boys is a bad thing. It gives a negative connotation to being female and there's a lot that little boys can learn from girls...vice versa as well. That being said, I do agree that parents baby their kids way too much and an element of independence is being lost. What I like about the article is that she emphasizes lessons in respect. Learning to respect that others have different opinions, respecting someone else's personal rules, etc. I think that respect is being lost b/c there's an expectation that other people will drop what they're doing to cater to the kid's wants.
No. It just means that there is a difference between boys and girls. A little girl may be able to sit and color at 3 because she is developmentally able to do so, but typically boys don't have this skill until much later but we expect them to conform to this more desirable standard.

I can't even sit and color. The reason I said that is from working at a summer camp. We had several kids who had problems with listening and respect....and who would often purposely hurt other kids just because they could. A few were boys and we got the "boys will be boys" excuse from their parents. No. I don't care if you're a boy or girl, running up to hit another kid in the face with a stick is not acceptable behavior...especially if that kid was just sitting and minding their own business.

bumpuser10199668 · June 2014

brittneyandadam said:

I don't like the phrase "boys will be boys"...just because some people use it as a lame excuse to let their boys be little asshats while they sit by and watch. I also don't like when ppl think that "feminizing" boys is a bad thing. It gives a negative connotation to being female and there's a lot that little boys can learn from girls...vice versa as well. That being said, I do agree that parents baby their kids way too much and an element of independence is being lost. What I like about the article is that she emphasizes lessons in respect. Learning to respect that others have different opinions, respecting someone else's personal rules, etc. I think that respect is being lost b/c there's an expectation that other people will drop what they're doing to cater to the kid's wants.

So you're acknowledging there's an innate difference between boys and girls....which is what we are saying by 'boys will be boys and girls will be girls' .

I DO think feminizing boys is a bad thing, but that is in no way me saying being feminine is a bad thing. If a boy is naturally interested in more feminine things, that's one thing, but to feminize him is another.

I also feel like society may place a lot of pressure on feminine vs masculine traits, but I don't think any of that came about randomly. It's based on hundreds of years of observation.

The way boys and girls handle conflict is, by nature, very different. Girls brains need to be more analytical and talk things out, while boys brains are able to react and resolve rather quickly. Sometimes this is done through fighting, and that's is fine by me in some instances. That's just biology.

brittneyandadam · June 2014

CarmAlarm said:

brittneyandadam said:

I don't like the phrase "boys will be boys"...just because some people use it as a lame excuse to let their boys be little asshats while they sit by and watch. I also don't like when ppl think that "feminizing" boys is a bad thing. It gives a negative connotation to being female and there's a lot that little boys can learn from girls...vice versa as well. That being said, I do agree that parents baby their kids way too much and an element of independence is being lost. What I like about the article is that she emphasizes lessons in respect. Learning to respect that others have different opinions, respecting someone else's personal rules, etc. I think that respect is being lost b/c there's an expectation that other people will drop what they're doing to cater to the kid's wants.

So you're acknowledging there's an innate difference between boys and girls....which is what we are saying by 'boys will be boys and girls will be girls' .

I DO think feminizing boys is a bad thing, but that is in no way me saying being feminine is a bad thing. If a boy is naturally interested in more feminine things, that's one thing, but to feminize him is another.

I also feel like society may place a lot of pressure on feminine vs masculine traits, but I don't think any of that came about randomly. It's based on hundreds of years of observation.

The way boys and girls handle conflict is, by nature, very different. Girls brains need to be more analytical and talk things out, while boys brains are able to react and resolve rather quickly. Sometimes this is done through fighting, and that's is fine by me in some instances. That's just biology.

Yes, it's biology. But, I think it's good to teach boys to step back, analyze and talk it out rather than to immediately throw a punch or get in someone's face.

bumpuser10199668 · June 2014

brittneyandadam said:

brittneyandadam said:

I don't like the phrase "boys will be boys"...just because some people use it as a lame excuse to let their boys be little asshats while they sit by and watch. I also don't like when ppl think that "feminizing" boys is a bad thing. It gives a negative connotation to being female and there's a lot that little boys can learn from girls...vice versa as well. That being said, I do agree that parents baby their kids way too much and an element of independence is being lost. What I like about the article is that she emphasizes lessons in respect. Learning to respect that others have different opinions, respecting someone else's personal rules, etc. I think that respect is being lost b/c there's an expectation that other people will drop what they're doing to cater to the kid's wants.

So you're acknowledging there's an innate difference between boys and girls....which is what we are saying by 'boys will be boys and girls will be girls' .

I DO think feminizing boys is a bad thing, but that is in no way me saying being feminine is a bad thing. If a boy is naturally interested in more feminine things, that's one thing, but to feminize him is another.

I also feel like society may place a lot of pressure on feminine vs masculine traits, but I don't think any of that came about randomly. It's based on hundreds of years of observation.

The way boys and girls handle conflict is, by nature, very different. Girls brains need to be more analytical and talk things out, while boys brains are able to react and resolve rather quickly. Sometimes this is done through fighting, and that's is fine by me in some instances. That's just biology.
Yes, it's biology. But, I think it's good to teach boys to step back, analyze and talk it out rather than to immediately throw a punch or get in someone's face.

Sure. But that's also difficult because of wiring. I've seen plenty a teenage boy get into fights without even a warning and THEN step back and analyze and talk it out. That's progress.

I intend to teach my son that starting with physical violence is never an option but reacting with violence when confronted with violence absolutely will be.

bumpuser10199668 · June 2014

Also, to clarify, boys will be boys is NOT an excuse for them to act like 'asshats' or harm others for no reason. But I do think it is a good enough excuse for them to make guns with their fingers and go 'pew pew' at recess.

brittneyandadam · June 2014

CarmAlarm said:
Also, to clarify, boys will be boys is NOT an excuse for them to act like 'asshats' or harm others for no reason. But I do think it is a good enough excuse for them to make guns with their fingers and go 'pew pew' at recess.

This I totally agree with

conradraging · June 2014

I plan on letting my girl be interested in whatever she wants, whether that means sitting and coloring or playing cops and robbers. And it would be the damn same if I were having a boy. I absolutely agree that there are innate differences between males and females. To try and force either kinds of traits on a child is wrong. I don't think anyone here is saying "boys will be boys" as an excuse for their child to be an asshat. And I don't think anyone is teaching boys to throw punches without thinking about things..

wrightpalomo · June 2014

Sorry to have stirred the pot then fallen off the radar! We got some bad family news this evening and are now driving 5 hours to our hometown to see my in-laws. I really would love to discuss my issue with the "boys will be boys" point of view but I'm not in a good place to get into that now. Love the discussion so far and next time it comes up I'll be more engaged!

mrsdanielleM2010 · June 2014

@wrightpalomo‌ sorry to hear that there's bad news. I'll be thinking of you guys today, and if you need to talk, we are here. Hugs!

trebekastan · June 2014

@wrightpalomo I'm sorry to hear that you are having some issues right now.

Ecat504 · June 2014

CarmAlarm said:
Also, to clarify, boys will be boys is NOT an excuse for them to act like 'asshats' or harm others for no reason. But I do think it is a good enough excuse for them to make guns with their fingers and go 'pew pew' at recess.

This. Exactly this!!

Ecat504 · June 2014

@wrightpalomo‌ I'm so sorry to hear you got bad news, positive vibes your way!!

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