2.5 yo doesn't STTN

MillerTime0513 · May 2014

I was a regular on TTGP back in the day but haven't been around for a long while. DD will be three in August and has never STTN for more than 4-6 weeks a time. She has always been a terrible sleeper (our pedi called her a "power napper" when she was tiny). We've done CIO three or four times (I've lost count at this point), which will work temporarily but then we're right back where we started. I thought we had a breakthrough about a month ago when she finally told me she was crying because she needed help pulling up her blanket (seriously?!). Once I started tucking her blanket in tight she was sleeping all night...for a month. Now we're back to 1-2 wakeups a night. When I ask her what's wrong when she wakes up or the next morning she doesn't/can't tell me. She says she cries, "Because."

She's still in a crib and some friends have suggested transitioning her to a bed, but our plan was just to take the front rail off her convertible crib and I don't know how much good that's going to do. She goes to bed with a blankie, a lovey, a sippy cup of water, always has white noise (a humidifier) and a nightlight. She isn't PT yet (she has urinary tract problems but those are under control with medication). I got one of those wake up clocks on Amazon because I thought maybe she didn't realize it wasn't time to get up, but that hasn't helped either. She has had all her teeth for almost a year. Her ears are fine.

She goes to bed around 8:30p and is up around 6:30a. She usually takes one nap for around 1.5 hours.

I just can't take this anymore. I haven't gotten "real" sleep in over three years at this point and I'm just freaking exhausted. Does anyone else have any experience with this? I don't even know that I'm looking for solutions at this point, I could just use some commiseration because I feel like I am the only parent of a kid this old who still doesn't sleep.

ashiscute · May 2014

I'm a bit confused. Is she waking up just for a few minutes and then going back to sleep? Or is she awake for awhile each time? Because if she just wakes for a few mins and you have to go in there and re-tuck her in or whatever that doesn't seem like a huge deal to me. Or abnormal at all.

My DD is 3 and sleeps through the night IMO. However, that doesn't mean she doesn't wake up in the middle of the night ever. Sometimes she needs to pee but sometimes she just needs a hug. I just go in and hug her and go back to bed.

If she is waking up and crying for longer periods I would be more concerned about what's bothering and trying to figure it out. I would probably try to switch to a toddler bed and see if that helps. I'm sorry I couldn't be more helpful but you are definitely not alone.

MillerTime0513 · May 2014

When she wakes up she cries and yells for us until we go in there. Sometimes she'll go back to sleep just tucking her back in or patting her back/telling her to go back to sleep, other times she seems to go back to sleep but within 20 mins is yelling for us again. If we don't go in she will scream and cry for 10-20 mins. Which, as I said, I let happen from time to time but it never really seems to solve the problem.

I guess I should also say (if it wasn't clear) that this happens every single night. It isn't an every now and then thing. She will STTN more or less every night with a wake up here or there (which I can totally handle) for about a month, and then she starts waking up every night. It's a "huge deal" to me because I am so tired I can't function at work, and I'm grouchy and impatient with her because I am just exhausted. Once she wakes up I can't just go back to sleep immediately, so I'm basically getting four hours of sleep, then being woken up and being awake for at least half an hour, then getting about three more hours of sleep before I wake up. I'm part of a couple of Bump off boards and also have friends with children her age and out of probably 30-40 kids, there is only one still having sleep issues even remotely like this.

Snapdragon750 · May 2014

I know you're not asking for advice, but I think the bedtime is too late. 8:30 is a really late bedtime at that age, especially if the wakeup time is 6:30, and especially since the nap is only an hour and a half. Both the wakeup time and naptime are pretty typical of a 2.5 y/o, but the bedtime is an hour or two later, so your LO is missing out on a couple hours' sleep that most other toddlers are getting. That could make her a bit overtired, and when you're overtired it's more difficult to fall asleep and stay asleep.

To illustrate, my 2.5 y/o DD is a very good sleeper (12 hours through the night with a 2-3 hour nap), but when we took a vacation and she'd missed her naps for several days AND been kept up late, one night she started waking up crying. I had to come in to her room every half hour four times before I finally told her that I wasn't going to come in anymore because I needed to go to sleep. (miraculously, it worked.) That's the only time she's done that before or since, but it was obviously because she was so overtired that she couldn't sleep.

Also, though I'm a big proponent of CIO for babies, I think toddlers need to be checked in on when they cry at night...they have plenty of legitimate reasons that they could be crying and are developmentally capable of thinking that you're not caring for them if you don't come when they cry. Just go in and see if anything's wrong, and if nothing is wrong then tell her you love her but that she needs to sleep and you need to sleep too, so if she calls you again you're not going to come in. I think if you do that while moving the bedtime to 7:30 or even 7 or 6:30 you'd see a big improvement.

yeah. · May 2014

I'd try an earlier bedtime too. My DD is 3.5, but she's not always a great sleeper. I find that if she's asleep between 7-8, she sleeps better (no wakeups) but if she goes to bed later, she's more likely to wake up in the middle of the night

ashiscute · May 2014

MillerTime0513 said:

When she wakes up she cries and yells for us until we go in there. Sometimes she'll go back to sleep just tucking her back in or patting her back/telling her to go back to sleep, other times she seems to go back to sleep but within 20 mins is yelling for us again. If we don't go in she will scream and cry for 10-20 mins. Which, as I said, I let happen from time to time but it never really seems to solve the problem.

I guess I should also say (if it wasn't clear) that this happens every single night. It isn't an every now and then thing. She will STTN more or less every night with a wake up here or there (which I can totally handle) for about a month, and then she starts waking up every night. It's a "huge deal" to me because I am so tired I can't function at work, and I'm grouchy and impatient with her because I am just exhausted. Once she wakes up I can't just go back to sleep immediately, so I'm basically getting four hours of sleep, then being woken up and being awake for at least half an hour, then getting about three more hours of sleep before I wake up. I'm part of a couple of Bump off boards and also have friends with children her age and out of probably 30-40 kids, there is only one still having sleep issues even remotely like this.

I wouldn't let her cry at this age. Even if it doesn't seem a valid reason to you it is to her. I would try to work with her as much as you can to get her to explain why she is crying. I know you've said she just says "because" but I would try to talk her throughout the day about it.

I understand that it's frustrating to be getting up in the middle of the night. I have a 3 yo and 1 yo. But my DH and I alternate so it's not only one of us checking on the kids. For us sometimes means every night for a week or two and then not at all for another week or two. Usually DD doesn't give a reason other than wanting a hug. We hug her and leave. I'm not trying to make you feel bad when I say it doesn't sound like a huge deal. I just don't think it's abnormal. I think a lot of parents are getting up in the night.

I also disagree about the bedtime. Both of my kids go to bed between 8 and 830 and I don't think their sleep is a problem.

TiffanyBerry · May 2014

My 4yr old doesn't STTN. She's done it at most a dozen times? I get something like what you get - about three hours of sleep before she wakes up and calls me. But then I just go into her room and sleep with her. She usually wakes me up again three hours later, but I can usually get her to go back to sleep for another hour or two after that.

It's totally normal for my kid.

And for many of the kids I know in the under-5 range. They get up and either go into mom/dad's bed or have someone come to them. It's hard for a kid to be alone for 10 hours straight, just mentally.

ncbelle · May 2014

I agree it's totally normal - I still bed share with my 3 year old quite often (and did some with my oldest at this age). I would definitely try an earlier bed time and ditch the crib. I'm not a fan of leaving kids to cry at any age - I think that just increases the uneasiness that is causing her to need you in the first place. I'm also not a fan of going without sleep - thus my kids just sleep with me if they need to.

FWIW, my now 5 year old had MANY wakeful periods. For more than a year now, he has just happily climbed into bed at bed time, never fights it, goes straight to sleep, gets up to pee if he needs to, and goes back to bed - they all get there. And I think it's a lot more pleasant for all if we just provide them the support they need to get there along the way.

downtown80 · May 2014

I think that this age is tough. They are toddlers and are naturally testing limits. Their imaginations are hard at work too! So there could be things that are keeping/waking her up.

DD is a good sleeper, but even she goes through periods where she wakes up. She is cold and cannot cover herself just right, wants a hug, wants socks on, is thirsty, has to use the bathroom, etc. If she starts getting out of control and asking for things non-stop, we say "This is it. We are not coming in here again. It's time to sleep." She responds pretty well to that.

I would just make sure that you establish a consistent bedtime routine. Be consistent in what you say to her when you go in at night. And absolutely have your SO help out!!! On nights that you are "off duty" wear some earplugs!

Ardmhs83 · May 2014

Nicb13 said:

Snapdragon750 said:

I know you're not asking for advice, but I think the bedtime is too late. 8:30 is a really late bedtime at that age, especially if the wakeup time is 6:30, and especially since the nap is only an hour and a half. Both the wakeup time and naptime are pretty typical of a 2.5 y/o, but the bedtime is an hour or two later, so your LO is missing out on a couple hours' sleep that most other toddlers are getting. That could make her a bit overtired, and when you're overtired it's more difficult to fall asleep and stay asleep.

I don't agree. DS sleeps great, is well rested and happy and goes to bed around 8:30 every night, is up at 6:30 and his one nap ranges from 2-3 hours. I think it just depends on the kid.
I'm sorry I don't have anything else useful, just that the bedtime might not be part of the problem but there's no harm in experimenting with it to see if it helps.

I also don't agree. My DS is also 3, goes to bed at 8:30 and gets up at 6:30. When he goes to daycare he naps for 2 hours. When he's home he doesn't nap anymore at all. He sleeps all night, every night (let me not jinx myself now). We did do a modified Dr. Ferber when he was a bit younger and it worked within a few nights and has worked ever since.

I honestly just think it depends on the child. They all have different personalities. Just keep trying momma...hugs! I know it is hard

BookitBoo · May 2014

My 2 1/2 year old goes to bed at 8 and wakes up at 6:30 or 7. He wakes up in the middle of the night (between 1 and 3) and comes to bed with DH and I. He may wake up a few more times (looking for his blankie or because he kicked the covers off and is cold), but he seems to sleep pretty well once he knows that we're there.

Some nights if I'm really exhausted and DH is out of town I just go ahead and crash in his bed so that he won't wake up and have to walk to my room.

I'm sorry I'm not more helpful, but I don't think 8 is too late. Like a pp said, it's what suits the child and the wake-ups seem pretty average (even if frustrating).

Good luck, i hope you get some good sleep soon!

sohappy14 · May 2014

You're not alone! My 3 yo doesn't sleep well and never has. He's up almost every night two times.. Crying or potty. He's always cried and we'd have to go in calm
Him and then he'd go back. It's absolutely exhausting and like you, I don't fall back asleep easily. It's not fun! I feel like I screwed up when he was a baby and should have let him cry it out more.but we tried and never worked long term. My son is in crib too. I'm
Scared hell leave his room in bed. I've considered a sleep coach but my husband says no... It's good to hear that other kids wake at night too. I don't know what to do either.

erinlovesdavid · May 2014

My almost-3-year-old has also never been a good sleeper. He still wakes up crying in the middle of the night most nights at least once, sometimes twice. We had good luck with a sticker chart for a while, and also with setting a firm boundary on what mommy and daddy will/will not do in the middle of the night (i.e. we will not refill water or put blankets back on). Every time we seem to make some progress for a few weeks, something will happen to disrupt it - traveling, illness, etc. And then we are back to square one. It is exhausting.

My newest theory is that he is uncomfortable on the firm mattress in his crib (yes, he is still in a crib). We plan to move him to a full-sized bed soon (his crib converts) and see if that helps the problem. I'm grasping at straws as well. Just know that you're not alone, and he will eventually sleep!

bluejetta · May 2014

My daughter will be 3 in September. It took her a while to STTN and we've had a rough patch of late and although she's very verbal she can't explain her night wakings. I'm often up with her for 1-2hrs in a night and usually end up lying on her floor (she's in a crib) until she falls asleep. I think her imagination and cognitive development are in over drive. I can understand how awful sleep deprivation is and even one night a week is disruptive. If you do consider sleep advice I highly recommend The Baby Sleep Site -- they have helped me tremendously with both nap and night sleep and importantly made me feel normal for having issues. I think most people just don't talk about it.

ttimmerman · May 2014

MillerTime0513 said:

When she wakes up she cries and yells for us until we go in there. Sometimes she'll go back to sleep just tucking her back in or patting her back/telling her to go back to sleep, other times she seems to go back to sleep but within 20 mins is yelling for us again. If we don't go in she will scream and cry for 10-20 mins. Which, as I said, I let happen from time to time but it never really seems to solve the problem.

I guess I should also say (if it wasn't clear) that this happens every single night. It isn't an every now and then thing. She will STTN more or less every night with a wake up here or there (which I can totally handle) for about a month, and then she starts waking up every night. It's a "huge deal" to me because I am so tired I can't function at work, and I'm grouchy and impatient with her because I am just exhausted. Once she wakes up I can't just go back to sleep immediately, so I'm basically getting four hours of sleep, then being woken up and being awake for at least half an hour, then getting about three more hours of sleep before I wake up. I'm part of a couple of Bump off boards and also have friends with children her age and out of probably 30-40 kids, there is only one still having sleep issues even remotely like this.

Wait...so you're getting about 7 hours of sleep at night? Honestly, that's not that bad. At all. I get that it's broken sleep and not straight through, but I think there are PLENTY of parents that get similar or much worse sleep (your off board friends are either stretching the truth or it's a giant coincidence that they all have good sleepers). My 4 yo DD gets up once a night to go to the bathroom (I take her) probably 3-4 times a week. Sometimes I can fall right back to sleep, sometimes it takes me an hour. But if my cumulative sleep for the night is around 7-8 hours, then that's fine.

Anyway, what has worked for DD in the past was a sticker chart. I had to transition her to a big girl bed at 18 months b/c she kept climbing out of her crib and it was a nightmare. She had a hard time at bed time and kept getting up at night. I told her if she stayed in bed all night she would get a gold star and if she got a full row of gold stars then she could get a new toy. She LOVED getting the gold stars, but you can use anything that would appeal to your LO (have a jar where you put a quarter in for each night they stay in bed, once it's full they get a new toy, a chart with smiley faces, whatever). Or even do something more immediate - if LO stays in bed all night and doesn't call for you, she gets a treat or special activity in the morning. I'm not above bribery if it means more sleep.

Ceridwen21 · May 2014

Another vote for trying an earlier bed time. DS is 2.5 and only naps 1-1.5 hours per day, so his bedtime is 7pm and he wakes up between 6 and 7am.

Whatever you decide to do, you need to be consistent with it. CIO from time to time is not fair to your LO. Either do it or don't.

dschneider1583 · May 2014

Another person who doesn't think the bed time is a huge deal. My DS is 3 and goes to bed at 8:30-9:00 and wakes up some nights. He tells me he is having bad dreams or is cold, can be anything. I am pregnant and am too exhausted to try and fight him to go and cry on his own back to sleep and some nights he is really scared and just wants to be with me. My DH and I let him come in our bed and he sleeps the rest of the night fine. All parents have to do what is best for them but just realize you are not the only one getting up at night. It isn't easy but it is some of the things that we go through when we become parents.

I keep telling myself that if this is the worst thing my kid is doing, I have it pretty good.

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