Community› The Bump Message Boards› Toddlers: 12 - 24 Months
Toddlers: 12 - 24 Months
New Discussion

Why is sleep important? I need data.

Beth.1212Beth.1212 member
in Toddlers: 12 - 24 Months
I'm still getting DS's one nap a day routine down, but he's generally taking his nap a 12. Long story short, DH wants to push naptime during the weekend. 

My argument to DH is that (1) sleep is really important, (2) pushing naps too often results in an overtired little one, which means he won't sleep as long when we eventually get him down, which means that he's actually losing out on sleep time, and (3) that loss will have a real impact on DS. 

DH has an analytical mind and will be much more likely to make DS's naps a higher priority if I show him studies or other trustworthy sources of information illustrating why sleep is important. DH will be much more convinced by specific info like the findings of this study, which indicates that children who slept an hour less had their neurobiological function drop to the level of children two years younger.  General statements like "sleep is important for cognition" won't really help. He agrees that sleep affects cognition, but doesn't think pushing naps on the weekend will really have an effect. Does anyone have any articles or websites that you can point me towards? 
Report Reply to Post

Re: Why is sleep important? I need data.

  • Loading the player...
  • dufferoodufferoo member
    Pushing his naps a couple times won't crumble your whole beautiful schedule, so why not go ahead and let your husband try his plan one day a week and see what happens? Nothing will prove your point better than seeing it with his own eyes. And if things actually go okay, then no harm/no foul, right?
    Report Reply
  • dufferoodufferoo member
    Oh yeah, also the Dr. Ferber book (Solve your Child's Sleep Problems) is rich in data. I just wouldn't try to take away too much from his actual methods!
    Report Reply
  • Beth.1212Beth.1212 member
    jnnfrrose6 said:
    ...why does he want to move his naps around anyway? 
    To make it possible / easier to do things outside of the house, ex. go to the aquarium, the zoo, museum, visit family and friends, etc. Some things are possible to plan around his naps but not necessarily convenient to (ex. a day out with great-grandma and grandma, as the former needs extra rest in the morning and has a hard time getting together before 11 am and the latter has a hard time staying awake in the evening). Others are pretty tough to schedule around - if we go to a zoo that's an hour away, it's tough to spend any real time there when the earliest we can usually get out is around 9 am and DS eats lunch around 11 and takes a nap around 12-2 (ish). We can go after his nap, but then you're probably looking at leaving the house around 2:30, getting to the zoo at 3:30, and the zoo closes at 5.  We're not going to the zoo every week, of course, but it seems like there's always something that's tough to work around. Ex. last weekend it was DS's cousin's bday party. It was scheduled to start right at noon! 

    For clarification, I'm really not looking for suggestions about how to do the stuff outside of the house without pushing the nap. I know that's generally possible to do, but it means some sacrifices (ex. less time at the zoo) and/or reprioritization. I need the data to convince DH that the those sacrifices and such are worth it. 
    Report Reply
  • Beth.1212Beth.1212 member
    shannm said:
    In this situation, if he is not willing to look for the data himself, I would schedule a mom's day off and let him do whatever schedule he wants for a day or two. That will convince him. It's crazy to me that a baby yawning after lunch and acting cranky is not enough to convince him the kid needs to sleep.
    We're really lucky to have a baby that is incredibly good natured. He doesn't get cranky unless he is incredibly overtired - it'd take many days of messed-up naps to get him to the "I don't want to deal with this little bear" stage. Well before he hits that stage, though, I can tell that he's tired. Heavy eyes, more clumsy, less engaged, waking up from naps crying because he doesn't want to be awake yet, etc. These things don't seem to bother DH the way that they do me. I sit there thinking, "this isn't good, he's not getting his rest, how is this affecting his growth and development?" I don't think DH believes that the lost sleep does affect growth and development. I need to show him otherwise. 
    jociejones said:
    Pushing his naps a couple times won't crumble your whole beautiful schedule, so why not go ahead and let your husband try his plan one day a week and see what happens...
    His plan is to basically push DS's naps whenever it's convenient to. I've already offered to push them one day a week, but he doesn't want to be restricted to that. 

    Also, I wish that I had a beautiful schedule! We used to have a great routine down, but when DS started to transition to one nap that went out the window. We're struggling to get a good routine in place again. I really wish DS was one of those kids whose sleep was really flexible, and that he'd just take a good nap as long as we put him down somewhere in the middle of the day, but it's not working that way, unfortunately. 
    jociejones said:
    ...Nothing will prove your point better than seeing it with his own eyes. And if things actually go okay, then no harm/no foul, right?
    My response above applies here as well, so I'm just going to say the same thing if that's ok. DH thinks things are okay that I think are problematic. When we disrupt his naps too much, I can tell that he gets overtired. Heavy eyes, more clumsy, less engaged, waking up from naps crying because he doesn't want to be awake yet, etc. These things don't seem to bother DH the way that they do me. I sit there thinking, "this isn't good, he's not getting his rest, how is this affecting his growth and development?" I don't think DH believes that the lost sleep does affect growth and development. I need to show him otherwise. 
    Report Reply
  • Beth.1212Beth.1212 member
    RedheadBaker said:
    I agree with the above posters, but I also have an S.O. who is VERY data-driven (I think it's due to his career). So, I suggest you both read the chapter entirely devoted to sleep in the book "NurtureShock" by Po Bronson and Ashley Merryman. 
    jociejones said:
    Oh yeah, also the Dr. Ferber book (Solve your Child's Sleep Problems) is rich in data. I just wouldn't try to take away too much from his actual methods!
    Thanks so much! It looks like a trip to the library is in the cards for me. :)
    Report Reply
  • desertmouse39desertmouse39 member
    I don't have resources to site for you, but I have been really adamant about keeping to sleep schedules with LO #1, much to the chagrin of our relatives who find it inconvenient.  HOWEVER, there is a lot of data on kids who have a reasonable and consistant bedtime having fewer behavioral issues at school, the importance of consistant, quality sleep for neurological development, etc... and at least with our daughter, if she misses her nap time, it throws her off for the rest of the day.  If she naps at 1:30 or 2 instead of 12, well, then she isn't as ready for bed at bedtime.  When she is over-tired, she doesn't sleep well or long enough, then she is cranky and much less pleasant the rest of the day.  

    Sometimes it is unavoidable that nap will happen later than usual or a bedtime gets pushed back a little bit, and then you/we just have to deal with that.  But I wouldn't change weekend nap times for convenience purposes.  As LO grows, the routine will change on its own.
    Report Reply
  • shannmshannm member
    Beth.1212 said:
    shannm said:
    In this situation, if he is not willing to look for the data himself, I would schedule a mom's day off and let him do whatever schedule he wants for a day or two. That will convince him. It's crazy to me that a baby yawning after lunch and acting cranky is not enough to convince him the kid needs to sleep.
    We're really lucky to have a baby that is incredibly good natured. He doesn't get cranky unless he is incredibly overtired - it'd take many days of messed-up naps to get him to the "I don't want to deal with this little bear" stage. Well before he hits that stage, though, I can tell that he's tired. Heavy eyes, more clumsy, less engaged, waking up from naps crying because he doesn't want to be awake yet, etc. These things don't seem to bother DH the way that they do me. I sit there thinking, "this isn't good, he's not getting his rest, how is this affecting his growth and development?" I don't think DH believes that the lost sleep does affect growth and development. I need to show him otherwise. 
    jociejones said:
    Pushing his naps a couple times won't crumble your whole beautiful schedule, so why not go ahead and let your husband try his plan one day a week and see what happens...
    His plan is to basically push DS's naps whenever it's convenient to. I've already offered to push them one day a week, but he doesn't want to be restricted to that. 

    Also, I wish that I had a beautiful schedule! We used to have a great routine down, but when DS started to transition to one nap that went out the window. We're struggling to get a good routine in place again. I really wish DS was one of those kids whose sleep was really flexible, and that he'd just take a good nap as long as we put him down somewhere in the middle of the day, but it's not working that way, unfortunately. 
    jociejones said:
    ...Nothing will prove your point better than seeing it with his own eyes. And if things actually go okay, then no harm/no foul, right?
    My response above applies here as well, so I'm just going to say the same thing if that's ok. DH thinks things are okay that I think are problematic. When we disrupt his naps too much, I can tell that he gets overtired. Heavy eyes, more clumsy, less engaged, waking up from naps crying because he doesn't want to be awake yet, etc. These things don't seem to bother DH the way that they do me. I sit there thinking, "this isn't good, he's not getting his rest, how is this affecting his growth and development?" I don't think DH believes that the lost sleep does affect growth and development. I need to show him otherwise. 
    Well, based on your more recent updates, I'm kind of seeing your DH's side of things.  The main reason that we stick to a strict nap schedule is because of our kid's behavior otherwise.  Frankly, if it was only once a week to catch up with grandma or to spend an extra hour at the zoo, then it wouldn't bother me.  Our DD goes down any where between 11:30 - 1.  So there is some wiggle room there.
    Report Reply
  • Beth.1212Beth.1212 member
    shannm said:
    Beth.1212 said:
    shannm said:
    In this situation, if he is not willing to look for the data himself, I would schedule a mom's day off and let him do whatever schedule he wants for a day or two. That will convince him. It's crazy to me that a baby yawning after lunch and acting cranky is not enough to convince him the kid needs to sleep.
    We're really lucky to have a baby that is incredibly good natured. He doesn't get cranky unless he is incredibly overtired - it'd take many days of messed-up naps to get him to the "I don't want to deal with this little bear" stage. Well before he hits that stage, though, I can tell that he's tired. Heavy eyes, more clumsy, less engaged, waking up from naps crying because he doesn't want to be awake yet, etc. These things don't seem to bother DH the way that they do me. I sit there thinking, "this isn't good, he's not getting his rest, how is this affecting his growth and development?" I don't think DH believes that the lost sleep does affect growth and development. I need to show him otherwise. 
    jociejones said:
    Pushing his naps a couple times won't crumble your whole beautiful schedule, so why not go ahead and let your husband try his plan one day a week and see what happens...
    His plan is to basically push DS's naps whenever it's convenient to. I've already offered to push them one day a week, but he doesn't want to be restricted to that. 

    Also, I wish that I had a beautiful schedule! We used to have a great routine down, but when DS started to transition to one nap that went out the window. We're struggling to get a good routine in place again. I really wish DS was one of those kids whose sleep was really flexible, and that he'd just take a good nap as long as we put him down somewhere in the middle of the day, but it's not working that way, unfortunately. 
    jociejones said:
    ...Nothing will prove your point better than seeing it with his own eyes. And if things actually go okay, then no harm/no foul, right?
    My response above applies here as well, so I'm just going to say the same thing if that's ok. DH thinks things are okay that I think are problematic. When we disrupt his naps too much, I can tell that he gets overtired. Heavy eyes, more clumsy, less engaged, waking up from naps crying because he doesn't want to be awake yet, etc. These things don't seem to bother DH the way that they do me. I sit there thinking, "this isn't good, he's not getting his rest, how is this affecting his growth and development?" I don't think DH believes that the lost sleep does affect growth and development. I need to show him otherwise. 
    Well, based on your more recent updates, I'm kind of seeing your DH's side of things.  The main reason that we stick to a strict nap schedule is because of our kid's behavior otherwise.  Frankly, if it was only once a week to catch up with grandma or to spend an extra hour at the zoo, then it wouldn't bother me.  Our DD goes down any where between 11:30 - 1.  So there is some wiggle room there.
    Just to clarify - you noted that "if it was only once a week... it wouldn't bother me." I've told DH that I'm willing to push naps one time a week. He doesn't want it to be once a week. He wants it to be whenever it's convenient, which will probably be a couple of times a week. (Plus throw in those times he wants to push bedtime back so we can go out to dinner with great-grandma, who lives an hour away. But I digress, that's another issue.) 

    WRT the 1.5 hour nap window, if that works for your family, then that's great. Some kids are more flexible with sleep than others. We've tried putting DS down 1-2 hours after we probably should have, and the short version is, it doesn't work well for him. He doesn't get great rest when he gets overtired and goes down too late. 

    You and I have different outlooks on sleep, I think. That's 100% fine, of course. We all have slightly different parenting philosophies! Your main reason to stick to a strict nap schedule is because of your kid's behavior otherwise. I completely agree that adequate sleep is important for managing crankiness / behaviour. For me, though, adequate sleep is important because it helps DS to grow and develop optimally. I can tell that DS does not get enough rest when he's forced to be OT and then asked to nap. I don't think that either of us is right or wrong for focusing on different aspects of sleep. The fact that DS doesn't melt down when his nap is pushed, however, does not necessarily mean that it's ok to push the nap - not if pushing the nap means that he's getting overtired and losing out on sleep. 


    Okay, I am definitely digressing from my original question! If anyone else has any additional sites, books, etc. to suggest, I'd love to hear it! Otherwise, I'll focus on those already suggested. 

    Thanks guys!
    Report Reply
  • shannmshannm member
    Um, ok?

    Didn't mean to get you all riled up, lol.
    Report Reply
  • dufferoodufferoo member
    @Beth.1212 Just wanna say, I get super-stressed about sleep issues as well. My parents (who sometimes babysit) actually like to call me "the nap nazi." So I do get where you're coming from. I guess I'm just lucky my husband is willing to go along with my nap rigidity.
    Report Reply
  • emberlee3emberlee3 member
    LalaMama81 said:

    While I agree that screwing w/ nap and bedtime several times a week every week is a bit much, I also think panicking that your son is somehow not going to develop properly b/c he went to bed late is a bit much.

    This. The truth lies somewhere in the middle.
    DS born 8/8/09 and DD born 6/12/12.
    Report Reply
  • Beth.1212Beth.1212 member
    Nicb13 said:
    LalaMama81 said:
    While I agree that screwing w/ nap and bedtime several times a week every week is a bit much, I also think panicking that your son is somehow not going to develop properly b/c he went to bed late is a bit much.
    100 times this. It just sounds ridiculous to me and has never even once crossed my mind.
    I just want to clarify that I'm not panicking. At all. Am I concerned? Yes. Panicked? No. 
    Report Reply
This discussion has been closed.
Choose Another Board
Search Boards
"
"