Parenting

Zoo feeds unwanted giraffe to lions *warning, death mentioned...obvs*

Apparently for inbreeding purposes or something this zoo had to get rid of this young giraffe. Couldn't they have re-homed it or something? Jesus. 

WTF, who brings their toddler to see a giraffe getting shot in the head and then taken apart for an autopsy? Or am I being too sensitive and this is something fun for the young ones? At our local zoo, we can sign up to feed the giraffe's... that's more the family outing that suits me. 

Do NOT click the "pictures" within the news article. 


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Re: Zoo feeds unwanted giraffe to lions *warning, death mentioned...obvs*

  • What was seen cannot be unseen... I want to barf from those pics.


    Could you imagine bringing your kids to see an animal being killed?! There's a group of people standing around watching this. I'm shocked. 
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  • I heard about them killing it and thought zoos normally worked with one another to move animals especially with breeding. Course I bet it has to do with the fact giraffes aren't endangered cause of course they wouldn't kill a tiger cause of inbreeding concerns.
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  • Unbelievable. I can stomach a lot.  That was a very sick and cruel thing to do. The zoo director seems to have relished killing the young animal in front of young children... Sad times we are living in when we have an audience to kill something.


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  • pobrecita said:


    I think it's cool they fed it to the lions.
    I'm ok with the lions being fed. But a pubic execution of a giraffe is just... ugh. They shot it in the head. I mean, I guess it's about as fast as putting it to sleep but still, just seems so inhumane to me.  
  • pobrecita said:
    I wonder why they didn't kill him at birth? Or just wait until he was mature and neuter him?
    The neutering didn't cross my mind, but an excellent idea 

    I was wondering the same thing about letting him live so long. 
  • MonkeybabeMonkeybabe member
    edited February 2014
    Sometimes things have to be killed. I'm a huge animal lover, and this doesn't seem horrible to me. According to the article, it was shot so that the lions could eat it, since putting it to sleep with drugs would make it inedible. Zoos aren't all puppies and rainbows, and the only reason we're hearing about this one animal death is because they didn't do it discreetly.

    ETA: I should have refreshed after reading the article. Most of this has already been said.
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  • pobrecita said:
    chapski said:
    pobrecita said:


    I think it's cool they fed it to the lions.
    I'm ok with the lions being fed. But a pubic execution of a giraffe is just... ugh. They shot it in the head. I mean, I guess it's about as fast as putting it to sleep but still, just seems so inhumane to me.  
    Do you eat meat? Do you know how they kill cows?
    Not trying to start a PITA debate. 
    The pictures I saw of this giraffe shot in what seemed to be a public execution made me sad and a bit sick to my stomach. 
    ...if I watched a cow being slaughtered, I'd probably be sick to my stomach too... 
  • This link doesn't work for me. I'm a sicko and wanna see.
  • From what I've read they don't use bc or sterilization procedures
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  • The article I read made no mention of children watching it get shot, so I missed that part. Everything shows them watching it get butchered, which is still not awesome.
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  • It's not even the euthanasia that necessarily bothers me so much as the public execution. Animals are euthenized all the time for various reasons, just not in front of crowds of people and especially children.
    I see your point, but I'm actually kind of glad they used it as an educational opportunity. Just like we all dissected poor Mrs. Whiskerson the kitty kat in A&P classes.


    I "dissected" a frog via a website, in high school.

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    because it didn't fucking snow enough for me to build my own
  • I would not bring my toddlers to see that. 

    an older child, if they wanted to... whateves. 

    Those pictures made me sick to my stomach and I've seen some pretty gross shit. 
  • Why did I click this thread? There was a warning. Bad, River. Bad!
    Lilypie - (KNqh)
  • I don't like it personally, but don't forget kids see and participate in butchery on farms all the time (rabbits, chickens). It's part of the lifestyle and I don't know what kids were offered this particular viewing, how old they were, or if they were in a future zoologist program or whatever but I would hope it was not just open for gratuitous spectatorship.

    Ps. Did not read the article. I'm eating here.
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  • pobrecita said:
    The article I read made no mention of children watching it get shot, so I missed that part. Everything shows them watching it get butchered, which is still not awesome.
    Voluntarily.
    I'm not against it, but I agree with PP that I don't think it's the best thing for a toddler, and there are very young kids in the pictures. I think learning about this kind of stuff is good, because we're so fucking disconnected now, but I also think some things require some maturity to understand. If their parents are cool with them being there it's none of my business, though.
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  • Can someone point me to an article where it says that anyone watched the shooting, because I'm not seeing that. I see that crowds gathered as they were getting ready to cut it up.
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  • Zoos can't give private collectors animals or they lose accreditation. They don't own their animals, they're supposed to call themselves caretakers, not owners. They can't rehome without the permission of the overseeing body. What animal goes where is a really complicated thing and zoos often don't have control over that. I know there have been cases where the zoo wanted to keep a certain baby but it was sent elsewhere.

    As far as why he was kept alive two years... Perhaps they were looking for a spot for him (and the zoos offering him weren't a legit offer unless they were accredited and approved to take him) where he'd work well genetically. Or do you all really think it'd go well to kill a newborn giraffe because his genetics weren't valuable? I think they were also waiting for approval for the death after a certain point.

    Giraffes apparently don't do well with castration or birth control. I'm not sure why castration is hard on the males.

    I'm not that up in arms about it. I'd like to know a lot more about castration in giraffes and potentially ending pregnancies that are unwanted, like you can in cows or horses.

    The doing it in public... I can't get that upset about that either. Clearly people went to see it and wanted to see it. They'd have had to video it anyway so people couldn't claim later it was inhumane. Captive bolt guns are considered an extremely humane method of death and are used to slaughter cows and horses for food.


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  • i wonder if they normally invite an audience for dissection of the animals they put down or if this was a special event since this is a popular and cute animal.




    however long the night, dawn will break.

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  • DreadLoc said:

    i wonder if they normally invite an audience for dissection of the animals they put down or if this was a special event since this is a popular and cute animal.

    I'm sure they at least video it.


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  • pobrecita said:
    I read it as just the autopsy and feeding were public.
    NYT worded it this way.

    "Officials used a shotgun rather than an injection to kill the giraffe so that his meat would be safe for the zoo’s predator animals to eat. After an autopsy that was open to visitors as an educational opportunity, parts of Marius’s remains were fed to the zoo’s lions — and there is some left over."




    however long the night, dawn will break.

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  • Can someone point me to an article where it says that anyone watched the shooting, because I'm not seeing that. I see that crowds gathered as they were getting ready to cut it up.

    https://www.szsu.com/2014/02/09/copenhagen-zoo-under-fire-for-killing-giraffe-video/

    I guess it is kind of ambiguous in most articles. I got the impression he was shot as part of the demo. "The 18-month-old giraffe, named Marius, was shot with a bolt gun, and cut up in front of curious onlookers on the zoo property"

    I thought much of the twitter outcry was because of the public execution.

    If he wasn't shot publically I have much less of a problem with the demonstration. You want your kids to see that sick shit, be my guest.


    But why is killing an animal humanely in public bad?

    I know that may not be what happened here, but if the onlookers know that the animal is being killed and the animal isn't distressed by the onlookers, I don't think it's bad.


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  • It seems odd that he was born in the first place, if his genes weren't ones they wanted to pass on? Unless the problem is that he was male -- maybe if he'd been a female they would keep it for breeding anyway. But are they still allowing Marius' parents to breed? Will this just happen again? Curious. I'm not particularly up in arms, just baffled that anyone would bring their child to see the animal actually being killed :-/
  • I also wouldn't take a toddler, just because it would probably be scary and in no way educational to a child that isn't even school aged yet. An 8+ year old? Hell yeah.
    I mean, I'm not doing back flips over it but if a group of high school kids were there, I may feel less squeamish. 
  • Can someone point me to an article where it says that anyone watched the shooting, because I'm not seeing that. I see that crowds gathered as they were getting ready to cut it up.
    https://www.szsu.com/2014/02/09/copenhagen-zoo-under-fire-for-killing-giraffe-video/

    I guess it is kind of ambiguous in most articles. I got the impression he was shot as part of the demo. "The 18-month-old giraffe, named Marius, was shot with a bolt gun, and cut up in front of curious onlookers on the zoo property"

    I thought much of the twitter outcry was because of the public execution.

    If he wasn't shot publically I have much less of a problem with the demonstration. You want your kids to see that sick shit, be my guest.
    from your article:

    "After the giraffe was killed, the body was moved to a public location, where a crowd, including small children, watched as zoo officials cut up the body. A graphic video is below."





    however long the night, dawn will break.

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  • pobrecita said:



     As far as why he was kept alive two years... Perhaps they were looking for a spot for him (and the zoos offering him weren't a legit offer unless they were accredited and approved to take him) where he'd work well genetically. Or do you all really think it'd go well to kill a newborn giraffe because his genetics weren't valuable?

    Or they wanted a baby giraffe in the population for the draw.


    Baby animals are a huge draw.

    But if they don't use contraceptives then of course there will be babies. Over population of many species is a problem for zoos. Most zoos don't jump to take lions or other common species. Giraffes are very common.

    I know many zoos do have to do population control for many species that breed well, at least in the US. I don't know why that differs in Europe or if it's just for giraffes.

    As for the mention this wouldn't happen to a tiger... Well, it could. TIGERS aren't uncommon. "Pure" subspecies (Bengal, Siberian, etc) are. If your zoo has a crossbreed they're likely to be sterilized. They don't want more of them.


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  • As usual the media makes statements in the article that can easily be misconstrued leading to outrage. When I heard about this last night I was all "WTF!". Now, I can totally see taking older children interested in science and medicine to an animal autopsy.
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    chapski said:

    Apparently for inbreeding purposes or something this zoo had to get rid of this young giraffe. Couldn't they have re-homed it or something? Jesus. 


    WTF, who brings their toddler to see a giraffe getting shot in the head and then taken apart for an autopsy? Or am I being too sensitive and this is something fun for the young ones? At our local zoo, we can sign up to feed the giraffe's... that's more the family outing that suits me. 

    Do NOT click the "pictures" within the news article. 


    It won't link for me. Booo
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  • Captive bolt guns are used for cows to make yummy steak.

    Would you use the word "execution" to describe using a captive bolt gun on a cow in a slaughterhouse?

    I've just seen execution used a few times and wasn't sure if it was because the death was thought to be public or if it was because a giraffe died, not a cow.

    Execution seems like a dramatic term to me.


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  • The part that gets to me is he was so young. Totally irrational. But if you throw the words baby and execution out there together - I kind of want to cry.
  • If it were a hog or some other less cute animal this wouldn't have made international news
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  • Captive bolt guns are used for cows to make yummy steak.

    Would you use the word "execution" to describe using a captive bolt gun on a cow in a slaughterhouse?

    I've just seen execution used a few times and wasn't sure if it was because the death was thought to be public or if it was because a giraffe died, not a cow.

    Execution seems like a dramatic term to me.

    If done publicly, yes, I would call it an execution. Death of ANYTHING isnt a spectator activity.


    Is this where I confess I've seen/heard of demonstrations of various humane methods of killing? Usually it's been on by a vet school or sometimes a larger clinic. Sometimes just for pre-vet or vet students, sometimes for more general purposes.

    There's a series of excellent videos out on YouTube by a vet clinic out west, demonstrating humane methods of euthanasia and discussing disposal. Their goal was to let owners see what will happen and what their choices were. They were recorded and there were some people there as well. None of the horses were upset at all. They were "good deaths".

    I guess I see where the actual act can be a learning experience or educational moment. As long as the animal is treated with respect and not disturbed it doesn't bother me who sees. No death is a cause for celebration, but they can be "public" without being disrespectful or unkind and they can teach people something.


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  • DreadLoc said:
    pobrecita said:
    I read it as just the autopsy and feeding were public.
    NYT worded it this way.

    "Officials used a shotgun rather than an injection to kill the giraffe so that his meat would be safe for the zoo’s predator animals to eat. After an autopsy that was open to visitors as an educational opportunity, parts of Marius’s remains were fed to the zoo’s lions — and there is some left over."
    The more I think about this quote, the more is annoys me. A shotgun would have done a lot more damage to the giraffe's head and is not what was used. I wonder if they used "shotgun", because most Americans don't know what a captive bolt gun is? Accuracy in journalism is for the birds.
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  • DreadLoc said:
    pobrecita said:
    I read it as just the autopsy and feeding were public.
    NYT worded it this way.

    "Officials used a shotgun rather than an injection to kill the giraffe so that his meat would be safe for the zoo’s predator animals to eat. After an autopsy that was open to visitors as an educational opportunity, parts of Marius’s remains were fed to the zoo’s lions — and there is some left over."
    The more I think about this quote, the more is annoys me. A shotgun would have done a lot more damage to the giraffe's head and is not what was used. I wonder if they used "shotgun", because most Americans don't know what a captive bolt gun is? Accuracy in journalism is for the birds.

    A shotgun would've left it close to headless.

    I agree with your journalism sentiment.

    I was trying to avoid leaving that image in people's brains, lol.
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  • i didn't even notice the shotgun vs captive bolt gun difference.  

    a gun is a gun is a gun, amiright? -NYT




    however long the night, dawn will break.

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  • Gruesome thought, but would people rather have the zoo just let the live giraffe into the lion enclosure?
    SQUIRREL!!!

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  • myatalamyatala member
    edited February 2014






    DreadLoc said:


    pobrecita said:

    I read it as just the autopsy and feeding were public.
    NYT worded it this way.


    "Officials used a shotgun rather than an injection to kill the giraffe so that his meat would be safe for the zoo’s predator animals to eat. After an autopsy that was open to visitors as an educational opportunity, parts of Marius’s remains were fed to the zoo’s lions — and there is some left over."
    The more I think about this quote, the more is annoys me. A shotgun would have done a lot more damage to the giraffe's head and is not what was used. I wonder if they used "shotgun", because most Americans don't know what a captive bolt gun is? Accuracy in journalism is for the birds.

    A shotgun would've left it close to headless.

    I agree with your journalism sentiment.


    I was trying to avoid leaving that image in people's brains, lol.
    ***
    This inaccuracy on the part of the NYT bothers me, too. Killing an animal with a captive bolt gun disturbs me far less than if a shotgun were used, given the popularity of captive bolt guns for commercial slaughter.

    I think personally I'd be more comfortable viewing video showing cattle being slaughtered for meat than a giraffe because it opens a more straightforward discussion about where our food comes from. I'm less comfortable trying to understand the intricacies of the giraffe breeding program because seriously it sounds super complicated.
  • I can somewhat understand the sides to this but I still don't feel right about it. At least it was humane and they didn't waste the meat from it but still. I don't think this is right. 
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