Feeling Unappreciated...Want to Break the Cycle

elymock9 · January 2014

I'm sure this issue is as old as our profession, but I just can't take it anymore. I asked for help to do the dishes last night, after a Chili Cook off party my Husband hosted for his motorcycle group and it happened again...the "I'm lazy and depressed and need to get help" verbal beat down discussion. Not really a discussion, so much as hurtful words being thrown at me. I don't claim to be the poster mom of the SAHM's of the World, but I take care of our son, keep our home in great shape (and decorated impeccably - my former profession), I shop, I teach our son...I don't always have dinner ready, only because my Husband is super picky and doesn't know what he wants to eat until he gets home and I work hard preparing for these parties and get togethers. I'm definitely not as fun or as skinny or as happy-go-lucky as I used to be, but these constant (weekly) reminders of who I am not, do not help my mood at all. They make me feel even more terrible about myself...and they are making me start to dislike my Husband. I need to break this cycle. Please help...any advice is appreciated.

jillyjill1026sr · January 2014

Have you looked into couple's counseling?

vlagrl29 · January 2014

sounds like your H has some issues and needs individual counseling stat.

MomIn2013 · January 2014

To be honest, I really don't want to touch this with a ten foot pole. The phrases "verbal beat down discussion" combined with "hurtful words being thrown" at you makes me feel this is probably not an issue that can be resolved through advice given on this board. I second couple's counseling.

elymock9 · January 2014

I've asked him for over a year..he won't do it. He assures me that if we go, it will be a rude awakening for me. My Husband was never like this until we had a kid. We were a great couple. He's never been easy to argue with b/c he would rather win than let me get my point across. I personally think we need counseling.

elymock9 · January 2014

I've read quite a lot on this topic on other forums. There's obviously a lot more to the story than this one instance; low sex drive, being out of work for the first time in 18 years, money arguments, etc. I just don't understand why whenever I have an issue with anything, that he automatically goes to turning it back onto me? I am definitely not the same person I was before children, but I don't think I deserve this?? He's not a bad person...maybe just sexually frustrated and stressed at work? Not making excuses, just fell worn down.

Socialworkgirl · January 2014

I agree your husband sounds really hurtful and no one deserves to be treated like it sounds like he is treating you. I would tell him you need to talk to him and find a time when LO won't be around (like after bedtime) and really tell him how he is making you feel and that things have to change.

Maybe make a list of points you want to make ahead of time or even write him a letter and either read it to him or let him read it himself if that is a better way for you to get out what you want to say.

If I were in your position, I don't think I could stay with someone who treated me like that so I might tell him that it's either counseling or separation but obviously you have to be really ready for that. I am thinking about you and sorry you are going through this.

shotzie · January 2014

If he won't go to counseling with you, I would recommend you go for individual counseling. Perhaps some outside help/support would be a good thing.

elymock9 · January 2014

It's me not working for the first time in 18 years. He has a great job, just a stressful one. He does help out around the house, but on his own. When I ask for help...hell, when I ask for most anything these days, it turns into an argument. I love being home with my son. It is an especially thankless job in my situation. I think most humans thrive on positivity and being thanked. I rarely, if ever, hear a thank you. I often hear the opposite. His friends (some of them had never been to our house) were taking photos of our home and telling him how talented I was. I stayed home Saturday night and all day Sunday so he could go to another party and off-roading with his brothers. I had cleaned up everything else from the party and didn't feel like doing the dishes by myself as well. Especially since he got to go off and do what he wanted the rest of the weekend. His trade off for what he knows isn't fair to me, is usually a Saturday to get my hair or nails done, or shop alone, massage etc. All I really want is a thank you...for making the house look nice, or for letting him go out and do whatever. I feel like its just expected that I sit at home like it's any other weekday. It's a wonder I have any sense of self left?

elymock9 · January 2014

Definitely not physical abuse. I would be gone in a heartbeat. The words are pretty painful tho...and getting really old.

elymock9 · January 2014

I know Ive let it go too far. I'm always the first to admit that I'm not happy and I'm not doing the best I can. He's very good at minimizing his responsibility in any negative situation. I don't feel unsafe in any way. He is a great dad and we were once happy. It's because of his words that I don't want to be intimate with him. One or two nice gestures or a vacation don't erase how his words have made me feel. I tell him that all the time. You ladies have made me realize that it's more serious than I thought. Thank you for all of your advice and concerns.

vlagrl29 · January 2014

letranger said:

Just because it isn't physical doesn't mean it isn't hurting you. I'm really not trying to be pushy but he is clearly using dominate language and actions. Making you think counseling would hurt you, making you feel like bad guy, having to tip for to his eating preferences.

It can easily turn into physical. Mental abuse/verbal abuse is much harder to distinguish. With physical, you can see the damage, but the mental abuse lasts longer IMO and you tend to make excuses for the mental abuse behavior. Speaking from someone that had lived with it, it's not fun and you really should go to individual counseling for yourself as well.

Disneygeek77 · January 2014

Again, this is not normal. This is a board of SAHM like you and we are all saying the same thing, this isn't normal and our husbands don't behave like this. This goes beyond not being appreciated.

Please read the following link. In what you have mentioned, there are several red flags of your husband having an abusive personality. I have a feeling there are more.

https://psychcentral.com/lib/signs-you-are-verbally-abused-part-i/00015267

elymock9 · January 2014

I've said them many times. When I tried to tell him that I didn't appreciate his comments after simply asking him to help me with dishes, he went even further into "my problems." I've been in and out of depression since we began trying to have a baby in 2008. I went thru surgeries and shots and fertility pills and I gained a lot of weight. My husband's frustration began when my depression began. We finally had a child in 2011, but my lack of free time, continued depression and attempts to hire a sitter so I could work out and get out of the house ended in a money argument, that turned into another "its all my fault cause I'm not who I used to be argument." It just feels like a problem that I can only solve by losing 50 lbs, going back to work and pawning my kid off every weekend so we can do things we used to do. I think he's stuck there and I don't know if he will ever accept this new phase of our life? His frustration gets projected onto me for things not being like they used to. He's always been a horrible person to argue with. Whether it's with me or his brothers or whoever is the unfortunate soul on the receiving end. I once told him that I was going to put "Never lost an argument" on his grave. He was not amused. I'm just worn out and tired of every discussion or argument being turned back onto me. Hence, wanting to break the cycle

Andrewsgal · January 2014

I honestly don't know what you want anyone to say. Your husband is a verbally abusive douche. If he won't go to therapy you need to go alone so you can figure our how to get your life back. I would have left him the first time he cut me down. There is nothing normal about this relationship. You need to get out.

kcisthebombdotcom · January 2014

If he refuses couples counseling i would go to individual counseling because they can help you with your interactions with him. i agree with the others he sounds verbally abusive and hopefully a professional can provide some insight into breaking the cycle soon. good luck.

elymock9 · January 2014

I just wanted affirmation that counseling is definitely what we need. If he won't go, I will. Thank you everyone for your advice and concern. I will point out that I don't have anyone to talk to about this. My mother is gone, I can't talk to my dad b/c I don't want him talking about it with his gossipy wife, I don't want my sisters to form any negative opinions about my husband (b/c the goal is to stay together) and I haven't had any close friends since moving away from my home state (for him) in 2004. On top of all of this, I feel very alone. This is the first time I've reached out on a forum for advice. Thank you all again.

Louiej · January 2014

You can PM me if you want to, Ive been there. The fact that no one IRL knows how he treats you is disturbing to me, I didn't tell anyone about the abuses in my life either. Let me just say, if you wouldn't want your lo to treat their spouse the way your DH treats you, fix it now. Keep an open mind to leaving, sometimes that's the only option.

spring_time · January 2014

These sound like some deep problems. If he won't go to couples counseling, you should consider individual counseling for yourself. It may help with your depression and give you the strength you need to work on the issues in your family. As I am sure you know, these problems will not go away, they will only worsen and/or escalate.

I will say that couples counseling will not work if you are both not on board. We tried it for awhile during a rough patch with DH. He made it into a game and purposely manipulated the meetings to make everything my fault. I think the counselor was terrible for not recognizing it, but the whole experience soured me on counseling as a solution for all marital problems.

Although these ideas will only possibly help the surface problems, have you tried showing gratitude for what he does? It sounds like he is stressed and working hard, and probably not receiving much appreciation at work. My DH needs to be constantly complimented for the smallest contributions, and sometimes I need to grit my teeth and do it as a model. It sets a more pleasant tone in the house, and I find that he acknowledges my contributions more when I do it. At one point, I sarcastically started giving him a gold star for everything he did. He got the point. It sounds like you guys are past the playful reminders, though.

Have you directed his attention to the painful comments? Something along the lines of, "Wow, that is really hurtful. I hear you saying...., is this what you mean?" Sometimes I repeat things back to DH and he can't believe he said them. Nasty things get said in the heat of an argument.

Write things down. I find that I am not good in an argument situation. I am very good, however, with pencil and paper. DH has been the recipient of several letters from me where I was fully able to express my points without getting emotional. They always lead to more productive conversations. I once heard a suggestion of having a wordless discussion by exchanging a notebook back and forth.

Have you given him options on chores? I fought the good fight on doing dishes after I cooked. I felt if I cooked, then he could do the dishes. DH detests doing dishes, they never got done, it led to arguments. He will, however, vacuum all the floors. I guess I don't see it any differently than me refusing to shovel snow. I also need to be very explicit in what needs to be done. Sometimes there is a list and I ask what job he would like to tackle.

I would reduce your workload on the party prep and decorating. I made fancy meals that were never appreciated. However, if I bread and bake a chicken breast, I get rave reviews. Less work for me. I now only do the fancy cooking when I feel like it. Same goes for party preparation. I was killing myself because my expectations were high, he didn't care. I now do it for my own enjoyment and don't expect any sort of gratitude. If it's his buddies coming over for a party, they are perfectly capable of ordering pizza.

Again, these are just some ideas, but I think your problems are much bigger. The abusive language can become dangerous and it is obviously hurting your self esteem. I cannot stress how much I feel counseling for one or both of you is in order.

rockyrollgirl · January 2014

I have nothing nice to say about your husband. That is not normal behavior and his stress is no excuse. He is being an abusive asshole. I know that is not what you want to hear, but I am saying it. I would not stay with someone like that.

thechickencoop · January 2014

I'm sorry you're going through this. I just skimmed some of the other responses, but I definitely agree that counseling is the way to go. Having a baby and becoming a stay at home mom is a really big chang and can definitely take its toll on both of you. My DH is also very hard headed and stubborn when it comes to admitting that he is in the wrong or he has a problem that needs to get fixed. I ended up going to counseling on my own, and he has come with me a few times to talk about some of his problems also. It has definitely helped, it makes him see that not everything is about him.

Have you told him that you don't feel appreciated? I will also add that in addition to being stubborn, my H has complete blinders on when it comes to saying things like thank you, or I really appreciate that you did xyz. He just has no clue. Also if I need help with something, I need to lay it out for him. I don't know if it's just a guy thing or just my H, but once I figured out how to ask him for help, he didn't mind helping lol.

Also, is he telling you what he is irritated about? Or does he just let it go until it blows up? That's another thing that my DH is bad at and that we've been working on. For example, after we had DS he would come home from work and I would immediately leave the two of them alone to go finish dinner, or clean up something or whatever. He was getting so stressed out and angry and we would fight every evening about it. When we actually finally sat down and talked about it, he said that he needs really needs a few minutes to decompress when he comes home before he is on daddy duty. This kind of goes against what a lot of the girls say on this board, but he's not Superman. He works long hours and is very tired, so just making a switch of 'hey why don't you go watch TV for 10-15 minutes and I'll still hang out with DS' has made a really big difference. Then he can be 100 percent after he gets his few minutes to himself.

communication is so so important in any relationship. Good luck to you both.

elymock9 · January 2014

I'm very happy staying at home. I don't think I could ever go back to a conventional job after being home for so long. I haven't made friends here because I just haven't had any outlets. Back home I was still hanging out with my long time middle and high school friends and a few work and sports friends. Things are just different here. Everyone I worked with the first 5 years living here (AZ) were much older than me. I tried playing sports and it just made me miss my friends back home. There are no "beer leagues" here and evey team I joined were way too competitive. I just haven't clicked with anyone. I'm a guy's girl and very raw and tomboyish. Many women just don't get it and move on.

I just want to say again that my husband is a good person. If you knew him outside of this discussion, you wouldn't think it was him we were talking about. I just want him to act towards me the way he does towards others. Many of you are correct, and I see that now...I get blamed for his insecurities and downfalls. I know I've played my part in this, but I don't think I deserve constant blame and ridicule. I'm just trying to find our way back to being happy. If counseling doesn't achieve that for us, then I will weigh my options. I have called several counselors for quotes and will hopefully be talking to my husband tonight about how I feel about his words and what they are doing to us. Thanks again for all of your advice. It's made me open my eyes to a lot today...and will hopefully allow me to get to the bottom of this once and for all.

Andrewsgal · January 2014

Good men don't verbally abuse their wives or refuse couples therapy.

Disneygeek77 · January 2014

Good men don't verbally abuse their wives or refuse couples therapy.

In the same line of thinking, great dads don't verbally abuse the mother of their children. It doesn't work like that.

The Jekyll - Hyde swings is also another sign of someone with an abusive personality. In fact, many abusers are smart enough to know they can't be jerks all of the time and especially when they are around other people. This behavior is quite common for them.

Please please read this of the warning signs of a person with an abusive personality.

I am honestly scared for you because the more you post, the more red flags he displays.

https://www.northwestern.edu/womenscenter/issues-information/relationship-violence/warning-signs-abusive-person.html

notkateanymore · January 2014

I'll go ahead and reiterate...good men don't abuse their wives, any kind of abuse. And the fact that we wouldn't know he's a complete asswipe if we met him is what makes him so dangerous. Please, get some sort of help. Tell your family as well. They should know what you are dealing with, in case anything happens.

zbeesma86 · January 2014

This hurts my heart to read. This isn't the norm & you deserve to be treated better. Like others have said- good men don't abusive their wives- physically OR emotionally.

elymock9 · January 2014

I do want to add that I've seen many of our family and friends go thru very public marriage problems. Calling their spouses names and bitching about them very viciously to anyone who would listen. We vowed a long time ago to never do this to each other out of respect and we both have stuck to that. My husband is a very private person anyway and does not talk about his personal life to many people. Is what I'm going thru the same or worse than being publicly humiliated by your spouse behind your back? I've listened to it all over the years from my in laws and it's not pretty. I'm not trying to downplay my situation at all, but I at least know he's not badmouthing me to his family and coworkers. I have dozens of guy friends who are always calling their wives bitches, telling people they could do better and cheating on them. I know this is just another form of abuse, but it seems pretty common to me anymore. I guess that's maybe why I was just letting this happen? I barely know anyone who's happily married anymore...

notkateanymore · January 2014

No offense, but you need new friends. Also, your husband doesn't seem to respect you, why do you care?

You need to go to individual counseling and work on your self worth, then maybe you will realize just how horrible all of this is. Please stay safe until then.

bumpuser8448316 · January 2014

I hope you are able to get help, OP. N one deserves to be treated like this

elymock9 · January 2014

I understand all of your concerns toward me, but I think some of it might be reaching a bit. My H is not some closet bad guy...he's not a douche or an assbag or whatever names have been said. We are going thru a tough time and this is the way he's dealing with his anger and frustration. It may not be the right way, but it might be the only way he can deal with it. Idk about the rest of you, but my three serious relationships of my life have been with small town boys who grew up in the 70's and 80's under the tough love of their fathers. This didn't happen so much in the larger town where I grew up, but some of us were spanked...hard and often and sometimes with a belt...and sometimes these dad's thought that military tactics of breaking someone down to build them back up was the right way to do it. My H and his brothers, their Dad, Grandpa (and so on) were all Army. His mother dumped them off on their dad when he was 5 and he grew up under an Army dad. So, yes, there may be some counseling needed. I do appreciate the advice, but without actually knowing who we are, these conclusions can't be taken too far.

I did speak with him tonight. Things went ok...then not great...then he apologized and agreed to counseling. He had actually already gotten a number for a counselor from a friend who went thru something similar with his SAHM/wife. I look forward to working this out with a neutral third party, so we can find out the root of our problems. If I thought that my H was some closet sociopath or would physically harm me or my son in any way, I would be gone. I am a tough bitch from the Midwest and I'm not going to let this break me. I just needed to know that I was justified in that this wasn't normal and that counseling needs to happen. It's hard enough to get a man to go to the damn dentist, let alone a counselor. The whole situation sucks...this has been a long, emotional day for me, but I think it's going to be ok. He admitted to some things and so did I...it's a start. Thanks again for all of your advice, thoughts and concerns. The name calling...not so much, but to each their own.

Andrewsgal · January 2014

elymock9 said:

I understand all of your concerns toward me, but I think some of it might be reaching a bit. My H is not some closet bad guy...he's not a douche or an assbag or whatever names have been said. We are going thru a tough time and this is the way he's dealing with his anger and frustration. It may not be the right way, but it might be the only way he can deal with it. Idk about the rest of you, but my three serious relationships of my life have been with small town boys who grew up in the 70's and 80's under the tough love of their fathers. This didn't happen so much in the larger town where I grew up, but some of us were spanked...hard and often and sometimes with a belt...and sometimes these dad's thought that military tactics of breaking someone down to build them back up was the right way to do it. My H and his brothers, their Dad, Grandpa (and so on) were all Army. His mother dumped them off on their dad when he was 5 and he grew up under an Army dad. So, yes, there may be some counseling needed. I do appreciate the advice, but without actually knowing who we are, these conclusions can't be taken too far. I did speak with him tonight. Things went ok...then not great...then he apologized and agreed to counseling. He had actually already gotten a number for a counselor from a friend who went thru something similar with his SAHM/wife. I look forward to working this out with a neutral third party, so we can find out the root of our problems. If I thought that my H was some closet sociopath or would physically harm me or my son in any way, I would be gone. I am a tough bitch from the Midwest and I'm not going to let this break me. I just needed to know that I was justified in that this wasn't normal and that counseling needs to happen. It's hard enough to get a man to go to the damn dentist, let alone a counselor. The whole situation sucks...this has been a long, emotional day for me, but I think it's going to be ok. He admitted to some things and so did I...it's a start. Thanks again for all of your advice, thoughts and concerns. The name calling...not so much, but to each their own.

glad things went well but I will say again. Good men don't treat their wives like this. My husband was physically abused growing up. He is the kindest, nicest man and would never lay a hand on me. So you excusing his behavior on how he was raised is ridiculous. What you described in an abusive ass. It is what it is is. Sorry if calling him names hurts your feelings, but I call it like I see it. Oh and you need new friends this is in no way normal and neither is the way your friends treat their husbands. Good luck I think you are going to need it.

notkateanymore · January 2014

It makes me so sad to see you make so many excuses for him. This is not normal. No matter how you were raised. Good luck going forward though, I agree that you will need it.

jjt616 · January 2014

I'm late to this but from your original post, abuse popped right out at me and every response just made me cringe more and more. I am glad that you are going to couples counseling but I would suggest you go to individual counseling as well. I think it is important for you to do the individual counseling so you can take care of yourself, separate from your husband.

jensriot · January 2014

This is why I love this board. All of these heartfelt, well thought out responses are really great advice. OP, I have seen abusive relationships. My mom was in one for most of my life. Unfortunately, what you described sounds very much like one. Of course, we only know what you post here and must make opinions based on the little bit of info we have. Please seek out counseling now, for your sake and your child's. The abuse will eventually be turned on children (be it physical, emotional, verbal, etc). You do not need to be "broken down" to be built back up in your marriage. Your relationship is not boot camp. It should be a loving, safe place to rely on for all of you. Good luck to you.

kcisthebombdotcom · January 2014

I agree we only see one side of the picture--but i urge you to hit print on your printer right now, black out our responses and let a counselor read your words. i would bet money he/she will share our concerns. Its great he's open to counseling but you need some for yourself. just as a cautionary tale a friend of mine was severely beaten in front of her two young children by her fiance. it started as verbal abuse and she justified it just like you did--stress from his job loss. he was a nice generous guy to friends and went to church every Sunday. its not guys who are assholes who beat their wives and verbal abuse always precedes physical abuse.

elymock9 · January 2014

No judgment...and I'm not making excuses for him. I called it like it was during our talk last night. I think most couples have fights and say things they regret. I'm no angel either...we had some bad fights back when we were going out and drinking every weekend and there was never anything physical that came of those. I am his longest relationship at nearly ten years, so he's never dealt with one person for this long. I completely understand that you all would rather over evaluate the situation, so I know what I could possibly be up against...I get it. And some of you calling him names doesn't hurt my feelings at all...I just don't see where its productive, especially in this conversation about verbal abuse. The conversation we had last night was the first one we've had in a very long time that didn't result in my shortcomings being his copout. A step in the right direction...next step is our first counseling appt. on Friday.

As for "my friends" that I need to replace...they are not women...they are men, husband's, fathers. Idk if any of you have ever lived behind the veil of what men talk about when their wives aren't around, but I have. Again...maybe the reason I underplayed my situation. It's not all men (obviously) that act this way...but it's a lot more than you think. Some of them get divorced, some of them accept married life and make the turn to support their wives and families. But in their first years of marriage, it's how they process living with the opposite sex for the first time in their lives. My women friends do this too, but not to the extent that men do. Men are much more insecure than we are...and full of themselves at the same time. Now that my guy friends are approaching their 40's, they've calmed down a bit, but some of them would still try and get away with as much as they possibly could, so long as their wives don't find out. I personally don't agree with it, but I listen to their problems and try not to judge...just like a friend should. Maybe knowing this info has led to my passing off of my H's behavior? Not many women attend bachelor parties, stand up on the men's side at their weddings and get called at 9am on a saturday to go shoot hoops with the guys...I did. When my high school girlfriends all had bf's for the entire four years of school, that's what I was doing. You'd be surprised how many wives are clueless to this behavior. Again...not making excuses for my situation...I just went into marriage knowing more than I should about certain things.

Regardless, I'm feeling much better today. A big part of my frustration is with myself is my weight. I've always been in shape and thin...and I haven't been for over two years now. I've tried almost everything at this point and it's just not coming off. I've started going to a doctor and a trainer to help me with it, but it's just frustrating. My H has actually been very supportive of my journey and had shelled out a healthy amount of money for diets and pills and even surgery to fix my c-section area. He's not a bad guy...and thru all of this, he's never, ever called me fat. We will work this out...but thank you all for pointing out that it was a bigger issue than I was making it. I will post again after our appt. Better days are ahead.

Andrewsgal · January 2014

Lol because he never called you fat he is super amazing. Um okay. This gets more and more ridiculous.

rockyrollgirl · January 2014

Yes, I hang out with DH's friends when they come over for poker. I have gone out with them to bars where I was the only female. You are not the only guy's girl here. Only one ever complains about his wife, but the others do not really care to join in. Most discussions about wives and girlfriends are them joking around.

Who wants to be around people that constantly bitch and moan about their SO? Those men sound exhausting. The whole reason why I like hanging out with men is the lack of drama.

We have fought, but he has never made me feel worthless.

You only gave us reasons to dislike your husband in the beginning of the thread. Then you get defensive when we agree that he is treating you horribly. So whatever.

It is good you are going to counseling, but I agree you need to go by yourself as well.

irishgrl317 · January 2014

It is not normal for good men to sit around bashing their wives. You can continue to try to justify that behavior by saying you hang out with 'the guys' more than most women, but it's just not true. Good men don't sit around calling their wives and girlfriends bitches. My DH actually came home from lunch with the guys about a year ago telling me how uncomfortable it was that one of the guys was complaining about his 'bitch of a wife'. Nobody joined in with him, everyone was uncomfortable, and he was no longer included in their outings.

Being in the military doesn't have anything to do with it either. DH is the son of a lieutenant colonel in the Air Force and we have many friends and family members in the military. They do not disrespect their wives and children in an attempt to build them up.

If it really is the case that this behavior is the norm for the men in your life, You need to surround yourself with better men to see how a woman should be treated.

Good luck with the counseling. I hope it is a positive experience for you and your DH.

Andrewsgal · January 2014

I also have to say the fact that you married an asshole and hang around with them does not mean every man is one. I have spent plenty if time around men and the ones I hand around very rarely even talk about their wives and when they do it is always nice. It seems for some reason you are attracted to jerks in both your friendships and relationships. Hopefully counseling will help you figure out why.

jensriot · January 2014

I am confused what your relationship with the male friends has to do with your marriage. Regardless of what other men do, you deserve to have a healthy, supportive relationship with your husband. It's unfortunate that your experience of other relationships is full of jerks, but don't you still want more for you?

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