For those planning an unmedicated birth.

curlylocks3 · January 2014

joules235 said:

jshrop said:

Ladies, before we keep talking about how our bodies are made for this, I think we need to take that verbology (yeah I made up a word, so what about it?) out. It's not really fair as FTMs to say this when 1. We haven't done this shit yet sooooo we kinda are talking out our asses and 2. It's kind of insensitive to those who tried but we unable to have an unmedicated, non-interventioned birth. I'm just saying, I don't know if my body will be able to give a natural unmedicated birth so I'm not going to say "my body was made for this."

Your body is made to birth babies. From a biological standpoint the only purpose of the female body is to produce offspring and feed said offspring. Its not insensitive it's just the fact of the matter.

Of course some people have issues that require medical interventions but this does not negate the facts above.

For a FTM to have reasons why they want to have an unmedicated birth isn't talk out if your ass is simply presenting your reasoning based on your research.

------------------------------------------
Spoken like someone who has never known what it's like to have their body not do "what it's supposed to do". It's incredibly insensitive.

But you're right, I totally shouldn't have spent tens of thousands of dollars getting pregnant- my body was made to do this! And screw safety in labor- I should disregard all medically accepted guidelines and opt out of the epidural. And lastly, I should totally forego having functioning kidneys and ditch the medications that keep them as such, simply so I can say I breastfeed.

Honestly, I really don't know how you survive up there on your high horse.

MrsP419 · January 2014

snowpants said:

Thank you @jhsrop! I think (hope) most ladies don't mean anything by their comments but phrases like that can be very hurtful to ladies who, through no fault of their own, didn't have things go as planned. I sincerely hope every single lady here gets the birth they want, but chances are some will end up needing medical intervention land that doesn't mean they've failed!

LadyMacaron said:

1. Our bodies are meant to do this. Since the beginning of time. If every type of woman, in every part of the world can do it, so can I.

And this ^^ is just too much. Not every woman can do it, some bodies couldn't handle it, and thank God for modern medicine which saves so many lives (mom and baby both).

I definitely see your point, and absolutely agree that it is a blessing that we have modern medicine to help us with the many things that can go not as planned with our bodies. Biologically, our bodies are supposed to produce insulin, and my DH's does not. Thank God he can use artificial insulin or he would die. I feel the same way about depression medication. I am glad that not everyone needs these things to regulate their hormones, but my body needs them.

I think that women who hope for a med-free birth use phrases like that because there are a lot of situations where interventions are brought on by not being educated of one's options. The cases where the body absolutely does not birth the way it "should" are more of an exception (and very very valid and important situations; thank God that in those situations, there are interventions. And those moms are just as brave and valid and natural). I also know a lot of people who say they want to go med-free because they think they can't handle the pain (if someone chooses that they would rather not endure labor pain, that is one thing, but wholeheartedly believing that labor pain is near impossible to deal with is in most cases not true), or because they think that they have to follow hospital protocol. There are also cases where I think people are forced into epidurals because their pain is worse than necessary because of an unnecessary induction that required pitocin (again, I know there are times when you HAVE to be induced. That is not what I am talking about. And if I had pitocin in me, I would be begging for an epidural). My hospital for DD told me I had to be continuously monitored and lay on a bed my whole labor. That was simply not true; there was nothing wrong with me or the baby. It was procedure. In that case, they were putting more value on their interventions than on what I believed my body could do.

Anyway, all that to say that I think that we absolutely need to be sensitive and kind in how we word our birth plan wishes, but a desire to birth "naturally" is often stated in such a way (perhaps naively) not to insult or diminish others, but to empower women to believe that it is still possible to give birth in a way that culturally is not as acceptable these days. I am glad that there still ARE so many people who want to give birth med-free, because a lot of my circle thought I was nuts for trying it and were pretty insulting about my wishes to do so.

b48kate · January 2014

I'll just say it: the only reason I considered an epidural free birth is to prove to a certain SIL of mine that I am just as tough and I can totally take the pain. I was going to do this afterward while I was all pumped up on my womanly powers…

Then I realized I am a wuss and want all the pain meds available. Best of luck to all of you unmedicated ladies...I like to hear the stories!

LadyMacaron · January 2014

Our bodies are designed to do it. But, no, it doesn't come naturally to everyone. Women are MEANT to conceive, through biology. My body was not one of the bodies that came upon that biology naturally, I needed help with IVF. I don't think it's insensitive to state that our bodies know what to do. We are animals, it's biology. But, a lot of us will need help to conceive or give birth, because biology isn't without fault. Of course I appreciate the medical progresses, I mean thank god because I wouldn't be pregnant!

But, it is ridiculous to say it's insensitive to state the fact that women have been giving birth unmedicated for centuries, because it's true. Just like it's true that women have died in labor, and we have come a long way. And FYI, women STILL die when giving birth, and the us mortality rate is on the rise due to interventions...So, not everything is black and white. We are all making choices that make sense to us, and there is no need to judge however those decisions are made.

LadyMacaron · January 2014

snowpants said:

Thank you @jhsrop! I think (hope) most ladies don't mean anything by their comments but phrases like that can be very hurtful to ladies who, through no fault of their own, didn't have things go as planned. I sincerely hope every single lady here gets the birth they want, but chances are some will end up needing medical intervention land that doesn't mean they've failed!

LadyMacaron said:

1. Our bodies are meant to do this. Since the beginning of time. If every type of woman, in every part of the world can do it, so can I.

And this ^^ is just too much. Not every woman can do it, some bodies couldn't handle it, and thank God for modern medicine which saves so many lives (mom and baby both).

In addition to my previous post, let me add, that I didn't say ALL WOMEN CAN DO THIS. I said, women have been doing for centuries, so why shouldn't I try? Not that I should have to defend MY REASONS on why I am making my own choice regarding my labor. And yes, I am fully aware that "plans" change all the time, and at the end of the day we all just want a healthy baby.

jshrop · January 2014

snowpants said:

Thank you @jhsrop! I think (hope) most ladies don't mean anything by their comments but phrases like that can be very hurtful to ladies who, through no fault of their own, didn't have things go as planned. I sincerely hope every single lady here gets the birth they want, but chances are some will end up needing medical intervention land that doesn't mean they've failed!

LadyMacaron said:

1. Our bodies are meant to do this. Since the beginning of time. If every type of woman, in every part of the world can do it, so can I.

And this ^^ is just too much. Not every woman can do it, some bodies couldn't handle it, and thank God for modern medicine which saves so many lives (mom and baby both).

This is what I'm talking about. My post was simply to be sensitive to those who needed interventions. Some of "bodies are meant to do it" comments are extremely hurtful to some of my friends on here. I was noticing a trend that it was mostly FTMs making the comment. I wanted them to realize that WE have no idea what our bodies are capable of because we haven't been there yet (myself included). I hope to not need medical interventions but I also know that if I do I will utilize them, not because I'm weak but because my life, or my child's, may depend on them.

Joules, yes I understand biology and reproduction as survival of a species. I still find your comments of biological errors as insensitive to our friends around us on this board. I'm sorry, but I stand behind my comment to use just a little more tack when talking about this (and I am one who generally side-eyes people who are "offended")

jshrop · January 2014

Merie412 said:

MegK82 said:

Does the fact that my body conceives, grows, and births babies like a champ make me a superior female specimen?? If so, I want a special snowflake award. 8-|

I hope you can stand being in the company of biological errors like myself and @curlylocks3.

FWIW, @ladymacaron, I know it's what our bodies are "made" to do. And @joules235, I understand the biological aspect of it. But to state that it is our sole purpose is outdated and archaic and quite frankly, pretty ridiculous.
Infertility is no longer an anomaly or an irregularity. With 7.4 million women in the United States alone last year partaking in infertility treatments, I'd say that irregular is no longer an accurate descriptor of the situation.

LadyMacaron · January 2014

Merie412 said:

MegK82 said:

Does the fact that my body conceives, grows, and births babies like a champ make me a superior female specimen?? If so, I want a special snowflake award. 8-|

I hope you can stand being in the company of biological errors like myself and @curlylocks3. FWIW, @ladymacaron, I know it's what our bodies are "made" to do. And @joules235, I understand the biological aspect of it. But to state that it is our sole purpose is outdated and archaic and quite frankly, pretty ridiculous. Infertility is no longer an anomaly or an irregularity. With 7.4 million women in the United States alone last year partaking in infertility treatments, I'd say that irregular is no longer an accurate descriptor of the situation.

I am infertile. I was given a 1% chance to conceive. Endometriosis, while somewhat common, is not "normal" and there is still no biological reason or causation for it. It is an irregularity, that many of us have to deal with. Is cancer not an irregularity, just because it happens in nature? It's something that shouldn't happen, but does. I certainly don't think us infertiles are freaks of nature. You are reading WAY more into this than necessary.

To no one in particular...Honestly, if an unmedicated birth isn't something you are interested in, and you are just going to judge our reasons for choosing this path, why do you click on the thread? What's the point? I don't go into the pro epidural threads and tear people's reasoning down.

curlylocks3 · January 2014

LadyMacaron said:

Merie412 said:

MegK82 said:

Does the fact that my body conceives, grows, and births babies like a champ make me a superior female specimen?? If so, I want a special snowflake award. 8-|

I hope you can stand being in the company of biological errors like myself and @curlylocks3. FWIW, @ladymacaron, I know it's what our bodies are "made" to do. And @joules235, I understand the biological aspect of it. But to state that it is our sole purpose is outdated and archaic and quite frankly, pretty ridiculous. Infertility is no longer an anomaly or an irregularity. With 7.4 million women in the United States alone last year partaking in infertility treatments, I'd say that irregular is no longer an accurate descriptor of the situation.

I am infertile. I was given a 1% chance to conceive. Endometriosis, while somewhat common, is not "normal" and there is still no biological reason or causation for it. It is an irregularity, that many of us have to deal with. Is cancer not an irregularity, just because it happens in nature? It's something that shouldn't happen, but does. I certainly don't think us infertiles are freaks of nature. You are reading WAY more into this than necessary.

To no one in particular...Honestly, if an unmedicated birth isn't something you are interested in, and you are just going to judge our reasons for choosing this path, why do you click on the thread? What's the point? I don't go into the pro epidural threads and tear people's reasoning down.

Originally I came in because, as someone who CANNOT have an unmedicated birth, I was asking that the wording of the title be changed from "Natural" to "Unmedicated". And I saw that title without opening the thread.
Besides, while I might be a biological error, I am a naturally occurring one and my babies will be carrying on the biological errors that make me me. I only came back because I heard what was being said from other women who were hurt by it.

jshrop · January 2014

@ladymacaron no one is tearing down or judging reason to go unmedicated. It was simply a request to be more sensitive in your wording. It comes off as "superior" and hurtful. I, too, plan for an unassisted birth, but I'm also realistic enough to know it could be out of my hands. It's not about having an non-interventions birth!! I seriously hope your plan goes off with zero problems... From the most sincerest part of me I do. Just please, please try to understand what I was saying. It might be hurtful to you if someone used language that female bodies everywhere, across all time were designed to conceive unassisted. Maybe it doesn't affect you the same, or maybe it pisses you off. Either way, I'd be sensitive to that statement as well.

Sprinkles86 · January 2014

Im hoping my doula will help with a natural birth i just want to be in control of my body i feel all the drugs take that away i want to feel what im doing...

Lets see how it goes

flerlgirl · January 2014

joules235 said:

I didn't mean it be insensitive. There are biological errors all the time. Regardless of the errors the main purpose of any species is to reproduce. That is how I understand the statement "our bodies are made for this" well of course they are that is the main purpose of any being, male or female. Of course there will be anomalies which is when modern medicine can step in and solve or correct any irregularities.

I truly don't mean this to be insensitive, its just a purely biological view point.

@joules235 - "biological error"??? Are you serious? I believe you that you didn't mean for this to be insensitive. That doesn't change the fact that you have really hurt me with this comment and I am actually in tears over it. I should stop because you're certainly not worth the tears but, please, consider your words. I tried so hard to BF DS. I pumped and pumped and did every trick in the book. My milk never came in. My body never allowed him to get the nutrition he needed when he was inside me. Thanks to all of my biological errors, my son almost died. I wish you the best for your pregnancy but I'm done with you now.

curlylocks3 · January 2014

((@Flerlgirl))

flerlgirl · January 2014

LadyMacaron said:

Merie412 said:

MegK82 said:

Does the fact that my body conceives, grows, and births babies like a champ make me a superior female specimen?? If so, I want a special snowflake award. 8-|

I hope you can stand being in the company of biological errors like myself and @curlylocks3. FWIW, @ladymacaron, I know it's what our bodies are "made" to do. And @joules235, I understand the biological aspect of it. But to state that it is our sole purpose is outdated and archaic and quite frankly, pretty ridiculous. Infertility is no longer an anomaly or an irregularity. With 7.4 million women in the United States alone last year partaking in infertility treatments, I'd say that irregular is no longer an accurate descriptor of the situation.

I am infertile. I was given a 1% chance to conceive. Endometriosis, while somewhat common, is not "normal" and there is still no biological reason or causation for it. It is an irregularity, that many of us have to deal with. Is cancer not an irregularity, just because it happens in nature? It's something that shouldn't happen, but does. I certainly don't think us infertiles are freaks of nature. You are reading WAY more into this than necessary.

To no one in particular...Honestly, if an unmedicated birth isn't something you are interested in, and you are just going to judge our reasons for choosing this path, why do you click on the thread? What's the point? I don't go into the pro epidural threads and tear people's reasoning down.

I like to lurk allthethreads. Although to your point, I sincerely wish I hadn't opened this one.

LadyMacaron · January 2014

jshrop said:

@ladymacaron no one is tearing down or judging reason to go unmedicated. It was simply a request to be more sensitive in your wording. It comes off as "superior" and hurtful. I, too, plan for an unassisted birth, but I'm also realistic enough to know it could be out of my hands. It's not about having an non-interventions birth!! I seriously hope your plan goes off with zero problems... From the most sincerest part of me I do. Just please, please try to understand what I was saying. It might be hurtful to you if someone used language that female bodies everywhere, across all time were designed to conceive unassisted. Maybe it doesn't affect you the same, or maybe it pisses you off. Either way, I'd be sensitive to that statement as well.

Ok...I don't know how else to phrase what I have said a million times. Did you not see the other times I have said that I understand that our plans may not turn out? I have repeatedly used words like TRY, ATTEMPT, etc. I am well aware of things not going to plan...As you can read above, and my 3 year struggle to have this baby. We were asked to state OUR reasons for trying an unmedicated birth, and those were mine. I stand by what I said, and I don't have to apologize for believing that our bodies are supposed to know what do. Will mine? Who the hell knows. But, I'm going to try it. This isn't said to offend you, but to explain what I believe. I haven't insulted anyone.

But to answer you, no, it doesn't affect me to read that my body was not doing what was expected of it, I am well aware of that. It makes me angry at the circumstance, infertility sucks, but it doesn't make me blind to the millions of people that got pregnant easily.

chickpea912 · January 2014

@flerlgirl Huge hugs to you. I open most of threads just to see the conversation. How else am I supposed to learn or possibly change my mind on something. I am sincerely sorry I opened this thread. I have never been more inclined to say fuck it and leave the bump forever. I simply have no words. None.

ET(way)A: I hate typing on my iPad - too many stupid errors.

jshrop · January 2014

chickpea912 said:
@flerlgirl Huge hugs to you. I open most of huge threads just to see the conversation. How melse am I supposed to learn or possibly change my mind on something.

I am sincerely sorry I opened this thread. I have never been more inclined to say fuck it and leave the bump forever. I simply have no words. None.

I seriously hope you don't @chickpea912

jshrop · January 2014

LadyMacaron said:

jshrop said:

@ladymacaron no one is tearing down or judging reason to go unmedicated. It was simply a request to be more sensitive in your wording. It comes off as "superior" and hurtful. I, too, plan for an unassisted birth, but I'm also realistic enough to know it could be out of my hands. It's not about having an non-interventions birth!! I seriously hope your plan goes off with zero problems... From the most sincerest part of me I do. Just please, please try to understand what I was saying. It might be hurtful to you if someone used language that female bodies everywhere, across all time were designed to conceive unassisted. Maybe it doesn't affect you the same, or maybe it pisses you off. Either way, I'd be sensitive to that statement as well.

Ok...I don't know how else to phrase what I have said a million times. Did you not see the other times I have said that I understand that our plans may not turn out? I have repeatedly used words like TRY, ATTEMPT, etc. I am well aware of things not going to plan...As you can read above, and my 3 year struggle to have this baby. We were asked to state OUR reasons for trying an unmedicated birth, and those were mine. I stand by what I said, and I don't have to apologize for believing that our bodies are supposed to know what do. Will mine? Who the hell knows. But, I'm going to try it. This isn't said to offend you, but to explain what I believe. I haven't insulted anyone.

But to answer you, no, it doesn't affect me to read that my body was not doing what was expected of it, I am well aware of that. It makes me angry at the circumstance, infertility sucks, but it doesn't make me blind to the millions of people that got pregnant easily.

First, if you go back through your comments, try and attempt have not be words that you've used. At all.

Second, you HAVE insulted people, accept it.

Third, just because you are "unaffected" by comments (which I highly doubt, but maybe you truly are one of those ladies with balls of such steel nothing ruffles their feathers-- your use of caps lock suggests otherwise) doesn't mean that others feel the same. I was simply trying to bring awareness to ASSHAT COMMENTS THAT OFFEND OTHER PEOPLE WHO DONT DESERVE TO FEEL "LESS THAN".

I am so finished with this conversation. I, for one, am not a lady with balls of steel. My feathers are seriously ruffled and this doesn't even pertain to me. Seriously, my blood pressure is making me feel like my eyes are about to pop from my skull. Toodles from this thread ladies, I'll see ya'll somewhere else on the board.

flerlgirl · January 2014

@joules235 thank you

LadyMacaron · January 2014

jshrop said:

jshrop said:

@ladymacaron no one is tearing down or judging reason to go unmedicated. It was simply a request to be more sensitive in your wording. It comes off as "superior" and hurtful. I, too, plan for an unassisted birth, but I'm also realistic enough to know it could be out of my hands. It's not about having an non-interventions birth!! I seriously hope your plan goes off with zero problems... From the most sincerest part of me I do. Just please, please try to understand what I was saying. It might be hurtful to you if someone used language that female bodies everywhere, across all time were designed to conceive unassisted. Maybe it doesn't affect you the same, or maybe it pisses you off. Either way, I'd be sensitive to that statement as well.

Ok...I don't know how else to phrase what I have said a million times. Did you not see the other times I have said that I understand that our plans may not turn out? I have repeatedly used words like TRY, ATTEMPT, etc. I am well aware of things not going to plan...As you can read above, and my 3 year struggle to have this baby. We were asked to state OUR reasons for trying an unmedicated birth, and those were mine. I stand by what I said, and I don't have to apologize for believing that our bodies are supposed to know what do. Will mine? Who the hell knows. But, I'm going to try it. This isn't said to offend you, but to explain what I believe. I haven't insulted anyone.

But to answer you, no, it doesn't affect me to read that my body was not doing what was expected of it, I am well aware of that. It makes me angry at the circumstance, infertility sucks, but it doesn't make me blind to the millions of people that got pregnant easily.
First, if you go back through your comments, try and attempt have not be words that you've used. At all.
Second, you HAVE insulted people, accept it.
Third, just because you are "unaffected" by comments (which I highly doubt, but maybe you truly are one of those ladies with balls of such steel nothing ruffles their feathers-- your use of caps lock suggests otherwise) doesn't mean that others feel the same. I was simply trying to bring awareness to ASSHAT COMMENTS THAT OFFEND OTHER PEOPLE WHO DONT DESERVE TO FEEL "LESS THAN".
I am so finished with this conversation. I, for one, am not a lady with balls of steel. My feathers are seriously ruffled and this doesn't even pertain to me. Seriously, my blood pressure is making me feel like my eyes are about to pop from my skull. Toodles from this thread ladies, I'll see ya'll somewhere else on the board.

You are right, I used the word "attempt" in a different thread, but not this one. Sorry about that. I did use the word try, at least twice. And the only reason I have used caps lock, is because my dang italic button isn't working, not because I am angry. Honestly, I very rarely get angry during internet discussions. I so not ever engage in board drama, so I am sorry that you feel that I think I am better than anyone. I certainly don't. I have never been someone that feels any type of mother is better than any other, and you are welcome to look at my posting history if you'd like. I am a feminist that supports everyone making the choices best for them, and that we all have our own journeys. I guess that didn't come across...Anyways, I am done here as well. No need to keep re-hashing the same statements over and over.

iris427 · January 2014

Another biological error checking in LOL. I'm sure no one in here meant to be hurtful. But as a mother who planned an unmedicated birth with my first and ended up with an induction and a cesarean, statements like that and the whole "we were made to do this!!!1!" can come across as hurtful, insensitive or just ignorant. In the natural birth world, you hear a lot of stuff about how insensitive OBs can be, which is true, but there can be just as much insensitivity in the other direction too. I appreciate the apologies in here though. We all say the wrong thing sometimes, and we can just hope to learn from it and do better next time.

k2k2tog · January 2014

Hmm. This conversation has given me pause. I was one of those who responded with such a comment, with barely a thought to how it may be insensitive to some on the board, and even to my own future self. I suppose, as a FTM, not really sure what I've gotten myself into, the idea that my body has been designed to handle labour and delivery is a comforting thing that helps me alleviate the fear of it.

That said, I'd like to thank all you who came and shared your feelings about it here. I'll be the first to admit that I am naive in my lack of experience, and I appreciate your willingness to share your own knowledge and experience with a FTM. I am sorry for the way the things I, and others have said may have made you feel.

ElTrain5 · January 2014

@jshrop. I am a first time mother. I have never given birth,in any way. You do not speak for all first time mothers. I'm a reasonable person, and I do as much research as possible to empower myself to make the best choices for me and my child. Starting with the providers and support people I choose to surround myself with and continuing on with every choice I will need to make until my baby is safely in my arms. It is NOT "silly" or "naive" to be educated, to thoroughly research and consider the many choices and possibilities that come with birth. It is not silly or naive to have a plan and a set of preferences. It is also not silly or naive to use positive, reaffirming phrases to give myself confidence and to rid myself of fear. In fact, that is the basics of what many med-free birthing classes teach, to believe that you are able to accomplish the task of birth, to rid yourself of fear, in order to increase your chances of doing so. I use phrases like "my body knows what to do" to help accomplish those goals. My use of that phrase it for my mind, body and soul. It is not for anyone else, it is for me. Next time you suggest that all first time mothers don't know what we are doing, keep in mind that not all of us live with that mindset of "I have no idea what I'm doing or what to expect so I'm not making any plans and whatever happens happens". I make plans with the understanding that life is unpredictable. I make plans for a variety of different circumstances knowing that none of them may come to fruition. I will not feel like a failure in any circumstance because of things that are out of my control. My sense of accomplishment and self worth are not tied to my desire for a vaginal birth, not should anyone else's be. I'll put my faith in my body's ability to do this crazy thing and should it need help, I'll put my faith in the providers I've chosen. It won't make me a failure and it won't mean I was naive to plan and attempt to do it without that assistance.

ElTrain5 · January 2014

Oh, and for perspective, I also have endometriosis and a hormonal disorder. I needed surgery and medication to help conceive and I do not feel like a failure at all. And I don't think calling my condition an anomaly or an error of biology is offensive in the slightest. It's completely accurate. It doesn't make me any less of a human being or any less of a woman and I won't be any less of a mother than people who did not have that particular anomaly. And joules, I don't think your comments suggested that at all.

chickpea912 · January 2014

@joules235 Thank you for the apology, but just as I tell M when she's done something and tries to just apologize it away, sometimes saying "sorry" doesn't just make it all go away. I hope you can leave this thread with the understanding that however sure you are in your views, they aren't universal truths.

I will own the fact that I have had an emotional roller coaster of a week, and depression has been kicking my ass. So while I do stand by my statement that there has never (maybe rarely, to avoid making an absolute statement) been a thread that has made me want to quit the bump, I don't think I actually will. I have found such a wonderful community among some of the posters here. There are some that I have never really jived with, and this thread had certainly been enlightening.

I think the biggest problem with this thread - and others like it - is the matter of word choice and how it affects others. I appreciate the change of the title of the thread from "natural" to "unmedicated" - this is a great example of how the simple matter of the word "natural" can be hurtful to others, however well intended its use may be. I would offer up the idea that our bodies are DESIGNED for child birth, rather than MADE for it. I struggle with the biological side of pregnancy and childbirth - the animalist vs the cerebral - and the fact that I am apparently biologically challenged is difficult to come to terms with.

I am sure that no one meant to be insulting or dismissive in this thread, but it doesn't change the fact that they were. And that is probably just fine. We don't have to agree on everything or see eye to eye on each topic - if we did, this board would be even more boring than it has been for the last few days (save a few crazy drive bys here and there). I would just hope that people can be a little more understanding that their world view is not held by all and however convinced you are of the absolute brilliance and truth of your statements, there is no absolute truth. And once someone brings your attention to the fact that your statements might be hurtful, maybe take a step back and try to see the space for a different view rather than continue to restate your same flawed statements.

ElTrain5 · January 2014

@Merie415 Not you Merle! Specifically speaking to jshrop with regards to the "first time mom" comments. (Btw it's weird to type "merie" in your tag. Feels unnatural

)

flerlgirl · January 2014

And, even though I swore to run away, Simba, and never return to this thread - FWIW, I know that any comments made in here were not intentionally hurtful. And, like chick said, I can be overly sensitive to this topic. But just because one person didn't view it as offensive doesn't mean someone else wasn't offended. I have enough guilt and blame for my previous birth experience; I don't need to know that other people feel the same. I feel it enough for a million people. So while I know that no one meant any harm, harm was still done, at least to me.

That being said, I really, sincerely appreciate the apologies and the willingness to agree to disagree. If you're going med-free, best of luck to you and I hope you get the experience you want.

ElTrain5 · January 2014

@chickpea912 I totally agree with the use of "designed". Sometimes it's hard to work up the confidence to think we could ever do something this daunting, and the use of positive words and phrases can be enormously helpful and lessening the fear. It doesn't help that in some medical settings we tend to be told we can't, even before anything goes wrong (Having interventions pushed the minute you walk in the door or even before labor for example).

jshrop · January 2014

@eltrain5 I apologize if my words have offended you. I certainly do not speak for all FTMs, nor do I ever allude that I do. When I say "talking out our asses" I used it as a figure of speech to mean we haven't experienced it yet. Certainly everyone on this board is likely more educated and prepared than I am for this entire birthing process. I've admitted my cluelessness to this entire sh-bang! My entire sole purpose was to bring awareness to the hurt that other women were feeling from language that was being used. That is it. Boom.

As for the research that you've done, I'd love if you could message me your resources! I AM CLUELESS!!! I know what I'd like to think I want but little clue how to get there. Frankly I didn't intend to get pregnant, have no clue what to expect other than what my friends have told me, and am overwhelmed by the whole process (oh, and my husband is little help because he doesn't care to be proactive in it. Child birth is apparently my deal cause I'm the one who has to go through it so I've got to figure it out). Anywho....

chickpea912 · January 2014

@flerlgirl reminded me - my birth plan this time is likely already made for me, based upon my past birth, my current high risk status, and the myriad of unknowns that lay between me and my EDD (which I won't see). Like I said in one of my first responses to this thread, I try to practice what I preach and learn from others, knowing that it might change the way I view something. I'm conflicted about birth and the options that I may or may not have, so I was intrigued with the thought process of those who have choice. I hope that everyone is able to have the positive birth experience they hope for - I know for some women, it can be an absolutely amazing, empowering experience. I envy you all for that potential.

ElTrain5 · January 2014

@jshrop no worries, and I appreciate your honesty about everything. And I definitely don't look down on anyone who chooses not to go into all the research I have, my sister for example was pretty much my polar opposite when it came to all this stuff and I completely respect her choice. Unfortunate my anxiety will not allow me to not read all the things about anything that scares me. It's just how I deal. I'll definitely pm you some stuff. I highly recommend "evidence based birth"'s website as a starting point.

ElTrain5 · January 2014

Now let's all look at this baby goat in a tote bag. I seriously lerv you guys.

chickpea912 · January 2014

ElTrain5 said:

@chickpea912 I totally agree with the use of "designed". Sometimes it's hard to work up the confidence to think we could ever do something this daunting, and the use of positive words and phrases can be enormously helpful and lessening the fear. It doesn't help that in some medical settings we tend to be told we can't, even before anything goes wrong (Having interventions pushed the minute you walk in the door or even before labor for example).

I totally agree on the power of words and positive thinking - I completely don't discount that many of the phrases in this thread can be immensely helpful during childbirth. Like I said, I had many issues with my first birth experience, and in looking back, I can say that if I wasn't confined to a bed, perhaps I could have helped M descend by changing position (since being on my back is obviously not the ideal position for having an open pelvic area) - I KNOW that it wasn't due to some faulty design of my body.

I'm not one to flat out discount an unmedicated birth - like I said, I know it can be an amazingly rewarding experience. I just had issues with word choice and some of the ideas a PP spouted off.

jshrop · January 2014

Lol, @eltrain5 it's not that I don't want to do research, I have no clue where to start. When I get overwhelmed I shut down. Immediately. (Like yoo-hoo earth to Jen.... Anyone home????) Anyway. There's sooooooooo much out there and it's too much for my brain to process. My girlfriends are all 1000 miles away and their advice has been "enjoy eating all the things." So, this is pretty much where I'm at.

JNYLP · January 2014

curlylocks3 said:
Perhaps calling it unmedicated birth would be better? Honestly, birth is a natural process. And receiving pain medications does not make it less so, needing a c-section does not make it less so.

This! I ended up getting an epidural with DD and then needed a c section based on the way my body's built- so I'll be having one this time too. You can't prepare for everything!

Also, my DH was an active participant the whole time- never was he just sitting in a chair "waiting" feeling "unneeded"! He was in awe right by my side the entire time and so involved emotionally with the birth of DD! Just want to put all your minds at ease that your husband is needed whether or not you do meds!

ADalesa29 · January 2014

Sorry to anyone offended/hurt by my previous posts. I just meant that anatomically our bodies are designed to procreate but fully realize that sometimes medical intervention is necessary in the conception/birth due to various reasons. That being said I agree with one of the ladies above that telling myself my body was made for this is a positive affirmation I've come across in many of the books I've been reading on the subject and that this isn't the route for everyone.

Want a personalized experience?

For those planning an unmedicated birth.

Re: For those planning an unmedicated birth.

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