NBR/GTKY: School Dress Code Policies Are Stupid.

tealowl · September 2013

I am pissed off about DD's school dress code policy. They are not allowed to wear tank tops, even though it's 90,000 degrees out, because sometimes the girl's bra straps show. (OH THE HORROR LET ME CLUTCH MY PEARLS).

I couldn't understand why DD said she couldn't wear her plain old wide strap tanks so I had to call today to verify (I knew cami's were off limits, so I thought she was confused). The secretary told me all of this and I asked her, "But...the boys can wear tank tops, am I right?" And she kinda laughed and then whispered to me, 'Well...we KNOW which girls are purposely doing it to show off."

So..now we are slut shaming junior high girls? Girls have breasts, and need to wear bras. What is so sexual about a friggin' bra strap? Should they not wear bras at all and have their nipples showing?

She gave me the number to the asst principal. Obviously me calling is going to do nothing to change this policy, but I'm still upset. The policy is strongly geared towards girl clothing and not boy clothing. I don't know if I should e-mail/call him or not.

I'm just really disappointed that DD is now being shown that anything she wears can be deemed 'wrong' and 'sexual'...like an Old Navy tank top and a training bra strap showing.

So let's make this a GTKY: Ever violated your school dress code policy?

I had to wear a hoodie one day in 7th grade because I was wearing overalls and a baby doll tee and you could see the sides of my slutty whore stomach inside my overalls.

mmb248 · September 2013

Yes. Back in 1993, shirts with sheer panels were all the rage, and I had a shirt that was sheer (but still dark and patterned) from the middle of my ribcage and down and you could almost see my belly button. My bf at the time had a t-shirt in his locker, so rather than miss my algebra test, I wore a boy's dirty, funky smelling, gym shirt. Just think about how foul that smelled - a 13 year old boy's gym shirt.

At my school, boys weren't allowed to wear sleeveless shirts because their underarms were considered obscene. Girls could wear sleeveless, but it couldn't be a shirt with straps because you might be able to see bra strap.

By the time my sister got to high school, you had to wear a collared shirt with sleeves and either navy or khaki pants/skirts/shorts.

Savvy122 · September 2013

Wait... boys are permitted to wear tanks, but not girls? That's ridiculous!

We have a "no tank top" dress code policy at the school where I teach, but it's for both sexes. FWIW, I agree that it's a stupid policy, especially when it's 90 degrees outside and the school has no A/C.

And to answer your question... I never got in trouble for violating the dress code. I was a goody goody and way too paranoid about getting in trouble!

EmilyA724 · September 2013

That is a ridiculous policy. When I was in middle school we couldn't wear spaghetti-strap tanks because of the bra strap thing but we could wear thick strapped ones. What I hated most about it was the teachers didn't enforce the rule for girls without boobs but they did for ones with. I think for your daughter's school it should be no tank-tops period for boys or girls if that's how they want to do it.

I'm actually a supporter of school uniforms. I think it just makes everything easier on the students and teachers because teachers also don't want to waste their class time fighting with students about dress-code.

I actually had a problem recently with dress code. Since some of the departments at my organization works with refugees and we have a lot of refugee walk-ins in the building, we are not allowed to wear anything that shows our shoulders. This summer I had a very nice dress on that showed my shoulders so I also had a short-sleeve cardigan on over it. However, when getting into my car that morning I accidentally brushed up against my neighbor's rose bush and didn't realize until I got to work that I had gross tiny green bugs all over my back. I was so disgusted by it I took as many off as I could then put my sweater in a bag. Unfortunately that left me with exposed shoulders. I felt so ashamed of my shoulders that I didn't leave the office all day. I couldn't even get up to use the bathroom. I understand we're trying to be respectful of other cultures but I was still wearing a nice dress. Feeling ashamed of exposed skin feels like something we should be fighting against not perpetuating. I hated that day.

KingLED · September 2013

I got in trouble for cleavage like, every fucking day. I'm sorry I have tits, but I don't like t-shirts. Anything that's not a t-shirt is going to show cleavage. I try to not show it off, but I have boobs. Get over it.

On another note, our shorts policy was that you couldn't wear shorts that were more than 6" from your knees (our school handbook was 6" and used to measure). I never wear shorts, but I did in protest because I had a friend that was 6'1" in high school. I'm only 4'11" and six inches from my knees and 6" from her knees was drastically different. I could easily wear booty shorts and be okay. She could wear mom shorts and still not be covered. It was stupid. We got the policy changed, though! It was changed to shorts had to be at least half the length from your hip to your knee.

ETA: I also got in trouble for wearing tank tops (none were allowed regardless of gender, but during sports we were allowed to run around in sports bras. Thank you, logic.) and jackets/camisoles and then taking off the jacket when I got hot flashes even though EVERYONE knew if I didn't cool off I could easily pass out. That was really only for like one year when we got a new principal, though. I went to a tiny school.

KingLED · September 2013

Oh, and it wasn't me, it was one of my friends, but our class changed a lot of our dress code policies.

My friend, Jacob, decided that girls had too many dress restrictions and there weren't enough general or male geared policies. So he decided to dress up in a full cow suit one day. He tried out a couple others, but he wore the cow one a lot. This lasted maybe 3-4 weeks before a policy was put in place. That was in '03 and my sister (a junior) commented on it a few days ago because it seemed a random thing to have in the handbook and I got to tell her the awesome stories.

mmb248 · September 2013

NariaDreaming said:

::snip::

I got an out of school suspension for that smart mouth.

My only suspension was because I was being a smart mouth. My mom apologized to the school profusely. My dad found out what happened and showed up at the school demanding to know why his 15 year old had more sense than the teacher, principal and guidance counselor.

The same thing happened to my sister and my dad showed up at the school. This time, to "punish" her, he bought her tickets to the Aerosmith concert the night of the suspension and wrote her an excuse to be out the next day. I've always wondered if anyone read the note he wrote because it said, "Please excuse my daughter from school today. She isn't feeling well due to a late night partying with rockstars and I doubt there's anything you can teach her that will be as memorable as recuperating from an Aerosmith concert."

To say he had a problem with authority is an understatement. FTR - my sister and I were both honor roll goody goodies.

KLL22 · September 2013

I took my sister school shopping this year. While reading her schools list of demands, there was an actual LIST of dress code violations. No flip flops, no jeans with holes, tank tops... etc. We had to put back half the crap we were going to buy. I think the no flip flops thing is especially taking it to far.

I have huge knockers so whatever I wore my boobs would pretty much show somehow. I remember one time a teacher actually said to just "please wear a sweatshirt everyday" to me. She was apparently tired of having to see my size F boobs all the time and reporting me. I got so sick of it that I would purposely wear things to piss her off. Ahh... High school.

KingLED · September 2013

GhostMonkey said:

MauiBliss said:

EllyD14 said:

I got in trouble for cleavage like, every fucking day. I'm sorry I have tits, but I don't like t-shirts. Anything that's not a t-shirt is going to show cleavage. I try to not show it off, but I have boobs. Get over it.

On another note, our shorts policy was that you couldn't wear shorts that were more than 6" from your knees (our school handbook was 6" and used to measure). I never wear shorts, but I did in protest because I had a friend that was 6'1" in high school. I'm only 4'11" and six inches from my knees and 6" from her knees was drastically different. I could easily wear booty shorts and be okay. She could wear mom shorts and still not be covered. It was stupid. We got the policy changed, though! It was changed to shorts had to be at least half the length from your hip to your knee.

ETA: I also got in trouble for wearing tank tops (none were allowed regardless of gender, but during sports we were allowed to run around in sports bras. Thank you, logic.) and jackets/camisoles and then taking off the jacket when I got hot flashes even though EVERYONE knew if I didn't cool off I could easily pass out. That was really only for like one year when we got a new principal, though. I went to a tiny school.

Oh yes, this. I never did understand that.

After school athletics =/= classroom.

It wasn't just after school stuff, though. Gym class, anything during school like homecoming week games, during lunch our weight room was open and all of those places sports bras for girls and shirtless for guys was completely acceptable. All sports-type activities the rules just went out the window. Oh, but the shorts still had to be a certain length.

AllyTales · September 2013

That is so stupid. I wouldn't argue a rule, but I would argue that it's sexist. It needs to be across the board- period. Both males and females.

Our school district doesn't allow "spaghetti straps" of any kind. But they can wear tanks, if the straps are thicker. I think the rule is dumb, period, but oh well.

And I'm not sure I ever violated one. We didn't have all the clothing rules back then, which wasn't even THAT long ago. We could wear spaghetti straps. I think the only rule was no vulgarity on clothing, and no hats. I wore neither.

mmb248 · September 2013

KLL22 said:

I took my sister school shopping this year. While reading her schools list of demands, there was an actual LIST of dress code violations. No flip flops, no jeans with holes, tank tops... etc. We had to put back half the crap we were going to buy. I think the no flip flops thing is especially taking it to far.

I have huge knockers so whatever I wore my boobs would pretty much show somehow. I remember one time a teacher actually said to just "please wear a sweatshirt everyday" to me. She was apparently tired of having to see my size F boobs all the time and reporting me. I got so sick of it that I would purposely wear things to piss her off. Ahh... High school.

We were never allowed to wear flip flops at school. It was a safety issue. Kids running and in a crowd, the flip-flop gets stepped on and people trip, etc. etc. etc.

Your teacher sounds like a peach. WTF were you supposed to wear?

Oh, another reason for no flip flops was that you could smack people with them. We also weren't allowed to have spiral bound notebooks because kids would unwind the metal, rub it against the sole of their sneakers to make it hot and then burn people with it.

ErikaLynn75 · September 2013

At every school I've been a part of (mostly Illinois public schools), boys were not allowed to wear tank tops either. Now I work at an all-girls Catholic school and our girls have to wear collared shirts. Even if they wear a sweater over it, it has to be a polo underneath. But we have AC also, so the heat isn't an issue.

As a teacher, I think school dress codes are absolutely necessary. Most of our problems had to do with low-cut tops though. Two girls can be wearing the same top and it can look fine on one and completely trashy on another, and you can't say "Well she can wear that but you can't because your tits are bigger than hers." So you just have to make blanket rules and enforce them for everyone. A cap sleeve isn't going to be the difference in overheating when it's hot outside. At my last job, I taught in a 90 degree classroom all day long and couldn't even wear shorts. So I had no sympathy for the girls that complained.

divinemsbee · September 2013

I can't imagine going through back to school shopping without a uniform. I went tonCatholic schools, so I always had one and 'free dress' days were absolutely nerve wracking. I never got busted for uniform infraction, my sis was always having to kneel to show that her skirt was in regs, she just has really long legs. I really like uniforms, takes a lot of guesswork out and is cheaper. I think my brother and I both used a lof of the same uniform polos. Gah, I just remember what it was like to try to find three pairs of khaki pants and a couple of white button ups to wear in high school, not to mention shoes. I can't imagine going through that with no limitations on what to wear.

EmeJay · September 2013

The big thing when I was in elementary school was to "color" our hair with the smelly crayons, the one that smells like fruit? I got in trouble for that.

In High School, the big thang was to wear overalls but without the straps. I got in trouble for that too.

And I once had to wear the stupid HS sweatshirt because I had a Smiley face t-shirt that was deemed "violent"

ally510 · September 2013

tealowl said:

I am pissed off about DD's school dress code policy. They are not allowed to wear tank tops, even though it's 90,000 degrees out, because sometimes the girl's bra straps show. (OH THE HORROR LET ME CLUTCH MY PEARLS).

I couldn't understand why DD said she couldn't wear her plain old wide strap tanks so I had to call today to verify (I knew cami's were off limits, so I thought she was confused). The secretary told me all of this and I asked her, "But...the boys can wear tank tops, am I right?" And she kinda laughed and then whispered to me, 'Well...we KNOW which girls are purposely doing it to show off."

So..now we are slut shaming junior high girls? Girls have breasts, and need to wear bras. What is so sexual about a friggin' bra strap? Should they not wear bras at all and have their nipples showing?

She gave me the number to the asst principal. Obviously me calling is going to do nothing to change this policy, but I'm still upset. The policy is strongly geared towards girl clothing and not boy clothing. I don't know if I should e-mail/call him or not.

I'm just really disappointed that DD is now being shown that anything she wears can be deemed 'wrong' and 'sexual'...like an Old Navy tank top and a training bra strap showing.

So let's make this a GTKY: Ever violated your school dress code policy?

I had to wear a hoodie one day in 7th grade because I was wearing overalls and a baby doll tee and you could see the sides of my slutty whore stomach inside my overalls.

I'm a middle school teacher (8th grade) and our dress code says that the straps of tank tops must be 3 fingers wide and shorts/skirts must be longer than your fingertips when your hands are by your sides. The dress code does not say it only applies to girls, so I suppose boys should follow these guidelines as well. For us it is less about bra straps than it is about tops being revealing. Girls often wear thicker strap tank tops were racer back bras, so you can completely see the straps and are not called out dress code violations. The thing is that when girls who are well endowed wear spaghetti straps, they often show a lot of cleavage. That's why spaghetti strap are deemed inappropriate. Unfortunately, schools cannot say the dress code applies only to girls with larger bra sizes. This is not to say that there are not several other styles that can show tons of cleavage, but that's for another discussion. Right or wrong, the rationale is that wearing revealing clothes can be a distraction in class. From a middle school teacher's perspective, a girl wearing revealing clothes can certainly be distracting to the boys, depending on her body type. If your daughter was busty, would the same outfit be appropriate for school?

To answer the GTKY question - I don't think I ever violated a school dress code. I'm not even sure I knew there was one.

oneblessedmess · September 2013

slappalicious said:
I agree with dress code policies so long as they're being enforced equally across the board. I couldn't tell from your post, but are they not enforcing it with boys? If the boys of One Direction are of any example, tank tops are popular with them too. They should be enforcing it for everyone. All of our dress code policies did not distinguish between what sex could or could not wear what clothing.

Doesn't her school have A/C? Why can't your daughter just wear a light camisole if she *has* to wear a tank? What about finding her shirts with cap sleeves? Is having to wear some sort of sleeve *that* much of difference?

I grew up in a hot and humid (tropical) environment, I never felt the need to dress inappropriately to school. I mean, school is a formal institution. Don't you want to teach your daughter how to present herself properly in a professional setting? Plus, if you wore something inappropriate to school when I was going, you'd be put into Internal Suspension for the day. And yes, I did have a friend that thought school was a night club. She wore clubbing outfits every day and lived in IS. I PPH'd that girl, but I never understood it.

Hell, we even have a dress code at work. Tanks are not allowed here. And I'm not talking from the standpoint that tanks look sexual in ANY of this, I just don't think they look professional on men or women.

On another note; I also think GradNight went down hill (and was eventually cancelled) for many reasons, one of them is from the fact that they quit enforcing the dress code. I noticed that when I chaperoned, the kids would be just a little more well-behaved when they had to dress more nicely. But that's just an observation of mine. I could be totally off-base.

I'm pretty much in agreement with all of this. I grew up in Miami and wore tanks outside the house all the time, but I never even thought about wearing tank tops at school. In fact half the time I brought a sweater with me because they BLASTED the AC in there.

I do think it's complete BS that boys get to wear tank tops, at my school everyone had to wear a shirt with sleeves. The only exception was cheerleaders in uniform, and they had to make sure their bra straps weren't showing.

oneblessedmess · September 2013

KLL22 said:

I took my sister school shopping this year. While reading her schools list of demands, there was an actual LIST of dress code violations. No flip flops, no jeans with holes, tank tops... etc. We had to put back half the crap we were going to buy. I think the no flip flops thing is especially taking it to far.

No flip flops are more of a safety issue than anything. I worked with elementary school students and it was ridiculous the amount of times flip flops got stepped on and kids tripped and fell. Or flip flops would break and the kid would have to go barefoot the rest of the day.

tealowl · September 2013

slappalicious said:

I agree with dress code policies so long as they're being enforced equally across the board. I couldn't tell from your post, but are they not enforcing it with boys? If the boys of One Direction are of any example, tank tops are popular with them too. They should be enforcing it for everyone. All of our dress code policies did not distinguish between what sex could or could not wear what clothing.

Doesn't her school have A/C? Why can't your daughter just wear a light camisole if she *has* to wear a tank? What about finding her shirts with cap sleeves? Is having to wear some sort of sleeve *that* much of difference?

I grew up in a hot and humid (tropical) environment, I never felt the need to dress inappropriately to school. I mean, school is a formal institution. Don't you want to teach your daughter how to present herself properly in a professional setting? Plus, if you wore something inappropriate to school when I was going, you'd be put into Internal Suspension for the day. And yes, I did have a friend that thought school was a night club. She wore clubbing outfits every day and lived in IS. I PPH'd that girl, but I never understood it.

Hell, we even have a dress code at work. Tanks are not allowed here. And I'm not talking from the standpoint that tanks look sexual in ANY of this, I just don't think they look professional on men or women.

On another note; I also think GradNight went down hill (and was eventually cancelled) for many reasons, one of them is from the fact that they quit enforcing the dress code. I noticed that when I chaperoned, the kids would be just a little more well-behaved when they had to dress more nicely. But that's just an observation of mine. I could be totally off-base.

I need to read the guidebook, but when I asked about the boys, the secretary mumbled, "Well, we don't uh..have too many boys wearing tank tops." So? If girls can't wear them, they can't either.

They do have A/C in the school now, so she's not going to melt, but if the policy is specifically because bra straps can show, that's not cool with me.

They also have a shitty (lol pun) bathroom policy, you only get two bathroom breaks the whole semester. You can get your grade dropped if you request more than that. What if you have to poop? Change a tampon? They expect all the kids to pee in 3 minutes between classes.

How could you get to your locker, then the bathroom, pee, change a tampon if you need too, wash your hands and then get to your next class on 3rd floor in 180 seconds?

I told DD if she needs to go and she gets in trouble for having to use her bowels during class I will back her up for it. RESIST TEH AUTHORITY.

MeggoWaffles · September 2013

When I was in high school, I was on the varsity rifle team (like, target shooting, not spinning rifles) freshman year. We were the state champs, and all got varsity jackets that had rifles on the back. That summer, a group starting showing up to all our school board meetings with signs that said "books not bullets" screaming about how we were teaching our kids to kill people.

Got back to school in the fall to find out our team had been disbanded, and wearing my varsity jacket now violated dress code bc it "encouraged violence".

oneblessedmess · September 2013

Two bathroom breaks per SEMESTER? What in the heck?? I remember having a teacher who really disliked us using the bathroom during class, and when we would complain that we didn't have enough time to use the restroom between classes without being late, she would tell us that's what lunch period is for. -_- Luckily there wasn't ever am actual rule about how many times we could get a bathroom pass so she couldn't actually stop us.

themrsJRD · September 2013

slappalicious said:

AMazeOfGrace said:

I'm pretty much in agreement with all of this. I grew up in Miami and wore tanks outside the house all the time, but I never even thought about wearing tank tops at school. In fact half the time I brought a sweater with me because they BLASTED the AC in there. I do think it's complete BS that boys get to wear tank tops, at my school everyone had to wear a shirt with sleeves. The only exception was cheerleaders in uniform, and they had to make sure their bra straps weren't showing.

It must be a South Florida schools thing. DH has a drawer full of jackets for kids to use in his classroom because it gets so freaking cold. Heck, when I went to summer school, I brought a winter jacket (well, what I think is a winter jacket. I don't know if the rest of the world would consider it as one) with me every day because the room was so effing cold.

And ditto on the flip flops. We had to wear shoes that had a strap in the back. It was for safety reasons and they always made that clear.

Are you in South FL? We just moved down here and my husband says the same thing! He wears long sleeves to work because it gets so cold.

I'm not in South Florida but I'm on the Gulf Coast and it's also common here for the AC's to be very cold. I think it's more to keep the humidity down inside the buildings than anything!!! (Humidity is annoying lol and so are mosquitos)

Jasperk23 · September 2013

MauiBliss said:

That seems silly, Teal. Either NO ONE gets to wear tanks, or everyone can. It's not fair that only boys can. And a tank is different than a camisole, in my opinion.

For me, I was at private school with uniforms for most of school. I actually preferred it. I never had to spend time figuring out what to wear. Plus, I was a nerd so before uniforms, my clothes got made fun of a lot because I had ZERO fashion sense. Then, I got switched to public for senior year and it was all kinds of confusing to me. I wound up wearing uniform stuff anyway simply because it was so much easier after early practices to just throw on the old standard.

As a fellow Teenage Unfashionable, I also quite liked our school uniforms. So much easier in the morning.

I went to an all-girls Catholic school, but most of the teachers were surprisingly lax. I used to wear bandannas a lot (not all folded up, wrapped around like a biker because I was obviously very cool) and they didn't say anything too often.

In twelfth grade, I had dreads. This was against the rules, but no one ever said anything about it.

rlyttle · September 2013

As a middle school teacher I completely agree with the no tank top rule. I'm sure your daughter is fine & innocent, but you have NO IDEA what these kids wear. It's really sad how some of them dress. Plus girls don't look 12 anymore, they look 18. It's a huge distraction for other students at times. Middle school boys can't handle any distractions. It's not right that boys are allowed to wear them though. NOBODY is allowed to wear them at my school including staff.

tealowl · September 2013

DarcyHermione said:

tealowl said:

slappalicious said:

I agree with dress code policies so long as they're being enforced equally across the board. I couldn't tell from your post, but are they not enforcing it with boys? If the boys of One Direction are of any example, tank tops are popular with them too. They should be enforcing it for everyone. All of our dress code policies did not distinguish between what sex could or could not wear what clothing.

Doesn't her school have A/C? Why can't your daughter just wear a light camisole if she *has* to wear a tank? What about finding her shirts with cap sleeves? Is having to wear some sort of sleeve *that* much of difference?

I grew up in a hot and humid (tropical) environment, I never felt the need to dress inappropriately to school. I mean, school is a formal institution. Don't you want to teach your daughter how to present herself properly in a professional setting? Plus, if you wore something inappropriate to school when I was going, you'd be put into Internal Suspension for the day. And yes, I did have a friend that thought school was a night club. She wore clubbing outfits every day and lived in IS. I PPH'd that girl, but I never understood it.

Hell, we even have a dress code at work. Tanks are not allowed here. And I'm not talking from the standpoint that tanks look sexual in ANY of this, I just don't think they look professional on men or women.

On another note; I also think GradNight went down hill (and was eventually cancelled) for many reasons, one of them is from the fact that they quit enforcing the dress code. I noticed that when I chaperoned, the kids would be just a little more well-behaved when they had to dress more nicely. But that's just an observation of mine. I could be totally off-base.

I need to read the guidebook, but when I asked about the boys, the secretary mumbled, "Well, we don't uh..have too many boys wearing tank tops." So? If girls can't wear them, they can't either.

They do have A/C in the school now, so she's not going to melt, but if the policy is specifically because bra straps can show, that's not cool with me.

They also have a shitty (lol pun) bathroom policy, you only get two bathroom breaks the whole semester. You can get your grade dropped if you request more than that. What if you have to poop? Change a tampon? They expect all the kids to pee in 3 minutes between classes.

How could you get to your locker, then the bathroom, pee, change a tampon if you need too, wash your hands and then get to your next class on 3rd floor in 180 seconds?

I told DD if she needs to go and she gets in trouble for having to use her bowels during class I will back her up for it. RESIST TEH AUTHORITY.
Holy Crap! (Pun intended) Two bathroom breaks? Really? Your daughter's school makes me angry.

I thought I read it wrong, and had to verify w/another parent. I think they have two semesters, so basically they get 4 breaks for the whole school year. I couldn't believe it.

Yes, I get that you don't want all the kids going to the bathroom all the time and disrupting class, but c'mon now.

This is the same school district I was in, and the rules weren't this strict when I was in school.

And I see the cross county kids all the time running near my neighborhood, and they have the boys and the girls practicing at the same time, and tons of girls are in shorts and just sports bras, and that's okay now. WTF?!

tealowl · September 2013

cjchio said:

rlyttle said:

As a middle school teacher I completely agree with the no tank top rule. I'm sure your daughter is fine & innocent, but you have NO IDEA what these kids wear. It's really sad how some of them dress. Plus girls don't look 12 anymore, they look 18. It's a huge distraction for other students at times. Middle school boys can't handle any distractions. It's not right that boys are allowed to wear them though. NOBODY is allowed to wear them at my school including staff.
I'm sorry, but these boys have self control, they aren't wild animals with no way to check themselves. I hate when people make boys and men look like animals because they can't "control" themselves from the evil women.

This is where rape culture stems from.

My DD is 12 and she looks...12.

Parents needs to teach their sons some fucking self control, instead of shaming young girls about their bodies.

This is exactly where rape culture comes from...girls get raped because they shouldn't have been drunk, they shouldn't have worn a short skirt, they shouldn't have some of their breasts showing out of a tank top...

Quit blaming girls bodies for boys acting inappropriate.

bumpuser9343355 · September 2013

cjchio said:

rlyttle said:

As a middle school teacher I completely agree with the no tank top rule. I'm sure your daughter is fine & innocent, but you have NO IDEA what these kids wear. It's really sad how some of them dress. Plus girls don't look 12 anymore, they look 18. It's a huge distraction for other students at times. Middle school boys can't handle any distractions. It's not right that boys are allowed to wear them though. NOBODY is allowed to wear them at my school including staff.

I'm sorry, but these boys have self control, they aren't wild animals with no way to check themselves. I hate when people make boys and men look like animals because they can't "control" themselves from the evil women.

This is where rape culture stems from.

I think middle school boys can't control a lot of things going on in their bodies, not saying they will act on anything, but trying to get them to focus on reading when the girl next to them has her boobs hanging out...not going to happen. They don't even have to be thinking about it, sometimes during puberty their bodies just take over.

That being said, the school I work at doesn't allow tank tops for anyone (and we have had over 100 degree temps every day since we went back to school mid August). I do think if there is a rule for girls, it should be the same for boys, but I think no tank tops is an okay rule. I used to work at a high school and the things the girls would wear were out of control. The male teacher in the room next to me would regularly call me into his room to send girls up to the office for dress code violations. He didn't want to be the one to call them out on what they were wearing because he was worried about being labeled a pervy teacher.

As for the bathroom rule, that seems a bit extreme. But I tell my students that, on multiple occasions, I have walked from my classroom at the back of the school, stopped at the bathroom, and made it to the MPR at the front of campus, all during a passing period. It can be done if you don't stop and talk and you walk fast. But twice a semester seems a little crazy.

ETA: spelling

KristaU831 · September 2013

yes. i was in highschool in the early-mid 2000s and yeah the britney-era was skin tight, low cut, low waisted.
everyone violated it, and during my senior year a few friends and i all got in trouble on the same day (abercrombie jean skirts) and we "went home to change" and just didn't come back and went to lunch instead.
my favorite was one day i got reprimanded for wearing a low cut top and it was my mom's shirt and said so. the teacher had no idea what to say to that one.

ErikaLynn75 · September 2013

I don't think it's really about bra straps being sexual. It's about teaching kids what appropriate attire is for different situations. When you're running cross country, running shorts and a sports bra is appropriate attire for that activity. School attire should be fairly professional. Wearing a shirt that shows your bra straps is not a professional look. I would say it's not appropriate anywhere, to be honest. The sad fact is that a lot of kids don't have anyone at home teaching them about appropriate clothing choices.

ETA: If I had my way, I would say tank tops or even strapless tops were fine as long as you wear an appropriate bra, whether it's strapless, or a racerback, or whatever is necessary so it doesn't show.

But I would keep the cleavage rule. Thumbs in your armpits, hands in front of your chest parallel to the floor. That's the limit for what your top should cover on your chest.

tealowl · September 2013

I remember being so embarrassed about my boobs, I had my bra snapped all the time by boys, and nothing was ever done about it. I was called 'slutty' by girls because I had cleavage, and that's just how my body was. I have big boobs, they will show cleavage in a fucking turtleneck. I've been boob grabbed back in school a few times before, titty twisters, etc...

So this is why I'm so mad about it. It's sexist and it's teaching my daughter that bras are embarrassing and so are boobs. And if boys look at boobs, it's the girls fault?! It's stupid and now that I know that teachers think this way about girls, it saddens me.

Some girls look older than their age because they just do. DD's best friend is still 11 and she's taller than me, she seriously looks 14 or so. That's genetics, not her trying to look older.

My DD is 12 and very tiny and short for her age, and she hates it. And now she's getting boobs, which mean they'll probably be huge like mine, and she'll have to deal with having the same body type I did, and I don't want her to think that her body is something to be ashamed about.

And just because she looks that way doesn't mean she's purposly titillating boys with her alluring bra straps on her tiny little training bra.

bumpuser9343355 · September 2013

cjchio said:

BeesTimesThree said:

cjchio said:

rlyttle said:

As a middle school teacher I completely agree with the no tank top rule. I'm sure your daughter is fine & innocent, but you have NO IDEA what these kids wear. It's really sad how some of them dress. Plus girls don't look 12 anymore, they look 18. It's a huge distraction for other students at times. Middle school boys can't handle any distractions. It's not right that boys are allowed to wear them though. NOBODY is allowed to wear them at my school including staff.

I'm sorry, but these boys have self control, they aren't wild animals with no way to check themselves. I hate when people make boys and men look like animals because they can't "control" themselves from the evil women.

This is where rape culture stems from.

I think middle school boys can't control a lot of things going on in their bodies, not saying they will act on anything, but trying to get them to focus on reading when the girl next to them has her boobs hanging out...not going to happen. They don't even have to be thinking about it, sometimes during puberty their bodies just take over.

So what if her boobs are hanging out? That's not her issue, it's the boy's. This is early staging of slut shaming, and I think it's appalling. It's all her fault he can't focus? I call bullshit.

I'm not saying it's the girls' fault that the boys can't focus. Like @DarcyHermione said, sometimes the boys get turned out without even seeing anything remotely sexual. I don't think girls should have their boobs on display at school because it is not the time or place. And I think it's a bit unrealistic to jump from "middle school boys can't handle distractions" to "this is where rape culture stems from".

KingLED · September 2013

@tealowl, Can I just say that I think you're the coolest mom ever. Seriously, you make me happy.

KingLED · September 2013

BeesTimesThree said:

cjchio said:

BeesTimesThree said:

cjchio said:

rlyttle said:

As a middle school teacher I completely agree with the no tank top rule. I'm sure your daughter is fine & innocent, but you have NO IDEA what these kids wear. It's really sad how some of them dress. Plus girls don't look 12 anymore, they look 18. It's a huge distraction for other students at times. Middle school boys can't handle any distractions. It's not right that boys are allowed to wear them though. NOBODY is allowed to wear them at my school including staff.

I'm sorry, but these boys have self control, they aren't wild animals with no way to check themselves. I hate when people make boys and men look like animals because they can't "control" themselves from the evil women.

This is where rape culture stems from.

I think middle school boys can't control a lot of things going on in their bodies, not saying they will act on anything, but trying to get them to focus on reading when the girl next to them has her boobs hanging out...not going to happen. They don't even have to be thinking about it, sometimes during puberty their bodies just take over.

So what if her boobs are hanging out? That's not her issue, it's the boy's. This is early staging of slut shaming, and I think it's appalling. It's all her fault he can't focus? I call bullshit.

I'm not saying it's the girls' fault that the boys can't focus. Like @DarcyHermione said, sometimes the boys get turned out without even seeing anything remotely sexual. I don't think girls should have their boobs on display at school because it is not the time or place. And I think it's a bit unrealistic to jump from "middle school boys can't handle distractions" to "this is where rape culture stems from".

I don't think it's at all unrealistic. If you're going to let boys off the hook for their actions and never teach them they have to learn to live with things that may be distracting and to respect other people regardless, then how are they going to magically be able to deal with it later in life when no one is there to tell them to pay attention?

Granted, I'm bad at wording things, but hopefully you get my point.

bumpuser9343355 · September 2013

@EllyD14, I'm not sure I'm doing a good job explaining my point. I fully agree that if girls are not allowed to wear tank tops, boys shouldn't be either. If any middle school boy took action (bra snapping, any sort of touching) that should be immediately dealt with. Obviously that is not okay in any way, shape, or form. But I do think it is not possible (some of the times) for boys in the middle of puberty to fully control their bodily functions. That is not their fault, or the girls' fault. It is going to happen. As long as they are not behaving inappropriately when it does happen, I don't think it's fair to tell them to have "self control". Yesterday I had a boy ask to leave class to use the restroom after silent reading. I asked if he could wait and he said no, it was an emergency. He walked out of the room with his arms crossed in front of his crotch. He had been reading a play about Goldilocks and the Three Bears. Is that him not having self control?

ally510 · September 2013

tealowl said:

I remember being so embarrassed about my boobs, I had my bra snapped all the time by boys, and nothing was ever done about it. I was called 'slutty' by girls because I had cleavage, and that's just how my body was. I have big boobs, they will show cleavage in a fucking turtleneck. I've been boob grabbed back in school a few times before, titty twisters, etc...

So this is why I'm so mad about it. It's sexist and it's teaching my daughter that bras are embarrassing and so are boobs. And if boys look at boobs, it's the girls fault?! It's stupid and now that I know that teachers think this way about girls, it saddens me.

Some girls look older than their age because they just do. DD's best friend is still 11 and she's taller than me, she seriously looks 14 or so. That's genetics, not her trying to look older.

My DD is 12 and very tiny and short for her age, and she hates it. And now she's getting boobs, which mean they'll probably be huge like mine, and she'll have to deal with having the same body type I did, and I don't want her to think that her body is something to be ashamed about.

And just because she looks that way doesn't mean she's purposly titillating boys with her alluring bra straps on her tiny little training bra.

All this may be true, but the school's primary responsibility is to help kids learn. To do this, they make every attempt to eliminate variables that distract kids from learning. That is the purpose of the dress code. Just like the dress code should not apply only to girls, it should not apply to more mature/busty girls. They have to create one for everyone to follow because all parents do not show proper judgement where there kids' wardrobe is concerned. In addition, parents may not let their kids leave the house in inappropriate clothes, but many change when they get to school. Thus the school needs to have policies in place to make sure the kids can't get away with that either.

tealowl · September 2013

BeesTimesThree said:

@EllyD14, I'm not sure I'm doing a good job explaining my point. I fully agree that if girls are not allowed to wear tank tops, boys shouldn't be either. If any middle school boy took action (bra snapping, any sort of touching) that should be immediately dealt with. Obviously that is not okay in any way, shape, or form. But I do think it is not possible (some of the times) for boys in the middle of puberty to fully control their bodily functions. That is not their fault, or the girls' fault. It is going to happen. As long as they are not behaving inappropriately when it does happen, I don't think it's fair to tell them to have "self control". Yesterday I had a boy ask to leave class to use the restroom after silent reading. I asked if he could wait and he said no, it was an emergency. He walked out of the room with his arms crossed in front of his crotch. He had been reading a play about Goldilocks and the Three Bears. Is that him not having self control?

But if her boobs were 'hanging out', it's totally her fault her bra got snapped, right?

Seriously, wtf?! This is such a 'boys will be boys' attitude and yes, this is the stream that trickles in the river of rape culture.

You're saying boys can't help themselves when they see tits, so if they grabbed some girls tits it would be okay because they were JUST COULDNT HELP IT. Bullshit and wrong.

bumpuser9343355 · September 2013

tealowl said:

BeesTimesThree said:

@EllyD14, I'm not sure I'm doing a good job explaining my point. I fully agree that if girls are not allowed to wear tank tops, boys shouldn't be either. If any middle school boy took action (bra snapping, any sort of touching) that should be immediately dealt with. Obviously that is not okay in any way, shape, or form. But I do think it is not possible (some of the times) for boys in the middle of puberty to fully control their bodily functions. That is not their fault, or the girls' fault. It is going to happen. As long as they are not behaving inappropriately when it does happen, I don't think it's fair to tell them to have "self control". Yesterday I had a boy ask to leave class to use the restroom after silent reading. I asked if he could wait and he said no, it was an emergency. He walked out of the room with his arms crossed in front of his crotch. He had been reading a play about Goldilocks and the Three Bears. Is that him not having self control?

But if her boobs were 'hanging out', it's totally her fault her bra got snapped, right?

Seriously, wtf?! This is such a 'boys will be boys' attitude and yes, this is the stream that trickles in the river of rape culture.

You're saying boys can't help themselves when they see tits, so if they grabbed some girls tits it would be okay because they were JUST COULDNT HELP IT. Bullshit and wrong.

That's the exact opposite of what I am trying to say. They can't help getting aroused. They can definitely control themselves from touching of any sort (hence my statement that has been bolded about that not being okay in any way, shape, or form). I don't think going through puberty and being easily aroused necessarily leads to touching. And if it did, that WOULD NOT BE OKAY.

ErikaLynn75 · September 2013

To be totally honest, I've had moments as a teacher where I was distracted by the amount of cleavage I had to look at on a girl in the front row. Or the girl whose skirt is too short and doesn't cross her legs under her desk so I can see all kinds of stuff I don't want to see. It's disgusting. And aside from boys being distracted, it tends to cause drama among girls as well. I wish we could make the dress code just say "Have some class," but unfortunately a lot of people don't know what that means.

It shouldn't be my job as a childless math teacher to teach other people's daughters how to dress. And that's why we need dress codes. I don't want anyone to be ashamed of their boobs or their sexuality, but I do want them to understand what is appropriate to wear and what is not. The way you dress makes an impression on people. It's just how it is. If you have huge knockers at the age of 12, then you need to learn at the age of 12 how to dress nicely with the body that you have.

Valie18 · September 2013

I've only read the OP but... AMEN Sister!

Our rule in elementary was straps had to be a minimum of three finger widths wide. I had the skinniest fingers! Also, I didn't wear bras yet. I remember the girls who did wear bras being harassed by teachers if a strap was showing and then it got to be a big deal on the playground if a boy saw a bra strap.

Thinking of this I am still mad at those teachers - for years I was embarrassed/ashamed if a bra strap peeked out. Stupid teacher jerks.

Jasperk23 · September 2013

hampire said:

I'm not even jumping in to the debate at hand. My public high school's dress code was pretty strict. No sleeveless shirts on either sex, no shorts or skirts above the knee, no midriff, no low cut, no sagging, nothing explicit or drug or alcohol related, no flip flops, no bandanas, no hats...thats about all I can remember. I believe it was mostly due to being deep in the bible belt.

The only time I ever got in trouble was during my angsty alternative days when I put a bunch of safety pins on my clothes. I found a large (like 5 inch long), novelty safety pin and hung it from my belt loop and the school thought it was "dangerous" and more or less constituted a weapon.

I'm afraid I haven't been fully honest with you guys. I am guilty of this, too. It didn't jump to mind right away because it got shut down pretty quickly. I used to make those friendship bracelets (trust me, they were very badass), so I often kept one safety pin on the knee of my pants to pin that to. It kind of just escalated from there.

Edited because ; ) inside a bracket looks awkward to me.

Pepper6 · September 2013

I never had issues with our school dress code because it was fairly reasonable. Shirt straps had to be 4 fingers wide, but mostly, as long as it wasn't a spaghetti strap, they never had many issues with it. Shorts had to be fingertip length (or thereabouts) with your arms at the side. No offensive language or scenes otherwise you had to wear your shirt inside out. We had no restrictions on footwear.

My biggest pet peeve when I was in school was when they decided to ban soda. At first, they put timers on the soda machines so you could only buy them during lunch hour, but then they replaced them all together with Gatorade/Powerade machines, or took out all the carbonated drinks and only left Hawaiian Punch and Nestea. I get the lunch time thing, but seriously, the huge bottles of Gatorade have way more sugar than a can of soda. And Hawaiian Punch isn't any better for you than soda either, it's just not carbonated. I get they are trying to force better nutrition in schools, but it was still annoying.

EmeJay · September 2013

If you want to read something fun, read this blog post of a mother about teenage girls.

My favourite part

"Did you know that once a male sees you in a state of undress, he can’t quickly un-see it? You don’t want our boys to only think of you in this sexual way, do you?"

Fun thing to know - At first, all the photos on the post were of her shirtless boys on the beach.

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NBR/GTKY: School Dress Code Policies Are Stupid.

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