B born 7/15/13, C born 3/2/15, #3 on the way May '17
I’m a modern man, a man for the millennium. Digital and smoke free. A diversified multi-cultural, post-modern deconstruction that is anatomically and ecologically incorrect. I’ve been up linked and downloaded, I’ve been inputted and outsourced, I know the upside of downsizing, I know the downside of upgrading. I’m a high-tech low-life. A cutting edge, state-of-the-art bi-coastal multi-tasker and I can give you a gigabyte in a nanosecond! I’m new wave, but I’m old school and my inner child is outward bound. I’m a hot-wired, heat seeking, warm-hearted cool customer, voice activated and bio-degradable. I interface with my database, my database is in cyberspace, so I’m interactive, I’m hyperactive and from time to time I’m radioactive.
Re: Toy Guns... Opinions?
I lost my angels 07/2010, 04/2017, 10/2017
Meimsx no more
I do see how it might not be okay for everyone for their kids to have toy guns. It does sound like they could have given the toy back with more tact but they are making their wants for their kids known. Nothing wrong with that as we all have to do that at some point or another.
I don't have a problem with them. Probably not even the plastic ones that look like real ones.
Now video games where you kill people/zombies--I have a problem with those and my kids will not be playing those kind if I can help it.
Agreed with you and meismx. You can pry my super-soaker from my cold, dead hands.
Seriously, it is strange to have the reaction to nerf toys. However, I wonder if how it was handled sheds anymore light? Are these very risk averse people?
Well, basically, SIL just gave the gift back to my mom and said "we don't agree with toy guns, hopefully you can still return this". Just that. No apology or thanks for the thought of the gift. SIL kind of does this a lot which is why I think it bothers me. My mom is very caring and awesome and really puts thoughts into gifts so it was really hurtful to her. I begged her to keep the gun and gift it to my kid when he is 2 because we are going to ROCK that thing!
Haha, your post reminds me of the time I put ice water in my Super Soaker. The kids in the neighborhood never saw it coming!
I agree, too. I do have some issues with toy guns that you can't always tell are toys (and not everyone knows to look for the orange tip so even with that I'm not a huge fan), but obviously toy guns like Nerf and water guns I see no issue with. Maybe it's because I grew up in a rural area where hunting is very popular so I grew up around it, and she's a city kid who didn't? I don't know... I just don't get what the big deal was.
B born 7/15/13, C born 3/2/15, #3 on the way May '17
I’m a modern man, a man for the millennium. Digital and smoke free. A diversified multi-cultural, post-modern deconstruction that is anatomically and ecologically incorrect. I’ve been up linked and downloaded, I’ve been inputted and outsourced, I know the upside of downsizing, I know the downside of upgrading. I’m a high-tech low-life. A cutting edge, state-of-the-art bi-coastal multi-tasker and I can give you a gigabyte in a nanosecond! I’m new wave, but I’m old school and my inner child is outward bound. I’m a hot-wired, heat seeking, warm-hearted cool customer, voice activated and bio-degradable. I interface with my database, my database is in cyberspace, so I’m interactive, I’m hyperactive and from time to time I’m radioactive.
Realistic looking guns not so much.
For me...it's that real guns are a tool, and shouldn't be confused with a toy. You can play with toy guns, but you don't PLAY with real guns. Those are something that, to me, you need to learn how to use, build up the ability to be responsible about it, etc. Toy guns that look nerf-y, which I really don't think anyone, even kids, confuse with real guns - those are a toy. And there might be some rules/boundaries for using them, but they're for play. To me, they're two totally different things.
And I'm a bleeding-heart liberal from the city!
They used to have a Nerf gun. I remember playing with it last year but I noticed it wasn't around at this visit. But my mom bought it knowing they did have one once and didn't think anything of it.
Maybe it is because of Sandy Hook. I would hope not as it would suck for my nephew if their parents freaked and changed rules in his life anytime something bad happened.
B born 7/15/13, C born 3/2/15, #3 on the way May '17
I’m a modern man, a man for the millennium. Digital and smoke free. A diversified multi-cultural, post-modern deconstruction that is anatomically and ecologically incorrect. I’ve been up linked and downloaded, I’ve been inputted and outsourced, I know the upside of downsizing, I know the downside of upgrading. I’m a high-tech low-life. A cutting edge, state-of-the-art bi-coastal multi-tasker and I can give you a gigabyte in a nanosecond! I’m new wave, but I’m old school and my inner child is outward bound. I’m a hot-wired, heat seeking, warm-hearted cool customer, voice activated and bio-degradable. I interface with my database, my database is in cyberspace, so I’m interactive, I’m hyperactive and from time to time I’m radioactive.
Make a pregnancy ticker
Exactly. Kids turn everything into guns. We had a party a couple of years ago, and all the kids were turning little stress ball brains into guns. Brains!!
We always had nerf guns and Water guns. As far as I know, none of us has ever had any interest in owning a real gun!
BFP #1 5/27/12- m/c 7/9/12 @ 10w2d (cytotec induced @11w).
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There is no way I would allow anyone to teach my 7 or 8 yr old how to shoot guns. That is wildly, wildly inappropriate in my opinion. Let the children do their target practice with something less violent. There is no reason a child needs to learn to use a gun or any sort at that age. This isn't their main source of procuring food. This is America and we have these wonderful things called grocery stores. I hope that field dressing an deer is included in your camp lesson. I am 100% anti gun, I wouldn't even shoot a skeet gun on my honeymoon in Scotland, instead I chose to try archery that day.
My MIL bought a realistic looking toy gun on a weird type of holster that also included a canteen. I threw away the gun. I don't know if DH told her I threw it way, but there was no way I was going to let my then 3 yr old play with such a thing.
DS1 has received a few toy dinosaurs that have little guns attached to them which shoot out small plastic arrows and things, but I haven't thrown those away. The truth is that little boys will fashion a gun out of anything, a stick, building blocks, whatever, even if they have never watched a show or read a book in which people are shooting things. I honestly don't know where they pick it up, but they do. Which is fine I guess, but I'm sure as hell not going to give them something large and realistic looking that shoots out things that can hit people or break things.
No matter how mild you may think this nerf thing is, there is no way that any kid is going to keep his shooting isolated to the target. The cat, his little brother, the vase on your mantle is going to be a target sooner or later. I don't think the parents were out of line at all, I think your mother was.
I don't see a problem with them but maybe its just like you said. I grew up in a rual county were all the hunters were accidentaly bring their pocket knifes to school because they had just gotten off of a big deer hunt. I will admit the gun's that doesn't look like toys are a big problem with me.
My child will grow up with guns and knifes (Safely put away! I might add!), I remember being twelve and my mom going over gun safety with me and making sure I knew how to handle it properly and I just thought it was normal cause everyone else had already had their lessons even younger then I was. When I hit the age that I could carry a firearm and date (Let me just say most importantly date!) My cousin after buying me Mace, Knives and a taser bought me a gun (You can tell he was a little protective? lol). Most girls my age had shot guns and went out hunting deer with their dads and here I had a little twenty two that could fit in the palm of your hand.
Anyways I think she over reated a little bit more then she should have and could have been a little bit more mellow about it. Your not being naive about anything that I could tell. Any problem I could see is the small plastic tips that a child could swallow but other then that there is nothing bad about them.
This. I used to babysit for a family that was very very strictly no violence, no toy weapons etc. so the 5 year old boy chewed his toast into a gun shape and played with that..there's only so much you can do!
They used to have a nerf gun, now they don't. I'm pretty sure that was a purposeful plan on their part. I find it incredibly rude to buy a gift that makes a lot of noise or shoots something without checking with the parents first. We're always advising people on the bump to draw the line early with MILs when they are overstepping their bounds. I think OP's opinion of her mom's behavior might be biased.
My son accidentally kicked off his slipper the other day it flew up to the mantle and knocked something off, which thankfully wasn't breakable. It is amazing the damage you can't anticipate before you have children.
What else do you do target practice with? The only other thing I can think of would be a bow....and I don't see how that's much different. Don't learn to shoot a gun but use something else for target practice? Again, like what?
I come at this from a different lense. I'm the wife of a police officer. We have guns in our house, that believe or not, are for something other than hunting and sport. A gun is a tool that my husband takes to work everyday no different than his baton, taser, handcuffs, and flashlight. Gun safety is something we do and will continue to take seriously. If they are in our house and my child will be seeing them everytime daddy goes to work, you better believe they'll know about them before the age of 7 or 8.
I'm sorry but what makes you think MIL knew they had gotten rid of it?
I lost my angels 07/2010, 04/2017, 10/2017
Meimsx no more
A bow and arrow if they must, although my preference would be pine cones aimed at a tree.
And really, you don't see the difference between a bow and arrow and a gun? I've never heard of any drive by arrow murders in my city, nor have there been any recent bow and arrow shopping mall mass murders in my city, nor have I ever read of any accidental bow and arrows accidentally being released at home and a child or person dying on accident from it.
i beg to differ.
https://www.freep.com/article/20121201/NEWS07/121201024/Wyoming-Christoper-Krumm-James-Krumm-Heidi-Arnold
I lost my angels 07/2010, 04/2017, 10/2017
Meimsx no more
They can both be deadly, can't they? Is one smaller and more "practical" to carry and hide/ sure. But implying one is safer than the other is just silly, IMHO.
ETA: Quick search:
https://kstp.com/news/stories/s2801239.shtml
https://wiredtohunt.com/tag/bow-and-arrow-injury/
It doesn't matter whether she knew or not, it is still rude to give that type of give to a young child w/o giving the parent a heads up first, IMO.
We're only hearing one side of the story from someone who is casting judgement on how someone else chooses to raise their child. She already stated there is a lot more to the story, I think she just has an issue with her SIL in general.
Yes, which is why my preference is pine cones.
Also, I think we're starting to conflate two issues - teaching the difference between toys and real guns vs. the very real problems of violent crime and mental illness (which is almost always behind mass shootings, at least in the US).
I agree with KdgTeacher and a few others who've posted similar things - guns are tools, and gun safety, responsibility, and ironclad rules for the use of guns should ALWAYS be part of responsible gun ownership (I also think that we should do a better job of making sure that it's easier to get health care than weapons, but that's probably for a different message board!).
That said, I think that unrealistic-looking toy guns are just that - toys. I don't think that means kids should get to play with them with no rules (for example, not shooting the cat seems like an excellent rule to me, and if a kid broke that rule, I'd take away that toy, whether it was a gun, a ball, or a bow and arrow, etc). I really don't see much of a difference between a nerf gun and a nerf bow and arrow. I also think that parents can, and should, teach kids that there IS a difference between, say, a squirt gun and an Uzi. That's not a huge mental leap for a kid to make.
It's also probably pretty dependent on the kid. If you don't think your kid is mature enough yet to start to understand that difference, then that kid shouldn't be allowed to shoot things (whatever they are).
My mistake, I intended to write "nor have I ever read of any accidental bow and arrows accidentally being released at home and a child or person dying on accident from it, although I'm sure that happens too."
Clearly my brain is working faster than my hands can keep up.
But FTR, I could easily post links to the shooting we just had here. A shooting that, if my cousin had not been severely ill with mono & strep, my aunt and my 3 yr old cousin would have been at that mall at the same time as the shooting as is their weekly routine. So as you might imagine it is a little hard for me to cast judgement on someone who doesn't want their 3 yr old to play with guns right now.
Gotta speak up on this one. I don't mind people having opinions but you are very naive if you think there's nothing dangerous about a bow and arrow. I've shot a bow just as long as I've been shooting guns and never once have I been injured by the gun. But I did get to spend six amazingly horrible hours in a hospital getting hundreds of fiberglass splinters removed from my arms and face because a brand new bow burst apart in my hands. Turns out there had been a recall on the bows we hadn't been made aware of and THANK GOODNESS is happened to me and not a child. But still, it sucked. Everything from riding your bike to sleeping on a mattress can potentially hurt or even kill you. At our camp the majority of our injuries come from the horse program (kicks and bucks most often). Some come from the water front and boating. Occasionally there will be a random fall off the climbing wall. To date the only area at the camp that has a 100% safety rating dating back to the start of the camp in 1898 is the gun program.
Oh, and there was a double homicide that occurred in a school in Wyoming on December 2nd with a bow and arrow. It just didn't get the same amount of news. Numerous children were killed by a knife in China on the same day as Sandy Hook, and last year someone killed a bunch of children at their school with a hammer.
B born 7/15/13, C born 3/2/15, #3 on the way May '17
I’m a modern man, a man for the millennium. Digital and smoke free. A diversified multi-cultural, post-modern deconstruction that is anatomically and ecologically incorrect. I’ve been up linked and downloaded, I’ve been inputted and outsourced, I know the upside of downsizing, I know the downside of upgrading. I’m a high-tech low-life. A cutting edge, state-of-the-art bi-coastal multi-tasker and I can give you a gigabyte in a nanosecond! I’m new wave, but I’m old school and my inner child is outward bound. I’m a hot-wired, heat seeking, warm-hearted cool customer, voice activated and bio-degradable. I interface with my database, my database is in cyberspace, so I’m interactive, I’m hyperactive and from time to time I’m radioactive.
I would rather feed my children meat that I know where it came from and that it is hormone free etc. instead of the crap that grocery stores carry that is from abused an inhumanely slaughtered animals. Just sayin' don't hate on those of us that DO get our meat from hunting or small farms.
Maybe you may see things a little differently once you have an outside child, but the mother probably needed to make her point clear then to not only her MIL, but also her son. This toy isn't coming home with us. This toy is not appropriate for you. No, your aunt can't talk me into opening it up right now so that she (the aunt) can play with it. She was probably trying as best she could to avoid a major fit being pitched. It was an extremely rude and difficult situation her MIL put her in and I think she handled it politely and as best she could.
No need to link stories--I live in one of the top 3 most dangerous cities in the US and like I said, MH is a police officer.
Side question, how do/will you handle it in your house when your sons turn other objects (Legos, sticks, shoes, etc) into guns?
Pretty much what you said. Mom knew they had a Nerf gun around this time last year (because I was playing with it in their living room last Christmas) so when she saw this set, which was on sale, she nabbed it up. Didn't think twice since the whole gun thing has never been an issue for us. It's so commonplace here that gun safety is taught in 6th grade as a STANDARD CLASS that everyone takes here. We also learn how to treat hypothermia and create a signal fire. So we don't think twice about these things. Obviously SIL did which is a clear conflict of upbringings, but it was more the way she handled it that bothered me.
Give it back, say "thank you but we have decided not to give him toy guns anymore" or something. Not how she said it. She CAN be a very blunt person and sometimes rude person, I still love my SIL and love having her in my family, I guess I'm just not used to her mannerisms when it comes to some things yet.
B born 7/15/13, C born 3/2/15, #3 on the way May '17
I’m a modern man, a man for the millennium. Digital and smoke free. A diversified multi-cultural, post-modern deconstruction that is anatomically and ecologically incorrect. I’ve been up linked and downloaded, I’ve been inputted and outsourced, I know the upside of downsizing, I know the downside of upgrading. I’m a high-tech low-life. A cutting edge, state-of-the-art bi-coastal multi-tasker and I can give you a gigabyte in a nanosecond! I’m new wave, but I’m old school and my inner child is outward bound. I’m a hot-wired, heat seeking, warm-hearted cool customer, voice activated and bio-degradable. I interface with my database, my database is in cyberspace, so I’m interactive, I’m hyperactive and from time to time I’m radioactive.
Bwahaha, that's a whoooooole different thread.
On the contrary, I'm not hating on it. I'm from the PNW, I have sportsmen and anglers in my own family, I understand that this is a cultural tradition that is important to Americans. But that is exactly why I think that field dressing should be included in this shooting lesson. I think that if a child that young needs to learn to use a gun, he or she better also know the effect of shooting it which is then cleaning and butchering your dinner.
Exactly. I would never be RUDE and refuse a gift that someone got my child that was a normal gift to give a child (even if it wasn't normal, I would probably never refuse it). Nerf and other toy guns are normal. You might not think so queenbone, but they are. The majority of parents out there don't really have a problem with them.
Why not just donate it? Or try to do a return yourself--most Nerf guns are sold at Target and they do returns w/o a receipt all the time. And then get the kid something that you would like them to have. Like maybe pinecones.....or something.
Also, I get that maybe you are against guns queenbone and that is totally okay to me. I respect other people's decisions. But the tone of your replies are so self-righteous, even if you add in the "IMO." It's like starting a thread with "I don't mean this to be rude" and then finishing it with, "You're a twatwaffle." I've noticed this in a lot of your comments on this board. Get off your high horse. You aren't some "queen" around here.
There's that whole self-righteous tone again. Who gives an eff if she has an outside kid or not? I do and I still think you are the one being biased here. Her MIL did nothing rude. It has been stated that the SIL used to let her kids play with toy guns, MIL did not know it was no longer acceptable, SIL didn't even say "thanks, but no thanks." Also, if it is normal for the whole family to not have any issues with guns and SIL does now, it should be her responsibility to let everyone know this so something like this doesn't happen. I just don't get how MIL is the rude one here.
Do you let your kids give back gifts to people because they don't like them? Do you let them get away with not saying thank you? You bet your sweet ass I am teaching my kids manners. It sounds to me like you and SIL could be BFFs.
Are you f*cking kidding me? Are you seriously going to use the "well you don't know what it's like until you shoot a kid out of your vagina" line? I've heard you say some pretty dumb things on this board but since I believe everyone is entitled to their own opinions and beliefs I've kept my mouth shut about it. But this is the single rudest, dumbest thing I've ever read on here.
This thread has really gotten out of hand and I apologize for everyone that I posted it. I was honestly looking for INTELLIGENT opinions on subject to see if I was out of touch. I really didn't imagine it going to the level of pure stupidity as it has.
B born 7/15/13, C born 3/2/15, #3 on the way May '17
I’m a modern man, a man for the millennium. Digital and smoke free. A diversified multi-cultural, post-modern deconstruction that is anatomically and ecologically incorrect. I’ve been up linked and downloaded, I’ve been inputted and outsourced, I know the upside of downsizing, I know the downside of upgrading. I’m a high-tech low-life. A cutting edge, state-of-the-art bi-coastal multi-tasker and I can give you a gigabyte in a nanosecond! I’m new wave, but I’m old school and my inner child is outward bound. I’m a hot-wired, heat seeking, warm-hearted cool customer, voice activated and bio-degradable. I interface with my database, my database is in cyberspace, so I’m interactive, I’m hyperactive and from time to time I’m radioactive.
I tell him that I don't want him playing that way. Guns kill people and they are not toys. I don't put him in time out over it, I can't really stop him from doing it, but I think that repeating the message that guns aren't toys and it isn't a nice way to play will hopefully sink in. Unfortunately we have to talk about death a lot since my father and uncle have died with in the last few years and my son asks where they are and will they ever come back.
I will probably allow my child to play with nerf guns and water guns, as I did as a child, however I believe that children should be aware of real guns and the dangers that come with them if they are not properly used. Children need to learn to respect guns and know they are not a toy.
At the risk of going against the majority here, I do not believe it is right and will not be endorsing our little ones having anything that resembles a gun (nerf or otherwise) at 3 years old. I certainly don't mind a super soaker or nerf when they are 7 or 8 - I had those up at the cottage when I was that age - but I don't see the benefit of allowing children to mimic the actions of a gun/shooting, even if its just for play, when they are that little.
It is one thing if someone in the household uses a gun for work (like a cop or a hunter or something), I can see you needing to educate then about the dangers and uses for sure. But I still don't see why you'd want to make a game out of shooting anything (targets, pinecones, trees) with anything (water, nerf balls, water) for kids that little. However far fetched it may seem to an adult to connect that type of play to the real thing of shooting a real gun, I still think it desensitizes children to the idea of it, which in my life, I don't see why I'd want to do that.
Call me a bleeding heart liberal Canadian, but I think part of why we have so few gun deaths in comparison to the US is the lack of "gun culture" in general. So few people have them, even fewer take interest in them (learning to shoot for fun etc), and there's just a general lack of exposure to them (unless you live in a very rural area).
Perhaps they way she did it was comsidered rude, but i cannot think of any person on this board thwt would look down on someone for standing up for their beliefs when it comes to parenting, regardless of whether you agree or not with those beliefs. Just my $0.02.
Since everyone's being so picky about facts, none of those children in the Chinese knife attack were killed... https://www.cnn.com/2012/12/24/world/asia/china-school-knife-attack/index.html
Kristina
Kristina - 34
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