New to S. FL and... need some help.

WordsmithMom · January 2012

Hi ladies!
I often lurk but don't post; my family moves to Miami in a few days (my DH went to HS there, I'll be totally new). I'm running into something - not just in my job search, but in trying to find a doctor, a colorist, etc to have in place before we arrive - that really confuses me.

My husband, and I are respectable, well-educated, home-owning, well-spoken professionals who present ourselves well in terms of appearance and conduct. Our son is a well-behaved, clean child. None of us has ever had difficulty making and keeping friends.

I'm not saying everyone has to like us, but I'm confused as to why the majority of the time I speak with people on the phone, they're normal and helpful, but completely shut down when I say "we're new in town" or "we're moving on X date." A few have even become outright hostile, asking irrelevant questions like am I from there, do I have family in the area, etc.

I know that every city has different rules, and that not all like newcomers - for example, were someone to move to the small town where I grew up, I'd tell them to buy X brand of clothes, participate in Y activities, and be vocal about having Z values. It would break the ice, and they'd have some good friends within a year or so. Is there such a secret in South Florida? I just want friends and a good job, and I'm not sure why my being new seems to just offend most people.

Please enlighten me, I'm trying very hard not to draw unfair conclusions about the city before I even move there.

rosesandpeonies · January 2012

I did find South Florida to be a somewhat "tough" area to move to. Not everyone is like that though! I promise.

I also never feel the same kind of "neighborly" feeling that I did in my hometown, but it might just be where I live.

It might be like that any time you move though...this is the first place I ever moved!

I live in the Boca/Delray area and I did have some trouble finding friends after my college friends left, but little by little I have met so many nice people.

Mrs.HisOnly · January 2012

I've lived here for 24 years and I will say that Miami is home to probably the rudest people I've ever met.

My husband and I love going out of town for that reason.

That being said, not EVERYONE is like that. The girls on this board for example are pretty awesome. But people in general in Miami, suck. I honestly don't know what it is but people down here seem to have terrible attitudes.

That's just my opinion. If it was up to me, I'd move back up north but my husband doesn't want to.

and again, before anyone here is offended, not everyone is like that.

WordsmithMom · January 2012

Mrs.HisOnly:

and again, before anyone here is offended, not everyone is like that.

Of course neither of us is saying that... I can understand reticence, but not outright hostility, you know?

I really really really really really hate that this has even crossed my mind, but could it have anything to do with the fact that our names and physical appearances indicate that we're not Latino, and that Spanish is obviously not a first language for either of us (we can hold detailed, intelligent conversation, but have accents)?

Am I better off just focusing my job search in Broward?

Mrs.HisOnly · January 2012

I want to say it's a cultural thing but I've honestly seen it from all kinds of people.

You'd really have to leave the South Florida all together to get away from it.

Honestly, eventually you get used to it.

WordsmithMom · January 2012

Mrs.HisOnly:

I want to say it's a cultural thing but I've honestly seen it from all kinds of people.

I'm glad (sort of) to hear it's everybody - at least in the sense of, I don't want my son growing up to form unfair prejudices or have a chip on his shoulder.

In the sense of "nobody likes a d-bag" though... not so much. So basically, people are just going to be royally p*ssed that we intruded in their hometown, and there's nothing we can do about it?

ValAndRyan · January 2012

We just moved to South Miami last July. I just came from Philly so I'm sort of used to the toughness. I find that there are extremely rude people and extremely nice people. There really isn't any in between. I've learned to not take anything personally and people are generally out for themselves, except those really nice people I've come across.

I have to say though, I haven't gotten the attitude you were getting from people and FL being their place and making you feel unwelcome. All the doc's offices and hair cut places have been really nice so far. Just ignore it and find another doc office or whoever you contacted if you feel your not getting treated "fairly". They should really be professionals. Sorry your going through that. It's stressful moving in itself.

GL with your move!

Sparks in training! · February 2012

I'm a west coast girl and found So.FL to totally lack the customer service and friendly vibe i grew up with in So. Cal. However, I have met some of the coolest people here and surround myself with positive people.

Schools are a HUGE deal here! I have a 5th grader that was BULLIED (stole lunch money, called a lesbian for not wanting to have a BF) hard core in 2nd grade!! I had to change schools and go through that drama.

I live in Plantation and like that community. My DH works in Miami and I in Ft. Lauderdale. I like Plantation Acres, Davie area.

When looking for a rental, USE A RE AGENT! They will be able to show you homes, apts etc

Hospital- Broward General is GREAT

Ped- Dr. Juan Milion

OB- Dr. Skeete-Henry

southmiamiwifejen · February 2012

EspressoBean:

I really really really really really hate that this has even crossed my mind, but could it have anything to do with the fact that our names and physical appearances indicate that we're not Latino, and that Spanish is obviously not a first language for either of us (we can hold detailed, intelligent conversation, but have accents)?

Maybe I misread your initial post, but I thought you indicated that you had not yet actually arrived in Miami and all these instances you described took place over the phone. If that's the case, how could the fact that your "physical appearances indicate that [you're] not Latino" have anything to do with anything? Doesn't make a lot of sense since people can't see you over the phone. Plus, as you'll soon learn when you move down here, it's not always obvious from a person's physical appearance whether or not they're "Latino." Hispanics range from having blond hair, blue eyes, and pale skin, to being black (of African descent), with every variation imaginable in between.

As to the fact that Spanish is obviously not your first language, there is a huge sector of the Hispanic population in Miami who also does not have Spanish as a first language as they were born and raised here. Another huge sector of the Hispanic population may have Spanish as a first language, but speak English fluently and without an accent due to the fact that they have spent decades living in this country and have been educated here as well as built their careers here speaking primarily English. I am assuming that when you had these conversations with the doctors, colorists, etc., in question, you were speaking in English. If that's the case, I don't think it would have been "obvious" to them that Spanish is not a first language for you. Unless you tried to have detailed, intelligent conversations with them IN SPANISH and thus revealed your obvious non-Hispanic accent, I don't think this would be a factor.

That only leaves your name as an indication that you are not "Latino." I would hate to think that any professional at any of these various offices you contacted would treat you differently because of your name, but I suppose it's a (remote) possibility. However, while there are many Hispanics in Miami, there are also many, many, many non-Hispanics who somehow manage to lead very normal and fulfilling lives as integral parts of our community despite the dead giveaway by their last names that they're not Hispanics. So either you have just had very, very, very bad luck and have managed to come in contact with a few individuals who are ignorant enough to discriminate against you because of your last name, or you're just jumping to conclusions about your ethnicity playing a part in the treatment you receive. Try to at least wait until you're living here before you start to think that people are going to be unwelcoming because you are not Hispanic.

As the other girls have said, Miami isn't the most particularly warm and welcoming place in the world. Sadly, there is an overall tendency to be rude to strangers. Again, like everyone has said, not ALL Miamians are like this, but it does seem to be more prevelant than in other places in the country. People here also happen to be terrible, aggressive drivers (this and the rudeness probably go hand in hand). It's just part and parcel of what this city is. I think you'll find, though, that once you move here and start to settle into your little niche of the community and make friends through work, school, your neighbors, etc., it's really not that bad. Yes, you may not get random strangers smiling at you and wishing you a good day as you walk down the street, but I'm SURE you will manage to find a group of friends who will be warm and welcoming and make you feel at home. I would NEVER, EVER advise anyone to "buy X brand of clothes, participate in Y activities, and be vocal about having Z values" for the sake of breaking the ice or making friends. Just be yourself. This city is big and diverse enough that there's something for everyone and you will find people that you have stuff in common with without having to learn a new set of rules or adopt a persona that's just not you.

WordsmithMom · February 2012

SouthMiamiWifeJen:

EspressoBean:

I really really really really really hate that this has even crossed my mind, but could it have anything to do with the fact that our names and physical appearances indicate that we're not Latino, and that Spanish is obviously not a first language for either of us (we can hold detailed, intelligent conversation, but have accents)?

Unless you tried to have detailed, intelligent conversations with them IN SPANISH and thus revealed your obvious non-Hispanic accent, I don't think this would be a factor.

I would NEVER, EVER advise anyone to "buy X brand of clothes, participate in Y activities, and be vocal about having Z values" for the sake of breaking the ice or making friends.

Thank you for the well thought out post. As I said, I was only speculating my non-latinaness (very eastern euro name, and obvious non-FL regional accent) might be a reason I'm being made to feel unwelcome. ie, a recruiter being very enthusiastic about my skill set/experience until I say I'm new in town, then she hurries me off the phone and won't return my calls or emails. Job postings that state you MUST be English/Spanish bilingual to do an office job that requires minimal customer service and zero dealings with Spanish-speaking countries. And yes, I have been asked questions in Spanish that require detailed answers when speaking with recruiters on the phone, though my resume indicates "conversant" not "fluent". A OB receptionist giving me attitude when I tell her I'm moving to town on X date (she'd asked why I was leaving my former OB). All are very frustrating, and I was looking for a reason to explain such frankly bizarre behavior. I'm sorry if I offended anyone though.

About the "do X, Y, Z to fit in" - as I might've/should've mentioned, I grew up in a very insular, homogenous town of 6,000 people. While I no longer live there for many reasons (narrow-minded community values a main one) and would never advise anyone to move there, honestly that's what you have to do in that particular community to fit in. But that was just an example. I'm glad to hear, as I assumed, that Miami is big and diverse enough to not be that way.

UMwife · February 2012

I want to piggyback off of what Jen said and add that while I understand the whole concept of "from here's" and "come here's," I don't feel like that's necessarily what you're experiencing down here. My husband and I are originally from Miami, but have spent the last 5 years in a very small "friendly" town in Virginia where they don't ask you why you're there. Instead, they refer to you as a "from here" (locals who grew up in the area or are originally from there) or a "come here" (those who aren't). People there said hi to you on the street and the way of life was a bit different than what you'll experience in Miami. Miami is a very fast paced city and even for a "local" like me, it's hard to keep up sometimes (especially after getting used to the pace we had in VA). My advice...just don't take it personally.

Questions like whether you're from here or if you have family down here might seem irrelevant to you, but most likely, they're asking out of curiosity. Could it just be their delivery of the question that's turning you off? As for the english/spanish thing, spanish is such a widely used language down here that some people don't even consider the fact that someone else may not speak the language. I'm Hispanic, but my spanish is terrible and a lot of times I have to let people know that I don't understand what they're saying. Most of the time, they make no big deal of it and speak to me in english. Granted, you will run into a select few who get annoyed with the fact that you don't speak spanish because they feel like we should just learn the language (instead of them learning english which is bizarre!).

WordsmithMom · February 2012

UMwife:

Could it just be their delivery of the question that's turning you off?

It's the tone of voice and attitude used, yes. The actual questions, when delivered in a more friendly manner, I wouldnt give it a second thought.

UMwife · February 2012

EspressoBean:
UMwife:

Could it just be their delivery of the question that's turning you off?

It's the tone of voice and attitude used, yes. The actual questions, when delivered in a more friendly manner, I wouldnt give it a second thought.

There's a lot of locals who wish they could move out of Miami, so maybe they're surprised that you would choose to come live here. I don't know. I still get the "you have sixteen heads" look when people learn that I *chose* to move back here. Also, Miami is not a very transient city in the sense that the people that are here have been here for a long time. You see more of an outflux than an influx...so maybe they're tone is just surprise with a dash of "why in the world..." LOL

In any case, if you have any questions, we're a pretty good group of ladies here. I hope the city doesn't turn you off too much and that you're able to find the beauty this place has to offer.

WordsmithMom · February 2012

UMwife:
[There's a lot of locals who wish they could move out of Miami, so maybe they're surprised that you would choose to come live here.

This is definitely a more palatable explanation to believe than anything I was coming up with. I think I'll believe this, thanks.

southmiamiwifejen · February 2012

EspressoBean:

I'm sorry if I offended anyone though.

I did find it a little offensive that you were already speculating about people being discriminatory against you for being non-Hispanic when you haven't even moved down here yet and the only interactions you had with these people were over the phone. I'm sure you didn't mean to be offensive, but you threw out a lot of misguided stereotypes out there (like the fact that Hispanic people must all look a certain way and thus you can tell whether or not someone is Hispanic just by looking at them).

Anyway, Nikki brings up a lot of really good points. I honestly never really thought of this city as being "against" outsiders but then again I was born and raised here, so what do I know? It's really a big city, very diverse, and there are people from everywhere. So I just find it hard to imagine that people would be unwelcoming towards you because you aren't originally from here. My undergraduate university consisted more of students not from Miami than from Miami, and I was also in a sorority with a lot of girls who were not from Miami, and I honestly never heard any of my classmates or sorority sisters say that they were treated poorly because they weren't from here. As you clearly know, there is a big Hispanic population here and like Nikki said, there are certain parts of town where if you walk into a small, hole-in-the-wall, mom and pop type of establishment, you may have a hard time finding someone who can communicate fluently with you in English. But that should NOT be the case for more professional establishments like doctor's offices.

Honestly, I think it all goes back to what a lot of us have candidly admitted to you all along - people in Miami can be rude. It sucks, but try not to let it turn you off. If you end up living here long enough, you honestly won't even notice it anymore, or at least not to the point where you'll take it personally. This city has a lot of amazing things to offer. And try not to take the rudeness as a Hispanic v. non-Hispanic thing or you'll drive yourself crazy with paranoia.

UMwife · February 2012

SouthMiamiWifeJen:
I did find it a little offensive that you were already speculating about people being discriminatory against you for being non-Hispanic when you haven't even moved down here yet and the only interactions you had with these people were over the phone. I'm sure you didn't mean to be offensive, but you threw out a lot of misguided stereotypes out there (like the fact that Hispanic people must all look a certain way and thus you can tell whether or not someone is Hispanic just by looking at them).

At first look, I found the original post a bit offensive, too. Especially with the hispanic "look" (take Nick for example...you would never guess he was Cuban based on the stereotypes). With that said, I've seen what it's like to be "on the outside" when we were living in Gloucester, so I could somewhat understand what she was talking about with people seeming to shut down the minute they realize you're not a local. I don't, however, think that Miami has that kind of mentality at all. I also don't think that people are intentionally rude here, I just think that people down here tend to get so consumed in their own situations, that they're actions come off as rude due to carelessness and a lack of consideration.

southmiamiwifejen · February 2012

UMwife:

Especially with the hispanic "look" (take Nick for example...you would never guess he was Cuban based on the stereotypes).

lol yes, nik...i think there would be people who would be surprised that our blond kids are hispanic.

UMwife:

I don't, however, think that Miami has that kind of mentality at all. I also don't think that people are intentionally rude here, I just think that people down here tend to get so consumed in their own situations, that they're actions come off as rude due to carelessness and a lack of consideration.

i agree with this. it's just a very fast-paced city and everyone is always in their own little world doing their own thing. living here doesn't give you a lot of time to just relax and leisurely go about your day, so i think most people tend to be wound pretty tight as they're out and about running errands, battling traffic, long lines, etc. it seems like people don't really relax and let their guard down until they're in the comfort of their own home or around family and friends.

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