Bah!

bstrangely · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
She just posted a new article about studies. I didn't look at it. Honestly, I am also speaking based off of what I read 2 years ago, I know shiz has changed since then.
I also got on the train and vaccinated the kid because I ended up believing it was the right thing to do. I did deny some vaccines for my older one, but for different reasons than autism.

who, heather? she posted an article about what people believe about vaccines. you would be part of the 21% the rest of us are astounded by.

this "stuff" does not change every day. most of it hasn't even changed in 10 years, let alone 2. seriously, this whole conversation makes me sad. how can you take pride in questioning authority when you don't seem to do any research? that's not questioning authority, it's called paranoia.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

I want to say polio, but I can't really remember. Maybe I have the print out in my files, let me dig.

Unknown · September 2011

This content has been removed.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

bstrangely:
Jake's Mom:
She just posted a new article about studies. I didn't look at it. Honestly, I am also speaking based off of what I read 2 years ago, I know shiz has changed since then.
I also got on the train and vaccinated the kid because I ended up believing it was the right thing to do. I did deny some vaccines for my older one, but for different reasons than autism.
who, heather? she posted an article about what people believe about vaccines. you would be part of the 21% the rest of us are astounded by.
this "stuff" does not change every day. most of it hasn't even changed in 10 years, let alone 2. seriously, this whole conversation makes me sad. how can you take pride in questioning authority when you don't seem to do any research? that's not questioning authority, it's called paranoia.

Strangely, you are always so quick to nut up on someone. I mean really, I said I don't remember back that far. Why is that so hard for you to understand.

The opinions on this subject have changed over the past few years. I have not researched any of it lately because I am done having kids.

I also am entitled to believe what I want, just like you. If you want to call it paranoia, cool. Whevs, I don't really care.

J+MS · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
Strangely, you are always so quick to nut up on someone. I mean really, I said I don't remember back that far. Why is that so hard for you to understand.
The opinions on this subject have changed over the past few years. I have not researched any of it lately because I am done having kids.
I also am entitled to believe what I want, just like you. If you want to call it paranoia, cool. Whevs, I don't really care.

I like to call it "ignorance".

Jake's Mom · September 2011

Vaccines are promoted primarily to generate profits for manufacturers and financial donations for medical organizations that endorse vaccines. In 2003, a House Committee on Government Reform report (4 MB) [40] revealed that the CDC Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices had members with significant financial ties to vaccine companies. The American Academy of Pediatrics, a leading pro-vaccination organization, receives millions of dollars from vaccine companies. [20]
https://vaccines.procon.org/

J+MS · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
Vaccines are promoted primarily to generate profits for manufacturers and financial donations for medical organizations that endorse vaccines. In 2003, a House Committee on Government Reform report (4 MB) [40] revealed that the CDC Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices had members with significant financial ties to vaccine companies. The American Academy of Pediatrics, a leading pro-vaccination organization, receives millions of dollars from vaccine companies. [20]
https://vaccines.procon.org/

You know manufacturers make way more on prescription drugs than vaccines? Vaccines don't bring in shiit.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

J+MS:
Jake's Mom:
Strangely, you are always so quick to nut up on someone. I mean really, I said I don't remember back that far. Why is that so hard for you to understand.
The opinions on this subject have changed over the past few years. I have not researched any of it lately because I am done having kids.
I also am entitled to believe what I want, just like you. If you want to call it paranoia, cool. Whevs, I don't really care.

I like to call it "ignorance".

No, not at all. I was far more informed then and not now. I have bigger fish to fry right now.

Heather R · September 2011

Jake's Mom:

Have they ever said oh we haven't seen "x" in "x" years, we can remove this vaccine because it is "dormant" or whatever they would call it.

It all seems like they just add new ones, never delete old ones.

yes, they have. measles was eradicated in the US until the nutters started fermenting.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

J+MS:
Jake's Mom:
Vaccines are promoted primarily to generate profits for manufacturers and financial donations for medical organizations that endorse vaccines. In 2003, a House Committee on Government Reform report (4 MB) [40] revealed that the CDC Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices had members with significant financial ties to vaccine companies. The American Academy of Pediatrics, a leading pro-vaccination organization, receives millions of dollars from vaccine companies. [20]
https://vaccines.procon.org/
You know manufacturers make way more on prescription drugs than vaccines? Vaccines don't bring in shiit.

Yeah, right.

We all know we can argue the vaccine pro con tip all day long. My kid is vaccinated, I got on the train. What is the big effing deal.

Just let it go hun, just let it go. You cannot fix me.

Heather R · September 2011

Jake's Mom:

She just posted a new article about studies. I didn't look at it.

Crying <----- laughter

haleymay18 · September 2011

The quoting that is happening in this thread is Carazay. You really only need to quote the last thing you are responding to.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

Heather R:
Jake's Mom:

Have they ever said oh we haven't seen "x" in "x" years, we can remove this vaccine because it is "dormant" or whatever they would call it.

It all seems like they just add new ones, never delete old ones.

yes, they have. measles was eradicated in the US until the nutters started fermenting.

I vaguely remember the pedi saying something to me about yea you don't really have to do this stuff because here in the USOFA most of these things don't exist. But when you travel, which we do at great length, then he is more likely to be exposed to this stuff.

I also have had very bad experiences with doctors and the last bebe. Like making me stop breastfeeding for the most stupid reason.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

Heather R:
Jake's Mom:

She just posted a new article about studies. I didn't look at it.

<----- laughter

Uh I am quite capable of reading urls. doh

KJmashup · September 2011

ntyravgmom:
So, for people who think thiomersal is the cause of the autism, is it the mercury that's in it? If so, how do they explain the difference in the mercury that is in thiomersal (ethyl mercury, non-accumulating in the body) and methyl mercury--the "bad" mercury?

Some people claimed that. Thiomersal can be harmful, but no one knew the effects it could have being in vaccines. A large group claimed (claimed being the operative word here) that it was the cause of autism. It was removed only as a safety precaution. (and probably because at the time there was a perceived rise in autism-not to mention all of these parents causing a huge stink about unnecessary things being injected into their children. Plus they were starting to sue the federal government for damages; stating that vaccines caused their children to have autism. Some of them won their lawsuits.)
Again, I don't believe any of that. However, I am glad that the CDC and the APA took another look at vaccines and tried their best to make them safer. Whether they actually did or not, I don't know.

I see. Well, thanks for answering my question!

Heather R · September 2011

Jake's Mom:

]

I vaguely remember the pedi saying something to me about yea you don't really have to do this stuff because here in the USOFA most of these things don't exist.

Like making me stop breastfeeding for the most stupid reason.

1. You still don't get it. The disease was eradicated BECAUSE OF vaccines. It doesn't mean you stop giving the vaccine.

2. How does someone make you stop breastfeeding?

Jake's Mom · September 2011

Heather R:
Jake's Mom:

]

I vaguely remember the pedi saying something to me about yea you don't really have to do this stuff because here in the USOFA most of these things don't exist.

Like making me stop breastfeeding for the most stupid reason.

1. You still don't get it. The disease was eradicated BECAUSE OF vaccines. It doesn't mean you stop giving the vaccine.

2. How does someone make you stop breastfeeding?

I am not a doctor I cannot confirm or deny your claim.

Meds I was taking caused them to tell me to stop breastfeeding him, but their info was wrong. So he went on the bottle and everything got all f-d up. Long story and I am sure it would cause some wtf to go down if I talked about it. So I won't. hmph

bstrangely · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
Do you really want to start the guardasil debate again?
Also, here in the woods they FORCE you to vaccinate your kids. You can't even register them unless they are up to date.

did you mean gardasil?

and nobody forces anyone to vaccinate your kids. you can always get an exemption.

i can see you are very well read on this subject.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

bstrangely:
Jake's Mom:
Do you really want to start the guardasil debate again?
Also, here in the woods they FORCE you to vaccinate your kids. You can't even register them unless they are up to date.
did you mean gardasil?
and nobody forces anyone to vaccinate your kids. you can always get an exemption.
i can see you are very well read on this subject.

Until you have jumped through the hoops I had to, to register my child for middle school in a new state STFU. You have no idea what you are talking about.

ETA- Yeah I spelled it wrong, so?

bstrangely · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
Strangely, you are always so quick to nut up on someone. I mean really, I said I don't remember back that far. Why is that so hard for you to understand.
The opinions on this subject have changed over the past few years. I have not researched any of it lately because I am done having kids.
I also am entitled to believe what I want, just like you. If you want to call it paranoia, cool. Whevs, I don't really care.

no, they haven't. at least, not amongst the people who actually like, read and ***.

please feel free to believe whatever you like. and the minute it falls out of your head onto the screen we are also entitled to believe you're an idiot.

Heather R · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
[ You have no idea what you are talking about.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

bstrangely:
Jake's Mom:
Strangely, you are always so quick to nut up on someone. I mean really, I said I don't remember back that far. Why is that so hard for you to understand.
The opinions on this subject have changed over the past few years. I have not researched any of it lately because I am done having kids.
I also am entitled to believe what I want, just like you. If you want to call it paranoia, cool. Whevs, I don't really care.
no, they haven't. at least, not amongst the people who actually like, read and ***.
please feel free to believe whatever you like. and the minute it falls out of your head onto the screen we are also entitled to believe you're an idiot.

Let's see how old is your kid? Oh wait, your kid isn't even the one in your sig. Hmmm.

Well then, I am not sure if you remember this or not but back in 2009 there was some pretty heavy debates going on about the autism vaccine links. It was all over the place. Sure the feds said they are safe back in 2009 and plenty of years prior to that and they still do today, but then there were those other guys screaming that the feds were wrong.

Maybe you don't think it changed because the feds said it was OK which seems to be all you pay attention to and you obviously don't ask questions when they drop 30 vaccines on your kid, but I did. Hate away baby, hate away.

jprior85 · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
I think it is the power lines.

LOL, I work for our utility and people are always genuinely worried the power lines are doing something bad to them.

Unknown · September 2011

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Jake's Mom · September 2011

beccaga16:
In regards to the government influencing research, it just isn't true.

Goverment funds research and regulates the rights of human and animal subjects. Beyind that they are not present at all while research is conducted.

A sponsor (drug company) gets facilities (ie doctors/hospitals) to run the studies. The sponsor and the government are not present during the study visits and have no influence over the data collected.

https://www.addictionsolutionsource.com/smoking_nicotine_addiction/corporate-funding-by-cigarette-company-taints-lung-cancer-study

Corporate financing can have subtle effects on research and lead to bias. Studies have shown that sponsored research tends to reach conclusions that favor the sponsor, which is why disclosure is encouraged. The tobacco industry has a long history of underwriting research, sometimes through independent-sounding foundations, to make cigarettes seem less dangerous

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/2010/08/02/industry-sponsored-drug-trials-more-likely-to-report-positive-results/

"While we cannot specifically point to which factors contribute to the association between funding source and positive result reporting, our findings speak to the need for more disclosure of all elements of a study," Bourgeois said.

Unknown · September 2011

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KJmashup · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
beccaga16:
In regards to the government influencing research, it just isn't true.

Goverment funds research and regulates the rights of human and animal subjects. Beyind that they are not present at all while research is conducted.

A sponsor (drug company) gets facilities (ie doctors/hospitals) to run the studies. The sponsor and the government are not present during the study visits and have no influence over the data collected.
https://www.addictionsolutionsource.com/smoking_nicotine_addiction/corporate-funding-by-cigarette-company-taints-lung-cancer-study
Corporate financing can have subtle effects on research and lead to bias. Studies have shown that sponsored research tends to reach conclusions that favor the sponsor, which is why disclosure is encouraged. The tobacco industry has a long history of underwriting research, sometimes through independent-sounding foundations, to make cigarettes seem less dangerous

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/2010/08/02/industry-sponsored-drug-trials-more-likely-to-report-positive-results/

"While we cannot specifically point to which factors contribute to the association between funding source and positive result reporting, our findings speak to the need for more disclosure of all elements of a study," Bourgeois said.

This is why write-ups of studies are peer-reviewed before they are published in big-name, well-respected journals.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

beccaga16:
I don't doubt there is always going to be some type of bias out there. The most probable reason for this is because if there are safety issues the drug studies are stopped and never published. They also go through so many years of animal testing before it gets to human trials that they have a good idea that it will be somewhat effective.

I am telling you what I see everyday. I conduct research and there are no outside influencse in my facility, or the others I have worked closely with.

ETA

Ok your directly involved great. yay.

How many places such as the place you work for exist? There have to be more than 10...probably thousands if not 100k+?

bstrangely · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
bstrangely:
Jake's Mom:
Strangely, you are always so quick to nut up on someone. I mean really, I said I don't remember back that far. Why is that so hard for you to understand.
The opinions on this subject have changed over the past few years. I have not researched any of it lately because I am done having kids.
I also am entitled to believe what I want, just like you. If you want to call it paranoia, cool. Whevs, I don't really care.
no, they haven't. at least, not amongst the people who actually like, read and ***.
please feel free to believe whatever you like. and the minute it falls out of your head onto the screen we are also entitled to believe you're an idiot.
1. Let's see how old is your kid? Oh wait, your kid isn't even the one in your sig. Hmmm.
Well then, I am not sure if you remember this or not but back in 2009 there was some pretty heavy debates going on about the autism vaccine links. It was all over the place. 2. Sure the feds said they are safe back in 2009 and plenty of years prior to that and they still do today, but then there were those other guys screaming that the feds were wrong.
3. Maybe you don't think it changed because the feds said it was OK which seems to be all you pay attention to and you obviously don't ask questions when they drop 30 vaccines on your kid, but I did. Hate away baby, hate away.

1. how do you know?

2. based on what?

3. see above. i actually have followed this for years, even before i had a baby (GASP!). because i would like to know if our government is in fact allowing unscrupulous companies to sell poison. shouldn't that be enough reason for anyone?

and that's kind of the reason i harp on people for this ***. if you think the government is evil, why wouldn't you find out and move or otherwise do something about it? why would you just continue taking the advice of the medical establishment? my belief is that it's just easier to absolve yourself of knowing anything, and your participation in this thread is bearing this out.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

bstrangely:
1. how do you know?
2. based on what?
3. see above. i actually have followed this for years, even before i had a baby (GASP!). because i would like to know if our government is in fact allowing unscrupulous companies to sell poison. shouldn't that be enough reason for anyone?
and that's kind of the reason i harp on people for this ***. if you think the government is evil, why wouldn't you find out and move or otherwise do something about it? why would you just continue taking the advice of the medical establishment? my belief is that it's just easier to absolve yourself of knowing anything, and your participation in this thread is bearing this out.

1. Because the picture is tagged with parenting.failblog.org. So either you put your kid on there or it isn't your kid. I am going with the latter.

2. I don't totally know what you mean by "based on what" but I will go with what I think you are saying.

The court case wasn't finalized until sometime in 2009, which is when I got PG and started researching it.

https://articles.cnn.com/2009-02-12/health/autism.vaccines_1_childhood-vaccines-autism-autistic-children?_s=PM:HEALTH

3. Yay that you had the time to research it prior to having babies. I was out hauling people around on my 60 foot public transit bus. I didn't have time to surf the net like I do now or go to a library, I was working 16 hour days being a single mom raising a kid. Thus I didn't start looking until I was pregnant in 2009 and working for my hubs.

I would like to leave the country, my husband won't let us. After we dropped a more than a 100k in taxes I was pissed and ready to go because I am now paying more than a normal persons salary in a year in taxes and have 0 say besides maybe a vote which to me ain't crap.

I didn't find a good doctor until gosh like 2006. Prior to that I was stuck with Kaiser via my job and Kaiser sucks. But you may have no idea about Kaiser and that f'd to hell place.

Life isn't always peachy and maybe you shouldn't assume that everyone has the time to research stuff like you did back in 2000-2009.

bstrangely · September 2011

Jake's Mom:
1. Because the picture is tagged with parenting.failblog.org. So either you put your kid on there or it isn't your kid. I am going with the latter.
you don't think he looks an awful lot like the kid in my avatar?
2. I don't totally know what you mean by "based on what" but I will go with what I think you are saying.
i am asking what people base their fear of vaccines on, since that seemed to be your position. yet now you post an article about a court case that determined there was no link. so, i have to surmise that you are crazy.
3. Yay that you had the time to research it prior to having babies. I was out hauling people around on my 60 foot public transit bus. I didn't have time to surf the net like I do now or go to a library, I was working 16 hour days being a single mom raising a kid. Thus I didn't start looking until I was pregnant in 2009 and working for my hubs.
I would like to leave the country, my husband won't let us. After we dropped a more than a 100k in taxes I was pissed and ready to go because I am now paying more than a normal persons salary in a year in taxes and have 0 say besides maybe a vote which to me ain't crap.
if you pay 100k in taxes i do not feel sorry for you.
Life isn't always peachy and maybe you shouldn't assume that everyone has the time to research stuff like you did back in 2000-2009.
dude, i didn't assume. you said you'd done the research. you said you were raised to question authority and whatnot. and now you say you didn't really because you didn't have time. so please, see my response to 2.

Unknown · September 2011

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Unknown · September 2011

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Jake's Mom · September 2011

bstrangely:
Jake's Mom:
1. Because the picture is tagged with parenting.failblog.org. So either you put your kid on there or it isn't your kid. I am going with the latter.
you don't think he looks an awful lot like the kid in my avatar?
2. I don't totally know what you mean by "based on what" but I will go with what I think you are saying.
i am asking what people base their fear of vaccines on, since that seemed to be your position. yet now you post an article about a court case that determined there was no link. so, i have to surmise that you are crazy.
3. Yay that you had the time to research it prior to having babies. I was out hauling people around on my 60 foot public transit bus. I didn't have time to surf the net like I do now or go to a library, I was working 16 hour days being a single mom raising a kid. Thus I didn't start looking until I was pregnant in 2009 and working for my hubs.
I would like to leave the country, my husband won't let us. After we dropped a more than a 100k in taxes I was pissed and ready to go because I am now paying more than a normal persons salary in a year in taxes and have 0 say besides maybe a vote which to me ain't crap.
if you pay 100k in taxes i do not feel sorry for you.
Life isn't always peachy and maybe you shouldn't assume that everyone has the time to research stuff like you did back in 2000-2009.
dude, i didn't assume. you said you'd done the research. you said you were raised to question authority and whatnot. and now you say you didn't really because you didn't have time. so please, see my response to 2.

you don't think he looks an awful lot like the kid in my avatar?

Slightly. Also I take serious offense to that picture because I am also heavily tattooed. BTW if he is your kid you are posting your kids pics on https://cheezburger.com/, neways.

i am asking what people base their fear of vaccines on, since that seemed to be your position. yet now you post an article about a court case that determined there was no link. so, i have to surmise that you are crazy.

People base the fear off of the shiz in the media and gross over exaggeration via the media outlets. All I remember from those times are the vaccines cause autism, then I started digging and talked to the pedi. But then you have these cases like I linked to and the other guy saying they are not true. Each person has to make the choice that is best for them, not just follow the rest of the crowd.

if you pay 100k in taxes i do not feel sorry for you.

HAHAH. You are funny. We have a CPA so if there was a way to pay less I would have found it and he would have made it happen.

dude, i didn't assume. you said you'd done the research. you said you were raised to question authority and whatnot. and now you say you didn't really because you didn't have time. so please, see my response to 2.

I did question the pedi and looked up shiz when I was PG in 2009. Prior to that I did not have time. You are not reading and absorbing what I am saying.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

beccaga16:
Jake's Mom:
beccaga16:

I don't doubt there is always going to be some type of bias out there. The most probable reason for this is because if there are safety issues the drug studies are stopped and never published. They also go through so many years of animal testing before it gets to human trials that they have a good idea that it will be somewhat effective.

I am telling you what I see everyday. I conduct research and there are no outside influencse in my facility, or the others I have worked closely with.

ETA

Ok your directly involved great. yay.

How many places such as the place you work for exist? There have to be more than 10...probably thousands if not 100k+?

You can look up every individual investigator and the credentials if you want. They are hiding nothing.

Do credentials mean someone cannot be paid off or bought?

What I am getting at is sure there are reputable places that do testing and aren't dirty.

But on the other hand I don't think there are only good places out there. Just because some are on the up and up doesn't mean all are.

Sort of like pill doctors.

Jake's Mom · September 2011

It has been fun ladies. I have to get my kid and go to dinner.

We can continue on Mon Bstrangely if you like. You seem to have a hard on for idiots like me!

It makes me feel loved. Just remember you can't fix stupid i.e me.

bstrangely · September 2011

Jake's Mom sez:

Slightly. Also I take serious offense to that picture because I am also heavily tattooed. BTW if he is your kid you are posting your kids pics on https://cheezburger.com/, neways.

what? why is it offensive? do you even know who that is?

People base the fear off of the shiz in the media and gross over exaggeration via the media outlets. All I remember from those times are the vaccines cause autism, then I started digging and talked to the pedi. But then you have these cases like I linked to and the other guy saying they are not true. Each person has to make the choice that is best for them, not just follow the rest of the crowd.

dude, i'm not following the crowd. you're not making any sense. either there really is something to worry about with regard to vaccines, or there ain't. and if you can't explain why you're worried, beyond some vague memory of somebody saying something once upon a time... then why participate at all? the cases you linked to showed NO LINK.

HAHAH. You are funny. We have a CPA so if there was a way to pay less I would have found it and he would have made it happen.

i don't think you should pay less. you're rich and obviously very comfortable. i just don't feel sorry for you either, since uh, you're rich.

I did question the pedi and looked up shiz when I was PG in 2009. Prior to that I did not have time. You are not reading and absorbing what I am saying.

look at what you're saying here... you think the medical establishment might be poisoning kids and giving them autism, so you asked one member of said medical establishment and did research which i guess you promptly forgot, since you're not sharing any of it with us.

does that really sound smart to you?

monimonimoni · September 2011

Oh dear.

monimonimoni · September 2011

bstrangely:
Jake's Mom sez:
Slightly. Also I take serious offense to that picture because I am also heavily tattooed. BTW if he is your kid you are posting your kids pics on https://cheezburger.com/, neways.
what? why is it offensive? do you even know who that is?

I, for one, enjoy your siggy pic. It's hilarious!

bstrangely · September 2011

monimonimoni:
bstrangely:
Jake's Mom sez:
Slightly. Also I take serious offense to that picture because I am also heavily tattooed. BTW if he is your kid you are posting your kids pics on https://cheezburger.com/, neways.
what? why is it offensive? do you even know who that is?
I, for one, enjoy your siggy pic. It's hilarious!

thank you! it always cheers me up to see your keyboard cat

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