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Babies: 6 - 9 Months
simplyatomic
member
[color=#FF0000]Mom to 5 girls 23,22,18,9,7 and one sweet Wonderboy almost 4[/color]
The Chaos of Six!
Not vaxing.. a serious question
simplyatomic
member
We stopped all vaxs on Eleanor after a reaction, and we wont be doing anymore on Liam until after we go to the Pediatric Epilepsy Center for testing and maybe not even after that if they find a connection.
What about those parents who don't vax because of situations like mine?
[color=#FF0000]Mom to 5 girls 23,22,18,9,7 and one sweet Wonderboy almost 4[/color]
The Chaos of Six!
This discussion has been closed.
Re: Not vaxing.. a serious question
This. And I would like to add that at least you arent against vax because of a debunked theory that it causes Autism. Some children, biologically can not handle certain vax, totally understandable. However, I do think that once the issue has been figured out and if there is a way to safely vax then it should be done.
OP I just want to say that I love that you call it vaxing.
DD had what the Drs called "possible seizure as a result of vaccines" after her 4 month shots. We were in the ER for about 10 hours and she was poked and prodded, had a CT scan, inspected but about 6 doctors, it was the scariest day of my life.
When her 6 month vaccines came up we decided to spread them out. She got a vaccine every few weeks and had no reaction.
Nope the bump doesnt make my parenting choices lol. I was just wondering if anyone was BSC enough to think people in my situation were dumb for not doing them so that I can stay clear of that one. lol
[color=#FF0000]Mom to 5 girls 23,22,18,9,7 and one sweet Wonderboy almost 4[/color]
The Chaos of Six!
These statements are offensive to parents who have children with autism. Just as you don't believe that vaccines are linked, some parents do, and we have a right to protect our children.
Yes, the safety of others via vaccinations is everyones responsibility, but at the same time, we (as parents) have to weigh the pros and cons and what we are more afraid of. For some, they are more afraid of polio, measles, etc. For others of us, we are more afraid of an adverse reaction that could lead to autism. 1 in 100 boys has autism, and I won't let an injection cause my child to be one of those.
How is it offensive when the study WAS debunked? It was false. You can believe it all you want, just like I can believe oranges cause cancer (which I don't...but the science is just as "solid") But at least my belief (if I didn't let my kids have oranges) wouldn't put them in serious danger.
Actually Wake Forest University is doing an additional study to re-examine the study that was "debunked" by the british scientist. They are examining 275 children with regressive autism and bowel disease (which an extremely high percentage of children with autism have bowel problems). So far, 82 have been tested. 70 of those 82 are positive for the measles virus...not the type you would get exposed to in real life and develop antibodies to, but specifically the type in vaccines.
Their work so far is not indicating that autism is caused by vaccines; however they are stating that it indicates that the measles virus in the gut could be (key word = could) coming from the MMR vaccine. The interesting link to austism is the severe bowel problems these children have.
In addition, there recently was a supreme court case that awarded the parents of an autistic child money because they found that vaccines did, in fact, trigger this particular child's autism. The key is that some children have an underlying mitochondrial disorder. Many times these disorders are undiagnosed at birth. The immature immune system of these children can't handle the vaccines and the result is autism. I am a therapist and I work with several families whose children have a mitochondrial disorder that was diagnosed after they developed autism.
The key is that some of us do not trust the FDA, because it is true that pharmaceutical companies are way too involved with the FDA. How can I trust a company that says "here, get a chicken pox vaccine - chicken pox are deadly" when chicken pox are very very rarely serious. In fact, in my state, there were more deaths related to adverse reactions to the vaccine in the last 10 years than deaths related to chicken pox themselves. Same thing with rotovirus - they make it out to be deadly but really it's just a bad stomach bug.
My main reason for not vaccinating our son is religious. However, I also would not vaccinate (apart from our religion) because I do not know for certain that my son doesn't have an underlying mitochondrial disorder. Therefore, I won't vaccinate as it has been proven by the US courts that there is a link there.
Please don't assume that those of us who don't vaccinate are basing our info on Jenny Mcarthy or whatever her name is that has become so famous after she got on Oprah. Our pediatrian actually recommends that no one vaccinate until 9 months and even then only with dTAP - waiting until several years old for anything else. There ARE legitimate doctors out there who know there is sketchy business between the FDA and pharmaceutical companies.
And more thing. You might be more afraid of measles / mumps - and that's your choice to vaccinate to protect your child. Some of us are more afraid of the unknown reaction to a vaccine that could cause harm - and that's our right. If you trust the vaccines so much, why are you so afraid if we don't vaccinate? You must have some doubts about how great they are if you have that fear.
Okay off my soap box.
** edited for spelling
I love you.
Mommy's sweet girls
Kaatje Grace 4.26.2010
Eloise Hope 2.10.2012
Oh...and it's actually apples that cause cancer. Oranges just cause sticky fingers.
Mommy's sweet girls
Kaatje Grace 4.26.2010
Eloise Hope 2.10.2012
And thank goodness we live in a country where you are able to make that choice, and we are able to make the opposite choice. I'm willing to take my chances.
Gotcha. I was kind of wondering where you were going with it. ;-D There are BSC people out there though!
And WOW, you are Mom to 5 girls??? There is a special place in heaven for you, FOR SURE. I'm the oldest of 4 girls, and I barely survived! LOL!
Ok, I was trying to be nice, but now you are being ridiculous. Vaccines do not take in every child. And, there are some children like the OPs kids who, for medical reasons, cannot be vaccinated. People like you who CHOOSE to not vax put those kids at risk. Its not an issue of me being afraid of some hidden danger in the vax. Its a legite issue of herd immunity being compromised. So yes, it is technically your choice, but you are putting others at risk other than your child.
Its not as simple as you making the choice to just potentially harm your own child. You are potentially harming others as well. Look at the recent rise in diseases that we thought were gone.
Really? You'd rather your baby die of polio than become Autistic?
$10 says you are pro-life too.
I think not getting vaccinations due to medical reasons is fine.
My DS had a horrible reaction to shots. He had a fibril seizure after his 4 month shot (he got pediarix). We went to an allergy specialist and had him tested for every single vaccine. He's not getting any more DTaP or rotavirus but will get one individual vaccine no more often than once a week. It works for us. That said, I think it is totally acceptable for you to not vaccinate. You have a legitimate reason for not doing so.
For the Wake Forest: https://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb4345/is_10_34/ai_n29321363/ please note that this was published in a research journal. His actual work is not yet completed.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-kirby/government-concedes-vacci_b_88323.html one of many articles that will validate my statement that the supreme court did award the family compensation, indicating an association between autism, mito. disorder and vaccinations.
I am pro-choice.
Lol. So from what I get from skimming that article, a) they made it very clear there is zero proof and b) they haven't said if the percentage of children with that disease in their guts with autism is any different than the percentage of kids without.
But, I will give your post a chance and spend time reading the whole thing.
I just can't imagine risking my child's life because of a very small study that hasn't been completed yet that actually doesn't prove anything. But call me crazy.
you didn't answer my question...
Your statement indicates that we really have a choice in the matter. If someone was standing here saying "your child can either have polio or be autistic" , then that would be a different situation. However we don't have that choice. We could vaccinate and they could have a deadly reaction. I'm not willing to take that chance - and part of making such a serious decision as not vaccinating is being comfortable with the potential consequences, which could include infection. However we are under the guidance of a pediatrician and he has suggested we wait. Our son has had medical complications but we would hav emade this decision even without the complications. We can't live with ourselves if something were to happen.
I think perspective changes when you work with families of children with autism who truely believe that something happened to their child. I can't argue with them - they are mothers just as I am and I respect that if they think the vaccinations caused their child to regress, then that's what happened.
Neither of these articles support your position. In fact, they argue against it.
My post never stated that any research has indicated there is a link (yet). My post stated that they have found that children with autism have gut issues...and that they have found a large percentage of these kids have the measles virus in their gut. Does this mean that it caused it? There is no proof. But based on that information and other information I have learned from going to conferences (for work), my husband and I are not comfortable vaccinating until there is more information out there. They may one day find there is no link - and I hope that's the case. But they could find there is a link - and I can't live with myself if I've already injected my child at that point.
Until then, we will wait. And we will wait for unbiased (as in, no money from pharmaceutical companies) research.
I think there are two ways to look at proof -
1) People who vaccinate until there is proof they are not safe.
2) People who don't vaccinate until there is proof they are safe.
I'm in the second situation because once you inject your child, you can't take it back. So since there is doubt, I won't vaccinate until there is proof.
Just because a study isn't published yet doesn't mean it's not reputible. It means it's not concluded or that there are other factors.
I'm glad you're able to do what makes your family comfortable, and we will do what makes my family comfortable.
You are still evading my question.
Autism is not a deadly reaction.
Your baby is much more likely to contract a fatal issue if you do not vaccinate. You are choosing that fate if you do not vax.
This statement makes no sense:
Our son has had medical complications but we would hav emade this decision even without the complications.
And finally:
they are mothers just as I am and I respect that if they think the vaccinations caused their child to regress, then that's what happened.
So if these mothers told you the boogie man came in and gave their baby measles, would you believe that too? Cause really, the chances of both of those things happening is pretty much equal.
I'm still just trying to get a straight answer out of you. You are running a BIG risk of your baby get a FATAL disease to remove the extremely small and as yet unhypothesized (nevermind proven) risk of your baby getting a behavioral disability?
I would 10% understand this position if you could offer me one (just one) hypothesis as to how you think that actually biologically occurs with vaccines and the human brain. The fact is that despite what people want to believe or think, there still isn't any actual suggestion that they can come up with as to how these are related. I agree that the FDA sucks and we call put 2+2 together on a lot of medical issues way before science confirms it - but we typically have at least a basic biological understanding to go along with our theory.
I am in the special education field. I've worked with autistic children in NC, KY, KS and now CA. Very, very few of the parents I've worked with believe that their child's autism was caused by vaccines. When I taught in KY, I had the honor of working with a high school student with autism. His father was a well respected neurologist and his mother an anesthesiologist turned ASD clinical researcher. They were pro-vaccines and had fully vetted any plausible link. Another mother of a student in that same class did believe there was a link. Her source: the Oprah.com message board. My experience was that the parents who believed there was a vaccine link were very closed off to any other explanation. They declined invitations to attend conferences that explored genetic, neurological or metabolic influences.
I'm also really curious to know what conferences you're going to, Tar Heel, that preach the evils of vaccines.
Is this your approach with everything though or just vaccines? Is there proof that oranges don't cause cancer? Is there proof that plastic doesn't? Will you not do ANYTHING untill there is proof its harmless? because I'm thinking you will live in a bubble. We don't have proof, really., that anything is harmless.
Or are you just randomly paranoid about this one thing? I dom't mean that in a snarky way, honestly.
You don't have a right to "protect" your children at the expense of other children like the OP's child. A child like the OP's who CANNOT be vaccinated due to medical reasons is the most at risk from your ignorance and misguided beliefs. Children like that depend on herd immunity - i.e. everyone who can be vaccinated is - maintaining a certain threshold to keep these diseases out of the community. When people fail to vaccinate "just because" or because they have a delusion that vaccines cause autism, then they are DIRECTLY endangering those children who cannot be vaccinated.
This is totally factually inaccurate. First of all, the Supreme Court doesn't award money. They decide matters of constitutionality.
Second of all, the Supreme Court hasn't even RULED on that case yet. The only thing that's happened so far is that they've decided to hear it and have begun to hear arguments.
Third, the case that is currently before the SCOTUS is that the plantiffs (i.e. the family of the child who was allegedly harmed by the vaccine) were denied their right to a fair trial because their case was heard in a special vaccine court rather than in a regular court. The ONLY thing the SC will decide is whether their case should be heard in a regular civil court. They will make no rulings whatsoever on the science of the case because that is clearly beyond their jurisdiction. The Supreme Court Justices are legal professionals, not doctors.
FINALLY, the "vaccine court", which is a special court set up to hear claims of those who say they have been harmed by vaccines, does not decide ANYTHING related to medical issues. The burden of proof in that court is far, far lower than it is in other courts. All you have to do is essentially prove that you got a vaccine and then you suffered an injury. You don't have to prove that the vaccine caused the injury hardly at all.
You should really do your research before you go around spouting nonsense.
So, when your child dies a horrible death from polio or pertussis, how will you feel then? And I'm sure mothers with autistic kids are great resources for medical advice.
There is a ton of proof that vaccines prevent deadly and debilitating diseases. There is no proof that vaccines cause other harmful things such as autism.
You're basically saying that something that has never been proven is more important than something that has been proven over and over again. In your opinion, the risk of your child dying, becoming paralyzed or suffering brain damage due to a disease like polio or HiB is less important than a groundless theory that he or she might suffer some unspecified reaction to a vaccine.
And that's not even getting into all the other people's children (like the OP's child) that you are putting at risk in the process.
What will you accept as proof that vaccines are "safe"? Isn't this kind of proving a negative? Tylenol has potential side effects, some of them very serious. Do you believe that Tylenol is unsafe and you will never, ever give it to your child?
Car accidents are the #1 cause of death among children. I'm assuming that you never, ever let your child ride in a car, am I correct?