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1st Trimester
NBR: Have you ever surrendered a pet?
We have a Maltese and we are thinking of surrendering him to a maltese rescue association about 4 hours away. DH and I are really struggling with this - we have had our dog for 7 years - since he was tiny. He has never been the most obedient dog, but he has always been very sweet with us.
When DS was born, however, things slowly started to change and when DS started to walk and eat people food, they got REALLY bad. Our dog bit DS once and still constantly tries to grab food out of his hands. We try to eat at the table most meals, but the dog is still constantly jumping, lunging up between DS's legs to get crumbs. He is extremely food aggressive. His overall behavior is worse, too - he barks like crazy at anyone who passes by the street, knocks on the door, comes to visit. We have stopped inviting people over because it takes our dog so long to calm down and if it's a man that is visiting, he growls and shows his teeth. We took the dog to the vet for a 2 hour behavioral consultation after the bite, and he hasn't bitten again, but things are still tense around the house.
We find ourselves completely dreading certain circumstances, like when DS wants to have a snack and watch TV - it's a total nightmare. The constant barking is disrupting our sleep and DS's. With another baby now on the way, DH and I feel like we are at wit's end.
I just feel horrible about it. I am not going to write any more of the details because I am not trying to justify this decision. Frankly, I feel the dog would be much happier in another home, too - a home without children in particular and that is another reason that after 2 years of serious difficulty, we are finally considering finding another home for him. Has anyone done this? Did you regret it forever? Do you feel relieved that your dog might be happier somewhere else? I am really unsure what is the best decision.
This discussion has been closed.
Re: NBR: Have you ever surrendered a pet?
I'm not an animal expert, but it seems that your dog's behavior has become very protective of your DS. This would attribute to the barking when people walk by.
As for the aggressive behavior towards DS and his food, I'm not sure if keeping your dog outside or in a separate room would help with the behavior. If the behavior does get worse, I don't think anyone would blame you for giving up your dog in concern for DS. Good luck to you.
ETA: Protective of your DS.
Just a warning that the Pets Board may stumble across this post and try to flame you. Just remember that you have to think of your children and their safety first and foremost.
It sounds to me like you have tried everything you can, including behavioral consulations.
I'll just tell you my story. We had two dogs and after I had my second son my bull terrier got increasingly more dominant. He nipped at me several times and kept trying to pick fights with our other dog. This dog had been through all sorts of training - puppy kindergarten, two basic obedience classes, and some other home training. He was a really good dog. But, something about after I had the second baby made him change a lot - maybe he wasn't getting as much attention as he used to or something.
After he nipped a couple times, we started gating him off from the rest of the family during the day. It was impossible for me to watch two small children and two dogs all day long, while taking care of a home. I felt horrible about keeping him away, but I couldn't find any other alternative. Looking back now, I wish we would have re-homed him at that point.
Well, after a few months of this, we had both of our dogs in our fenced backyard one day and something happened that made the bull terrier snap. He attacked our older dog and nearly killed him. It was the most gruesome thing I've ever come across. Luckily, the older dog survived after some surgery, but after what Angus had done we could no longer trust him around any other animals or small children. Our vet told us we had to put him down.
I guess my point in telling you this story is that animals are really unpreditable. Even the best trained dog can snap if provoked in the right way, my dog was a prime example. If your dog is already showing signs of aggression, I say rehome him now because the behavior could just get worse and someone could get hurt. I really wish we would have made that tough decision long before the attack happened, because then we wouldn't have had to make the tougher decision of putting our beloved pet down.
The safety of your children is the most important thing.
Owen Anders: labor (natural onset), failed VBAC, emergency c/s.
I haven't, but we've thought about it (and wow, huge mistake to post about my dilemma on the Pets board! I was just too sensitive about it to take all the criticism.).
We have 3 cats - 2 are siblings and about 13 years old. One of them has almost been put to sleep 3 times now, but keeps bouncing back from things the vet says at the time he can't recover from. He goes through long periods of needing medication, needing to be isolated, needing different food. A few months ago, the other older cat came down with a bad kidney infection and started peeing everywhere, at the same time the older cat started having diarrhea and dragging it all around the house. They both needed different foods, and couldn't be out unattended during the day. I was at my wits end because we just don't have space to isolate 2 cats in separate rooms and still have food & a box out for the third. I was stressed out, cleaning carpets and furniture every night, and didn't know what options I had other than cages or getting rid of a cat.
Luckily, 1 of the cats got over his problems, and dealing with just one sick cat again seemed more doable. But I still feel like animals deserve a happy home, and if we can't give it to them anymore, sometimes we need to find another option for them. In your case, if you feel it would be better for both you and the dog, and you can find a new home for him, it might be the right thing to do.
I personally think when you take on a pet, you should try everything you can to make it work in your home. I hate when people give away pets because they simply don't have time for it once they have children, or for other silly reasons. But you sound like you've done everything you can. I typically side with trying to keep the pets in these situations, but I wouldn't fault you for not in your situation (not that you need my approval to do so).
The only advice I would give you is to try and give the dog more exercise if you're not now. I run with my dog, and am already dreading when I can no longer run, although I know I'll have less time to workout once the baby comes, too, so he's going to have to get used to it. But always remember that a tired dog is a well-behaved dog. Maybe try doggie daycare a couple days a week if nothing else.
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No "rescue" will take a dog with a bite history. And if you don't tell them about the bite, then you could be held liable if the dog bites someone else. Likewise, a shelter can't adopt out a dog with a bite history, so essentially, unless you find someone you know to take the dog, you're condemming the dog to be put to sleep. I'm not trying to be harsh here - it's reality, and as a shelter volunteer and a rescue volunteer, I see these things on a daily basis.
That being said, there are many things you can do and try to curb this behavior, starting with a behaviorist. I'm newly pregnant, and already, I love my child dearly. But I can tell you with 100% certainty that I would never surrender either of my dogs.
Chase, the spotted boy in my siggy, had a whole host of behavioral issues when we adopted him. He was a stray that I found, and when no one claimed him after a week at the pound, we adopted him. He bit me and dh within the first two weeks of having him, he ate moulding off the doorways, he tried to bust out a window. He was bananas. We started working with a behaviorist 3x a week, and did so for almost 9 months. Now, we maintain by going once a week. He's a completely different dog, and while I would never leave ANY dog alone with a child, I certainly trust him to be around my niece and small neighborhood kids.
It's possible to improve the situation before before your new LO arrives. If you can find a good behaviorist and work with him/her, I'd encourage you to do so. I'd be happy to help you find resources in your area as well.
It sounds like that's what she has done.
And I disagree which is why I wrote it in the first place.
That's not what she did. She had a 2 hour behavioral consultation. That's not the same as working WITH a behaviorist. For the type of help her dog needs, it needs to be an ongoing process, which could take weeks or months. A two hour lesson isn't going to solve the issue.
Noted, figured as much when I read it the first time.
Ok. But I'm sure there is more to it than this. For her to have to come to this sort of decision for her children safety, that's for her to decide. I read that you spent nearly a year working with your adopted dog. That's awesome that you were able to yield those kinds of results. But for the OP it might not be so, she may not have the time (with children) or finances to be able to have that for her dog. Many people don't have that kind of money which is why, sadly, animals are then put up for adoption.
no, and i never will. pets are a lifetime committment. i put in a lot of work at the beginning, lots of training classes until i had good voice control outside the house, and until they respected my boundaries. we also knew we might have children, so they have been exposed to children of all ages since we adopted them (both rescues, about a year old when we adopted them).
dogs are not baby substitutes, and should not be treated as such. you confuse a dog when you treat them like a human, and you confuse them even more when you get a baby and suddenly shut them out. so they act out because theyr'e confused and they're stressed and don't know where they stand.
trainers and behaviorists are not the same. and some are better than others. and i sure as heck would never take training advice from a vet. a 2 hour lesson isn't going to fix everything the owner is doing wrong. and yes, i said owner. we have "out-of-control" dogs at our training facility come in on a daily basis, and within a week, we have far more control over the dogs than the owners do, by just treating the dog like a dog and using positive reinforcement.
a dog with a bite history is a liability to a rescue group. if you truly feel the dog is out of control and you won't put in the effort to consult a behaviorist and work with your dog on a daily basis, the kindest thing to do is to euthanize him yourself. being bounced from home to home isn't easy on a dog, and if you don't love your bitey dog that you've had for 7 years, who else will?
Have you seen my monkey?
You have not tried to properly train this dog, obviously. You have had him 7 years? Get on the ball!
What are you going to do if DS starts acting wild? Drop him off somewere? You are not going to exhaust every efffort to help a member of your family?
We can't really know, because she didn't elaborate. I understand that she might not have the resources to do more, but really, when you adopt/buy/rescue whatever, you are making a committment to that pet for life. And her post indicates ONE behaioral session. If she were seriously committed to helping the dog, she would have invested more in this are, whether it be working with the behaviorist, or working diligently on her own (if she really didn't have the resources)
ANY dog is capable of having or developing a behavioral issue and one of the reason there are so many animals in shelters is because people cop out when the dog needs behavioral help. It's not THAT difficult to find the time and/or resources to do what's right instead of dumping the problem on someone else.
A consultation is not going ot cut it. A baby is a life changing event, for both you and your pet. You need to take the dog to obedience classes regularly and actually practice what they teach you there at home.
Most shelters are already overloaded with people who cannot afford their pets due to the economy, please don't add to their burden. Make the effort to help your furry little family member.
Wow. Those are some awesome people you are friends with! Do you have any idea how easy it is to housebreak an adult dog? I've house trained 12 foster dogs. It's not hard. At all. And some of these dogs have never even been inside, much less lived in a house. Zomg,I must be some sort of miracle worker!
Anyway, OP, I think you have gotten some good ideas, especially from Nital and Mrs.Johnson. I wouldn't surrender my dog- but we have worked very hard in the past 5 years to ensure she is very well behaved and obedient. And I ditto pp on the the behaviorist.
It would kill me to give up one or both of our dogs. They are a part of the family.
I've found a few links that might help you, OP:
It sounds like your dog needs some serious training. I would start with NILIF immediately.
Here's a good link on the difference between trainers and behaviorists.
Here is a great link for resources on preparing your dog for baby.
I do hope that you rethink your decision and that you decide to keep your dog and give it the home that it deserves.
I also agree with everything that Nital said.
No - nor would I. As others have said it is your responsibility to train your dog and keep him out of situations (like dinner time) that lead to ill behavior.
It is your responsibility to work with a behavior specialist (1 two hour session is not behavior training). You have had this dog for 7 years - he is a member of your family and you should do right by him.
Also realize it is very unlikely a dog of his age who has not be properly trained will find a good home. A life stuck in a no kill shelter or a series of foster homes is no life for a dog and will be very confusing to him.
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Excuse me, but I am simply contributing a story that I thought would be helpful to the poster. And yes, I know very well how to train dogs- I have 2 dogs who are excellent in all respects with training and housebreaking. And there is no circumstance in the world where I would think of giving them up for ONE SECOND. They are my family members. Plus, who are you to make such a judgemental comment. You know nothing about their situation, so don't make ignorant assumptions. Why would you even pick on that? It's not helpful to the original poster, so let's not get off track here. And I highly doubt you are any form of a miracle worker.
I was being sarcastic, moron. Hence, the eyeroll in the post.
And, well your post wasn't really helpful, now was it? Plus, you air your idiot friend's dirty laundry online, YOU make it open for criticism and judgment. HTH. YWIA.
But your story of "oh my friends did it" was helpful and gaave the OP good reasons/resources NOT to surrender the dog? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black in terms of ignorant comments.
Who are we to make judgements? Look at what you said above in bold! Kind of a "do whatever you got'a do!" answer! Don't think half of us didn't give you the side eye for not showing her that she is going to make a stupid mistake that would result in the death of that dog.
Oh boy, now the name calling starts. I was being sarcastic too, so maybe that makes you the bigger moron. I've wasted enough time defending my point. When I need a miracle, I'll be sure to look you up!
OMG this is insanity!!!! Did I say I would ever do it? NO! And I wouldn't! But I am not in her shoes, she knows what is the best decision, and these kinds of posts don't help her, or anyone!
Where were you sarcastic at all? If you were, sorry, I don't get your sarcasm. I think you're embarrased that you were trying to support something you KNOW is wrong and got called out on it.
I'm sure it is really scary to deal with a nip and frustrating to deal with the behavior in general. I don't think a 2 hour consultation with a vet is going to be enough to solve a problem 7 years in the making. Honestly, vets don't have a lot of behavioral training unless they have gone on to become a vet behaviorist which requires additional training beyond vet school. I'm sure you could find a more qualified professional to help.
Closapio offered some great links that could really help in your situation. I also think baby gates and a crate could go a long way to help you manage the behavior while you work on it. Baby gate your pup out of the room during meals (or crate him). Unless you are able to closely supervise him and your LO then seperate them. In the long run it will keep everyone safe while you are able to work on the problem behaviors with the help of a professional.
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Ha. You still don't get sarcasm, do you?
Here, let me help you a little bit.
2. a sharply ironical taunt; sneering or cutting remark
Bottom line is, you can't take the fact that you weren't helpful, encouraged her to dump her dogs because "your friends did it and it was fine" and are now being called out on it by multiple people.
The point is WHY try to encourage with a story of how your friends did it, if you wouldn't do it yourself? I don't encourage things that I don't believe in. It's called morals and values.
I agree with this 100%!!
They see us rollin'...they be hatin'.
I think you need a good dog trainer, not a vet.
Also, how often do you walk your dog? Walks do amazing things for all dog problems.
I am very much against giving dogs away. Three things stand to me in your OP.
1. You've had him for 7 years and he still isn't properly trained.
2. He's never been the most obeient? Reference #1
3. You took him to ONE consultation.
This tells me that your dedication has been seriously lacking. Now the dog will be put to sleep because of it. You can't justify your decision.
No, I would never give my dogs up. And if I was in your situation, I would do everything in my power to change it-not give my dog up because that's what seems easy.
I understand you're frustrated with your situation. But from the information that you have given, I don't believe that you've been as vigilant with training as you should/can be. You need to understand that you have essentially created the behavior because you let it happen and never tried to change it
. You have had some wonderful suggestions I hope that you consider-crate training would be great-and working with trainer/behaviorist is a must.
Such a hard situation. I'm sorry you are going through this right now. Obviously, this touches a nerve in many of us. A few years ago, I couldn't understand how anyone could give their pet away. My dog has always been like my child. And then I had my first child and I saw things a little differently.
When I started dating my husband, he had just gotten a border collie from the pound here. She was labeled as kid aggressive (why he got her, I don't know!)--but she's super sweet and wonderful with adults. Terrible with other dogs and small people. (She's the dog pictured in my profile photo). When my husband and I married, she became my dog and was truly the baby of our family. We got a trainer for her and really improved most of her behavioral issues, except for the kid biting thing. She actually bit a friend's kid and I felt then that it probably wasn't safe for us to have her. But my husband really had a hard time letting her go, understandably. She's also snapped and bitten others (runner on our hiking trail, other dogs, etc.). When we had our son, I was really afraid of what might happen. We brought our trainer in to work with her when our son was small. Amazingly, she didn't seem to be interested in biting or being aggressive with our son. She growled here and there, but no biting. Until he got to be a little over 1 yo. She became more aggressive and afraid of him, and she did bite him twice. I love her, but felt certain we needed to find her a better home. Monitoring her with our son was a constant source of stress--and the issue had become a real stressor in my marriage, as my husband was still reluctant to find her a new home. Long story short (sorry this is so long!), my husband actually made the final decision to give her to his aunt, who has a huge home and large backyard (we have no backyard). She's so much happier in her new home. And yes, it was hard and we miss her very much. But I don't regret it at all. It's a huge weight lifted. And my husband, as opposed to it as he was, agrees. I never could have taken her back to the pound, but I felt better about knowing she was with family, at least. I do believe it's better for her there.
You have to do what's right for your family and children. It doesn't mean you don't love your dog. It doesn't mean it's not a hard decision. I totally get how dogs are family and become like children. They truly are a part of our families. But a dog is not a child. And I think that aggressive dogs and small children aren't a great combo. (Am I going to get flamed for saying all that? That's ok. I know it's a hot topic.)
Good luck to you in your decision!