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Babies: 9 - 12 Months
ncbelle
member
Night Waking Doesn't Equal Sleep Deprived
ncbelle
member
This is not an anti-Ferber or anti-CIO post but I can not stand the argument that a baby who wakes at night is a sleep deprived baby. And the argument that Ferber or CIO is the only solution for night waking is just as bad!
It is VERY NORMAL for babies to wake at night. Kiddo nurses several times a night and neither of us is sleep deprived.
Obviously if they are waking and staying awake, something needs to be done. But leaving them to cry isn't the only answer. It's fine if that's what you choose to do and it works for you - but there are other options!
That is all ;-)
This discussion has been closed.
Re: Night Waking Doesn't Equal Sleep Deprived
David still wakes 3 times a night to nurse.
well, family bed stuff is a whole different animal. but babies waking and needing to be soothed each time (NOT needing to eat), yes this is causing sleep deprivation. i am not sure how you can say it's not?
to each his own on the CIO and Ferber thing but you are right. night waking is 100% normal. i however have to disagree that i am not sleep deprived. research shows that adults need 8 hours consecutive sleep. i know that on the nights when i get that, i feel much better. bailey is exactly the same if she STTN, wakes up once or 10 times.
so while night waking may not be detrimental to the kid, i definitely think it is detrimental to me.
This. But it is a solution that woks for a lot of people and has worked for a long time. And based on the amount of wakings the poster below gave and her telling us her baby is a terrible sleeper, I'd say that her LO was likely sleep deprived. I don't think anyone was generalizing.
I posted this below but I'll post it again: https://www.kellymom.com/parenting/sleep/sleep.html
Babies are biologically designed to wake at night. I'm pretty sure I know my kid. He sleeps plenty and is quite happy. And I'm pretty sure I don't feel sleep deprived myself.
Infant sleep patterns are not adult sleep patterns. And besides, when was the last time you slept 12 hours or even 8 without waking up AT ALL??
Breastfeeding Counselor with Breastfeeding USA
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I sleep 8-10 hours per night and do not become conscious...neither do either child when they slept/sleep with me.
I have. It's called my kid sleeps through the night
It's glorious, really glorious.
I think it is a problem when your kid hits a year and is still waking five or six times at night. It's an even bigger problem when your kid hits eighteen months and is still waking that many times and is waking up his four year old sister, who is falling asleep in preschool because she's not getting enough sleep.
I know your kind. You spout off how it is normal for a baby to wake multiple times at night, which is fine. But then once your kid hits a year or fifteen or eighteen months, you start to get cranky. Your kid starts to get cranky.
But then it's a little too late and your kid is old enough to realize what is going on. No one's getting any sleep after that, trust.
1) when grant was doing his non stop night wakings (most of which were not to eat), he was cranky, exhausted and miserable during the day. much like me!
2) I know infants have different sleep patterns than adults, but the become much closer to ours, the older they get.
3) for people not doing extended breastfeeding, nursing all night isn't really an option
4) after a certain point in babyhood, i firmly believe a mom has a right to be well rested and happy, as much as her baby.
5) yes i wake up during the night, but i don't become *fully* awake and have a 20-30 minute shltstorm of crying and needing to be helped back to sleep.
before I had kids.
9/24/2011 Plymouth Firefighters 5k: 47:13
11/12/2011 Diva Dash 5k: 45:45
5/5/2012 STEM school 5k TBD Coming up in 2012:
6/10/2012 Walk to Remember SIDS foundation 5k
(in memory of a sweet baby boy)
11/10/2012 Diva Dash 5k
I love that dd is naturally progressing into better sleep patterns.
"Just keep swimming, just keep swimming..."
Um... "you know my kind" - ok??
My point is that it's not abnormal for babies to wake at night - and yet we are made to feel like it is. Kiddo is learning to put himself back to sleep and wakes far less frequently than he used to.
If someone wants to sleep train, that's their choice. But they shouldn't feel like they "have" to nor is CIO or Ferber the only option (if they aren't comfortable with those options).
Breastfeeding Counselor with Breastfeeding USA
Babywearing Guide ** Newborn Carriers
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Safe Bed Sharing Info
4) after a certain point in babyhood, i firmly believe a mom has a right to be well rested and happy, as much as her baby.
Yes - I assume the day I get a good night sleep is the day my children have graduated high school and are married off. lol I don't expect to rest peacefully until that point. That's the price of parenthood.
ETA - only because even when they STTN I am still lying awake worrying about other things. These kids will be the death of me.
I have never in my life slept that many hours without at least waking to flip over - and yet I always feel well rested. Maybe I'm just a weirdo??
Breastfeeding Counselor with Breastfeeding USA
Babywearing Guide ** Newborn Carriers
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i kind of disagree. when my DD wakes at night because she is teething or something, unless she falls back asleep in a minute, she is a different kid the next day. when she has those brief wakes- where i can watch her roll around or shove the pacifier back in her mouth, she is fine.
and I myself am a nightmare- cranky, can't get my job done, not as fun of a mom- if I don't get at least 6-7 hours of consecutive (non-waking consciously) of sleep a night.
yup, what Kel said. I tried CIO with DD and felt horrible, went back in because I thought it was the worst thing ever. You know what, she is 4yrs old and still waking up at night. It is a struggle to get her to bed, she's a total crab during the day. She wakes both DH & myself up, DH drives all day long for work he cannot afford to lose sleep. If I could go back I would have just let her CIO and learn to self soothe.
9/24/2011 Plymouth Firefighters 5k: 47:13
11/12/2011 Diva Dash 5k: 45:45
5/5/2012 STEM school 5k TBD Coming up in 2012:
6/10/2012 Walk to Remember SIDS foundation 5k
(in memory of a sweet baby boy)
11/10/2012 Diva Dash 5k
Come on Adams I mean I ususally agree with you and we share a lot of the same viewpoints but martyr much?
That came off biitchy, and it probably was, because I am, in fact, a biitch. But that's not really important right now.
Living in a hippy section of Chicago, I've met quite a few AP parents who were staunchly against Ferber or CIO. You would have thought I'd mentioned Satan when I said Ferber.
But now that their babies are toddlers and still waking up six or seven times at night to nurse, they aren't so smug. Not saying you were smug. Just that they were and still are a tad.
But my kid is the well-rested one who is running circles around their children at the park, who are sitting against playground equipment drooping. Not a coincidence, I think.
Obviously every case is different. If a child is waking and staying awake, a solution is needed - I don't disagree with that.
Breastfeeding Counselor with Breastfeeding USA
Babywearing Guide ** Newborn Carriers
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Safe Bed Sharing Info
Has nothing to do with the price of parenthood! This is you not facing and dealing with your anxiety. Before I dealt with my stress I too stayed awake nights not resting my body and mind. This was long before children. Because I sleep well at night as do my kids 99% of the time does not mean I or anyone who sleeps are not paying their dues!
no one is disputing this. the point is most babies DON'T just 'roll over' when they wake up. it's becoming fully conscious, crying, needing soothing etc.. it's a big chunk of time taken out of consecutive sleep for them.
It was a bad attempt at a joke, obviously. Of course I plan to STTN at some point in the near future.
I just know when I signed up to be a parent that I am never going to sleep as well as I did before I became one. If it's not a newborn baby keeping you up, it's a sick child or a child that is having problems at school or a child who is driving for the first time or a child who is out past curfew or you caught doing drugs, etc.
I just assume that the day I lay my head on the pillow and get 8-10 hours of peaceful sleep without worry is the day they are completely responsible for themselves. lol
K-I agree with you 100%. Babies do have the ability to STTN and not wake. Julia is in the same spot at 6am, in the same position I put her down at 7pm most nights.
And I hit the pillow and wake in the same exact position.
My friends, not hippies but never had the nerve to sleep train, have a 4 and 6 year old who have never STTN. We go to the beach together every Summer. I put my kids to bed, they sleep and we have adult time, they are up and down with the kids all night and they do not go to sleep w/o a parent laying down with them.
Which sounds more appealing and who are you doing it for?
And I do agree that if they are waking and staying awake that something needs to be done to help them - but there are multiple ways to skin the "teaching to self soothe" cat.
Breastfeeding Counselor with Breastfeeding USA
Babywearing Guide ** Newborn Carriers
Cloth Diaper Guide
Safe Bed Sharing Info
Oh, good lord, "the price of parenthood" is not getting uninterrupted sleep until your kid is EIGHTEEN. I didn't know I signed on to be a complete and total martyr when I had kids.
I didn't do CIO with my DD. No need. I only had one kid, and she slept like a dream. I did with DS. Of course babies (and adults) wake up multiple times a night to turn over, adjust blankets, pee, whatever. But DS was not able to get back to sleep alone, and he was waking up his 2.5 year old sister who is most def cranky without sleep. And sleeps 12-13 hours a night without making a peep and has since 15 wks old. I can count on one hand the number of times she's woken up in the last 2.5 years, even when sick, teething, whatever. I was counting DS's wake ups on two hands over the course of one night. Different kids, I did different things. I totally agree that night nursing, family bed, whatever works for some families, and I can see that some people don't need long stretches of uninterrupted sleep. But some DO. Can you not see the opposite view?
ETA: Phew! Saw that was a joke about the 18 years of uninterrupted sleep
I do agree there are others ways than CIO, but I don't think that's the point. I did a version of CIO with ds, and it worked great at helping him fall asleep on his own. When we did it he was around 4.5 months old and he still woke for 1 night feeding until he eventually weaned himself around 5.5 months.
I do believe, from my own experience, that night wakings do for a tired baby make. When ds wakes at night now due to teeth, he is different and cranky the next day. Besides that..night wakings make me tired, and irritable. I lose my patience a lot quicker when I am tired.
Although infants so have different sleeping patterns, I really think they should not be waking out of hunger after about 6 months. Really, at that point it is a habit.
I don't think not sleep training (as in not using Ferber/CIO) = kids who can't sleep later in life. Sorry, I've heard too many folks who never sleep trained who have great sleepers and plenty of folks who did who have crappy sleepers.
I've never woken up in the same place as when I first went to bed - and I never have a night where I don't remember waking. And I was sleep trained as an infant ;-)
Breastfeeding Counselor with Breastfeeding USA
Babywearing Guide ** Newborn Carriers
Cloth Diaper Guide
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WOW! i have never in my life slept (with the exception of 1st tri) more than 4-5 consecutive hours without waking up. I am a terrible sleeper. I average 5-6 hours a night every night even on weekends. I was like this all through middle school, high school, college, law school (i don't think i slept at all during law school lol) and now. it runs in my family. we just don't need sleep.
ETA: when i say "we" i mean me and my siblings, obviously max needs sleep and he gets it. but he does wake some nights for his paci or because he rolled over etc. and i am ok with getting up soothing him for a minute and going back to bed. i also think its a stretch to say that if you dont do sleep training when they are babies then they will never be able to sleep well 4 or 6 years later. JAR-me thinks that your friend has more issues with her kids then not doing ferber when they were babies if she can't get them to sleep when they are 6 y/o
Well, your mother had a gaggle of kids. I bet she didn't Ferberize you guys and destined y'all to be horrible sleepers. That's why it runs in your family.
j/k
I have one sleep trained kid and one untrained kid. Both sleep well. My 2nd it just came naturally. If it had not I would have sleep trained her. Thought Julia handles teething and illness worse than C does. She wakes easier when in pain where C could sleep through. Must have been all the time she was sleeping anywhere with the months of pneumonia.
ETA: FWIW I just asked my Mom, I was CIO kid.
We as a family love to sleep a ton. It has been passed along thank goodness!
LOL!!! she did not ferberize. at least from i remember with my little sister and stories from my older siblings. instead i shared a bed with my sister so in essence i've always co-slept!!!!
I hate it when I agree with you.