Use last Frozen Embryo or Fresh cycle?

Momarazzi007

Ok, so i haven't hit AF yet, but mentally i think I've given up for the month so trying to plan for the future. I've typed my history on other posts, so I will start from what is important. I am currently 32, 33 October 4. We fresh cycled in June 2010 and when said and done, 7 embryos made it to 5 day 2 transferred fresh cycle, the rest frozen. That ended ectopic, waited to November and transferred two frozen. Did not take. January, two more, two took, one made and is our dd. we are male factor infertility and I'm good to go for all the testing and issues I could have, we were fortunate on this part. BUT because it took us six eggs to get to dd, we are trying to figure out what to do. Do we risk a FET on last snowbaby or since financially we would be almost halfway to fresh cycle, save until spring and go fresh route and use last frozen Embie with new ones once we get there. Part of me feels fresh cycle way to go, I'm still "young" but the eggs aren't getting any younger and if we got lucky first try this time it isn't like we would be mad we spent the money as we would have plenty to FET later provided we were lucky to get around 7 again no guarantee I know!. But I'm also not getting younger, and FET is so much less invasive and taxing on the body. I've been weaning dd and am down to morning and night and she is so sad about it and still asks through out day, but can't be nursing and do either cycling. Just feel like we are stuck trying to figure everything out and looking for any good reasons to do one or other and maybe you smarties have an insight I don't or we haven't thought of or anything of that sort of advice.
Thanks!

Kitty Holland

Of course it's incredibly personal and depends on how many kids you want (in an ideal world). If I were you and you are going for 3 or 4 kids, then I'd go fresh since it effectively freezes time for you. Good luck!

AprilDrew04

That was my advice too.  If you are thinking of trying for more than 2 kids, then go fresh and hope that is enough to have 2 or more kids.  My biggest issue would be having extra frozen embies.  I would have to use them.  Best of luck in whatever you decide.

nycbride0707

If you're OOP, I'd say do a fresh, since it will probably (likely) increase your chances. We have one frozen and plan to use it first, as we now (thank g-d) have coverage, but if we didn't I think I'd go straight to a fresh cycle (DD was the result of IVF#1).

CMDR513

I agree. I would go fresh. 

Momarazzi007

Thanks everyone! Great points! And thank you for Sharon some personal insights. This is the way I had been leaning, but Dr says its a good chance and our youngest and these will be older, so we were debating since the 8th. But if it fails, the next round is so much farther off so we can save up and I and eggies will be that much see too! So I think I'm convinced! Thank you all so much!!!

Momarazzi007

I actually just say down and priced it all out, they have a program, a multicycle deal, that I think we are going to go with, this way if for whatever reason, we have included thre cycles and all FETs until we get pregnant. Plus it includes the ICSI and frozen embryo set up and storage with makes it much more cost effective than single cycle that doesn't include it.
What does OOP stand for?

MJC1116

OOP stands for Out Of Pocket.

Just wanted to wish you the best of luck! No decisions with IF seem to be easy but it sounds like you are really considering everything and will make the best choice!

Momarazzi007

MCJ1116
Sorry for delay, kind of went through a bad week here and went out of town. I knew OOP, Lord help me I can no longer remember acronyms I know!!! Lol!
So we got back bad news, they are not giving us the same discount as last time, they will give us 5%, but not the 25%. As we all know, that is the difference between hundreds and thousands if dollars. So now we are at square one. Now hubby is thinking just do FET, even though he thinks it will fail, and "when it does" we just save up a few years and try again then. I'm devastated. Been kind of dead inside for past week and just lost. I mean I totally know there is a 20-25% chance it could take, but just knowing the slim chance and how my husband is being totally cold about it is just killing me. We have been trying on our own despite his super low almost non existent count and he feels like we can still conceive naturally. Um, we were off bc for years and never had a pregnancy scare even. And he wants to instead of doing the FET in October like we would have originally planned to of if we didn't wait for fresh cycle, now he wants to wait to December to give us another month or two to try and conceive naturally. ???? Am I being unreasonable to think this is ridiculous? He also said this would give me another month or two to get in better shape, what? Our fertility doctor actually went out if his way to comment that I was in great shape and the only thing we would have to do is make sure I give myself a couple days rest right around time of transfer (not that I over do it at gym or anything either). That he was impressed I lost weight when it is so hard after having kid. So just a lot of upset, a lot of me having to suck up life again. I actually blew up a little at husband last night, I told him that I was not being impatient and pressuring him, that I wanted a clear answer when we planned to do this, not just late fall early winter. That we wasted four years that I wanted to start having children and he wanted to just enjoy a few years of us being married before kids and then wasted another three years just or find out we can't conceive naturally and it was ridiculous to think all of a sudden, given one or two more months, we would be able to. That i had been more than caring and understanding for last four years since he got infertility diagnosis, never blamed him, supported him and did everything right. that he could be a little sensitive for the one time I'm actually openly hurting about the whole situation. That this whole time the very few people we have told about any of this have been only upset or sympathetic for him, including my mom, "It must be hard for him as a man to have this issue," and "He is really going to need your support." No one has even asked me if I was ok except my bf just hugged me and prayed w me. And his mom is telling me behind his back how stupid we are to have more kids and THEY cant afford it ( like we EVER asked them for a cent- um no, id rather die) and actually lecturing me behind his back that I am pressuring him too much to have more kids when we weren't meant to (WTF, these are and would be your grand kids???) and I haven't even pressured about doing any cycles because I am still slowly weaning dd. it wasn't until yesterday i really asked for more concrete dates so I could wean dd in time and be mentally prepared. They only thing I kept asking was when we might do cycle because I want dd weaned at least a month before. I'm just so mad he is acting like this- I mean, he has the infertility, but it effects us both. And on top of everything, I'M the one with all the shots, appointments, treatments, meds, hormones, and tests. I'm the one who ended up with ectopic that I had to have rounds of Shots to abort, and had hemorrhaging when we lost DD's twin. His pride is a little hurt, but my dreams are shattered. I have six brothers and sisters, I always planned to have like four kids. He, admitted, never thought about kids. He said one day and I agreed, better to wait a few years til he was ready, but he just doesn't get it. Sorry, venting and am just so lost. I feel so lost so upset and so stuck. I actually asked him how he felt a few weeks ago about donor sperm since money was such an issue and he said he would not do it bc he would not feel same, that they wouldn't be his kids. So I asked him if he had the diagnosis of zero sperm and unable to conceive at all and we were faced with that or adoption what would he have done? And he told me we wouldn't have kids. I was speechless. I love him so much, but I signed up for kids. I can't imagine and I don't know what I would have done if that had been case. Ok I think I am done, again sorry MIA and then huge dump.

AprilDrew04

I totally understand.  DH gets into the whole poor me, and tells me I would be better off married to someone else.  I grew up in a family of 7 and had the same dream of lots of kids.  I would be happy with only 2-3 at this point.  I agree that asking for a time frame is not pressuring too much.  You just need to be able to plan so you can deal.  I'm the same way.

I can also relate to the feelings that go with IF, even when the "issue" is MFI, you still go through all the ups and downs and frustrations.  I am saying a prayer that your DH can be a bit more supportive.

My in-laws, who luckily I rarely see, told us after a year of marriage that it was good we didn't have kids yet because we were bound to get divorced.  They also think it was ridiculous for DH to have surgery so we could have a child.  They told us we should just adopt a chinese baby.  Some people are just unable to be supportive.

Momarazzi007

Wow!!! Wtf??? My inlaws haven't gone that far, they know I'd put them in their place so fast it would make their head soon (but that is a recent thing, me standing up to them- they were headed in that direction and often joke "who had 9 years?" As in pool of bets after 9 years we'd split- we aren't but you know- snotty little comments!!!). My hubby had surgery and they were of the mindset that we could just do procedure (IVF) again or not have anymore. Not that having naturally or having them at all is better right???
Ugh.
Thank-you for prayers and understanding! I never used to open up about these things, but glad I found this board and women in similar situations! Makes it bearable to not I'm not all alone!

KC1212

I completely understand (well mostly understand) as we are MFI also. {TMI alert} but my DH had undescended testes as a child that wasn't caught til age 5 or so. He had a minor surgery to have it fixed when he was little. After several months of ttc #1 he says to me one day " I think it's me" he had remembered the surgery from childhood.

In search of a way to place blame somewhere I often mentally blame my MIL for not catching it sooner. Interestingly, his brother who did NOT have the condition is the one who easily fathered a daughter.

It is very frustrating because I have no known issues, ovulate like clockwork,etc. (knock on wood). We toyed with Donor sperm (and to play the devils advocate) while cheaper than IVF it is still pricey.

DH and were both willing to do donor sperm but it was the most ultimate last resort. And I assured him that if the tables were turned I would use Donor eggs. I also offered to let him pick the sperm OR to pick a donor that seemed most like him in looks and personality.

Luckily, we didn't have to resort to that. No matter though as our DS looks more like me!

Were any efforts made by doctors to increase his count? I've read stuff on the web about giving the GUY clomid?? But I haven't found the theory behind it.

Right now I have my hubby on count boost, Fertilaid, and motility boost...I'm giving it 3-6 months trial...he's been a trooper. I figure what the heck?

I don't want to give you "it just takes one advice" but I wouldn't give up on trying naturally as miracles happen and your DH's numbers could always change BUT I'm with you I would have to DO something.

Are you guys not candidates for IUI at all? I know the success rates aren't as high as IVF but it's still probably better than a natural cycle (I would guess).

I wish I had better advice.

hoping4more

I just wanted to say that MFI and FFI (female factor) are likely both very hard. I know I have felt the same way as some of the things you said DH felt. I have told my DH to divorce me cause he deserves to have a fertile wife & bio kids. I have used a donor egg (& a donor uterus) and she is just as much my kid as my bio DD. It is all about what you make it in that respect.

KC1212

I agree hoping for more- Bio Babies or not I would love them all the same. Heck, there is even a lady where I'm at who runs a boutique here that sells cloth diapers and the like. She not only adopted children but nursed them til they were 2!

One she was already lactating at the time the other in which she went through the process of re-lactation.

hoping4more

I induced lactatikn and supplemented at breast till she was 6 weeks old she was EBF. Then I switched to bottles as I didn't produce enough & was exhausted

Momarazzi007

I would totally induce lactation! That is awesome you did that hooing4more! I would adopt, donor eggs, whatever, I just know I am meant to be a mom! It saddens me he is totally closed off to donor or adoption.
He had varicocele repair the same month IFV stuck w dd. it improved quality, but numbers still under a Million. And sadly were told they wouldn't consider anything under 5 million for IUI
Does anyone know? Why can't the take several deposits from man and use them all in one IUI? I mean, the donor sperm is frozen... Has anyone heard of this?
He is and has been in the fertility boosters and me too bc we figure best have me as ready as possible too. He did semenanlysis after being on them a few months, no measurable difference and our doctor said no on Clomid for him.
I haven't given up on naturally conceiving, just after six going on seven years combined unprotected non birth controlled actively trying- you mentally just give up- even when your heart tells you it could still happen. I find myself slipping into depression, and I had that before we started IVF and back when I was in Army. Meds mess me up and not good for trying anyway so being and feeling so lost is just making it worse and that we are so limited and can't afford to do anything but least guaranteed way. I feel like no matter how good of shape I am I am going to be so worried I am going to screw it up and we all know the more people say just calm down the more we freak

KC1212

Why can't the take several deposits from man and use them all in one IUI? I mean, the donor sperm is frozen


Right! I totally thought that too when we went through IUI!

Momarazzi007

Hmm... Day two researching... Lol, I'll be back with an answer so help me!!!

Momarazzi007

Wow, not finding anything like this... Do I need to become a doctor and get some trials going? Because seriously, this makes sense. They have to wash the sperm before freezing or doing an IUI- why not combine multiple donations into one until optimal number is reached and then mass thaw specimens to use in on procedure? Please someone show me the homes in this logic?

Momarazzi007

Homes supposed to be homes, I do not like autocorrect

freakyfast

Momarazzi007 said:

Homes supposed to be homes, I do not like autocorrect

Hehe... did you get auto-corrected again? 

AprilDrew04

Clomid is used in men to increase testosterone.  If he doesn't have a testosterone issue then clomid won't help.  DH took clomid to conceive DD, and we tried it again only to find out that was no longer an issue but sperm count was still low.

Also had vericocele surgery and it only helped improve quality of sperm as well.

I agree with the idea of combining samples.  Makes sense to me.

KC1212

AprilDrew04 said:

Clomid is used in men to increase testosterone.  If he doesn't have a testosterone issue then clomid won't help.  DH took clomid to conceive DD, and we tried it again only to find out that was no longer an issue but sperm count was still low.

Also had vericocele surgery and it only helped improve quality of sperm as well.

I agree with the idea of combining samples.  Makes sense to me.

Oh I see! I thought it had something to do with count and stuff. I would read about men on clomid and seriously couldn't figure it out.

That stuff made me psycho. I mean like pms on steroids. Did it make your hubby crazy? Also- how does testorone (sp) factor into MFI? I'm really curious.

Momarazzi007

DYAC!!!

Ok, so yes, testosterone was great, so that is why not for him.

Ugh

KC1212

What is DYAC?

AprilDrew04

Low testosterone can affect the sperm count. And yes it made him moody. Although men take it continuously, like every other day, not just for a few days each cycle. So the mood swings were continuouse also, he had to start taking mood stabilizers to balance it out.

hoping4more

Damn you auto correct I think

KC1212

hoping4more said:

Damn you auto correct I think

Oh LOL

KC1212

AprilDrew04 said:

Low testosterone can affect the sperm count. And yes it made him moody. Although men take it continuously, like every other day, not just for a few days each cycle. So the mood swings were continuouse also, he had to start taking mood stabilizers to balance it out.

Thank you! I had read accounts of men on clomid and was completely baffled.

Momarazzi007

Lol, sorry, DYAC yes darn you autocorrect. My most used acronym in mobile

MJC1116

Hoping4More, I completely know what you mean. I have cried to my husband many times about how he doesn't deserve the crap hand he was dealt by marrying me and the issues I have. He is such a great dad, and has been since day one, that I feel so awful that my situation has prevent us from having the family size we dreamed about. 

Either way, IF sucks... it involves so many people and affects so many lives. I'm sure for all you ladies dealing with MFI that it's so difficult to deal with, and I can only imagine you frustrations. My RE told me "you should see what we can do with one sperm" when we were talking about the differences between male and female infertility issues. She said when there's an egg quality issue (what I'm suspecting I have), it's really difficult, but sperm issues aren't as bad. So there is hope!!

With regards to donor eggs/sperm... I totally get it. If you asked me years ago or heck even last year, I probably would have been pretty dismissive. But if it ever came down to it, I would accept donor eggs in a heartbeat. To me, it's adopting AND carrying a baby -- both incredible gifts. With donor eggs, you can actually control the pregnancy to a certain degree - exercises, healthy foods, vitamins, etc. My sister (who also dealt with both MFI + FFI) and her husband are meeting a potential child tomorrow to see if he fits in with their family. He's 18 months and -- a meth baby -- poor thing. Breaks my heart. The last baby they fostered was a newborn who had to stay in the hospital for a week. He was born to a transient, drug addict mother who already had 3 children taken from her. This poor little guy went through detox at weeks old. So incredibly sad. Sorry, I digress!

DH and I have had many long conversations and some of them involve how thing would be different if the tables were turned. He said if the issue was his, he would hate himself for doing that to me (pretty much how I feel about myself). I asked him if he would ever consent to donor sperm, and he said flat out, NO. I asked why not and he explained that for him, as a man, he feels that he's already so removed from the pregnancy, that it would be difficult for him to see past the genetics of it all. I don't know -- men are weird. But I kind of see their point. It really takes a very special kind of guy to agree to that. But, I can't say I judge men who won't do it.

Sorry for this long rambling tangent here... I guess just getting some thoughts out

Momarazzi007

It's ok, it is good to hear other view points! I don't judge him, it is totally different for me. Any baby in my life I feel like a second Mommy too, my little sister was born when I was 12, when I got home from school she was mine, naps, feeding, playing, changing- I loved it. At a year they moved her crib to my room and she learned to crawl out and sleep with me- so I always knew cosleeping was great- waking up with a baby in your face. My friends all had babies before me and we called them cling-ons on (star trek nerds- Klingons, get it her der lol) And if i were around, the kids are with me and listened to me like i was their moms bc i hold them to same standards and have treated them the same since they were babies, changing and feeding them too. My stepmom adopted me and my family dynamics were never nuclear family- so for me, adoption and donor eggs and sperm doesn't mean you aren't family- to me it is the family God intended- (I know not everyone believes in God- but I very much do and this is the path he has given me to the family he planned- not my plan!). So it kills me that my husband would not even open his mind to that. He is from a family that has had one divorce and that was estranged family member so in their nuclear family it is them and only them- except his mom was adopted. So that he doesn't get adoption kind of baffles me now that I think of it. Yes, I get genetics is the closest thing guys feel for pregnancy and child bearing, and I know my background and how I was raised in the position of caring for so many wonderful babies and kids and non of them mine totally clashes with his never held a baby until he was 20 and never changing a diaper til he was 30, but I just wish he would consider all the possibilities that go with it. Not just- it's not my kid. His grandparents never said that about his mom and no one I know even has an inkling that my mom adopted me- everyone comments that we look so similar and her bio daughter looks like our Dad, nothing like her lol. I don't know, I know we are the sum of our experiences. It does take a special guy to do that, but I guess maybe Since I am just finding out my husband isn't that guy I am in shock- I always thought he would be- it is weird- I guess just coming to terms and still reeling that had we not been able to conceive dd, he would have been fine not having kids at all- I didn't sign up for that. That thought scares me. I hear so many stories of infertility tearing couples apart- it scares me bc I made the vows for better or worse, but I don't know if I could have handled that worse. So that scares me the most you know? And I totally get I shouldn't be worried about that because we have dd, but I think we all think of possibilities on this forum and over analyze them. So hopefully I'll get over that soon.
I pains me thinking about the women who cannot conceive or carry. I know my doctor told me we were lucky it was mfi, and I know from my gfs who have ffi how bad it can be. One other reason I want to have my kids is to have them where I still have enough good years to become. A surrogate mother at least once if not twice. After going through and still going through this infertility crap, I always think I hope there would be someone willing to do this for me. Maybe I we wait to do fresh cycle that would be enough time to do a surrogate pregnancy and make someone else's dreams come true while we save up... I have talked to my husband about this for years and about donating eggs. He is surprisingly fine with that. Well, I guess I have more to think about!!!

KC1212

Would he be open to networking and speaking with couples who did use some form of third party reproduction? That might be able to answer questions and such before he just threw it off the table?
You might want to approach it that way if you have a mind to persuade him.

MJC1116

I agree with KC. Sometimes I feel like my husband needs a lot of time to warm up to an idea. When we first faced these issues, he said flat out that he didn't want to pursue any treatment options. We're Catholic and he researched the church's current stance on the issue and it was pretty grim. At the suggestion of my acupuncturist, we set a limit of time that felt comfortable to us and at the end of that time frame, we would agree to set a plan of action. During that time, we talked a LOT about our feelings about IUI/IVF, having more kids, adoption, etc, and by the end of it, he agreed to do a medicated IUI and felt comfortable with it. It was really strange. My husband is pretty set in his convictions.

I hope I didn't upset you when I said that it takes a special kind of guy to agree to a donor... I don't mean to suggest that your husband (or mine!) is not a great guy. I'm sure he is wonderful!! I think my choice in adjective was poor -- I just meant that I think many guys are not as open to that idea for whatever reason. I think genetically their brains are programmed  to "spread their seed" if you know what I mean and they maybe feel emasculated by the thought of being unable to do so. Heck, women are probably programmed that way too, which is why I feel like such a jerk for having such a hard time getting pregnant. 

I think you are a saint for wanting to donate eggs and serve as a surrogate. I think that is such a beautiful gift to give somebody and I don't think I could be emotionally strong enough, or selfless enough, to ever do something like that. 

I'm sorry you are dealing with the uncertainties. Maybe a little bit of time and a lot of talking will help DH come around.

Momarazzi007

MJC, no no no! Not at all!!! It does take special types of people to do things. Just like when single moms date, most wait to talk about their kids to make sure the guy is capable of being the man for the family, adoption isn't for everyone, taking in people isn't for everyone, donor eggs and sperm isn't for everyone. It in no way hurts my love for him, just coming to terms with the disappointment he isn't open to it and he isn't the person I completely thought he'd be if that makes sense. It's kind of like you think of some people as capable if anything until you find out they aren't. He is human and I can't hold that against him.
So he is pushing now to do the FET in November/ December. So I think if it fails I will talk to him again about looking at donor sperm as an option and kind of bring it up in a different way. If he again is totally against it, we will have to wait a few years to save up for fresh cycle and I will probably look at trying to do a surrogacy. Only time will tell. The waiting game, two weeks or any time frame is just awful.

KC1212

MJC1116 said:

I agree with KC. Sometimes I feel like my husband needs a lot of time to warm up to an idea. When we first faced these issues, he said flat out that he didn't want to pursue any treatment options. We're Catholic and he researched the church's current stance on the issue and it was pretty grim. At the suggestion of my acupuncturist, we set a limit of time that felt comfortable to us and at the end of that time frame, we would agree to set a plan of action. During that time, we talked a LOT about our feelings about IUI/IVF, having more kids, adoption, etc, and by the end of it, he agreed to do a medicated IUI and felt comfortable with it. It was really strange. My husband is pretty set in his convictions.

I hope I didn't upset you when I said that it takes a special kind of guy to agree to a donor... I don't mean to suggest that your husband (or mine!) is not a great guy. I'm sure he is wonderful!! I think my choice in adjective was poor -- I just meant that I think many guys are not as open to that idea for whatever reason. I think genetically their brains are programmed  to "spread their seed" if you know what I mean and they maybe feel emasculated by the thought of being unable to do so. Heck, women are probably programmed that way too, which is why I feel like such a jerk for having such a hard time getting pregnant. 

I think you are a saint for wanting to donate eggs and serve as a surrogate. I think that is such a beautiful gift to give somebody and I don't think I could be emotionally strong enough, or selfless enough, to ever do something like that. 

I'm sorry you are dealing with the uncertainties. Maybe a little bit of time and a lot of talking will help DH come around.

Are you sure we haven't met? LOL!

I am a convert and my husband is a cradle catholic!

We got a lot of flack about the IUI's from my stepdad (also cradle catholic) but at the time (and I feel bad for saying this) but I was in a bad place with IF

I said : If I go to hell for wanting a child this badly I don't really think I belong in heaven to begin with.

When we "gave up" I told God (I had a friend once tell me it was completely Okay to yell at God, she said he's a big God he can take it! Lol) I said " fine, if I'm not meant to be a mother fine. Just tell me what the hell you have planned then because I give up." LOL I guess he just wanted me to Patient and chill out. LOL

anyway I don't know where I was going with this...I feel like we have a one -track mind!!

What state are you in? we should get coffee sometime lol.

Momarazzi007

You know, I'm not Catholic, but I had some issues coming to terms with IF treatments of any kind, but a friend if mine who worked at church at and my best Christian friend told me that we as humans have it all figured out, but God makes it so. We can put a perfect 5 day blastocyst in a perfectly prepped and ready womb. But if he isn't ready to knit that person together (psalm 139:13), we cannot change his will. And I realized that he gives us the technology bc he wants us to be fruitful, but he still decides the if and when. So if that was the path I was being led down, it would still be in his time and his pleasure. Doesn't make it any easier, but at least it makes more sense and I feel a little more peace with it. DD was meant to be, and this was how. Ok, my input on the religious aspect, if you think in way off, that is ok too, I know we all have different beliefs and views!

KC1212

No! I totally agree! I feel like God blessed the doctor with the skills he required to perform the procedure.

He certainly didn't wire me to be a doctor.

MJC1116

I totally agree with both of you!!!

KC -- I'm in CA! I will get on a plane to get coffee with you -- you sound like a girl after my own heart! I said something along the same lines to my husband when we were discussing it. I told him that I cannot fathom that a God of love would scorn or punish me for wanting to bring a child into a loving family. I don't think that IUIs or IVF or any sort of assistance is "immoral." It's causing no harm. 

I think God wants me to be patient. LOL - he is a big God, he can take it. I love that! I might have to tell my 2nd graders that. I feel very frustrated at times because I am SUCH a control freak/very impulsive when it comes to things that I want. I feel like God really wants me to be patient, too, and DH and I think that this time of struggle is really to open our eyes to see how blessed we are with DD. Things happened so easily and quickly with her. I think we took it for granted. Now we are learning to stop and appreciate each moment.

Momarazzi-  I love your perspective and it's so true! When we were talking to RE and even after the failed IUI, it was clear to us that even with the assistance, the miracle of creation still needs to happen. Even with IVF - there's the uncertainty factor, and that's God working his miracle. It does bring a lot of peace knowing that!

KC1212

Well, shoot MJ- we're not even on the same coast lol! Although I do love CA. I've been to LA and Venice Beach (probably about 10 years ago)

I'm stuck here in the sticks with like 2 RE's in our area one of which has crappy reviews online.

Momarazzi007

So, hubby and I talked. We are moving forward with FET Nov/Dec time frame and if that does not take then we will move forward with me being a surrogate! For the first time in weeks I don't feel depressed- we have a plan! He did mention it might set us back, but I told him if we have to wait two to three years anyway, I could use that time to help someone else's life finally start. And he got it, if we were that couple we'd pray that someone would help us like this. So, not what we want to do perfectly, but if we have to wait, in the meantime I can hopefully help another family and we will have money from that too which will help in the long run. But- hopefully this is all just long term planning what if and the FET takes. Long time to wait between now and end of fall, but I finally feel I am in a better place that I am not standing still. So that is good!! I might actually be able to sleep tonight!!!