I don't think trying to do your own research is bad, but with high amounts of misinformation and many people on this list claiming they want to wait, follow Dr. Sears, or weigh the risk of disease against the "risk of vaccination", I think it's the wrong message to suggest that we can't trust government panels and recommendations. Although some people may want to be this critical, find out the backing of every panel member, and read a million sources (and they should if they want), people just looking for basic info should trust panels, their doctors, and scientific literature summaries. To think that both sides are equal on this issue or that we should fear that the government is trying to mislead us on vaccinations has lead to a widespread public health crisis and puts babies of people reading this at risk.
Go to a childrens hospital where you will see sick and dying children who weren't vaccinated, all from very preventable diseases. Maybe you will also see the 1 in a million case where a child had a bad reaction to the vaccine but most likely not.
We vaccine according to the recommended schedule but I understand parents who do a bit of delayed schedule. No vaccines for two years seems extreme and dangerous to me.
I don't think trying to do your own research is bad, but with high amounts of misinformation and many people on this list claiming they want to wait, follow Dr. Sears, or weigh the risk of disease against the "risk of vaccination", I think it's the wrong message to suggest that we can't trust government panels and recommendations. Although some people may want to be this critical, find out the backing of every panel member, and read a million sources (and they should if they want), people just looking for basic info should trust panels, their doctors, and scientific literature summaries. To think that both sides are equal on this issue or that we should fear that the government is trying to mislead us on vaccinations has lead to a widespread public health crisis and puts babies of people reading this at risk.
Sometimes there are really not two equal sides to each story.
And you know, there is a reason that doctors go to medical school and spend years and years learning about medicine. It means something, and an hour or two of googling does not make you a medical expert qualified to interpret clinical studies.
We are vaccinating on schedule. All the studies about vaccines being linked to autism are debunked. Also, I am not willing to compromise my child's health when they are at their most vulnerable.
You want an unbiased opinion?
Go to a childrens hospital where you will see sick and dying children who weren't vaccinated, all from very preventable diseases. Maybe you will also see the 1 in a million case where a child had a bad reaction to the vaccine but most likely not.
We vaccine according to the recommended schedule but I understand parents who do a bit of delayed schedule. No vaccines for two years seems extreme and dangerous to me.
Agree. I also know someone whose niece got Polio and will be in a wheelchair for the rest of her life. Her parents did not vaccinate. Sorry to be debbie downer but non vaxers make me very upset.
We were 2 under 2, now 3 under 3!
Team Green turned Team Pink with #1, Team Green turned Team Blue with #2, Team Green turned Team Pink again with #3
... "the panic virus" by Seth mnookin for a thorough unbiased report on vaccines.
THIS! I saw him give a keynote address last year and have read his book. Incredibly thought provoking and about as unbiased as it gets. Of course, the problem with calling something "unbiased" is that people tend to feel something is "biased" if they don't agree with it.
I work at the #1 children's hospital in the US. We are asked this question on a daily basis. I regularly refer people to an article by Dr. Paul Offit- he's about as good as it will get when it comes to immunologists.
I will be vaccinating my child on the recommendations of many many many professionals, agencies, and groups- all of which have determined that there are far more risks of not vaccinating than doing so. I encourage others to gather peer-reviewed, scientifically founded research to make their personal decision.
He's pandering to the masses with a "mother knows best" message. You can't have mother's intuition about whether your child is at risk from disease or a vaccine like you do when you sense the neighbor is a little creepy. Definitely recommend reading this article if you think Dr. Sears is the best source.
OP posts like these make my blood boil. My Dad got polio when he was 18 months old. He nearly died and was permanently disfigured. These diseases are real. They do exist and they DO kill babies. My Grandma would have given anything to save her son from so much suffering. Now all it takes is an injection!! I will never understand parents who do not vaccinate unless of course there is a medical reason!. I judge those who do not vaccinate as selfish and stupid. We vaccinate for everything and on time.
Go to a childrens hospital where you will see sick and dying children who weren't vaccinated, all from very preventable diseases. Maybe you will also see the 1 in a million case where a child had a bad reaction to the vaccine but most likely not.
We vaccine according to the recommended schedule but I understand parents who do a bit of delayed schedule. No vaccines for two years seems extreme and dangerous to me.
Agree. I also know someone whose niece got Polio and will be in a wheelchair for the rest of her life. Her parents did not vaccinate. Sorry to be debbie downer but non vaxers make me very upset.
It's not being Debbie Downer when it's the honest truth that people don't want to face.
We vaccinate on the recommended schedule. You put your children and other's people children at risk when you don't vaccinate... Our daycare definitely requires up-to-date vaccinations to attend. We bring in our new record each time he gets a new shot.
I am not sure if they are required for day care but I am planning on vaccinating on a spread out schedule since I am wary vaccines in general. I haven't gotten too heavy into my research but I am planning on doing research on both sides.
I have found that a lot of the anti-vax things I have read seem very one sided, like they are trying to get a very stringent anti-vax agenda across. I would prefer to read something that presents both pros and cons or isn't written like vaccines are 100% bad. I do see the good in them and I will vax my child close to what is on schedule. I will definitely vax before age 2.
If anyone has any unbiased, factual sources please share!
I just watched the vaccine war on Netflix last night. It was interesting. I am still going to be vaccinating according to schedule, but it did cover both sides of the argument. My FIL is very anti-vac and as a result is making my H doubt them. I definitely put my foot down on this though. Just seeing a baby struggling to breathe from a case of pertussis is enough for me.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6. Surprisingly enough, our peditrician who is very well known and recommended in our area supports our decision. However, I am SAHM so I can't help as far as the daycare aspect goes.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my vaccine delayed children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
*Julie* Wife to Micheal and mama of 5, soon to be 6!*
You want an unbiased opinion?
Go to a childrens hospital where you will see sick and dying children who weren't vaccinated, all from very preventable diseases. Maybe you will also see the 1 in a million case where a child had a bad reaction to the vaccine but most likely not.
We vaccine according to the recommended schedule but I understand parents who do a bit of delayed schedule. No vaccines for two years seems extreme and dangerous to me.
Agree. I also know someone whose niece got Polio and will be in a wheelchair for the rest of her life. Her parents did not vaccinate. Sorry to be debbie downer but non vaxers make me very upset.
This is one of the worst things I have heard in awhile! How could you live with yourself as a parent, knowing that could have been avoided? How do you explain that to the child when they come to you with questions, because they will! This is just heart wrenching.
Vaccines are a social responsibility and I will never see it any other way. By vaccinating my own DD I am not only protecting her, but those who can not yet or may never be able to get vaccinated.
OP: This is the way I look at it. You will be hard pressed to find something that doesn't have risks and benefits. Are vaccines 100% safe? No, just read the information provided when you get them, there are risks. But the miniscule risk far outweighs the benefits in my opinion. We follow the CDC schedule with the exception of Hep B which we don't do in the hospital. We do Hep B once BFing is well established which for DD was at 2 weeks.
As far as daycare is concerned I guess I have to ask you this: would you want to send your unvaccinated child to a place where you can pretty much guarantee there will be others who are not vaccinated? If you are thinking of waiting I would advise you to start looking for doctors right now, because some will not even see you after 6 months if you don't vaccinate. My SIL is a pedi at a hospital and a family there recently turned down the PKU. My SIL called their pedi's office hoping the doctor could talk to them and change their mind. The pedi said if they are turning down that test tell them they are not welcome at our office.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my unvaccinated children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
I have a friend who was never vaccinated herself and does not vaccinate her daughter. Sadly after this baby is born I'm going to have to tell her she can't come around until my baby has started his/her vaccines. The problem is LOs can't get all their vaccines at once, so they are left unprotected.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6. Surprisingly enough, our peditrician who is very well known and recommended in our area supports our decision. However, I am SAHM so I can't help as far as the daycare aspect goes.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my vaccine delayed children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
Someone who gets a "giggle" at this is making clear her utter lack of adequate knowledge about immunization. Also, not vaccinating at all until 18 months? So.....would whooping cough in an infant be a giggle to you, too?
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my unvaccinated children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
I have a friend who was never vaccinated herself and does not vaccinate her daughter. Sadly after this baby is born I'm going to have to tell her she can't come around until my baby has started his/her vaccines. The problem is LOs can't get all their vaccines at once, so they are left unprotected.
But glad that gives you a giggle!
Exactly! Little babies who are exposed to unvaccinated children are at risk. So are older children and adults who have not been re-vaccinated and no longer have immunity, which is not regulated or checked as much since these people aren't seeing pediatricians regularly. So are people who cannot get vaccinations for medical reasons. People who do not vaccinate are directly responsible for cases of disease in these groups, sometimes as directly as your LO gives it to an LO with cancer playing at the same park or a tiny LO at daycare. It's not something to shrug off. It's something to pray about and consider how many LOs you want to kill.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number ofnbsp;vaccinations they recieve at one time,nbsp;and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time theynbsp;start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6.nbsp;Surprisingly enough, our peditrician who is very well knownnbsp;and recommendednbsp;in our area supports our decision. However, I am SAHM so I can't help as far as the daycare aspect goes.
I donbsp;kind of get anbsp;giggle at those who worry about mynbsp;vaccine delayednbsp;children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
Take for instant if your unvaccinated child gave my one year old measles, which can and is deadly. He's too young to be fully vaccinated for that which is why he is at risk.
This is why its s public health issue even when the majority does vaccinate. Not quite sure what part of that causes a giggle but I sure wont be if my child gets sick because of someone's irresponsible decision.
You know, I read the book and I read the response and the thing that struck me the most, was that I did not read into the book that way. I thought it was informative about the diseases and vaccines etc, but the points in the response never crossed my mind. I suppose if you read the book as anti-vaccinate, it might. But after each "sum up" section, I was always given the impression that he advocated getting the vaccine. :shrug:
It seems most of the concern with the alternative schedule is that it will "will likely decrease immunization
rates" because it requires more appts. but I find that's mostly based on barely getting some parents to bring their child in for well visits, and those aren't likely going to be the ones choosing an alternate schedule.
I think the only place I'm going with this, is that with both sources, it depends on your perspective, but either way, it's good to get all the vax.
I'm glad you posted this because honestly, I never picked up the book, just read the response.
I agree with Brachysira 100% and can not add anything except "get your kids vaccinated and quit reading all of this anti-vax BS on the web". I am a microbiologist and all of this anti-vax BS is driving me nuts! The anti-vaxers are the ones that are causing a resurgence of diseases and putting everyone at risk.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my unvaccinated children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
I have a friend who was never vaccinated herself and does not vaccinate her daughter. Sadly after this baby is born I'm going to have to tell her she can't come around until my baby has started his/her vaccines. The problem is LOs can't get all their vaccines at once, so they are left unprotected.
But glad that gives you a giggle!
It's not just that, either...
Unvaccinated children and adults are viable hosts for diseases to thrive and mutate within... the reason we have old strains of Pertussis evolving into new strains that aren't protected against by our current vaccines is because that bacteria is gaining more hosts to mutate within. The fewer hosts in which the bacteria can grow and mutate, the fewer strains that can develop. The majority of cases of Pertussis in vaccinated children in WA have been new strains being spread by the unvaccinated community.
*Spontaneous* OHSS diagnosed 08.06.2012 Right ovary removed 09.04.2012 via vertical laparotomy Essure implant placed on remaining tube 06.13.2013; successful followup scan 09.30.2013
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number ofnbsp;vaccinations they recieve at one time,nbsp;and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time theynbsp;start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6.nbsp;Surprisingly enough, our peditrician who is very well knownnbsp;and recommendednbsp;in our area supports our decision. However, I am SAHM so I can't help as far as the daycare aspect goes.
I donbsp;kind of get anbsp;giggle at those who worry about mynbsp;vaccine delayednbsp;children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
Take for instant if your unvaccinated child gave my one year old measles, which can and is deadly. He's too young to be fully vaccinated for that which is why he is at risk.
This is why its s public health issue even when the majority does vaccinate. Not quite sure what part of that causes a giggle but I sure wont be if my child gets sick because of someone's irresponsible decision.
Consider some of the examples of unvaccinated children causing epidemics here: https://shotofprevention.com/2011/04/12/why-worry-about-the-unvaccinated/. The article also notes that some people who do everything right and get vaccinated on schedule still get the disease from unvaccinated kids because the vaccine didn't work, because it doesn't in every single person. It just doesn't make sense to say "well, other people can go to hell because I did what I thought was best for my kids" when what is "best" for your children neither protects them from disease nor is there any evidence that not vaccinating keeps them healthy in any other way.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6. Surprisingly enough, our peditrician who is very well known and recommended in our area supports our decision. However, I am SAHM so I can't help as far as the daycare aspect goes.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my vaccine delayed children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
If my infant got whooping cough because you decided you didn't need to vaccinate your kid until a year and a half and that was something that gave you a "giggle", I would punch you square in your face.
If I wanted to hear the pitter-patter of little feet, I'd put shoes on the cat.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my vaccine delayed children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
Colin was a full term, healthy, seven pound baby who gained weight
every week. He was born on October 28, 2002, and weighed 10 pounds by
December 3 rd, when his mom, Pamela, took him to the hospital for
vomiting and a cry he had developed, which she felt indicated that he
was in pain. After examination at the hospital, Colin was sent home.
On December 6 th, baby Colin, presenting the same symptoms from his
visit a few days before, was admitted to the hospital with a diagnosis
of pneumonia.
Colin rapidly declined and was rushed to CHOP in Philadelphia. On
day three of his stay in the hospital, he was finally diagnosed with
pertussis. He lived until December 14 th, when life support was
terminated due to a hemorrhage in the brain. Colin was 47 days old. In
just a few days he had gone from being a healthy, growing, beautiful
baby boy to a baby with a fatal illness.
Colin was too young to be immunized and it?s not known where he contracted the disease.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6. Surprisingly enough, our peditrician who is very well known and recommended in our area supports our decision. However, I am SAHM so I can't help as far as the daycare aspect goes.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my vaccine delayed children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
If my infant got whooping cough because you decided you didn't need to vaccinate your kid until a year and a half and that was something that gave you a "giggle", I would punch you square in your face.
Agreed 100%. There are plenty of babies who are getting vaccinated on a regular schedule but are simply too young to have had certain vaccines yet. Your delayed vaccine schedule may put these vaccinated babies at risk. It's pretty disgusting that you can "giggle" at that, mommajewels87.
Re: Vaccines
Go to a childrens hospital where you will see sick and dying children who weren't vaccinated, all from very preventable diseases. Maybe you will also see the 1 in a million case where a child had a bad reaction to the vaccine but most likely not.
We vaccine according to the recommended schedule but I understand parents who do a bit of delayed schedule. No vaccines for two years seems extreme and dangerous to me.
Sometimes there are really not two equal sides to each story.
And you know, there is a reason that doctors go to medical school and spend years and years learning about medicine. It means something, and an hour or two of googling does not make you a medical expert qualified to interpret clinical studies.
LFAF Summer 2016 Awards:
Agree. I also know someone whose niece got Polio and will be in a wheelchair for the rest of her life. Her parents did not vaccinate. Sorry to be debbie downer but non vaxers make me very upset.
Love this link about Dr. Sears you gave: https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/123/1/e164.full
He's pandering to the masses with a "mother knows best" message. You can't have mother's intuition about whether your child is at risk from disease or a vaccine like you do when you sense the neighbor is a little creepy. Definitely recommend reading this article if you think Dr. Sears is the best source.
It's not being Debbie Downer when it's the honest truth that people don't want to face.
We vaccinate on the recommended schedule. You put your children and other's people children at risk when you don't vaccinate... Our daycare definitely requires up-to-date vaccinations to attend. We bring in our new record each time he gets a new shot.
I just watched the vaccine war on Netflix last night. It was interesting. I am still going to be vaccinating according to schedule, but it did cover both sides of the argument. My FIL is very anti-vac and as a result is making my H doubt them. I definitely put my foot down on this though. Just seeing a baby struggling to breathe from a case of pertussis is enough for me.
We vaccinate on a delayed schedule, limit the number of vaccinations they recieve at one time, and do not start vaccinations at all until around 18mos. They do eventually recieve all of their vaccinations and are fully vaccinated by the time they start school. This is the way we've done it with all 5 of our children and it's the way we will do with with LO6. Surprisingly enough, our peditrician who is very well known and recommended in our area supports our decision. However, I am SAHM so I can't help as far as the daycare aspect goes.
I do kind of get a giggle at those who worry about my vaccine delayed children exposing their vaccinated children to certain illness... but I'm going to play nice.
This is one of the worst things I have heard in awhile! How could you live with yourself as a parent, knowing that could have been avoided? How do you explain that to the child when they come to you with questions, because they will! This is just heart wrenching.
Vaccines are a social responsibility and I will never see it any other way. By vaccinating my own DD I am not only protecting her, but those who can not yet or may never be able to get vaccinated.
OP: This is the way I look at it. You will be hard pressed to find something that doesn't have risks and benefits. Are vaccines 100% safe? No, just read the information provided when you get them, there are risks. But the miniscule risk far outweighs the benefits in my opinion. We follow the CDC schedule with the exception of Hep B which we don't do in the hospital. We do Hep B once BFing is well established which for DD was at 2 weeks.
As far as daycare is concerned I guess I have to ask you this: would you want to send your unvaccinated child to a place where you can pretty much guarantee there will be others who are not vaccinated? If you are thinking of waiting I would advise you to start looking for doctors right now, because some will not even see you after 6 months if you don't vaccinate. My SIL is a pedi at a hospital and a family there recently turned down the PKU. My SIL called their pedi's office hoping the doctor could talk to them and change their mind. The pedi said if they are turning down that test tell them they are not welcome at our office.
I have a friend who was never vaccinated herself and does not vaccinate her daughter. Sadly after this baby is born I'm going to have to tell her she can't come around until my baby has started his/her vaccines. The problem is LOs can't get all their vaccines at once, so they are left unprotected.
But glad that gives you a giggle!
This is of course not unbiased either, but this is a really interesting response to Dr. Sears. It goes bullet by bullet addressing his arguments.
https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/123/1/e164.full
Someone who gets a "giggle" at this is making clear her utter lack of adequate knowledge about immunization. Also, not vaccinating at all until 18 months? So.....would whooping cough in an infant be a giggle to you, too?
Exactly! Little babies who are exposed to unvaccinated children are at risk. So are older children and adults who have not been re-vaccinated and no longer have immunity, which is not regulated or checked as much since these people aren't seeing pediatricians regularly. So are people who cannot get vaccinations for medical reasons. People who do not vaccinate are directly responsible for cases of disease in these groups, sometimes as directly as your LO gives it to an LO with cancer playing at the same park or a tiny LO at daycare. It's not something to shrug off. It's something to pray about and consider how many LOs you want to kill.
Take for instant if your unvaccinated child gave my one year old measles, which can and is deadly. He's too young to be fully vaccinated for that which is why he is at risk.
This is why its s public health issue even when the majority does vaccinate. Not quite sure what part of that causes a giggle but I sure wont be if my child gets sick because of someone's irresponsible decision.
I'm glad you posted this because honestly, I never picked up the book, just read the response.
It's not just that, either...
Unvaccinated children and adults are viable hosts for diseases to thrive and mutate within... the reason we have old strains of Pertussis evolving into new strains that aren't protected against by our current vaccines is because that bacteria is gaining more hosts to mutate within. The fewer hosts in which the bacteria can grow and mutate, the fewer strains that can develop. The majority of cases of Pertussis in vaccinated children in WA have been new strains being spread by the unvaccinated community.
Right ovary removed 09.04.2012 via vertical laparotomy
Essure implant placed on remaining tube 06.13.2013; successful followup scan 09.30.2013
Consider some of the examples of unvaccinated children causing epidemics here: https://shotofprevention.com/2011/04/12/why-worry-about-the-unvaccinated/. The article also notes that some people who do everything right and get vaccinated on schedule still get the disease from unvaccinated kids because the vaccine didn't work, because it doesn't in every single person. It just doesn't make sense to say "well, other people can go to hell because I did what I thought was best for my kids" when what is "best" for your children neither protects them from disease nor is there any evidence that not vaccinating keeps them healthy in any other way.
If my infant got whooping cough because you decided you didn't need to vaccinate your kid until a year and a half and that was something that gave you a "giggle", I would punch you square in your face.
Colin was a full term, healthy, seven pound baby who gained weight every week. He was born on October 28, 2002, and weighed 10 pounds by December 3 rd, when his mom, Pamela, took him to the hospital for vomiting and a cry he had developed, which she felt indicated that he was in pain. After examination at the hospital, Colin was sent home.
On December 6 th, baby Colin, presenting the same symptoms from his visit a few days before, was admitted to the hospital with a diagnosis of pneumonia.
Colin rapidly declined and was rushed to CHOP in Philadelphia. On day three of his stay in the hospital, he was finally diagnosed with pertussis. He lived until December 14 th, when life support was terminated due to a hemorrhage in the brain. Colin was 47 days old. In just a few days he had gone from being a healthy, growing, beautiful baby boy to a baby with a fatal illness.
Colin was too young to be immunized and it?s not known where he contracted the disease.
Oh yeah, hilarious!
Agreed 100%. There are plenty of babies who are getting vaccinated on a regular schedule but are simply too young to have had certain vaccines yet. Your delayed vaccine schedule may put these vaccinated babies at risk. It's pretty disgusting that you can "giggle" at that, mommajewels87.