A CP for your Saturday

NatesLady1309

Tell it like is. [Poll]

pinkshades05

I have nothing against you, BUT this poll is kind of silly. If you want to be here then stay. This is up to you. FWIW I can't remember what you said that got flamed.

ETA: I went back and re-read what happened. I think the moms on this board have more than a right to be upset/hurt/angry/etc. You really earned their anger.

NatesLady1309

I made it because I don't really want to be flamed ALL THE FREAKING TIME for my every opinion. There's plenty of things I've seen others post that I don't agree with but I don't flame the pants off of them every. single. time. I'd rather not stick around if that's what's going to constantly happen because that's just depressing and unhelpful. What's done is done. Some people hate me now. I get that. I'd like to move on if that's possible. Guess I'm wondering if that's possible.

livinginashoe

Honestly, I still think you owe Lancy an apology. The way you spoke to her was abhorrent. If you want to spout off ignorant opinions, go to town. But to say what you did about her without displaying even a shred of remorse, yeah. I'm going to flame the ever loving heIl out of you. Can't stand the heat, get out of my kitchen.

lancyjo

NatesLady1309:

I made it because I don't really want to be flamed ALL THE FREAKING TIME for my every opinion. There's plenty of things I've seen others post that I don't agree with but I don't flame the pants off of them every. single. time. I'd rather not stick around if that's what's going to constantly happen because that's just depressing and unhelpful. What's done is done. Some people hate me now. I get that. I'd like to move on if that's possible. Guess I'm wondering if that's possible.

...and the insults you hurled at working moms were in no way depressing and unhelpful.

Do you realize what you did to me personally in your accusatory attacks? How you made me feel like the worst mother on Earth because I work to afford Aria the lifestyle we want to give her? That you made me feel less than human because sometimes I need antidepressants? Did you consider for one second that you'd make me feel unworthy to be a mother? Do you realize that I went home that day, held my daughter and cried? My husband would have throttled you had he known you in person. Instead, he held me and tried to pick up the pieces.

No, I'm not getting over it anytime soon. You could never come back to this board and I wouldn't bat an eye.

Edited for grammar.

lancyjo

livinginashoe:

Honestly, I still think you owe Lancy an apology. The way you spoke to her was abhorrent. If you want to spout off ignorant opinions, go to town. But to say what you did about her without displaying even a shred of remorse, yeah. I'm going to flame the ever loving heIl out of you. Can't stand the heat, get out of my kitchen.

Thanks, Shoe.

fredpuma

If you want to move on, then move on. But you can't control how other people feel. You didn't just push buttons with those comments about working moms, you smashed them with a sledge hammer. I don't think people are flaming every single opinion you have. Just the ones that come off holier than thou, which brings them right back to your lovely statement that if a mom is going to work, she might as well just not have kids since someone else is going to raise them. If you weren't prepared to get some backlash for that incredibly hurtful, incredibly judgmental, and incredibly narrow minded statement, then maybe you shouldn't have said it.

Favority

livinginashoe:

Honestly, I still think you owe Lancy an apology. The way you spoke to her was abhorrent. If you want to spout off ignorant opinions, go to town. But to say what you did about her without displaying even a shred of remorse, yeah. I'm going to flame the ever loving heIl out of you. Can't stand the heat, get out of my kitchen.

This.  

Jen0204

There's no need to set up a poll for us. I think it's pretty much a given that many of us will never forget what you said or look at anything you post in the same manner. You were rude, hurtful, and disrespectful and never once bothered to even say anything like "I never thought about it that way" when people explained why they like working or anything even remotely remorseful for making people feel like crap. Yet now you're all pissy because others are using your words to make you feel like crap? That's rich. 

If you don't like people responding to you and including what you've said previously then I don't see this board being a good place for you. But that's only a decision that you can make, not one that any poll will solve for you. If your poll actually means "will all of you forget what I said even though I've shown no remorse for making many women feel like crap" my answer is a resounding NO. 

Shawnee11507

I'm not even working right now but you really rubbed me the wrong way with your judgey self-righteousness. I probably won't ever respond to your posts or take any advice from you because you seem awfully ignorant to me now.

NatesLady1309

I actually think it's interesting that none of you seem to find any difference at all that I clearly, in the many posts that followed, said that it's not working moms PERIOD. It's working moms who are working even though it's not actually needed to cover the necessities. It's for the extras. I realize "the extras" can be defined different ways. But it's silly for many of you to think I just plain hate working moms or something, because that's not true. I don't hate anyone for that matter. I just don't get the whole "I'm working just so we can have extra" thing. You've spread it to include any moms who work, period, for any reason, and that is never what I meant or said.

Jen0204

Oh my god, you STILL don't get it! The fact that you judge moms who might be able to squeak by without working but choose to have a lifestyle with vacations, mo eh to pay for college, for a nice house in a good school district, or any other "extras" is still ridiculous. If that's not what YOU choose, great, but to tell me - in your exact words - that my relationship with my daughters will never be what it could be is insulting, judgmental, and just WRONG. 

Jen0204

And even if you don't judge moms who "have" to work, your message is still "we'll, I get why you're working and respect that, but your relationship with your kid ill never be as good as mine. Sucks to be you!". You don't get why that's offensive to the same moms who you're supposedly not judging?

lancyjo

Jen0204:

And even if you don't judge moms who "have" to work, your message is still "we'll, I get why you're working and respect that, but your relationship with your kid ill never be as good as mine. Sucks to be you!". You don't get why that's offensive to the same moms who you're supposedly not judging?

Well said Jen. Unfortunately, you can't reason with a twit. Moving on.

k.linn

NatesLady1309:

I actually think it's interesting that none of you seem to find any difference at all that I clearly, in the many posts that followed, said that it's not working moms PERIOD. It's working moms who are working even though it's not actually needed to cover the necessities. It's for the extras. I realize "the extras" can be defined different ways. But it's silly for many of you to think I just plain hate working moms or something, because that's not true. I don't hate anyone for that matter. I just don't get the whole "I'm working just so we can have extra" thing. You've spread it to include any moms who work, period, for any reason, and that is never what I meant or said.

Seriously?

How do you not get that THIS is what grates on people? It is shitty to say that moms who work (regardless of the reason) are inferior.  Honestly, I have encountered plenty of SAHMs who were not any better at mothering than their working counterparts. (But would I ever make sweeping generalizations about SAHMs? Nope, because that's not fair, nor is it my business). I work and I don't have to--my salary is purely for the extras, and I can't say I'm hurt by your opinions in this slightest--I think it's just a display of self-righteous, narrow-minded judgement. I know I'm a good mom who spends plenty of quality time with my children, and I take pride in the fact that I will be able to help support them throughout life with all of those "extras."

laura.noel

Jen0204:

And even if you don't judge moms who "have" to work, your message is still "we'll, I get why you're working and respect that, but your relationship with your kid ill never be as good as mine. Sucks to be you!". You don't get why that's offensive to the same moms who you're supposedly not judging?

Thanks, Jen, you said what I was thinking. 

 NatesLady, you may not have realized it when you said it, but many of the working moms took your comment to mean that you think we're not going to have good relationships with our children because we work, even if you have judged our need to be worthy. And that's one of the most hurtful things you can say to a mother, especially a relatively new mother like most of us are. I think you'll find a lot of people are going to hang on to that hurt.

I didn't vote, because I think the poll is super unnecessarily melodramatic. But I wouldn't count on any forgiving and forgetting any time soon.  

fredpuma

So, if you HAVE to work, it's ok, the relationship you have with your kid will be just fine, and everything is even with sahm's. But if you DON'T HAVE to work, your relationship will suffer, someone else is raising your kid, and you probably just shouldn't have had them in the first place. Got it, thanks. You're crazy! It's either ok or it's not ok. You can't put qualifiers on whether you think someone else is raising my kid for me. Good God, you're a sanctimonious bich.

MrsGlaedr

What you said was not only hurtful, but it was also none of your damm business. It wont be forgotten, and, speaking for myself, it wont be forgiven because Lancy is a great person and didnt deserve any of that.

Raise your child however you please and let other raise them theirs.  

runrinserepeat

Ok, NatesLady, here's what. You seem to respect me, so hopefully you'll take this to heart.

I'm a working mother. DH SAH. Idk how you feel about that, but I was definitely rubbed the wrong way by your UO. Whatever, though. It's an UO, and that happens. I do think your comments to LancyJo were out of line, though, and like Shoe said, I think you should consider re-reading that thread from her point of view and think about apologizing to her.

Other than that, you had an UO. It happens. If you're truly not sorry for anything you've said, then just own it and move on. I don't think there's any reason for you to leave, but I think you need to own your opinions. Just like I think working mothers can try to not be bothered by your judgment of them, you can try to not be bothered by everyone's judgment of you. 

katea81

Can someone please repost the thread? I can't access it through my computer for whatever reason.

Thanks.

 

 

NatesLady1309

kleMcK:

Ok, NatesLady, here's what. You seem to respect me, so hopefully you'll take this to heart.

I'm a working mother. DH SAH. Idk how you feel about that, but I was definitely rubbed the wrong way by your UO. Whatever, though. It's an UO, and that happens. I do think your comments to LancyJo were out of line, though, and like Shoe said, I think you should consider re-reading that thread from her point of view and think about apologizing to her.

Other than that, you had an UO. It happens. If you're truly not sorry for anything you've said, then just own it and move on. I don't think there's any reason for you to leave, but I think you need to own your opinions. Just like I think working mothers can try to not be bothered by your judgment of them, you can try to not be bothered by everyone's judgment of you. 

 

I do respect you more than the average poster on this board. Reason being, I've seen you have some strong opinions in the past, question a lot of things, and the like. I think you're bold. I don't think you always flow with the current and I dig that.

I get that you don't agree with me, and what I respect the most is that you've never flamed the pants off of me for it. You've only "spoken" calmly from what I remember and not acted all hot and bothered like the majority of the posters before you. I may call you "the voice of reason." Hmmmm...

Shawnee11507

katea81:

Can someone please repost the thread? I can't access it through my computer for whatever reason.

Thanks.

 

 

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https://community.thebump.com/cs/ks/forums/1/68996198/ShowThread.aspx

 

NatnDyl

I think you were pretty brutal to working moms and lancy, to make it personal was so unnecessary. And to comment on anyone's need for antidepressants is extremely rude. I also happen to be on antidepressants. I think that there is enough stigma in the world about antidepressants, ppd, and mental illness in general. It's disgusting to make someone feel that a medical problem like ppd is their fault.

kittyh8r

I was just thinking yesterday, "This woman just needs to GBCB and move on." No one is ever going to respect you on TB again. You've earned the anger. 

I am a SAHM, and I was put off by your comments. 

Favority

EmmaBoBemma:

I was just thinking yesterday, "This woman just needs to GBCB and move on." No one is ever going to respect you on TB again. You've earned the anger. 

I am a SAHM, and I was put off by your comments. 

I am also a SAHM and I was thinking the same thing. While I enjoy hearing an opinion different to mine, I think the way it was delivered was out of line.  Like others have said, you are welcome to your opinion and to say whatever you want, but so are the rest of us. Also not ALL of your posts are flamed, just the ones that are flame or side-eye worthy. If you don't want to hear what other people think of your parenting choices, don't post them. 

bethanyturon

Nates, I think you should stay.  I think it would really be a shame to let people who are emotionally abusive win.  It has happened too much, and every time someone else leaves, they get reinforced for this behavior.  Ignore the immaturity, learn what you can from the conversation, and feel bad for those people who want to get emotionally wrapped up in things that don't actually impact their own lives.

I never spoke on the original FFFC topic, but just to let you know... I am a working mom, and DH stays at home.  Obviously, your opinion affected me, because I view people as just that - people, and each family has to do what is right for them individually.  Just because someone has a vagina shouldn't automatically make them the one (if any) who should stay home with a child.  We all have different emotional make-ups.  Some of us make better parents when we have a variety of activities in our lives, some of us make better parents just parenting all day.  I think people had an issue because there was an assumption that every female could be happy doing that if they made the decision to have a child.  Even in ancient societies, this is not how life worked.  We all have a different role to play in the world, life works best when we realize that and support each other with following their own paths.

aracelyluna

i hate u

kittyh8r

bethanyturon:

Nates, I think you should stay.  I think it would really be a shame to let people who are emotionally abusive win.  It has happened too much, and every time someone else leaves, they get reinforced for this behavior.  Ignore the immaturity, learn what you can from the conversation, and feel bad for those people who want to get emotionally wrapped up in things that don't actually impact their own lives.

I never spoke on the original FFFC topic, but just to let you know... I am a working mom, and DH stays at home.  Obviously, your opinion affected me, because I view people as just that - people, and each family has to do what is right for them individually.  Just because someone has a vagina shouldn't automatically make them the one (if any) who should stay home with a child.  We all have different emotional make-ups.  Some of us make better parents when we have a variety of activities in our lives, some of us make better parents just parenting all day.  I think people had an issue because there was an assumption that every female could be happy doing that if they made the decision to have a child.  Even in ancient societies, this is not how life worked.  We all have a different role to play in the world, life works best when we realize that and support each other with following their own paths.

 

Okay. While I do think that women on TB sometimes take things waaay further than they should have just to put someone down...I don't think that's the case with Nateslady. She made comments that were down right flame worthy. She deserved the things that were said to her. No one is going to have respect for someone who tells them that daycare is raising their child. 

 

OP- if you want to stay, get a new account and start over. If you don't, you'll always get flamed. 

bethanyturon

The problem with flaming someone who isn't intentionally trying to create drama is that it generally ends up just damaging relationships instead of helping the person to see where they are looking at things incorrectly.  Personally, I don't care how rude someone's comments are, I will do my best to respond with rational, mature thoughts.  In my experience, that's got the best chance of changing someone's viewpoints, and if that doesn't work, it's on them, not me.  I guess part of me imagines that DD is experiencing the energy I create, all the time, even if she doesn't hear it.  So I imagine she was there listening to the conversation I am having and understanding what is being said.  If I wouldn't be proud to have her hear what I'm saying, then I probably need to reword myself.

Jen0204

bethanyturon:

Nates, I think you should stay. nbsp;I think it would really be a shame to let people who are emotionally abusive win. nbsp;It has happened too much, and every time someone else leaves, they get reinforced for this behavior. nbsp;Ignore the immaturity, learn what you can from the conversation, and feel bad for those people who want to get emotionally wrapped up in things that don't actually impact their own lives.

So recalling what she's said previously and thinking that it's not okay how she approached things and showed such utter disregard for how insulting she was being is emotionally abusive? Okay...

Jen0204

I'm completely good with what I said in this post an the previous one. She asked why women would choose to work if they didn't have to, was given genuine, thoughtful responses and still came back with the "well your relationship with your kids won't be all it could be then".

You're assuming that she wanted a discussion and was open to seeing other viewpoints. In the originally post she made it abundantly clear that's not the case. Normally I agree with you, and I think this board has had a lot of debates some heated and everyone is fine the next day. This was completely different.

bethanyturon

I understand that it's frustrating when a person's opinion is clearly in the vast majority and doesn't seem open to reason.  My issue is how people react to that frustration.  Name calling, insults, ostracization, to me, put ourselves to a place that is no better than the other person.  In my mind it should be enough to simply say that you feel the other person's comments are closed-minded, rude, offensive, etc and that your opinion of them has now fallen drastically.

aglenn

Feel free to stay, whatever. I do recommend that you read the book, "The Feminine Mistake." It might clear up some of your confusion about why women work.

livinginashoe

bethanyturon:

In my mind it should be enough to simply say that you feel the other person's comments are closed-minded, rude, offensive, etc and that your opinion of them has now fallen drastically.

You say potato, I say snatchface. 

MrsGlaedr

She personally attacked a fellow bumpie for being BRAVE enough to get on medication to be  better mother. She was cruel to this person and in no way open to opinions, she was being downright hurtful and sent that women home crying. If I knew this person IRL I WOULD ostracize her because I dont care to be around anyone like that.

And ftr, if Kyle were to hear me say any of those things? Thatd be fine by me. I hope when he grows up he feels the courage to stand up for others being put down. 

livinginashoe

To be clear, I voted that you should stay. I don't understand why you care what we all think. Also, since I haven't heard more from Lancy and because I saw you were sending her a pm, I'm hoping that you came to your senses and tried to make nice. As far as I'm concerned, if Lancy says we're good we're good. My issue isn't with your (ignorant) opinion. It's with the way you treated Lancy.

MeganSony

I'm really confused... Is this still stemming back to the FFFC that happened a while back? I've clearly missed something. But you've been participating since the whole "moms shouldn't work just to have nice things" bit. Why is this coming up now?

Also, I'm surprised that you were surprised you got flamed. Considering probably 1/2 of us work.

mkarns

Alright, I'm all caught up on the drama. I voted you should stay. Check it:

We aren't always going to agree with you. That's a given. So you stirred the place up. NBD. Where you have to draw the line is the Lancy thing. Don't make up hurtful things about people. A disagreement, an argument, name calling...All go on message boards. People get over that kind of stuff. What they can't get over is an isult on a personal issue.

Telling someone with PPD that they brought it on themselves is WRONG WRONG WRONG. It is exactly what is says- A Disorder. I assume you know you were wrong now. I assume you apologized. Take everyone's criticism and move on (on this board). It's for the best. Had you made that mistake to someone who didn't have support it really could end tragically.

Will everyone like you? Nope. People voted you off the island...But you sureashell aren't the only one. Stick around, let things blow over. Try not to write anything douchey for a few weeks. Or take ownership of being douchey. One or the other.

NatesLady1309

MeganSony:

Why is this coming up now? Also, I'm surprised that you were surprised you got flamed. Considering probably 1/2 of us work.

Someone posted earlier that their weekend is yucky. Part of it was because they said they were stuck working both days this weekend. I replied to the post saying I was sorry her weekend wasn't going well. She replied to my comment with some serious attitude, even though I was being sincere. So that's why it's coming up now. This is not the first time I've posted something and gotten crap for it even though it has nothing to do with the original FFFC thread. That's why it's come up now.

I'm not surprised I was flamed. I'm shocked that a group of grown women can't put on their big girl panties and move on. 

NM86

bethanyturon:

I understand that it's frustrating when a person's opinion is clearly in the vast majority and doesn't seem open to reason.  My issue is how people react to that frustration.  Name calling, insults, ostracization, to me, put ourselves to a place that is no better than the other person.  In my mind it should be enough to simply say that you feel the other person's comments are closed-minded, rude, offensive, etc and that your opinion of them has now fallen drastically.

Lena122

NatesLady, when I read the OP I thought "Sure, stay, why not? We all have bad days and say dumb sh!t" even though I very distinctly remember your comments from that original FFFC and think they were out of line.

But then I read your follow up comments on this thread. And I think you should get out.