UO?

mrsodonnell12

RachelG1016:

mrsodonnell12:

hansonam446:

MrsRiceARoni:

nycitygirl1:

mrsodonnell12:

nycitygirl1:

mrsodonnell12:

Not supporting gay marriage DOES NOT equal anti gay.

I think a lot of people might disagree with you there, since getting married affords certain benefits (both financial, social, legal, and emotional) and this is civil rights issue more than anything else. I think we covered "separate but equal" (which is a fallacy) back when schools and water fountains were segregated and this is the same thing.

You have a right to your opinion and me to mine, but I don't like when people claim that stripping someone of basic rights that all other heterosexual people have is somehow not "anti-gay." By that same argument, a white person who thinks blacks should also go to their own schools would not be "anti-black."

 

Hmm.... thats not true at all. I posted this in the UO thread because I know that it's an UO. I understand that if you are not religious then you will not understand my reasoning... which I clearly explained in my OPs. We look at things/life differently. I completely disagree that this is the same thing as segregated schools and drinking fountains.

It is wrong according to my religious beliefs. There is really no reason for me to even be discussing this because if you do not have the same religious convictions then it is nearly impossible to even have the conversation.

I understand that you posted this on UO. That said, you can't expect to make anti-gay remarks and not have anyone challenge you about this. I believe I was respectful in my response, despite how ignorant I find your comments.

I also understand this goes against your religious beliefs, which you are entitled to. However, here in America we have a separation of Church and State. Thank goodness we do not live in a country governed by the Church -- such as some of the countries in the Middle East where religion is used as a weapon to keep other people down who may have differing beliefs, be of a different gender, etc.The whole point of separation of Church and State is that it allows religious freedom for everyone while protecting people of different beliefs EQUALLY UNDER THE LAW.

My point is that marriage is NOT a religious institution as it is recognized by the American government and has an impact on things like taxes. I respect that homosexuals will not be getting married by within the church you attend - I don't take issue with that. However, your church's religious beliefs should not stop a homosexual couple from being able to walk down to City Hall and get married, like all of the rest of us heterosexual folks can.

I find it interesting that you don't see the similarities between the discrimination of blacks and the discrimination against homosexuals.

I find it comical when people use the idea of seperation of church and state to try to keep churches from influencing the government, but at the same time have no problem with the government attacking churches. As for marrige not being a religious institution, to those of us that believe that God created marriage it is. He created marriage far before government ever existed so he gets to determine how it is defined. Obviously that wont stop the government from trying to change how marriage is defined, but atleast for now most states still recognize marriage as being between a man and a woman like it was when it was originally started back with Adam and Eve.

 

While I understand what you're saying, God didn't "create" marriage. It was around long before Christianity. I'm not going to get into a religious debate but ancient societies such as the Egyptians and Greeks had marriage ceremonies so Christianity doesn't get the exclusive rights to the word. 

Adam and Eve were before the Greeks and Egyptians.

Adam and Eve weren't Christians. Christ wasn't born until thousands of years later.

]

You said "God didn't create marriage".... God created Adam and Eve.... they are the first example of marriage in the bible. I never said anything about Christians creating marriage.... I said God created marriage.

jdm7

mamak0328:

knittylady:

jdm7:

Necack:

 Im the same way. I live in pittsburgh and I hate the Steelers which is like swearing around here. I hate going to game parties for the exact same reason. In truth inmate all sports, fortunately so does DH. But my whole family, and surrounding community for that matter, acts like sports are the end all be all of life. I hate it. Most of the time, I really could give two craps about teams and the drama that surrounds them, but the penn state situation isn't so much about the team as it is about those poor children, and that is what gets my attention. 

I grew up in Pittsburgh (moved away 5 years ago), you shut your potty mouth!!! LOL  

That's what I'm sayin'!  I was born and raised in Pittsburgh (also moved away now, but it will always be home!).  Pretty sure my first word was Steelers, lol.

I can't stand the Steelers!  Ravens fan here!  I have a good friend who is a Steelers fan.  Things get interesting during football season.   

I now live in the Cleveland area. My husband is a Browns fan. I f'ing hate the Browns.

Here's an UO - I don't get how women will change their favorite team (if you're a fan of a team) because it's what their husband likes. F that, I won't be wearing this orange/brown junk up here. I scrub my d@mn hands after I touch it because I bought him something. I bleed too much black and gold to change. We accept each others baseball teams (since they're not direct competitors), and he likes the Pens and if I have to like basketball (which I don't) it's the Cavs, but Pens, Pirates and Steelers always win my heart first and foremost, no matter where I live. 

jdm7

lilobaby:

MrsRiceARoni:

I find it comical when people use the idea of seperation of church and state to try to keep churches from influencing the government, but at the same time have no problem with the government attacking churches. As for marrige not being a religious institution, to those of us that believe that God created marriage it is. He created marriage far before government ever existed so he gets to determine how it is defined. Obviously that wont stop the government from trying to change how marriage is defined, but atleast for now most states still recognize marriage as being between a man and a woman like it was when it was originally started back with Adam and Eve.

Not really sure how government is "attacking churches" here. As far as I know, no state government is requiring churches to allow gay couples to be married in the church. I wouldn't vote for an amendment that forces churches to perform marriage ceremonies for gay couples. If you want to attend a church that doesn't accept marriage equality than that is up to you. You are a member of that church and what happens in that church is important to you. My problem is that your church is forcing its beliefs on to me, someone who does not attend your church, does not believe in your God, and believes that two consenting adults who love each other should have the same rights as anyone else. As long as the governments have the power to accept and ratify marriage than that government has an obligation to ensure that all of its citizens are represented equally under the law.

I wouldn't say the government is attacking churches... but if you want to look at it in the light of a current situation that any business that provides insurance MUST cover birth control. The Catholic Church is against contraception of any kind, if it is due to this belief that they do not cover birth control for any of their employees. I think the government forcing anyone that they must offer things that do not coincide with their beliefs could be seen as a government attack on the church.  

RachelG1016

mrsodonnell12:

RachelG1016:

mrsodonnell12:

hansonam446:

MrsRiceARoni:

nycitygirl1:

mrsodonnell12:

nycitygirl1:

mrsodonnell12:

Not supporting gay marriage DOES NOT equal anti gay.

I think a lot of people might disagree with you there, since getting married affords certain benefits (both financial, social, legal, and emotional) and this is civil rights issue more than anything else. I think we covered "separate but equal" (which is a fallacy) back when schools and water fountains were segregated and this is the same thing.

You have a right to your opinion and me to mine, but I don't like when people claim that stripping someone of basic rights that all other heterosexual people have is somehow not "anti-gay." By that same argument, a white person who thinks blacks should also go to their own schools would not be "anti-black."

 

Hmm.... thats not true at all. I posted this in the UO thread because I know that it's an UO. I understand that if you are not religious then you will not understand my reasoning... which I clearly explained in my OPs. We look at things/life differently. I completely disagree that this is the same thing as segregated schools and drinking fountains.

It is wrong according to my religious beliefs. There is really no reason for me to even be discussing this because if you do not have the same religious convictions then it is nearly impossible to even have the conversation.

I understand that you posted this on UO. That said, you can't expect to make anti-gay remarks and not have anyone challenge you about this. I believe I was respectful in my response, despite how ignorant I find your comments.

I also understand this goes against your religious beliefs, which you are entitled to. However, here in America we have a separation of Church and State. Thank goodness we do not live in a country governed by the Church -- such as some of the countries in the Middle East where religion is used as a weapon to keep other people down who may have differing beliefs, be of a different gender, etc.The whole point of separation of Church and State is that it allows religious freedom for everyone while protecting people of different beliefs EQUALLY UNDER THE LAW.

My point is that marriage is NOT a religious institution as it is recognized by the American government and has an impact on things like taxes. I respect that homosexuals will not be getting married by within the church you attend - I don't take issue with that. However, your church's religious beliefs should not stop a homosexual couple from being able to walk down to City Hall and get married, like all of the rest of us heterosexual folks can.

I find it interesting that you don't see the similarities between the discrimination of blacks and the discrimination against homosexuals.

I find it comical when people use the idea of seperation of church and state to try to keep churches from influencing the government, but at the same time have no problem with the government attacking churches. As for marrige not being a religious institution, to those of us that believe that God created marriage it is. He created marriage far before government ever existed so he gets to determine how it is defined. Obviously that wont stop the government from trying to change how marriage is defined, but atleast for now most states still recognize marriage as being between a man and a woman like it was when it was originally started back with Adam and Eve.

 

While I understand what you're saying, God didn't "create" marriage. It was around long before Christianity. I'm not going to get into a religious debate but ancient societies such as the Egyptians and Greeks had marriage ceremonies so Christianity doesn't get the exclusive rights to the word. 

Adam and Eve were before the Greeks and Egyptians.

Adam and Eve weren't Christians. Christ wasn't born until thousands of years later.

]

You said "God didn't create marriage".... God created Adam and Eve.... they are the first example of marriage in the bible. I never said anything about Christians creating marriage.... I said God created marriage.

Sorry... I jumped in mid conversation. I didn't say anything about marriage before this other than saying that if people want to have a marriage ceremony in a church  they can but that everyone could have a civil ceremony to get benefits like insurance and tax breaks. That allows for same sex couples to get the same rights as opposite sex couples while keeping the sanctity of marriage between a man and a woman.

....slowly backing out of thread....

mrsodonnell12

RachelG1016:

mrsodonnell12:

RachelG1016:

mrsodonnell12:

hansonam446:

MrsRiceARoni:

nycitygirl1:

mrsodonnell12:

nycitygirl1:

mrsodonnell12:

Not supporting gay marriage DOES NOT equal anti gay.

I think a lot of people might disagree with you there, since getting married affords certain benefits (both financial, social, legal, and emotional) and this is civil rights issue more than anything else. I think we covered "separate but equal" (which is a fallacy) back when schools and water fountains were segregated and this is the same thing.

You have a right to your opinion and me to mine, but I don't like when people claim that stripping someone of basic rights that all other heterosexual people have is somehow not "anti-gay." By that same argument, a white person who thinks blacks should also go to their own schools would not be "anti-black."

 

Hmm.... thats not true at all. I posted this in the UO thread because I know that it's an UO. I understand that if you are not religious then you will not understand my reasoning... which I clearly explained in my OPs. We look at things/life differently. I completely disagree that this is the same thing as segregated schools and drinking fountains.

It is wrong according to my religious beliefs. There is really no reason for me to even be discussing this because if you do not have the same religious convictions then it is nearly impossible to even have the conversation.

I understand that you posted this on UO. That said, you can't expect to make anti-gay remarks and not have anyone challenge you about this. I believe I was respectful in my response, despite how ignorant I find your comments.

I also understand this goes against your religious beliefs, which you are entitled to. However, here in America we have a separation of Church and State. Thank goodness we do not live in a country governed by the Church -- such as some of the countries in the Middle East where religion is used as a weapon to keep other people down who may have differing beliefs, be of a different gender, etc.The whole point of separation of Church and State is that it allows religious freedom for everyone while protecting people of different beliefs EQUALLY UNDER THE LAW.

My point is that marriage is NOT a religious institution as it is recognized by the American government and has an impact on things like taxes. I respect that homosexuals will not be getting married by within the church you attend - I don't take issue with that. However, your church's religious beliefs should not stop a homosexual couple from being able to walk down to City Hall and get married, like all of the rest of us heterosexual folks can.

I find it interesting that you don't see the similarities between the discrimination of blacks and the discrimination against homosexuals.

I find it comical when people use the idea of seperation of church and state to try to keep churches from influencing the government, but at the same time have no problem with the government attacking churches. As for marrige not being a religious institution, to those of us that believe that God created marriage it is. He created marriage far before government ever existed so he gets to determine how it is defined. Obviously that wont stop the government from trying to change how marriage is defined, but atleast for now most states still recognize marriage as being between a man and a woman like it was when it was originally started back with Adam and Eve.

 

While I understand what you're saying, God didn't "create" marriage. It was around long before Christianity. I'm not going to get into a religious debate but ancient societies such as the Egyptians and Greeks had marriage ceremonies so Christianity doesn't get the exclusive rights to the word. 

Adam and Eve were before the Greeks and Egyptians.

Adam and Eve weren't Christians. Christ wasn't born until thousands of years later.

]

You said "God didn't create marriage".... God created Adam and Eve.... they are the first example of marriage in the bible. I never said anything about Christians creating marriage.... I said God created marriage.

Sorry... I jumped in mid conversation. I didn't say anything about marriage before this other than saying that if people want to have a marriage ceremony in a church  they can but that everyone could have a civil ceremony to get benefits like insurance and tax breaks. That allows for same sex couples to get the same rights as opposite sex couples while keeping the sanctity of marriage between a man and a woman.

....slowly backing out of thread....

HAHA! Me too I dont like arguing about this topic because no ones mind will EVER change based on a conversation like this... it is a much too heated topic.

jdm7

mrsodonnell12:

See here's the thing... you can call me ignorant in my views toward gay marriage... and I can call you ignorant in your understanding of Christianity... we can go in circles all day long, I am not interested in that.

My entire point is that I live my life according to my morals as a Christian. Being a Christian is not something you are sometimes but then as soon as you go to vote you throw out the window. Chritianity is all encompassing and it is the way I make my decisions.

I can love my friend who is living with her boyfriend... that doesnt mean I agree with her lifestyle. I can love my cousin who is a gay man living with his partner- but that does not mean I have to agree with his lifestyle.

I choose not to vote for or against gay marriage- God gave us the gift of free will- we are to do with that as we see fit. Having the opinion that gay marriage is not ok and being anti-gay are two very, very different things. I love people for who they are, not for what they do, because we are all humans and none of us are perfect.

I highly respect you for living and defending your religious beliefs. (I'm being serious)

In the case of CFA - they are anti-gay. If it was just gay marriage they didn't support, I'd say "yea, maybe just anti-gay marriage." But when you look into it and see that they donate money to anti-gay organizations and charities, it's a different outlook, and no longer just against gay marriage, it comes across as just anti-gay.

I also agree with the bold part above. To me, if gay people want to get married, have at it. At the same time, I don't have to agree with it. I know quite a few gay people, and I love and respect them but at the same time I don't have to agree with their lifestyle choices, just like they don't have to agree with mine.  In the end, I choose to look at it (outside of my religious beliefs) that it does not affect the way I live or what I do. 

pghctwife

jdm7:

mamak0328:

knittylady:

jdm7:

Necack:

 Im the same way. I live in pittsburgh and I hate the Steelers which is like swearing around here. I hate going to game parties for the exact same reason. In truth inmate all sports, fortunately so does DH. But my whole family, and surrounding community for that matter, acts like sports are the end all be all of life. I hate it. Most of the time, I really could give two craps about teams and the drama that surrounds them, but the penn state situation isn't so much about the team as it is about those poor children, and that is what gets my attention. 

I grew up in Pittsburgh (moved away 5 years ago), you shut your potty mouth!!! LOL  

That's what I'm sayin'!  I was born and raised in Pittsburgh (also moved away now, but it will always be home!).  Pretty sure my first word was Steelers, lol.

I can't stand the Steelers!  Ravens fan here!  I have a good friend who is a Steelers fan.  Things get interesting during football season.   

I now live in the Cleveland area. My husband is a Browns fan. I f'ing hate the Browns.

Here's an UO - I don't get how women will change their favorite team (if you're a fan of a team) because it's what their husband likes. F that, I won't be wearing this orange/brown junk up here. I scrub my d@mn hands after I touch it because I bought him something. I bleed too much black and gold to change. We accept each others baseball teams (since they're not direct competitors), and he likes the Pens and if I have to like basketball (which I don't) it's the Cavs, but Pens, Pirates and Steelers always win my heart first and foremost, no matter where I live. 

 

In case that was directed at me... I don't actually care about pro football at all so saying Im a steelers fan by marriage is sort of tongue in cheek. Im a big college sports fan, but really Im not big into football at all. So I go along with the steelers fandom since it is just more fun than being a party pooper  

mamak0328

mindy0711:

mamak0328:

knittylady:

jdm7:

Necack:

 Im the same way. I live in pittsburgh and I hate the Steelers which is like swearing around here. I hate going to game parties for the exact same reason. In truth inmate all sports, fortunately so does DH. But my whole family, and surrounding community for that matter, acts like sports are the end all be all of life. I hate it. Most of the time, I really could give two craps about teams and the drama that surrounds them, but the penn state situation isn't so much about the team as it is about those poor children, and that is what gets my attention. 

I grew up in Pittsburgh (moved away 5 years ago), you shut your potty mouth!!! LOL  

 

That's what I'm sayin'!  I was born and raised in Pittsburgh (also moved away now, but it will always be home!).  Pretty sure my first word was Steelers, lol.

I can't stand the Steelers!  Ravens fan here!  I have a good friend who is a Steelers fan.  Things get interesting during football season.   

 Another Ravens fan!!!!!!! Two weeks until the first preseason game, I cannot wait!! Do you live in MD???  My BIL is from Pittsburgh and has brainwashed my SIL and now niece into becoming steelers fans...so football season gets REAL interesting! We usually go to the Steelers, Ravens game in Baltimore.....the ride home is usually really quiet!

 

Yes I am in MD!  I am so excited for this season!  Fun fact and probably an UO, my basement is painted Ravens purple.

jdm7

Pgh-CTBride:

In case that was directed at me... I don't actually care about pro football at all so saying Im a steelers fan by marriage is sort of tongue in cheek. Im a big college sports fan, but really Im not big into football at all. So I go along with the steelers fandom since it is just more fun than being a party pooper  

Not directed at anyone in particular. I know a ton of women who change their favorite sports team based on their SO/DH.