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Attachment Parenting
KorieAngela
member
Questions about immunizations & vaccinations...
KorieAngela
member
I am currently 6 months pregnant with my first child. I have been reading a lot on NOT vaccinating your children because of the ingredients in the vaccinations. I am really interested to know where I can find more information. I, myself, refuse any immunizations or vaccinations. I would like to do the same for my child until they can make their own choices...but which ones can I say no to and which ones are important? I know schools won't let children attend without updated shot records...What do I do there? Any advice on this topic will be greatly appreciated as I am 100% in the dark.
Thank you!
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Re: Questions about immunizations & vaccinations...
MY JOURNEY AS A SINGLE BF-ING, CD-ING, BABYWEARING MOM
I am completely with ya! Just not sure what I think or what exactly to do. I found this article today and found it helpful. Dr Sears is another good one to look at like the pp suggested. And yes this could get heated but ultimately you need to do what you feel is right for your child.
I would really suggest you do some research.
Being totally unvaccinated and then bringing home an infant is incredibly dangerous. If you catch a vaccine-preventable disease you could kill your infant.
There are absolutely risks with vaccinating. Vaccine injuries and deaths are real and happen. However, the vast majority of kids vaccinated do so without injury or illness. Infectious, deadly diseases are on the rise from the anti-vac movement and are a far greater threat than the miniscule risk of vaccine injury. In regards to vaccines, the benefits far outweigh the risks.
This.
Also, vaccines would protect your child against things that could kill them. Autism is not fatal. Oh, and my son? Diagnosed with autism a few months ago. Would I vaccinate him again? Absolutely. Every single time.
DS2 - Oct 2010 (my VBAC baby!)
Vaccinate. Your. Children.
This is not just about your child. More important than the protection you and your child get is the herd immunity of the entire populace. Some people cannot get vaccinations (due to age or particular sensitivities) or their immune systems are compromised and their vaccinations no longer effective. Having an immune herd protects these people.
Every time someone chooses not to vaccinate their child, another hole is poked in the herd immunity. Whooping Cough (pertussis) is becoming endemic in parts of the US after it had been nearly eradicated because of non vaccinating parents. Babies who can't be vaccinated yet can DIE of pertussis. Adults who no longer have immunity to chicken pox will get shingles, which can be permanently debilitating (think one infected kid visiting grandma in the nursing home...). Polio was eradicated in the US, but it is not in a number of countries and it is very possible for it to slip back into the US and start infecting people. There is NO TREATMENT for polio.
Get your child vaccinated.
Aviva Jill Romm has a great book on vaccines. She doesn't try to sway you one way or the other, but she does present pertinent medical advice for treatment of diseases if you choose not to. Myself and all of my close friends do not vaccinate our children.
This unlike any other AP board I've been to. I'll be bowing out now as this is not the version of AP I'm acquainted with.
lurker here... but ummmm...wtf
Um, was your mom vaccinated? Because whopping cough is mainly spread by adults who are. It up to date on their vax.
LO agree with the pp posters - vax are important for controlling these diseases and are safe for most of the population. Read the inserts. There is a lot of reliable info in them as well as the CDC website, and I also Rec the dr sears book.
Yup. She's always up on her vaccinations because of her husband's job in healthcare. She was one of many cases of vaccinated people contracting pertussis in her state this year.
Read up on the major diseases and what they do to the human body and to infants who are at greater risk of dying from these diseases. I do not say that to be snarky, rather in complete earnestness. These days, in this country (or in any developed country if you are not in the US), we are pretty privileged and most of us have never been epxosed to real disease and illness. We are familiar with sterile hospitals and available drugs, and are not generally aware of what diseases like pertussis or polio really do to people because we've never seen it.
These diseases kill, in horrible and painful ways. And even in the cases where they don't, they can be ravaging to the body and damaging for life. To say that our bodies can fight it or that they are treatable is to take a risk. It may work out or it may not. You, of course, as the parent, have the right to make the decision for your child about whether or not you are comfortable with that risk.
However, this is bigger than your child or your family - it's not like breastfeeding or babywearing or BLW or cloth diapers. Choosing not to vaccinate your children can put others in danger as well. I had to watch my DD get her first set of vaccinations today and it was not fun. Five shots and an oral vaccine. She's been feverish and fussy since. I've felt bad all day - but I would feel a lot worse if she contracted pertussis, which is so easily preventable. I think it would be selfish of me not to vaccinate her, frankly.
At the very least, thoroughly research this. Speak at length with your chosen pediatrician about the issue. Get actual information, not biased information or scare tactics (from any side).
Gabriel Ross - August 24, 2009 * Vivienne Rose - May 1, 2012
My Blog
Adding another voice to this discussion... I'm a pedi that's all for AP. I BW, EBF, and bed share, but many of my major hesitations with even a delayed schedule are explained here, much better than I ever could myself.
I respect parent's right to make decisions for their own children, but I would be seriously freaked out if I knew a large number of my friend's children or my child's classmates weren't vaccinated.
https://www.pediatrics.org/cgi/content/full/123/1/e164
BFP#2 3/16/11, beta 138; 4/12 Baby/HB DS born 9/10/11 at 29w4d due to partial abruption and PTL
BFP#3 8/19/13 Another boy! 17P, modified bedrest and Nifedipine helped us have a termie! DS2 born 4/19/14 at 38w5d.
I agree with your second paragraph. Personal choices are great until they start to negatively impact society generally.
So......vaccinated people catching and likely spreading pertussis - how is that non-vaxers fault? TBH this seems to be a reason not to get vaxed, because obviously the vaccine doesn't stop you from catching pertussis anyway.
My LO is vaxed, but surely people can understand why (beyond the Wakefield jackasss) parents are nervous about trusting the pharmaceutical complex. This is an industry that includes huge companies GlaxoSmithKline which a year or so ago was ordered to pay something like $700 million to settle a slew of lawsuits over bad products.
Even though we chose to vax, it frustrates me to see people on TB so adamant that vaccines are 100% safe and imply that anyone who questions that is a terrible parent or moron or both. Time and again people say Wakefield was a lying liar as if that's the only person who has ever questioned vaccine safety.
Fact is there are risks with vaccines, one of which is that they simply won't be effective. Are the risks minimal, sure. But our reporting system is also pretty flawed. I think people who are pro-vaccine would do their cause a favor by presenting a more balanced viewpoint.
All our choices impact society generally.
If you chose to use disposable diapers, the landfills you're filling up, the production/chemicals used, trees cut down, etc. all impact my world. Yet no one goes on about how sposie users are awful parents that are poisoning our children's earth. Or talks about how they won't let their kids play with kids who wear sposies.
We are a group, and as such our choices and decisions impact one another. I do agree that all people need to think beyond themselves and consider how their choices will impact others. Including the choice to vaccinate.
All our choices impact society generally.
If you chose to use disposable diapers, the landfills you're filling up, the production/chemicals used, trees cut down, etc. all impact my world. Yet no one goes on about how sposie users are awful parents that are poisoning our children's earth. Or talks about how they won't let their kids play with kids who wear sposies.
We are a group, and as such our choices and decisions impact one another. I do agree that all people need to think beyond themselves and consider how their choices will impact others. Including the choice to vaccinate.
Non-vaxers increase the risk of everyone else getting sick because vaccines work most of the time, but not always. "Most of the time" is quite effective when we're talking about a population: if it's unlikely for any one person to get it, it's unlikely that the disease will get a foothold. Non-vaxers increase the likelihood of a disease reinfecting people and spreading through a population. The choice to avoid vaccines increases the risk for yourself and everyone else.
ITA - I was playing the devils advocate and pointing out how your story seems contradictory. I just think it's important to acknowledge that it's not as black/white as we'd like it to be, although nothing ever is!
I agree that it's not black & white, and one of the most frustrating parts is that it's hard to get good scientific proof about this issue (among many, many other issues). The outbreaks in Oregon and Washington (both states with high numbers of vax refusers) seems like a pretty strong warning to me, though.
I asked this same question a few months ago and the replies that I received really made me upset. This is an extremely heated topic for both sides of the debate, which is easily understandable. Everyone just wants to keep their kid safe and healthy. I don't judge either opinion because I know that we all have the same goal in mind. We all want to protect our children from harm.
I personally will not be vaccinating my child for religious reasons. The ingredients in the vaccines are repulsive and go against my beliefs. I just do not understand why doctors want pregnant women to keep their bodies pure of anything harmful and then as soon as the baby is born they inject them with toxins. It doesn't make any sense!
I can't help but wonder that if the increase of vaccines in the past 25 years is associated with the declines in children's health. ADHD, Learning Disabilities, Ear Infections, Anaphylactic Food Allergies, Eczema, Asthma, Obesity, and Juvenile Diabetes has risen drastically in recent years.
In the end you need to do your own research and come to a decision that you can live with. If you choose to vaccinate then you have to be aware of the risk of serious side effects. If you choose to not vaccinate then you need to be aware of the risk associated with your child contracting some of the diseases and illnesses that the vaccines can prevent. This is just one of the decisions you will have to make as a mom. Good luck with whatever you decide.
Correlation does not equal causation. If you look at the changes in society and the environment in the past 25 years, there are thousands of other things that could be contributing to these diseases (many that are more likely choices than vaccines). We choose to avoid overly processed and non-organic food for DD, to use cloth diapers, and to avoid unnecessary air pollution in our home, but we vaccinate on schedule. The dangers of not vaccinating far outweigh the potential dangers of a vaccine.
BFP #1 9/7/10, EDD 5/14/11, Violet born 5/27/11.
BFP #2 4/9/12, EDD 12/16/12, M/C Rory 4/24/12.
BFP #3 10/6/12, EDD 6/16/12., Matilda born 6/17/13.
This. And we have been giving vaccines longer than 25yrs.
Which ingredients and which toxins are you talking about?
And wanting to protect our children from harm and doing so in an effective manner are two different things. Some people might believe they are protecting their children from harm by practicing animal sacrifice or by bloodletting, but that doesn't mean we should just smile and say "everyone has an opinion and all moms' opinions are equally valid!"
Don't be an idiot. By the time your kid is old enough to make his/her own decision about vaccinating (FFS), he/she could be dead or disabled.
Get your kid the motherfcuking shots.
Correlation =/= causation. Just because more types of ice cream are available doesn't mean that it causes a rise in violent crime.
My Blog
Yes you are right! Why didn't I see it before. Obesity is totally caused by vaccines! Why my God! It has nothing to do with the fact that food portions are a billion times larger than they were 50 years ago. Or the fact that people these days don't even understand what a healthy meal is. Or the fact that sugar is added to everything. Or the fact that kids no longer go outside because they want to play video games. Or the fact that schools are doing away with physical education programs.
And seriously? An increase in learning disabilities? Let me say I work for a welfare agency and deal with people 50+ all the time and COUNTLESS numbers were diagnosed with learning disabilities in school. And you know what? Countless more are diagnosed later in life because there was no program that helped them when they were younger. But yes, you must be right..vaccines not better awareness is obviously the problem!
I have no clue what repulsive ingredients you are talking about. But unless you grow all of your own fruits/veggies from heirloom seed varieties, milk your own cow, kill your own meat, wear a gas mask on a daily basis, and don't own a single thing that is fire retardant I am guessing you ingest countless repulsive chemicals on a daily basis that are FAR worse than vaccines.
But go on. My child will continue to protect your child with his vaccines.
I live in an area with low immunization rates. In the past few years we've had outbreaks of pertussis (which can kill newborns) mumps (which leads to sterility), measles (can also kill). I have family members who spent their lives in wheelchairs because of polio and others with lung and heart complications from communicable, vaccine preventable diseases.
Are those really "choices" you want to leave your child to make? The "choice" between hand powered and motorized wheelchairs? The "choice" between adoption, donor DNA, or childlessness for infertility? The "choice" of a good cardiologist or pulmonologist for treating lifelong complications from other vaccination preventable diseases?
The first smallpox vaccine was developed in 1796. That's not a typo. That's also why, almost 200 years later, smallpox became the first disease to be eradicated by human technology. Think about how amazing that is. Human being eliminated a disease. A disease which killed possibly millions of people throughout history. No one will ever have to suffer and die from smallpox again, or live with the horrible scarring it could leave (famously, George Washington had a pockmarked face from smallpox).
We are close to eliminating polio, but many people in the areas in which it still exists (Nigeria, Afghanistan, Pakistan) are now spreading conspiracy theories that the vaccinations are a western plot to sterilize children. Hence, people are scared to vaccinate. Hence it is beginning to spread again. Sound familiar? If you think that's a crazy theory, it's no crazier than any other theory about the evils of vaccines.
40/112
It's not even a correlation. It's just two things that happened at the same time. Those things happen to un-vaxed kids, too.
I read about half of the replies and then decided that I'm tired of all the people saying there's no risk from vaccines and that "YOUR BABY MIGHT DIE IF THEY GET SICK! ZOMG!"
Look.
You need to read everything you can about vaccines and determine what you can and can't live with. Can you live with the documented possibility of your child contracting something that there is a vaccine for? Can you live with the documented side effects of specific vaccines? Is the risk/reward ratio high enough to make the decision clear? Are you willing to alter your initial plan based on changes in your community and environment?
Read all the vaccine fact/FAQ sheets that they provide on the CDC website and then read some books about alternate schedules. Decide what you and your family can live with and then make your choice.
We all have to do what's right for our children and unfortunately that may not be what others approve of.
Except your baby's car seat situation has no impact on my baby's car seat situation.