Pre-School and Daycare

one of the teachers in my DD's 3 yo class is kinda mean

Not really mean, but she's very firm w/ the kids sometimes and it rubs me the wrong way.

The other morning somebody had a breakdown b/c he wanted to read a book to the class, but it wasn't his turn, so he started crying, laid down on the floor, etc.  And, she was just like "well, its not your turn today, stop crying, it will be your turn ___" no one else is crying, etc.  And, today, the same boy (or maybe another one) was having a fit b/c he threw his lunch box and coat on the floor and he wanted the teacher to help him clean it up/do it for him, but she wouldn't since he did it on purpose - and of course, then he had another fit.  And, when I walked in, the other teacher came in at the same time and the first teacher very loudly explained to teacher #2 what the issue was and not to help him, etc. 

I get where's she's coming from, and I know she needs to set limits w/ the kids to prepare them for school, but I wish she was a little more "soft" with the kids. 

DD's main teacher is #2 teacher (who comes in a little later) so I'm glad for that.

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Re: one of the teachers in my DD's 3 yo class is kinda mean

  • I hope I don't offend you but I want that teacher!!!!  Seriously, I would love my kids to be in that class.  I think kids this age need to start getting taught boundaries b/c kinder is a very demanding environment.  There will be 15-20 kids with one teacher and those kids will be expected to learn challenging stuff.  If there is one kid out of line being a drama llama it will be the entire class that suffers.  I get frustrated b/c at home myself and my nanny give the kids firm boundaries but Harm's teacher just coddles him.  It makes him think it is appropriate to act up b/c he gets away with things at school.  In fact I'm in the process of getting him moved to a new program b/c he needs more structure.

    I see your point!  My Callum is just a very gentle child and doesn't really act out.  I hope he has a very gentle teacher but my other two need the mean one.  That kid in your daughter's class really seems like the type who also needs firm boundaries.

    Mom to Harmon 1/17/08 and twins Rachel & Callum 8/28/09 Photobucket 29o0v13.jpg
  • DD has a teacher like and at 1st I didn't know how I felt about her, but now she DD's favorite teacher (and mine as well) She doesn't take crap from anyone and I like how she disciplines the kids that need it
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  • I get it.  I think that she could still tow that line without coming off as quite so harsh.  It would be like me treating both of my kids the same.  As sensitive as DD can be, I can actually be more direct with her than with DS.  The message is still the same, but I have to deliver it differently to each of the kids and it seems with DS, I have to be a little more gentle surprisingly, both for purposes of his reaction and overall effectiveness.


    image
    DD -- 5YO
    DS -- 3YO

  • I agree with fran.  I think smaller children do need a teacher who sets firm boundaries and bad behavior should result in a firm but "nonchalant" attitude. Overreacting because a child doesn't comply only adds to the mess...you get more frustrated and the child gets away with bad behavior and also gets the reaction they want from you.  I taught Pre-K for 2 years and I was a "firm" teacher; mostly in those moments that required me to be firm.  Temper tantrums, bad behavior, non-compliance with class rules--I had to be firm.  But, I also knew that there was a time for me to be "soft"--ouchies on the playground, hurt feelings after a fight over a book or tears after mommy/daddy drop-offs--require a gentler touch.  

    But it's also about perceiving the intention of the "firm" teacher as well.  I used to teach under a wonderful woman.  She was the head of the Pre-K class and she'd taught for 25+ years.  She was tough; I'm not gonna lie but she cared about those kids like nobody's business.  Her size was somewhat imposing (she was large) and she had an "I don't care" attitude.  One little boy would cry EVERY MORNING when his dad dropped him off.  Her reply EVERY MORNING?  "C'mon on in here lil' boy and let your daddy get off to work.  He's a policeman and we need him on those streets to put the bad folks in jail."  And she would let him sit as his table and cry and 15 minutes later, he was hugging her and playing with the rest of the kids.  (I would be the one to sit at his table with him to hug and wipe his tears.  But, that was my role and I was cool with it.) Was she tough?  Yes.  But her intentions were always 100% good and the parents loved her for it.   

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  • There is a difference between "You may play with the toys when you have cleaned up your coat and lunchbox" and "No one else is crying".  One is productively firm, the other just makes the kid feel bad.  In the grand scheme, it's a small thing, and unless it's combined with other things, I'd cringe and let it go because I understand we have to put our trust in these teachers for our kids' sakes.  I've heard some things like that at DD"s school and they added up until I talked to the director about it and things got much better.  I just didn't (and still don't to some extent) feel like they give equal patience and attention to the 3 year olds in the multiage classroom as they do the 5/6yos.  An example is if they don't clean up their work when they are told to it goes in the trash.  NOT ok, and especially not ok in a Montessori environment when their work is almost sacred.  I'm picking my battles right now to get some other things worked out, but have a feeling I'll be switching her to another class next year.  
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  • imagefranciscaz:

    I hope I don't offend you but I want that teacher!!!!  Seriously, I would love my kids to be in that class.  I think kids this age need to start getting taught boundaries b/c kinder is a very demanding environment.  There will be 15-20 kids with one teacher and those kids will be expected to learn challenging stuff.  If there is one kid out of line being a drama llama it will be the entire class that suffers. 

    This exactly.  

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  • I agree with the others, I want that teacher.  The teachers at DS's school coddles them way too much...and than DS tries that stuff with me and it doesn't work.  Do you really expect the teacher to clean up the boy's mess that he did on purpose?  When my  DS threw his lunch box (age 3), he had no lunch box for 2 days (had to carry his food containers)-he never did it again.
  • imageseptemberdreams:
    I agree with the others, I want that teacher.  The teachers at DS's school coddles them way too much...and than DS tries that stuff with me and it doesn't work.  Do you really expect the teacher to clean up the boy's mess that he did on purpose?  When my  DS threw his lunch box (age 3), he had no lunch box for 2 days (had to carry his food containers)-he never did it again.

    I know what you guys are saying, there's just a "tone" to her voice sometimes that I dont' like, but I think in the wrong run, its OK.  I know her teacher doesn't coddle her or the others, but she's a little nicer about it too.

    I don't expect the teachers to clean up after the boy, but I think instead of talking to him about it from across the room, she could have walked to him or quietly taken him aside and repeated that he needed to pick up his coat and lunch and put them in his cubby.  I don't know, maybe he's always a mess at drop off, so maybe she could try a gentler approach.

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  • Last year DD had a teacher that was more firm and much more direct.  She disciplined differently than me, but it never crossed the line or made me uncomfortable.  I think it was actually a great experience for DD.  It taught her how to navigate a different set of rules and reactions to the same situation (i.e., spilling lunch on the floor).  This year's teacher is very different in her approach.  I prefer it, but I'm glad DD had the other experience.  That being said, I think there is also something to say about following your gut and actually witnessing something versus hearing it second-hand, etc. 

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  • I don't know, that's how I act with my own kids when they throw fits...I guess I'm mean too!

    I just don't put up with the bad behavior - if my DD were to purposely throw something on the floor you better believe she's the one picking it up.   

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  • I hear you. There is one teacher in my school that seems always to be on her last nerve when I pick the kids up. A bit abrupt. Not nasty, just not soft.
    image
  • imagekmhunt11:
    There is a difference between "You may play with the toys when you have cleaned up your coat and lunchbox" and "No one else is crying".  One is productively firm, the other just makes the kid feel bad.  In the grand scheme, it's a small thing, and unless it's combined with other things, I'd cringe and let it go because I understand we have to put our trust in these teachers for our kids' sakes.  I've heard some things like that at DD"s school and they added up until I talked to the director about it and things got much better.  I just didn't (and still don't to some extent) feel like they give equal patience and attention to the 3 year olds in the multiage classroom as they do the 5/6yos.  An example is if they don't clean up their work when they are told to it goes in the trash.  NOT ok, and especially not ok in a Montessori environment when their work is almost sacred.  I'm picking my battles right now to get some other things worked out, but have a feeling I'll be switching her to another class next year.  

    I completely see where the majority is coming from and think it's important to have firm discipline and boundaries but I soooo agree with the above statement.  I think that the nobody else is crying thing and don't help him comments make me think she's bitchy and I'm guessing there is a lot more that you've seen and felt that built up to this post.  Making the kid clean up his crap is fine, realizing he did it because he's upset his mama left is a whole different ballgame than throwing it on the floor at lunch time because he's mad he didn't get a cookie today in his box and require a different approach.  Sure both times you're going to make him clean it up himself but he deserves a bit more compassion in the 1st scenario than the 2nd.

    The thing about nobody else is crying, get off the floor ect just shows a lack of respect for the child and that's not ok with me. I get that a kid can't be distrupting the entire class but you still can validate and respect his feelings.

  • I have to say that I think it may not be such a bad thing either.  I probably come off as a little harsh at times with my kids and especially my almost 5yo niece that I am helping care for while my mom is in the hospital (she and I have spent tons of time together over the years anyway), but with my niece's personality, it's really the only way to deal with her when she's whiny and throwing tantrums b/c she wants attention and/or b/c she's frustrated. 

    If you're "soft" with her, she'll just get worse and never try to do it herself at all.  She just does this limp noodle fall to the floor, whines until she gets her face all screwed up and gradually escalates to big ol' crocodile tears.  So, I suppose the gist is that I think there is a place for this kind of interaction.

     
  • imagejulygal:

    Last year DD had a teacher that was more firm and much more direct.  She disciplined differently than me, but it never crossed the line or made me uncomfortable.  I think it was actually a great experience for DD.  It taught her how to navigate a different set of rules and reactions to the same situation (i.e., spilling lunch on the floor).  This year's teacher is very different in her approach.  I prefer it, but I'm glad DD had the other experience.  That being said, I think there is also something to say about following your gut and actually witnessing something versus hearing it second-hand, etc. 

    I agree with this too.  Add this to my PP please.  Wink

     
  • imagefranciscaz:

    I hope I don't offend you but I want that teacher!!!!  Seriously, I would love my kids to be in that class.  I think kids this age need to start getting taught boundaries b/c kinder is a very demanding environment.  There will be 15-20 kids with one teacher and those kids will be expected to learn challenging stuff.  If there is one kid out of line being a drama llama it will be the entire class that suffers.  I get frustrated b/c at home myself and my nanny give the kids firm boundaries but Harm's teacher just coddles him.  It makes him think it is appropriate to act up b/c he gets away with things at school.  In fact I'm in the process of getting him moved to a new program b/c he needs more structure.

    I see your point!  My Callum is just a very gentle child and doesn't really act out.  I hope he has a very gentle teacher but my other two need the mean one.  That kid in your daughter's class really seems like the type who also needs firm boundaries.

    Amen sister!!!  As a daycare teacher we are looked at by many eyes, some want us to be soft, some firm!  I feel like a mattress, anyway I think I would have done the same, seeing it was a FIT!  Now if the child was sad cause they were hurt or sick or something else then I would have been more understanding but they child wanted to get their way and in my classroom that doesn't fly.

    If you really don't like the way your child's teacher act say something to the director.

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  • imagejsugrin:

    imagekmhunt11:
    There is a difference between "You may play with the toys when you have cleaned up your coat and lunchbox" and "No one else is crying".  One is productively firm, the other just makes the kid feel bad.  In the grand scheme, it's a small thing, and unless it's combined with other things, I'd cringe and let it go because I understand we have to put our trust in these teachers for our kids' sakes.  I've heard some things like that at DD"s school and they added up until I talked to the director about it and things got much better.  I just didn't (and still don't to some extent) feel like they give equal patience and attention to the 3 year olds in the multiage classroom as they do the 5/6yos.  An example is if they don't clean up their work when they are told to it goes in the trash.  NOT ok, and especially not ok in a Montessori environment when their work is almost sacred.  I'm picking my battles right now to get some other things worked out, but have a feeling I'll be switching her to another class next year.  

    I completely see where the majority is coming from and think it's important to have firm discipline and boundaries but I soooo agree with the above statement.  I think that the nobody else is crying thing and don't help him comments make me think she's bitchy and I'm guessing there is a lot more that you've seen and felt that built up to this post.  Making the kid clean up his crap is fine, realizing he did it because he's upset his mama left is a whole different ballgame than throwing it on the floor at lunch time because he's mad he didn't get a cookie today in his box and require a different approach.  Sure both times you're going to make him clean it up himself but he deserves a bit more compassion in the 1st scenario than the 2nd.

    The thing about nobody else is crying, get off the floor ect just shows a lack of respect for the child and that's not ok with me. I get that a kid can't be distrupting the entire class but you still can validate and respect his feelings.

    Agree HEARTILY with both of these posts.  

    Wheee!
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    "When it comes to sleeping, whatever your baby does is normal. If one thing has damaged parents enjoyment of their babies, it's rigid expectations about how and when the baby should sleep." ~ James McKenna, Ph.D., Mother Baby Behavioral Sleep Center, University of Notre Dame

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  • you also don't know if the history of the kid who was throwing the tantrum.   Maybe this is a kid who is constantly throwing a fit when he doesn't get his way.   Maybe they have learned that this is a kid who seeks negative attention and she has found that being firm, even though it sounds like she is being mean, is the only thing that works for this kid.  
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