So let's talk about monogamy. (LIP)

EmmieB

Today on Forum on NPR, it was the topic. From the website:

"We explore the history of monogamy and what science tells us about the true nature of human sexuality. Psychologist Christopher Ryan joins us to discuss his book "Sex at Dawn," which challenges conventional wisdom about mating and marriage, tracing the prehistoric origins of modern sexuality to explain why people have so much trouble sticking with just one sexual partner."

 https://tinyurl.com/7l9z5zz

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it's an hour long. I'll let you listen :-)

My.ABC.Life

If I listen to this... am I going to want to allow my husband to have an open marriage!?! 

EmmieB

depends on whether you're looking to be convinced or not...I guess.

Lexi & Orion's Mommy

i can't remeber where i read it, but i remeber reading something to the effect of, once a man decides to commit (fully) it is easier for him to stay faithful then it is a woman. That a woman is eaiser to persude than a man.

DH and I have discussed this recently, as I have noticed over the years he is getting to be more jelous than he ever was in the past. And in the past i was purposely trying to make him jelous, and now, he is just reading into things.

I believe our marrige is strong, and i have faith we can over come anything together.

another quote i heard that i allways kinda liked, was a secret to a long lasting marriage is to never fall out of love at the same time.

EmmieB

Lexi & Orion's Mommy:

i can't remeber where i read it, but i remeber reading something to the effect of, once a man decides to commit (fully) it is easier for him to stay faithful then it is a woman. That a woman is eaiser to persude than a man.

DH and I have discussed this recently, as I have noticed over the years he is getting to be more jelous than he ever was in the past. And in the past i was purposely trying to make him jelous, and now, he is just reading into things.

I believe our marrige is strong, and i have faith we can over come anything together.

another quote i heard that i allways kinda liked, was a secret to a long lasting marriage is to never fall out of love at the same time.

they actually talk about strong polyamorous marriages often are, because of the level of communication they require from each other.  

Celyn

I've known LOTS of people in polyamorous relationships over the years and many people in open marriages.  None of the polys have lasted in their primary relationship.  I know three people currently with the another partner that was brought into the relationship (they each eventually left their primary for that other person).  Two of those relationships are currently very unstable (one because the husband had a secret affair that came out in a very public way).  One couple has made it pretty long term (12 years), but they are now monogamous.  All the open marriages have eventually broken up or become monogamous.

EmmieB

Celyn:

I've known LOTS of people in polyamorous relationships over the years and many people in open marriages.  None of the polys have lasted in their primary relationship.  I know three people currently with the another partner that was brought into the relationship (they each eventually left their primary for that other person).  Two of those relationships are currently very unstable (one because the husband had a secret affair that came out in a very public way).  One couple has made it pretty long term (12 years), but they are now monogamous.  All the open marriages have eventually broken up or become monogamous.

aside from the one guy keeping secrets, do you have any theories on why they've all failed (for lack of a better term.)

I'm so monogamous that i've never even casually dated more than one person before, but people close to me are polyamorous, so i'm trying to get as much info as i can. :-) 

AvaLikeLava

Celyn:

I've known LOTS of people in polyamorous relationships over the years and many people in open marriages.  None of the polys have lasted in their primary relationship.  I know three people currently with the another partner that was brought into the relationship (they each eventually left their primary for that other person).  Two of those relationships are currently very unstable (one because the husband had a secret affair that came out in a very public way).  One couple has made it pretty long term (12 years), but they are now monogamous.  All the open marriages have eventually broken up or become monogamous.

You know... it's interesting. Your (personal) experience confirms what our pre-marital counseling therapists discussed in our sessions. I forget the reasoning, but they did quote some studies showing open marriages to be more likely to dissolve over time than monogamous relationships. I found it surprising too.

Structenggal

AvaLikeLava:

Celyn:

I've known LOTS of people in polyamorous relationships over the years and many people in open marriages.  None of the polys have lasted in their primary relationship.  I know three people currently with the another partner that was brought into the relationship (they each eventually left their primary for that other person).  Two of those relationships are currently very unstable (one because the husband had a secret affair that came out in a very public way).  One couple has made it pretty long term (12 years), but they are now monogamous.  All the open marriages have eventually broken up or become monogamous.

You know... it's interesting. Your (personal) experience confirms what our pre-marital counseling therapists discussed in our sessions. I forget the reasoning, but they did quote some studies showing open marriages to be more likely to dissolve over time than monogamous relationships. I found it surprising too.

For me, it would be a jealousy issue.  I knew a couple that had an open marriage while they lived in different cities (she was in Davis finishing her PhD and he was in Seattle).  They had some rule that they couldn't comment on each others' hookups, and I know he had no problem sleeping with other women, but he would get really jealous when he'd happen to meet any of the guys that his wife had slept with.   

EmmieB

Structenggal:

AvaLikeLava:

Celyn:

I've known LOTS of people in polyamorous relationships over the years and many people in open marriages.  None of the polys have lasted in their primary relationship.  I know three people currently with the another partner that was brought into the relationship (they each eventually left their primary for that other person).  Two of those relationships are currently very unstable (one because the husband had a secret affair that came out in a very public way).  One couple has made it pretty long term (12 years), but they are now monogamous.  All the open marriages have eventually broken up or become monogamous.

You know... it's interesting. Your (personal) experience confirms what our pre-marital counseling therapists discussed in our sessions. I forget the reasoning, but they did quote some studies showing open marriages to be more likely to dissolve over time than monogamous relationships. I found it surprising too.

For me, it would be a jealousy issue.  I knew a couple that had an open marriage while they lived in different cities (she was in Davis finishing her PhD and he was in Seattle).  They had some rule that they couldn't comment on each others' hookups, and I know he had no problem sleeping with other women, but he would get really jealous when he'd happen to meet any of the guys that his wife had slept with.   

do you think he would have had the same issue had she been sleeping with women - or if he'd been sleeping with men? as in - if one or both of them were bisexual? Or if they'd been living together while having this open relationship?

Celyn

Oh boy, that's complicated.  Sometimes it seems that honesty is really an issue.  Like if the arrangement is that you only get to sleep with other people that your partner approves, and the one you really want to get with is not approved.  In the past I've seen that turn into illicit affairs.  Sometimes only one partner really wants to be poly/open and the other person doesn't have enough backbone to say no, then grows that backbone after they feel like they got walked all over; or was curious to try it and then decided they didn't want to do it.  Sometimes there's a rule about hookups only and not romantic feelings, but those happen anyway, and then there's guilt and/or lies.  I've seen a few couples for whom their sex lives became their whole "lifestyle", which is a great recipe for sex addiction, and that rarely ends well.  I've seen couples with kids get torn up because one parent wanted to disclose to their kids and one didn't.

EmmieB

Celyn:

Oh boy, that's complicated.  Sometimes it seems that honesty is really an issue.  Like if the arrangement is that you only get to sleep with other people that your partner approves, and the one you really want to get with is not approved.  In the past I've seen that turn into illicit affairs.  Sometimes only one partner really wants to be poly/open and the other person doesn't have enough backbone to say no, then grows that backbone after they feel like they got walked all over; or was curious to try it and then decided they didn't want to do it.  Sometimes there's a rule about hookups only and not romantic feelings, but those happen anyway, and then there's guilt and/or lies.  I've seen a few couples for whom their sex lives became their whole "lifestyle", which is a great recipe for sex addiction, and that rarely ends well.  I've seen couples with kids get torn up because one parent wanted to disclose to their kids and one didn't.

sex addiction aside - it does seem like it boils down to communication...which is true for any relationship. Once the lies/omitting starts, it's all downhill from there. 

 

EmmieB

I would also like to add that while I am very glad that husband and I are conventionally monogamous....when they were talking about a group of women buying up a mcmansion and raising their kids together in it, that really appealed to me. I like the idea of living on a commune/in a little village where everyone pitches in and looks out for each other. And Baz would have playmates and I might be able to pee alone! Ah.....the dream.... ;-)

Celyn

I like the idea of a commune/village too.  I'm happy to share my groceries, crafting supplies and child-rearing responsibilities, but I'm not interested in sharing my husband with anyone.  Heck, I get jealous when his band takes up too much of his time

AvaLikeLava

EmmieB:

I would also like to add that while I am very glad that husband and I are conventionally monogamous....when they were talking about a group of women buying up a mcmansion and raising their kids together in it, that really appealed to me. I like the idea of living on a commune/in a little village where everyone pitches in and looks out for each other. And Baz would have playmates and I might be able to pee alone! Ah.....the dream.... ;-)

I'd like a sister-wives type of setup with no dudes... or the guys live in a separate part of the house and only appear when called(like when i need something off the high shelf, or something repaired that I don't want to deal w/ myself). And I like my husband

amyfelice

That's a kibbutz! The people all have their own space to live with their families, but during the day the kids are all together, everyone takes turns watching them and also doing all the other tasks. Everything is owned communally but the couples are not necessarily open marriages. It may happen that some are, but it's not the general rule or anything. For me personally, no way! 

EmmieB

amyfelice:

That's a kibbutz! The people all have their own space to live with their families, but during the day the kids are all together, everyone takes turns watching them and also doing all the other tasks. Everything is owned communally but the couples are not necessarily open marriages. It may happen that some are, but it's not the general rule or anything. For me personally, no way! 

no way on the kibbutz? Or no way on the open marriage?

 

I had a professor once who said the perfect setup for married people was to own both sides of a duplex and then if you wanted to see the other person, you just opened the adjoining door. ;-) 

f&s2006

Celyn:

I like the idea of a commune/village too.  I'm happy to share my groceries, crafting supplies and child-rearing responsibilities, but I'm not interested in sharing my husband with anyone.  Heck, I get jealous when his band takes up too much of his time

 

Pretty much exactly what celyn said here, except replace 'band' with 'video games'... 

 and if I'm being honest with myself probably I wouldnt' want to share groceries, I hate when I can't find something I bought for a meal... or find my MIL drank all my juice. haha.  though I love  meal-sharing arrangements in general.  

EmmieB

f&s2006:

Celyn:

I like the idea of a commune/village too.  I'm happy to share my groceries, crafting supplies and child-rearing responsibilities, but I'm not interested in sharing my husband with anyone.  Heck, I get jealous when his band takes up too much of his time

 

Pretty much exactly what celyn said here, except replace 'band' with 'video games'... 

 and if I'm being honest with myself probably I wouldnt' want to share groceries, I hate when I can't find something I bought for a meal... or find my MIL drank all my juice. haha.  though I love  meal-sharing arrangements in general.  

My sister's house has been called a commune before (lots of tennants - including roommates of tenants, people on the couch, general crowds) and they solved the "i expect this to be here when I come looking for it" by having designated fridge shelves and labeling everything. Like college ;-)