Yup, another MSPI post...
laxchick60
member
Sorry about this. I'm a regular on the CD board so I know newbie posts can get repetitive. I read back a few pages and saw several milk allergy posts but I'm having a hard time deciding if this is really a problem and if I should also cut out soy. And with no-one else, ie: pediatricians, thinking that milk allergy could be a cause, I'm wondering if Dr. Google has just made me paranoid.
Other than weight issues the first week (milk took a few days to come in), she has been EBF and gaining weight like a champ. Was born just under 7 lbs and was 12.3 lbs at her 2 month, and when I weighed her with my home scale last week was in the neighborhood of 14 lbs. So clearly weight gain issues and failure to thrive are not symptoms.
Symptoms: (I highlighted the MSPI symptoms and wrote other things it could be caused by)
1. Frequent diaper rash, but no rash elsewhere. Could be eczema, could be sensitivity to wetness or from pooping in her sleep. Clears up then comes back with a fury. (She has become a very drooley baby in the last month, which can also cause diaper rash)
2. Congestion every morning/after naps. Sneezes frequently, at least once a day. Could be allergies/dust.
3. Spit-up after almost every feeding (EBF), sometimes undigested milk directly after eating, othertimes digested milk some time later. Could be reflux.
4. Mucousey stool sometimes, green some days, regular EBF stool other days. Last night blood tinged, mucousey, bubbly stool. I assume the bubbly part is from the gas. When I changed her diaper she was being gassy so I let her have some air out time and did some bicycles, which is why I noticed the bubbles. ETA: She was also straining to poo/fart which she normally doesn't do at this time during the night. Once we do bath/bedtime routine, she eats and goes to sleep, but didn't go to sleep and was fussy and kept straining to poo/fart.
The only thing different in my diet yesterday, because I eat dairy/breads regularly, was a whey protein bar. Obviously the protein bar would be loaded with milk proteins, but I had that after dinner (cheese ravioli) and it was only a few hours later that the blood tinged stool occurred, would that be too soon to affect her so severely?
So, since these are the only 4 symptoms that relate to MSPI, in your opinions, is Dr. Google making me paranoid that they are all related as opposed to separate issues?
Thanks!
Re: Yup, another MSPI post...
My LO has MSPI and he didn't have diaper rash at all (or rashes of any kind) until just the past few days. He also didn't have congestion and didn't spit up after every feeding. I never noticed mucousey stool but what tipped us off was the blood in his stool. It was regular and often. In speaking with our pedi when we first had the bloody stools, she said that if it only happens the one time, not to be concerned. It's only if it's regular and often that it points to this particular allergy or some other major issue. LO was also extremely fussy while eating, would pull away often, only to want to eat more, and would cry out or scream while eating. Sometimes they also have major spit up or vomiting and diarrhea (LO didn't have this).
So, long story short, I think Dr Google is getting you paranoid!
And just to clarify, I posted those four symptoms in my op because almost every website i read gave those as symptoms of milk protein intolerance, along with a few others. I wonder if some of the symptoms are "more important" than others when attempting to diagnose this?
Thanks!
Regarding the congestion.. do you have a cool mist humidifier? That was our issue when LO was little.. and that helped a lot! We went through 3 different humidifier (cool mist) before finding one we like. But it could also be a dust issue like you said. .Maybe get hyperallergenic sheets and see if that helps?
it honestly wouldn't hurt to cut out dairy/soy for a month to see if she gets better. it does sound a little like MSPI vs an allergy. Does she scratch her body ever? eczema?
DS has sensitivities to dairy, soy, rice, and something else we haven't pinned down yet. We took him to the pedi when I found blood in his diaper. She confirmed it was blood and we ultimately wound up cutting out all three foods and visiting an allergist to confirm that it's a sensitivity rather than a true allergy.
DS's symptoms have been loose, mucus-y stools (I could see strands of mucus in the diapers) with occasional small quantities of blood. He also gets a rash in the shape of a ring right around his anus, which I've heard is connected to digestive upset. It doesn't seem to have affected his mood at all, and while he occasionally spits up I don't think that's affected by my diet either (he mostly spits up when he eats a lot and then insists on bouncing on his tummy - go figure). I honestly can't recall if he was more stuffed up while I was eating those things.
It's worth noting that the pediatrician didn't think that mucus-y stools were a cause for concern. In her experience some kids just have them, and that's normal for them. When I cut those foods out of my diet, though, the mucus went away and it's the first thing to return if I slip up. When I do slip up, we usually see the results the next day, and it will take a day or two for the visible signs of gut irritation to go away.
Have you called the pedi about the blood-tinged diaper in specific? Ours was very blase about his diapers, since they weren't "bad" in her experience (food allergies run in my family, so I was keeping an eye out for possible symptoms). If you have and they've blown you off, or if you've called prior to this diaper, I'd call again and insist on being seen (take the bloody diaper with you, if you still have it, or take another poopy diaper. They can run a simple blood test on it - this doesn't damage the diaper). You can definitely play with eliminating foods in your diet by yourself, but if she's reacting to these foods it would help to have that on her medical record. If nothing else, we're sending DS to daycare soon and will have the doctor's office backing us up that he can't have certain foods.
When she was younger and I brought up the theory of milk sensitivity they brushed it off and said it was just reflux/immature digestive system. So I'm thinking they're not too receptive to different ideas.
So it sounds like, short of forcing my pedi's to give me a referral to an allergist, my next step should be eliminating dairy to see if these symptoms go away. It sounds awful to say and think, but should I replicate the foods I ate the other day to see if the mucus/blood come back? It would give me ammo when I go to the pedi but it wasn't pleasant for her and I'd feel terrible about the inside damage if that was indeed the cause of the bleeding the other day.
Thanks!
Technically a food sensitivity actually is an immature gut problem. The phrase I've heard to describe it is "leaky gut"; basically, the gut is letting food particles through that it shouldn't, and the immune system is reacting to them because they're in the wrong place.
Imagine, if you will, some star's private security getting PO'd by the presence of no-name people who aren't supposed to be in the VIP lounge but were let through by an incompetent bouncer. The security team will react to those no-name people inside the VIP lounge, but if they encounter them in the street they won't do anything. The bouncer is the lining of the gut, the no-name people are food particles that aren't supposed to get through, and the security team is the immune system; it'll react to particles that get through the leaky gut, but it won't react to those same particles elsewhere.
That's the difference between a food sensitivity and a food allergy. I actually had a true food allergy when I was a child; if you spilled cow's milk on my arm, I'd break out in hives (the equivalent of the security team beating down the no-names on the street). DH would get congested if you fed him eggs. The fact that DS didn't respond to the skin scratch test is great news, both from the standpoint that he'll probably outgrow this faster and from the standpoint that repeatedly exposing him to the things he reacts against probably won't make the reaction worse (so said the allergist). We were actually told that because DS likely has a food sensitivity rather than a true allergy, I can still go ahead and eat the foods he reacts against (preferably in small quantities and only from time to time) without really harming him. The biggest dangers would be blood loss, if he happened to be losing that much blood from his gut, and (they didn't say this but I imagine) decreased nutrient intake from his gut being inflamed. I've chosen to cut those foods out entirely, but the allergist said he'd understand if I wanted to eat them occasionally.
One more thing: because children at this age are changing so rapidly, and because the science isn't nearly as well developed as for adults, it's possible that he does have an allergy and his immune system just isn't mature enough to respond to the skin scratch test. We have a followup visit when he's about a year old to repeat the test, just to be sure.
Thanks for taking the time to explain all that Beth. I'm still thinking my best option is going to be eliminating dairy/soy to see if that helps. If it does I'll get the pedi to refer us to an allergist so we can determine if these are sensitivities or allergies and to get them on her medical record.
Also, magdusia, I forgot to reply to your questions in my other post. She's still only 3.5 months old, so I don't know if a baby that young is coordinated enough to consistently scratch at a spot that itches. She's gotten a few bug bites and hasn't scratched them. I have wondered if her diaper rashes could be eczema but I don't know what to look for to determine that and I'd have to do some research on how to treat that specifically, if that is the cause. She has pretty clear skin with the occasional small bump that disappears on its own and doesn't seem to be dry or itchy anywhere that I can tell. Even with all the drooling and chewing on her fingers she's doing, I'm not noticing a reaction on the skin around her chin yet. And I did read on a few websites that food allergies/sensitivities can bring about things like eczema, because its all based on the immune system, so it could all be connected.
Gah! This isn't really clearing anything up is it.... I'm the type of person that wants to know exactly what the deal is so I know exactly what to do to make it better, so obviously this is a little frustrating. I haven't wanted to talk about the rashes much with her pedi because I'm sure I'll just hear a "its the CD, switch to sposies" speech but I'm starting to wonder if I should bring up all these things and talk about the connection there could be to see if I can get her in to an allergist. Especially since I start work, and thus she starts daycare
, at the end of August when school starts.
Oh, and I forgot to say - if you decide to cut out dairy, figure out whether or not you want to eliminate hidden dairy, too. Some children will be fine as long as their mom isn't eating very much dairy, and some need it all removed. If you decide to remove hidden dairy, then you'll need to read labels and be really careful. Dairy ingredients include things like casein (which is found in "non-dairy" creamer). Kellymom.com has a list of things to keep an eye out for.
General food sensitivity info: https://www.kellymom.com/babyconcerns/food-sensitivity.html
Ingredients to avoid if you're cutting hidden dairy (pdf): https://www.kellymom.com/store/freehandouts/hidden-dairy01.pdf
If you decide to cut out soy, you're going to have to be really vigilant about reading labels. I've found soy in garlic salt, in tuna where it doesn't appear in the ingredients list (but is listed underneath in the allergen warning) and in spray canola oil. You'll also have to be careful about nonspecific vegetable oil, because that often includes soy (I found vegetable oil listed as an ingredient in Squirt, of all things - I would not have expected to see oil in a soda).
Wouldn't I have to eliminate everything to see if dairy/soy is the cause? What little I've read about elimination diets is that you eliminate everything then add back in every couple weeks until you get a reaction, so you can note exactly ingredient is the issue.
Would it be worth the time/effort to eliminate both dairy and soy right from the get go? Or eliminate just dairy for now (including the hidden stuff), then soy if no improvements are noted?
I've already started checking labels and it is amazing the stuff you find that you wouldn't think would be there. I know to look for whey and casein but don't most labels these days have allergy warnings? Do they not recognize casein and whey as dairy allergens? I'm not a coffee drinker so I can't go check a bottle of non-dairy creamer to see if they do or not lol...
We started off eliminating individual things so that's just how it worked out for us (and since he's now better if I don't eat those things, I don't see the point in doing the full-on elimination diet for us). I would either do a full elimination diet or get rid of one thing at a time, just because I like to know exactly what I can and can't eat.
DH's container of non-dairy creamer lists casein as a "milk derivative," and then lists "milk derivative" under the allergy warnings. I think it's non-dairy in the sense that it's OK for people with lactose problems to have, but if you're allergic to the milk proteins you need to avoid it (lactose is a milk sugar rather than a protein).
That I did know lol... I'm trying to start this todaybut its tough, everything in my house has dairy and/or soy! I guess maybe I should just start with dairy and see where that gets us. And I guess I need to go grocery shopping. Ugh.