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Northern California Babies
S/O sort of regarding the nail polish post
I have been thinking a lot about this tonight, why is something we choose to do or not to do with our kid "flameworthy"? Just because we may "go against the grain" and not agree with what everyone else on the board says, does not make the decision flameworthy.
How we each INDIVIDUALLY CHOOSE to raise our children is no one's business but our own. Can you imagine a world where we all agree how one thing should be done?
This board has become a bit "puppies and rainbows". Reality check my friends, the world doesn't work that way. We can't raise our kids in bubbles, as much as we would like to.
This discussion has been closed.
Re: S/O sort of regarding the nail polish post
Ehhh... I can't speak for anyone else, but I think saying something is "flameworthy" is just a way of saying, head's up, I'm not going to be the popular poster on this one. I don't think it's at all apologizing for your choice. Semantics, kind of. I don't think it's a big deal to say "flameworthy".
I'm not sure if I'd say the board is "puppies & rainbows" but it sure is different than it used to be. Although, today, I felt like some of that old spirit was back, and I actually really enjoyed "nesting" today- but again I have been participating more today and I always find that participating more makes it more enjoyable and less annoying.
Dontcha wanna just pop some Chard by the campfire and sing Kumbaya with me? Some of us can nurse our 4 year olds, others of us can feed our kids chicken nuggets, we can have a plastic toy and a wooden toy area, and my kid will be in his crib, crying and alone (gasp!) because he needs his rest. I don't know about the rest of you, but I feel like this board does a pretty good job of respecting those differences...
Yes and no, Julie. I am in the same camp as you regarding the nail painting. I feel there are so many things that are brought up on this board that everyone responds with what they think people want them to say (aka what is "right" or popular) instead of what they really believe.
I disagree with Julie on nail polish but I agree with her on this.
Should? maybe. Do we? No. Judgement is everywhere and about everything. I am sure I'll get flamed for saying it, but we all judge others about at least something. To say we don't is lying to ourselves as much as lying to others. Maybe pail painting isn't the topic you judge others on but I am sure there is a parenting topic that you are sensitive too.
That's my point. I think people are worried about going against popular opinion because they are afraid of getting flamed.
I do agree with that Rachel. And I also think people who are in to the more "popular"/"crunchy" sides of things are more apt to stand up and say things like "Oh, I love giving my kids organic veggie biscuits that I grew the veggies and raised the chickens" rather than, "Hey, my kid just ate a Happy Meal."
It's like a "shame in your game" kind of thing. Saying "I raised the grass fed beef on my burger" CAN have a bit of an elitist tone to it, especially if you are someone who is just trying to keep your head above water, as many of us are.
BUT- I know from personal experience with many nesties that some who are more "crunchy" about certain things are not trying to make anyone feel bad and do not judge other moms for their choices. And I'm sure there are those that do judge. So this is when we have to go to- it's the Internet. Take it and leave it.
Agreed. But at the same time, it's the Internet, don't be afraid to say what you really believe.
Totally. I'm not! But are you taking issue with the almost pre-apologizing for it? Because I though in the post, J got some honest feedback and questions but everyone was fine with her opinion? I think really it was just a "know your audience" kind of pre-emptive offering. A little sugar coating maybe? And really what's wrong with that? I mean, you do catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
If she came out guns blazing like OH HELL NO I WILL NOT THAT IS A SIN!!!! (not saying that's what you believe, Julie, just for arguments sake) would anyone have learned anything from it? I thought the way she put it allowed people to read it and maybe see the other side?!?!
I do agree the board can feel one sided, and maybe its just me reading into posts/responses because I am often disagreeing. E.g. There was a long time I didn't want to talk about CIO on the board. But I've had nice conversations with some on the *other side* and feel much more comfortable posting about it now.
That said, I feel like sometimes one side of the argument can say whatever they want, *guns blazing* and I need to sugar coat what I say without getting in to it.
I'll continue to be sensitive to hot topics but I do try to be as honest as possible in my responses.
I know you aren't afraid to say what you mean
But it's not just this post I am referring to, it is just this one that pushed me over the edge to call it out.
The ultimate meaning behind this post is that I wish people weren't afraid to say what they believe for fear of being flamed or not of the popular opinion.
word. I think some days people are completely honest about how they feel on a subject. It usually takes someone brave to start it. I think today is a good example of people disagreeing, but being respectful about it.
As for me, I come from a long line of sh!t-disturbers, so I have no problem telling my opinion.:) Even if I know it goes against popular opinion.
Honestly alot of times I don't post things cause I don't have the time to have the discussions that go along with what my response or post would bring.
I am in no way scared or passive about my opinion. Since my parenting style is different then the main stream way, usually it comes with alot of questions. I honestly deal with so many questions and issues with it in my real life I don't have the patience for it online for the most part.
Therefore most of the time I don't say awhole lot on the board. I also believe things work great for my family, and that has nothing to do with how things work for another family.
I think your right Rachel about people being afraid to say what they believe, why do you think I made that post a poll? out of 75 votes, 15 people said flat out no. Did you see 15 people respond in text saying why they believe that way? nope.
It is sad to me in a way because I think that people benefit in hearing both sides of the conversation, even if one side is in the minority. I think it is nice to hear why people choose to CIO, or to say your not BF without feeling beat up about it, or why you may or may not paint your sons toenails. I just don't know if people feel comfortable having THAT conversation here, because it may not be popular opinion.
For what it's worth, I think that people's lack of sharing is less a reflection about the dynamics of the board and more a reflection of society's need in general to fit in. A number of studies show that most people do not like confrontation and find it easier to go along with the norm than stand alone in the minority. I think this would be the same whether on the board or in person.
I say that if people really want to get into we start roller derby teams.
Same here. Although I'm not trying to stir the sh!t, I just like to be honest and feel pretty damn secure in the parenting choice we make, so I share - because I know damn well not everyone is making growing green beans in their backyard, cooking them, pureeing them and feeding them to their infant that is at least 7 months old with a wooden spoon (so as to avoid any exposure to plastic). If you want to do that, great. But if you don't, great - and you're not alone. Hell, I packed a Lunchable for my kid's lunch last night because I was too damn tired to make a sandwich.
I see opinion as operating in two distinct ways on this board, and it took me a long time to navigate it and figure it out. When someone says they don't want to be flamed but X, and that opinion is different than the perceived popular opinion, they're usually met with lots of support. If someone says X and then someone else flames them because they strongly disagree, on the other hand, the flamer is often... flamed.
I think it takes a while for people to see that the reason flaming goes on here has very little to do with parenting style and everything to do with approach when presenting that opinion.
As a complete aside, I find it funny that anyone would think this board is strongly anti-CIO, because I've felt it to be the exact opposite. It's funny how differently we perceive things
the secret blog
It is nice to sometimes be able to just voice your opinion flatly without having to add in the qualifying "This is just my honest opinion" or "Please no flames, I'm just being honest" or "I understand the other side, but this is how I feel b/c of this..." etc etc etc...
I mean, those things could just go without saying and we could just all have a little more confidence in each other and our intent...but it's the Internet, and when you read something without tone and inflection, you're going to give it YOUR tone and inflection andi t could read completely different.
So, I save my perhaps-controversial, flat, non-puppies & rainbows type responses to things that may seem dissenting for national boards (birth month, tri boards, etc for example), honestly. Here, I feel like it's a group of (mostly) friends who I respect and I try to say things as if I were sitting around a table with all of you having a discussion. Often times, that does mean just shutting up b/c I know that one or more people on the board/around the table will really disagree with my position. It's the blessing and the curse of actually knowing my audience here - like knowing them as in they're people I hang out with off the board. I definitely feel like I can give my opinion because it'll be respected, but I'm much more concious and aware of how I give it b/c I wouldn't want to be misinterpreted by or hurt/offend someone I really enjoy spending off-board time with. If any of that makes sense
I really appreciate how Stef worded this. Often times I have a much different opinion than what is stated here. I am not ashamed in any way about what I believe, but for the sake of relationships and friendships I often keep my mouth shut.
Another reason I often don't say anything is because I am too tired to even write a coherent response
LOL!
This post made me want to break out in song. Everyone sing along...
Now, the world don't move to the beat of just one drum,What might be right for you, may not be right for some.
A man is born, he's a man of means.
Then along come two, they got nothing but their jeans.
But they got, Diff'rent Strokes.
It takes, Diff'rent Strokes.
It takes, Diff'rent Strokes to move the world.
I agree with this, I have also felt often times that I take time to respond to a post asking for advice, only to be met with a "that won't work" attitude when it's something they haven't tried. I get that some things are outside of your comfort zone, but to shoot down other peoples suggestions, when you've asked for suggestions is sort of rude IMO. SO I stopped answering some peoples posts for that reason. Why take my time to help someone if they don't want my help...ya know.
I really wish you would respond.
Like Julie with the nail polish: your opinion is different than mine, and I have respect for that. I assume that you (everyone) come to your decisions after much thought and discussion with your children's caregivers (SO, DCP, Grandparents, clergy, whomever) and any questions I ask are PURELY for the purpose of helping me understand and get to know you better.
I like a good debate and as long as things don't get insulty and facts don't get made up, I will happily hear your opinions and experiences. And who knows - you might even change my mind!
1st: that totally made me gigglesnort.
2nd: I am TOTALLY that person. Except I have no shame saying that last week when we both had head colds and my option was drive-through or grocery store, I picked McDonald's. And then I ate not only my food, but most of Baz's as well. And the toy is on our mantel to be opened when he gets bored.
Honestly I don't respond much anymore because:
1) when I do post my own thread - there are too many views and no responses and it pisses me off.
2) some times I have the same opinion as the other 5 responders (whoo-hoo a whole FIVE people responded - now THAT's a good response!) and I'm too lazy to type "me too")
3) I have a different opinion and I'm honestly too lazy (or don't care enough) to actually type it all out.
4) I don't like/want to post from my phone - it's a PITA.
5) It doesn't feel like people genuinely care to get to know each other. There are the people that already know some of the board members...and then there are new board members who made their own groups....and there's not much cross reference.
I have more but I choose not to share them. And for what it's worth: I voted "no" in the poll about nail polish - but didn't respond because "why should I"? Not worth the fight IMO. And if I choose to NOT paint my son's nails pink or purple or green or black or whatever, I don't feel like I need to have a dissertation about it. LIke you said - it's my choice how to raise my son. And I choose to teach him that nail polish is for girls. As is makeup.
So there. :-p
(Now I'm posting and running because I have lunch to fix for 2 hungry kids).
I couldn't agree more. I know that I am extremely "crunchy," more so than probably most here know, lol. I think that here and IRL friends generally know that and I don't feel the need to stand on a soap box. For example, if someone wants to talk to me about BFing a toddler I'll talk to them, but I feel no need to interject my strong feelings on BFing into a group of friends who might be struggling with BFing at all. And while I could spout off to strangers this group isn't a group of strangers to me. I value people's opinions and appreciate that they didn't make any choice - who cares whether I agree - without careful consideration.
I totally agree with all of you!
I've actually never felt like I should or shouldn't respond to a post. I have to admit, I've bitten my tongue a few times when I REALLY disagreed just because I didn't think I could add anything constructive, but otherwise I pretty much say what I think.
Having said that, I don't post as much as I used to because I'm busier (back to work, which I haven't even really mentioned on here), and because I tend to use Facebook. FB is a problem, though, because it means I haven't met any of you outside of my circle of friends because we aren't FB friends, and I feel strange adding you all as friends on FB because I am afraid you will think I'm a weirdo stalker stranger!